Thai military keeps US waiting over Cobra Gold

[rametindallas]

The foreign policy of the US's 'community organizer' president has been a disaster. An article today from a 'liberal' website is just one example: 'Everyone Says John Kerry Should Stay Out of the Middle East' http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/07/13/everyone-says-john-kerry-should-stay-out-of-the-middle-east.html

To a Thai, a true friend doesn't desert them over high-horse principles. A true friend is someone who will stick with you through thick and thin. The current administration of the US has clearly stated (by Thai standards) that it is not a friend to Thailand and will only help/cooperate with Thailand if Thailand follows the US's rules. I can't say I blame the NCPO for taking the attitude they have; in fact I admire their courage to stand up the the US pressure/threats. The US needs all the support it can get and the current administration is too dense to comprehend that. I hope that by the time a new administration is sworn in that it is not too late to repair the relationship as Thailand is strategically located and really does have some influence on the region. This is not good for Thailand either as any partnership with China will have many more 'strings' attached than one with the US.

[PhilipCook]

Red rover red rover send a new US ambassador over.

[Tatsujin]

As I've said before, there is a major shift in attitudes here to the USA, and China is picking up ALL the pieces the USA threw out of their pram when they heard the words "coup".

The US Ambassador to Thailand has done an absolutely shit job in letting Washington know what Thailand is all about . . . and after all these years I would have thought they would understand the Thai/Asian mindset a little better.

[rametindallas]

US is bound by their own law in how they react to a coup. I'm surprised the Thai government doesn't know that.

What US law are you referring to? Did you even bother to read the OP?

The exercises have been conducted every year since they began without interruption. They were even held in 2007, one year after a military coup led by retired Army General Sonthi Boonyaratglin dislodged former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra.

Now, what are you surprised the Thai government didn't know? They should have let the overzealous supporters of the remains of Thaksin's puppet government continue their violence on legal, peaceful demonstrations because of the threat of US sanctions? Thailand, with this most recent action inaction has proven once again it will not be a puppet state of the US.

[aussieinthailand]

USA you hurt my feeling and now I'm not talking to you. REALLY, grow up.

[Benmart]

It's just an excuse to let the grunts visit the knocking shop anyway.

Crude and juvenile. It reveals a lack of military experience and a mature understanding of the nature of these exercises.

[sweatalot]

If you don't invite them, they might invade.

and make Thaksin dictator

[Benmart]

US is bound by their own law in how they react to a coup. I'm surprised the Thai government doesn't know that.

What US law are you referring to? Did you even bother to read the OP?

The exercises have been conducted every year since they began without interruption. They were even held in 2007, one year after a military coup led by retired Army General Sonthi Boonyaratglin dislodged former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra.

Now, what are you surprised the Thai government didn't know? They should have let the overzealous supporters of the remains of Thaksin's puppet government continue their violence on legal, peaceful demonstrations because of the threat of US sanctions? Thailand, with this most recent action inaction has proven once again it will not be a puppet state of the US.

The Foreign Assistance Act of 1961, Section 508 may be the law the poster is refering to.

During the 2006 coup, aid was indeed suspended in certain areas, but the US Government decided to participate in the 2007 Cobra Gold Exercise. This past decision has sparked new debate about the appropriateness of that decision and how it has been applied during recent events.

As for the US/Thailand relations. The term "Puppet State" seems to be used by those that cannot or will not see the relationships, between two sovereign countries, to negotiate treaties and trade pacts that benefit both states.

The US and many other countries, with all their past and present faults, have contributed to the modernization of Thailand. Japan, once an occupying force in Thailand during the 1940s , is now investing enormous amounts of money into Thailand. The US, as far as I know, never invaded or occupied this country by military force. (GI's on R&R and bases here during the Vietnam War don't count).

The bravado statement "...not be a puppet state", seems to attach more importance to a situation than it warrants. I would hardly describe the US as an interested Puppet Master of a rather small, inward looking, puppet show.

This Too Shall Pass

Edited July 14, 2014 by Benmart

[Benmart]

The foreign policy of the US's 'community organizer' president has been a disaster. An article today from a 'liberal' website is just one example: 'Everyone Says John Kerry Should Stay Out of the Middle East' http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/07/13/everyone-says-john-kerry-should-stay-out-of-the-middle-east.html

To a Thai, a true friend doesn't desert them over high-horse principles. A true friend is someone who will stick with you through thick and thin. The current administration of the US has clearly stated (by Thai standards) that it is not a friend to Thailand and will only help/cooperate with Thailand if Thailand follows the US's rules. I can't say I blame the NCPO for taking the attitude they have; in fact I admire their courage to stand up the the US pressure/threats. The US needs all the support it can get and the current administration is too dense to comprehend that. I hope that by the time a new administration is sworn in that it is not too late to repair the relationship as Thailand is strategically located and really does have some influence on the region. This is not good for Thailand either as any partnership with China will have many more 'strings' attached than one with the US.

Your post has merit. However, I'm not a political "expert", if there is such a thing. There may be political posturing for public consumption, but I would imagine the discussions of substance take place behind closed doors. Hence, I'm in the dark about much of this as anyone else.

My guess, and the are many on this forum, is that relationships between the USA and Thailand will warm up once the civilian government is back in place.

As for Mr. Kerry (as well as his predecessors), I wish him well. It's a rough job. Avoided by most. Criticized by many. A appreciated by few.

[sgtsabai]

By law the US is obligated to reduce military spending etc. following the "overthrow" of a democratically elected government (I'm not going into the semantics of democratically). On the other hand the US doesn't follow it's laws except when it wants to, i.e. Egypt military aid, spying etc., etc., etc. The Thai general is no fool, but John Kerry certainly is. China is just waiting to pick up the pieces. It was a very bad, stupid mistake by the US, lets hope it doesn't get compounded by letting China get a real foothold here. And for the poster about 'knocking shop' (assuming that bit of slang means house of prostitution) you know nothing. This has been covered over and over again in other threads. Just a quick reminder, if they get caught with a prostitute they face courts martial. Oh thank you Buddha, it wasn't that way when I was USMC.

[chuang]

Playing hard to get...

[arjunadawn]

The problem is the current administration in the USA, not the Americans. The destruction of trust with Americas allies, everywhere, is so great as to hardly be accidental. Thailand needs America a lot less then America needs Thailand. This is what happens when 60s radical druggies put on a suit, dust off the 4 year degree, and work for the us government.

Thailand is brilliant in requesting a written statement while publishing the USA offer to begin exercises. Personally, I think Thailand should politely refuse to "play" for whatever reason. This'll send them spinning as they watch the USA Asian Pivot, String of Pearls, unravel (string of pearls- theory of encircling and containing china via regional partners). Good for Thailand!

[arjunadawn]

By law the US is obligated to reduce military spending etc. following the "overthrow" of a democratically elected government (I'm not going into the semantics of democratically). On the other hand the US doesn't follow it's laws except when it wants to, i.e. Egypt military aid, spying etc., etc., etc. The Thai general is no fool, but John Kerry certainly is. China is just waiting to pick up the pieces. It was a very bad, stupid mistake by the US, lets hope it doesn't get compounded by letting China get a real foothold here. And for the poster about 'knocking shop' (assuming that bit of slang means house of prostitution) you know nothing. This has been covered over and over again in other threads. Just a quick reminder, if they get caught with a prostitute they face courts martial. Oh thank you Buddha, it wasn't that way when I was USMC.

I agree with you. Recently I've told others that the USA has no choice but to reduce military type aid to any country who has a non elected government. Yea.. But inside I do know this is waiverable by the executive branch. We saw this authority in Egypt recently. The US waded in like it does every other place and issue, ignorantly, and amateurish. Many have said the US admin wants to reduce Americas prestige in the world. Others have said it's bumbling amateur hour at the White House- always. Still, a few fools think the US Gov is wise. I'm not sure a small group of people can be so ignorant and accidentally destructive to USA/Allies needs. Behind the buffoonery of the White House there's some really brilliant lifetime employees that are super smart. They must be intentionally doing stupid crap- such as the response to Thailand. I think so.

[spidermike007]

Make em suffer.

China is a waaaaay better option.

Thailand doesn't need the US anywhere near as much as the USA need them.

While I agree to some extent, in making them squirm a bit, over the false, silly, childish, churlish reaction of the neophyte foreign policy nincompoops in Washington, cozying up to China may be an unwise move. If you think the US has bad motives, it is nothing compared to the Chinese. They are positively heinous. I am not referring to the Chinese people, whom I like and respect. I am talking about the Politburo, which is a group of super corrupt billionaires bent on world domination, in line with the communist manifesto. Take a look at an excerpt from a recent article on China, written by the Los Angeles Times:

Why do China's officers want to go to war? There is an unfortunate confluence of factors. First, there is a new Chinese confidence bordering on arrogance. Beijing leaders, especially since 2008, have been riding high. They saw economic turmoil around the world and thought the century was theirs to dominate. The U.S. and the rest of the West, they believed, were in terminal decline.

The Chinese military also has gained substantial influence in the last year, perhaps becoming the most powerful faction in the Communist Party. Beginning as early as 2003, senior officers of the People's Liberation Army were drawn into civilian power struggles as Hu Jintao, then the new leader, sought their support in his effort to shove aside Jiang Zemin, his wily predecessor who sought to linger in the limelight. Last year, the civilian infighting intensified as the so-called Fifth Generation leadership, under the command of Xi, took over from Hu's Fourth. Like a decade ago, feuding civilians sought the support of the generals and admirals, making them arbiters in the party's increasingly rough game of politics.

The result of discord among civilian leaders has been a partial remilitarization of politics and policy. Senior officers are now acting independently of civilian officials, are openly criticizing them and are making pronouncements in areas once considered the exclusive province of diplomats.

The remilitarization has had consequences. As Huang Jing of Singapore's Lee Kuan Yew School of Public Policy said: "China's military spending is growing so fast that it has overtaken strategy. The young officers are taking control of strategy, and it is like young officers in Japan in the 1930s. They are thinking what they can do, not what they should do."

​Where will all this lead? I believe the Chinese have some very, very bad intentions. So beware what you wish for. All this is just my opinion of course.

[ClutchClark]

Delete

Edited July 14, 2014 by ClutchClark

[Baerboxer]

The US should detach from Thailand. It is not welcome or wanted by the Thais. The US has wasted a lot of taxpayer money in South East Asia and making the Thais rich and secure. Security in South East Asia, provided by the US, has inspired Japanese investment all over Thailand. Without US security and military support, the Thais will be fine. They have proven time and again that they can take care of their own affairs. The US should stop wasting US taxpayer money in Thailand.

Will you be writing to President Obama with this pearl? I'm sure he'll take such inputs and treat them appropriately when devising US foreign policy.

[sgtsabai]

The Foreign Assistance Act, a U.S. law first enacted in 1961, is pretty clear: It says, in Section 508, that the United States must cut aid to any country whose duly elected head of government is deposed by military coup or decree.

Thailand, 2006: Bush cut military aid

The George W. Bush administration punished the Thai military by freezing some $24 million in military aid but maintained humanitarian aid programs as well as economic aid.

Let me add, Thaksin was a 'buddy' of Bush.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_Assistance_Act, http://legalnotepad.wordpress.com/2013/07/06/egyptian-coup-detat-and-the-foreign-assistance-act-of-1961/, http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2013/07/05/u-s-has-spotty-record-on-law-requiring-it-to-cut-aid-after-coups/

[Rorri]

Make em suffer.

China is a waaaaay better option.

Thailand doesn't need the US anywhere near as much as the USA need them.

And why does the US need Thailand, can you please explain, I'm interested in why you say this and where did you get your information.

[Baerboxer]

As I've said before, there is a major shift in attitudes here to the USA, and China is picking up ALL the pieces the USA threw out of their pram when they heard the words "coup".

The US Ambassador to Thailand has done an absolutely shit job in letting Washington know what Thailand is all about . . . and after all these years I would have thought they would understand the Thai/Asian mindset a little better.

Not just the US diplomats. I wonder what the European and Aussie diplomats feed back too. Just how much of the detail of the Thaksin proxy government and how they operate in reality has been fed back. It seems like the focus as been on the fact they were "elected" and removed. The reasons why seem to have been dampened down.

[H1w4yR1da]

Make em suffer.

China is a waaaaay better option.

Thailand doesn't need the US anywhere near as much as the USA need them.

Looks like someone hasn't got a clue about world politics.

But then again, Thailand's already run by the Chinese.

Suzuki GSX-R1000 L3 182 hp in-line 4 Superbike

[KhnomKhnom]

Great to see Thailand stick it to USA. If usa wants to be dumb about Thailand and try to play usa's silly little "freedom" card, usa can go play by itself. Go Thai Army !!!

USA still does not understand the world has grown up around it and now considers Uncle Sam an out of touch old fogy. Sam can not slap nations around with the "democracy" stuff anymore. Sam has used up his credibility.

Note, stat on Net says Thailand is China's THIRD largest trading partner. Handwriting is on the wall.

PS, usa war planes need SEA bases; Diego Garcia is a little too far and Australia is way way too far.

[SanSaiExPat]

Great to see Thailand stick it to USA. If usa wants to be dumb about Thailand and try to play usa's silly little "freedom" card, usa can go play by itself. Go Thai Army !!!

USA still does not understand the world has grown up around it and now considers Uncle Sam an out of touch old fogy. Sam can not slap nations around with the "democracy" stuff anymore. Sam has used up his credibility.

Note, stat on Net says Thailand is China's THIRD largest trading partner. Handwriting is on the wall.

PS, usa war planes need SEA bases; Diego Garcia is a little too far and Australia is way way too far.

Okinawa is close enough my friend. We can still reach out and touch you anywhere we want.

[than]

After threaten Thailand, US fear to loose is last ally in region .......

[wandasloan]

The US acted incredibly foolishly and short-sighted to make this threat when China is right there is the shadows waiting to strengthen their relationship both militarily and commercially.

You might be right IF the US had made this threat. But the US has not made this threat. A US congressman once asked a State Department official if the US intended to make such a threat. But no such threat has been made. This is censorship propaganda from the junta, and the report that the US has threatened to do anything at all about Cobra Gold - delay it, move it, cancel it, change it in any way - is simply false, utterly false and reported by the Thai media under both censored news and strong intimidation.

.

[Payboy]

Luckily, the Trouser Snake Gold exercises aren't being relocated.

[iReason]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

Don't take it too serious about what the current regime in the USA has to say about the coup in Thailand. Things will get back to normal once this POS POTUS leaves office. That is as long as the people vote for someone that actually has the ability to restore the USA to what it once was. The current regime in Washington D.C., including John (the lurch) Kerry, should keep it's nose out of Thailand's business.

"vote for someone that actually has the ability to restore the USA to what it once was."

Once was when? Under what administration?

[rebeli]

The US acted incredibly foolishly and short-sighted to make this threat when China is right there is the shadows waiting to strengthen their relationship both militarily and commercially.

You might be right IF the US had made this threat. But the US has not made this threat. A US congressman once asked a State Department official if the US intended to make such a threat. But no such threat has been made. This is censorship propaganda from the junta, and the report that the US has threatened to do anything at all about Cobra Gold - delay it, move it, cancel it, change it in any way - is simply false, utterly false and reported by the Thai media under both censored news and strong intimidation.

.

Dream on with your conspiracy theory.

[Scott]

Off-topic, inflammatory and posts with incorrect information have been removed along with replies.

[bangkapi]

The USA military should get the hell out of everywhere and just defend its own borders.

The military industrial complex is a totally disgusting waste of the world's dwindling resources.

[Old Man River]

US is bound by their own law in how they react to a coup. I'm surprised the Thai government doesn't know that.

Given these guys have been in the military a long time, my guess is they were caught off guard by the one sidedness of the local State Dept. I know I was.

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