Legally work as a freelance programmer in Thailand

[AYJAYDEE]

I would agree it would constitute work.. But its just another vague law, with poor consistency, and even worse understanding of enforcement. If the people enforcing the laws cannot get it right per a definition, what hope does anyone else have.

Even the very definition of 'work' is a joke.. They use the word 'work' within the definition of the term 'work'.. Someone needs to go back and do logic 101.

Exactly. By the definition as stated in the Thai immigration policy millions of tourists are breaking the law when they check or respond to emails or have to make a call to the office.

It is a joke, the definition is covers everything from running a gogo bar to helping the house maid hang out washing.

I am sure they will get around to rewriting it at some point. Personally I fail to see any economic downside to allowing well paid, tax paying professionals to work in Thailand. There is a serious problem in this country with the 5+ million people working illegally (estimated as of 2005), but the problem does not lye with Freelance IT professionals and freelance business consultant that are more than willing to pay tax.

dos your home country allow just any IT guy that feels like living there and working do so?

[arnold40844]

Its a very vague question.

I come from the UK, we have a Tier based system, below are the different Visas that relate to work. Tier 1 is highly skilled, Tier 2 is Skilled, Tier 3 was finally dropped in 2010 and was designed for nonskilled workers, Tier 4 is for students.

Its very black and white here, the options are very limited if you are not being employed by a Thai firm or you are not willing to setup a company and employ staff.

I am just saying from an econimic perspective Thailand should do its self a favor and sort this out.

Tier 1 (Entrepreneur) visa
Tier 1 (Exceptional Talent) visa
Tier 1 (General) visa
Tier 1 (Graduate Entrepreneur) visa
Tier 1 (Investor) visa
Tier 2 Priority Service
Tier 2 (General) visa
Tier 2 (Intra-company Transfer) visa
Tier 2 (Minister of religion) visa
Tier 2 (Sportsperson) visa
Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Charity Worker) visa
Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Creative and sporting) visa
Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Government Authorised Exchange) visa
Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - International Agreement) visa
Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Religious Worker) visa
Tier 5 (Youth Mobility Scheme) visa
Domestic Workers in a Private Household visa
Representative of an Overseas Business visa
Turkish Businessperson visa
Turkish Worker visa
UK Ancestry visa
Working in the UK as a Croatian national
Check a biometric residence permit
UK visa sponsorship for employers
UK visa sponsorship management system

I would agree it would constitute work.. But its just another vague law, with poor consistency, and even worse understanding of enforcement. If the people enforcing the laws cannot get it right per a definition, what hope does anyone else have.

Even the very definition of 'work' is a joke.. They use the word 'work' within the definition of the term 'work'.. Someone needs to go back and do logic 101.

Exactly. By the definition as stated in the Thai immigration policy millions of tourists are breaking the law when they check or respond to emails or have to make a call to the office.

It is a joke, the definition is covers everything from running a gogo bar to helping the house maid hang out washing.

I am sure they will get around to rewriting it at some point. Personally I fail to see any economic downside to allowing well paid, tax paying professionals to work in Thailand. There is a serious problem in this country with the 5+ million people working illegally (estimated as of 2005), but the problem does not lye with Freelance IT professionals and freelance business consultant that are more than willing to pay tax.

dos your home country allow just any IT guy that feels like living there and working do so?

[Stan7444]

I do similar (not IT but travel related)

I used a non multiple visa for years now as over 50 on a o retirement visa I work from home and regular business trips realistically if you don't have a high profile or broadcast it to neighbors farang or Thai never had a problem.

I suspect I am not alone doing this!

Not sure where all of the TV commentators are getting their info but I have spoken with many attorneys in Thailand and "it is not illegal to be conducting business in other countries while resident in the Kingdom as long as you are not conducting any business, paid or unpaid, in the Kingdom." As I have pointed out many times, if it were illegal to conduct international business while physically located in the Kingdom then all of the people in the airports and other tourists in hotels would be subjected to being arrested.

Suggest you consult with a good US or other farang lawyer who is located in Thailand (almost exclusively in BKK, Phuket or Pattaya), and they will confirm the above. You can get a list on any of the foreign chamber of commerces websites, such as: http://www.amchamthailand.com/ACCT/asp/corplist_type.asp?SponsorID=1108. On this site, select business type (Legal) and click search. I have found Michael Doyle as one of the best American attorneys who has lived in Thailand many years and he reads and speaks Thai fluently. http://www.amchamthailand.com/ACCT/asp/corpdetail.asp?CorpID=84.

[arnold40844]

For example youth Mobility Visas in the UK (formerly Working Holidaymaker Visas) are still incredibly popular with freelancers under the age of 30 from Australia and New Zealand. Many IT professionals in particular choose to come over to the UK for a period of up to two years in order to gain valuable experience of consulting abroad. Tier 5 Youth Mobility Visas allow Australian, Canadian, Japanese and New Zealand nationals to work freely in the UK for a period of up to two years, after which time they must leave the United Kingdom.

All im saying is that there are ways and means. In Thailand it is "B Visa" or "no B Visa".

When these changes are implemented, the revenue streams to the public sector will improve the welfare of this country significantly. Right now, this place is very unattractive to well paid freelancers looking for some sun.

Its a very vague question.

I come from the UK, we have a Tier based system, below are the different Visas that relate to work. Tier 1 is highly skilled, Tier 2 is Skilled, Tier 3 was finally dropped in 2010 and was designed for nonskilled workers, Tier 4 is for students.

Its very black and white here, the options are very limited if you are not being employed by a Thai firm or you are not willing to setup a company and employ staff.

I am just saying from an econimic perspective Thailand should do its self a favor and sort this out.

Tier 1 (Entrepreneur) visa
Tier 1 (Exceptional Talent) visa
Tier 1 (General) visa
Tier 1 (Graduate Entrepreneur) visa
Tier 1 (Investor) visa
Tier 2 Priority Service
Tier 2 (General) visa
Tier 2 (Intra-company Transfer) visa
Tier 2 (Minister of religion) visa
Tier 2 (Sportsperson) visa
Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Charity Worker) visa
Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Creative and sporting) visa
Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Government Authorised Exchange) visa
Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - International Agreement) visa
Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Religious Worker) visa
Tier 5 (Youth Mobility Scheme) visa
Domestic Workers in a Private Household visa
Representative of an Overseas Business visa
Turkish Businessperson visa
Turkish Worker visa
UK Ancestry visa
Working in the UK as a Croatian national
Check a biometric residence permit
UK visa sponsorship for employers
UK visa sponsorship management system

I would agree it would constitute work.. But its just another vague law, with poor consistency, and even worse understanding of enforcement. If the people enforcing the laws cannot get it right per a definition, what hope does anyone else have.

Even the very definition of 'work' is a joke.. They use the word 'work' within the definition of the term 'work'.. Someone needs to go back and do logic 101.

Exactly. By the definition as stated in the Thai immigration policy millions of tourists are breaking the law when they check or respond to emails or have to make a call to the office.

It is a joke, the definition is covers everything from running a gogo bar to helping the house maid hang out washing.

I am sure they will get around to rewriting it at some point. Personally I fail to see any economic downside to allowing well paid, tax paying professionals to work in Thailand. There is a serious problem in this country with the 5+ million people working illegally (estimated as of 2005), but the problem does not lye with Freelance IT professionals and freelance business consultant that are more than willing to pay tax.

dos your home country allow just any IT guy that feels like living there and working do so?

[arnold40844]

As I think a few people have mentioned here, some of the laws in the kingdom need to be taken with a pinch of salt. Like prostitution and not wearing underpants.

I do similar (not IT but travel related)

I used a non multiple visa for years now as over 50 on a o retirement visa I work from home and regular business trips realistically if you don't have a high profile or broadcast it to neighbors farang or Thai never had a problem.

I suspect I am not alone doing this!

Not sure where all of the TV commentators are getting their info but I have spoken with many attorneys in Thailand and "it is not illegal to be conducting business in other countries while resident in the Kingdom as long as you are not conducting any business, paid or unpaid, in the Kingdom." As I have pointed out many times, if it were illegal to conduct international business while physically located in the Kingdom then all of the people in the airports and other tourists in hotels would be subjected to being arrested.

Suggest you consult with a good US or other farang lawyer who is located in Thailand (almost exclusively in BKK, Phuket or Pattaya), and they will confirm the above. You can get a list on any of the foreign chamber of commerces websites, such as: http://www.amchamthailand.com/ACCT/asp/corplist_type.asp?SponsorID=1108. On this site, select business type (Legal) and click search. I have found Michael Doyle as one of the best American attorneys who has lived in Thailand many years and he reads and speaks Thai fluently. http://www.amchamthailand.com/ACCT/asp/corpdetail.asp?CorpID=84.

[LivinLOS]

I do similar (not IT but travel related)

I used a non multiple visa for years now as over 50 on a o retirement visa I work from home and regular business trips realistically if you don't have a high profile or broadcast it to neighbors farang or Thai never had a problem.

I suspect I am not alone doing this!

Not sure where all of the TV commentators are getting their info but I have spoken with many attorneys in Thailand and "it is not illegal to be conducting business in other countries while resident in the Kingdom as long as you are not conducting any business, paid or unpaid, in the Kingdom." As I have pointed out many times, if it were illegal to conduct international business while physically located in the Kingdom then all of the people in the airports and other tourists in hotels would be subjected to being arrested.

Suggest you consult with a good US or other farang lawyer who is located in Thailand (almost exclusively in BKK, Phuket or Pattaya), and they will confirm the above. You can get a list on any of the foreign chamber of commerces websites, such as: http://www.amchamthailand.com/ACCT/asp/corplist_type.asp?SponsorID=1108. On this site, select business type (Legal) and click search. I have found Michael Doyle as one of the best American attorneys who has lived in Thailand many years and he reads and speaks Thai fluently. http://www.amchamthailand.com/ACCT/asp/corpdetail.asp?CorpID=84.

The part in bold is what catches everyone out.

[Soutpeel]

I do similar (not IT but travel related)

I used a non multiple visa for years now as over 50 on a o retirement visa I work from home and regular business trips realistically if you don't have a high profile or broadcast it to neighbors farang or Thai never had a problem.

I suspect I am not alone doing this!

Not sure where all of the TV commentators are getting their info but I have spoken with many attorneys in Thailand and "it is not illegal to be conducting business in other countries while resident in the Kingdom as long as you are not conducting any business, paid or unpaid, in the Kingdom." As I have pointed out many times, if it were illegal to conduct international business while physically located in the Kingdom then all of the people in the airports and other tourists in hotels would be subjected to being arrested.

Suggest you consult with a good US or other farang lawyer who is located in Thailand (almost exclusively in BKK, Phuket or Pattaya), and they will confirm the above. You can get a list on any of the foreign chamber of commerces websites, such as: http://www.amchamthailand.com/ACCT/asp/corplist_type.asp?SponsorID=1108. On this site, select business type (Legal) and click search. I have found Michael Doyle as one of the best American attorneys who has lived in Thailand many years and he reads and speaks Thai fluently. http://www.amchamthailand.com/ACCT/asp/corpdetail.asp?CorpID=84.

And as said in the similar post you made in another thread on the same subject, Attorneys can only offer an opinion on the law, what is "legal or not" is down to a court of law to decide.

Have said "many attorneys" given this you in writing on their letterhead etc ?...All they can possibly say in OUR interpretation of the law is that its not not illegal...if they have, I would be interested to see they wrote.

Further why consult a good US lawyer or farang lawyer if they are not licensed to practice law in Thailand ? if they are not licensed, why are they offering advice in legal system they are not licensed to practice in ? and this in fact could be illegal in its self, if they are licensed fine, but again all they can do is offer an opinion.

People keep spinning these red herring's "I have spoken to a lawyer and they say its ok, if you have spoken to a lawyer, you have paid for their services and they have clarified a "point of law" one would at least expect to see something in writing, this has certainly been the case of every lawyer I have dealt with Thailand included their "advice" is summarized at least in writing

I am sorry if someone gets banged up in a jail or court case over this, Its a bit of weak defense to say... "XYZ lawyers TOLD me its ok", however if one ended up in a court and pulled out a letter from said legal stating this then yes you have acted on the written advice of lawyer and you might just get away with it...

One suspects if you asked a Thai legal company or DOL to put in writing that "Person XYZ" PP number doesn't need to WP"...they would run a mile

[DrTuner]

One thing to consider if using an umbrella company to go legit: The work permit has an address where you're supposed to work. Since that would be your home, there might be difficulties because the address is not registered for business.

[Stanley78]

afther the visa runners, immigration might have a go at all those "website developpers" working illegaly ...

and apparently, there are quiete a few members here that seem to be involved ...

next thing : police are checking farang houses / telephone lines and internet connections with a lot of upload / download activities / ftp connections

I'm going to go out on a limb here and second guess you a bit. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

You resent the fact that there are "website developers" living and working in Thailand without a permit. I agree that you have every right to disagree with their choice. That's your prerogative.

But let's be realistic here, just because you disapprove of it doesn't mean that it is likely that the police would ever go around checking apartments where the internet connection has "a lot of FTP connections".

As for "a lot of upload / download activities" yes that would be great for catching people who share movies etc. online.

But working on developing websites doesn't necessarily use much data, especially compared to movies, and I am speaking as a person who has previously worked as a developer and who owns some quite popular sites.

[samran]

So where is the holier-than-thou brigade from the visa exempt crackdown threads?

Sitting back and watching you squirm?

[samran]

Its a very vague question.

I come from the UK, we have a Tier based system, below are the different Visas that relate to work. Tier 1 is highly skilled, Tier 2 is Skilled, Tier 3 was finally dropped in 2010 and was designed for nonskilled workers, Tier 4 is for students.

Its very black and white here, the options are very limited if you are not being employed by a Thai firm or you are not willing to setup a company and employ staff.

I am just saying from an econimic perspective Thailand should do its self a favor and sort this out.

Tier 1 (Entrepreneur) visa

Tier 1 (Exceptional Talent) visa

Tier 1 (General) visa

Tier 1 (Graduate Entrepreneur) visa

Tier 1 (Investor) visa

Tier 2 Priority Service

Tier 2 (General) visa

Tier 2 (Intra-company Transfer) visa

Tier 2 (Minister of religion) visa

Tier 2 (Sportsperson) visa

Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Charity Worker) visa

Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Creative and sporting) visa

Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Government Authorised Exchange) visa

Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - International Agreement) visa

Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Religious Worker) visa

Tier 5 (Youth Mobility Scheme) visa

Domestic Workers in a Private Household visa

Representative of an Overseas Business visa

Turkish Businessperson visa

Turkish Worker visa

UK Ancestry visa

Working in the UK as a Croatian national

Check a biometric residence permit

UK visa sponsorship for employers

UK visa sponsorship management system

Pretend for a second that you aren't a UK or EU citizen. Now look into the requirements for getting one of those visas you mention above (hint, it ain't easy).

Having gotten a tier one visa under my own steam I can say the uk ain't easy. If you think the UK is a virtue of transparency, I suggest you google the HSMP Ltd vs Home Office case which highlighted the UK governments slipshod handling of the tier one category you show above.

If you think the moaners are load now, go right ahead and institute the above.

You also might note that Australia and Thailand have reciprocal working holiday visas. That there are not more probably reflects the fact that not western countries don't want to negotiate reciprocal arrangements.

Edited May 20, 2014 by samran

[DrTuner]

You also might note that Australia and Thailand have reciprocal working holiday visas. That there are not more probably reflects the fact that not western countries don't want to negotiate reciprocal arrangements.

The case with Europe and those arrangements was made difficult with the Schengen area. Individual countries in the area can't make their own arrangements any more. Otherwise there might be a few countries with a bilateral agreement.

[samran]

You also might note that Australia and Thailand have reciprocal working holiday visas. That there are not more probably reflects the fact that not western countries don't want to negotiate reciprocal arrangements.

The case with Europe and those arrangements was made difficult with the Schengen area. Individual countries in the area can't make their own arrangements any more. Otherwise there might be a few countries with a bilateral agreement.

Don't think so. Australia has seperate agreements with UK and Ireland (outside shengen to be sure) but from memory France Germany and a bunch of Scandinavian countries.

[Soutpeel]

But let's be realistic here, just because you disapprove of it doesn't mean that it is likely that the police would ever go around checking apartments where the internet connection has "a lot of FTP connections".

As for "a lot of upload / download activities" yes that would be great for catching people who share movies etc.

your correct the police are not going to go around knocking on door, but can we concede at that large numbers of the "on-liners" ,maybe not all, in Thailand are in and out Thailand on back to back tourist visa's, back to back visa waivers etc.

Therefore if the intent of the Thai authorities is to stop people working illegally in Thailand isn't the best place to start this at the borders ?, which it seems they are doing as regards the back to back visa's runs/visa Waivers

They will "catch out" more illegal workers doing this than they ever would, by investigating things case for case and the added advantage is, they don't need court cases, or prosecute people, if immigration even suspect your working and you cant prove you are complying with the terms of your stay in terms of the visa you hold or the reason you are living in Thailand full time....they can deny you entry.

The net result is the same...they are stopping people working illegally and going this route has the advantage, it costs them nothing budget wise and the Illegal workers are coming them

Based on the number of threads, on the "new visa rules" and the question of working on line, one suspects there are large numbers of people working on line in Thailand, and border running.

Edited May 20, 2014 by Soutpeel

[arnold40844]

I am aware how tough it is in the UK, been through it with my wife and 2 children.

My point was purely around the fact that if you're an IT contractor who earns say £100K a year (modest for a mid level Java developer) and wish to move to the UK, you will be granted a work visa, pay tax and go about your business. In Thailand it just goes back to this register a company, employ Thai's etc, etc......

Its a very vague question.

I come from the UK, we have a Tier based system, below are the different Visas that relate to work. Tier 1 is highly skilled, Tier 2 is Skilled, Tier 3 was finally dropped in 2010 and was designed for nonskilled workers, Tier 4 is for students.

Its very black and white here, the options are very limited if you are not being employed by a Thai firm or you are not willing to setup a company and employ staff.

I am just saying from an econimic perspective Thailand should do its self a favor and sort this out.

Tier 1 (Entrepreneur) visa
Tier 1 (Exceptional Talent) visa
Tier 1 (General) visa
Tier 1 (Graduate Entrepreneur) visa
Tier 1 (Investor) visa
Tier 2 Priority Service
Tier 2 (General) visa
Tier 2 (Intra-company Transfer) visa
Tier 2 (Minister of religion) visa
Tier 2 (Sportsperson) visa
Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Charity Worker) visa
Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Creative and sporting) visa
Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Government Authorised Exchange) visa
Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - International Agreement) visa
Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Religious Worker) visa
Tier 5 (Youth Mobility Scheme) visa
Domestic Workers in a Private Household visa
Representative of an Overseas Business visa
Turkish Businessperson visa
Turkish Worker visa
UK Ancestry visa
Working in the UK as a Croatian national
Check a biometric residence permit
UK visa sponsorship for employers
UK visa sponsorship management system

Pretend for a second that you aren't a UK or EU citizen. Now look into the requirements for getting one of those visas you mention above (hint, it ain't easy).

Having gotten a tier one visa under my own steam I can say the uk ain't easy. If you think the UK is a virtue of transparency, I suggest you google the HSMP Ltd vs Home Office case which highlighted the UK governments slipshod handling of the tier one category you show above.

If you think the moaners are load now, go right ahead and institute the above.

You also might note that Australia and Thailand have reciprocal working holiday visas. That there are not more probably reflects the fact that not western countries don't want to negotiate reciprocal arrangements.

[samran]

I am aware how tough it is in the UK, been through it with my wife and 2 children.

My point was purely around the fact that if you're an IT contractor who earns say £100K a year (modest for a mid level Java developer) and wish to move to the UK, you will be granted a work visa, pay tax and go about your business. In Thailand it just goes back to this register a company, employ Thai's etc, etc......

Its a very vague question.

I come from the UK, we have a Tier based system, below are the different Visas that relate to work. Tier 1 is highly skilled, Tier 2 is Skilled, Tier 3 was finally dropped in 2010 and was designed for nonskilled workers, Tier 4 is for students.

Its very black and white here, the options are very limited if you are not being employed by a Thai firm or you are not willing to setup a company and employ staff.

I am just saying from an econimic perspective Thailand should do its self a favor and sort this out.

Tier 1 (Entrepreneur) visa

Tier 1 (Exceptional Talent) visa

Tier 1 (General) visa

Tier 1 (Graduate Entrepreneur) visa

Tier 1 (Investor) visa

Tier 2 Priority Service

Tier 2 (General) visa

Tier 2 (Intra-company Transfer) visa

Tier 2 (Minister of religion) visa

Tier 2 (Sportsperson) visa

Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Charity Worker) visa

Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Creative and sporting) visa

Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Government Authorised Exchange) visa

Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - International Agreement) visa

Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Religious Worker) visa

Tier 5 (Youth Mobility Scheme) visa

Domestic Workers in a Private Household visa

Representative of an Overseas Business visa

Turkish Businessperson visa

Turkish Worker visa

UK Ancestry visa

Working in the UK as a Croatian national

Check a biometric residence permit

UK visa sponsorship for employers

UK visa sponsorship management system

Pretend for a second that you aren't a UK or EU citizen. Now look into the requirements for getting one of those visas you mention above (hint, it ain't easy).

Having gotten a tier one visa under my own steam I can say the uk ain't easy. If you think the UK is a virtue of transparency, I suggest you google the HSMP Ltd vs Home Office case which highlighted the UK governments slipshod handling of the tier one category you show above.

If you think the moaners are load now, go right ahead and institute the above.

You also might note that Australia and Thailand have reciprocal working holiday visas. That there are not more probably reflects the fact that not western countries don't want to negotiate reciprocal arrangements.

Again tell me how it is done. The HSMP visa was done away with. Basically you need sponsorship now.

Again, pretend you are not an eu national, not married to one, and tell me how it is done and let's compare notes with Thailand...

[DrTuner]

You also might note that Australia and Thailand have reciprocal working holiday visas. That there are not more probably reflects the fact that not western countries don't want to negotiate reciprocal arrangements.

The case with Europe and those arrangements was made difficult with the Schengen area. Individual countries in the area can't make their own arrangements any more. Otherwise there might be a few countries with a bilateral agreement.

Don't think so. Australia has seperate agreements with UK and Ireland (outside shengen to be sure) but from memory France Germany and a bunch of Scandinavian countries.

France, Germany and the bunch of Scandinavian countries are Schengen. Once you're inside, there are no border checks. That's why they have to go for a unified policy. If one of them lets foreigners in on a custom policy, they have access to all the countries.

The work permits are a different matter, those can be decided on national basis. I don't remember what the exact policy of Finland is, but every Thai I know who's gone there is working, the government supports it. They are all women and married to a Finn. No such thing for me here, it's a one sided affair. Also every year a large number of Thais travel there to pick berries.

[Soutpeel]

Again tell me how it is done. The HSMP visa was done away with. Basically you need sponsorship now.

Again, pretend you are not an eu national, not married to one, and tell me how it is done and let's compare notes with Thailand...

Sponsorship...you mean like a UK company providing you with documentation to gain you a visa, and then arranging for you to work legally in the UK ?.....hang on doesn't Thailand require this as well ?

But TV's finest commentators state Thailand's visa/work law's are so racist, oppressive and very difficult to comply with and the rest of the civilized world would never considering doing things so oppressive..

[samran]

Again tell me how it is done. The HSMP visa was done away with. Basically you need sponsorship now.

Again, pretend you are not an eu national, not married to one, and tell me how it is done and let's compare notes with Thailand...

Sponsorship...you mean like a UK company providing you with documentation to gain you a visa, and then arranging for you to work legally in the UK ?.....hang on doesn't Thailand require this as well ?

But TV's finest commentators state Thailand's visa/work law's are so racist, oppressive and very difficult to comply with and the rest of the civilized world would never considering doing things so oppressive..

Stone the crows! Who would have thought??!

Too many commentators here who have never travelled or worked overseas in their lives. Nor with any understanding how their home country does it nevertheless deeming they can pass judgment on Thailand.

I can certainly say, as an independent foreigner going through the hoops to get the UK, the UK is awfully bureaucratic at all levels. Thailand is a breeze by comparison.

Edited May 20, 2014 by samran

[arnold40844]

The HSMP is basically just a Tier 1 general now.

There is a legitamately regulated industry in the UK of Contractor Management (Umbrella) companies who sponsor Visa's for contractors who meet specific criteria, I have worked in recruitment for 9 years and have worked with many of them. Im not saying its easy in the UK, im just saying if you meet a certain criteria its relatively straight forward. Here you can be a practicing Architect and all get is setup a company, employ 5 people, register capital etc etc....

I am aware how tough it is in the UK, been through it with my wife and 2 children.

My point was purely around the fact that if you're an IT contractor who earns say £100K a year (modest for a mid level Java developer) and wish to move to the UK, you will be granted a work visa, pay tax and go about your business. In Thailand it just goes back to this register a company, employ Thai's etc, etc......

Its a very vague question.

I come from the UK, we have a Tier based system, below are the different Visas that relate to work. Tier 1 is highly skilled, Tier 2 is Skilled, Tier 3 was finally dropped in 2010 and was designed for nonskilled workers, Tier 4 is for students.

Its very black and white here, the options are very limited if you are not being employed by a Thai firm or you are not willing to setup a company and employ staff.

I am just saying from an econimic perspective Thailand should do its self a favor and sort this out.

Tier 1 (Entrepreneur) visa
Tier 1 (Exceptional Talent) visa
Tier 1 (General) visa
Tier 1 (Graduate Entrepreneur) visa
Tier 1 (Investor) visa
Tier 2 Priority Service
Tier 2 (General) visa
Tier 2 (Intra-company Transfer) visa
Tier 2 (Minister of religion) visa
Tier 2 (Sportsperson) visa
Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Charity Worker) visa
Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Creative and sporting) visa
Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Government Authorised Exchange) visa
Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - International Agreement) visa
Tier 5 (Temporary Worker - Religious Worker) visa
Tier 5 (Youth Mobility Scheme) visa
Domestic Workers in a Private Household visa
Representative of an Overseas Business visa
Turkish Businessperson visa
Turkish Worker visa
UK Ancestry visa
Working in the UK as a Croatian national
Check a biometric residence permit
UK visa sponsorship for employers
UK visa sponsorship management system

Pretend for a second that you aren't a UK or EU citizen. Now look into the requirements for getting one of those visas you mention above (hint, it ain't easy).

Having gotten a tier one visa under my own steam I can say the uk ain't easy. If you think the UK is a virtue of transparency, I suggest you google the HSMP Ltd vs Home Office case which highlighted the UK governments slipshod handling of the tier one category you show above.

If you think the moaners are load now, go right ahead and institute the above.

You also might note that Australia and Thailand have reciprocal working holiday visas. That there are not more probably reflects the fact that not western countries don't want to negotiate reciprocal arrangements.

Again tell me how it is done. The HSMP visa was done away with. Basically you need sponsorship now.

Again, pretend you are not an eu national, not married to one, and tell me how it is done and let's compare notes with Thailand...

Edited May 20, 2014 by arnold40844

[DrTuner]

Found the ones for Finland: http://www.migri.fi/working_in_finland/self_employed_person . Foreigners can put up a company, which will set you back less than 100€, and then apply for a residence permit based on that.

[ubonjoe]

Since this topic has drifted entirely off topic with discussion about other countries visas and work requirements it is now closed.