Unhappy?

[Scott]

It has appeared in a couple of threads that some posters are unhappy with the Gay Forum. Here is the place to discuss your concerns.

[ToddWeston]

Thanks Scott, I'm out today and I contribute when I have a moment over the weekend.

[isanbirder]

Can you be a bit more specific, Scott?

Some people, like myself, only post when there is something which interests them (e.g. not about the US!).. BTW, that's not really a complaint; the US gays have as much right here as anyone else.

Other people like to have their say on everything. That's their choice.

But the forum is gay-specific, and I quite agree with deleting the posts from mindless homophobes which turn up from time to time.

[CharlieH]

Well, for me, I came here and genuinely wanted to learn and understand different things and aspects of gay life but was basically "attacked" !

It seems, and this is only my personal observation, that certain people seem to think that if you dont agree or dont understand or question them you are immediately branded "homophobic".

Its used as an all purpose "diva" style response, which is sad in my opinion,as it paints an entirely wrong picture of others I have come to know and respect on this forum.

I took time to look beyond one individuals reaction, others may not have and branded the entire forum as hostile to non - gay posters.

[Scott]

Isanbirder, I can't really be much more specific. The forum is for the members and some seem to be unhappy with the content. This thread is general in nature and might give a better idea of where the problems are and if there are solutions.

Charlie H: The forum is for and about gay issues. It's not the best place to ask for input if your ideas are not particularly gay friendly. The general consensus has been that the posters would prefer to have a place where they don't have to justify their existence, behavior or lifestyle. Honest and sincere questions would/should be answered. Your suggestion has been heard and as a moderator, I will try and keep that in mind in deleting posts and closing topics.

Please understand that anti-gay comments will not be tolerated, however.

[CharlieH]

Scott, why did you feel it necessary to add that last line ?

That in itself is a warning that I feel is actually offensive. Why would you feel it necessary to say that directly to me ?

[Scott]

Because anti-gay comments won't be tolerated, that's why it was added. I haven't reviewed your posting history. You're posts may be fine, but if you are one of the many people who periodically drop in to this forum to deride gays and make disparaging comments and quote to bible and all kinds of other nasty stuff, it will get deleted. If it doesn't apply to you, then it doesn't apply to you.

[CharlieH]

Sorry Scott but if it doesnt apply to me you shouldnt say it to me or at the very least, as a moderator check your facts. You immediately went on the attack with your remark and "assumed" once again in this forum that if you are not gay then you must be here to riducule or offend those that are. You have stated as much.

Now, again as a moderator I suspect you will delete this as the truth hurts.However I will just say, keep it, I wont be visiting again. Gay people were once attacked and ridiculed etc for being gay, as time has moved forward I am happy to say that society no longer does this in the main, and it isnt tolerated, but in this forum its very clear to me its the reverse, and it seems to me you are doing the very thing that gay people despised so much in being done to them.

I wont return to this forum as I find the behaviour toward a non-gay totally unacceptable.

Perhaps you would be advised to put a "non-gay not welcome" banner on YOUR forum.

Edited March 28, 2014 by CharlieH

[OMGImInPattaya]

Well, for me, I came here and genuinely wanted to learn and understand different things and aspects of gay life but was basically "attacked" !

It seems, and this is only my personal observation, that certain people seem to think that if you dont agree or dont understand or question them you are immediately branded "homophobic".

Its used as an all purpose "diva" style response, which is sad in my opinion,as it paints an entirely wrong picture of others I have come to know and respect on this forum.

I took time to look beyond one individuals reaction, others may not have and branded the entire forum as hostile to non - gay posters.

If you're not gay, or at least bisexual, I don't see much reason why one would lurk around this subforum to learn and understand about aspects of gay life as you say. (Like I don't lurk around straight forums on the web because their issues and lifestyle aren't of much interest to me. I am active on several web ladyboy forums, however.) I would think most regular posters wouldn't have any objection to serious inquiries along these lines; but rememver this is not a human sexuality coloquim or college seminar and gay people are not specimens to be studied under a heterosexual microscope. The problem is that not being gay, you dont have any of the cultural foundation of gay knowledge or lived experience to participate intelligently in this forum and you would always be in danger of innocently posting questions or statements that are offensive to some.

If, for some reason, you are a straight person who has a genuine interest in gay life and gay issues and wants to post here that's great and I think again most would have no problem with it. However, just be aware of the dangers I mentioned above.

As to the op's query, I have no idea what you're talking about. Sorry.

Edited March 28, 2014 by OMGImInPattaya

[Scott]

Sorry Scott but if it doesnt apply to me you shouldnt say it to me or at the very least, as a moderator check your facts. You immediately went on the attack with your remark and "assumed" once again in this forum that if you are not gay then you must be here to riducule or offend those that are. You have stated as much.

Now, again as a moderator I suspect you will delete this as the truth hurts.However I will just say, keep it, I wont be visiting again. Gay people were once attacked and ridiculed etc for being gay, as time has moved forward I am happy to say that society no longer does this in the main, and it isnt tolerated, but in this forum its very clear to me its the reverse, and it seems to me you are doing the very thing that gay people despised so much in being done to them.

I wont return to this forum as I find the behaviour toward a non-gay totally unacceptable.

Perhaps you would be advised to put a "non-gay not welcome" banner on YOUR forum.

There are other forums on Thaivisa that may be more to your liking.

[ToddWeston]

I'm bowing out after reading the responses.

[sustento]

Sorry Scott but if it doesnt apply to me you shouldnt say it to me or at the very least, as a moderator check your facts. You immediately went on the attack with your remark and "assumed" once again in this forum that if you are not gay then you must be here to riducule or offend those that are. You have stated as much.

Now, again as a moderator I suspect you will delete this as the truth hurts.However I will just say, keep it, I wont be visiting again. Gay people were once attacked and ridiculed etc for being gay, as time has moved forward I am happy to say that society no longer does this in the main, and it isnt tolerated, but in this forum its very clear to me its the reverse, and it seems to me you are doing the very thing that gay people despised so much in being done to them.

I wont return to this forum as I find the behaviour toward a non-gay totally unacceptable.

Perhaps you would be advised to put a "non-gay not welcome" banner on YOUR forum.

There are other forums on Thaivisa that may be more to your liking.

You've no idea just how true that is.

[MichaelJackson]

Disgusting ! For gay person to adopt that atfifude.

It is a great irony that those seeking to increase tolerance and understanding do not extend that to those who disagree or dont understand them.

[Jingthing]

This is the new attack tactic of the anti-gay crowd. They accuse gay people who defend themselves against hate speech against gays of being intolerant haters themselves. That does not wash. Do not be deceived. Defending against bigotry is not intolerance.

Here is a thread about this very topic:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/647712-interesting-new-flavor-of-backlash-in-the-us-reverse-bigotry-panic/

More to THIS thread topic, there is a faction of gay posters here who are clearly of a more conservative bent and some even strangely HOSTILE to gay civil rights activism. Yes, I said bent. So do you actually want moderation to change to ALLOW homophobic comments here or not? I think they should not be allowed here (or actually anywhere on the wider website). Is hate speech against ANY OTHER identity group tolerated on the wider forum? I think the tolerance on the wider forum to anti-GLBT speech is greater than any other group. I am not saying that other identity groups are immune though, just a matter of degree and how common.

Are gay people not supposed to CALL OUT such hate speech here when it happens? Do you have no self respect, no GAY PRIDE? I know to some of you gay people the concept of GAY PRIDE makes you retch. I get it, that's your right, but heck this is a GAY forum ... don't be too shocked about it.

Yes I realize there are often grey areas about what is a hate speech comment and what is not. That's moderation's job to rule on of course.

If an official decision is made, anti-gay speech is totally OK on the gay forum, if that IS the decision that is the decision. The forum is a commercial enterprise, it is not owned by the users. But I would think in that case, it would still be OK for members to push back against such speech. I don't favor this change because then the forum is likely to become a free for all of homophobes coming in here to provoke. We get that here already, predictably, but they soon learn there ARE rules against that, at least in THIS gay forum.

Anyway, if you wish this change towards official toleration of anti-gay speech here, so be it, but it will turn out to be a classic case of be careful what you wish for.

So people, is that what you really want? No rules against anti-gay speech here?

Thanks to Scott for opening this thread.

Edited March 29, 2014 by Jingthing

[sustento]

Disgusting ! For gay person to adopt that atfifude.

It is a great irony that those seeking to increase tolerance and understanding do not extend that to those who disagree or dont understand them.

You appear to misunderstand. We don't want tolerance - we want equality. 'Tolerance' smacks a little too much of noblesse oblige to me. I really don't care whether you like me or not. I want to be equal before the law. Got it now?

[MichaelJackson]

This is the new attack tactic of the anti-gay crowd. They accuse gay people who defend themselves against hate speech against gays of being intolerant haters themselves. That does not wash. Do not be deceived. Defending against bigotry is not intolerance.

Here is a thread about this very topic:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/647712-interesting-new-flavor-of-backlash-in-the-us-reverse-bigotry-panic/

More to THIS thread topic, there is a faction of gay posters here who are clearly of a more conservative bent and some even strangely HOSTILE to gay civil rights activism. Yes, I said bent. So do you actually want moderation to change to ALLOW homophobic comments here or not? I think they should not be allowed here (or actually anywhere on the wider website). Is hate speech against ANY OTHER identity group tolerated on the wider forum? I think the tolerance on the wider forum to anti-GLBT speech is greater than any other group. I am not saying that other identity groups are immune though, just a matter of degree and how common.

Are gay people not supposed to CALL OUT such hate speech here when it happens? Do you have no self respect, no GAY PRIDE? I know to some of you gay people the concept of GAY PRIDE makes you retch. I get it, that's your right, but heck this is a GAY forum ... don't be too shocked about it.

Yes I realize there are often grey areas about what is a hate speech comment and what is not. That's moderation's job to rule on of course.

If an official decision is made, anti-gay speech is totally OK on the gay forum, if that IS the decision that is the decision. The forum is a commercial enterprise, it is not owned by the users. But I would think in that case, it would still be OK for members to push back against such speech. I don't favor this change because then the forum is likely to become a free for all of homophobes coming in here to provoke. We get that here already, predictably, but they soon learn there ARE rules against that, at least in THIS gay forum.

Anyway, if you wish this change towards official toleration of anti-gay speech here, so be it, but it will turn out to be a classic case of be careful what you wish for.

So people, is that what you really want? No rules against anti-gay speech here?

You are so predictable its pathetic, when in doubt when unsure or basically whenever the situation presents itself lets scream "homophobia", wow is me I'm gay and your wrong and homophobic its boring and predictable.

There are NO homphobic remarks made or inferred in this thread. Quite the opposite it seems its more about

" hetrophobia" and your obvious hate of non gays and assuming everyone who isnt gay MUST be homophobic.

Pathetic response largely not even relevant to this thread, posted I suspect purely in support of your clearly very biased friend.

[Jingthing]

Disgusting ! For gay person to adopt that atfifude.

It is a great irony that those seeking to increase tolerance and understanding do not extend that to those who disagree or dont understand them.

You appear to misunderstand. We don't want tolerance - we want equality. 'Tolerance' smacks a little too much of noblesse oblige to me. I really don't care whether you like me or not. I want to be equal before the law. Got it now?

Good point.

Nobody has to "like" anyone else.

That can't be legislated.

But laws fixing inequality under the law CAN be changed.

[Jingthing]

This is the new attack tactic of the anti-gay crowd. They accuse gay people who defend themselves against hate speech against gays of being intolerant haters themselves. That does not wash. Do not be deceived. Defending against bigotry is not intolerance.

Here is a thread about this very topic:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/647712-interesting-new-flavor-of-backlash-in-the-us-reverse-bigotry-panic/

More to THIS thread topic, there is a faction of gay posters here who are clearly of a more conservative bent and some even strangely HOSTILE to gay civil rights activism. Yes, I said bent. So do you actually want moderation to change to ALLOW homophobic comments here or not? I think they should not be allowed here (or actually anywhere on the wider website). Is hate speech against ANY OTHER identity group tolerated on the wider forum? I think the tolerance on the wider forum to anti-GLBT speech is greater than any other group. I am not saying that other identity groups are immune though, just a matter of degree and how common.

Are gay people not supposed to CALL OUT such hate speech here when it happens? Do you have no self respect, no GAY PRIDE? I know to some of you gay people the concept of GAY PRIDE makes you retch. I get it, that's your right, but heck this is a GAY forum ... don't be too shocked about it.

Yes I realize there are often grey areas about what is a hate speech comment and what is not. That's moderation's job to rule on of course.

If an official decision is made, anti-gay speech is totally OK on the gay forum, if that IS the decision that is the decision. The forum is a commercial enterprise, it is not owned by the users. But I would think in that case, it would still be OK for members to push back against such speech. I don't favor this change because then the forum is likely to become a free for all of homophobes coming in here to provoke. We get that here already, predictably, but they soon learn there ARE rules against that, at least in THIS gay forum.

Anyway, if you wish this change towards official toleration of anti-gay speech here, so be it, but it will turn out to be a classic case of be careful what you wish for.

So people, is that what you really want? No rules against anti-gay speech here?

You are so predictable its pathetic, when in doubt when unsure or basically whenever the situation presents itself lets scream "homophobia", wow is me I'm gay and your wrong and homophobic its boring and predictable.

There are NO homphobic remarks made or inferred in this thread. Quite the opposite it seems its more about

" hetrophobia" and your obvious hate of non gays and assuming everyone who isnt gay MUST be homophobic.

Pathetic response largely not even relevant to this thread, posted I suspect purely in support of your clearly very biased friend.

I wasn't talking about the thread, but the history of the forum in general.

If you don't know that we often get virulent homophobic comments on this forum, well, you haven't read the forum for long.

Sir, please desist from insulting me personally. I am not anti-straight people. I am against bigotry of ALL kinds, including homophobia.

I also think a gay forum should not be a place where anti-gay speech is to be welcomed any more than racist speech would be welcome on a black people's forum.

Also it is a TOTAL LIE that I have ever said even one time that straight people are not welcome here (not that it's my call anyway). I have mentioned a number of times that it is important that straight people posting here be RESPECTFUL to gay people. That's all.

Also keep in mind, gay people are a TINY MINORITY in the world and in MOST countries, including Thailand, do not enjoy equal civil rights under the law. So this reverse discrimination meme really can't be take very seriously. Gay people control NO nation.

There are some other options here for people to consider. Not advocating them, but why not bring them up for discussion?

Option 1: Change the rule so every topic here needs to be BOTH gay related and Thailand related.

Option 2: Split the forum in two ... one about anything gay in ANY country (but not Thailand) and the other as above, needs to be gay AND Thailand. I don't think we have the active poster base to support that well, but it's an idea.

(The previous idea brought up on another thread to do a U.S.A only option should clearly be rejected for its not nice transparent motivations.)

Option 3: Consider closing the forum. For those who object to gays identifying as gay persons, why do you even wish that a separate gay forum EXISTS?

As far as this idea goes, that would mean that when people do have a gay and Thailand related topic to discuss, they would be free to do that on any other forum here where it fits. Personally, I don't think Option 3 is that horrible an idea. What do you think?

Perhaps others have additional options/issues to raise on the forum's future.

Edited March 29, 2014 by Jingthing

[MichaelJackson]

This is the new attack tactic of the anti-gay crowd. They accuse gay people who defend themselves against hate speech against gays of being intolerant haters themselves. That does not wash. Do not be deceived. Defending against bigotry is not intolerance.

Here is a thread about this very topic:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/647712-interesting-new-flavor-of-backlash-in-the-us-reverse-bigotry-panic/

More to THIS thread topic, there is a faction of gay posters here who are clearly of a more conservative bent and some even strangely HOSTILE to gay civil rights activism. Yes, I said bent. So do you actually want moderation to change to ALLOW homophobic comments here or not? I think they should not be allowed here (or actually anywhere on the wider website). Is hate speech against ANY OTHER identity group tolerated on the wider forum? I think the tolerance on the wider forum to anti-GLBT speech is greater than any other group. I am not saying that other identity groups are immune though, just a matter of degree and how common.

Are gay people not supposed to CALL OUT such hate speech here when it happens? Do you have no self respect, no GAY PRIDE? I know to some of you gay people the concept of GAY PRIDE makes you retch. I get it, that's your right, but heck this is a GAY forum ... don't be too shocked about it.

Yes I realize there are often grey areas about what is a hate speech comment and what is not. That's moderation's job to rule on of course.

If an official decision is made, anti-gay speech is totally OK on the gay forum, if that IS the decision that is the decision. The forum is a commercial enterprise, it is not owned by the users. But I would think in that case, it would still be OK for members to push back against such speech. I don't favor this change because then the forum is likely to become a free for all of homophobes coming in here to provoke. We get that here already, predictably, but they soon learn there ARE rules against that, at least in THIS gay forum.

Anyway, if you wish this change towards official toleration of anti-gay speech here, so be it, but it will turn out to be a classic case of be careful what you wish for.

So people, is that what you really want? No rules against anti-gay speech here?

You are so predictable its pathetic, when in doubt when unsure or basically whenever the situation presents itself lets scream "homophobia", wow is me I'm gay and your wrong and homophobic its boring and predictable.

There are NO homphobic remarks made or inferred in this thread. Quite the opposite it seems its more about

" hetrophobia" and your obvious hate of non gays and assuming everyone who isnt gay MUST be homophobic.

Pathetic response largely not even relevant to this thread, posted I suspect purely in support of your clearly very biased friend.

I wasn't talking about the thread, but the history of the forum in general.

If you don't know that we often get virulent homophobic comments on this forum, well, you haven't read the forum for long.

Sir, please desist from insulting me personally. I am not anti-straight people. I am against bigotry of ALL kinds, including homophobia.

I also think a gay forum should not be a place where anti-gay speech is to be welcomed any more than racist speech would be welcome on a black people's forum.

Also it is a TOTAL LIE that I have ever said even one time that straight people are not welcome here (not that it's my call anyway). I have mentioned a number of times that it is important that straight people posting here be RESPECTFUL to gay people. That's all.

You Sir, need to resd your own post ! You specifically state THIS thread ! Nowhere did i insult you directly or name you , unlike the poster above who was clearly singled out and insulted, this was in my opinion the vety thing YOU have just stated you are against.

There is a very clear statement made above to basically "go elsewhere" made directly to a non gay, if that was said to you in as a gay you would be up in arms ! and rightly so, therefore when the reverse happens and a direct comment to go elsewhere is made to a non gay ITS WRONG !

No homophobic comment was made or inferred it was ASSUMED to be present purely based on not being gay and that is WRONG.

It cuts both ways or does it only apply when it suits you and gay people are the victim of it !

[Jingthing]

MJ, you were replying directly to my post.

I've had enough of responding to you on this.

You have adopted a hothead mode. You are just screaming now and being very insulting.

Others -- you welcome that kind of posting? Again be careful what you wish for.

This could actually be productive discussion and I don't think you're adding anything to the potential of that with your over the top tone.

AGAIN, all people are welcome here to post, but anti-gay comments are NOT welcome and that is indeed reflected in the current RULES here.

Others who aren't here just to throw a hissy fit:

This thread is a chance to look at the BIGGER PICTURE here, instead of getting bogged down in personality conflicts.

Not saying I'm optimistic much improvement will come of it, but here is a chance.

Be clear, perhaps against expectations, I don't have the answers on how to improve the forum.

Except I'm clear that making it open season for homophobic posts wouldn't be too bright.

Your move.

OK, I will say something else that is likely to piss some people off, but here goes.

As this now IS a GAY forum, should the opinions of non-gays about the future of the forum really carry the same weight as the gay identified posters?

Does that really make any sense at all?

On a women's forum, would the women there accept that the men's opinions about the nature of their forum have the same weight as the women?

Come on, now, you KNOW they wouldn't!

Again, I think a matter of self respect ... gay people here, got it or not?

Cheers.

Edited March 29, 2014 by Jingthing

[marcusd]

Viva le gay. All the way and I love this forum EXACTLY for the very reasons you stated. A place to express ourselves without the whining of others on,other threads ..... why a missus robbed me coz I met her in a bar and did not understand..... I think we gays are far less silly and are here sharing a lot,more

Marcusd. Via tapatalk

[ToddWeston]

Option 2 close it down.

It serves no useful purpose except for the left bent fantatics to spread the poor me syndrome. The links provided are of no use as I have my preferred new source(s) that apply to the country in question, if it's GLOBAL news then there is a place for that & the mods will take care of any comments that are against forum rules.

There is little fun or humour and it's the same posts over and over again.

There isn't a hope in hell of ever attracting any advertiser on this sub forum once they see the comments. I spent a lot of advertising money in my previous life and I wouldn't want my name attached to this sub forum.

The homophobic comments are dealt with so that should be the least of everyone's concern, but I do believe some posters encourage hostility as it feeds their agenda.

Most importantly the constant us against them mentality is disturbing, I'm gay yet have brothers, uncles & friends who may wish to ask a question, they are treated horribly and that reflects on me, luckily my life isn't TV and I'm able to show others we are much more than the nasty comments posted here.

[MichaelJackson]

Disgusting ! For gay person to adopt that atfifude.

It is a great irony that those seeking to increase tolerance and understanding do not extend that to those who disagree or dont understand them.

You appear to misunderstand. We don't want tolerance - we want equality. 'Tolerance' smacks a little too much of noblesse oblige to me. I really don't care whether you like me or not. I want to be equal before the law. Got it now?

Who said anything about "like" or dislike , and the use of tolerance in the post was meant as per the dictionary description.

"a fair, objective, and permissive attitude toward those whose opinions, practices, race, religion, nationality, etc., differ from one's own; freedom from bigotry"

Do you understand now ?

What happened on this thread was WRONG you all know it was wrong but no one has the strength of character to admit it, you would rather try and divert attention to other allied issues or away completely and detract from the point that it was wrong and should not have been said or perhaps more appropriately, handled in the manner in which it was.

The final "go elsewhere" was totally un-called for. If that was said to you on any other forum because you were gay it would be stamped on. Where is the equality now, that you are so passionate about ?

Hypocrites, and now I too will leave in disgust with a more enlightened opinion.

Edited March 29, 2014 by MichaelJackson

[Jingthing]

Option 2 close it down.

...

OK, so that's a vote for close it down from a gay identified person, which in my view, carries more weight here on the gay forum.

As I said before, I don't think that's a horrible idea.

One problem with that is when people do post gay and Thailand related topics on other forums here (it happens sometimes already) then there might be more work for moderation on those topics (as they do attract homophobic responses predictably).

Even though I don't think it's a horrible idea to close it, if you strongly feel that way, why not just let it be and not post or read it instead?

Then it would be closed for you ...

No I am not suggesting that you don't post or read if it remains open, which it probably will, but I still think it's a valid question.

Again, I don't feel strongly to close it or not. I can see both sides. So as I don't feel strongly that it should be closed, I guess that is kind of a default approval of it not being closed, isn't it?

So, now, here we are, are there any others who have been active posters who we know are GLBT identified (of course there aren't MANY of those people, but that's the situation) who agree with Todd to CLOSE it down?

If so, please speak up. That doesn't mean that the admins need to listen, but it would be valuable input. If there was a clear majority of GLBT people for closing it down, I think that would be fine ... though again, it's ultimately not our call, it's a commercially run website.

I would be surprised if such a majority of GLBT people exists here wishing to close it down, but if it does, it wouldn't be the first time I've been surprised.

Edited March 29, 2014 by Jingthing

[sustento]

Disgusting ! For gay person to adopt that atfifude.

It is a great irony that those seeking to increase tolerance and understanding do not extend that to those who disagree or dont understand them.

You appear to misunderstand. We don't want tolerance - we want equality. 'Tolerance' smacks a little too much of noblesse oblige to me. I really don't care whether you like me or not. I want to be equal before the law. Got it now?

Who said anything about "like" or dislike , and the use of tolerance in the post was meant as per the dictionary description.

"a fair, objective, and permissive attitude toward those whose opinions, practices, race, religion, nationality, etc., differ from one's own; freedom from bigotry"

Do you understand now ?

What happened on this thread was WRONG you all know it was wrong but no one has the strength of character to admit it, you would rather try and divert attention to other allied issues or away completely and detract from the point that it was wrong and should not have been said or perhaps more appropriately, handled in the manner in which it was.

The final "go elsewhere" was totally un-called for. If that was said to you on any other forum because you were gay it would be stamped on. Where is the equality now, that you are so passionate about ?

Hypocrites, and now I too will leave in disgust with a more enlightened opinion.

Don't let the door hit your arse on the way out.

[Jingthing]

...

The links provided are of no use as I have my preferred new source(s) that apply to the country in question, if it's GLOBAL news then there is a place for that & the mods will take care of any comments that are against forum rules.

...

Todd, would you be so kind as to NAME this source that you rely on? Thank you.

Edited March 29, 2014 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

Here is another problem I've noticed on the forum.

Among the actual GLBT people posting (keeping in mind the nature of this forum) one can't help noticing that there is not a lot of LOVE between most of the active GLBT posters.

Putting that mildly of course.

Non GLBT will of course notice this as well, and perhaps be entertained and amused, or maybe not.

Not suggesting the purpose of this forum is a public relations campaign to show the Thailand expat world that GLBT are love bunnies who all agree on everything (or anything at all?), that clearly was not the purpose of such a forum in the first place -- it was created mainly as a forum FOR the GLBT people here to communicate on topics of interest to them.

Some might be excused to conclude that gay is not about men loving men but rather men being nasty to men ...

Of course liking or loving can't be forced, you feel it, or you don't ... but that's the situation, out in the open.

I don't have a solution.

Do you?

To add: I say GLBT but in real life here almost all of the GLBT participation has been by gay MEN.

Edited March 29, 2014 by Jingthing

[OMGImInPattaya]

Oy vey...gave me a headache reading the last couple pages! One thing that did stick in my mind was your comment JT about conservative gays (and the old college Republicans were some of the gayest groups on campus in the day...dressing up in their preppy Ralph Lauren and Paul Stuart outfits. I mean, what conservative gay boy could resist that!) Anyway, your comment seemed to almost equate conservative gays with resistance to gay civil rights. Am I reading you right? So the only "good" gay is a liberal one? I'm sure you didn't mean to imply that but it sorta came out sounding like that.

You also sorta implied there are dome self-hating gays posting here. That seems to me to be a bit presumptuous.

As to forum options, the limiting it to gay AND Thailand would effectively kill it as there really wouldn't be much to post about in that case. I would find very little of interest in Thai gay life and culture worthy enough to write about.

Edited March 29, 2014 by OMGImInPattaya

[Jingthing]

I agree that limitation would kill it

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[orchis]

I mostly look for useful information of which there is little here, not for the discussion threads which btw

seem to get argumentative quickly. Except for a few forums this seems to be

a general trend on Thaivisa ( I've been a member here since 2004 and in Thailand since 1995).

Most of the gay topics are covered widely outside this forum and not Thailand related.