Holiday in Thailand could end for expats

[Lite Beer]

Holiday in Thailand could end for expats

Steve Finch

 

A warning issued to foreigners who have overstayed by more than 90 days states they would be banned from Thailand for between one and ten years [Steve Finch/Al Jazeera]

 

BANGKOK: -- The new military government has issued warnings that it will soon start to clampdown on immigration offenders.
 
Thailand - For decades, hundreds of thousands of home-weary expats have lived in Bangkok or in the palm-lined beach resorts dotted along the Gulf of Thailand.

Drawn to the country by its tropical weather, laidback hospitality and cut-rate comforts, most have made Thailand their home after completing the correct immigration paperwork.

However, others have easily dodged lax visa enforcement, itself another reason Thailand has remained so attractive.

"There are between half a million and one million foreigners living in Thailand, maybe more. No one actually knows," said George Anderssen, the CEO of Thaivisa.com, a website used by expats to exchange tips on visas and other topics related to life in Thailand.

But following the coup in late May, the new military government issued warnings that it will soon start to clampdown on immigration offenders, raising fears among many that their expat lifestyle in Thailand could soon come to an abrupt end.

"The crackdown is meant for those foreign visitors who abuse the visa exemption scheme for working illegally in Thailand," according to a recent explanation issued by the Thai Embassy in Canberra, Australia.

The warnings issued in July to foreigners who have overstayed by more than 90 days, states they would be banned from Thailand for between one and ten years, although no start date has been announced. From August 12, visitors arriving at Thai airports may be denied entry if immigration officers suspect they are living in the country on short-term visas, according to another notice.

'Desperate people'

Although Thailand has warned of similar crackdowns in the past, most have come and gone as quickly as successive Thai governments, amid a cycle of coups and elections in the past decade.

But recent forced deportations of undocumented migrant workers from neighbouring Myanmar, Cambodia, and Laos, as well as a campaign against grey industries including unlicensed taxis and street vendors, suggests the military government means business, said Rex Baay, an immigration consultant at Siam Legal International.

"This time I think they are kind of serious about visas," he said. "Every day we receive telephone enquiries from desperate people."

Nationals of 48 countries including the UK, US, and Australia have been able to enter the country for up to 30 days with a visa-exemption stamp or 60 days extendable for another 30 days with a visa from a Thai embassy overseas.

By simply leaving and entering Thailand on so-called 'visa runs', many have lived for years in Thai cities including the popular beach resorts of Phuket and Pattaya.

Then, last month, border immigration officials began to deny re-entry to people believed to be exploiting the system, particularly at crossings in the south with Malaysia. Although enforcement has reportedly remained more relaxed on Thailand's eastern border with Cambodia and particularly at northern crossings with Laos, immigration officials have warned that the policy will apply everywhere starting next month.

"If you can't declare you are a tourist you may not be allowed in," said an immigration official in Tak province, which shares a border with Myanmar.

"We urge people to get the right visa," said the official, who requested anonymity because they were not authorised to speak to the media.

Thousands of foreigners living legally in Thailand are able to apply for work visas through their employers, or retirement visas if they are over 50 years old and can prove they have adequate finances. Others, particularly men, can live in the country on marriage visas.

Ghost schools

Education visas, which provided a more legitimate long-term option for expats, have become a target of the recent crackdown due to the large numbers of ghost schools in Thailand that provide the necessary paperwork without offering any classes. The military government has reportedly ordered schools across the country to ask for signed declarations from foreign students who must now promise they will attend classes.

For people who fit into none of these categories, question marks remain. A semi-retired UK national in his 40s who asked not to be identified said he has visited Thailand a dozen times since he closed a telecommunications consultancy in Europe two years ago. Although a visa-exemption on arrival worked in the past, he said he is reluctant to fly back to Thailand in case he is refused entry.

"I will not be stranded by the visa crackdown as I have my own home outside of Thailand, but it will force me to change my plans," he said.

He had to cancel plans for a $6,000 medical operation and switch to a hospital in Singapore.

Economic threat

Thailand's travel industry represents 20 percent of the country's total economic output. Thailand's medical tourism industry accounts for about 40 percent of the global market. Anything that restricts the free movement of foreigners into and out of the country is likely to impact Thailand's economy.

Last year, Bangkok was ranked the world's most visited city with nearly 16 million people travelling to the Thai capital, ahead of London and Paris, according to Global Destination Cities Index.


Cambodian immigrants flee Thailand

But more than six months of protests leading up to the May 22 coup - and the military takeover itself - have reduced the number of arrivals this year.

Ten percent fewer foreigners travelled to Thailand in May compared to the same month in 2013, according to Ministry of Tourism figures.

The visa crackdown expects to depress these figures further: Foreigners living in Thailand illegally on short-term visas have typically marked themselves as tourists on arrival cards, causing artificial inflation of the numbers on tourism data.

How immigration rules will be enforced still isn't clear.

Airlines contacted by Al Jazeera, including the national carrier Thai Airways and budget operators Nok Air and AirAsia, said the government has so far not asked them to vet passengers before they board, raising the possibility some could be turned away after landing.

"The immigration Bureau will be taking the lead on this initiative," said Piyasuda Archasantisuk, a Bangkok-based spokesman for AirAsia. "Our normal procedure is to conduct a basic document check prior to the passenger's departure."

With stricter enforcement not due until later in August, the number of people leaving the country remains low but could increase, said Thaivisa.com's Anderssen. Some have headed to neighbouring Cambodia but most want to stay, he added.

"Many of these people have been in Thailand for years," he said. "For them, there simply is nowhere else."

 

Source: http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/features/2014/08/holiday-thailand-could-end-expats-20148110534020783.html

 

--ALJAZEERA 2014-08-02

[carstenp]

Thanks admin :) you know what I mean.

[VegasVic]

The title of the article should read "Holiday in Thailand could end for expats who VIOLATE Visa laws"    I say more power to the government in enforcing its visa laws, those expats who do not abide by them should be kicked out of the country   I just wish that the U.S. had leadership that would enforce our visa/immigration laws

[terryp]

or retirement visas if they are over 50 years old and can prove they have adequate finances.

 

 

yeah try and get a non O visa in the UK now...without a STATE pension ........not an easy route, you are now requested to apply for a NON O-A with police clearance certificates and in many cases a personal interview , so much for get the right visa they are easy

[laurentbkk]

Bangkok was ranked the world's most visited city with nearly 16 million people travelling to the Thai capital, ahead of London and Paris

 

 

sorry but London had 28 millions visitors and Paris 26 millions ..... I wonder where they got their information .

[pinkpanther99]

Good article and interesting that a big media organisation has picked up on the visa 'crackdown' (or whatever you want to call it).

 

That said, I'm not sure that there is any real 'new' info here we haven't already read on Thai Visa.

 

Still an interesting read for a Saturday morning

[carstenp]

Bangkok was ranked the world's most visited city with nearly 16 million people travelling to the Thai capital, ahead of London and Paris
 
 
sorry but London had 28 millions visitors and Paris 26 millions ..... I wonder where they got their information .

You are properly right, but the new information in this article, is about the Ghost schools :)

[bertty]

Looks pretty clear cut to me.

where do you get your figures from ?

 

[attachment=277604:Top-20-destinations-chart.jpg]

[glegolo]

Lite Beer I am sorry!!

 

But why publish yet ANOTHER newspaper-story, for what reason?? This will only fuel once again all the people that have a hardtime to understand

and value the present situation.

 

Plse plse enlighten me so that I understand for what reason you took the work to publish already to 100% known facts...

 

Glegolo

[grantbkk]

Looks pretty clear cut to me.
where do you get your figures from ?
 
Top-20-destinations-chart.jpg

Snap. It's a beautiful Saturday morning here in Thailand. Chill out and rethink your nonsensical attack. A news thread about visas... An international news item about visas... Tends to give perspective to many concerned world travelers than might not be on Thai Visa. As another stated, its a good read.

[isawasnake]

The thing I find so arbitrary about so much of this, is the fact that if you just so happen to have just gotten a new passport, you are free to do what you want? It just seems so ridiculous, like such an arbitrary way to judge someone's travel records. 

[noitom]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

 

Bangkok was ranked the world's most visited city with nearly 16 million people travelling to the Thai capital, ahead of London and Paris

 

 

sorry but London had 28 millions visitors and Paris 26 millions ..... I wonder where they got their information .

Thai thin air as usual.

[chrisinth]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

 

Lite Beer I am sorry!!

 

But why publish yet ANOTHER newspaper-story, for what reason?? This will only fuel once again all the people that have a hardtime to understand

and value the present situation.

 

Plse plse enlighten me so that I understand for what reason you took the work to publish already to 100% known facts...

 

Glegolo

 

Glegolo, the story has been published on this site as it has direct linkage to it. It is also relevant that the problems are now being reported by the international press, and as such, keeping TV members up to date with this.

 

Not all media reports read the way we would like them to.................

 

AFAIK, this is only a social media site and not a news site.

 

 

Edited August 2, 2014 by chrisinth

[Jdiddy]

Initially read 1st part as "A warning issued to foreigners who have overstayed by more than 90 days states they would be banned from Thailand for between one and ten years"  

 

 

[Calach]

Well, we don't accept it either when immigration rules are abused or exploited in our home countries, there's no reasons Thailand should be more lax.

[horsewell]

I've heard about these ghost schools but never seen or heard of any particular schools. It all seems very nebulous. I'm sure they exist but I don't think many westerners would sign up to them in great numbers. I know every now and then a school is busted and there is a footnote somewhere but it seems like the same argument as the one about foreign criminals. If it is really happening then you would think that it would be news. If it was westerners then there would be news on TV at the very least. I do a google search and it seems that every other country has a problem with ghost schools except for Thailand, at least in English. Would really appreciate someone pointing me to some (source) information as I'm wondering if it's a problem big enough to even mention in a news article.

[baboon]

Lite Beer I am sorry!!
 
But why publish yet ANOTHER newspaper-story, for what reason?? This will only fuel once again all the people that have a hardtime to understand
and value the present situation.
 
Glegolo

Perhaps you have answered your own question there...

[chrisinth]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

 

I've heard about these ghost schools but never seen or heard of any particular schools. It all seems very nebulous. I'm sure they exist but I don't think many westerners would sign up to them in great numbers. I know every now and then a school is busted and there is a footnote somewhere but it seems like the same argument as the one about foreign criminals. If it is really happening then you would think that it would be news. If it was westerners then there would be news on TV at the very least. I do a google search and it seems that every other country has a problem with ghost schools except for Thailand, at least in English. Would really appreciate someone pointing me to some (source) information as I'm wondering if it's a problem big enough to even mention in a news article.

 

They were known as 'visa mills or factories'. In a lot of cases, registered schools which provided the documentation required for the Ed-visa and running token fronted programs to disguise the primary intention.

[Tao Diver]

I am still waiting to read a post that contains some confirmed date of when the blacklisting is to start. People keep posting when they think it might start. Can't someone in immigration just tell everyone when ?

I have also asked if the mods can pin a thread and lock it with just confirmed press releases to save people trawling through pages of people slagging off over stayers etc. ? 

[AnotherOneAmerican]

Expats live here, so not a holiday.

[carstenp]

Expats live here, so not a holiday.

A expat is on Holiday , if the person don't have the correct visa or abuse the law to stay here long term :) Edited August 2, 2014 by carstenp

[Expattaff1308]

I am still waiting to read a post that contains some confirmed date of when the blacklisting is to start. People keep posting when they think it might start. Can't someone in immigration just tell everyone when ?

I have also asked if the mods can pin a thread and lock it with just confirmed press releases to save people trawling through pages of people slagging off over stayers etc. ? 

The latest known date is the 25th August but theres nothing in stone!! are you referring to your friend?

If any overstayers hasn't taken advantage of the very long warning that things are about to change and dealt with their overstay then Im sorry but whatever their reason to overstay starts to loose any symapthy if they are still here and chancing their arm. How much more warning do you need?

They have told you its gonna be introduced that should be enough to get sorted ASAP!!

[stevenl]

A pity the visa run crackdown is connected to the military government in the article.

[AnotherOneAmerican]

Expats live here, so not a holiday.

A expat is on Holiday , if the person don't have the correct visa or abuse the law to stay here long term

No, that would make them an illegal immigrant, not a holidaymaker.

[chrisinth]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

 

 

Expats live here, so not a holiday.

A expat is on Holiday , if the person don't have the correct visa or abuse the law to stay here long term

 

 

Actually, if an expat living in Thailand was on holiday, would he/she not be somewhere else?

[Jay Sata]

Well, we don't accept it either when immigration rules are abused or exploited in our home countries, there's no reasons Thailand should be more lax.

Exactly.

The large Russian community running business's in Phuket was a prime example of tourist visa abuse.

Thailand has tens of thousands of Farangs working under the radar and using so called visa runs.

For them the end is near and they do not have my sympathy.

Get the correct visa and you will have no problem with immigration.

[paddyjenkins]

Well, we don't accept it either when immigration rules are abused or exploited in our home countries, there's no reasons Thailand should be more lax.

Exactly.

The large Russian community running business's in Phuket was a prime example of tourist visa abuse.

Thailand has tens of thousands of Farangs working under the radar and using so called visa runs.

For them the end is near and they do not have my sympathy.

Get the correct visa and you will have no problem with immigration.

Then rather than abolish entry stamps for the majority of people who are simply frequent visitors who like come to Thailand and stay in hotels and spend money and contribute to the economy and do nothing that isn't good for the country, why not just pay a visit to Russian businesses and demand to see work permits? Same goes for other illegal workers.

Talk about throwing out the baby with the bath water, but this crackdown is just plain dumb. Most people are perfectly legitimate, I know lots of people who visit many times a year and do nothing wrong. If they don't stay long enough to need a tourist visa, I.e., entry stamps are appropriate, then what exactly is the problem with that? I wish somebody would just say something half way sensible as an answer...just partially intelligent would do.

These people who visit several times a year on entry stamps didn't force the immigration officer to stamp their passport, that's what Thailand provides to short term visitors and there is no rule or guideline that says you can only have a certain number of these before you become branded as some kind of undesirable.

And by the way on the entry card that you fill out on the plane, tourism is the only appropriate answer I can see. I don't come on business, to work, to attend meetings, to get married. I stay in hotels, I go to restaurants, I go to bars, I go shopping. I do that several times a year in Thailand. So what is it that makes doing that once great, twice great, three times fine, four times fantastic, but suddenly, at five, say, or six, it becomes a terrible abuse?

How is it that if I visit, say, four times a year for 4 weeks each time I'm a tourist contributing to Thai GDP, but as soon as it becomes 5 or 6 times I'm no longer a contribution to the Thai economy's and instead am an abusive and undesirable criminal? Can someone answer that....in an intelligent way....by the way "just get the correct visa" isn't intelligent, before another dim wit says it.







Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[JLCrab]

Sure -- they just want to throw out ugly babies with the bathwater.

[Tchooptip]

Looks pretty clear cut to me.
where do you get your figures from ?
 
Top-20-destinations-chart.jpg

The explanation maybe difference between total visitors and foreign ones ?
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tourism_in_Paris

[AGareth2]

reckon you could come to Thailand 12 times a year if you stayed a week