Questions on the crackdown

[oldthaihand99]

I dont think anyone has been to Phnong Phen. Ever.

Then that makes it virgin territory.

I am hoping to be the first.

[LuckyLew]

The amount of money to be gained from income tax revenue is much smaller than the amount of money that will be lost from foreigners going elsewhere.

And both numbers greatly pale in comparison to the amount of money lost in the rice scheme.

I think yo uare totally wrong

If you decide to leave, there is surely someone waiting to fill your shoes

What does the rice scheme have to do with work permits?

You seemed to have made up your mind that the crackdown should not apply to you and your fellow teachers and now you are grabbing at straws when people with brains come along a rebut / refute your opinion

Edited July 2, 2014 by LuckyLew

[JomtienEats]

Why do under 50 year olds need to pay 500,000 baht for a sketchy "elite" visa that had problems in the past when over 50 year olds only need to make a deposit in a bank that remains theirs?

The rules change every time the government changes. But I'll never understand why being 50 and up is considered an asset, especially given the greater likelihood of needing expensive healthcare services which they may not be able to pay for on a pension.

There's no masterplan. Perhaps the general will clear the shanty town, and erect a shining city of well thought out, comprehensible rules in pursuit of laudable immigration goals. But my guess is that things will get tightened for a while, then there will be some terrible tourist numbers reported (those border runners are counted in the tourist numbers, right?) and then things will be relaxed again.

[NoshowJones]

It wasn't that long ago that the retirement rule was reduced from i think 60yrs of age

to 50yrs, so in actual fact it's been made easier to retire in Thailand.

Why 50yrs old, well, they have to draw the line somewhere, and it's unlikely that under 50's

will be wanting to retire anyway, it's just common sense.

As for your other questions, on working illegally, well this is what they want to stop, by

enforcing the rules to make everyone get the correct visas and work permits and then

pay income tax too.

Can't anybody retire if they have enough money to support themselves? Why do you need to be a certain age?

You need to have a university degree to get a work permit, and many teachers don't have that. So it's not going to make everyone pay more tax, it's going to force a lot of teachers to leave. Thus leaving many schools with no foreign english teachers. What is the major benefit for the country in that?

I have said this many times on this forum and it is the truth. I worked for three years as an English teacher, I had a work permit and no university degree, I got my work permit by being a teacher, not a classroom assistant or anything else.

As far as I know, nothing has changed in the last two years where work permits and teaching is concerned. I also had to do the Thai culture course which is compulsary for all Foreign teachers.

[BlueEasySleep]

No one has really answered my first question.

This crackdown was the work of the previous administration, correct? Is there any word on the plans of the successors?

[BlueEasySleep]

I have said this many times on this forum and it is the truth. I worked for three years as an English teacher, I had a work permit and no university degree, I got my work permit by being a teacher, not a classroom assistant or anything else.

As far as I know, nothing has changed in the last two years where work permits and teaching is concerned. I also had to do the Thai culture course which is compulsary for all Foreign teachers.

I know teachers with a work permit who never had to take the culture course.

And they said they did need their degree.

Hard to figure out the rules.

[paz]

No one has really answered my first question.

This crackdown was the work of the previous administration, correct? Is there any word on the plans of the successors?

Yes it was. How on heart can people know about the future or unreleased plans ?

Seems to me you want too much from a discussion forum.

[NoshowJones]

I have said this many times on this forum and it is the truth. I worked for three years as an English teacher, I had a work permit and no university degree, I got my work permit by being a teacher, not a classroom assistant or anything else.

As far as I know, nothing has changed in the last two years where work permits and teaching is concerned. I also had to do the Thai culture course which is compulsary for all Foreign teachers.

I know teachers with a work permit who never had to take the culture course.

And they said they did need their degree.

Hard to figure out the rules.

Maybe it's the same as the Thai Immigration offices, banks, government departments etc etc. Some will some won't, some do and some don't

[isawasnake]

Was hoping for a higher level of discussion.

Just trying to understand thai thinking and the rules.

Sent from my GT-I8552B using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Your second question, that is, or would, not matter at all. You could get a monkey in there to teach these classes, and they would learn the same amount of english. There just simply is not learning going on out in the sticks for the most part. It is probably due to behavioral issues.... and um, students never speaking a word of english for years in end. I think the foreign contingent is way overestimated. The ones without degrees OR training are probably doing more harm than good.

I personally think they should in fact make it much harder for people who dont work here to stay, and much easier for people who are married to a thai.

[oldthaihand99]

You could consider Singapore which has somewhat the opposite rules to Thailand.

In SG young talents are prefered over old expat retirees.

[oldthaihand99]

No one has really answered my first question.

This crackdown was the work of the previous administration, correct? Is there any word on the plans of the successors?

August 12. D-day.

[oldthaihand99]

No one has really answered my first question.

This crackdown was the work of the previous administration, correct? Is there any word on the plans of the successors?

August 12. D-day.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/738876-confirmed-visa-run-crackdown-effective-from-august-12-2014-thai-foreign-ministry/

[ubonjoe]

No one has really answered my first question.

This crackdown was the work of the previous administration, correct? Is there any word on the plans of the successors?

August 12. D-day.

The 10th of May was when it started well before the coup.

August 12th is the date they have set to deny visa exempt entries for visa runners..

[somo]

It seems to me that as Thailand is crying out for english teachers they could forget the work permit requirement for them.

Thailand allows hundreds of thousands + slaves to work here without permits but they are asian. Why the prejudice against a few thousand farang?

If they did away with all the regulations they would save money and probably benefit from the small influx of better educated people who want to contribute and make money which in turn will benefit local economies. I guess they could restrict such people from sending money abroad so all benefits do stay at home.

[Suradit69]

3. Maybe because they are NOT taking money from the thais, Which is a way of putting it like thais do... Whenever a falang comes here to Thailand and work, "they take money from Thailand"... They are just not interested to learn, not to gain from other peoples knowledge,, And why should they,, they know everyting already from the very start!!

Glegolo

"And why should they,, they know everyting already from the very start!!"

I always thought it was farangs (AKA "other peoples") who post on Thai Visa who knew "everyting."

"...not to gain from other peoples knowledge "

You mean like learning English from "teachers" who are functional illiterates?

They have gained both knowledge and economic benefits from Japanese car makers who established factories here and trained workers and from companies that produce computers & accessories who did likewise among others.

Not so much export value or increased GDP attributable to itinerant unemployable farang individually seeking work in the third world.

Edited July 2, 2014 by Suradit69

[YuliyaSerg]

Hello! What about ED-visas? Does anyone has real information, not unfounded rumours? Some people says there is no more prolongation for 1 year, only for 3 months, some says that soon no more possibility to get ED visa in school only in university. What about people who wants to get this type of viza first time?

Edited July 2, 2014 by YuliyaSerg

[ericthai]

It wasn't that long ago that the retirement rule was reduced from i think 60yrs of age

to 50yrs, so in actual fact it's been made easier to retire in Thailand.

Why 50yrs old, well, they have to draw the line somewhere, and it's unlikely that under 50's

will be wanting to retire anyway, it's just common sense.

As for your other questions, on working illegally, well this is what they want to stop, by

enforcing the rules to make everyone get the correct visas and work permits and then

pay income tax too.

Can't anybody retire if they have enough money to support themselves? Why do you need to be a certain age?

You need to have a university degree to get a work permit, and many teachers don't have that. So it's not going to make everyone pay more tax, it's going to force a lot of teachers to leave. Thus leaving many schools with no foreign english teachers. What is the major benefit for the country in that?

Why does the USA, UK, Australia etc. make it so difficult to get a visa. Hell I can be in the USA and decide I want to go to Thailand tomorrow and buy a ticket and leave. A Thai cant decide I want to go to the USA tomorrow and buy a ticket and leave. They have to apply for a visa that takes months to just get an interview and then hope and pray they get one. For the most part Thailand has easy visa requirements.

[silver sea]

>3. I'm curious if anyone knows why over 50 year olds with a pension are welcomed with a special visa, while under 50 year olds with cash are now being asked to leave. What is the rationale? Why is over 50 and foreign desirable for the country?

I cannot see that anybody is being asked to leave. They just want people to use visas instead of doing border runs for exempt entries. I think a lot people are making a lot more out of the tightening up of the rules than there really is.

It is still going to be possible to get tourist visas.

I agree with you ubonjoe.

I live on Koh Samui. I first came to Samui, and indeed Thailand, in January 2012 for three weeks. I was given the standard 30 day "visa exempt" stamp in my passport at Bangkok Airport.

I came back in late August 2012, for three months until late November 2012. I had a single entry tourist visa i.e. 60 days + 30 days.

I returned in January 2013 and stayed 9 months, until September 2013, on a triple entry tourist visa i.e. 60 days + 30 days x 3. To activate my 2nd and 3rd visas I went on a "border bounce" i.e. I went to the Malaysian border, did the usual "out, in; out in" at the border posts and was back on Samui the same day.

I returned in November 2013 i.e. 10 weeks after I had left. Again I had a triple entry tourist visa. Again I activated my second and third visas in exactly the same way.

I am still on Samui. I fly back to the UK on 1st August 2014. It is my intention to return to Samui on 1st October 2014 i.e. 8 weeks after leaving. I shall seek another triple entry visa (my third) from the Thai Embassy in London, just before I fly back to Samui.

In May this year, I wrote to the Thai Consulate in Hull. They had been granting my previous visas. I referred them to their computer records and asked them whether it was likely that I would be granted a third triple visa so soon after my earlier ones.

Their reply on 12th May 2014 was:

"You will be granted a further triple entry visa. There is no

current restriction on this being granted on multiple occasions.

Regards

Royal Thai Consulate (Hull)"

This seemed clear enough to me. There has however been a lot of argument on TV about the new rules that come into effect next month and about what they actually relate to.

In order to avoid any unpleasant surprises I wrote again last Friday to the Hull Consulate to see whether I would still get my third triple entry visa. They replied the same day, although I never received it; it is floating in cyberspace somewhere I guess. They sent me a copy today:

"The changes coming in are aimed at people who do not have tourist visas

in place but try to extend their stay by "border hopping". If you have

the triple entry tourist visa in place, this is not relevant to you now

and will not be in August.

The Consulate in Hull can only supply you with a visa if you apply in

person. If you wish to apply by post you can only do this now by

sending your application to the Royal Thai Embassy in London and you

must use the Embassy's form.

We here in Hull are open Monday to Friday, from 9.30 to 4pm. We will be

closed on August Bank Holiday Monday."

I did not ask, but I assume that this advice applies irrespective of your age i.e. whether you are over or under 50.

In my case, I no longer work. As far as I am concerned I am a tourist. I do all the things that tourists do, stretched over 9 months rather than squeezed into 30 days of frantic hedonism.

I then return to UK to deal with personal matters, and to enjoy my home country, for 2 or 3 months before getting another triple entry visa and returning to Samui.

Here is the OED definition of tourist:

http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/tourist

"A person who is travelling or visiting a place for pleasure." There is no limit on time i.e. 2 weeks, 30 days 90 days or whatever; you can be a tourist for as long as you want.

The Thai authorities are well aware of my travelling history to their country. They are happy for me to return as a long term tourist.

I appreciate that my story does not conform to some TV members' definition of what a "tourist" should be, but there you go. The Thais are happy and therefore so am I.

Finally, it's worth repeating ubonjoe:

I cannot see that anybody is being asked to leave. They just want people to use visas instead of doing border runs for exempt entries. I think a lot people are making a lot more out of the tightening up of the rules than there really is. It is still going to be possible to get tourist visas.

.

Edited for typos.

Edited July 2, 2014 by jukebox

[user82374298374]

Bullsh*t. Over 16000 dollars (3225 per year!) wasted while you can get 12 month business visa in Cambodia for 280 dollars.

Yes, but Cambodia sucks.

;>

[BlueEasySleep]

I was nearly denied entry with an ED visa from a government university. If you think they'll just wave you through suvarnabhumi with a passport full of tourist visas, that may be changing.

Sent from my GT-I8552B using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[tingtongteesood]

Number 3 is just the standard impetuous nonsense we see all the time. If you have money and want to live in Thailand under 50, go get the Thai Elite Card - 500,000 baht for five years.

Thailand has exceptionally generous visa options.

I have money because I am not stupid. Visas for 5 years cost NOWHERE near that much. It is very far from being a good deal. If it was 200,000 then I may consider it...

[BlueEasySleep]

It wasn't that long ago that the retirement rule was reduced from i think 60yrs of age

to 50yrs, so in actual fact it's been made easier to retire in Thailand.

Why 50yrs old, well, they have to draw the line somewhere, and it's unlikely that under 50's

will be wanting to retire anyway, it's just common sense.

As for your other questions, on working illegally, well this is what they want to stop, by

enforcing the rules to make everyone get the correct visas and work permits and then

pay income tax too.

Can't anybody retire if they have enough money to support themselves? Why do you need to be a certain age?

You need to have a university degree to get a work permit, and many teachers don't have that. So it's not going to make everyone pay more tax, it's going to force a lot of teachers to leave. Thus leaving many schools with no foreign english teachers. What is the major benefit for the country in that?

Why does the USA, UK, Australia etc. make it so difficult to get a visa. Hell I can be in the USA and decide I want to go to Thailand tomorrow and buy a ticket and leave. A Thai cant decide I want to go to the USA tomorrow and buy a ticket and leave. They have to apply for a visa that takes months to just get an interview and then hope and pray they get one. For the most part Thailand has easy visa requirements.

Because westerners have a lot more money than thais. And because Thailand has no welfare system to exploit, whereas the us and uk do.

That's pretty obvious.

Sent from my GT-I8552B using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[tingtongteesood]

>3. I'm curious if anyone knows why over 50 year olds with a pension are welcomed with a special visa, while under 50 year olds with cash are now being asked to leave. What is the rationale? Why is over 50 and foreign desirable for the country?

I cannot see that anybody is being asked to leave. They just want people to use visas instead of doing border runs for exempt entries. I think a lot people are making a lot more out of the tightening up of the rules than there really is.

It is still going to be possible to get tourist visas.

But from 12th August even visas are not going to be guaranteed entry. It's getting mad !

[paz]

But from 12th August even visas are not going to be guaranteed entry. It's getting mad !

Wrong, Have visa, no problem.

[silver sea]

>3. I'm curious if anyone knows why over 50 year olds with a pension are welcomed with a special visa, while under 50 year olds with cash are now being asked to leave. What is the rationale? Why is over 50 and foreign desirable for the country?

I cannot see that anybody is being asked to leave. They just want people to use visas instead of doing border runs for exempt entries. I think a lot people are making a lot more out of the tightening up of the rules than there really is.

It is still going to be possible to get tourist visas.

But from 12th August even visas are not going to be guaranteed entry. It's getting mad !

Sorry, tingtongseetood, but you are wrong - see my post #49 on the previous page of this thread.

[BlueEasySleep]

I had a visa and had a problem. it's definitely not guaranteed.

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[paz]

I had a visa and had a problem. it's definitely not guaranteed.

One experience, against tens of thousands daily is statistically insignificant. And in the end, you were allowed.

Guess what, all those that have got no problems don't bother reporting or even reading this forum.

[BlueEasySleep]

Desirable long term guests in any country should be:

1. Those who have expertise in business/science/etc and can fill positions of professional need. This would include English teachers.

2. Those who have money and want to spend it, regardless of their age. This would include those who spend money on education.

[MrWorldwide]

It wasn't that long ago that the retirement rule was reduced from i think 60yrs of age

to 50yrs, so in actual fact it's been made easier to retire in Thailand.

Why 50yrs old, well, they have to draw the line somewhere, and it's unlikely that under 50's

will be wanting to retire anyway, it's just common sense.

As for your other questions, on working illegally, well this is what they want to stop, by

enforcing the rules to make everyone get the correct visas and work permits and then

pay income tax too.

Can't anybody retire if they have enough money to support themselves? Why do you need to be a certain age?

You need to have a university degree to get a work permit, and many teachers don't have that. So it's not going to make everyone pay more tax, it's going to force a lot of teachers to leave. Thus leaving many schools with no foreign english teachers. What is the major benefit for the country in that?

Why does the USA, UK, Australia etc. make it so difficult to get a visa. Hell I can be in the USA and decide I want to go to Thailand tomorrow and buy a ticket and leave. A Thai cant decide I want to go to the USA tomorrow and buy a ticket and leave. They have to apply for a visa that takes months to just get an interview and then hope and pray they get one. For the most part Thailand has easy visa requirements.

Because each of those countries has massive problems with illegal workers overstaying - and in many cases being exploited by local employers and worse. Most of us have read the trafficking horror stories but a lady I knew in Udon Thani wasnt trafficked - she went to Melbourne willingly to work for a Thai-Australian family in northern Victoria. When I met her back in Melbourne a couple of months later she had worked on farms all over the district for 250 Australian dollars a week - a pittance - alongside a team of other women from Isaan. They did whatever they were asked to do, in bitterly cold weather, without complaint and the host family was obviously doing very well out of them. The next time I heard from her she sent me a text from Villawood Detention Centre saying they were deporting her - roughly 5 months after coming to Australia on a 30-day tourist visa I dont blame her for trying to improve her lot in life, but its not hard to see why Australian Immigration wants to do everything they can to ensure that the Australia taxpayer doesnt foot the bill to detain people and fly them back to their country of origin. No idea if the family involved was prosecuted.

Edited July 2, 2014 by MrWorldwide

[jacko45k]

They could make the same bank requirements for under 50s as they do for over 50s. I don't see that as making any sense.

They have decided that they will welcome retirees who have enough pension income or savings to live here, as a retiree.

It is perhaps hard for them to grasp that there may be under 50's who are already financially sound and no longer wish to work.

At what age do you think a retirement visa / (dosser visa ) should be obtainable? 49, 39, 29, 19 or 9?

Edited July 2, 2014 by jacko45k