Building a Low Cost But Capable Desktop - opinions sought!

[JSixpack]

Okay, final decision - off to the shop in an hour...

Intel G3220 CPU = 1,890

Gigabyte GA-B85M-HD3 - 2,340

Kingston DDR3 ram, 1 x 4Gb = 1,260

1 TB. SATA-III Seagate (64MB, STrek) HDD = 2,030

DVD RW Samsung = 510

1 IDE to SATA convertor (to install the old 250GB HDD in the machine) = 110

PSU 450W DTECH (3yr warranty) = 575

Case: eMaster E-3306B (Black) = 450

Total is therefore 9,165 Baht

I just can't bring myself to buy the much less powerful biostar CPU/mobo combination, even though I think it will be fine for him right now. It just feels like I would be short changing his experiencing of moving to his first new PC and experiencing the pleasure of speed...

I really do take on the SSD point (I love 'em), BUT I wouldn't buy less than a 120GB and that's out of range for now. If he stuffs up the OS in a couple of years and I end up doing a reinstall I may encourage the SSD at that point - he gets a a second "oh my that's fast": experience! For now, with downloading, he needs a large reliable space for storage, the Seagate SATA will give him that with the IDE drive used for backup only. I think I will just put the 250GB in and retire the 80GB (actually I might use it to make a system image once I have got his machine fully installed, then I can use it for a fast future restore if needed).

The UPS is going to have to wait, in preference to a faster machine. I'll just give him a printout of what to buy and direct him to get one soon or risk the consequences. At least my ass is covered!

Lastly (before I am off to the shops)...

Thank you all for your valued input and helping me to chew over the pros and cons of the various options. In the end I am persuaded that power is worthwhile, even for this relatively light user. Once it is all setup I'll do some benchmarks on it and report back. I think she is going to be a beauty - and with 3 years warranty on all major components. Not bad for 9k Baht... WAY better than anything available "off the shelf" for this money.

Now you done good. This is IT, except . . . I'd go w/ the 500W RAIDMAX RX (Box/Cable) 500 w. * SATA * 80 PLUS Brozne 1,500 PSU taking you only B215 over budget, to be recouped in power savings. Or, if you can't stand that B215, 450W Corsair (VS450) (Box/Cable) 450 w. * Fan 12 cm. * SATA 1,180 and still be under budget at 9895.

I assume he's got a quality surge protector (Belkins are sold in Thailand) and his power is grounded. Better power supplies handle surges better, BTW.

Rational decision on the UPS. Nice to have (very nice, actually) but not required. I don't know what the percentage is of desktop PC users don't use a UPS and never have, but I suspect it's quite high indeed.

Let us know how it goes. Assembling it yourself or letting them do it? If I buy a complete build from a Thai shop, I let them do it so it can have some testing right there--may save time-wasting later in case anything is DOA (happens). 'Course I'm lazy anyway. Back home I may rearrange some things. Some Thai builders are really quite good, however. It's only Lego.

Edited April 16, 2014 by JSixpack

[JimShortz]

Alright, report back time. I was at the shop for 10am this morning and gave him my printed list (exactly as I listed above). Surprisingly, they had everything except that motherboard, the SATA/IDE convertor and the case. So, I headed over to JIB and bought the motherboard from them for just 90 Baht more than Advice sells it for, went back to Advice and asked them to get all of the other components together. They are slow!

While they mess around I went around the nearby plazas on a hunt for a cheap case. Unfortunately everything around 4 or 5 hundred Baht was nasty, so I decided keep the original case.... I could have hunted for the SATA/IDE convertor, but couldn't really be bothered. That's for another day.

Anyway, I'll try and keep this short. I headed home with everything else, stripped the case, put all the new gubbins in, connected up all of the leads and booted her up. Hoorah, all working, lights and all. Windows 7 ultimate 64 bit installing as I type this from a nearby cafe where I am having lunch. Not bad.... I have done this many times before, but not for a few years. The motherboard manual was a great guide for all of the leads and it went like clockwork. I am waiting for the failure now! This is too good, lol.

I should have mentioned that the HDD price had apparently leapt 300 Baht overnight, so altogether I have spent about 9k and have a cracker I think. They would have done the putting components together for 300 Baht, but to be honest if you know a bit about the inside of computers it is simple enough to do it yourself - especially if you are testing the limits of Cheap Charlie builds.

Happy days!

[GuyL]

Great news, JimShortz!

In case you can't get the SATA/IDE converter at a later date, you still can buy an external enclosure (preferably a USB 3.0 one) with IDE support (or IDE/SATA combo) for your friend's old HDD.

[fatdrunkandstupid]

Tesco Lotus have some budget towers for sale and occassionally they have a 30 or 40 percent sale. There is one on at the moment to clear Songkran stock. You can therefore get a box ready to go for 4 or 5k THB. And then tweak it if needed.

[JimShortz]

Tesco Lotus have some budget towers for sale and occassionally they have a 30 or 40 percent sale. There is one on at the moment to clear Songkran stock. You can therefore get a box ready to go for 4 or 5k THB. And then tweak it if needed.

Not really, I'm afraid... I always take a peak at those offers. They seem like a good idea, but are ALWAYS low spec junk that tweaking would involve replacing every component... They are useable (you can use anything) but unpleasant!

[JimShortz]

The final report...

It's a beauty! I can't benchmark it since I have already delivered it to its extremely happy owner, but... having been installing multiple programs at the same time while downloading and browsing there is basically no lag, and multi-tasking is great.

At its new home the computer today ran full 1080p video on the TV while we were setting stuff up and downloading updates using the PC screen (I have it setup as an extended two monitor desktop) completely problem free.

I guess what this build has taught me is that for most users the real high-end stuff is not necessary at all. Put a 3k video card in this box and it would even be a pretty decent gaming machine!

I was discussing this build with a visiting friend a few days ago and he was telling me how much he had spent on an i7 rig with 16GB ram, great video card, etc. BUT he basically uses it for the same as this machine will be used for. His machine is complete overkill for his use, but is what you are sold if money is no object I guess... I know many people see this as future proofing, but the components still get old and are more likely to fail than if you build a new moderate machine every few (5?) years, IMHO. If you're rich though, who cares!

[GuyL]

Yep! That's a quite apt configuration for most average users, I reckon. Good work!

[JSixpack]

I guess what this build has taught me is that for most users the real high-end stuff is not necessary at all. Put a 3k video card in this box and it would even be a pretty decent gaming machine!

So true. Enlightening article:

Can a £300 gaming PC compare to a £3,000 one?

We pit a cheap gaming PC against a high-end rig

Most of the time, most of our subjects literally could not tell the difference. In fact, it was worse than that. It wasn't just a case of putting hands up in the air and declaring it a dead heat. Frequently, our testers actually got it the wrong way round, declaring the low-end rig to be rendering with greater fidelity or actually running faster.

--http://www.techradar.com/news/computing/pc/can-a-300-gaming-pc-compare-to-a-3000-one-1071338/1#articleContent

I have to laugh at some of the ridiculous overkill you see among enthusiasts and wannabe techies. The phrase "more money than sense" always comes to mind.

Edited April 17, 2014 by JSixpack

[JimShortz]

Very interesting read JSixpack - enlightening indeed!

It's so easy when you haven't had much hands on experience to get into reading too many reviews and believing that you will get huge gains in usability from spending lots more. Clearly not always true...

I can remember falling for this back in the day of 486 processors, if you can go back that far. I swapped one out for another with a higher Mhz rating, believing it would be a revelation. The revelation was that the OS wasn't happy and I needed to do a full reinstall, only to find it was very little faster than what I had before. I really couldn't tell the difference in actual use, but only by running benchmarks tests! Lol

I am not into naming and shaming, but towards the end of this thread a member who clearly had the best of intentions PMed me to inform me that I really need at least a quad core processor, more Ram, an expensive PSU, improved case cooling, etc. The thing is, I know he meant well, but has just been led up the garden path to believe this (along with lots and lots of others).

For me, cheap(ish) is the future, even when building for myself + more beer with all of the change! ;-)

[Kiwi1]

Am new to Thaivisa so forgive me if this message posted twice.

Thanks Jim and all for the encouragement and advice.

As said, have a reasonable technical background but lack clues about IT.

Very interested in following JS recipe.

Questions:

1. Logistics:

I go to Advice with JS shopping list. Assuming all the stuff available, pay them to assemble, test and load with my Windows7. Think I can load everything else myself or with help from friends.

Will this work?

2. Technical:

Take it the JS system uses one HDD for the OS and reuses the owner's existing HDD for data.

(a)My present Lenovo flat pack desktop probably 6 years old, so think new HDD a good idea. Would appreciate advice on suitable units to fit.

( Like the idea of SSD for the OS. Advice on unit to buy and price?

My budget can go over 10,000 baht.

Would be great if someone in CM learned in the art could come with me to supervise the shopping. (No need to hold my hand). My pleasure to buy lunch or a present such as a bottle of something.

[JSixpack]

I can remember falling for this back in the day of 486 processors, if you can go back that far.

Cough. I, uh, can! Well, at least the 486 was better than the Z80, I must say.

I am not into naming and shaming, but towards the end of this thread a member who clearly had the best of intentions PMed me to inform me that I really need at least a quad core processor, more Ram, an expensive PSU, improved case cooling, etc. The thing is, I know he meant well, but has just been led up the garden path to believe this (along with lots and lots of others).

For me, cheap(ish) is the future, even when building for myself + more beer with all of the change! ;-)

That's been my plan for many years since I <blush> bought that Athlon 1200 for B10,000 (!). Now it's quality, but just enough to do the job. I'm happy; I'm spending part of my Songkran running Skyrim on better-than-average but still budget hardware and it's running just fine. I did splurge on my new Corsair C70 case (now a fetish), and a sound card (music's so important).

I noted in a similar thread years ago that asking in this forum for a budget build is about like walking into a gym full of preening steroid-infused bodybuilders and asking about a workout routine for "toning." Ha! However, we've had some very intelligent, reasonable responses--best such thread I've seen here actually.

When contemplating an upgrade or new build I usually listen to the gurus on Tom's Hardware and Ars Technica (e. g., http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1229895) before pulling the trigger on anything. If anybody knows what they're doing, they do.

Edited April 17, 2014 by JSixpack

[JSixpack]

Am new to Thaivisa so forgive me if this message posted twice.

Thanks Jim and all for the encouragement and advice.

As said, have a reasonable technical background but lack clues about IT.

Very interested in following JS recipe.

Questions:

1. Logistics:

I go to Advice with JS shopping list. Assuming all the stuff available, pay them to assemble, test and load with my Windows7. Think I can load everything else myself or with help from friends.

Will this work?

Good. That'll work. Consider JIB--sometimes hardware's a bit cheaper there. See if you can't get free assembly, since you're buying a package--it's pretty common but less so if you're wanting your own Windows installed (they usually just restore an image). Be sure to check the front USB and audio ports--sometimes a point of neglect, but really unlikely they'll miss them.

2. Technical:

Take it the JS system uses one HDD for the OS and reuses the owner's existing HDD for data.

(a)My present Lenovo flat pack desktop probably 6 years old, so think new HDD a good idea. Would appreciate advice on suitable units to fit.

You can check the drive w/ CrystalDiskInfo (http://www.softpedia.com/get/System/Hard-Disk-Utils/CrystalDiskInfo.shtml) (take a look at the temp, too) but at 6 years I'd definitely replace. Should take a standard 3.5" HD I guess. If you can spend a little more, WD Red and WD Black get a good deal of love. I've had a Red under heavy use for more than a year and so far so good. You can look at newegg.com for highest ratings on HDs. Truth is, you never know. Every brand/model has its supporters and detractors. Good thing is if they fail, they usually fail w/i the warranty period. After that, all bets are off, but start worrying at 4 years and get ready to replace at 5. Monitor the drives w/ HDSentinal or CrystalDiskInfo. Keeping your drive cooled (fan) to 40 C or under is well worth doing to help maximize life. Common arrangement is to put the HD behind the front fans. If your Lenovo case provides for that but has no front fan, get one installed.

( Like the idea of SSD for the OS. Advice on unit to buy and price?

My budget can go over 10,000 baht.

Samsung gets good recommendations for value. I have a Kingston and it's been great. Check this:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/ssd-recommendation-benchmark,3269.html

The minimum will have to be 60 GB, but you'll be much happier w/ a 120 GB. Need to redirect your document, photo, video, and music libraries to the HD.

Would be great if someone in CM learned in the art could come with me to supervise the shopping. (No need to hold my hand). My pleasure to buy lunch or a present such as a bottle of something.

Hope you get a positive response--first time is a bit disorienting. I went along w/ a newbie years ago to Pantip and later he developed into quite a computer hobbyist himself.

[Kiwi1]

Thanks very much JS:

Will need a little study to get all on board, but good learning curve for me.

Yes, I have been a ham radio operator for a bit over sixty years and look forward to learning how to build PCs, or at least replace major components.

Will take a bit of time to get up to speed.

Yes, Lenovo has two front fans and I sit it on a laptop cooling pad. Case still gets warmer in the way of the power supply than I would like, tho.

[JimShortz]

Thanks very much JS:

Will need a little study to get all on board, but good learning curve for me.

Yes, I have been a ham radio operator for a bit over sixty years and look forward to learning how to build PCs, or at least replace major components.

Will take a bit of time to get up to speed.

Yes, Lenovo has two front fans and I sit it on a laptop cooling pad. Case still gets warmer in the way of the power supply than I would like, tho.

Hi Kiwi1, JS is offering lots of good advice, including the well respected websites that he refers to as solid places to look for advice. I'd follow that up and do a bit of research, as you say.

I'm flat out for the next couple of weeks, but if you need help after the end of this month I will be happy to meet up with you to finalise what you buy and give you a hand with the shopping. I can also help you out with the OS - it's best not to let them install that un-updateable Windows 7 image that they throw on in the shops. They just want it quick and easy...

Happy researching!

[Kiwi1]

Thanks very much!

There is no hurry and would be good to meet with you early next month and put this deal together.

Will PM you with my contact info, providing I can work the Thaivisa system.

Thanks again.

[GuyL]

Great to see that you will be helped by JimShortz! You are in good hands, Kiwi1!

Earlier in this thread, I mentioned several solutions for still being able to use your old IDE HDDs with modern motherboards that often don't have any IDE (PATA) connector, one of those solutions consisting in adding a PCI IDE controller adapter card. One is available for 240 THB only here: http://www.advice.co.th/products/preview.php?code=A0057838

By the way, great info was given by JSixpack about recommended SSDs. One of them (Samsung 840 EVO, 120 GB capacity) is available here: http://www.advice.co.th/products/preview.php?code=A0061754

If you can afford it, Kiwi1, I'm quite sure that you will be very pleased.

[JimShortz]

Great to see you are still here offering good advice GuyL!

Since Advice didn't have the IDE to SATA converter I wanted in stock (and said that they couldn't get it) I decided to order off eBay. It has cost the vast sum of about 80 Baht including shipping. I'm sure I could've found one elsewhere in Chiang Mai, but I am in no rush, so took the lazy route! The card that you mention sounds like a very good idea. I might take a look at that too; the converter would always be handy to keep in-hand anyway.

I've just spoken to Kiwi1 outside of the forum to make an arrangement for early next month to put his computer together. We agreed to continue the discussion here instead of on the phone so that we could pool the wisdom and share the final decision.

From my discussion with Kiwi1 I gather that he is after probably much the same machine, but he needs to buy a case (suggestions anyone?) and most probably wants to go with an SSD, actually more for increased reliability rather than just the speed improvements. Are any more reliable than others? I'd never really though about it that way, but i guess being solid state (with no moving parts) they ought to be more reliable too.

GuyL, why do you recommend the Samsung 840 EVO in preference to other SSDs? I have a Vertex in one of my machines and an Intel in the other. Neither were chosen for a great reason other than price and availability!

[GuyL]

JSixpack provided a link a bit earlier in this thread. From there, you may read more information about Samsung 840 EVO SSDs: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/ssd-recommendation-benchmark,3269-2.html

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/samsung-840-evo-review-1tb-ssd,3567.html

At the moment, I haven't had yet bad experiences (directly or via friends' reports) with any of the major brands, but have noticed that Samsung 840 EVO SSDs got many good reviews for their value on several trustworthy websites.

[JimShortz]

Yes GuyL, they do indeed look like a great SSD, and that is certainly a reliable source.

One question I have for Kiwi1 is whether he plans to have an SSD only, or have a smaller SSD + a traditional hard drive. I guess to answer that we need to know a little more.

If he has a large music collection and uses the computer for significant torrent downloading then it really has to be a smaller SSD (I would suggest 120GB, smaller is annoying, when you consider it hosts all of your programmes + anything on the desktop) + a 1TB or bigger hard Drive.

If on the other hand he doesn't store much data a single 120GB SSD may be sufficient, although if it's a sole drive I would go for at least double that size - they are getting pricey at this level though!

Just some thoughts...

[lomatopo]

Things that usually get overlooked/under-budgeted:

a really good case: design/accessibility-cleaning/cooling

a really good PSU

a really good CPU cooler

[JimShortz]

I agree about choosing a good case, but to me that just means choosing one that seems substantially built, has USB and audio connections near the top (I like the computer under the desk where it doesn't buzz in my ear), doesn't have the annoying pointless drawer fronts for the DVD, and looks good to my taste.

As for PSU, I do agree that a good PSU is an investment, but the price also needs to fit in with the budget. I think, for a non-gaming machine, the one I specified in this system, with a 3 year warranty is just fine.

The processor used here is relatively low power consumption and shouldn't run very hot at all. The one I bought was the boxed one from Intel, with their cooler. I'm pretty confident that this should be sufficient... I hope! For a gaming rig with a high powered processor, or for overclockers, then better cooling would be essential, but not really here.

I assist with the purchasing of computers for a school that runs around 130 machines. The only ones that have ever caused us overheating problems were AMD chips (several different ones). For this reason we no longer use AMD in school and I never recommend them or buy themyself. I know, however, that others run them with no problems... YMMV

Sent through the ether from my iThingymabob using Thaivisa Connect App

[Kiwi1]

Thanks for all the constructive interest,

Am presently uisng 41 GB of my 111GB hard drive.

Assuming I use SDD for Windows 7 OS then could I get away with, say 60GB SSD plus a larger HDD for data?

[lomatopo]

Okay, new plan!

I don't see any budget for an OS. Is that over/above the 10,000 baht goal?

[JimShortz]

Okay, new plan!

I don't see any budget for an OS. Is that over/above the 10,000 baht goal?

No OS budget necessary, that has all been taken care of, and yes, it will update, etc...

and we don't have a 10k goal this time, just somewhere around that area!

[lomatopo]

No OS budget necessary

Lucky you.

[JimShortz]

Thanks for all the constructive interest,

Am presently uisng 41 GB of my 111GB hard drive.

Assuming I use SDD for Windows 7 OS then could I get away with, say 60GB SSD plus a larger HDD for data?

Hi Kiwi1. To answer your question, yes, you certainly could do that. I just wonder if it is the best solution...

From 41GB of disk usage I would guess that no more than 10 or 15 GB are data (i.e. not program installations). If that's the case you may be better off with just an SSD and no Hard Drive, for now, and use something like Google drive to keep your data backed up in "the cloud" for free. Google supplies a free 25GB cloud storage space to all Gmail users for free!

What I have done on my home computer is downloaded the google Drive app and installed that, then I have set that drive folder as the only folder within my Windows 7 Documents library. The upshot is that when I save anything to my documents folder it is actually my Google Drive folder, and as such it automatically backs up all of my important data to the cloud, on the fly, with no effort from me. In between typing on Thaivisa (too much!) I am working on an important assignment. I love the fact that as it is saved as I go along it is automatically in the cloud; the last thing I want is to be 5000 words in and have the beast disappear due to my hardware failing. it could happen...

To be on the safe side (and that is the best side) I also occasionally back this folder up to an external drive. I'm guessing that in your case you could even do this simply on a 16GB flash drive or SD card - cheap as chips!

I would not buy a 60GB SSD (ever, in fact - I think they will become increasingly cramped and restrictive in a few short years). IMHO you should spend the extra on a minimum 120GB SSD. Remember that as well as your regular use of space (41GB in your case) anything on your desktop that is being played with has to be added in (maybe occasional large photo or video editing?) and you need space to allow for data growth - an unstoppable phenomenon... The OS also needs some spare space for working. Basically, don't buy a 60GB SSD unless you want it to be annoying you in the near future... IMHO. You can, but I wouldn't!

Of course, you can always add another HDD or SSD later if storage demands grow, but try and avoid being saddled with lots of increasingly useless small drives.

[JSixpack]

Just a few thoughts:

I agree about choosing a good case, but to me that just means choosing one that seems substantially built, has USB and audio connections near the top (I like the computer under the desk where it doesn't buzz in my ear), doesn't have the annoying pointless drawer fronts for the DVD, and looks good to my taste.

You pretty much get what you pay for in cases these days. Competitive market. Name brands give you better quality: good switches, front panel connectors & wires, expansion slot inserts, airflow, well-designed bay cover inserts, quality fan, no sharp edges, steel not too flimsy, cable management provision, air filters, etc.

The price for a decent case starts at around B800

AeroCool V3X (Black) 1 Fan 8 cm. * 410 x 175 x 410 * 1DVD 790
http://www.advice.co.th/products/preview.php?code=A0054186

mATX Zalman T2 Plus (Black) Pro! Ready Point 1 Fan 92 mm. * 400 x 169 x 348 * 1DVD * Bay 3.5' 990
http://www.advice.co.th/products/preview.php?code=A0062977

CoolerMaster Elite343 (Black) Pro! Ready Point 1 Fan 12cm. * 352 x 180 x 440 * 2DVD * Steel Body 1,090
http://www.advice.co.th/products/preview.php?code=A0061159

As for PSU, I do agree that a good PSU is an investment, but the price also needs to fit in with the budget. I think, for a non-gaming machine, the one I specified in this system, with a 3 year warranty is just fine.

Just for the record, let's do be aware, now, that the warranty doesn't cover the other components a cheap PSU may take out with it.

Well, my SSD finally arrived and I reinstalled Windows. I'm still getting the hangs and crashes. It appears that when the PSU burned out, it dragged my MB down to the depths with it. I tried updating the BIOS, clearing the CMOS, to no effect. I even tried switching out the ram and this didn't solve the problem. It looks like I'm going to have to replace the board

I'm not too surprised, since I noticed the burned electrical smell coming from the PSU, and from the CPU area of the M/B. I just would have thought that, if the M/B got fried, it would be completely dead, and not partially functional???
--http://forums.anandtech.com/archive/index.php/t-2044167.html

It happened to me in 2006. Something inside a cheap PSU loudly exploded (large capacitor, maybe something else as well), there was a fair amount of smoke and nasty smell. Nearly every component was destroyed by this incident - 2 HDDs, mobo, CPU, multiple PCI cards, FDD, CDRW drive, DVD burner. The only things I was able to salvage were the case, heatsink, and amazingly Creative Live 5.1 PCI card was working afterwards, but there were some problems with it as well - can't remember exactly what, but it was not the same afterwards.

Lesson learned - never again to use any cheap PSUs. All my systems now have quality power supplies now, which is also beneficial for proper operation of the memory, which might be the case with some motherboards.
--http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/technology/1186418/m16870306/#m16870306

Tom's Hardware tutorial on building a PC:

The power supply is the single most critical component in the entire system. A faulty unit can die a horrible death, taking out several key pieces of hardware in the process, while an underpowered part can cause crashes or even boot failure.

I assist with the purchasing of computers for a school that runs around 130 machines. The only ones that have ever caused us overheating problems were AMD chips (several different ones). For this reason we no longer use AMD in school and I never recommend them or buy themyself. I know, however, that others run them with no problems... YMMV

AMD CPUs had some much ballyhooed issues about heat many years ago, though I never experienced such. They ran hot, but so what: it was w/i spec, so it wasn't overheating unless there was an airflow/thermal paste issue. At the time, lower-end mainboards/BIOSes didn't help so much w/ hardware monitoring & thermal protection--and that's changed. Yet the myth about their overheating seems to persist forever, a kind of urban legend. I'd have no reservations whatsoever about using an AMD when price/performance warranted. I also like rooting for the underdog. That said, in the price bracket and proposed use under discussion, the G3220 wins handily.

Edited April 19, 2014 by JSixpack

[JimShortz]

Hi JSixpack, that's some nice advice on the case - Kiwi1 should have plenty to think about there....

I know that you are also right about the power supply too, but it's tough in a cheap build to put a lot into something that you basically never see. What happened to you sounds horrific, but it's not something that has ever happened to me when I have had power supplies fail. I have been fortunate in it just being the PSU failing alone... You pay your money ( or don't ) and take your chance I guess. Everyone has to do the cost/risk thing; a bit like do you want to buy insurance or not I suppose!

I had opted for the 3 year power supply in the hope that if they are prepared to guarantee it for 3 years it has a lesser chance of failure. I hope that logic doesn't prove to be flawed.

Have you got any moderately priced power supplies that you think could be a good buy?

I'm sure you are also right about AMD now too, but for me I can't get over the once bitten twice shy feeling. I also used to support AMD as the underdog - then the bugger bit me!

[Kiwi1]

Thanks JimShortz and all:

Things seem to be falling into place.

Not learned in these things, but the 10.000 baht recipe sounds excellent value for the money.

Now looking beyond that.

The 120 GB SSD sounds like the way to go.

I do have Google + and will try to do the trick that Jim uses and get everything backed up to the Cloud.

So looks like we after 120GB SSD, plus enclosure ( like the one with the bigger fan), plus happy to spend a little bit more for a generous power supply.

More or less by accident I acquired a 1TB external HDD and use it for backup now. Assume could use it as working HDD if I ever ran over the 120 GB. but present pattern of use suggests that not very likely.

Looks to me like I would be getting good speed and reliability and value for money.

Thanks all around.

[JSixpack]

What happened to you sounds horrific, but it's not something that has ever happened to me when I have had power supplies fail.

Sorry, that was part of a quotation from the source listed below, hence the indentation. I should use italics or the forum quote facility . . . .

Hasn't happened to me 'cause I always splurge on a good PSU--which I hate doing, being naturally frugal except for the necessities of wine, women, and song. I did have a lightning strike once take out my mainboard via the telephone line to the internal modem. Well, that's a blast from the past.

I have seen a lot of mysterious problems clear up when the PSU is upgraded. Friend of mine blew thru 3 cheap PSUs while my original FSP was still going great. 'Course, he only bought those B400 PSUs from tiny shops in Tukcom. Penny wise, pound foolish eh.

I have been fortunate in it just being the PSU failing alone... You pay your money ( or don't ) and take your chance I guess. Everyone has to do the cost/risk thing; a bit like do you want to buy insurance or not I suppose!

Right!

Have you got any moderately priced power supplies that you think could be a good buy?

The Raidmax looks good 'cause of the 80+. Raidmax used to build low-end only, and they were crap, but lately has been getting some love.

450W Corsair (VS450) (Box/Cable) 450 w. * Fan 12 cm. * SATA 1,180

500W RAIDMAX RX (Box/Cable) 500 w. * SATA * 80 PLUS Brozne 1,500

500W ThermalTake LitePower (Box/Cable) 500 w. * Fan 12 cm. * SATA 1,750