Phuket marine tour operators face hefty hikes in park fees

[belg]

best to avoid such a ripp-off prices

why more expensive ? 5x more than thais already not enough ?

most thais don't pay any taxes to start with

but suck the tourist dry ...

the smart one's stay away

what is next, double pricing in big c, tesco ? based on your skin = rascism ...

[Wombat6]

The argument is that Thai people and foreign residents pay for the up keeping of the nature parks with there tax payments.

Tourist are not paying tax for the parks and should pay extra.

Don't know if it is a valid argument but it sounds logical.

Not really a valid argument as most Thais don't pay Tax.

[KarenBravo]

At least leave the original text intact if you quote.

BTW, if living here one pays the Thai price.

The original quote is intact. And augmented.

Too confusing for you?

"BTW, if living here one pays the Thai price."

Great!

So I pay 100B?

Thanks for clarifying that!

Wait a minute, the Thai price for everything?

Jeez, that's not what they tell me...

Original quote:

"The new fee will be B500 for [foreign] adults and B300 for [foreign] children."

Your quote:

"The new fee will be B500 for(Falang) foreign adults and B300 for (Falang) foreign children."

Not the same, and especially not the same in meaning. Plus, with the Chinese being by far the biggest tour group there, incorrect as well.

Are you really that naive?

foreign=falang=tourist.

If you are not Thai, you are Falang.

Living here?

Still equals: foreign=falang=tourist.

I've lived here 12 years and still get treated like I just came off the boat.

How would they know the difference? (rhetorical)

They don't care.

BTW, "augmented" was a key term...

12 years here and you haven't a clue.

You think Thai people call Chinese, Malays, Burmese, Indonesians and Africans farang?

You need to get out more.

[stevenl]

5 times the price of a Thai.

I would not set foot on place.Never visit anywhere with such a racist policy

There are a lot of rich Thai people now and not so many rich farang.

Most of the visitors here are non-farang but Chinese, paying the foreigner price.

Chinese tourists get substantial discounts on everything including taxi meters from the airport.

For Similans trips the big market are the Chinese tourgroups, the ones that do everything organised.

The officials don't even see the people, they just trust the operator. Of course the operator skims a few guests of the list, but no way would the operator give a discount in this case to the guests. The agent pays for the guests, so the operator will pocket the difference himself.

The westerners are just a small part of the total market here, and independent westerners, where the officials charge the people directly, so without operator, are non-existent.

[keestha]

Thai authorities have done some shifting around as far as foreigners national park entry fees are concerned. For a short while (not talking about marine national parks here) it was 400 Baht. They quickly brought it back to 200. Lots of frustration for staff manning the entry booths, too many people turning around.

[NamKangMan]

The argument is that Thai people and foreign residents pay for the up keeping of the nature parks with there tax payments.

Tourist are not paying tax for the parks and should pay extra.

Don't know if it is a valid argument but it sounds logical.

"Tourist are not paying tax for the parks and should pay extra." - the majority of tourists fly in, and out, of Thailand.

There is an 800 baht tax on their exit, or return ticket. I believe this is not specifically an airport tax, but I am happy to stand corrected on this from any member who knows more about it.

There are other fees and surcharges attached to the air ticket which I believe go directly to airport revenue.

I was under the belief this 800 baht went to consolidated revenue, which then "should" go to the maintanence of the things that tourist use, or in this case, a marine park.

[NamKangMan]

The argument is that Thai people and foreign residents pay for the up keeping of the nature parks with there tax payments.

Tourist are not paying tax for the parks and should pay extra.

Don't know if it is a valid argument but it sounds logical.

Possibly but Id like to see a published source first, wouldnt you? Furthermore, it could just be as simple as Thai Economics 101 kicking in No Hab Biznit, poot pwicess up.

I think it's as simple as that, BTH. As you say, Thai Business 101 - "Money go down - put price up."

I expect to see more of this Thai business practice in the future, on Phuket, and across a broad range of industries.

[stevenl]

The argument is that Thai people and foreign residents pay for the up keeping of the nature parks with there tax payments.

Tourist are not paying tax for the parks and should pay extra.

Don't know if it is a valid argument but it sounds logical.

Possibly but Id like to see a published source first, wouldnt you? Furthermore, it could just be as simple as Thai Economics 101 kicking in No Hab Biznit, poot pwicess up.

I think it's as simple as that, BTH. As you say, Thai Business 101 - "Money go down - put price up."

I expect to see more of this Thai business practice in the future, on Phuket, and across a broad range of industries.

With the increasing tourist numbers there this is not the case.

[NamKangMan]

The argument is that Thai people and foreign residents pay for the up keeping of the nature parks with there tax payments.

Tourist are not paying tax for the parks and should pay extra.

Don't know if it is a valid argument but it sounds logical.

Possibly but Id like to see a published source first, wouldnt you? Furthermore, it could just be as simple as Thai Economics 101 kicking in No Hab Biznit, poot pwicess up.

I think it's as simple as that, BTH. As you say, Thai Business 101 - "Money go down - put price up."

I expect to see more of this Thai business practice in the future, on Phuket, and across a broad range of industries.

With the increasing tourist numbers there this is not the case.

Russian and Chinese package holiday tourists are propping up the tourist numbers, but they come here on a tight budget, therefore, do not spend and inject little into the Phuket economy.

The numbers may be up, but the money is down.

Therefore, Thai Business 101 kicks in - "Money go down - put price up."

[stevenl]

Russian and Chinese package holiday tourists are propping up the tourist numbers, but they come here on a tight budget, therefore, do not spend and inject little into the Phuket economy.

The numbers may be up, but the money is down.

Therefore, Thai Business 101 kicks in - "Money go down - put price up."

At Similans, what this topic is abut, tourist numbers are way up. Don't try to make this about something it is not.

[starkey_rich]

Here is a few more places to avoid if you don't like being ripped off.

http://www.2pricethailand.com/

I have been to a couple of places on here a while ago and showing my Thai License ect was just met by smarmy smile and then ignored.

[NamKangMan]

Russian and Chinese package holiday tourists are propping up the tourist numbers, but they come here on a tight budget, therefore, do not spend and inject little into the Phuket economy.

The numbers may be up, but the money is down.

Therefore, Thai Business 101 kicks in - "Money go down - put price up."

At Similans, what this topic is abut, tourist numbers are way up. Don't try to make this about something it is not.

"At Similans, what this topic is abut, tourist numbers are way up." - source please.

[stevenl]

Russian and Chinese package holiday tourists are propping up the tourist numbers, but they come here on a tight budget, therefore, do not spend and inject little into the Phuket economy.

The numbers may be up, but the money is down.

Therefore, Thai Business 101 kicks in - "Money go down - put price up."

At Similans, what this topic is abut, tourist numbers are way up. Don't try to make this about something it is not.

"At Similans, what this topic is abut, tourist numbers are way up." - source please.

Just look at the offers of the tour operators now and compare that to 2-3 years ago. Trips to the Similans have at least doubled.

Just ask any of the operators.

You could also do a search here on the forum, and check the posts about Similans. I recall the rangers complaining about the great numbers of Chinese leaving their cigarette butts behind e.g.

Oh, and most importantly, I know what I'm talking about.

[billythehat]

Possibly but Id like to see a published source first, wouldnt you? Furthermore, it could just be as simple as Thai Economics 101 kicking in No Hab Biznit, poot pwicess up.

I think it's as simple as that, BTH. As you say, Thai Business 101 - "Money go down - put price up."

I expect to see more of this Thai business practice in the future, on Phuket, and across a broad range of industries.

With the increasing tourist numbers there this is not the case.

Russian and Chinese package holiday tourists are propping up the tourist numbers, but they come here on a tight budget, therefore, do not spend and inject little into the Phuket economy.

The numbers may be up, but the money is down.

Therefore, Thai Business 101 kicks in - "Money go down - put price up."

Agreed and relevant to the OP.

The reality of Thai economics still appears to elude some of the inmates here, ‘if living here one pays the Thai price’ blah, blah, blah, but at the end of the day one needs to view this as just a sardonic opinion rather than fact. Quite harmless. The price increases to Similan and indeed other tourist traps will have a cut-off point for whoever wants to go; price it too high and you end up with an over rated niche that only the rich, or dumb, or expats that live there can afford. Clever, successful business folk are usually canny enough to avoid such a situation when the majority of your custom is from the hinterlands of Siberia, Derka Derka Stan and Xinjiang.

[billythehat]

Russian and Chinese package holiday tourists are propping up the tourist numbers, but they come here on a tight budget, therefore, do not spend and inject little into the Phuket economy.

The numbers may be up, but the money is down.

Therefore, Thai Business 101 kicks in - "Money go down - put price up."

At Similans, what this topic is abut, tourist numbers are way up. Don't try to make this about something it is not.

"At Similans, what this topic is abut, tourist numbers are way up." - source please.

Just look at the offers of the tour operators now and compare that to 2-3 years ago. Trips to the Similans have at least doubled.

Just ask any of the operators.

You could also do a search here on the forum, and check the posts about Similans. I recall the rangers complaining about the great numbers of Chinese leaving their cigarette butts behind e.g.

Oh, and most importantly, I know what I'm talking about.

"Oh, and most importantly, I know what I'm talking about."

[NamKangMan]

Russian and Chinese package holiday tourists are propping up the tourist numbers, but they come here on a tight budget, therefore, do not spend and inject little into the Phuket economy.

The numbers may be up, but the money is down.

Therefore, Thai Business 101 kicks in - "Money go down - put price up."

At Similans, what this topic is abut, tourist numbers are way up. Don't try to make this about something it is not.

"At Similans, what this topic is abut, tourist numbers are way up." - source please.

Just look at the offers of the tour operators now and compare that to 2-3 years ago. Trips to the Similans have at least doubled.

Just ask any of the operators.

You could also do a search here on the forum, and check the posts about Similans. I recall the rangers complaining about the great numbers of Chinese leaving their cigarette butts behind e.g.

Oh, and most importantly, I know what I'm talking about.

"Just look at the offers of the tour operators now and compare that to 2-3 years ago." - how does offers from tour operators indicate tourist numbers are way up? If anything, it would suggest they are deperate to sell tours.

"Trips to the Similans have at least doubled." - once again, please post the source to back up your claim.

I was actually asking for some statistics to back up your claim that the "tourist numbers are way up."

"Just ask any of the operators." - they are in the industry, therefore, have a conflict of interest. Would you honestly expect them to say "it's dead out there at the moment?" A bit like asking a time share tout about property investment on Phuket.

"I recall the rangers complaining about the great numbers of Chinese leaving their cigarette butts behind e.g." - I googled and found an article in the PW (which I can't post the link) about the Chinese, and their cigarette butts, on the Similans - it was dated Thursday 11th April, 2013 - some 18 months ago. A lot has changed in Thailand, and on Phuket, since then. Therefore, your claim may well be out dated.

"Oh, and most importantly, I know what I'm talking about." - once again, I'm only asking for some half reliable statistics to back up or claim, or, considering you work in the industry, I would have to view your claim with some suspicion.

[keestha]

I have been sending tourists on snorkeling trips to Similan since 2001, and I hate to confirm that yes, it is becoming more and more crowded there every year, the Similans are about as well known as the Niagara Falls now, also among Chinese and Russians. Since a few years I always try to convince customers to go to Surin or Koh Ta Chai instead, it is less overcrowded there. But it costs a bit more also.

In Khao Lak, because of cut throat competition among the tour operators, the snorkeling tour prices have remained stable for a long time.

[NamKangMan]

I have been sending tourists on snorkeling trips to Similan since 2001, and I hate to confirm that yes, it is becoming more and more crowded there every year, the Similans are about as well known as the Niagara Falls now, also among Chinese and Russians. Since a few years I always try to convince customers to go to Surin or Koh Ta Chai instead, it is less overcrowded there. But it costs a bit more also.

In Khao Lak, because of cut throat competition among the tour operators, the snorkeling tour prices have remained stable for a long time.

Keeping an open mind, given that you and stevenl say the numbers are up on the Similans, is this rise in fees nothing more than a typical Thai grab for cash, and do you think the extra cost will deter some from going to the Similans in the future?

[keestha]

I have been sending tourists on snorkeling trips to Similan since 2001, and I hate to confirm that yes, it is becoming more and more crowded there every year, the Similans are about as well known as the Niagara Falls now, also among Chinese and Russians. Since a few years I always try to convince customers to go to Surin or Koh Ta Chai instead, it is less overcrowded there. But it costs a bit more also.

In Khao Lak, because of cut throat competition among the tour operators, the snorkeling tour prices have remained stable for a long time.

Keeping an open mind, given that you and stevenl say the numbers are up on the Similans, is this rise in fees nothing more than a typical Thai grab for cash, and do you think the extra cost will deter some from going to the Similans in the future?

Hardly. When we are talking about snorkeling tours, prices vary wildly, depending on how much profit the travel agency takes. People staying in a 5 star hotel may have paid 3200 Baht for a 1 day Similan snorkeling tour, but they end up in the same boat as backpackers who have paid only 1700 Baht for it at the guesthouse. (Khao Lak price level) What difference makes a small entry fee price hike make than? It might just deter a very small number of rock bottom backpackers, who might be willing to pay 1700 Baht, but cannot accept 1800 Baht.

[NamKangMan]

I have been sending tourists on snorkeling trips to Similan since 2001, and I hate to confirm that yes, it is becoming more and more crowded there every year, the Similans are about as well known as the Niagara Falls now, also among Chinese and Russians. Since a few years I always try to convince customers to go to Surin or Koh Ta Chai instead, it is less overcrowded there. But it costs a bit more also.

In Khao Lak, because of cut throat competition among the tour operators, the snorkeling tour prices have remained stable for a long time.

Keeping an open mind, given that you and stevenl say the numbers are up on the Similans, is this rise in fees nothing more than a typical Thai grab for cash, and do you think the extra cost will deter some from going to the Similans in the future?

Hardly. When we are talking about snorkeling tours, prices vary wildly, depending on how much profit the travel agency takes. People staying in a 5 star hotel may have paid 3200 Baht for a 1 day Similan snorkeling tour, but they end up in the same boat as backpackers who have paid only 1700 Baht for it at the guesthouse. (Khao Lak price level) What difference makes a small entry fee price hike make than? It might just deter a very small number of rock bottom backpackers, who might be willing to pay 1700 Baht, but cannot accept 1800 Baht.

I was enquiring more of the Chinese and Russians, the largest demographic of tourists here now, especially given some Chinese package holiday companies have not been paying their bills on Phuket.

I'm sure you saw the recent thread about this.

[madmitch]

Interestingly, day trips to the Similans from Khao Lak or Phuket do not seem to differentiate in price between Thais and foreigners.

This implies one of three things:

The tour company pays an overall amount for access to the islands for an extended period of time;

Money's paid under the table to the National Park rangers;

Both the above.

[stevenl]

I was enquiring more of the Chinese and Russians, the largest demographic of tourists here now, especially given some Chinese package holiday companies have not been paying their bills on Phuket.

I'm sure you saw the recent thread about this.

Not 'some companies', but one, and they have made a payment arrangement to settle all in full.

And no, this really won't affect them. Russians don't go much there anyway, of the package tourists mainly Chinese and Koreans.

[Tep]

The argument is that Thai people and foreign residents pay for the up keeping of the nature parks with there tax payments.

Tourist are not paying tax for the parks and should pay extra.

Don't know if it is a valid argument but it sounds logical.

"Tourist are not paying tax for the parks and should pay extra." - the majority of tourists fly in, and out, of Thailand.

There is an 800 baht tax on their exit, or return ticket. I believe this is not specifically an airport tax, but I am happy to stand corrected on this from any member who knows more about it.

There are other fees and surcharges attached to the air ticket which I believe go directly to airport revenue.

I was under the belief this 800 baht went to consolidated revenue, which then "should" go to the maintanence of the things that tourist use, or in this case, a marine park.

Prior to the corporatisation of Airports of Thailand (AOT) into AOT Plc in 2002, the Passenger Service Charge (PSC) was 500 baht and not included in the ticket price. You may remember having to purchase a coupon at the airport. This PSC was shared 50% with Ministry of Finance, going to general revenue and 50% retain by AOT as revenue.

As part of the corporatisation, Cabinet approved the increase of the PSC to 750 baht of which 100% would be retained by AOT Plc as revenue. This was in recognition of the capex required for Suvannabhumi which was still under construction and not opened until 2006.

The Civil Aviation Board regulates AOT Plc, including its revenue through a revenue cap process. The Maximum Allowable Revenue (MAR) is determined for the year (or regulatory period) and AOT Plc sets the level of fees as they wish to reach that revenue. Additional fees and charges imposed by AOT Plc include landing and parking charges for the airlines. All of this constitutes revenue for the partially privatised state company and none of it goes to the Ministry of Finance, except for corporate tax consistent with all companies in Thailand.

So no incoming or departing airline passengers actually would be contributing directly to general revenue of the government through their ticket purchase via fees or charges imposed by AOT Plc.

In terms of the dual pricing issue, I avoid national parks but other government related attractions such as Bang Sai Royal Arts and Crafts Centre have allowed me entrance at the Thai price using a drivers license. I can't speak for other facilities and I avoid privately run 'attractions' that use dual pricing.