Thai men and their offspring - why do so many not care after a divorce?

[Frank James]

"Of course I don't want to generalize as I see many decent Thai men taking care of their kids. Of course, they also tend to be more affluent and upper society as those are the circles I roll in. Except when I ghetto down sometimes and partake in Isaan cuisine. But I would never marry one, unlike so many of the readers here.

Those are the circles you roll in? You are one Mackin' Player, Bro! Word!

Jesus.

[maprao]

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Thai men are just less susceptible to blackmail.
My former western wife tried it on with me, being a sensible Thai man, I just moved country.

They/we just place "not being a pussy whipped doormat" above "being a dad".

Sounds like a loser attitude, real men take care of their kids.

and the Thai wife looks for a foreigner to take care of his and her kids.

Just the way it is. Thai men run

In the west they take you to the cleaners

I think it is the lack of availability in the UK and US and the abundance of skank here lol

Edited June 14, 2014 by maprao

[atyclb]

in the usa theres lots of fathers doing the same thing that this thread alleges about thai guys. not infrequently in the us you see it in lower socio-economic circles. maybe the court awards support but if no job, no money, no assets or in prison the final effect is the same as in thailand.

there might be many gals looking for financial support from a western guy as an easier option then to perhaps struggle month to month. theoretically if the guy likes kids it can be a decent situation. not withstanding i must legitimately question the frequent financial disparity in many such relationships. i personally would feel more comfortable in a such a situation if it were one devoid of the need for financial support requisite. that way the foundation of the relationship is solid, and not anchored in cash.

[Cypress Hill]

I think one reason is it usually happens when the man or woman are young and have no prospects in life. Another reason is, as all other laws in Thailand, the child support laws are not enforced so the men can get away with it. How many men in the west would abandon their children if they could get away with it?

Correct!

Why was the UK's CSA given broad powers to pursue fathers the length and breadth of the country, make attachments to their salaries and prosecute them for missed payments?

Because a lot of men feel - quite rightly - that if a woman goes ahead and makes a unilateral decision to have a child against the father's wshes citing the good ol' "my body, my choice" crap then that woman should assume full responsibility for that childs upbringing - emotionally and financially.

I happen to agree with that reasoning

If both parents agree that a pregnancy is a wonderful thing then, of course, the guy MUST step up and do the right thing but if there is objection from the man, the woman should bear the burden.

Sorry but I think that's fair.

[Emster23]

A boy can make a baby, but takes a man to raise a child.

My gf got preg, dropped out of school, had village string ceremony, baby. 6 months after birth hubby decided he didn't like baby crying, so went home to his mama. Last she ever saw of that irresponsible bastard. Daughter is now 18.

My view is that posters who rant and rationalize hopefully know somewhere inside they are full of crap. Yes, women can raise kids on their own, so could fathers. But much better if both pitch in. If they don't then they have severe issues and should seek therapy, unless sociopaths. Therapy is usually a waste of time with them.

Yes, of course single moms look for someone to help them out. So would you if you were in their position. Try a little empathy.

Not all birth control works all the time either.

[antsrule]

I have been wanting to comment on this for a long time. I believe that the biggest social problem facing society today are the children of single parents. I have helped 2 women and their children after they lost their husbands in a civil war in an arabic country back in 1994. I still help them. I helped a Chinese mother immigrate to my western country and helped her meet a moderately wealthy man who had lost his wife. I helped her daughter get into university there as well. Recently I helped an issan woman and daughter immigrate to my country as well. She is also now married to a countryman of mine. I shared an apartment with a girl who became my girlfriend. I found out that she worked in Soi Cowboy. She took me down there and introduced me to her friends and explained how the businees worked. One thing I discovered was that most of the women had one or 2 children all of whom (of those I met) were 100% Thai with father out of the picture. Like the OP I was stunned that the fathers made no effort to be part of the lives of the children and no one else seemed to care either. Just a different culture, not my circus, not my monkeys. In the west it is very very different, so what! So I am the looser for doing what I want? So what, up to me! I am divorced from the mother of my many children. I speak to each of them every week. Up to me. You Thai guys do what you want, no problem for me. I will continue to help as many of your children as I can to have a better life. You are welcome.

[bonobo]

There has been a plethora of personal attacks in this thread. If you want to comment on the subject, then please feel free. But this is not a venue to simply slag off on another poster.

Further such flames could result in suspensions.

[8OA8]

Just some issues to arise form the OP ...

"Men will pay millions in child support payments following custody judgements." ... since you are using a Western example, lets presume that you are referring to either Dollars or Pounds.

Millions ... don't you think that the statement is a bit of a stretch? Stats to back up that claim?

"I've simply never seen such a lack of care in any other culture." ... you've personally visited every other Culture?

Coffee time ...

.

I'm of course referring to the high profile celebrity suits where the father is willing to spend millions of dollars for access to his children. Have you heard of the same occurring in Thailand? Why don't the Thai father's care?

Allegedly, sometimes a firearm is shown to the man and he's persuaded never to.make any contact with the child or the mother ever again. Allegedly!

[Thongkorn]

Just look at the feral women in Britain who have children with So called men, and leave there children for us the state to bring up So its not just Thailand.

[kurnell]

There will be a whole generation of Thai adults with no idea where their father is, if there is not already. Perhaps the upcoming reforms will find a way to deal with deadbeat fathers.

[TheFishman1]

Most Thia girls I meet that have kids I always ask do there father help you with money I never had one say yes. Usual reply is they have new family go fig

[ironbark]

While it is difficult to make generalisations without hard data the observations of the OP are similar to mine.

I think it is because of the significant difference in the role of males and females in Thai society compared to our western judeo-christian culture.

We have a greater emphasis on the "sanctity" of marriage and the dominant role of the male as the "breadwinner" In western culture we are a patriacal culture while here it is more matriacal. In many Thai families the wife is the main breadwinner and owns the "shop". Women behind the scenes are actually very dominant in Thai relationships.

There is not the same social stigma for a married man to have extra-marital affairs. In deed in some hi-so circles a mans status is defined by having a "little wife", However, if a marriage does break up, then despite that the law says things should be equally divided the wife generally keeps the assets which includes the children while the man moves on to another relationship.

It may also be that the new "wife/gf" does not want children of the previous relationship around. (again a sign of her dominance).

Put more simply, he man has sown his "seed" and past on his genes. The mother will look after them, so its time for him to move on and try to sow some more.

[pgrahmm]

I have read before that the child in Thailand becomes the mother's responsibility/liability.......This is ingrained/entrenched into the Thai societal way of life.....so - the men, I guess including us are free to create multiple sonic boom booms without ever bearing the weight of responsibility for their offspring......thus many proud first daughters endow their parents with a second set of children to raise while they:

Either provide money through legal employment

Or

Continue boom boom for money until they find a mark to hang the responsibility on

When you calculate the ages of the women versus the ages of their children it's amazing how many great looking women have been fertilized between 17-21......I imagine there are a great deal of Thai guys out there doing a bang up job - over and over.....

[Suradit69]

Contrast this with what I see so many times in Thailand where the father doesn't even care to visit his children or pay any type of financial support.

So many times? So you've studied this vast randomly selected sample of divorced fathers in the "west" and also in Thailand? Utter nonsense. You may have seen a few examples ... and probably "saw" only those examples that suited your prejudices ... and blew them up into your hyperbolic screed, but a few anecdotal examples are utterly meaningless.

I know of several examples (which amount to only a few examples and not some all-encompassing generality) where the father kept the child and the mother went off. In one case the father was totally distraught at the prospect of losing his daughter when he separated from his wife and he now has essentially 100% custody of her and, despite financial constraints, he's paying for a rather expensive private school for her. He's dead tired most of the time from working at his regular job while playing at mother & father for the child and she always comes first for him.

Once again ... there are 67 million Thai people. Stop judging them all based on a few you may know (or THINK you know) something about and stop always seeing Thais as something other than just people ... good, bad, happy, sad, foolish, wise ... just like the rest of us. There is no shortage of useless fathers in the west and in most cases the vast sums of money they hand out for child support has nothing to do with love or generosity, but part of the divorce agreement and the threat of doing jail time if the payments aren't made.

Edited June 14, 2014 by Suradit69

[Sandman77]

I always ask my self , why is something like it is! I see here everyday , that the education of small kids beginn from childhood is diffrent from western, in our world a child cannot do what a child wants to do

The parents or the teacher mostly

Not let there kids unattended

Everything a child want do in western world will be monitored , and even interrupted before the kid can do a duty bring to the end , someone always come and interrupt , to teach from childhood this is wrong and that's okay!

It'd called bonus system , if you do something good , that you are a better person!in the later life

When parents do there job good

A strong spirit of responsibility is the result

In Thailand , the system is via versa!

I often here children never belive what parents say, most of them are unattended , can do what want do do !

No body is here, to tell you do something wrong or not!

If you not learn from childhood what is wrong or not wrong , you cannot learn responsibility !

Often not for yourself end never for others !

Here many deadly accident in isaan because 15 year old boy not belive motorbike dangerous when drive to quickly without helmet!

Thaimans are seldom a prototypical to there own child!

Not all but most I see here!

Thai wife's make the big mistake to

Also not learn a child , how to handle a problem, Also when it's little !

And when you run away from every problem , or hide behind your smiling face for a lifetime you can never learn responsibility!

I bought a Rubic cube for a nabour child

Show him 20 minutes step by step how it works, but it not take any minute time , to think how to solve the cube to get same colors on each surface come back in full!

It run away with a smile!

I not want tell with my deep society analyses that no one here take responsibility, the first year of childhood in education are most importend , when not learn in first years of a young life, the change to learn responsibility in later life is gone!

[ota101]

I think this post is right on. I have been broken financially to see my children which the ex used like a weapon. My current Thai wife of 15 years would never leave me even if I was not a good person out of love and devotion to our two boys. The two marraiges were like night and day. Meanwhile my half and half boys love me to death while the farang children don't even talk to me.

[daveAustin]

Is this a cultural thing or something else? I've simply never seen such a lack of care in any other culture.

Check out the jungle, there's a similar culture there where the man monkeys walk.

I think brains and empathy come into it.

[enufsaid]

It's a cultural thing, pretty much the same in most Asian countries, I see western men in Japan try to get access to their children and every obstacle is put in their way. But easy on western women, not all men give up everything to see their children, it's changing with shared custody but still many men don't pay maintainece. And many men & women don't fight tooth & nail for their " share" of the child's life .thai women will take children of the marriage home to the parents & move on with their lives , most Asian women do not like their new husband to have anything to do with children of previous relationship . It's over move on.

[SOTIRIOS]

....it must first be established who fathered the child.....

[Shenta]

Not try to offense anyone here, but have you ever seen a male dog take care his young? It is animal nature to just have a fxxk and go look for the next one. However, what differentiate human from animal is knowing what's right or wrong...

Welcome to Thailand my friend, you got alot to learn...

[balo]

Thais are living very different lifes from what we think about family life in the west .

In my neighborhood , I see very young dads , maybe 17 or 18 year olds , and most of them enjoy to play with their kids and take care of them. But if things gets complicated some of them will look for an easy escape. But remember most Thais have a big, extended family, so someone will take care of the kids, that's the good thing about living in a big family here. So what about the father? He will maybe find another woman and have more kids, and if necessary repeat all over again.

This is the Thai life that most westerners cannot understand.

Edited June 14, 2014 by balo

[Datebayo]

Some might, some won't. It really depends on the kind of person.

[dotpoom]

Thai men are just less susceptible to blackmail.

My former western wife tried it on with me, being a sensible Thai man, I just moved country.

They/we just place "not being a pussy whipped doormat" above "being a dad".

Sound advice there for all you dads and future dads. .....A mans EGO is by far heaps more important that his children and their future wellbeing.

[dotpoom]

Please remove.

Why? Is it not a legitimate observation? How many high profile custody court cases have you read about in Thailand where the father is fighting for custody for visitation rights? I haven't. Why?

Yes...I have made the same observations. I am told in Thai society that the man has the natural rights to his children rather unlike the West where it is the Mother who has those rights. I wonder would this have anything to do with it, like a psychological thing....."I can have them whenever I want them" type of thing. Don't know, just putting that forward.

Edited June 14, 2014 by dotpoom

[dotpoom]

Thai men are just less susceptible to blackmail.

My former western wife tried it on with me, being a sensible Thai man, I just moved country.

They/we just place "not being a pussy whipped doormat" above "being a dad".

Sounds like a loser attitude, real men take care of their kids.

The women don't care, the courts don't care, it appears the men aren't needed, just their wallets.

And if the man's wallet goes, it's replaced by a government wallet.

So explain why "real men take care of their kids" when nobody appears to want them to do that.

Seems to me the losers are the guys that hang around to endure the shit heaped on them.

Because the kids need a dad so they can grow up to be functioning, working members of society. Generally a father's job is to do that. Should it be any different in Thailand?

Of course I don't want to generalize as I see many decent Thai men taking care of their kids. Of course, they also tend to be more affluent and upper society as those are the circles I roll in. Except when I ghetto down sometimes and partake in Isaan cuisine. But I would never marry one, unlike so many of the readers here.

I was going along with your post until you dropped in this lowest of low racist remarks about Issarn people. You have lowered yourself lower than the people you look down on, I think it's time to start looking up now. I see many hard working fathers from all over Thailand having great fun on a daily basis in every KFC and such places and boy....are they proud of their off spring. I absolutely love watching them and wish my own Father had one ounce of their love for their children.

[kinmaew]

They can be heartless pricks. I know of a case where the father did not even want to see his child after it was born after they broke up. Why they are like this? I would say down to how their society functions, lack of transparency, lack of accountability and responsibility and false values and a hollow religion.

[tartempion]

Who says kids need a dad?

Not the courts

Not the welfare

Not the mothers

I know a whole host of single mothers and their children in the USA and Thailand, most of them seem to do OK without a dad.

Jeez, what a load of rubbish.

This must be the most stupid reply in 2014 so far....

[tartempion]

What I often see here in Isaan are children raised by the grand parents.

The real parents are off to work not only in Bangkok, also 40kms away in Udon Thani, even 1km away.

I know at least 10 cases here in the village alone, I find that behavior very strange.

A young couple married last year, the girls mother (thai living in farangland) built them a house 500m from my place.

The boys parents live in the nearby village, girl was pregnant when they married.

Boy runs a motorbike repair shop at his home (so does his father in the village)

The child lives with the grand parents since it was born, now 1 year ago.

Not being Thai I have no idea what motivates this behavior.

My gf's brother has a 3 year young daughter.

His wife left him when the kid was 3 months young.

We sent him to Taiwan to get his life together, which he did not.

They sent him back one month ago as a drug addict.

We are raising his (their) child since she is 11 months young.

He even can't take care of himself, he can't pay food or clothes for the child, he is plain stupid and an *hole.

I just hope he will stay away from our home and forget he ever made a woman pregnant.

Edited June 14, 2014 by tartempion

[joshstiles]

In answer to your question.........there are men who care and men who don't care and a mixture of everything in between in every culture. Western men who pay child support do so because they do not want to go to jail. If there weren't the threat of jail, how many would pay??? Money talks! As for Thai men who don't care after divorce....you are not seeing the real picture.....they didn't care before the divorce.

[Seastallion]

A quote from the movie "Fight Club" about children, women and marriage,

"We are a generation of men raised by women. I'm wondering if another woman is the answer we really need."

Glad you posted that quote. In context, it is condemning the sad fact that so many boys are brought up without a male role model. This is why he started the fight club, this is why he was so fkcued up in the head, because he had no dad to show him what it is to be a man and his instincts took over in a fkced up way.