New role eyed for Prem

[SICHONSTEVE]

Interesting, this bit about "this could be actioned even without a power vacuum", that suggests to me they don't think they've got their judicial coup. Their claims are false, if Prem's control of the military is weak, then I assume his influence on the independent agencies is also weak, and the cases themselves are a joke. So it looks like they're trying for a coup without first ejecting Yingluk.

Hence this group has been formed from the loyal but now retired, Prembots and trying for the coup via Section 7 while Yingluk is still in power.

Think about it for a second, Suthep has been visiting *non-retired* permanent secretaries. Yet they could only get *retired* Prembots, meaning the second generation appointed beaurocrats couldn't be brought into this group. They weren't directly appointed and don't share the loyalty of their retired elders.

How about thinking about what you have said?

Yingluk is still in power.

She is in power and look at what is happening in the nation. A group openly suggesting splitting Thailand in to two different countries children being killed with grenades old monks being attacked by groups of up to 30 attackers. The population being ignored in favor of her brother.

Yes she is in power but she does not choose to use it. She is to busy on Facebook. If the population wants to know what she has to say they have to get a computer. Just go farther in debt to hear her words of wisdom garbage. It's not like the people weren't far enough in debt now.

A real winner that one.

She is not in power actually - she is there solely in a caretaker capacity. She has no powers to do anything other than to keep the current government departments functioning!!!

If she was still in power then there would be no need for elections would there!!!

[SICHONSTEVE]

Call for Thai senior statesman to help resolve political stalemate

By English News

BANGKOK, April 15 A group of respected older Thai citizens has called on Privy Council President Prem Tinsulanonda to take the leading role in seeking a royal command to resolve Thailands months-long political impasse.

Former supreme commander Saiyud Kerdpol said the current political crisis could be resolved by the power of His Majesty the King as in cases in the past, including the October 14, 1973 student uprising and the 1992 Black May events.

Gen Saiyud gave a press conference on Resolutions for Thailand together with Pramote Nakornthap, independent academic, Terdsak Sajjaraksa, former deputy air force commander, and Prasai Songsuravej, former governor of the National Housing Authority.

They identified themselves as members of the State Individual Group.

Gen Saiyud said the Kings charisma will lead Thailand through the political crisis but His Majesty has to stay away from politics.

In this case, Gen Prem who is in the prestigious position of Thailands senior statesman should be the pillar for the judiciary, military and society by presenting a royal command for HM the Kings endorsement, he said.

Gen Saiyud said he believed that Thai society will accept a royal command as in the past, adding that the royal command is different to that proposed in accord with Section 7 of the Constitution.

Caretaker Justice Minister Chaikasem Nitisiri earlier proposed that His Majesty could be asked to exercise his power as stipulated in Section 7 of the Constitution in case of a political vacuum.

Caretaker Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra is currently awaiting two crucial rulings one from the National Anti-Corruption Commission concerning her role in the rice pledging scheme and the other from the Constitutional Court on the transfer of National Security Council chief Thawil Pliensri. If found guilty, she could be removed from power.

Mr Pramote said the older citizens proposal was by no means a move to disturb HM the King.

Bancherd Singkaneti, rector of the Faculty of Law, National Institute for Development Administration, described it as one of several proposed resolutions for the country.

Whether the group should wait until the country is plunged into a political vacuum or not before making the proposal, he said, is subject, a matter of opinion. (MCOT online news)

-- TNA 2014-04-15

Why not just let the Thai people work out their political differences in a democratic manner through elections. There is no need to tread them like children, and be lead around like children by Prem or any other "elder statesmen."

Tried that..........didn't work!!!!

Certainly not to the satisfaction of this lot . medical for the poor, otop, money for villages, subsidies here and there.

Outrageous.

I am instinctively very scared of retired armed forces people planning things like this. If this south america, everyone would be up in arms.

Why anyone gets a feeling to want to trust these fossils god only knows. Its a coup, no matter what spin is put on it.

This is for an interim PM to hold the fort whilst reforms are put in place so how can you call it a coup!!

Why are we in this dilemma? because Yingluck's gang couldn't behave properly and they all acted like spoilt children put in charge of the candy jar!! I can guarantee, as soon as they took office the first thing on their minds was 'what's the easiest way to make a tidy sum', I bet they were salivating at the time!!

Thailand is in this position because

A. The army have meddled into society and ripped up constitutions for decades preventing the systemn from correcting itself.

B. The legal system is bent because no one bothered to really make it fair and independent because it suits the rich/elite/ammart to keep it that way. Now the bent judiciary has been exploitee by Thaksin they don't like it one bit.

These dinosaurs are a very big part of the problem. Not the whole problem but a big part of itm

So you think it is right that "Thaksin has exploited the judiciary" whereas the Dem's don't need to!!!

It is illegal to interfere in the judiciaries work (yes even for Thaksin), don't they know that!!!

[northernjohn]

Call for Thai senior statesman to help resolve political stalemate

By English News

BANGKOK, April 15 A group of respected older Thai citizens has called on Privy Council President Prem Tinsulanonda to take the leading role in seeking a royal command to resolve Thailands months-long political impasse.

Former supreme commander Saiyud Kerdpol said the current political crisis could be resolved by the power of His Majesty the King as in cases in the past, including the October 14, 1973 student uprising and the 1992 Black May events.

Gen Saiyud gave a press conference on Resolutions for Thailand together with Pramote Nakornthap, independent academic, Terdsak Sajjaraksa, former deputy air force commander, and Prasai Songsuravej, former governor of the National Housing Authority.

They identified themselves as members of the State Individual Group.

Gen Saiyud said the Kings charisma will lead Thailand through the political crisis but His Majesty has to stay away from politics.

In this case, Gen Prem who is in the prestigious position of Thailands senior statesman should be the pillar for the judiciary, military and society by presenting a royal command for HM the Kings endorsement, he said.

Gen Saiyud said he believed that Thai society will accept a royal command as in the past, adding that the royal command is different to that proposed in accord with Section 7 of the Constitution.

Caretaker Justice Minister Chaikasem Nitisiri earlier proposed that His Majesty could be asked to exercise his power as stipulated in Section 7 of the Constitution in case of a political vacuum.

Caretaker Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra is currently awaiting two crucial rulings one from the National Anti-Corruption Commission concerning her role in the rice pledging scheme and the other from the Constitutional Court on the transfer of National Security Council chief Thawil Pliensri. If found guilty, she could be removed from power.

Mr Pramote said the older citizens proposal was by no means a move to disturb HM the King.

Bancherd Singkaneti, rector of the Faculty of Law, National Institute for Development Administration, described it as one of several proposed resolutions for the country.

Whether the group should wait until the country is plunged into a political vacuum or not before making the proposal, he said, is subject, a matter of opinion. (MCOT online news)

-- TNA 2014-04-15

Why not just let the Thai people work out their political differences in a democratic manner through elections. There is no need to tread them like children, and be lead around like children by Prem or any other "elder statesmen."

Tried that..........didn't work!!!!

Certainly not to the satisfaction of this lot . medical for the poor, otop, money for villages, subsidies here and there.

Outrageous.

I am instinctively very scared of retired armed forces people planning things like this. If this south america, everyone would be up in arms.

Why anyone gets a feeling to want to trust these fossils god only knows. Its a coup, no matter what spin is put on it.

Funny thing about you is you are for any thing Thaksin OKs and against any thing he doesn't Ok.

The money here and there is supposed to go to the farmers not to politicians with off shore bank accounts.

Yes deliver all your villages votes and you will receive some money. Free medical my ass It is 30 baht where as it was free under the Democrats. The 30 baht cost 50 baht to administer which has to come out of the medical fund net result loss of medical services Nurses demonstrating and Doctors demonstrating. 1 million cases treated for 30 baht equals 20 million less baht for treating people.

Why do I have to pay a 1,000 baht a month for my mother in law to receive a medical shot she needs when she is on this so called free medical plan you talk about?

But that is all OK because you are afraid of retired army personnel.

You have it backwards. It is the active army personnel you a should be afraid of. They are the ones who can do the damage. Fortunately they are sitting on the side lines offering to help negotiate and not rattling swords.

[Thai at Heart]

Steve, you miss.my point. Why are we here now?

Because the judiciary is so bent. I made no comment about who is right or wrong. A strong independent judiciary has had 80 years to be created ..Thaksin has been in power on and off for 10.

The first judgement on his assets is.probably the start of the whole problem. An expedient decision that this country has paid dearly for.

[BlueNoseCodger]

Think about what went into this group:

They're a bunch of retired officials, from many different offices who previously didn't work together, or socialize together, or know each others names, let alone addresses, or telephone numbers, or even know they are of like minds.

They somehow get together, agree on a name, and an agenda, hire a PR person to write the press releases and handle the press (and translation), and a treasurer to handle the payroll for these people.

The name to suggest they are all uncoordinated even, 'State INDIVIDUALS group', see nothing with 'reform' in it, like the other 50 groups were all blah blah for reform, this group is totally different.... yeh... different.

They come along and plan on choosing a PM and asking for a Section 7, almost exactly like Suthep said on March 28th. How his backers would take back Thailand for its real owners, appoint a leader to replace Yingluk using Section 7.

All, so familiar. So how did this group meet? When? How did they contact each other? Did they vote on their proposal, or someone choose it and they signed off on it? Who did that? They only seem to be connected via being appointed by Prem, a National Housing Officer does not normally interact with an ex General for example, so who contacted them? Lots and lots of questions here....

Edited April 15, 2014 by BlueNoseCodger

[SICHONSTEVE]

Steve, you miss.my point. Why are we here now?

Because the judiciary is so bent. I made no comment about who is right or wrong. A strong independent judiciary has had 80 years to be created ..Thaksin has been in power on and off for 10.

The first judgement on his assets is.probably the start of the whole problem. An expedient decision that this country has paid dearly for.

The judiciary is not bent!!!

If a red shirt admits to stealing a car in Chiang Mai, he goes to court and the judiciary find him not guilty and free him. is that correct?

Well that is what you are implying. If he is found guilty then it's an ammart conspiracy against him.

If Yingluck had acted properly and not been a serial liar and breaker of laws then she wouldn't have to worry about the courts.

She is always breaking the law and so she must spend some court time before being unceremoniously retired in disgrace!!

[Fryslan boppe]

So, did Thaksin do ANYTHING illegal prior to his conviction in your blinkered tiny little mind?" (Quote fromTatsujin, Post #18 above)

Not if the source of those accusations are rooted and sourced from the Coup-makers and all their appendages, as part of their demonization of Thaksin in order to validate themselves.

Lest anyone think that this opinion is aberrational, let me remind you that it reflects the Electoral Majority. Their very objective, measurable electoral actions support it......It is why there is such a concerted effort to silence that electoral majority, clearly evidenced this last election and by the Lumpini crowd, and their associates...........Check where the aberration is...It is not with this majority and this opinion, but the anti-democratic minority..

However, the greatest aberration, are those Farangs coming from countries with democratic traditions, who by consistently dumping on Thaksin, Ms. Y and the elected PTP, are effectively sympathizing with those who advocate a “Civilian Dictatorship” to replace Electoral and Parliamentary Democracy…….I am not one of those!

Edited April 15, 2014 by Fryslan boppe

[fab4]

One too many words fab4 - the 'Constitution' won the day!!

Interpretation of the constitution is the key word, I think you'll find. 6 judges said the Election was unconstitutional, 3 judges said that it was constitutional.

Surely something wrong there?

Maybe the constitution needs rewriting to make it clear, ah, let's not go there..............................

[Old Man River]

Prem Tinsulanonda http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prem_Tinsulanonda

After all the demonizing of Prem after the 2006 coup and Prem being accused of pulling the strings of the mysterious 'third hand'. I can't see how Gen. Prem can be effective in this role (nor will Thaksin accept him) and that is why I think he will refuse to be the mediator. Dr. Thaksin will not accept anything less than one of his puppets being in charge and Suthep, who may be to only man in Thailand as stubborn as Thaksin, will not accept any Thaksin puppets in a future government. I am not saying this is democratic in any way, as both men abhor democracy. Dr. Thaksin has approached Suthep several times wanting to cut a secret, back-room deal but Suthep remains adamant on public discussions of the future of democracy in Thailand; besides, he can't trust Thaksin to abide by any secret deals. Would you?

So, Thailand will plod along with nothing changing except the days of the calendar until something dramatic happens. I expect the courts will precipitate the only changes in the near future.

You are assuming that Thaksin and Suthep need to be part of this. One is a convicted criminal and the other has charges against him. Why should they be part of this?

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[Fryslan boppe]

"The problem is, he's a convicted criminal on the run, and no one voted for him.

You don't see a problem in that?"

Thank you for agreeing that Thaksin is actually running this country, finally.

The problem is, he's a convicted criminal on the run, and no one voted for him.

You don't see a problem in that?

Not the least bit.

The only crowd who sees that Thaksin court thing as anything other than politically motivated, and part of the Thaksin demonization campaign I referenced, are those trying to 'normalize the abnormal" today, with respect to the judiciary and Ind. Org's.

There is an attempt to reprise this whole thing now, using many of the same tactics as were used in 2006.....Although they are trying to be more subtle now......By not using the military, they hope to obscure their intentions from an International audience.

That little add-on via edit, about no-one voting for Thaksin is folderol....He was duly elected until the unelectable Elites "unelected him" in 2006....His association with the last election was huge and transparent...The electorate governed themselves accordingly.....They are quite happy to see his influence, and voted for it....Only the electorally-challenged PAD-Dem's are unhappy......But blinded to the need to "reform themselves before an election".

You don't see a problem in someone running a country that wasn't elected, interesting, and I love your attempts to rewrite history once again. So blind. So sad. I'll let all the other convicted criminals on the run worldwide know that it's not a problem, you can rape and pillage to your hearts content, be convicted, but still run a country even though they weren't on the ballot. They'll be so happy.

So, did Thaksin do ANYTHING illegal prior to his conviction in your blinkered tiny little mind? Or is he completely innocent of all charges?

By the way, the only attempt to reprise/rewrite anything just now are your attempts to whitewash Thaksin and PT of any wrongdoing and your attempts to legitimize his criminal actions. Thankfully, the "majority" of the sane people in Thailand can see through it.

Give it up. 'Bob', can't and won't be reasonable. He has a mission and he will let neither logic nor the facts stand in his way. He seems to have no moral compass nor pride. Sad, really.

Does anyone believe Boppe's rhetoric extolling the complete innocence of the convicted criminal fugitive, ignoring the 15 charges waiting trial. All written off as "politically motivated" eh, even before any evidence is presented? The hidden assets really was an honest mistake after all eh Bop? Just a misunderstood self proclaimed genius who should be above all this law and elections nonsense.

He wasn't elected, or even dares to come back and face the music, but it's still o k for him to run the country? Very democratic indeed! Just like his attempts to stifle critics and free speech with his threats of law suits, and use of the top cyber policeman to threaten social media posters. Laughable that a convicted criminal on the run can order the government and police what to do, Clearly, he's above the law and that's perfectly o k with Boppe.

Does anyone really believe these Fresian Boppe posts are written by an aged expat from a rural region of the Netherlands?

"Just like his attempts to stifle critics and free speech with his threats of law suits"

One thing about these Elitist coup advocates, they will stop at nothing to achieve their goal...I see their misleading stuff all the time in their mainstream media.

This penchant for making up stories and reporting them as fact, was challenged by Thaksin, the guy they were after, considering they couln't beat him in an election.....He essentially challenged them about these stories..."prove it under oath"......What did they do?......Run away, screaming the exact verbiage of above quote.

The anti-UDD/RS/PTP Media was no different then, than now.

[Thai at Heart]

quote name="northernjohn" post="7691881" timestamp="1397540529"]

Call for Thai senior statesman to help resolve political stalemate

By English News

BANGKOK, April 15 A group of respected older Thai citizens has called on Privy Council President Prem Tinsulanonda to take the leading role in seeking a royal command to resolve Thailands months-long political impasse.

Former supreme commander Saiyud Kerdpol said the current political crisis could be resolved by the power of His Majesty the King as in cases in the past, including the October 14, 1973 student uprising and the 1992 Black May events.

Gen Saiyud gave a press conference on Resolutions for Thailand together with Pramote Nakornthap, independent academic, Terdsak Sajjaraksa, former deputy air force commander, and Prasai Songsuravej, former governor of the National Housing Authority.

They identified themselves as members of the State Individual Group.

Gen Saiyud said the Kings charisma will lead Thailand through the political crisis but His Majesty has to stay away from politics.

In this case, Gen Prem who is in the prestigious position of Thailands senior statesman should be the pillar for the judiciary, military and society by presenting a royal command for HM the Kings endorsement, he said.

Gen Saiyud said he believed that Thai society will accept a royal command as in the past, adding that the royal command is different to that proposed in accord with Section 7 of the Constitution.

Caretaker Justice Minister Chaikasem Nitisiri earlier proposed that His Majesty could be asked to exercise his power as stipulated in Section 7 of the Constitution in case of a political vacuum.

Caretaker Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra is currently awaiting two crucial rulings one from the National Anti-Corruption Commission concerning her role in the rice pledging scheme and the other from the Constitutional Court on the transfer of National Security Council chief Thawil Pliensri. If found guilty, she could be removed from power.

Mr Pramote said the older citizens proposal was by no means a move to disturb HM the King.

Bancherd Singkaneti, rector of the Faculty of Law, National Institute for Development Administration, described it as one of several proposed resolutions for the country.

Whether the group should wait until the country is plunged into a political vacuum or not before making the proposal, he said, is subject, a matter of opinion. (MCOT online news)

-- TNA 2014-04-15

Why not just let the Thai people work out their political differences in a democratic manner through elections. There is no need to tread them like children, and be lead around like children by Prem or any other "elder statesmen."

Tried that..........didn't work!!!!

Certainly not to the satisfaction of this lot . medical for the poor, otop, money for villages, subsidies here and there.

Outrageous.

I am instinctively very scared of retired armed forces people planning things like this. If this south america, everyone would be up in arms.

Why anyone gets a feeling to want to trust these fossils god only knows. Its a coup, no matter what spin is put on it.

Funny thing about you is you are for any thing Thaksin OKs and against any thing he doesn't Ok.

The money here and there is supposed to go to the farmers not to politicians with off shore bank accounts.

Yes deliver all your villages votes and you will receive some money. Free medical my ass It is 30 baht where as it was free under the Democrats. The 30 baht cost 50 baht to administer which has to come out of the medical fund net result loss of medical services Nurses demonstrating and Doctors demonstrating. 1 million cases treated for 30 baht equals 20 million less baht for treating people.

Why do I have to pay a 1,000 baht a month for my mother in law to receive a medical shot she needs when she is on this so called free medical plan you talk about?

But that is all OK because you are afraid of retired army personnel.

You have it backwards. It is the active army personnel you a should be afraid of. They are the ones who can do the damage. Fortunately they are sitting on the side lines offering to help negotiate and not rattling swords.

Who cares 30 or 50 or zero. It wasn't there at all before. Everything that has ever been put up by TRT/PTP has been vilified by the so called elite.

Everything. It has stole their fire.

[SICHONSTEVE]

One too many words fab4 - the 'Constitution' won the day!!

Interpretation of the constitution is the key word, I think you'll find. 6 judges said the Election was unconstitutional, 3 judges said that it was constitutional.

Surely something wrong there?

Maybe the constitution needs rewriting to make it clear, ah, let's not go there..............................

No!! lets go there - the constitution does need rewriting by way of reforms (before) holding a free and fair election, easy!!!

The fact that the vote was split 6 - 3 means that it was not politically contrived and was unbiased depending on the jurors personal take on the matter.

[rametindallas]

Prem Tinsulanonda http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prem_Tinsulanonda

After all the demonizing of Prem after the 2006 coup and Prem being accused of pulling the strings of the mysterious 'third hand'. I can't see how Gen. Prem can be effective in this role (nor will Thaksin accept him) and that is why I think he will refuse to be the mediator. Dr. Thaksin will not accept anything less than one of his puppets being in charge and Suthep, who may be to only man in Thailand as stubborn as Thaksin, will not accept any Thaksin puppets in a future government. I am not saying this is democratic in any way, as both men abhor democracy. Dr. Thaksin has approached Suthep several times wanting to cut a secret, back-room deal but Suthep remains adamant on public discussions of the future of democracy in Thailand; besides, he can't trust Thaksin to abide by any secret deals. Would you?

So, Thailand will plod along with nothing changing except the days of the calendar until something dramatic happens. I expect the courts will precipitate the only changes in the near future.

You are assuming that Thaksin and Suthep need to be part of this. One is a convicted criminal and the other has charges against him. Why should they be part of this?

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Well, Thaksin controls the PTP which can mobilize 45% of the electorate on a good day and Suthep leads the movement that has the whole country tied in knots since November. I wasn't aware of any other power players in this game. Please tell me, if not Thaksin and Suthep, who will make the decisions here? I suppose the acting President of the Senate could nominate a replacement, temporary PM for Royal Endorsement and that would bypass both T and S but I'm sure PTP would involve the courts if that was done. How do you think the issue of succession will play out?

[BlueNoseCodger]

Why not just let the Thai people work out their political differences in a democratic manner through elections. There is no need to tread them like children, and be lead around like children by Prem or any other "elder statesmen."

Tried that..........didn't work!!!!

Certainly not to the satisfaction of this lot . medical for the poor, otop, money for villages, subsidies here and there.

Outrageous.

I am instinctively very scared of retired armed forces people planning things like this. If this south america, everyone would be up in arms.

Why anyone gets a feeling to want to trust these fossils god only knows. Its a coup, no matter what spin is put on it.

Funny thing about you is you are for any thing Thaksin OKs and against any thing he doesn't Ok.

The money here and there is supposed to go to the farmers not to politicians with off shore bank accounts.

Yes deliver all your villages votes and you will receive some money. Free medical my ass It is 30 baht where as it was free under the Democrats. The 30 baht cost 50 baht to administer which has to come out of the medical fund net result loss of medical services Nurses demonstrating and Doctors demonstrating. 1 million cases treated for 30 baht equals 20 million less baht for treating people.

Why do I have to pay a 1,000 baht a month for my mother in law to receive a medical shot she needs when she is on this so called free medical plan you talk about?

But that is all OK because you are afraid of retired army personnel.

You have it backwards. It is the active army personnel you a should be afraid of. They are the ones who can do the damage. Fortunately they are sitting on the side lines offering to help negotiate and not rattling swords.

The healthcare costs 1800 baht per person paid by the government, not 30. That's just the fee the person pays per visit to stop them abusing the system, 60% of hospital revenue is from the government health scheme, it was introduced by Thaksin and neither dems nor coup government has removed it, so if you don't like socialize medicine form a party and campaign on it. Hospitals like it, it's the majority of their income now!

Funny, because it was one of the major claims used to oust Thaksin. They claimed he was bankrupting hospitals by this 30 baht scheme, while neglecting to tell anyone that each hopsital was getting 1500 baht/person for everyone in their catchment area. Yet as soon as they got the coup, the military kept the scheme and dropped the 30 baht part!

The same pattern of endless lies and false allegations are now used against Yingluk, yet none of them stick. The evidence they claim turns out to be lies, the claims false and malicious.

Suthep says he'll choose a PM and appoint it via a Section 7 request, and this group magically appears wanting to choose Prem and appoint Prems chosen one via a Section 7. It's not difficult to see who Suthep is phoning all the time, the backer he keeps consulting, the one we had to wait all day for.

[Bluespunk]

now 6 letters ... starts with an 'A' and ends in a 'T'

Artist

Ageist

Aghast

Albert

Almost

August

[harkish]

Oh goodness, was he head of the group of retired prominent bureaucrats that proposed himself? No surprises here, and no support from the red side, I suspect. But they are probably betting that they don't need it, that support for Thaksin has dropped enough upcountry that the judicial coup option won't lead to much of a response. And they might be right. It will be interesting to see.

[Old Man River]

First a history of military coups. Then a Court coup. Now a Covenant coup? Thailand politics seem to have an unlimited imagination when it comes to obstructing or destroying democracy but mindless when it comes to preserving it. Hopefully the EC will see to its responsibility to cease obstructing new elections and cooperate with the Government to get the country moving forward once again to the re-establishment of a democratically elected administraion.

If, as you say, democracy is having problems surviving in Thailand, then perhaps democracy is not the right system for Thailand.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[Just1Voice]

Prem should be the appointed as the permanent PM of Thailand because he is neutral and accepted by all parties as the non-bias true leader, and love the king.

Do your parents know their minor children play on their computer when they are not around?

[BlueNoseCodger]

First a history of military coups. Then a Court coup. Now a Covenant coup? Thailand politics seem to have an unlimited imagination when it comes to obstructing or destroying democracy but mindless when it comes to preserving it. Hopefully the EC will see to its responsibility to cease obstructing new elections and cooperate with the Government to get the country moving forward once again to the re-establishment of a democratically elected administraion.

If, as you say, democracy is having problems surviving in Thailand, then perhaps democracy is not the right system for Thailand.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

I'm having difficulty overcoming this tumour, so perhaps a tumour free life isn't right for BlueNoseCodger? I should hire Prem to mediate with the tumour, perhaps? Will the tumour end up rich like the others Prem negotiates with? The young turks now abroad, General Suchinda who moved from the failed 1992 coup to be head of telecom Asia?

This is the modern age, perhaps we can track down all these people now, and start digging into their lives to find out the who/what/where/when of their various coups. Who gave the young turks commands, or did they decide for themselves?

I think, given what we know about this present coup, we should re-examine previous coups to see if any patterns can be discerned.

Learn from previous coups to strengthen democracy, and block future attempts to undermine the elected government by third hand attempts at coups.

Edited April 15, 2014 by BlueNoseCodger

[fab4]

One too many words fab4 - the 'Constitution' won the day!!

Interpretation of the constitution is the key word, I think you'll find. 6 judges said the Election was unconstitutional, 3 judges said that it was constitutional.

Surely something wrong there?

Maybe the constitution needs rewriting to make it clear, ah, let's not go there..............................

No!! lets go there - the constitution does need rewriting by way of reforms (before) holding a free and fair election, easy!!!

The fact that the vote was split 6 - 3 means that it was not politically contrived and was unbiased depending on the jurors personal take on the matter.

And that was just what the PTP were going to do until the CC stepped in (several times, becoming increasingly bizarre in their rulings as they went along).

A 6 - 3 ruling doesn't mean it was not "politically contrived and unbiased" at all - how could it? I would suggest the very opposite is the case with that ruling.

[SICHONSTEVE]

First a history of military coups. Then a Court coup. Now a Covenant coup? Thailand politics seem to have an unlimited imagination when it comes to obstructing or destroying democracy but mindless when it comes to preserving it. Hopefully the EC will see to its responsibility to cease obstructing new elections and cooperate with the Government to get the country moving forward once again to the re-establishment of a democratically elected administraion.

If, as you say, democracy is having problems surviving in Thailand, then perhaps democracy is not the right system for Thailand.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

I stated this months ago - Thailand needs a helping hand and is not mature enough for democracy. What it needs is benign dictatorship!!

[SICHONSTEVE]

One too many words fab4 - the 'Constitution' won the day!!

Interpretation of the constitution is the key word, I think you'll find. 6 judges said the Election was unconstitutional, 3 judges said that it was constitutional.

Surely something wrong there?

Maybe the constitution needs rewriting to make it clear, ah, let's not go there..............................

No!! lets go there - the constitution does need rewriting by way of reforms (before) holding a free and fair election, easy!!!

The fact that the vote was split 6 - 3 means that it was not politically contrived and was unbiased depending on the jurors personal take on the matter.

And that was just what the PTP were going to do until the CC stepped in (several times, becoming increasingly bizarre in their rulings as they went along).

A 6 - 3 ruling doesn't mean it was not "politically contrived and unbiased" at all - how could it? I would suggest the very opposite is the case with that ruling.

You do see things in funny ways!!!

[JAG]

"The problem is, he's a convicted criminal on the run, and no one voted for him.

You don't see a problem in that?"

Thank you for agreeing that Thaksin is actually running this country, finally.

The problem is, he's a convicted criminal on the run, and no one voted for him.

You don't see a problem in that?

Not the least bit.

The only crowd who sees that Thaksin court thing as anything other than politically motivated, and part of the Thaksin demonization campaign I referenced, are those trying to 'normalize the abnormal" today, with respect to the judiciary and Ind. Org's.

There is an attempt to reprise this whole thing now, using many of the same tactics as were used in 2006.....Although they are trying to be more subtle now......By not using the military, they hope to obscure their intentions from an International audience.

That little add-on via edit, about no-one voting for Thaksin is folderol....He was duly elected until the unelectable Elites "unelected him" in 2006....His association with the last election was huge and transparent...The electorate governed themselves accordingly.....They are quite happy to see his influence, and voted for it....Only the electorally-challenged PAD-Dem's are unhappy......But blinded to the need to "reform themselves before an election".

You don't see a problem in someone running a country that wasn't elected, interesting, and I love your attempts to rewrite history once again. So blind. So sad. I'll let all the other convicted criminals on the run worldwide know that it's not a problem, you can rape and pillage to your hearts content, be convicted, but still run a country even though they weren't on the ballot. They'll be so happy.

So, did Thaksin do ANYTHING illegal prior to his conviction in your blinkered tiny little mind? Or is he completely innocent of all charges?

By the way, the only attempt to reprise/rewrite anything just now are your attempts to whitewash Thaksin and PT of any wrongdoing and your attempts to legitimize his criminal actions. Thankfully, the "majority" of the sane people in Thailand can see through it.

Give it up. 'Bob', can't and won't be reasonable. He has a mission and he will let neither logic nor the facts stand in his way. He seems to have no moral compass nor pride. Sad, really.

Does anyone believe Boppe's rhetoric extolling the complete innocence of the convicted criminal fugitive, ignoring the 15 charges waiting trial. All written off as "politically motivated" eh, even before any evidence is presented? The hidden assets really was an honest mistake after all eh Bop? Just a misunderstood self proclaimed genius who should be above all this law and elections nonsense.

He wasn't elected, or even dares to come back and face the music, but it's still o k for him to run the country? Very democratic indeed! Just like his attempts to stifle critics and free speech with his threats of law suits, and use of the top cyber policeman to threaten social media posters. Laughable that a convicted criminal on the run can order the government and police what to do, Clearly, he's above the law and that's perfectly o k with Boppe.

Does anyone really believe these Fresian Boppe posts are written by an aged expat from a rural region of the Netherlands?

They appear to have a number of posters on this forum excited, to the extent that they feel the need to allege that he is in the pay of Thaksin, is really Robert Amsterdam etc. I am sure that given time some of the more excitable posters will burst forth to claim that he is the spawn of the devil, the Antichrist or some such. At least one prolific antipodean with multiple identities will no doubt soon call for him to be "crushed".

Perhaps he is just a chap from the rural coastal Netherlands, who holds views on the current situation which are not shared by many/most on this board, and who has the time and interest to make them public. Doesn't make him evil you know.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[JAG]

First a history of military coups. Then a Court coup. Now a Covenant coup? Thailand politics seem to have an unlimited imagination when it comes to obstructing or destroying democracy but mindless when it comes to preserving it. Hopefully the EC will see to its responsibility to cease obstructing new elections and cooperate with the Government to get the country moving forward once again to the re-establishment of a democratically elected administraion.

If, as you say, democracy is having problems surviving in Thailand, then perhaps democracy is not the right system for Thailand.

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I stated this months ago - Thailand needs a helping hand and is not mature enough for democracy. What it needs is benign dictatorship!!

The trouble with benign dictatorships is that to survive they have to suppress any opposition. Unless that opposition is supine ( and in Thailand it won't be) then they pretty soon stop being benign, and have to become ruthless.

With the anticipated unhappy event this bunch are old men in a hurry. They will be ruthless.

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[Morch]

First a history of military coups. Then a Court coup. Now a Covenant coup? Thailand politics seem to have an unlimited imagination when it comes to obstructing or destroying democracy but mindless when it comes to preserving it. Hopefully the EC will see to its responsibility to cease obstructing new elections and cooperate with the Government to get the country moving forward once again to the re-establishment of a democratically elected administraion.

They tried Suthep's 'peoples' coup... flopped... numbers don't add up.

They tried threats (threatening her son's safety and genital surgury against her), failed.

They tried to drag the military in via false flag attacks, also flopped, too many cameras recording their acts.

Direct pleas to the army? Flop, Prayuth says he can't just ignore the elected government.

They're trying for a judicial coup, but these judicial coup fronts opened up as Suthep's coup attempts were failing. It was a sign that Suthep had failed that they needed to open a new coup front.

Trying for a case based on Thawil while the senate is out for election? Likely flop, less than half of the appointed senators backed the case, so they couldn't even get a majority of appointees!

Now we have this new 'pensioners coup', but why would they open a new coup front if the judicial coup had succeeded? And to have to directly mention Prem, who normally stays hidden in the shadows, it suggests they don't have the people or the influence needed.

They did not, in fact, threat Yingluck's son's safety.

If they did carry out "false flag attacks" as you claim - where's the proof?

I'm sure you can find enough arguments against the PDRC's actions without resorting to made-up ones.

For the topic on hand - Prem is clearly not a suitable candidate to mediate the current impasse, seen as decidedly being in one side's favor. Same goes for the GOM who initiated this.

I think Anand said a while back that Thailand's problem isn't about knowing which reforms to take or how to go about it - just a lack of will to compromise.

[SICHONSTEVE]

First a history of military coups. Then a Court coup. Now a Covenant coup? Thailand politics seem to have an unlimited imagination when it comes to obstructing or destroying democracy but mindless when it comes to preserving it. Hopefully the EC will see to its responsibility to cease obstructing new elections and cooperate with the Government to get the country moving forward once again to the re-establishment of a democratically elected administraion.

If, as you say, democracy is having problems surviving in Thailand, then perhaps democracy is not the right system for Thailand.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

I stated this months ago - Thailand needs a helping hand and is not mature enough for democracy. What it needs is benign dictatorship!!

The trouble with benign dictatorships is that to survive they have to suppress any opposition. Unless that opposition is supine ( and in Thailand it won't be) then they pretty soon stop being benign, and have to become ruthless.

With the anticipated unhappy event this bunch are old men in a hurry. They will be ruthless.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

I can't disagree with that. Looks like they must look for a third way!!

[Morch]

So, did Thaksin do ANYTHING illegal prior to his conviction in your blinkered tiny little mind?" (Quote fromTatsujin, Post #18 above)

Not if the source of those accusations are rooted and sourced from the Coup-makers and all their appendages, as part of their demonization of Thaksin in order to validate themselves.

Lest anyone think that this opinion is aberrational, let me remind you that it reflects the Electoral Majority. Their very objective, measurable electoral actions support it......It is why there is such a concerted effort to silence that electoral majority, clearly evidenced this last election and by the Lumpini crowd, and their associates...........Check where the aberration is...It is not with this majority and this opinion, but the anti-democratic minority..

However, the greatest aberration, are those Farangs coming from countries with democratic traditions, who by consistently dumping on Thaksin, Ms. Y and the elected PTP, are effectively sympathizing with those who advocate a “Civilian Dictatorship” to replace Electoral and Parliamentary Democracy…….I am not one of those!

So basically, in your mind, there was no need for the infamous Amnesty bill, as anyway, anything Thaksin did during the covered time span was completely legit by virtue of Thaksin doing it?

[Morch]

You don't see a problem in someone running a country that wasn't elected, interesting, and I love your attempts to rewrite history once again. So blind. So sad. I'll let all the other convicted criminals on the run worldwide know that it's not a problem, you can rape and pillage to your hearts content, be convicted, but still run a country even though they weren't on the ballot. They'll be so happy.

So, did Thaksin do ANYTHING illegal prior to his conviction in your blinkered tiny little mind? Or is he completely innocent of all charges?

By the way, the only attempt to reprise/rewrite anything just now are your attempts to whitewash Thaksin and PT of any wrongdoing and your attempts to legitimize his criminal actions. Thankfully, the "majority" of the sane people in Thailand can see through it.

Give it up. 'Bob', can't and won't be reasonable. He has a mission and he will let neither logic nor the facts stand in his way. He seems to have no moral compass nor pride. Sad, really.

Does anyone believe Boppe's rhetoric extolling the complete innocence of the convicted criminal fugitive, ignoring the 15 charges waiting trial. All written off as "politically motivated" eh, even before any evidence is presented? The hidden assets really was an honest mistake after all eh Bop? Just a misunderstood self proclaimed genius who should be above all this law and elections nonsense.

He wasn't elected, or even dares to come back and face the music, but it's still o k for him to run the country? Very democratic indeed! Just like his attempts to stifle critics and free speech with his threats of law suits, and use of the top cyber policeman to threaten social media posters. Laughable that a convicted criminal on the run can order the government and police what to do, Clearly, he's above the law and that's perfectly o k with Boppe.

Does anyone really believe these Fresian Boppe posts are written by an aged expat from a rural region of the Netherlands?

"Just like his attempts to stifle critics and free speech with his threats of law suits"

One thing about these Elitist coup advocates, they will stop at nothing to achieve their goal...I see their misleading stuff all the time in their mainstream media.

This penchant for making up stories and reporting them as fact, was challenged by Thaksin, the guy they were after, considering they couln't beat him in an election.....He essentially challenged them about these stories..."prove it under oath"......What did they do?......Run away, screaming the exact verbiage of above quote.

The anti-UDD/RS/PTP Media was no different then, than now.

More like prove it under threat of going bankrupt and/or pulling a disappearing act.

Unless mistaken, most defamation cases filed by Thaksin were actually dropped.

[Fryslan boppe]

"Perhaps he (FB) is just a chap from the rural coastal Netherlands, who holds views on the current situation which are not shared by many/most on this board, and who has the time and interest to make them public" (Quote from Post #83 - Jag)

Not shared by many/most on this board, but reflecting the views among UDD/RS's, which happen to make up the bulk of the electoral majority.

The attempt to make those views appear to be aberrational does not take into account that majority/minority reality....In fact, seeking to make the majority view aberrational, and their minority one normative, just doesn't fly, other than among those minority accolytes............The real world doesn't compute that way.

[Morch]

"Perhaps he (FB) is just a chap from the rural coastal Netherlands, who holds views on the current situation which are not shared by many/most on this board, and who has the time and interest to make them public" (Quote from Post #83 - Jag)

Not shared by many/most on this board, but reflecting the views among UDD/RS's, which happen to make up the bulk of the electoral majority.

The attempt to make those views appear to be aberrational does not take into account that majority/minority reality....In fact, seeking to make the majority view aberrational, and their minority one normative, just doesn't fly, other than among those minority accolytes............The real world doesn't compute that way.

I do wish you'd stop using the "electoral majority" bit.

The PTP had a majority in Parliament, not a popular vote majority - the UDD aren't a party.

The majority in Parliament was not due to getting the majority of votes, but due to Thailand's elections system (party list and constituencies). They got more votes than the Democrat Party, they were the largest party - that's about it, no need to overdo it.