Protests Against Coup Continue in Bangkok

[bkkjames]

I am sure mcd is not enjoying this added attention nevermind some red shirt leader dressing up as ronnie and defying the coup.

Maybe spin it another way, coup combo to go pls, better up size it as it may be awhile.

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[Piichai]

Don't know if McDonald's is a pro-government company or not. But 7/11 sure is, and they closed shop quickly when they saw the Reds coming!

I'm lovin'it!

[The stuttering parrot]

Just seen it on the news.

The army was there then the police turned up a few scuffles broke out and then a very strange thing happened.

The protesters were allowed to March and are now on their way to victory monument to join the others.

I hope it doesn't get ugly!

[Robby nz]

BANGKOK: -- About 200 people staged a protest against the military takeover at Ratchaprasong shopping district this morning.

The protesters, who called themselves Red Sunday group, gathered in front of McDonald outlet and shouted abuses at a group of army troops dispatched to contain the protest.

Meanwhile Mr Sombat Booonngarm-anong, editor of Lai Chud magazine and a supporter of the United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship, posted a message in his Facebook page threatening to launch a protest campaign, Eat Mc to Protest against Coup, every Sunday at McDonald outlet against the coup.

He urges supporters of his campaign to wear red and to gather in front of designated McDonald outlets to conduct any conceivable activities such as eating or exercising.

Source: http://englishnews.t...p-ratchaprasong

-- Thai PBS 2014-05-24

He must have a lot of shares in Mc Donalds.

[wealth]

and you Alex have a simplistic idea that there's NOTHING going to stop vote buying, vote buying isn't just about the handing out of money, it's using promises that you will get X,Y and Z if you vote for me, isn't the promise to reduce income tax by 2% (IF) that politician was to get into power not vote buying of a kind too?

Vote buying is such a crass term, and it's always one side, normally the losing one that uses it, a better name for it is a "vote incentive"

The issue is that demographically, there's just more people within these regions, that simply don't like the other regions, both sides hate each other, and incite their followers with jingoism and hate speeches all the time, both sides do all they can to demonise the opposition, it happens all over the world, it's called dirty tricks, it just seems that the Thais do it a little better than most

The vote buying issue is moot, and simple to sort, if your opponent offers 500 baht for his vote, you offer 550!! Thais are influenced by personal finance, not by fair minded policies, you can be the nicest man in the world, and they give you food and water, but it means nothing if the village <deleted> gives them 500 baht to "sway" their views.

Suthep and many of his followers here have stated repeatedly they had the "majority" of the country behind them, but they never took the "leap of Faith" and prove this was the case, by allowing elections to take place, why ? If I made a claim I have a million men behind me supporting me, day in day out, and when push came to shove, there was only a 1000, who is then made to look stupid?

Come on sir, there never was a "majority" that you were comfortable enough to take the leap of faith and let elections happen, your own leaderships fear of looking stupid was the reason, it would have been a huge humiliation for them, and well you know it, we will never know if this is true, as the reforms will prevent the voice of the people from ever being heard of again, you can rest assured of that. So you can keep on believing that you would have lost the elections as the "majority" of the country suddenly said " Up yours, I'll take 500 baht" doesn't wash, it means pure and simple that integrity isn't in the nature of the Thai people, especially the invisible "majority" who would have sold you down the river come polling day for a days wage!!!

there's lots of SOUL-SELLING going on. Massive! Do you feel better now? Sold souls don't vote but acknowlege their masters at the ballot. Nothing to do with election or democracy.

[dude123]

SKY news UK keeps going live to the protests - crowd looks quite big 500 + and are pushing aggressively at army line - reporter says mood much more tense than yesterday with bigger numbers.

The only tense mood I witnessed from the video came from the reporter himself excitingly waving his arms and pointing in the faces of the police.

Edited May 25, 2014 by dude123

[ATF]

Don't know if McDonald's is a pro-government company or not. But 7/11 sure is, and they closed shop quickly when they saw the Reds coming!

I'm lovin'it!

Do you want fries with that? I see this as blatant discrimination against KFC.

[MobileContent]

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Coups vs the natural democratic or representative electoral system? I have always believed the military should only defend borders, repel invaders, or otherwise as legislatively directed by executive. For the first time I note an example where a military coup may have actually enabled the democratic process; because of it's acting, it may actually save a system that wAs otherwise not ripe, or rotted. Which begs the question:

Is it true that previous coups have set Thailand back, stunted the due process of the march of democracy? I ask because democratic processes do not take hold in all nations equally, monolithically- and poof! Your a democracy. It's been noted adversely that Thailand's coups have variously injured "democracy." Isn't at least plausible that in some instances this mechanism has enabled, or preserved, the notion of representative government? Follow me, here; as an example, if the current political morass was allowed to indefinitely fester you would surely have nothing even resembling a state. Over time there'd be little institutional memory of representative mechanisms, and a prime breeding ground for despotism might ensue. By the very action that those who oppose limited military intervention are we not also overlooking something positive it achieves (in this limited example)? I am confident once a nation is fully despotic the road back is quite perilous. With the disintegration stopped here! Now! Might the institutional yearning and memory remain to enable, hopefully, more success next time?

I hold that when any form of democratic representative government is so corrupt, so saddled with nepotism, collusion, and corruption that only tearing the infection from the roots can save the host. It should never be true that democracy is a suicide pact and that once we have elected to declare ourselves "democracy" we are required to march to the gallows embracing this fantasy even long after it's been hijacked! In this regard, Thailand and America are similar; except Thai ppl have the courage to see their political system is shadows (at least their military sees this now). On this point it is telling that the US firmly endorses the Thai Status Quo; and not because this is a moral imperative of the US Foreign Policy. The US variously supports military, or not, involvement around the world, depending which strongman, dictator, or government is in power. In this case, the US objected to Thai military involvement because the status quo served US purposes. The very thing the Thai Military sought to heal, that issue which the majority of hype Thai people recognize, is the one issue the US sought to remain static. This point should not be lost on the Thai, and not soon forgotten.

I pray Thailand find the medicine to expunge this sickness and restore some semblance of trusted government. It is not easy. I just hope the military acts fast to get ahead of the mounting pressure the "status quo" fools will bring to bare. They will bring pain, sanctions, pressure, personal bank seizures, and travel restrictions, etc. if the generals move quickly they can stay two steps ahead of the sanctions by virtues of controlling the news cycle. "just do it,"

The Military can't even defend the three Southern provinces so it says a lot of the Thai Army. I wish Prayuth would take action in the South the way of finding some catches of weapons in KK, rounding up the caretaker government and now they want to go after those anti coup protests but in the South they are just like Banock.

[AGareth2]

can't have foreign military in the country sorry

[Robby nz]

Seems to me that the more protests there against the military there are the longer it will be before an election can be held.

Anyone who genuinely wants to see reforms and a free and fair election should be, not getting behind the military, but lets say getting in parallel with them to get the process of reforms underway as soon as possible.

That way those who have interests in particular reforms, say education, can have an input as to what these reforms should be.

The more people and groups who give input the better the eventual results of reforms would be.

It would also mean that there is in fact a check on the military for if groups come forward as a compliment to the military in formulating reforms and working towards free and fair elections then they would be in a position to make sure the military kept to their promises.

Should the military not keep their promises then would be the time to come out against them.

This is day 3, they have started cleaning the political toilet and tomorrow the farmers start to get paid, looks like a good start.

Give them another couple of months then we will have a better idea of where things are going.

[MobileContent]

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these students are not helping at all, why don't they butt out and see were this goes - the path has been taken and not really much choice now - it has to run it's course

I haven't seen too much to criticise up to now, they are mopping up all the rally sites and now need to mop up the mess PTP have left the country in - which isn't pretty I'd imagine - so just let them get on with it

I'm keenly interested in the governments finances

This isn't really about the PTP any more. In 1992 it was about the Chart Pattana Party when Suchinda send Chatchai off to the golf course and it wasn't CP that demonstrated but as always it's the students that started marching. Everyone welcomed Suchinda when he took over but then came the point where he appointed himself as acting PM and then he started ordering the shooting and this general was history except joining the board of CP Group where all those generals will end one day if they are disgraced.

Gen. Prayuth walks on a very thin line. If students or demonstrators will die, he is finished and he knows it. My guess they will only go after protest leaders but the numbers will get higher by the day. Many of those students fought hard against the military regime that has ruled most of the last 60 years Thailand and TU lost many students that were burned to death in the 70's.

I hope this all will end peacefully but having seen 2006 and 1992 I doubt it as the army is one of the major problems why Thailand can't have reforms.

[Smokemachine]

Oh, those protesters against coup?

How many of them had received their 400baht?

[Familyonthemove]

The Army left Chidlom at around 3:00 and Chitlom/Ploenchit BTS stations were reopened. Still a few protesters and the typically ineffective Police opposite Central World but most protesters seem to be heading to Victory Monument.

Lots of angry shouting and emotion - I don't think anyone is being paid to demonstrate and with such strength of feeling I worry about the future of this country.

[Piichai]

Oh, those protesters against coup?

How many of them had received their 400baht?

The Red's couriers have been severely hampered due to martial law, and are now paying them off in french fries.

[Mackie]

All staged for the foreign media in hope that the police or army would resort to violence. Typical of Thaksin. Using every single opportunity to score cheap propaganda points.

[Piichai]

The Army left Chidlom at around 3:00 and Chitlom/Ploenchit BTS stations were reopened. Still a few protesters and the typically ineffective Police opposite Central World but most protesters seem to be heading to Victory Monument.

Lots of angry shouting and emotion - I don't think anyone is being paid to demonstrate and with such strength of feeling I worry about the future of this country.

Of course they're being paid.

And the Reds were just as loud and obnoxious back in 2010.

[wolf5370]

The Army should confiscate their iPhones then they would all start crying.

yep, probably right there. What I find annoying, is that often around the world, students get involved, and everything turns into a mess! They have no understanding of where democracy comes from or what it should be. Why can't they sit, watch, and learn from it. But no, these days it looks cool to be a rebel when you are a teenager.

I think there is more to that than is immediately obvious. I hope he army use a RF jammer so their mobiles and G3 iPads will not connect - this is better than shutting down local towers as it affects less people - but it would still stop external control. They should also make a point of photographing the students, and arrest them later individually as they have broken the martial law rule as to 5+ people gatherings for political reasons. See how many turn up the next time. Release them after a few days, maybe confiscate their laptops and phones for a month or two to boot. No one in their right mind want to go back to the last 7 months of turmoil and violence.

And was this done against the political opposition when the government declare a state of emergency and prevented groups of five or more people from gathering? The courts at that point decided that people have the right to protest. But they don't know now? Really? You are clearly in the wrong side of history. You will learn soon enough.

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It should have been - it is a non-violent way to stop external control of a demonstration, it should be done in preference to any violent act and done early. If protestors are there for their beliefs, then they do not need to be in direct contact with others and allowing them to be allows for organisation between demonstrations. That is using people as cannon fodder, and can be stopped easily and without violence. So, yes, I think it should always be used at demonstrations. I feel history is on my side - violence happens when one side is backed into a corner, it happens en masse and at different places when it breaks out elsewhere - violence spreads and escalates. This is why the best police forces/services separate and divide protestors and cut mobile signals. It works. Along with white sound and flood lights is a good non-violent tactic to control violent demonstrations.

The courts made their decision outside of martial law. Whether you agree with it or not, we are under martial law and the rules have changed. The scenario is different, the army are trying to clam the situation and remove violence and dissent from the streets - they should be given time to do so. If they refuse to leave after a year, or whatever, then that is the time to protest, not now - not while blood is still too hot across the country. They are playing with gun powder!

[MaxLee]

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these students are not helping at all, why don't they butt out and see were this goes - the path has been taken and not really much choice now - it has to run it's course

I haven't seen too much to criticise up to now, they are mopping up all the rally sites and now need to mop up the mess PTP have left the country in - which isn't pretty I'd imagine - so just let them get on with it

I'm keenly interested in the governments finances

This isn't really about the PTP any more. In 1992 it was about the Chart Pattana Party when Suchinda send Chatchai off to the golf course and it wasn't CP that demonstrated but as always it's the students that started marching. Everyone welcomed Suchinda when he took over but then came the point where he appointed himself as acting PM and then he started ordering the shooting and this general was history except joining the board of CP Group where all those generals will end one day if they are disgraced.

Gen. Prayuth walks on a very thin line. If students or demonstrators will die, he is finished and he knows it. My guess they will only go after protest leaders but the numbers will get higher by the day. Many of those students fought hard against the military regime that has ruled most of the last 60 years Thailand and TU lost many students that were burned to death in the 70's.

I hope this all will end peacefully but having seen 2006 and 1992 I doubt it as the army is one of the major problems why Thailand can't have reforms.

This man is just ruthless,... no matter if the UDD folks get a slap on the wrist or whatever... be careful what you wish for folks. The reigning army chief can and will shoot anyone who dares to speak up, no matter who they are,..

,... wanna bet???

No matter how cleaned up the UDD mess seems by the army general,... watch out for hidden agenda's bseides absoulte media censorship and etc...

this man is cold blooded by nature,... he can order a complete Thailand blackout without further warning....

....wanna bet???

[Dogmatix]

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these students are not helping at all, why don't they butt out and see were this goes - the path has been taken and not really much choice now - it has to run it's course

I haven't seen too much to criticise up to now, they are mopping up all the rally sites and now need to mop up the mess PTP have left the country in - which isn't pretty I'd imagine - so just let them get on with it

I'm keenly interested in the governments finances

This isn't really about the PTP any more. In 1992 it was about the Chart Pattana Party when Suchinda send Chatchai off to the golf course and it wasn't CP that demonstrated but as always it's the students that started marching. Everyone welcomed Suchinda when he took over but then came the point where he appointed himself as acting PM and then he started ordering the shooting and this general was history except joining the board of CP Group where all those generals will end one day if they are disgraced.

Gen. Prayuth walks on a very thin line. If students or demonstrators will die, he is finished and he knows it. My guess they will only go after protest leaders but the numbers will get higher by the day. Many of those students fought hard against the military regime that has ruled most of the last 60 years Thailand and TU lost many students that were burned to death in the 70's.

I hope this all will end peacefully but having seen 2006 and 1992 I doubt it as the army is one of the major problems why Thailand can't have reforms.

There was not much reaction to the 1991 coup - some student type protests reminiscient of the 1973 and 1976 protests but they soon fizzled out. The general public was quite happy with the Anand administration appointed by the military. They did a great job of reforming the economy. Things only turned nasty when Gen Suchinda tried to retain power after the 1992 elections aided by Samak, Chalerm, Banharn and all the usual thugs who later sided with Thaksin for pecuniary gain. Then the student involvement was not really significant, except at Ramkhamhaeng where there a horrible showdown was looming when HMK intervened. The core of the anti-military protests were urban Chinese who were called the "middle class mob" or the "mobile phone mob" and they were the forerunners of the PAD and the urban PDRC.

It seems likely that the current opposition to the coup is carefully orchestrated by red shirt academics and other red shirt leaders in the cities and is the first response part of a detailed contingency plan about how to resist a coup. The armed response will come later, unless the military moves fast, effectively and without mercy against the armed red shirt militants. One assumes that the military must also have a detailed plan but we are in uncharted territory.

Edited May 25, 2014 by Dogmatix

[Smokemachine]

Oh, those protesters against coup?

How many of them had received their 400baht?

The Red's couriers have been severely hampered due to martial law, and are now paying them off in french fries.

Some couriers have miss out in the RTA's list 5555

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=706498446075111&set=a.105881512803477.4265.100001448865433&type=1&theater

[MobileContent]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

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these students are not helping at all, why don't they butt out and see were this goes - the path has been taken and not really much choice now - it has to run it's course

I haven't seen too much to criticise up to now, they are mopping up all the rally sites and now need to mop up the mess PTP have left the country in - which isn't pretty I'd imagine - so just let them get on with it

I'm keenly interested in the governments finances

This isn't really about the PTP any more. In 1992 it was about the Chart Pattana Party when Suchinda send Chatchai off to the golf course and it wasn't CP that demonstrated but as always it's the students that started marching. Everyone welcomed Suchinda when he took over but then came the point where he appointed himself as acting PM and then he started ordering the shooting and this general was history except joining the board of CP Group where all those generals will end one day if they are disgraced.

Gen. Prayuth walks on a very thin line. If students or demonstrators will die, he is finished and he knows it. My guess they will only go after protest leaders but the numbers will get higher by the day. Many of those students fought hard against the military regime that has ruled most of the last 60 years Thailand and TU lost many students that were burned to death in the 70's.

I hope this all will end peacefully but having seen 2006 and 1992 I doubt it as the army is one of the major problems why Thailand can't have reforms.

There was not much reaction to the 1991 coup - some student type protests reminiscient of the 1973 and 1976 protests but they soon fizzled out. The general public was quite happy with the Anand administration appointed by the military. They did a great job of reforming the economy. Things only turned nasty when Gen Suchinda tried to retain power after the 1992 elections aided by Samak, Chalerm, Banharn and all the usual thugs who later sided with Thaksin for pecuniary gain. Then the student involvement was not really significant, except at Ramkhamhaeng where there a horrible showdown was looming when HMK intervened. The core of the anti-military protests were urban Chinese who were called the "middle class mob" or the "mobile phone mob" and they were the forerunners of the PAD and the urban PDRC.

It seems likely that the current opposition to the coup is carefully orchestrated by red shirt academics and other red shirt leaders in the cities and is the first response part of a detailed contingency plan about how to resist a coup. The armed response will come later, unless the military moves fast, effectively and without mercy against the armed red shirt militants. One assumes that the military must also have a detailed plan but we are in uncharted territory.

Lets see how it works out. By the way I dint see any armed red shirt militants today on the foreign news channels at Victory Monument.

[valvenus]

Interesting the protesters today have limited their use of English signs?

And why are they so afraid of wearing their red shirts?

because they're not all 'red shirts'.

RT@pakhead: There are people identifying themselves as red shirt leaders organising Amarin protest.

yeah, so some of them are 'red shirts'. some are yellow voters.

You took a poll of their voting preferences while visiting them?

[lomatopo]

In that uniquely Thai way, Pro-Coup demonstrators are at Democracy Monument and Anti-Coup demonstrators are at Victory Monument.

[valvenus]

BANGKOK: -- About 200 people staged a protest against the military takeover at Ratchaprasong shopping district this morning.

The protesters, who called themselves Red Sunday group, gathered in front of McDonald outlet and shouted abuses at a group of army troops dispatched to contain the protest.

Meanwhile Mr Sombat Booonngarm-anong, editor of Lai Chud magazine and a supporter of the United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship, posted a message in his Facebook page threatening to launch a protest campaign, Eat Mc to Protest against Coup, every Sunday at McDonald outlet against the coup.

He urges supporters of his campaign to wear red and to gather in front of designated McDonald outlets to conduct any conceivable activities such as eating or exercising.

Source: http://englishnews.t...p-ratchaprasong

-- Thai PBS 2014-05-24

He must have a lot of shares in Mc Donalds.

He's just a chubby guy with a fondness for Extra Large Fries and Supersized Cokes.

[celso]

Arrest all protesters, for commiting crimes against Thailand.

[aimbc]

There are always those that are going to try and protest and it's their rights. But just not enough of them to matter. No one likes a coup, and no one likes the way government is running at the moment. Everyone needs to give the military a chance to bring this chaos under control. I say they make a legislation banning all convicted politician from life of politics. To go as far as not allowing these criminals to interact with other active politicians and can no longer do business with the government. Why allow criminals back into politics. This is the first problem Thailand has to change. It's the easiest as well.

[lomatopo]

Arrest all protesters, for commiting crimes against Thailand.

Note that there are pro-Army/pro-coup protesters. I'm guessing you don't recommend arresting them, even though they might be violating laws/rules issued by the Junta?

[Smokemachine]

Poor fellow got hurt by anti-coup protesters.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=513622565410231&set=pcb.513624672076687&type=1&theater

[mike2011]

Seems to me that the more protests there against the military there are the longer it will be before an election can be held.

Anyone who genuinely wants to see reforms and a free and fair election should be, not getting behind the military, but lets say getting in parallel with them to get the process of reforms underway as soon as possible.

That way those who have interests in particular reforms, say education, can have an input as to what these reforms should be.

The more people and groups who give input the better the eventual results of reforms would be.

It would also mean that there is in fact a check on the military for if groups come forward as a compliment to the military in formulating reforms and working towards free and fair elections then they would be in a position to make sure the military kept to their promises.

Should the military not keep their promises then would be the time to come out against them.

This is day 3, they have started cleaning the political toilet and tomorrow the farmers start to get paid, looks like a good start.

Give them another couple of months then we will have a better idea of where things are going.

Very thoughtful. Maybe some military hip hop for music classes. Drill for boys in sports classes? Mr Robby has problems to understand what a coup means. NO input wanted. They decide. Period. I can see that this imposing of orders on anyone without those time consuming exercises like elections, discussions ets is appealing to certain characters. Thai and others, including online persons.

However, legitimacy is gained exclusively through democratic elections. In Europe, the US, also New Zeeland (check it, yes, unbelievable - it is true!!) and it was so in Thailand, however flawed it was here.

Offering collaboration (look up the word) to promote once 'interests' (what a revealing term) to the current individuals wielding power is a perfect suggestion. But not for one who still upholds the principles of his/her home country and the ideals for which millions fought in WWII who overcame that sort of rule which robby nz seems so enticing.

I m still struggling to understand the logic of people like robby z and his sort. Neither the yellow nor the red shirts liked fair discussion, both abused the democratic process, we all can think of abuses of the law committed by both. That's why many, including myself, dont like those two sides. What I fail to get into my head how a group of people who committed the worst possible abuse of the democratic system can be supposed to perfect it? Given the past record, 1992 already forgotten?, it seems that both those yellow and red shirts pale in comparison to those guys now.

Edited May 25, 2014 by mike2011

[ATF]

Very thoughtful. Maybe some military hip hop for music classes. Drill for boys in sports classes? Mr Robby has problems to understand what a coup means. NO input wanted. They decide. Period. I can see that this imposing of orders on anyone without those time consuming exercises like elections, discussions ets is appealing to certain characters. Thai and others, including online persons.

However, legitimacy is gained exclusively through democratic elections. In Europe, the US, also New Zeeland (check it, yes, unbelievable - it is true!!) and it was so in Thailand, however flawed it was here.

Offering collaboration (look up the word) to promote once 'interests' (what a revealing term) to the current individuals wielding power is a perfect suggestion. But not for one who still upholds the principles of his/her home country and the ideals for which millions fought in WWII who overcame that sort of rule which robby nz seems so enticing.

I m still struggling to understand the logic of people like robby z and his sort. Neither the yellow nor the red shirts liked fair discussion, both abused the democratic process, we all can think of abuses of the law committed by both. That's why many, including myself, dont like those two sides. What I fail to get into my head how a group of people who committed the worst possible abuse of the democratic system can be supposed to perfect it? Given the past record, 1992 already forgotten?, it seems that both those yellow and red shirts pale in comparison to those guys now.

I would try to educate myself if i was you. You have no idea what Democracy is and Democracy is not a Human Right under the UN. You are only entitled to the right to take part in the government of your country, directly or through freely chosen representatives.. Democracy limits this right because it limits the options that are available to you. If I want to vote for a Military Dictatorship I cannot under the Democratic system.because I am limited to social norms. The UK is not a true Democracy because it doesn't have a Constitution and the US is not a true Democracy because I cannot vote for a Communist Candidate.

Most countries live under a Capitalist Democracy. There is no reason whatsoever that you can't have a Communist Democracy. Democracy is a word used by politicians to convince you you are living in a free and fair society. That's all.

If someone like Dr. Thaksin was ever elected to power in the US or the UK those countries would have military coups also.

A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.

Edited May 25, 2014 by ATF