Wanna buy a house in Thailand with your Thai wife / GF? Think twice and DON'T DO IT.

[Scarpolo]

Gee guys! You know one woman, one single Thai woman and that is enough to know how all other 30 million women in Thailand are!

My somewhat limited experience is different. I know about a dozen farang here in Thailand, married to a Thai woman and having their house in her name. Most of them for longer than 15 years. They have a family, kids, job etc.... a normal life.

Oh, and I count myself in the same category.

Nobody can guarantee that my marriage will last forever, I know. But I believe I know my wife after 16 years of marriage and I know, worst case scenario, I will loose the house. But think of the alternatives. Right.

Either you have to pay a rent or live in a condo.

The rent for a nice house in Bangkok would be around THB 60,000 pM. After 10 years you have spent a total of THB 7,2 mio. That's just about the value of the house. Except if you bought the house, you still have that value. If you rent, that money is gone. We bought the house, in her name. The kids have a home. Even if one day I am no longer there.

YES......I was paying rent for about 4 years, that's why WE decided to buy a house. I was now making the mortgage payments (NOT PAYING RENT). I was making an investment (or so I thought), so that is why I am asking for some of my money, THAT I INVESTED, back.

All your troubles would go away, by changing your perceptions about leasing versus buying.

Was there ever truly a time, when she didnt act like it was "her" house?

You were leasing, she was buying. You were helping. What is the problem?

and, what did you to get kicked out?

just accept it, and next time, understand this is what you are doing.

I lived with a girl, in her house, for nearly 4 months and paid all the bills, including the mortgage.

That still cost me less than living in a condo, and stopped forcing me into restaurants every day.

And when it came to the bedroom, it was already upstairs, we didnt have to drive to it

Edited March 29, 2014 by Scarpolo

[soihok]

The OP is either a fool or a victim of his own doing (sounds like both )

[soihok]

Don't tar everyone with the same brush OP.

Some of us actually have a great family in Thailand, we all look after each other. The reward is immense.

Couldn't ask for more really.

[wym]

Go out into the real world and open your eyes instead of spending your life on the forum relying on Google searches for stats to lend gravitas to your stupid claims.

The PRACTICAL difference in the wealth gap in this country compared to that in, say, Europe or the UK is like night and day.

Sure, maybe not between those at the extremities but there are far more people in the middle in Western societies than there are in Thailand.

That you suggest otherwise only serves to compound your stupidity.

By "practical" etc you mean anecdotal, your personal perception.

And I did compare to the US, obviously Europe is much less polarized.

Around 30 years ago in my area of the states I returned from overseas and slotted right into a job doing routine DTP work for $12.50 an hour. That was considered sh1t work, mowing lawns and UPS paid $16-18.

Today guys SCRAMBLE for a job that pays that well, including 40's and 50's primary breadwinners who were making well over 100K before the crisis. Lots of people happy to work for 8 or 9. Cost of living, especially food, housing and transportation have way more than doubled in that time.

This isn't abstract statistics, real people's lives.

Difference between the US and Thailand is that things are rapidly improving here for the underclass, the middle is growing. Stateside the "middle class" is rapidly shrinking, the top 1% is 100x richer top 10% maybe 30x, the "working" class is nearly completely marginalized.

[Scarpolo]

Gee guys! You know one woman, one single Thai woman and that is enough to know how all other 30 million women in Thailand are!

My somewhat limited experience is different. I know about a dozen farang here in Thailand, married to a Thai woman and having their house in her name. Most of them for longer than 15 years. They have a family, kids, job etc.... a normal life.

Oh, and I count myself in the same category.

Nobody can guarantee that my marriage will last forever, I know. But I believe I know my wife after 16 years of marriage and I know, worst case scenario, I will loose the house. But think of the alternatives. Right.

Either you have to pay a rent or live in a condo.

The rent for a nice house in Bangkok would be around THB 60,000 pM. After 10 years you have spent a total of THB 7,2 mio. That's just about the value of the house. Except if you bought the house, you still have that value. If you rent, that money is gone. We bought the house, in her name. The kids have a home. Even if one day I am no longer there.

YES......I was paying rent for about 4 years, that's why WE decided to buy a house. I was now making the mortgage payments (NOT PAYING RENT). I was making an investment (or so I thought), so that is why I am asking for some of my money, THAT I INVESTED, back.

You forgot rule number one. Nothing is free. Time after time people come on this forum bragging how they don't pay for it. How they have a normal relationship. How they are so much better than the guys who pay for it. Well now you know. Money for chicks and nothings for free. That would be a good song title eh? Maybe needs a little more work.

It's not bragging (not on my part anyway). Some of us do have normal relationships with successful women who contribute at least 50% to household expenses and we get bored of listening to men that married prostitutes trying to justify their bad choices by saying that everybody pays for it.

you realize of course though,

that we believe you are paying for it, just calling it something else.

and many come here describing what they thought we LTR, that turned out to be less, and when the girl gets the upper hand, it is you guys who scream in surprise at their cunning and ruthlessness of assault

maybe it happens to them more so they hit the kill switch faster than girls in the west, and therein lies the cultural divide?

thai girls it turns out, are smarter

Edited March 29, 2014 by Scarpolo

[paz]

Go out into the real world and open your eyes instead of spending your life on the forum relying on Google searches for stats to lend gravitas to your stupid claims.

The PRACTICAL difference in the wealth gap in this country compared to that in, say, Europe or the UK is like night and day.

Sure, maybe not between those at the extremities but there are far more people in the middle in Western societies than there are in Thailand.

That you suggest otherwise only serves to compound your stupidity.

By "practical" etc you mean anecdotal, your personal perception.

And I did compare to the US, obviously Europe is much less polarized.

Not any less. Many countries with uneployment in the 20s. Taxation easily exceeds 45% on any bracket (ok, one gets "free healthcare"). Average net income say 2,000 USD monthly and be thankful for that. Fuel costs an eye. Families in Eastern Europe countries go hand to mouth practically speaking.

The richer is getting richer, that's for sure.

[wym]

Now i am just generalising.......you know the girl....the 55 yr old guy is now married under false, naive maybe, perceptions....when later he gets scammed emotionally and/or financially.....well....shit happens....i am happy i do not know you.

What you think we should warn him? Why just because we're white or something?

Right is right....wrong is wrong....Naivety i.e. stupidity as you call it. Surely your comments are supported by the many of posters here. That is the sad part. Understand though where you are coming from.

I do. In this case I don't feel the OP has a leg to stand on, not from a practical/cynical POV, not from the legal side and IMO not even morally.

The house is in her name, the loan is in her name, he chose for whatever reason to make the payments for her, didn't have any sort of explicit agreement with her to handle the inevitable split-up scenario, anyone looking at it from any objective POV - other than the "poor me I'm a nice-guy victim please feel sorry for me and validate my nice-guys should win" attitude - would agree he got what was coming to him, he completely cooperated in engineering the situation that he's complaining about, he made the bed and now complains, acts surprised that he has to lie in it.

Hmmm....so OP started the relationship with the woman.....bought a house....paid for it.....and at the end consciously planned to have this predicament. Well.... then ....reciprocity and morality is surely lacking on your part. In fact you say....well done girl.....

She hasn't done anything WRONG you idjit!

What gave the OP the idea he'd get anything back? If I choose to pay someone's bills, up to me! but it doesn't create any obligation for them to pay me back does it? Unless that had been discussed and agreed and even then better get it in writing to avoid misunderstanding.

In a divorce situation most times it's all-out war, anything goes, especially when it comes to kids you better have all your ducks lined up, if you're relying on the other party to be "fair" with you then yes you do deserve everything you get.

And wrt to houses, the Thais bend over backwards to ensure we are encouraged to "invest" but don't get to reap the rewards, all the scammy workarounds lawyers and land officials nudge nudge wink wink aren't worth the paper they're written on when push comes to shove it stays with the Thais.

And yes that's the way it should be - only rent, never buy. . .

[wym]

Not any less. Many countries with uneployment in the 20s. Taxation easily exceeds 45% on any bracket (ok, one gets "free healthcare"). Average net income say 2,000 USD monthly and be thankful for that. Fuel costs an eye. Families in Eastern Europe countries go hand to mouth practically speaking.

The richer is getting richer, that's for sure.

OK earlier-developed G7 Europe then.

I may have a chance to emigrate to Norway via my SIL, she's expressed an interest in adopting my kids and helping me find a wife, apparently easy since so many local fellas import Thai brides.

I'm sorely tempted from an economic POV, kids' education, support in my old age etc.

But the girls are so fat, and the winters so long and dark and cold, don't know if I could handle it. . .

[Scarpolo]

Has been the general advice for Falangs for the last 30 years (or more).

But as I speak ( or write), come Monday, a dozend of Farangs will venture out to a far corner of Thailand with the intention to erect a mansion, if ever possible on family land (with or without proper land-papers.)

And why? My wife/GF is different from all the rest and the family is so nice to me !

Amen.

Cheers.

did you say she was, er; different?

[Mossfinn]

And yes that's the way it should be - only rent, never buy. . .

It really depends on each and every situation.

But if one person tells you that is the only way to go, then they are telling you to live in their little World, frankly I prefer to live in the World that I happen to live in.

If you feel it is right to buy in your World, then buy, if it goes pear shaped, don't moan, if you think it is right to rent, then rent, but don't follow internet anonymous nonsense that is not backed up with info based on your personal circumstances.

As the man said falling from a high building, as he passed each floor, 'so far so good'.

[Mossfinn]

Thai brides.

Just curious, do you use the term American bride, or Brit bride, or Norwegian bride, nothing serious, just curious

[liddelljohn]

If you have a legal registered Thai marriage ,, when you get divorced the property obtained during the marriage will be split 50/50 if your wife does not sell the house or give you 50% of the proceeds etc cars . banks she will go to jail ,I have seen it happen several times ,,, get a proper court divorce and she has to comply .

[wym]

Thai brides.

Just curious, do you use the term American bride, or Brit bride, or Norwegian bride, nothing serious, just curious

To the extent they're imported in bulk to another country then I suppose I would.

Would "they've been importing wives from Thailand" be more PC for you?

[Seastallion]

Who was it that said, "Don't get married. Just find a woman you don't like and give her all your money."?

[wym]

And yes that's the way it should be - only rent, never buy. . .

It really depends on each and every situation.

But if one person tells you that is the only way to go, then they are telling you to live in their little World, frankly I prefer to live in the World that I happen to live in.

If you feel it is right to buy in your World, then buy, if it goes pear shaped, don't moan, if you think it is right to rent, then rent, but don't follow internet anonymous nonsense that is not backed up with info based on your personal circumstances.

That's what TV is for, helping others learn from each others' mistakes.

I stand by my advice, very few exceptions

I do qualify my "don't buy" - some are happy to pay for something as a gift and can well afford it.

Savvy businessmen with RE experience, solid legal knowledge and strong local connections may be another - RARE - exception.

Just the ordinary fools that think they are "investing" in connection with personal motives I keep trying to warn.

[NeverSure]

Who was it that said, "Don't get married. Just find a woman you don't like and give her all your money."?

Johnny Carson of "The Tonight Show" years ago after about 4 divorces. I was watching the show and heard him say it. It got big laughs. IIRC he actually said "Why get married? Just find a woman you hate and buy her a house." Of course he was incredibly wealthy.

[Skint]

If only Steven leathers book was given on the plane the heart ache it would save

[Mossfinn]

Thai brides.

Just curious, do you use the term American bride, or Brit bride, or Norwegian bride, nothing serious, just curious

To the extent they're imported in bulk to another country then I suppose I would.

Would "they've been importing wives from Thailand" be more PC for you?

No, not more PC. People are people, so they would be individuals, importing commodities, well.

[Mossfinn]

And yes that's the way it should be - only rent, never buy. . .

It really depends on each and every situation.

But if one person tells you that is the only way to go, then they are telling you to live in their little World, frankly I prefer to live in the World that I happen to live in.

If you feel it is right to buy in your World, then buy, if it goes pear shaped, don't moan, if you think it is right to rent, then rent, but don't follow internet anonymous nonsense that is not backed up with info based on your personal circumstances.

That's what TV is for, helping others learn from each others' mistakes.

I stand by my advice, very few exceptions

I do qualify my "don't buy" - some are happy to pay for something as a gift and can well afford it.

Savvy businessmen with RE experience, solid legal knowledge and strong local connections may be another - RARE - exception.

Just the ordinary fools that think they are "investing" in connection with personal motives I keep trying to warn.

Go on then qualify it, by meaningful study and reasoned debate with quantifiable results.

Not by every Joe Smoke who comes on here who's situation has gone South,

[NeverSure]

I have scanned this thread and can't figure out whether the OP signed on the mortgage and is now further obligated, or whether he just made payments on his lady's mortgage and it's over.

If he just made payments on her house while he lived there, I don't see the issue. He essentially paid rent. In fact, I like that idea.

I have a school teacher friend in Isaan who wants me to move in with her. She bought a house on the New House Scheme that's available to government employees. She also bought a pickup on the New Car Scheme. She also helps her parents. Needless to say she struggles with money.

If I moved in with her and put money in the kitty each month to cover her car and house payment, and extra for food and sundries, I wouldn't feel ripped off if I left. I have to live somehow.

[Scarpolo]

I have scanned this thread and can't figure out whether the OP signed on the mortgage and is now further obligated, or whether he just made payments on his lady's mortgage and it's over.

If he just made payments on her house while he lived there, I don't see the issue. He essentially paid rent. In fact, I like that idea.

I have a school teacher friend in Isaan who wants me to move in with her. She bought a house on the New House Scheme that's available to government employees. She also bought a pickup on the New Car Scheme. She also helps her parents. Needless to say she struggles with money.

If I moved in with her and put money in the kitty each month to cover her car and house payment, and extra for food and sundries, I wouldn't feel ripped off if I left. I have to live somehow.

thats a pretty accurate description of what I just did, without getting married, albeit, it was just a few short months, and round two hasn't occured.

but, I do have a place to go back too,

and it was very cozy

every time I paid in, I felt it was fair

[mikemac]

For all you Foreigners thinking about getting involved in buying a house with your Thai wife or girlfriend.........think again and DON'T DO IT! My friends and family told me to be careful but stupid me didn't listen.

I made that mistake and trusted my EX believing that she would be fair and rational. Yeah right.....a Thai person who's fair and rational when it comes to money.

For three years I made ALL the mortgage payments on the house. Our relationship ended and now she refuses to give me any of the money that I paid towards the mortgage. Money that will be returned to her if or when she sells the house.

Typical Thai logic. She compares it to me paying RENT on a house instead of me paying money towards an investment.

If she had made any payments towards my car loan, I would have returned that money to her if I sold the car. It's only fair.

I see many posts about Foreigners interested in buying land, house, etc. Save yourself the trouble and don't do it.......especially if you have to get involved with a Thai to get the deal done.

By the time I finished reading your heartbreaking tale I was wishing I had never started.

Stories like yours are a dime a dozen and I cannot help but wonder how good a husband you were to your ex. Seems like money is more important to you than anything else.

Personally, I am happily married and have just bought my wife a nice block of land outside Chiang Mai with plans to build a house on it soon. Everything is hers, in her name, for her and the kids.

If you wanted to buy land and house and not run the risk of losing it you should have stayed home, stayed single, and stayed miserable.

Now please go to the back of the queue for disgruntled losers.

[simon43]

So, after several pages of mudslinging, I am still no clearer why the OP has not claimed his 50% of the marital assets.

Let me put it this way. If you were legally married and your (rich) wife paid for everything in the marriage, 'owned' in her name only in any mortgage ciontract, car ownership agreement etc, whilst you sat on your backside, you are still legally entitled to 50% of these assets, (which includes 50% of the value of any land that you acquired after your marriage).

It is irrelevant whose name these assets are in - they are joint and common property.

This is not bar talk. I have been legally married twice in Thailand and divorced from both these 'ladies'. In both cases, I didn't have to claim for my 50% of the marital assets, (although the first did take a little time to persuade...). I acquired 50% of the marital assets because (most important!), I was legally married to them and those assets were obtained after our marriage.

So OP, were you legally married? And if so, why did you not claim what was legally your right?

Simon

[Scottythai]

Rule 1 - If it's not in your name it's not your house.

Rule 2 - Very hard for non thai people to own a house / land here.

Rule 3 - Condo's and Town houses can be owned.

You might have been thinking with the little head and rushed into things a bit. I am sorry for your loss but chalk it up to a life lesson and move on.

[BritManToo]

Any street in any major city in the West (with a few exceptions) will depict a wealth gap that is far less prominent that the one here. Walk anywhere in BKK and the signs of widespread poverty are everywhere. Not even talking beggars here - I'm talking about hotel staff, 7-11 staff, massage women, bus drivers, security guards and cleaners etc.

The middle class in the UK and Europe is massive. If you're not on benefits and you're not rich in the UK and Europe, then you're in the middle albeit between some very widely-spaced goalposts.

You can still - at a stretch - get a mortgage, finance on a car, a new LED TV and still have enough left over to feed yourself reasonably well. That is NOT the case here. Here, those jobs I mentioned earlier don't pay anywhere near enough for the people doing them to call themselves middle class. They are poor. They can't buy houses, cars and LED TVs ............even on credit.

The wealth gap is the same in the UK as it is in Thailand (large).

The difference is, many of the poor in Thailand own their own land and home.

Much easier for the poor in Thailand to get a loan, loan sharks everywhere.

In Thailand the poor don't freeze to death in the winter, and they have plenty of food.

I would say the poor in Thailand are much better off than the poor in the UK.

Middle class in the UK is defined by education and occupation, not income or wealth.

On benefits with a degree is still middle class in the UK.

In Thailand if you can show income of 15k a month, you can get a mortgage.

How much would you need to earn in the UK?

[Scarpolo]

For all you Foreigners thinking about getting involved in buying a house with your Thai wife or girlfriend.........think again and DON'T DO IT! My friends and family told me to be careful but stupid me didn't listen.

I made that mistake and trusted my EX believing that she would be fair and rational. Yeah right.....a Thai person who's fair and rational when it comes to money.

For three years I made ALL the mortgage payments on the house. Our relationship ended and now she refuses to give me any of the money that I paid towards the mortgage. Money that will be returned to her if or when she sells the house.

Typical Thai logic. She compares it to me paying RENT on a house instead of me paying money towards an investment.

If she had made any payments towards my car loan, I would have returned that money to her if I sold the car. It's only fair.

I see many posts about Foreigners interested in buying land, house, etc. Save yourself the trouble and don't do it.......especially if you have to get involved with a Thai to get the deal done.

By the time I finished reading your heartbreaking tale I was wishing I had never started.

Stories like yours are a dime a dozen and I cannot help but wonder how good a husband you were to your ex. Seems like money is more important to you than anything else.

Personally, I am happily married and have just bought my wife a nice block of land outside Chiang Mai with plans to build a house on it soon. Everything is hers, in her name, for her and the kids.

If you wanted to buy land and house and not run the risk of losing it you should have stayed home, stayed single, and stayed miserable.

Now please go to the back of the queue for disgruntled losers.

Whats decent land in Chaing Mai going for these days?

[sdanielmcev]

The gf and I are buying a house. Not a mansion, just a comfortable 4 room cottage with plenty of yard for her garden and me to build a shop. I/we could afford more, but she doesn't want it. Hmmm, maybe she's different. You see, down the road, if it doesn't work out, I'll still remember the original commitment to buy her a house.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

The OP hasn't exactly been clear on all the pertinent details of his situation. But overall:

1. While I'm sorry his relationship ended, he's only out 3 years of mortgage payments, based on his posts. He ought to consider himself a whole lot more fortunate than those guys in similar situations who pay out 3, 4, 5 million baht for buying or building houses, only to lose it all when the relationship ends.

2. As others have said, if the OP was legally (amphur) married and not just village ceremony, then the general rule of law is all assets and income acquired during the marriage are to be divided evenly upon divorce (except foreigners cannot own and hold land). Likewise, all pre-marriage assets are deemed separate property and kept by the man and lady upon divorce.

If he was legally married and if he had income coming in during the period of their marriage, she would be entitled to the value of half of his income during the period of the marriage, just as he would be entitled to the value of half of her income (assuming she had any).

It would be unlikely that his name would be on the mortgage, since Thai banks generally aren't keen on issuing mortages in the name of foreigners. If the woman took out the morgage prior to their marriage, then clearly the obligation would be hers alone.

If the woman took out the mortgage in her name only AFTER they were legally married, I'm not sure how the legal issues of that apply in the event of a divorce.

[kurnell]

I have a house with the Thai msz and when it is paid off it will go to our kids. Then again, I do have a pot to piss in so no big issue for me. If you can't aford to buy, then rent.

[thailiketoo]

YES......I was paying rent for about 4 years, that's why WE decided to buy a house. I was now making the mortgage payments (NOT PAYING RENT). I was making an investment (or so I thought), so that is why I am asking for some of my money, THAT I INVESTED, back.

You forgot rule number one. Nothing is free. Time after time people come on this forum bragging how they don't pay for it. How they have a normal relationship. How they are so much better than the guys who pay for it. Well now you know. Money for chicks and nothings for free. That would be a good song title eh? Maybe needs a little more work.

It's not bragging (not on my part anyway). Some of us do have normal relationships with successful women who contribute at least 50% to household expenses and we get bored of listening to men that married prostitutes trying to justify their bad choices by saying that everybody pays for it.

You said, "Some of us do have normal relationships with successful women." If that's not bragging I don't know what is. You are saying you and some lucky others have normal relationships and us others don't. Sorry that is bragging.