Experts pinpoint Thai tourism setbacks

[h90]

"outlined two major problems"

I thought something like: fraud, safety, rip off, damaged environment comes.....

But no...it is the statistics.....

[Fred Flinstone]

Could just be the people running the country are not representatives of the Thais majority , but do so because they have tanks and guns and rewrite the script to suit.

Maybe they don't get it ?, But most people object to military law imposed on them , including tourists.

Its not rocket science.

Nor is it believed that any propaganda which shows different is at all credible excuse.

Numbers will fall until thailand is again a free democratic nation.

Edited September 17, 2014 by Fred Flinstone

[casindonet]

Is the photo used for this news is for real....."Opportunity has landed"? Can just imagine all the scammers drooling at the sight of tourists coming out of the arrival hall......

[Kees5555]

I am missing this about cleaning up Thailand: what is Thailand going to do about garbage on the beaches? And in the streets? Many sois in Pattaya, Jomtien Beach are garbage dumps !

And what about all the garbage from the rivers that is flowing into the Gulf of Thailand ? !

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SkwUMSYD6q4

[charmonman]

I think the main problem with the Thai tourism industry, from the perspective of the tourist, is that there are too many damn tourists!

[namdocmai]

I think the main problem with the Thai tourism industry, from the perspective of the tourist, is that there are too many damn tourists!

Too many bad mannered ones from certain country's.

Also Samui is overbuilt, when i stayed in a nice resort in Chaweng we heard the discobeat all night long, nobody could sleep untill 6 am. Will never go back there. The owner of the disco paid the police to do so.

[Sayonarax]

What a stupid report, half the members on TV have better opinions, and that's saying a lot.

[mike324]

TAT gets huge funds from the government, great article that highlights the tip of the iceberg regarding to corruption in this department.

[Emster23]

Mark Twain defined an expert as "an ordinary fellow from another town". Will Rogers described an expert as "A man fifty miles from home with a briefcase. ." Maybe expert here is "fellow who once stayed at resort for weekend". I know posters on TV can get a bit overboard at times, but if someone with influence regarding tourism skimmed our myriad posts they could get perhaps a glimpse of what needs to be corrected. It ain't rocket science.

[bunuel]

Just from pure and simple observation over the last 5 years alone, the visible number of tourists has dropped MASSIVELY. High season this year most hotels were operating at 30%.

Towns like Hua Hin are still virtually deserted.

Pattaya is seeing a decline in Russian tourists - but perhaps for other reasons - but this still adds to the overall depletion of numbers.

The recent southern island murder mystery is going to have a massive impact on a global perception of Thailand, alongside the fact that the country is still under military rule.

To the uneducated overseas tourist - Thailand is an increasingly less attractive destination.

Not even the wondrous Thai punani can overcome that I'm afraid.

On the contrary, it is not "uneducated tourists" that are the problem, they are indeed informed and well educated on what is happening in Thailand which is why numbers are falling.

I think the increasing feel of xenophobia and the perception that foreigners are not welcome is also having an impact,, maybe small impact but once the idea that Thai's hate foreigners gets out that is a very difficult thing to shake. If someone asked me today how Thai people treat foreigners I would tell the truth and it would not be good.

Just this week there was another news item claiming that foreign gangs are "plaguing" Thailand with criminal activity,, total nonsense in my opinion but when the economy is tough the locals will listen and take it to heart.

I firmly believe how the local people treat you is a major contributing factor into choosing your holiday destination, along with safety, price and weather. Right now Thailand has the weather but the other points are under attack.

I guess the only way this will change is if Thailand lose the arrogance and wake up,, they need tourists, they need people to come to Thailand and spend money as tourists as well as invest in business,, make this unattractive and you lose everything.

I hope they smell the coffee soon because I get the feeling the clock is ticking.

Agree 100% . Tourism is a touchy business, and negative perceptions, fair or unfair, can be devastating to any country as reliant on tourism as Thailand ( 10% of the national economy is a lot). As someone who has written about sustainable tourism development around the world, I can point to two basic problems in LOS.

1) Short term, there has been a serious lack of planning. Successful tourism planning requires designating specific areas of the country for specific markets. This means market research - what do various national groups like to do, etc. Generally speaking, one has to be careful with mixing people with conflcting interests . Have seen the Russian sun n sand lovers coming to Pattaya now for the past few years, and this was a big mistake. The beaches in Pattaya are terrible, and the city is not ( to be charitable) destination for Russian families. Furthermore, the Russians drive away many of the Western Europeans, who generally are not crazy about Russians. So, what has happened is that low market mass tourism has driven away higher market special interest tourism from Western Europe over the past two years. Now, for domestic economic reasons. the Russian market is way down, and I also get the impression many Russians were not happy with the travel product they were getting ( lousy beaches, robberies, rip offs etc). As a result, Pattaya is left in the lurch, since the Western Europeans have found other destinations to go to. This is the result of poor tourism planning. It would have been much better to develop an area for Russian sun n sand tourists - like Kao Chang - where there were not many Western Europeans, and where there are beautiful beaches. Some parts of Pattaya, like Jomtien, had real potential as retirement havens, with the construction of quality homes and condos for Western European retirees. This potential was damaged by the mass construction of cheap condos intended for the Russian market - which now is evaporating. Who is going to buy these cheap condos now? Can't think of anybody, unfortunately.

The second major issue is the gorilla in the room - the military dictatorship. Regardless of local issues, military dictatorships are generally bad for tourism business anywhere in the world. There are exceptions, to be sure, but it remains to be seen how skillfull the Thai junta is in managing public relations internationally.

The Thai tourism industry has an uphill climb ahead. I love Thailand, but these are not going to be easy times.

[quandow]

I've been through several coups while in LOS, this one has a dangerous odor to it. If anyone really reads what is being planned for the future here, then they should be scared, it isn't pretty. That will surely create a rise in tourism if TAT reporting has anything to do with it; the rest of the world knows what going down, and that's number of tourists.

[BangkokHank]

I actually think the tourists are down by about 50% in real terms.

. . . but only 10% in fake terms, which is much better. I therefore suggest that we continue using the fake numbers.

[eeworldwide]

Just from pure and simple observation over the last 5 years alone, the visible number of tourists has dropped MASSIVELY. High season this year most hotels were operating at 30%.

Towns like Hua Hin are still virtually deserted.

Pattaya is seeing a decline in Russian tourists - but perhaps for other reasons - but this still adds to the overall depletion of numbers.

The recent southern island murder mystery is going to have a massive impact on a global perception of Thailand, alongside the fact that the country is still under military rule.

To the uneducated overseas tourist - Thailand is an increasingly less attractive destination.

Not even the wondrous Thai punani can overcome that I'm afraid.

On the contrary, it is not "uneducated tourists" that are the problem, they are indeed informed and well educated on what is happening in Thailand which is why numbers are falling.

I think the increasing feel of xenophobia and the perception that foreigners are not welcome is also having an impact,, maybe small impact but once the idea that Thai's hate foreigners gets out that is a very difficult thing to shake. If someone asked me today how Thai people treat foreigners I would tell the truth and it would not be good.

Just this week there was another news item claiming that foreign gangs are "plaguing" Thailand with criminal activity,, total nonsense in my opinion but when the economy is tough the locals will listen and take it to heart.

I firmly believe how the local people treat you is a major contributing factor into choosing your holiday destination, along with safety, price and weather. Right now Thailand has the weather but the other points are under attack.

I guess the only way this will change is if Thailand lose the arrogance and wake up,, they need tourists, they need people to come to Thailand and spend money as tourists as well as invest in business,, make this unattractive and you lose everything.

I hope they smell the coffee soon because I get the feeling the clock is ticking.

Agree 100% . Tourism is a touchy business, and negative perceptions, fair or unfair, can be devastating to any country as reliant on tourism as Thailand ( 10% of the national economy is a lot). As someone who has written about sustainable tourism development around the world, I can point to two basic problems in LOS.

1) Short term, there has been a serious lack of planning. Successful tourism planning requires designating specific areas of the country for specific markets. This means market research - what do various national groups like to do, etc. Generally speaking, one has to be careful with mixing people with conflcting interests . Have seen the Russian sun n sand lovers coming to Pattaya now for the past few years, and this was a big mistake. The beaches in Pattaya are terrible, and the city is not ( to be charitable) destination for Russian families. Furthermore, the Russians drive away many of the Western Europeans, who generally are not crazy about Russians. So, what has happened is that low market mass tourism has driven away higher market special interest tourism from Western Europe over the past two years. Now, for domestic economic reasons. the Russian market is way down, and I also get the impression many Russians were not happy with the travel product they were getting ( lousy beaches, robberies, rip offs etc). As a result, Pattaya is left in the lurch, since the Western Europeans have found other destinations to go to. This is the result of poor tourism planning. It would have been much better to develop an area for Russian sun n sand tourists - like Kao Chang - where there were not many Western Europeans, and where there are beautiful beaches. Some parts of Pattaya, like Jomtien, had real potential as retirement havens, with the construction of quality homes and condos for Western European retirees. This potential was damaged by the mass construction of cheap condos intended for the Russian market - which now is evaporating. Who is going to buy these cheap condos now? Can't think of anybody, unfortunately.

The second major issue is the gorilla in the room - the military dictatorship. Regardless of local issues, military dictatorships are generally bad for tourism business anywhere in the world. There are exceptions, to be sure, but it remains to be seen how skillfull the Thai junta is in managing public relations internationally.

The Thai tourism industry has an uphill climb ahead. I love Thailand, but these are not going to be easy times.

Interesting points indeed. Unfortunately your points and ideas are waay waaaay to coherent and logical to be implemented here in Thailand. Their simplicity would be merely baffling to the TAT.

And as I said in my OP, of course- the current governmental situation to the uneducated overseas tourist, before they have booked their flight here, would make it seem like perhaps not the best choice of destination.

It's gonna be like pushing a snowball up a sand dune in the Sahara Desert in Thailand for the foreseeable future.

[halloween]

Some years back, an English girl was raped and murdered on Lamai Beach on New Years Eve. It made for big news in the UK.

2 days later, an english friend got a call from his mother - isn't that where you live, it looks absolutely beautiful. He said "yeah, if you don't mind being raped and murdered" to which his mother replied "I could be raped and murdered in my own home." (as related to me).

Millions of people who had never heard of koh Tao will now know of it and its attractions. Once the crime is solved and the hullaballoo dies down, tourism will actually increase IMHO.

'There's no such thing as bad publicity.' P T Barnum

BS

Thank you for your witty critique of my post. Would you care to explain which part you find objectionable? Don't strain yourself, one syllable words will suffice.

Edited September 17, 2014 by halloween

[Greg Nixon]

It would be interesting for the government to survey those foreigners who stay for work, business and retirement or on short term furloughs from jobs offshore. One of the very important questions would be , " how much money do you spend annually in Thailand. That would help in promoting Thailand for various reasons other than just tourism.

[Benmart]

I refuse to believe my heroes in the very efficient and totally transparent TAT would ever report inaccurate or misleading data and they would never do it deliberately, would they ?

After reading the article, it appears any doubt about the inaccuracy of data is a moot point. The horse is dead and time time to get off and move forward.

[Benmart]

Some years back, an English girl was raped and murdered on Lamai Beach on New Years Eve. It made for big news in the UK.

2 days later, an english friend got a call from his mother - isn't that where you live, it looks absolutely beautiful. He said "yeah, if you don't mind being raped and murdered" to which his mother replied "I could be raped and murdered in my own home." (as related to me).

Millions of people who had never heard of koh Tao will now know of it and its attractions. Once the crime is solved and the hullaballoo dies down, tourism will actually increase IMHO.

'There's no such thing as bad publicity.' P T Barnum

No such thing as bad publicity, unless you are the victim or the families and friends left behind.

[rmacee]

From a UK perspective .. why waste the best part 2 days travelling, pay £650/700 for a flight when so much is still available in Europe .. at a fraction of the price as Thailand is no longer a cheap place to visit. The weather is also getting less predictable.

And the smiles is well gone out of LOS ..

[NoshowJones]

I actually think the tourists are down by about 50% in real terms.

I flew to the UK last month and back to Thailand, The plane was completely full both times. Would that suggest that tourism is down by 50%?

[Thai at Heart]

17 million in the same period last year, or a 10-per-cent drop. But ATTA's statistics showed that arrivals during those eight months plunged by 40 per cent year on year.

Ouch. Tat, where are u with some whitewash.

[Strangebrew]

Well they scratched the surface, Now firstly I never believe the tripe TAT spews out. If you do believe Yea there is a Santa Claus. Now for the facts Tourists read You have an amazing amount of suicides in Thailand do tourists really think there that high in a word "NO", Not to mention the amount of scams going on unchecked. We know the Police are as crooked as a dog's back leg, sure you had unrest But that is because the people are tired of same ole same ole. You talk change but fail to make change. You fail to understand how the world around you works. You blatantly support the two price system as normal. Yet other countries well most other countries have one price for all. You Blame your woes on farangs when it is the expats living and working in your country that drive your economy. You rely on outside investment to create jobs, yet want 51% of the profit Instead of a fair taxing system to get your share. You make harder for those who follow the rules to stay here. Yet the so called Quality tourist spend little and spit everywhere. Now your blaming the murders of two Brits on farangs without all the facts or even proof. Only to save face Well time to pull out of where sun don't shine and smell the coffee. Time for Reforms in attitude and way things are run or your Doomed in tourism business.

[paddyjenkins]

I'm always just amazed at how supposedly tourism is just 6% of GDP, yet these type of headlines dominate the news which seems to me shows that tourism is much larger than is being let on. I can't really recall most first world countries generating big headlines about their tourism numbers like Thailand.

I think it's officially more like 8%. But that excludes a lot of the spending by tourists as well as the indirect impact of how far each tourist dollar goes when it's received by a local and then spent onwards. Most economists would argue 20% is a more realistic contribution. But that 20% is a vitally important 20% as it goes to those with the least, which means there may be little else for them to do. Just think of all the extended families that benefit, all the businesses that benefit indirectly...the chain is long, or maybe better analogy is the ripple out effect is extremely wide. That 20% goes to support a huge number of people. Take away a large portion of that 20% and you soon have more than a drop on GDP to worry about.

[rreddin]

I also think that a lot of neighbouring countries are now accessible compared to years before, so that is having an impact too. Many tourist who travel here are the adventerous type and with all the problems we see and know they simply go to neighbouring countries. It's the same types of beaches and sea, just less hassle.

Thailand is yet to wake up to the fact that there is now serious competition for tourists from other countries in the region. The Daily Mail's travel section had a piece a day or so ago saying Vietnam was now the favourite destination for Brits visiting this part of the World.

[Cats4ever]

Mark Twain defined an expert as "an ordinary fellow from another town". Will Rogers described an expert as "A man fifty miles from home with a briefcase. ." Maybe expert here is "fellow who once stayed at resort for weekend". I know posters on TV can get a bit overboard at times, but if someone with influence regarding tourism skimmed our myriad posts they could get perhaps a glimpse of what needs to be corrected. It ain't rocket science.

A certain Melbourne footy commentator (Rex Hunt) defined an expert as ex = "used up or used to be" , and spert (consider it phonetically) "a drip under pressure".

[chumpy]

Just from pure and simple observation over the last 5 years alone, the visible number of tourists has dropped MASSIVELY. High season this year most hotels were operating at 30%.

Towns like Hua Hin are still virtually deserted.

Pattaya is seeing a decline in Russian tourists - but perhaps for other reasons - but this still adds to the overall depletion of numbers.

The recent southern island murder mystery is going to have a massive impact on a global perception of Thailand, alongside the fact that the country is still under military rule.

To the uneducated overseas tourist - Thailand is an increasingly less attractive destination.

Not even the wondrous Thai punani can overcome that I'm afraid.

On the contrary, it is not "uneducated tourists" that are the problem, they are indeed informed and well educated on what is happening in Thailand which is why numbers are falling.

I think the increasing feel of xenophobia and the perception that foreigners are not welcome is also having an impact,, maybe small impact but once the idea that Thai's hate foreigners gets out that is a very difficult thing to shake. If someone asked me today how Thai people treat foreigners I would tell the truth and it would not be good.

Just this week there was another news item claiming that foreign gangs are "plaguing" Thailand with criminal activity,, total nonsense in my opinion but when the economy is tough the locals will listen and take it to heart.

I firmly believe how the local people treat you is a major contributing factor into choosing your holiday destination, along with safety, price and weather. Right now Thailand has the weather but the other points are under attack.

I guess the only way this will change is if Thailand lose the arrogance and wake up,, they need tourists, they need people to come to Thailand and spend money as tourists as well as invest in business,, make this unattractive and you lose everything.

I hope they smell the coffee soon because I get the feeling the clock is ticking.

I totally agree,I don't know about how things are in other tourist destinations in Thailand but in Phuket I can describe the attitude of the locals towards foreigners as being hostile,not always but very often.I assume that they are angry with us because there are no longer so many of us coming and times are hard,the whole island has only one source of income and that's from the tourists / expats.Many Thais are now expecting a good high season because they think that the army has now cleaned the place up,ie removed the taxi mafia and beach chairs,I myself am not so optimistic,to start off with the locals might want to act a bit more friendly towards the foreign visitors or expats,this was previously a huge selling point for Thailand and set them apart from a lot of countries.

And then there's the often discussed topic that expats don't contribute much to the economy,bear in mind that many tourists stay at international hotel chains,a lot of the money spent at these hotels goes abroad,that's how multi national companies operate.

[halloween]

Some years back, an English girl was raped and murdered on Lamai Beach on New Years Eve. It made for big news in the UK.

2 days later, an english friend got a call from his mother - isn't that where you live, it looks absolutely beautiful. He said "yeah, if you don't mind being raped and murdered" to which his mother replied "I could be raped and murdered in my own home." (as related to me).

Millions of people who had never heard of koh Tao will now know of it and its attractions. Once the crime is solved and the hullaballoo dies down, tourism will actually increase IMHO.

'There's no such thing as bad publicity.' P T Barnum

No such thing as bad publicity, unless you are the victim or the families and friends left behind.

Publicity certainly won't hurt the victim. How does inadvertently advertising the area where a crime took place hurt the families and friends? Should we ban the reporting of crimes, or the giving of geographical information about the location of the crime?

[VINCENT2012]

Amazing that they are unable to point to the current reason for the huge decline in tourism and other sectors.

is blindness related to thainess........?

[Thai at Heart]

Just from pure and simple observation over the last 5 years alone, the visible number of tourists has dropped MASSIVELY. High season this year most hotels were operating at 30%.

Towns like Hua Hin are still virtually deserted.

Pattaya is seeing a decline in Russian tourists - but perhaps for other reasons - but this still adds to the overall depletion of numbers.

The recent southern island murder mystery is going to have a massive impact on a global perception of Thailand, alongside the fact that the country is still under military rule.

To the uneducated overseas tourist - Thailand is an increasingly less attractive destination.

Not even the wondrous Thai punani can overcome that I'm afraid.

On the contrary, it is not "uneducated tourists" that are the problem, they are indeed informed and well educated on what is happening in Thailand which is why numbers are falling.

I think the increasing feel of xenophobia and the perception that foreigners are not welcome is also having an impact,, maybe small impact but once the idea that Thai's hate foreigners gets out that is a very difficult thing to shake. If someone asked me today how Thai people treat foreigners I would tell the truth and it would not be good.

Just this week there was another news item claiming that foreign gangs are "plaguing" Thailand with criminal activity,, total nonsense in my opinion but when the economy is tough the locals will listen and take it to heart.

I firmly believe how the local people treat you is a major contributing factor into choosing your holiday destination, along with safety, price and weather. Right now Thailand has the weather but the other points are under attack.

I guess the only way this will change is if Thailand lose the arrogance and wake up,, they need tourists, they need people to come to Thailand and spend money as tourists as well as invest in business,, make this unattractive and you lose everything.

I hope they smell the coffee soon because I get the feeling the clock is ticking.

I totally agree,I don't know about how things are in other tourist destinations in Thailand but in Phuket I can describe the attitude of the locals towards foreigners as being hostile,not always but very often.I assume that they are angry with us because there are no longer so many of us coming and times are hard,the whole island has only one source of income and that's from the tourists / expats.Many Thais are now expecting a good high season because they think that the army has now cleaned the place up,ie removed the taxi mafia and beach chairs,I myself am not so optimistic,to start off with the locals might want to act a bit more friendly towards the foreign visitors or expats,this was previously a huge selling point for Thailand and set them apart from a lot of countries.

And then there's the often discussed topic that expats don't contribute much to the economy,bear in mind that many tourists stay at international hotel chains,a lot of the money spent at these hotels goes abroad,that's how multi national companies operate.

Foreign hotels are run on a franchise or as a Thai company.

Thanks to protectionism, foreigners cannot own hotels in Thailand.

[DrTuner]

Keep on the puritanical crackdowns on petty vice and see the tourist numbers plummet. Guess what, not everyone comes here for the temples.

[smedly]

what effects tourism ?

First the article in the OP is complete nonsense and is a fine example of people in Thailand that don't have a clue thinking they do, tourists have absolutely no interest in what figures Thailand published about numbers - here is what matters

- Safety

- Value for money

- exchange rate

- double pricing

- greed

- over pricing

- Infrastructure

- cleanliness

- environment

- corruption

- Mafia in tourist areas abusing tourists - scams

The short term decline could probably be mostly attributed to the state of finances in other countries.

Any long term decline trend is attributable to the list above

As I have said many times before the Thai people have been making large sums from tourism for years but instead of using 10 - 20 - 30% of that and putting it back in to improve all of the above they can't get it into their pockets fast enough - pure greed without forward thinking

Private sector has been building world class hotels and other accommodation but unfortunately once you step out into the city you are met with stench pollution filth danger corruption scams and abuse which they have done nothing to improve for years

They need to get their heads out of their greedy asses and see it for what it is

Paying the same price for a bottle of beer in tourist areas as people do back home is quite simply ridiculous - they have priced themselves out of business, a fine example would be waking street in Pattaya - price fixing exists and if you step out of the box you will be removed - a beer is 35baht in a 7/11 it should never be anywhere near 280baht no matter where your business operates