Israel prepares for ground military operation, 98 dead in Gaza Strip airstrikes

[Pattszero]

 

 

^^ There you go again - denying the rights of the indigenous people. 

 

It's appalling. 

 

Asinine. Who are these "indigenous people" and where did they come from? If you mean the "Palestinian" imposters, they sure aren't indigenous.

 

There never was a people called Palestinians until after WWII when this bloody terrorist group hijacked the name from the old name of Palestine which was an area that included several countries.

 

There never was a country called Palestine and there never were, and there aren't Palestinians. They aren't even imposters. They are name inventors.

 

 

I think it is rather immaterial now.  The Palestinians, under one name or another have their roots in the area. The Jews do as well.

 

Getting into a pissing contest about who was first, or who has more historical/religious right to the land is all very nice, but the reality nowadays is that both got a valid claim. Denying the other side existence as a people, or denial of other side's right to exist are both unacceptable, and lead nowhere.
 

 

 

Correct -  

 

The fact of the matter is that the vast majority of the settlers in Israel have zero connection to the country.  They are European and have been for a thousand years or more. 

 

This entire imbroglio is a European creation now backed by monstrous right-wing Christian zealots who have the temerity to say that 1947 is the only year that matters.  I can't be bothered going into all that but anyone with a brain can see how morally abhorrent that position is.

 

As far as I'm concerned, as a Brit, I would issue every single European settler in Israel a British passport and invite them to come live among us. We Brits, especially the English, owe the Jewish people a historical apology for expelling them. It was an aberration of our historical declaration of the freedom of men enshrined in the Magna Carta and the Declaration of Arbroath.

 

The Jews shouldn't be in Israel, they should be here living under our protection while they await the Last Days, and their calling  by God.

 

The UN Resolution of 1947 was not God's calling.  There are millions of Jews that agree with that. 

[Jingthing]

Jews in general have no reason to trust Europe (Eastern or Western) after what happened to the Jews there in thousands of years there of European history. Now things can possibly change over time... witness the trend of migration of Israelis to Berlin Germany. But contrast that with the massive increase of antisemitism in France encouraging many French Jews to go to Israel. For the foreseeable future, Zionism lives in Israel. 

Edited July 13, 2014 by Jingthing

[Ulysses G.]

The fact of the matter is that the vast majority of the settlers in Israel have zero connection to the country.  They are European and have been for a thousand years or more.

Wrong again. Israel has been a country for 66 years. The the vast majority of their citizens were born right in Israel. They have little to do with Europe and are not going anywhere. People like you better get used to it.

[Pattszero]

 

The fact of the matter is that the vast majority of the settlers in Israel have zero connection to the country.  They are European and have been for a thousand years or more.

Wrong again. Israel has been a country for 66 years. The the vast majority of their citizens were born right in Israel. They have little to do with Europe and are not going anywhere. People like you better get used to it.

 

 

See, this is where the problem lies - people like you actually believe that this 66 year figure is relevant in the context of thousands of years.  It's a nonsense - based upon a diabolical decision by the white man's club.  

 

Then the big white man's club wields a veto to ensure that no matter what the Israelis do, they will never be censured by the now more representative UN. It's a land grab, illegal in every way, made worse by the fact that every single time the Israelis grab more land, the US is now powerless to prevent it.  

 

It's the perfect storm of self-defeating policies.  Defended by morally abhorrent people who would man the barricades if a similar illegal occupation was enforced on their home countries.  

[Ulysses G.]

If Israel does not target civilians, so why UN: 77% of the dead in Gaza are civilians ??

You better start watching the news before making ignorant comments. 
Number one, those figure come out of a hat. Hamas do not wear uniforms, so there is no way to tell who is who at this point in time.
Number two, Hamas has been encouraging civilians to ignore warnings of airstrikes and some have been rushing into buildings that were about to be hit, so that they could become "martyrs" and be guaranteed those 72 virgins. The blame for civilian deaths goes to Hamas.
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXZEzbT0H1s

[Pattszero]

 

If Israel does not target civilians, so why UN: 77% of the dead in Gaza are civilians ??

You better start watching the news before making ignorant comments. 
Number one, those figure come out of a hat. Hamas do not wear uniforms, so there is no way to tell who is who at this point in time.
Number two, Hamas has been encouraging civilians to ignore warnings of airstrikes and some have been rushing into buildings that were about to be hit, so that they could become "martyrs" and be guaranteed those 72 virgins. The blame for civilian deaths goes to Hamas.
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXZEzbT0H1s

 

 

If people rush voluntarily into the buildings then Hamas are not to blame. 

 

I bet you're the kind of guy that would eulogize Americans that gave up their lives to further the cause of nationhood, at lets say - The Alamo? 

 

Do you really understand how morally bankrupt your stance is? 

[Ulysses G.]

See, this is where the problem lies - people like you actually believe that this 66 year figure is relevant in the context of thousands of years.

No the problem is that the Jews were there long before the Palestinians to start with - over three thousand years - and that they have a viable country that is thriving economically. They have been recognized by the UN and they have won numerous wars against their enemies. Whether people like you like it, or not, they are not going anywhere.  

[up-country_sinclair]

 

If Israel does not target civilians, so why UN: 77% of the dead in Gaza are civilians ??

You better start watching the news before making ignorant comments. 
Number one, those figure come out of a hat. Hamas do not wear uniforms, so there is no way to tell who is who at this point in time.
Number two, Hamas has been encouraging civilians to ignore warnings of airstrikes and some have been rushing into buildings that were about to be hit, so that they could become "martyrs" and be guaranteed those 72 virgins. The blame for civilian deaths goes to Hamas.
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXZEzbT0H1s

 

 

Those figures came from the UN.

 

Israel is murdering women and children.
 

[Ulysses G.]

 

 

If Israel does not target civilians, so why UN: 77% of the dead in Gaza are civilians ??

You better start watching the news before making ignorant comments. 
Number one, those figure come out of a hat. Hamas do not wear uniforms, so there is no way to tell who is who at this point in time.
Number two, Hamas has been encouraging civilians to ignore warnings of airstrikes and some have been rushing into buildings that were about to be hit, so that they could become "martyrs" and be guaranteed those 72 virgins. The blame for civilian deaths goes to Hamas.
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXZEzbT0H1s

 

 
If people rush voluntarily into the buildings then Hamas are not to blame.

 

They are if Hamas tells them to do it as per the video that I linked to.

[Pattszero]

 

 

 

If Israel does not target civilians, so why UN: 77% of the dead in Gaza are civilians ??

You better start watching the news before making ignorant comments. 
Number one, those figure come out of a hat. Hamas do not wear uniforms, so there is no way to tell who is who at this point in time.
Number two, Hamas has been encouraging civilians to ignore warnings of airstrikes and some have been rushing into buildings that were about to be hit, so that they could become "martyrs" and be guaranteed those 72 virgins. The blame for civilian deaths goes to Hamas.
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXZEzbT0H1s

 

 
If people rush voluntarily into the buildings then Hamas are not to blame.

 

They are if Hamas tells them to do it as per the video that I linked to.

 

 

You're twisting in the wind 

[Ulysses G.]

 

 

If Israel does not target civilians, so why UN: 77% of the dead in Gaza are civilians ??

You better start watching the news before making ignorant comments. 
Number one, those figure come out of a hat. Hamas do not wear uniforms, so there is no way to tell who is who at this point in time.
Number two, Hamas has been encouraging civilians to ignore warnings of airstrikes and some have been rushing into buildings that were about to be hit, so that they could become "martyrs" and be guaranteed those 72 virgins. The blame for civilian deaths goes to Hamas.
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXZEzbT0H1s

 

 
Those figures came from the UN.

 

Would the UN hypocrites ever lie about Israel?  

http://www.algemeiner.com/2014/07/10/who-started-the-fighting-in-gaza-the-un-lies-as-usual/

Edited July 13, 2014 by Ulysses G.

[Pattszero]

From The Economist

 

[Ulysses G.]

You're twisting in the wind

 
Of course. A video from Hamas itself telling civilians to stay and die is not real proof. 

[up-country_sinclair]

 

 

Those figures came from the UN.

 

Would the UN hypocrites ever lie about Israel?
 

 

 

The thread would be better served if we all avoided tinfoil-hat conspiracy theories.
 

Edited July 13, 2014 by up-country_sinclair

[chuckd]

 

 

The fact of the matter is that the vast majority of the settlers in Israel have zero connection to the country.  They are European and have been for a thousand years or more.

Wrong again. Israel has been a country for 66 years. The the vast majority of their citizens were born right in Israel. They have little to do with Europe and are not going anywhere. People like you better get used to it.

 

 

See, this is where the problem lies - people like you actually believe that this 66 year figure is relevant in the context of thousands of years.  It's a nonsense - based upon a diabolical decision by the white man's club.  

 

Then the big white man's club wields a veto to ensure that no matter what the Israelis do, they will never be censured by the now more representative UN. It's a land grab, illegal in every way, made worse by the fact that every single time the Israelis grab more land, the US is now powerless to prevent it.  

 

It's the perfect storm of self-defeating policies.  Defended by morally abhorrent people who would man the barricades if a similar illegal occupation was enforced on their home countries.  

 

 

Let me get this straight.  

 

You make this claim in post number 121:

 

"This entire imbroglio is a European creation now backed by monstrous right-wing Christian zealots

 

Then you make this claim in the quoted post:

 

"  It's a nonsense - based upon a diabolical decision by the white man's club.  

 

Are you claiming that this war between Muslim Palestinian Arabs and Israeli Jews is all the fault of a diabolical and monstrous group of white people that are all right-wing Christian zealots?

 

Just wondering, do you have flashes of brilliance often?

[Ulysses G.]

The thread would be better served if we all avoided tinfoil-hat conspiracy theories.

Like claiming that Israel is purposely targeting civilians, despite the overwhelming evidence otherwise. 

Edited July 13, 2014 by Ulysses G.

[Scott]

Off-topic posts deleted along with replies.  

[Pattszero]

 

 

 

The fact of the matter is that the vast majority of the settlers in Israel have zero connection to the country.  They are European and have been for a thousand years or more.

Wrong again. Israel has been a country for 66 years. The the vast majority of their citizens were born right in Israel. They have little to do with Europe and are not going anywhere. People like you better get used to it.

 

 

See, this is where the problem lies - people like you actually believe that this 66 year figure is relevant in the context of thousands of years.  It's a nonsense - based upon a diabolical decision by the white man's club.  

 

Then the big white man's club wields a veto to ensure that no matter what the Israelis do, they will never be censured by the now more representative UN. It's a land grab, illegal in every way, made worse by the fact that every single time the Israelis grab more land, the US is now powerless to prevent it.  

 

It's the perfect storm of self-defeating policies.  Defended by morally abhorrent people who would man the barricades if a similar illegal occupation was enforced on their home countries.  

 

 

Let me get this straight.  

 

You make this claim in post number 121:

 

"This entire imbroglio is a European creation now backed by monstrous right-wing Christian zealots

 

Then you make this claim in the quoted post:

 

"  It's a nonsense - based upon a diabolical decision by the white man's club.  

 

Are you claiming that this war between Muslim Palestinian Arabs and Israeli Jews is all the fault of a diabolical and monstrous group of white people that are all right-wing Christian zealots?

 

Just wondering, do you have flashes of brilliance often?

 

 

Yes - and yes. 

[Clutch]

[quote name="Pralaad" post="8092120" timestamp="1405183713"][quote name="Clutch" post="8092116" timestamp="1405183522"] [quote name="Ulysses G." post="8091297" timestamp="1405166653"] [quote name="Pattszero" post="8091222" timestamp="1405165144"]These people who have no territorial claim. 
 
Beyond a fairy story written three thousand years ago,[/quote]That and the fact that they have been living there for more than 3,700 years, that the international community granted political sovereignty in Palestine to the Jewish people and that the Jewish people settled and developed the land - as well as winning 4 or 5 wars against overwhelming odds.[/quote]
3,700 years ago? 4 'OR' 5 wars?
And, Jesus was a carpenter, or at least that's what I'm told. Alibaba and the 30 thieves is a good read too.
 [/quote]
 
May be you should stop reading kids books and try books for grown ups, including history
 
By the way, its 40 thieves not 30,[/

I'm pleased you know your thieves! Thieves are a dime a dozen around the Palestinians land. PS: I'm not an Anti-termite, just saying how it is.

[Pralaad]

I'm pleased you know your thieves! Thieves are a dime a dozen around the Palestinians land. PS: I'm not an Anti-termite, just saying how it is.

 

You should be rather ashamed for not knowing the correct name for your own post but i guess small minds are easily entertained.

[Clutch]

I'm pleased you know your thieves! Thieves are a dime a dozen around the Palestinians land. PS: I'm not an Anti-termite, just saying how it is.

 
You should be rather ashamed for not knowing the correct name for your own post but i guess small minds are easily entertained.

Termites destroy houses. Got it!

[Pralaad]

 

 

I'm pleased you know your thieves! Thieves are a dime a dozen around the Palestinians land. PS: I'm not an Anti-termite, just saying how it is.

 
You should be rather ashamed for not knowing the correct name for your own post but i guess small minds are easily entertained.

Termites destroy houses. Got it!

 

 

As i said and now confirmed, small minds are easily entertained.

 

PS. i was referring to your total lack of knowledge on what you post regarding the name of the kids book, ie being 40 not 30.

 

But clearly even that was too hard to process or comprehend, 

 

Soldier On

[Johpa]

The UN calls for a ceasefire, but Israel is intent on continuing its ethnic cleansing campaign.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jul/12/un-security-council-gaza-ceasefire-call

 

 

 

 

 

As deplorable as many Israeli political decisions have been over the past decades  (e.g. the settlements on the West Bank) your characterization of Israeli policy as ethnic cleansing shows both your biases and your ignorance. As failed as I perceive the politics of Netanyahu, I recognize that it has nothing to do with ethnic cleansing.

[Clutch]

The UN calls for a ceasefire, but Israel is intent on continuing its ethnic cleansing campaign.
 
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jul/12/un-security-council-gaza-ceasefire-call
 
 
 
 

 
As deplorable as many Israeli political decisions have been over the past decades  (e.g. the settlements on the West Bank) your characterization of Israeli policy as ethnic cleansing shows both your biases and your ignorance. As failed as I perceive the politics of Netanyahu, I recognize that it has nothing to do with ethnic cleansing.

Go visit Israel some time, they're shipping out Ethiopian Jews like it's going out of fashion. YouTube if you like!

[up-country_sinclair]

 

The UN calls for a ceasefire, but Israel is intent on continuing its ethnic cleansing campaign.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jul/12/un-security-council-gaza-ceasefire-call

 

 

 

 

 

As deplorable as many Israeli political decisions have been over the past decades  (e.g. the settlements on the West Bank) your characterization of Israeli policy as ethnic cleansing shows both your biases and your ignorance. As failed as I perceive the politics of Netanyahu, I recognize that it has nothing to do with ethnic cleansing.

 

 

Take it up with the UN human rights recorder:

 

Richard Falk, United Nations special rapporteur on human rights in the Palestinian territories, told a news conference that Israeli policies bore "unacceptable characteristics of colonialism, apartheid and ethnic cleansing".

 

 

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/03/21/uk-palestinian-israel-un-idUKBREA2K1JM20140321

[Chicog]

 

See, this is where the problem lies - people like you actually believe that this 66 year figure is relevant in the context of thousands of years.

No the problem is that the Jews were there long before the Palestinians to start with - over three thousand years - and that they have a viable country that is thriving economically. They have been recognized by the UN and they have won numerous wars against their enemies. Whether people like you like it, or not, they are not going anywhere.  

 

 

I don't know where you get this from, but Israel is not thriving. They export about $63Bn and import about $70Bn. They have $79Bn of reserves and $112Bn of external debt.

They could not survive without being propped up.

 

Plus they have a growing population of those nutters who think they should spend every day doing nothing but bleating the torah and expect to get paid for doing it.

[Chicog]

 

The thread would be better served if we all avoided tinfoil-hat conspiracy theories.

Like claiming that Israel is purposely targeting civilians, despite the overwhelming evidence otherwise. 

 

 

They might not be deliberately targeting them, but they certainly shed no tears over the civilians they kill.

[Pralaad]

 

 

The UN calls for a ceasefire, but Israel is intent on continuing its ethnic cleansing campaign.
 
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jul/12/un-security-council-gaza-ceasefire-call
 
 
 
 

 
As deplorable as many Israeli political decisions have been over the past decades  (e.g. the settlements on the West Bank) your characterization of Israeli policy as ethnic cleansing shows both your biases and your ignorance. As failed as I perceive the politics of Netanyahu, I recognize that it has nothing to do with ethnic cleansing.

Go visit Israel some time, they're shipping out Ethiopian Jews like it's going out of fashion. YouTube if you like!

 

 

Please go educate yourself, you are making a complete fool out of yourself.

 

Israel to deport some 25,000 immigrants from Ethiopia, South Sudan, Côte d'Ivoire and Ghana.

 

They are not Jews and are not legal migrants

 

Do this look like Jews to you? Rhetorical question for those with little less termites through the brain

 

[attachment=275174:00260978-866013cab6ca7974d934e18da4c696c6-arc614x376-w614-us1.jpg]

 

Not all movies are made real, try reading for a change

http://allafrica.com/stories/201312100198.html

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/israel-says-it-wont-forcibly-deport-illegal-african-migrants-but-it-wants-them-to-leave/2013/12/20/1c81d8be-5cf2-11e3-8d24-31c016b976b2_story.html

Edited July 13, 2014 by Pralaad

[Johpa]

 

 

Jews were a small minority for centuries.

Again. Indigenous has nothing to do with being a minority. The American Indians and the Australian Aborigines are both minorities, but they were still there before the white man and are the indigenous people in their areas and so are the Jews in the area called Palestine. The Jews were there first and never left. Therefore, Jewish claims for some territorial rights based upon historical residence in the area are perfectly reasonable.

 

 

As a matter of historical detail did not the Jews (Joshua) destroy / remove the then existing indigenous population, the Canaanites. Justification being the Canaanite territory was the "promised land"

 

 

Perhaps it is indeed historical detail and it serves to demonstrate the long running brutal tides of history that include military conquests (losers and winners), political conquests(losers and winners) , migrations (Thais migrated down into Southeast Asia and displaced Mons), expulsions, irredentist populations, etc.  Going back centuries we see Magyars migrating and displacing Indo-Eurpean speaking people, Turkomans migrating into Byzantium, and more recently Chinese into Tibet and Tamils into Sri Lanka.  Again, history is brutal. 

 

Israel came into existence in 1947. Those 18 at that time would now be 85 so not many people around who were involved in that decision. So that leaves about 6 million Israelis who have no other concept of home apart from Israel. And despite Netanyahu and the AIPAC folks ridiculous statements, it sad nothing to do with biblical claims, and besides most Israelis are very secular. So there is little difference between the modern Israelis concept of "homeland" and an American or Australian concept of homeland, two examples of other nationalities that came relatively recently into existence by the same brutal historical forces that created Israel. 

 

The Arabs certainly have the right to protest the decsions made in 1947 by others, decisions that would not be made today, or at the very least a decision that I would not make today.  But to what effect is the current protest?  The modern state of Israel is, for all intents and purposes, a fait accompli, a result of migrations, military and political victories and I should add political mistakes by the Arab leadership during the Great Wars of the 20th century where they backed the losing side.  Bottom line is that Israel is not going anywhere and that reality trumps all the useless hot air about BIblical justifications and previous land rights, etc, etc ad nauseum.  So all the Arabs are doing, apart from being in denial of history, is to condemn their children to more generations of violence whilst the remainder of the world moves onward.  Chaiyo!

[johna]

 

The thread would be better served if we all avoided tinfoil-hat conspiracy theories.

Like claiming that Israel is purposely targeting civilians, despite the overwhelming evidence otherwise. 

 

Then I guess Israel is a lousy shot, because most of their victims are civilian.