Tot Local Call Charges

[doctormann]

Hi Guys

Sorry if this has been covered before but I can't find any info.

Right, I've just received a bill from ToT (at last!) and frankly I'm a bit puzzled.

I only use my ToT land-line to connect to the internet. CSLOXINFO is my primary ISP although I do sometimes use the ToT 1288 connection. All of the CSLOX calls that I make are supposed to be local calls to Chonburi numbers - prefix 038 - and my system is set up so that the modem calls only these numbers - and the connection dialogue box indicates that this is working correctly. However, on my ToT bill all internet calls are listed as 'mobile BKK' and the number quoted is one that I do not recognise - certainly not an 038 number but probably a mobile number - usually 050634375, which is certainly not dialled by the modem (unless it's doing it on the sly).

Furthermore, ToT seem to be charging these calls at 3 Baht / minute - I was under the impression that local calls were a 3 Baht flat charge. The listed duration of the calls seems generally reasonable although some are listed as a duration of 1 minute, only, which is curious.

Anyone out there have any info / suggestions before I go and butt heads with ToT, who are not known for being too helpful?

No viruses or spyware detected on the system, by the way. Running XP Pro.

Thanks

DM

[geoffphuket]

Hi Guys

Sorry if this has been covered before but I can't find any info.

Right, I've just received a bill from ToT (at last!) and frankly I'm a bit puzzled.

I only use my ToT land-line to connect to the internet. CSLOXINFO is my primary ISP although I do sometimes use the ToT 1288 connection. All of the CSLOX calls that I make are supposed to be local calls to Chonburi numbers - prefix 038 - and my system is set up so that the modem calls only these numbers - and the connection dialogue box indicates that this is working correctly. However, on my ToT bill all internet calls are listed as 'mobile BKK' and the number quoted is one that I do not recognise - certainly not an 038 number but probably a mobile number - usually 050634375, which is certainly not dialled by the modem (unless it's doing it on the sly).

Furthermore, ToT seem to be charging these calls at 3 Baht / minute - I was under the impression that local calls were a 3 Baht flat charge. The listed duration of the calls seems generally reasonable although some are listed as a duration of 1 minute, only, which is curious.

Anyone out there have any info / suggestions before I go and butt heads with ToT, who are not known for being too helpful?

No viruses or spyware detected on the system, by the way. Running XP Pro.

Thanks

DM

TOT charge 3 Baht flat rate per local CALL + 100 Baht/month service cahrge + 7% VAT to the total.

[lopburi3]

Local calls are 3 baht flat under normal payment plan but do not believe all 038 numbers are in one city and thus some are long distance from other reports. One minute calls would be attempts to connect that failed probably.

As for a mobile phone charge that will always be at least 3 baht per minute. Cheaper to use a mobile phone to call a mobile number these days.

[doctormann]

Hi Guys

Sorry if this has been covered before but I can't find any info.

Right, I've just received a bill from ToT (at last!) and frankly I'm a bit puzzled.

I only use my ToT land-line to connect to the internet. CSLOXINFO is my primary ISP although I do sometimes use the ToT 1288 connection. All of the CSLOX calls that I make are supposed to be local calls to Chonburi numbers - prefix 038 - and my system is set up so that the modem calls only these numbers - and the connection dialogue box indicates that this is working correctly. However, on my ToT bill all internet calls are listed as 'mobile BKK' and the number quoted is one that I do not recognise - certainly not an 038 number but probably a mobile number - usually 050634375, which is certainly not dialled by the modem (unless it's doing it on the sly).

Furthermore, ToT seem to be charging these calls at 3 Baht / minute - I was under the impression that local calls were a 3 Baht flat charge. The listed duration of the calls seems generally reasonable although some are listed as a duration of 1 minute, only, which is curious.

Anyone out there have any info / suggestions before I go and butt heads with ToT, who are not known for being too helpful?

No viruses or spyware detected on the system, by the way. Running XP Pro.

Thanks

DM

TOT charge 3 Baht flat rate per local CALL + 100 Baht/month service cahrge + 7% VAT to the total.

That's what I thought - but they seem to be charging 3 Baht / minute!

DM

[opalhort]

Hi Guys

Sorry if this has been covered before but I can't find any info.

Right, I've just received a bill from ToT (at last!) and frankly I'm a bit puzzled.

I only use my ToT land-line to connect to the internet. CSLOXINFO is my primary ISP although I do sometimes use the ToT 1288 connection. All of the CSLOX calls that I make are supposed to be local calls to Chonburi numbers - prefix 038 - and my system is set up so that the modem calls only these numbers - and the connection dialogue box indicates that this is working correctly. However, on my ToT bill all internet calls are listed as 'mobile BKK' and the number quoted is one that I do not recognise - certainly not an 038 number but probably a mobile number - usually 050634375, which is certainly not dialled by the modem (unless it's doing it on the sly).

Furthermore, ToT seem to be charging these calls at 3 Baht / minute - I was under the impression that local calls were a 3 Baht flat charge. The listed duration of the calls seems generally reasonable although some are listed as a duration of 1 minute, only, which is curious.

Anyone out there have any info / suggestions before I go and butt heads with ToT, who are not known for being too helpful?

No viruses or spyware detected on the system, by the way. Running XP Pro.

Thanks

DM

We had something similar here in BKK late last year. We never use our TOT lines for internet (have True line for this). Many calls were made to mobiles from one of our TOT lines which we never made. Investigation found that somebody in our soi tapped into our line, TOT found the point where somebody connected to the cable but still don't know who.

Loss was minor so we did not bother to follow up and it has stopped after the cable was replaced by TOT.

Have you ever tried to call the number you mention (050634375) to find out who answers?

An other problem could be TOT's billing system, they obviously have some major problems with it.

opalhort

[opalhort]

Hi Guys

Sorry if this has been covered before but I can't find any info.

Right, I've just received a bill from ToT (at last!) and frankly I'm a bit puzzled.

I only use my ToT land-line to connect to the internet. CSLOXINFO is my primary ISP although I do sometimes use the ToT 1288 connection. All of the CSLOX calls that I make are supposed to be local calls to Chonburi numbers - prefix 038 - and my system is set up so that the modem calls only these numbers - and the connection dialogue box indicates that this is working correctly. However, on my ToT bill all internet calls are listed as 'mobile BKK' and the number quoted is one that I do not recognise - certainly not an 038 number but probably a mobile number - usually 050634375, which is certainly not dialled by the modem (unless it's doing it on the sly).

Furthermore, ToT seem to be charging these calls at 3 Baht / minute - I was under the impression that local calls were a 3 Baht flat charge. The listed duration of the calls seems generally reasonable although some are listed as a duration of 1 minute, only, which is curious.

Anyone out there have any info / suggestions before I go and butt heads with ToT, who are not known for being too helpful?

No viruses or spyware detected on the system, by the way. Running XP Pro.

Thanks

DM

TOT charge 3 Baht flat rate per local CALL + 100 Baht/month service cahrge + 7% VAT to the total.

That's what I thought - but they seem to be charging 3 Baht / minute!

DM

calls from TOT land line to mobile are charged at 3.-Baht/minute.

opalhort

[doctormann]

Hi Guys

Sorry if this has been covered before but I can't find any info.

Right, I've just received a bill from ToT (at last!) and frankly I'm a bit puzzled.

I only use my ToT land-line to connect to the internet. CSLOXINFO is my primary ISP although I do sometimes use the ToT 1288 connection. All of the CSLOX calls that I make are supposed to be local calls to Chonburi numbers - prefix 038 - and my system is set up so that the modem calls only these numbers - and the connection dialogue box indicates that this is working correctly. However, on my ToT bill all internet calls are listed as 'mobile BKK' and the number quoted is one that I do not recognise - certainly not an 038 number but probably a mobile number - usually 050634375, which is certainly not dialled by the modem (unless it's doing it on the sly).

Furthermore, ToT seem to be charging these calls at 3 Baht / minute - I was under the impression that local calls were a 3 Baht flat charge. The listed duration of the calls seems generally reasonable although some are listed as a duration of 1 minute, only, which is curious.

Anyone out there have any info / suggestions before I go and butt heads with ToT, who are not known for being too helpful?

No viruses or spyware detected on the system, by the way. Running XP Pro.

Thanks

DM

We had something similar here in BKK late last year. We never use our TOT lines for internet (have True line for this). Many calls were made to mobiles from one of our TOT lines which we never made. Investigation found that somebody in our soi tapped into our line, TOT found the point where somebody connected to the cable but still don't know who.

Loss was minor so we did not bother to follow up and it has stopped after the cable was replaced by TOT.

Have you ever tried to call the number you mention (050634375) to find out who answers?

An other problem could be TOT's billing system, they obviously have some major problems with it.

opalhort

Yes, I tried calling the 0506.. number but it doesn't connect.

Probably a problem with ToT billing, as you suggest. They seem to be pretty hopeless all round - took the best part of two years to get a bill out of them at all. I'll go down to the office tomorrow but I'm not too optimistic - usually end up with a headache trying to talk to them. Typical uncooperative, uninterested government controlled jobsworths!

DM

[geoffphuket]

Hi Guys

Sorry if this has been covered before but I can't find any info.

Right, I've just received a bill from ToT (at last!) and frankly I'm a bit puzzled.

I only use my ToT land-line to connect to the internet. CSLOXINFO is my primary ISP although I do sometimes use the ToT 1288 connection. All of the CSLOX calls that I make are supposed to be local calls to Chonburi numbers - prefix 038 - and my system is set up so that the modem calls only these numbers - and the connection dialogue box indicates that this is working correctly. However, on my ToT bill all internet calls are listed as 'mobile BKK' and the number quoted is one that I do not recognise - certainly not an 038 number but probably a mobile number - usually 050634375, which is certainly not dialled by the modem (unless it's doing it on the sly).

Furthermore, ToT seem to be charging these calls at 3 Baht / minute - I was under the impression that local calls were a 3 Baht flat charge. The listed duration of the calls seems generally reasonable although some are listed as a duration of 1 minute, only, which is curious.

Anyone out there have any info / suggestions before I go and butt heads with ToT, who are not known for being too helpful?

No viruses or spyware detected on the system, by the way. Running XP Pro.

Thanks

DM

TOT charge 3 Baht flat rate per local CALL + 100 Baht/month service cahrge + 7% VAT to the total.

That's what I thought - but they seem to be charging 3 Baht / minute!

DM

calls from TOT land line to mobile are charged at 3.-Baht/minute.

opalhort

Opalhort...If you're being charged 3 Baht/min I'd get in touch with TOT pronto. Myself and all my neighbours only pay 3 Baht per call....Indeed I used to leave my computer connected all day to 1222 and the cost was still only 3 Baht.

[opalhort]

calls from TOT land line to mobile are charged at 3.-Baht/minute.

opalhort

Opalhort...If you're being charged 3 Baht/min I'd get in touch with TOT pronto. Myself and all my neighbours only pay 3 Baht per call....Indeed I used to leave my computer connected all day to 1222 and the cost was still only 3 Baht.

please note that I wrote "Land line to MOBILE"!!!

of course local calls land line to land line on TOT like the 1222 number are only 3.-/call

opalhort

[geoffphuket]

Sorry have to clean my spec's ...You're quite correct 3Bt/min to mobile (or more)

[Firefan]

I recall an old thread on this issue. As far as I recall: As mentioned above; even though both nos have 038 as start it does not mean that TOT have it as a "local" number - as they use their own "zones" or whatever. This could be the reason for you being charged "long distance" price - or in your case "mobile charge"(sounds like there is some kind of auto transfer taking place). TIT....better call them!

Cheers!

[libya 115]

Yes, I had the same problem two months ago. I assumed that 038 numbers were all cheap rate 3 baht per call. I ended up with two huge phone bills; imagine 60 hours at 6 baht per minute! I could have paid for UBC platinum for one year!

I had quickly assumed all 038 numbers were O.K. and used an 038 number in the microscopic Rayong box instead of Chon Buri. TIT

[doctormann]

Yes, I had the same problem two months ago. I assumed that 038 numbers were all cheap rate 3 baht per call. I ended up with two huge phone bills; imagine 60 hours at 6 baht per minute! I could have paid for UBC platinum for one year!

I had quickly assumed all 038 numbers were O.K. and used an 038 number in the microscopic Rayong box instead of Chon Buri. TIT

Definitely only using Chonburi 038 numbers, which CSLOX say should be local rate. I don't understand why these local calls are being charged at mobile rates - something is obviously seriously amiss somewhere. I'll go down to the ToT office tomorrow - wish me luck, I'll need it!

DM

[opalhort]

Hi doctormann,

it could be that the 1288 from TOT is a forwarding line to a mobile number which then connects to the 1222 of TOT.

note that CXLoxinfo does use the 1222 TOT line for their service up-country!

you dial in to CXLoxinfo but the line actually goes through TOT 1288 or 1222.

ask CXLoxinfo first before you confront the TOT guys!

opalhort

[doctormann]

Quick update:

Went to the TOT office in Pattaya today - quite helpful for a change. They agree with me that something is wrong somewhere - calls to my ISP on local numbers should definitely be 3 Baht flat rate. They are investigating and, in the meantime, I have paid a much reduced bill.

Also contacted CSLOX. They also confirm the 3 Baht flat rate and do not recognise the number that has been appearing on my bill. They have provided me with a cutomer usage record so I can compare this to the items on the TOT bill.

DM

[doctormann]

Well, some time has gone by and I'm really no further forward in bottoming my ToT billing problem - local internet calls being charged at 3 Baht / min and strange BKK mobile numbers appearing on my ToT bill.

Heard from ToT today - they blame the problem on CSLOX being 'dishonest' and redirecting my calls to a BKK mobile number. CSLOX often do this, they say, in which case why haven't we heard about this scam before? Personally, I don't believe a word of it. I know that my modem is dialling an 038 local number so:

1) Even if CSLOX is redirecting the call, which I don't believe, I should still only be charged for a local call.

2) Where is the monetary advantage for CSLOX in this supposed scam? It's ToT that are picking up the extra cash, not CSLOX.

I would rather believe that this is some sort of a ToT scam and this belief is reinforced by their advising me to change to ADSL (which I don't really need or want) and 'the problem will go away'.

CSLOX provided me with a complete call log for the month of June and this seems to correspond with my own records of internet access. It doesn't correspond with the ToT bill, however, and, before someone suggests that this is maybe somene else's bill let me just say that some other calls, which I have made, appear correctly.

So, anyone out there having similar problems? Anyone heard anything about CSLOX 'dishonesty'?

Anyone got any further comments or suggestions before I butt heads with ToT again?

DM

[opalhort]

Well, some time has gone by and I'm really no further forward in bottoming my ToT billing problem - local internet calls being charged at 3 Baht / min and strange BKK mobile numbers appearing on my ToT bill.

Heard from ToT today - they blame the problem on CSLOX being 'dishonest' and redirecting my calls to a BKK mobile number. CSLOX often do this, they say, in which case why haven't we heard about this scam before? Personally, I don't believe a word of it. I know that my modem is dialling an 038 local number so:

1) Even if CSLOX is redirecting the call, which I don't believe, I should still only be charged for a local call.

2) Where is the monetary advantage for CSLOX in this supposed scam? It's ToT that are picking up the extra cash, not CSLOX.

I would rather believe that this is some sort of a ToT scam and this belief is reinforced by their advising me to change to ADSL (which I don't really need or want) and 'the problem will go away'.

CSLOX provided me with a complete call log for the month of June and this seems to correspond with my own records of internet access. It doesn't correspond with the ToT bill, however, and, before someone suggests that this is maybe somene else's bill let me just say that some other calls, which I have made, appear correctly.

So, anyone out there having similar problems? Anyone heard anything about CSLOX 'dishonesty'?

Anyone got any further comments or suggestions before I butt heads with ToT again?

DM

just a thought (I have no experience with dial-up upcountry - only in BKK):

how many lines does CSLOX have under the local (038) dial-in number?

do you ever get a busy line when you dial in?

it could well be that CSLOX is redirecting calls to somewhere else if all their lines are engaged ("customer satisfaction -- never a busy line" etc.); they won't make money out of it apart from your log-in time but this kind of redirect may well be charged to TOT - hence, to you.

have you ever tried to subscribe to an other ISP on a temporary basis ( a month or so) to see if you have the same problem? If yes, TOT is the bad guy, if no, have a good talk with CSLOX.

opalhort

edit: did you verify that the charged mobile calls match exactly your log-in times at CSLOX?

Edited August 1, 2006 by opalhort

[doctormann]

just a thought (I have no experience with dial-up upcountry - only in BKK):

how many lines does CSLOX have under the local (038) dial-in number?

do you ever get a busy line when you dial in?

it could well be that CSLOX is redirecting calls to somewhere else if all their lines are engaged ("customer satisfaction -- never a busy line" etc.); they won't make money out of it apart from your log-in time but this kind of redirect may well be charged to TOT - hence, to you.

have you ever tried to subscribe to an other ISP on a temporary basis ( a month or so) to see if you have the same problem? If yes, TOT is the bad guy, if no, have a good talk with CSLOX.

opalhort

edit: did you verify that the charged mobile calls match exactly your log-in times at CSLOX?

Opalhort

Thanks for your input on this. In answer to your questions:

There are about ten 038 CSLOX connection numbers available in Chonburi. If the modem finds a busy number it dials the next on the list until it gets a connection. Just about always seems to connect at the first attempt though and this is confirmed by the CSLOX printout, which lists both the connecting number (mine) and the connected number (theirs - the 038 number, not the unexplainable BKK mobile number).

The call times and durations on the ToT bill and on the CSLOX printout do not correspond, even to the extent that on some days, when I have not used the internet, entries still appear on the ToT bill. This is highly suspicious - at first I thought that it was the wrong bill but, as I said in my previous post, other calls that I occasionally make do appear correctly. These are not local calls though.

I'm considering an alternative ISP subscription, as you suggest, as I need to bottom this problem somehow. I'm off to see ToT again today but I'm not too hopeful. They will just pass it up the chain to BKK who will say 'not our problem', same as before.

DM

[geoffphuket]

Just a thought but have you tried phoning the unknown mobile number on your bill and see who answers? That could answer a lot of questions. Possibly you've got a crossed line with a neighbour or someone has tapped into it - not un-common

[opalhort]

Opalhort

Thanks for your input on this. In answer to your questions:

There are about ten 038 CSLOX connection numbers available in Chonburi. If the modem finds a busy number it dials the next on the list until it gets a connection. Just about always seems to connect at the first attempt though and this is confirmed by the CSLOX printout, which lists both the connecting number (mine) and the connected number (theirs - the 038 number, not the unexplainable BKK mobile number).

The call times and durations on the ToT bill and on the CSLOX printout do not correspond, even to the extent that on some days, when I have not used the internet, entries still appear on the ToT bill. This is highly suspicious - at first I thought that it was the wrong bill but, as I said in my previous post, other calls that I occasionally make do appear correctly. These are not local calls though.

I'm considering an alternative ISP subscription, as you suggest, as I need to bottom this problem somehow. I'm off to see ToT again today but I'm not too hopeful. They will just pass it up the chain to BKK who will say 'not our problem', same as before.

DM

DM,

I don't know if this could apply to you but here is an experience I had a couple of years ago ('98 or '99) on a WIN98 PC:

Got a hefty bill from CAT for calls to Hong Kong which I had never made. CAT confirmed the calls were made from my number. I called the number and got the typical beeps of a fax/computer connection.

Then I disconnected the modem whenever I was not on-line and the problem stopped.

Investigation on my PC found an auto-dialer calling this number which also disabled the modem log and modem speaker. That's why I could not find any records or hear the modem dialing.

I got rid of the bug and all was OK. (at that time my PC protection was not up to par).

Can you recall if your PC was on or off when these "funny" calls were made?

opalhort

Edited August 2, 2006 by opalhort

[doctormann]

Just a thought but have you tried phoning the unknown mobile number on your bill and see who answers? That could answer a lot of questions. Possibly you've got a crossed line with a neighbour or someone has tapped into it - not un-common

Yes, tried this but always get an engaged tone.

I don't know if this could apply to you but here is an experience I had a couple of years ago ('98 or '99) on a WIN98 PC:

Got a hefty bill from CAT for calls to Hong Kong which I had never made. CAT confirmed the calls were made from my number. I called the number and got the typical beeps of a fax/computer connection.

Then I disconnected the modem whenever I was not on-line and the problem stopped.

Investigation on my PC found an auto-dialer calling this number which also disabled the modem log and modem speaker. That's why I could not find any records or hear the modem dialing.

I got rid of the bug and all was OK. (at that time my PC protection was not up to par).

Can you recall if your PC was on or off when these "funny" calls were made?

Can't find any auto-dialler or any other virus / spyware problems on the PC. Everything checks out clean.

As I said, the BKK mobile calls do not correspond to the call times and durations that I have logged. They often occur when the PC is switched off. What I find really strange is that none of my 'legitimate' calls appear on the ToT bill at all - i.e. no 038 numbers appear. You could almost believe that the calls were being re-directed somehow except for the lack of correspondence with reality. I'm not a telephone expert but I would have thought that as the connecting call has to go through the ToT exchange the number actually dialled would be the one logged by ToT. Very curious.

My trip to the ToT office has been postponed until tomorrow - I got mugged by a bottle of Tequila last night and 12 hours after I am still not in a fit condition to drive!

DM

[opalhort]

Can't find any auto-dialler or any other virus / spyware problems on the PC. Everything checks out clean.

As I said, the BKK mobile calls do not correspond to the call times and durations that I have logged. They often occur when the PC is switched off. What I find really strange is that none of my 'legitimate' calls appear on the ToT bill at all - i.e. no 038 numbers appear. You could almost believe that the calls were being re-directed somehow except for the lack of correspondence with reality. I'm not a telephone expert but I would have thought that as the connecting call has to go through the ToT exchange the number actually dialled would be the one logged by ToT. Very curious.

My trip to the ToT office has been postponed until tomorrow - I got mugged by a bottle of Tequila last night and 12 hours after I am still not in a fit condition to drive!

DM

OK, this clears CSLOX and your PC. That leaves only TOT or somebody is tapping into your line, the latter of which being unlikely.

TOT has for the past few months had quite a lot of problems with their billing system (there was an article about this in the BKK Post some time ago).

I always thought (at least this is the case here in BKK) that TOT only gives call details for calls beyond your area!? So a call from 038.... to 038....... would only be listed as one unit without any specifics being given.

Have you ever tried to contact TOT in BKK about this problem? The TOT guys here in BKK can be quite helpful provided you speak Thai or have somebody who can speak for you and understands your problem.

Why not switch from Tequila to beer? a lot less problems the next day!

opalhort