Sinsot refund...Its time all farang say no to this outdated peasant dowry system

[sdanielmcev]

Actually, the op never says she is a doctor. Just has a Dr in front of her name. Like Drusilla.

[Datebayo]

I marry my thai wife in Thailand and didn't pay a bath. My answer to this was that they (her family) should pay me for taking care of their daughter. And that's it! Her mohter didn't say hello to me for 3 years but I could live with that. Now I'm even more happy after my divorce!

I married my Thai wife in Thailand and I didn't pay a shower on our wedding day. My in-laws were looking at me with semi disgust

[Datebayo]

"My wife has Dr in front of her first name and wears a cute little hospital coat." ---- This is the first time in my life to come across a doctor not being addressed as a doctor but "....has Dr in front of her name....." I am curious as to what is she???

maybe Consulant at Dr BJ at Sukhumvit?

[MAJIC]

To avoid unpleasantness with the Inlaws,the Girlfriend must handle the return of the Sin Sod after the wedding,if she is not prepared to deal with her family and the the return of the Sin Sod then she is in collusion with her family!

[MAJIC]

To avoid unpleasantness with the Inlaws,the Girlfriend must handle the return of the Sin Sod before and after the wedding,if she is not prepared to deal with her family and the the return of the Sin Sod then she is in collusion with her family! and doesn't give a toss for you!

PS. I recommend that westerners attend a village wedding and witness the 20,000 baht offering,for a 18 year old,childless young lady who has never been married which makes a mockery of the whole Sin Sod,but don't let me stop you from being the stupid Farang!

[krisb]

Each to their own.

I married my wife outside of Thailand so that confused them.

I did too with my now ex wife but we had to register our marriage at the Amphur otherwise the marriage would not be recognized here. BTW why should we say no to sinsot? It is part of the culture & as we live here should respect that culture. Several years ago one of the country cousins received 100,000 from her prospective husband plus some gold & these people come from the lower end of the socio economic scale. I imagine it is still widely practiced.

There are a lot of posters who are Thai bashers. No respect for the customs. Want every thing like back home where they come from.

Are you calling me a Thai basher?

You don't even know me or my wife or my family you rude pos.

Let me tell you something, back home where I come from, the brides family pay for the wedding, which they didn't.

Sounds like you got sucked in to paying for a custom, that likely you don't fully understand anyway.

Strange I mentioned no names yet you take it personal. I wonder why?

There is a big difference between understanding and respect. You obviously do not know the difference.

I just have enough self respect to not pay for my wife.

How much did you pay for her btw?

[thairastawoman]

I think it's nice to meet guys with balls, but it's not so often !!!

[Piccadilly Circus]

And for all the foreigners that are more Thai than the Thais... why nobody commented the post where it says that the young Thais are for abolishing of this custom? None of you have read this post? None of you was informed about these discussions in Pantip? Why would they tell you , right? So what then, tell these younger people to go home to their country? Not this time!

To insult and attack the others who disagree with this is quite low. And that one, talking how if you dont have a million you shudnt .... blah blah...who are you mister millionaire to decide or tell? A doctor wont have time for a foreigner who wont be able to shell 1 million? Arent they people with hearts?

And to the fun , has anybody heard the song where its sang about the man who wants to marry a girl, but dont have the money for the sinsot. So he keeps working and asking wait for me, wait for me, 1 more year, 2 more years. And later when he s rich and can pay, he says its ok, I dont want you anymore. ( nice luktung song)

It's just a song In realtiy most of the young Thai males in today's society are too lazy to work and save for Sin Sot hence why they now are saying they don't want to pay it....work ethics.

[kannot]

I told my Wife to tell her parents go swivel, if u think Im some Jackass dumb Falang you can go screw yourself just like everyone has done to your daughter until i dragged her outta the bar still wet form the last customer....................

Both parents agreed with me and no sinsod was paid

You really do have to TELL EM

I must add both parents are dead so really this was a one way conversation with myself

[Grindting]

To avoid unpleasantness with the Inlaws,the Girlfriend must handle the return of the Sin Sod before and after the wedding,if she is not prepared to deal with her family and the the return of the Sin Sod then she is in collusion with her family! and doesn't give a toss for you!

PS. I recommend that westerners attend a village wedding and witness the 20,000 baht offering,for a 18 year old,childless young lady who has never been married which makes a mockery of the whole Sin Sod,but don't let me stop you from being the stupid Farang!

Funny you mention 20,000 baht, as that is the exact figure i paid at my thai wedding (obviously divorced now as per my previous post).

At that time, I was Very resentful of that sum which just in my opinion a direct payment to a family which were already getting all of my disposable income and more. I was 21 at the time working 4 days a week 1 day in university for a £19,000 pa salary in the UK which was probably good at my age. I somehow managed the 'sponsorship', all the wedding costs, flights and presents, all just to get her a marriage visa for her to get to the uk with me, which is what I thought she wanted. They squeezed me hard

I refused to listen to sense thrown at me by plenty of people in the know,. As we were young and 'she was different'. But it was all the same old shit. Sometime during the honeymoon period once I got her back to the UK I was informed I'd have to pickup the monthly payments (5,000) on her brothers pickup truck which he donated to his father as he could no longer afford the payments and faces repossession. If I didn't pay it would be repossessed. I said sell it, and pay off as much as the balance. "Nooo car good for family, we use it when we t in Thailand mean don't have to take taxi, save money". I actually married one of these f*cking types in my early 20s, I still laugh about how stupid I was today. Well it was thrilling at the time I suppose in the early parts of the relationship. Lucky I got out of it mutually and agreed on a clean split with no final settlement (not that I had absolutely anything at all to settle with!)

Edited July 21, 2014 by Grindting

[BlackArtemis]

One thing I learned from my own parents was "you not only marry the girl, you marry the family".

Unless she hates her family and has cut them off, you WILL have to deal with them in some capacity and through her they will have influence on your life.

I wouldn't even bother with a girl's family who had a low mentality, put up with laziness, theft, or scamming within their own family. Why bother with a family who worries more about their perceived face or stature over the happiness of their daughter.

Best to learn about family before things get too serious, just my two Baht.

[nong38]

Personally I think they should give us the sinsod for the enhanced life they are going to receive.

[thaitakeaway]

You've made a fatal error. Would've been better to ask for return of half of the dowry. What you did is show them you have little respect for their customs and zilch for them as parents who spent half a lifetime preparing the woman you chose as wife. Doesn't say much for you either, but, hey, that's the western minset set in proverbial rebellion and water tight self-righteousness. Good luck. You're gonna need it later, especually in a coutry you just insulted.

Although I am a relative newcomer to Thai ways, I totally agree.

Not sure if it's legit to mention here, but a recent StickmanWeeklyColumn compiled advice from nine successful 10-year+ expats. One of them cautioned that if we seriously want to do well here then we should take careful note of the concept of Kreng Jai, something that's almost hard wired into most Thais. When practiced - at home, at work, wherever - it basically means don't do anything to disrupt someone else's happiness, and explains why Thais will think nothing of getting out of potentially confronting situations via white lies, for example. Been there, seen that in action already.

Another poster here who refused to pay sinsot for his now ex-wife was shut out by his mother-in-law for 3 years, why, because he upset her happiness - and her bank a/c.

A blindsided farang - most of us initially? - might broach the subject this way: Yes darling, I will try to make you and your family happy, but...

Yoda wisely said: "Do or don't do, there is no try."

[wow64]

I got married outside of thailand and threw a big party when I came back for the family in Bangkok... Didnt pay sinsod, as I said to my wife I am not thai..we dont do that. Would have just stayed defacto if i had to pay it.

Party was very over the top actually cost a fair bit. So i hope that soften the pain of no sinsod.

Sent from my c64

[Zonka]

You've made a fatal error. Would've been better to ask for return of half of the dowry. What you did is show them you have little respect for their customs and zilch for them as parents who spent half a lifetime preparing the woman you chose as wife. Doesn't say much for you either, but, hey, that's the western minset set in proverbial rebellion and water tight self-righteousness. Good luck. You're gonna need it later, especually in a coutry you just insulted.

Although I am a relative newcomer to Thai ways, I totally agree.

Not sure if it's legit to mention here, but a recent StickmanWeeklyColumn compiled advice from nine successful 10-year+ expats. One of them cautioned that if we seriously want to do well here then we should take careful note of the concept of Kreng Jai, something that's almost hard wired into most Thais. When practiced - at home, at work, wherever - it basically means don't do anything to disrupt someone else's happiness, and explains why Thais will think nothing of getting out of potentially confronting situations via white lies, for example. Been there, seen that in action already.

Another poster here who refused to pay sinsot for his now ex-wife was shut out by his mother-in-law for 3 years, why, because he upset her happiness - and her bank a/c.

A blindsided farang - most of us initially? - might broach the subject this way: Yes darling, I will try to make you and your family happy, but...

Yoda wisely said: "Do or don't do, there is no try."

What a load of bull crap! Omar Zaid MD: It is a way outdated custom and as usual the price skyrockets for a Westerner. When was the last time a rural village guy paid up to 1 million for his thai bride? Also no respect for them as parents? half a lifetime preparing her for what? I think you may be confusing buddhist/muslim customs. Muslim customs prepare women for a life of servitude to the husband they pick for them/Thai customs 1. if a poor family, have the daughter working in the rice fields during school holidays, send them to Bangkok to earn more money when they are older and if they 'snag' a westerner get greedy for money ie sinsot. 2. if a rich family keep the daughter spoilt out of the sun so skin is perfect white and marry her to a guy whose family business is related to the brides family business thus maintaining the business monopoly the rich have over the poor.

Thaitakeaway.

Kreng Jai is not hard wired into thais - Lying is! I see no Kreng Jai during recent protests, none during the recent tragic rape and murder of a girl on a train,or even when the Thai guys get smashed on Lao Kao and get into an argument and shoot each other.

Also most guys would be happy to be shut out by the mother in law me thinks.

As for maintaining the family? Just tell them the same custom applies in your country hence most of your salary has to be sent home to your parents. If they want to be maintained then the daughter will have to go to work!

[Zonka]

By the way, I am married to a Thai. Did not pay any sinsod. My wife;s father died when she was very young, she has no sisters/brothers. Her mother is a very nice woman and a great grandmother to our daughter, and she NEVER asks me/us for money. In fact she spends too much on our daughter.

There are good ones out there and there are greedy ones out there. Just depends which of your 2 'brains' your using when you choose i suppose.

[Munger]

Each to their own.

I married my wife outside of Thailand so that confused them.

When they tell her to divorce you outside Thailand that will confuse you

Does your wifes family tell her what to do or something?

YUP, it sure sounds like it.

[Bangel72]

Whilst the country is waking up to the value of addressing corruption, this is also an area which from a grass roots perspective should also be on their list for consideration.

If corruption is embedded in a culture where do you draw the line between showing respect for a culture and moving forward towards a fair and reasonable society?

[hawker9000]

So if they hadn't returned it the day after (pleading "misunderstanding" or whatever), what would've been your next move?

[bankei]

As an English teacher you no doubt need to keep all of your cash to support yourself, but if you think the dowry system is an outdated peasant system then why did you participate in it at all? You just made the tradition continue a bit longer.

[Grindting]

I marry my thai wife in Thailand and didn't pay a bath. My answer to this was that they (her family) should pay me for taking care of their daughter. And that's it! Her mohter didn't say hello to me for 3 years but I could live with that. Now I'm even more happy after my divorce!

I married my Thai wife in Thailand and I didn't pay a shower on our wedding day. My in-laws were looking at me with semi disgust

Sounds like you had a magical day

[thaibeachlovers]

I gave some money to the MIL, and got it back, so no skin lost in that game. If it keeps them happy, why not?

However, refusing to give the family money has caused problems, but hey, do I care about them anyway? I feel sorry for my wife being caught in the middle though.

[canarysun]

Well i must admit i feel " awesome " to be a single man living in Thailand.I have never had a girlfriend & don't really want one either! Some of your " posts & problems " that i read on here don't come across as " loving relationships " but purely a " business arrangement " If two people really love each other and both want to be together then money should never be mentioned.I am totally aware of the thai cultures and have a few friends that are married to thai ladies and have never paid any money (dowry) whatsoever to the parents.

I think some of you need to " wake up and smell the coffee " ......

God bless you all !

Farang Jaidee

[kjhbigv]

Easy way not to pay.....

Get documents needed to get married, walk into local Amphur, get marriage certificate.....married.....job done.

[ericthai]

Out dated peasant system?? Have you seen any marriages from Move stars here? They pay dowry too, so maybe not just peasants.

I have seen some outrageous amounts too 5 million +.

I think you still have allot to learn about Thailand.

When I got married I put up the dowry. I got all my money back and

a few months later her dad transferred title to some land to my wife. We ended up with I believe it's 8 rai.

[David48]

I'm quite happy to pay a SinSot.

Well ... it's what my Thai partner wants.

The only thing I've asked thus far is that my gf matches Baht for Baht what we collectively contribute.

With SinSot ... there are many solutions as there are problems.

As many different opinions are there are members here.

I have some solid, smart guys as friends here on the Forum who refuse to pay 1 Baht.

Respect to them.

Everyone finds their own unique solution.

My Thai Partner and I aren’t rushing into anything ... marriage is a few years away yet.

Earlier this year we had kids together ... that's them in the Avatar.

Come closer to Marriage, the negotiations will start in earnest and with respect for all parties involved.

For me, I am blessed with a lady with an open mind, accepting of new things and has partly embraced my Culture.

I try and reciprocate the same for her.

Have I been asked to buy the Family a truck - No.

Have I been asked to build the Parents a house - No

Have I been asked to ... insert the next request - No

But Sinsot was discussed early on in our relationship and agreed in principle and I won't walk away from that.

Completing the Circle ... Everyone finds their own unique solution to the question of SinSot.

One tip though ... if you decide that it's what you will do ... be a smart negotiator.

Let everyone keep face during the process.

Don't think of it as a business deal.

Be strong, but not unmoving.

That's about it.

Good Luck.

Edited July 21, 2014 by cdnvic
Fixed typo at OP request

[slipperylobster]

Personally I think they should give us the sinsod for the enhanced life they are going to receive.

Not only that, it is the legacy as well. The children will go to good schools, perhaps travel to another country, and have a chance for decent wages. In return, they will also marry....continuing the process.

[MAJIC]

To avoid unpleasantness with the Inlaws,the Girlfriend must handle the return of the Sin Sod before and after the wedding,if she is not prepared to deal with her family and the the return of the Sin Sod then she is in collusion with her family! and doesn't give a toss for you!

PS. I recommend that westerners attend a village wedding and witness the 20,000 baht offering,for a 18 year old,childless young lady who has never been married which makes a mockery of the whole Sin Sod,but don't let me stop you from being the stupid Farang!

Funny you mention 20,000 baht, as that is the exact figure i paid at my thai wedding (obviously divorced now as per my previous post).

At that time, I was Very resentful of that sum which just in my opinion a direct payment to a family which were already getting all of my disposable income and more. I was 21 at the time working 4 days a week 1 day in university for a £19,000 pa salary in the UK which was probably good at my age. I somehow managed the 'sponsorship', all the wedding costs, flights and presents, all just to get her a marriage visa for her to get to the uk with me, which is what I thought she wanted. They squeezed me hard

I refused to listen to sense thrown at me by plenty of people in the know,. As we were young and 'she was different'. But it was all the same old shit. Sometime during the honeymoon period once I got her back to the UK I was informed I'd have to pickup the monthly payments (5,000) on her brothers pickup truck which he donated to his father as he could no longer afford the payments and faces repossession. If I didn't pay it would be repossessed. I said sell it, and pay off as much as the balance. "Nooo car good for family, we use it when we t in Thailand mean don't have to take taxi, save money". I actually married one of these f*cking types in my early 20s, I still laugh about how stupid I was today. Well it was thrilling at the time I suppose in the early parts of the relationship. Lucky I got out of it mutually and agreed on a clean split with no final settlement (not that I had absolutely anything at all to settle with!)

Achieving wisdom is never cheap!

[BudRight]

I wish someone would tell all those California feminists about sin sod. They'd be protesting the Thai consulate in Los Angeles.

[David48]

I wish someone would tell all those California feminists about sin sod. They'd be protesting the Thai consulate in Los Angeles.

Made me Smile, your comment ...