Israel declares seven-hour Gaza truce

[Jingthing]

I guess the Hamas et al need a few hours rest. Even monsters need to take five once in awhile to get refreshed for another mass killing.

Mass Killing?

Hamas has killed 2 israeli citizens and a Thai.

63 Israeli soldiers, two civilians and a Thai national have died and more than 400 have been injured as of two days ago.

Oh what were those Israeli soldiers doing again? Attacking Gaza. Militant/soldier deaths aside and focus on the innocents. Oh wait...

Attacking military targets that have been shooting rockets into Israel ... also the tunnel infrastructure ... also terrorist personnel. That is war. Hamas didn't want war? They have a very funny way of showing it.

[Jingthing]

This is a very old saying " The first casualty of War is the truth"

Today Europe recalls the start of Britains involvement in the start of WW 1

and that war was fuelled by lies once it started.

Propaganda is still alive and well.

Watch the slick lies in this civil war zone.

Civil war? Wrong thread, perhaps?

[Halion]

Hamas has rejected or violated every single ceasefire so far. I wonder how long it it will take the this time.

Well, you would say that wouldn't you.

Israel has used every single truce so far to restock its arms, while their ground troops continue their search and destroy tunnel mission. Israel has never stopped fighting at all.

Who can blame them when surrounded by nations that openly state that the eradication of Israel is their ultimate objective. I am sure that if it was happening in your neck of the woods you would not be so bloody partisan. You can't be a little bit pregnant and if you are in a war for the survival of your way of life,belligerence rules.

[kblaze]

Attacking military targets that have been shooting rockets into Israel ... also the tunnel infrastructure ... also terrorist personnel. That is war. Hamas didn't want war? They have a very funny way of showing it.

The fact is they were invading Gaza and were "killed in war".

NOT the same as civilian deaths. So when we talk about "mass killing" what do you think people think of? CIVILIAN DEATH.

So shall we compare again?

[kblaze]

Hamas has rejected or violated every single ceasefire so far. I wonder how long it it will take the this time.

Well, you would say that wouldn't you.

Israel has used every single truce so far to restock its arms, while their ground troops continue their search and destroy tunnel mission. Israel has never stopped fighting at all.

Who can blame them when surrounded by nations that openly state that the eradication of Israel is their ultimate objective. I am sure that if it was happening in your neck of the woods you would not be so bloody partisan. You can't be a little bit pregnant and if you are in a war for the survival of your way of life,belligerence rules.

Be more specific. Which states are calling for the eradication of Israel?

[Ulysses G.]

Mass killing are mass killings. Your own personal definition does not really count.

[Jingthing]

Attacking military targets that have been shooting rockets into Israel ... also the tunnel infrastructure ... also terrorist personnel. That is war. Hamas didn't want war? They have a very funny way of showing it.

The fact is they were invading Gaza and were "killed in war".

NOT the same as civilian deaths. So when we talk about "mass killing" what do you think people think of? CIVILIAN DEATH.

So shall we compare again?

No need. The point of the Hamas war was to gain international leverage with the civilian casualties which they forced. Now we'll see what happens next. Was their martyrdom worth it or not. If they win a lot from it, other terror groups will use the same tactics ... so I hope not.

Edited August 4, 2014 by Jingthing

[up-country_sinclair]

JERUSALEM — Minutes after Israel began a unilateral and partial cease-fire in Gaza on Monday, the air force struck a house in the Shati refugee camp in Gaza City, killing a girl, 8, and wounding at least 29 others.

More than six hours later, there was still no official comment about the strike from the Israeli military, which continued to withdraw many of its ground forces from populated areas in Gaza, about why it struck the house.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/05/world/middleeast/israel-gaza.html

Israel murdered an 8 year old girl in a refugee camp.

Savages.

[kblaze]

Attacking military targets that have been shooting rockets into Israel ... also the tunnel infrastructure ... also terrorist personnel. That is war. Hamas didn't want war? They have a very funny way of showing it.

The fact is they were invading Gaza and were "killed in war".

NOT the same as civilian deaths. So when we talk about "mass killing" what do you think people think of? CIVILIAN DEATH.

So shall we compare again?

No need. The point of the Hamas war was to gain international leverage with the civilian casualties which they forced. Now we'll see what happens next. Was their martyrdom worth it or not. If they win a lot from it, other terror groups will use the same tactics ... so I hope not.

"the Hamas war"

Care to explain where you get your idea that "the point of the Hamas war was to gain international leverage with the civilian casualties which they forced." ??

I'm not going to ask for a link or anything because I know it would be troublesome for you, so I just want to hear your reasoning for making such an astute judgement

[Bwanatickey]

Attacking military targets that have been shooting rockets into Israel ... also the tunnel infrastructure ... also terrorist personnel. That is war. Hamas didn't want war? They have a very funny way of showing it.

The fact is they were invading Gaza and were "killed in war".

NOT the same as civilian deaths. So when we talk about "mass killing" what do you think people think of? CIVILIAN DEATH.

So shall we compare again?

To Israel that amount of military personnel lost is a huge loss.

Wait until it is all over, and the post mortem on this loss will be weighed by the voters of Israel.

[kblaze]

Mass killing are mass killings. Your own personal definition does not really count.

Good lord.

Ask 100 people on the street what comes to mind when they see the word mass killing...you think they are going to say "military deaths!" Get real.

[Jingthing]

Attacking military targets that have been shooting rockets into Israel ... also the tunnel infrastructure ... also terrorist personnel. That is war. Hamas didn't want war? They have a very funny way of showing it.

The fact is they were invading Gaza and were "killed in war".

NOT the same as civilian deaths. So when we talk about "mass killing" what do you think people think of? CIVILIAN DEATH.

So shall we compare again?

To Israel that amount of military personnel lost is a huge loss.

Wait until it is all over, and the post mortem on this loss will be weighed by the voters of Israel.

That depends. So far overwhelming popular support in Israel for Protective Edge.

http://www.jpost.com/Diplomacy-and-Politics/Italian-MP-to-Edelstein-Terror-striking-Israel-now-but-US-and-Europe-could-be-next-370026

"It is clear that Israel could not respond to the missiles being shot and the threat of tunnels without harming civilians. Despite Israel's efforts to prevent civilian casualties, they had a negative influence on the media," Cicchitto observed.

Edited August 4, 2014 by Jingthing

[Ulysses G.]

Care to explain where you get your idea that "the point of the Hamas war was to gain international leverage with the civilian casualties which they forced." ??

You seem to be the only one that this strategy comes as surprise to. Lots of experts have expressed the same idea - even letters to the editor in newspapers.

Hamas routinely stores rockets munitions, and other weapons of war in hospitals, schools (including United Nations schools) and mosques. Hamas strategic and military operations against Israel are deliberately located in and around homes in densely populated neighborhoods in Gaza. This ends in tragedy for civilians in Gaza, but it is a major and ongoing element of Hamas' propaganda war, and they are unfortunately successful in getting people like Miller to believe Israel is responsible instead of understanding that Hamas is committing these abuses against their own people.

The fact that Hamas rejected the Egypt cease fire proposal and offer to negotiate a peace agreement which Israel accepted is just further evidence that Hamas has little concern for the people of Gaza. Civilian deaths are part of their strategic plan in their war against Israel.

Read more: http://billingsgazette.com/news/opinion/mailbag/hamas-strategy-counts-on-civilian-deaths/article_e8eb8c11-b2d8-5eb6-8cb8-1eba8c2147ac.html#ixzz39RHtwHO9

Edited August 4, 2014 by Ulysses G.

[Jingthing]

"the Hamas war"

Care to explain where you get your idea that "the point of the Hamas war was to gain international leverage with the civilian casualties which they forced." ??

I'm not going to ask for a link or anything because I know it would be troublesome for you, so I just want to hear your reasoning for making such an astute judgement

Your baiting attempt rejected.

[kblaze]

"the Hamas war"

Care to explain where you get your idea that "the point of the Hamas war was to gain international leverage with the civilian casualties which they forced." ??

I'm not going to ask for a link or anything because I know it would be troublesome for you, so I just want to hear your reasoning for making such an astute judgement

Your baiting attempt rejected.

For the record if there is anything you want me to explain, just ask, and I'll try. I enjoy trying to explain if I am making conjecture.

Edited August 4, 2014 by kblaze

[kblaze]

Care to explain where you get your idea that "the point of the Hamas war was to gain international leverage with the civilian casualties which they forced." ??

You seem to be the only one that this strategy comes as surprise to. Lots of experts have expressed the same idea - even letters to the editor in newspapers.

Hamas routinely stores rockets munitions, and other weapons of war in hospitals, schools (including United Nations schools) and mosques. Hamas strategic and military operations against Israel are deliberately located in and around homes in densely populated neighborhoods in Gaza. This ends in tragedy for civilians in Gaza, but it is a major and ongoing element of Hamas' propaganda war, and they are unfortunately successful in getting people like Miller to believe Israel is responsible instead of understanding that Hamas is committing these abuses against their own people.

The fact that Hamas rejected the Egypt cease fire proposal and offer to negotiate a peace agreement which Israel accepted is just further evidence that Hamas has little concern for the people of Gaza. Civilian deaths are part of their strategic plan in their war against Israel.

Read more: http://billingsgazette.com/news/opinion/mailbag/hamas-strategy-counts-on-civilian-deaths/article_e8eb8c11-b2d8-5eb6-8cb8-1eba8c2147ac.html#ixzz39RHtwHO9

Don't try to sidetrack the point.

The point is how does he know that this specific war was a plan to get international leverage.

That's more of the conspiracy camp is it not? As far as I remember the war was the product of escalation on both sides in the theater of the "kidnappings"

[Ulysses G.]

Care to explain where you get your idea that "the point of the Hamas war was to gain international leverage with the civilian casualties which they forced." ??

You seem to be the only one that this strategy comes as surprise to. Lots of experts have expressed the same idea - even letters to the editor in newspapers.

Hamas routinely stores rockets munitions, and other weapons of war in hospitals, schools (including United Nations schools) and mosques. Hamas strategic and military operations against Israel are deliberately located in and around homes in densely populated neighborhoods in Gaza. This ends in tragedy for civilians in Gaza, but it is a major and ongoing element of Hamas' propaganda war, and they are unfortunately successful in getting people like Miller to believe Israel is responsible instead of understanding that Hamas is committing these abuses against their own people.

The fact that Hamas rejected the Egypt cease fire proposal and offer to negotiate a peace agreement which Israel accepted is just further evidence that Hamas has little concern for the people of Gaza. Civilian deaths are part of their strategic plan in their war against Israel.

Read more: http://billingsgazette.com/news/opinion/mailbag/hamas-strategy-counts-on-civilian-deaths/article_e8eb8c11-b2d8-5eb6-8cb8-1eba8c2147ac.html#ixzz39RHtwHO9

Don't try to sidetrack the point.

The point is how does he know that this specific war was a plan to get international leverage.

Are you asking if Hamas told him personally? Lots of experts think the same thing, but Hamas did not provide a video of them making the decision and mail it to Jingthing, if that's your point.

[Pattszero]

The answer is, he doesn't know - he's now attacking members for posting links to Jewish protests against the war.

Then stating that over 90% of Israelis are in favour of the war. BS.

[Ulysses G.]

Then stating that over 90% of Israelis are in favour of the war. BS.

Yeah. He's wrong. Its closer to 95%.

The Israel Democracy Institute, a non-partisan Israeli think tank and polling outfit, conducts a monthly poll of Israelis on peace and security issues. Unsurprisingly, July's poll focused on the war in Gaza. It asked Jewish Israelis (Israeli Arabs were not polled), during both the air and ground phases of the campaign, whether they thought the Israeli operation was justified. It also asked whether they thought the Israeli Defense Forcers were using too much, too little, or the right amount of force.

The results are staggering. An average of 95 percent of Israeli respondents say they think the operation is "completely" or "moderately" justified. About 80 percent say it is "completely" justified.

http://www.vox.com/2014/7/31/5955077/israeli-support-for-the-gaza-war-is-basically-unanimous

[Pattszero]

Then stating that over 90% of Israelis are in favour of the war. BS.

Yeah. He's wrong. Its closer to 95%.

The Israel Democracy Institute, a non-partisan Israeli think tank and polling outfit, conducts a monthly poll of Israelis on peace and security issues. Unsurprisingly, July's poll focused on the war in Gaza. It asked Jewish Israelis (Israeli Arabs were not polled), during both the air and ground phases of the campaign, whether they thought the Israeli operation was justified. It also asked whether they thought the Israeli Defense Forcers were using too much, too little, or the right amount of force.

The results are staggering. An average of 95 percent of Israeli respondents say they think the operation is "completely" or "moderately" justified. About 80 percent say it is "completely" justified.

http://www.vox.com/2014/7/31/5955077/israeli-support-for-the-gaza-war-is-basically-unanimous

Do you honestly believe that figure?

[Ulysses G.]

Why wouldn't I? I trust a professional poll over some guy who hates Israel on Thai Visa any time.

Edited August 4, 2014 by Ulysses G.

[Pattszero]

Why wouldn't I? I trust a professional poll over some guy who hates Israel on Thai Visa any time.

Who's the guy that hates Israel?

I don't believe that headline figure - and if it's true, it's collective madness.

Even the article writers are incredulous.

Israel is losing this war, and the longer it goes on, the greater the defeat.

[Jingthing]

Why wouldn't I? I trust a professional poll over some guy who hates Israel on Thai Visa any time.

Who's the guy that hates Israel?

I don't believe that headline figure - and if it's true, it's collective madness.

Even the article writers are incredulous.

Israel is losing this war, and the longer it goes on, the greater the defeat.

Supporting defending your nation from Jihadist terrorists. Utter madness!

[Morch]

Ham-ass already broke it; 120 rockets fired as of an hour ago.

I'd like to bet they destroyed more potato fields than schools

Not for want of trying. Hamas wants as many deaths as possible - on BOTH sides.

And israel doesn't? I think the disproportionate civilian body count speaks volumes. I think you have tunnel vision, pardon the pun.

I think his point was that Hamas is interested in casualties on both sides, while Israel is interested in keeping its own casualty list as low as possible.

Israel makes a massive effort to protect its civilians - Iron Dome, Alarm system and shelters. Hamas, on the other hand, spent a fortune digging an underground network of tunnels, which was not utilized as shelter for civilians, and in addition, calls on civilians to ignore IDF warnings of impeding attacks. That's without considering the placement of all their military facilities within dense residential areas and public buildings. Refusing ceasefires did not help much, as well.

Without condoning the killing of civilians by the IDF, it does not seem like the Hamas is overly concerned about civilian casualties, even when most happen to be on its side.

[Morch]

Would love our Thai Government to break diplomatic relations with the terrorist state Israel and expect all its citizen. We do not want child murderers nor the ones who support these israeli extremists.

On who's behalf are you speaking? Most members are not even allowed to vote in Thai elections.

Will you also support bringing back all the Thai workers currently in Israel? Did you bother asking

them before throwing away their livelihood?

[Morch]

I guess the Hamas et al need a few hours rest. Even monsters need to take five once in awhile to get refreshed for another mass killing.

Mass Killing?

Hamas has killed 2 israeli citizens and a Thai.

63 Israeli soldiers, two civilians and a Thai national have died and more than 400 have been injured as of two days ago.

Oh what were those Israeli soldiers doing again? Attacking Gaza. Militant/soldier deaths aside and focus on the innocents. Oh wait...

Well, not like all the Palestinian casualties were civilians as well.

And yes, I'd rather wait for the smoke to clear before blindly believing casualty figures supplied by Hamas.

Wouldn't be the first time discrepancies appear after the fighting is done.

[Morch]

Then stating that over 90% of Israelis are in favour of the war. BS.

Yeah. He's wrong. Its closer to 95%.

The Israel Democracy Institute, a non-partisan Israeli think tank and polling outfit, conducts a monthly poll of Israelis on peace and security issues. Unsurprisingly, July's poll focused on the war in Gaza. It asked Jewish Israelis (Israeli Arabs were not polled), during both the air and ground phases of the campaign, whether they thought the Israeli operation was justified. It also asked whether they thought the Israeli Defense Forcers were using too much, too little, or the right amount of force.

The results are staggering. An average of 95 percent of Israeli respondents say they think the operation is "completely" or "moderately" justified. About 80 percent say it is "completely" justified.

http://www.vox.com/2014/7/31/5955077/israeli-support-for-the-gaza-war-is-basically-unanimous

Do you honestly believe that figure?

I believe support is very high, but wouldn't say is as high as that.

Should be noted that this is support is manifested with the Israeli Jews but not with Israeli Arabs, who for the most part

do not support it.

[Pattszero]

Why wouldn't I? I trust a professional poll over some guy who hates Israel on Thai Visa any time.

Who's the guy that hates Israel?

I don't believe that headline figure - and if it's true, it's collective madness.

Even the article writers are incredulous.

Israel is losing this war, and the longer it goes on, the greater the defeat.

Supporting defending your nation from Jihadist terrorists. Utter madness!

jdog.jpg

That's only your blinkered interpretation.

I posted a link to the hundreds of Israelis protesting in Tel Aviv - and you said it was an ad hominem argument.

It's not - it's evidence of Israelis taking to the streets to say stop the war - and what was the worst thing about it?

They were prevented from continuing the protest in case they were attacked.

So the voice of peace has been silenced -

Many Jews, Israelis, and friends of Israel are watching this collective madness in horror.

This complete and utter overreaction will come at a high price for Israel, A very high price.

[Jingthing]

Why wouldn't I? I trust a professional poll over some guy who hates Israel on Thai Visa any time.

Who's the guy that hates Israel?

I don't believe that headline figure - and if it's true, it's collective madness.

Even the article writers are incredulous.

Israel is losing this war, and the longer it goes on, the greater the defeat.

Supporting defending your nation from Jihadist terrorists. Utter madness!

jdog.jpg

That's only your blinkered interpretation.

I posted a link to the hundreds of Israelis protesting in Tel Aviv - and you said it was an ad hominem argument.

It's not - it's evidence of Israelis taking to the streets to say stop the war - and what was the worst thing about it?

They were prevented from continuing the protest in case they were attacked.

So the voice of peace has been silenced -

Many Jews, Israelis, and friends of Israel are watching this collective madness in horror.

This complete and utter overreaction will come at a high price for Israel, A very high price.

I can't take you seriously. You just totally distorted the context of what I said in a previous post. Otherwise, no problem with your expression of feelings of protest regarding the situation in Israel. But there is popular support, like it or not (obviously not).

[Pattszero]

Here is the post to which you refer - please note, I didn't reply to anyone - I posted the link with my opinion.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/741979-israel-prepares-for-ground-military-operation-98-dead-in-gaza-strip-airstrikes/page-28#entry8196905

Now, I would like to address this "taking seriously" issue -

The amount of times you edit posts is scandalous.