Jump to content

Leaked NRC names 'disappointing'


Recommended Posts

Posted

Leaked NRC names 'disappointing'
KRIS BHROMSUTHI,
PRAVIT ROJANAPHRUK
THE NATION

Large groups of popular society left out, which may result in biased reforms

BANGKOK: -- The 173 names of National Reform Council (NRC) members that were leaked yesterday clearly signify political bias and social exclusion, which could lead to unfair reform proposals that will make all reconciliation efforts fail, academics and politicians said.


Ekachai Chainuvati, deputy dean of law at Siam University, said the list wasn't surprising as the individuals had the "same political stance and military influence". He added that this would result in the exclusion of a large group in Thai society, resulting in "narrow" reform proposals.

"The fact that a big group of the popular sector was not given an opportunity to engage in the NRC means that in the end, the prime minister will not achieve his goal of reconciliation," he said.

Ekachai said he did not have a problem with the fact that many anti-Pheu Thai people were chosen, but added that he was disappointed that not all groups were included.

Mahidol University peace expert Gothom Arya agreed, saying it would be impossible for a junta-appointed NRC to achieve reconciliation.

"You can't achieve reconciliation with that

    ," Gothom said, adding that perhaps the NRC could organise events to foster dialogue and national reconciliation.

    "We need to get people who think differently to start talking to one another," he said. The peace expert said he would also be organising such events on his own, and holding brainstorming sessions on three key reform issues, namely elections, decentralisation, and political parties, from next month onwards.

    He added that the NRC would eventually deliver conservative proposals, as the members chosen were known conservatives.

    NRC 'will have little influence'

    However, Chamnan Chaneyang, independent law expert and a member of the Midnight University, said he was indifferent to the list. He said the purpose of establishing the NRC was for the National Council for Peace and Order (NCPO) to gain public approval and credibility, pointing out that the NRC would not have any real influence on the country's reform.

    "The NRC is not an essential part of the country's reform because its only task is to propose a reform agenda, which will be approved by the NCPO.

    "They only have two months to come up with wide-ranging reform proposals. What can you do in that time? It's impossible," he said.

    Surapong Tovichakchaikul, former deputy PM and ex-foreign minister, said he was disappointed because these were the same individuals who had been working with the NCPO. This means the reform agenda will not be inclusive of all sides and the real benefits will not reach ordinary people, he said.

    He added that it was a huge disappointment, as backward reform proposals would not ease any problems.

    Former Pheu Thai MP Amnuay Khangpha said the "same faces" who opposed the Pheu Thai-led government were selected, and the list included several members of the former "40 Senators" group. That was a group of conservative former senators who were known for their opposition to Thaksin Shinawatra and launched many fierce attacks in Parliament against the Pheu Thai administration.

    Amnuay also said he wasn't sure if the NCPO wanted to establish peace and reconciliation, or if it wanted to create another crisis.

    Meanwhile, Chulalongkorn labour expert Associate Professor Lae Dilokvidhyarat said the country's labour movement was deeply divided along the lines of Thai politics, and as a result, it failed to nominate candidates for the NRC.

    He added that many people also did not want to have anything to do with the military junta for fear their reputation would be tainted. As a result, there is nobody in the NRC who can truly represent the interests of the labour sector.

    Former Democrat MP Attawit Suwanpakdee said judging from the names, he believed they could contribute to an effective and fair constitution. However, he said, he wasn't sure if they could come up with good proposals for the 11 reform areas.

    Before the coup, "politicians and bureaucrats were part of the conflict, but now the former have been pushed to the side, as there appear to be many bureaucrats in the NRC list. This will make it difficult for the NRC to come up with innovative reform plans, for instance in terms of the police, governor elections or local administration," as these bureaucrats are fettered by their own ideas that "do not truly represent the voice of the people", he said.

    Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/politics/Leaked-NRC-names-disappointing-30244422.html

    nationlogo.jpg
    -- The Nation 2014-09-30
Posted

This doesn't surprise me at all. Reforms seem to be one sided. Its too bad, I had hope that something good would happen. But its same Oh again. They just don't get it reforms will not work if its one sided. Didn't they learn from the past.

"We hoped for the best, but it turned out as always." Viktor Chernomyrdin.

Posted

Looking forward to see the whole list and details of who they all are, especially looking forward to see representative from all areas of society and all walks of life as promised.

But alas, i have no doubt it will be stacked to the one side, as will the new constitution and we will start the merry go around again when it is shoved down everyone throats. Fast track 6 years and surprise surprise another coup is needed, only this time it will be the last and its really about reform............

In all seriousness they really do need to engage all political parties, they are not going to go away. Perhaps having moderates from each side selected would have been a good approach, and in that way, you never know alliances of the moderates in all sides could have been formed.

Posted

Consider the source. Surapong is nothing more than a Thaksin puppet.

If he's not happy, we are probably on track.

Surapong is not the source, he is just commenting, along with a few other people.

Posted

Don't you just love it when PTP figures complain about things that were commonplace during their time in power ?

Oh sorry I forgot, that was different.

However the more things change the more they stay the same especially here.

  • Like 1
Posted

This article is pointless drivel - the very fact that the author has something to say just highlights the problem in Thailand - constant polarisation

oh and the redshirts are not being represented - seriously ? why would a mafia/terrorist violent organisation be represented when the very existence of the NRC is to rid Thailand of same and create a fair balanced landscape with laws and reforms that make it difficult for such organisations to function

Hopefully the NRC will create a solid base for Thailand to enter into a true democracy that can not be abused or influenced by greed and those with power and money, Thailand needs to get tough on this **** if it really intends to break the historical cycle of elections - corruption and coups

Move along NRC - get it done, the few that have something to say on the matter are those that have the most to lose - politicians being a fine example

  • Like 2
Posted

This doesn't surprise me at all. Reforms seem to be one sided. Its too bad, I had hope that something good would happen. But its same Oh again. They just don't get it reforms will not work if its one sided. Didn't they learn from the past.

please explain how "reforms" can be one sided - what on earth does that mean - <snip>

  • Like 1
Posted

555 well this is a surprise. Does anyone here now seriously believe that the junta is some kind of neutral actor that could be a mediator between the Reds and the Yellows. This only confirms my suspicion that, long term, the country is heading on a direct path towards civil war.

"The peace expert said he would also be organising such events on his own, and holding brainstorming sessions on three key reform issues, namely elections, decentralisation, and political parties, from next month onwards."

- I wouldn't be surprised to see this stepped on by the junta. Especially given what happened recently with the Thammasat seminar on the 1976 massacre.

"However, Chamnan Chaneyang, independent law expert and a member of the Midnight University, said he was indifferent to the list. He said the purpose of establishing the NRC was for the National Council for Peace and Order (NCPO) to gain public approval and credibility, pointing out that the NRC would not have any real influence on the country's reform."

- But if the NRC is blatantly stacked, then it isn't going to gain much "public approval and credibility" now is it.

"The NRC is not an essential part of the country's reform because its only task is to propose a reform agenda, which will be approved by the NCPO."

- In other words, the whole NRC thing is just a charade to try and lend a veneer of legitimacy to the military regime. But I really don't understand the point of it, because I can't imagine who would get sucked in by the whole thing.

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

yeh sure just appoint Jutaporn Nattawut Thilda as heads of the NRC and get a direct skype link in so Thaksin can tell them all what to do and say

OK sorry but isn't that what this process is trying to eradicate and why there was a coup in the first place.......oh and dare I mention the stellar fiscal performance of PT and the missing billions

move along

  • Like 2
Posted

This article is pointless drivel - the very fact that the author has something to say just highlights the problem in Thailand - constant polarisation

oh and the redshirts are not being represented - seriously ? why would a mafia/terrorist violent organisation be represented when the very existence of the NRC is to rid Thailand of same and create a fair balanced landscape with laws and reforms that make it difficult for such organisations to function

Hopefully the NRC will create a solid base for Thailand to enter into a true democracy that can not be abused or influenced by greed and those with power and money, Thailand needs to get tough on this **** if it really intends to break the historical cycle of elections - corruption and coups

Move along NRC - get it done, the few that have something to say on the matter are those that have the most to lose - politicians being a fine example

A couple of points:

1) A very small percentage of red shirts have been violent, there are moderates affiliated with the group who should be included. Like it or not they have a huge amount of support, a number which you cannot just sideline by labeling them all terrorists. If you do that, next time the violence will be worse. They have to be listened to and included. Lest we forget the reason TS was able to get so much support from these people was because they felt disenfranchised and neglected, are they going to make the same mistake again?

2) You are aware how many people in the list will have been politicians in the past?

3) How is picking a heavily one sided NRC going to help the situation and prevent further coups? It is just repeating 2006 all over again.

Bring in the young modern generation, even if they have no political experience. We are going around in circles with all these old political and military geriatric dinosaurs/dynasties. The same names just come up over and over.

"one sided" to what, there is nothing political going on here (as it should be), it's about reforms to the system

and a small percentage of redshirts being violent ordered by the leadership is a very flawed way of thinking - they represent the whole organisation which is why they lost so much support

you seem to have already decided the outcome before it starts - lets give it a chance - it couldn't be any worse than it was......and that's a fact

Posted

What does "anti-PT" have t do with being anti "ordinary people". Just perhaps, there are people out there who want to support the poor, but don't necessarily support PT and they destructive populist policies.

Posted

This article is pointless drivel - the very fact that the author has something to say just highlights the problem in Thailand - constant polarisation

oh and the redshirts are not being represented - seriously ? why would a mafia/terrorist violent organisation be represented when the very existence of the NRC is to rid Thailand of same and create a fair balanced landscape with laws and reforms that make it difficult for such organisations to function

Hopefully the NRC will create a solid base for Thailand to enter into a true democracy that can not be abused or influenced by greed and those with power and money, Thailand needs to get tough on this **** if it really intends to break the historical cycle of elections - corruption and coups

Move along NRC - get it done, the few that have something to say on the matter are those that have the most to lose - politicians being a fine example

A couple of points:

1) A very small percentage of red shirts have been violent, there are moderates affiliated with the group who should be included. Like it or not they have a huge amount of support, a number which you cannot just sideline by labeling them all terrorists. If you do that, next time the violence will be worse. They have to be listened to and included. Lest we forget the reason TS was able to get so much support from these people was because they felt disenfranchised and neglected, are they going to make the same mistake again?

2) You are aware how many people in the list will have been politicians in the past?

3) How is picking a heavily one sided NRC going to help the situation and prevent further coups? It is just repeating 2006 all over again.

Bring in the young modern generation, even if they have no political experience. We are going around in circles with all these old political and military geriatric dinosaurs/dynasties. The same names just come up over and over.

"one sided" to what, there is nothing political going on here (as it should be), it's about reforms to the system

and a small percentage of redshirts being violent ordered by the leadership is a very flawed way of thinking - they represent the whole organisation which is why they lost so much support

you seem to have already decided the outcome before it starts - lets give it a chance - it couldn't be any worse than it was......and that's a fact

Nothing political, really are you that naive?

Prayuth's 'father' and the 'father' of the east tigers General Prawit was Defence Minister a few short years ago in the Democrat administration, among other rumors about the PDRC protests.

Granted it could not get much worse than what it was before, but they had a completely clean slate and can do whatever they want, yet they select the same old names and faces which rightly or wrongly due to the previous years are tainted and not seen as impartial by one side or the other.

Posted

What does "anti-PT" have t do with being anti "ordinary people". Just perhaps, there are people out there who want to support the poor, but don't necessarily support PT and they destructive populist policies.

PTP, UDD, their paid lobbyists and PR people all like to build on the myth that PTP is the party of the people, representing the poor and championing democracy.

Most people who live in Thailand, and I would suggest most foreign governments and NGOs, know that in reality it is simply a political vehicle for the Shiniwatra clan in their on going struggle with the "old guard" elite families for control of the government and the nation's wealth.

Neither side have really looked after the poor, revamped the education system, improved justice and law enforcement or sought to drastically change the feudal patronage system that allows a tiny % of people to control nearly all the wealth. It simply isn't in their interests to do so. The odd bone is thrown to the poor to keep them quiet, along with plenty of bullshit and the usual mushroom management, Certain people manage to enrich themselves, their families and their friends and allies and haven't the slightest intention of changing.

Whether the NCPO will, can, and are able to change this remains to be seen.

  • Like 1
Posted

Heavens to Murgatroyd!

Could it be that the whole setup (NCPO, NRC, PM, NLA, Constitution Committee, Interim Constitution Committee) was just intended to transition the interim military dictatorship to a permanent civilian dictatorship? Indeed, the military may have learned from its past mistakes of allowing an elected government to ever lead the country.

Who would have thought? wai2.gif

Posted

This article is pointless drivel - the very fact that the author has something to say just highlights the problem in Thailand - constant polarisation

oh and the redshirts are not being represented - seriously ? why would a mafia/terrorist violent organisation be represented when the very existence of the NRC is to rid Thailand of same and create a fair balanced landscape with laws and reforms that make it difficult for such organisations to function

Hopefully the NRC will create a solid base for Thailand to enter into a true democracy that can not be abused or influenced by greed and those with power and money, Thailand needs to get tough on this **** if it really intends to break the historical cycle of elections - corruption and coups

Move along NRC - get it done, the few that have something to say on the matter are those that have the most to lose - politicians being a fine example

A couple of points:

1) A very small percentage of red shirts have been violent, there are moderates affiliated with the group who should be included. Like it or not they have a huge amount of support, a number which you cannot just sideline by labeling them all terrorists. If you do that, next time the violence will be worse. They have to be listened to and included. Lest we forget the reason TS was able to get so much support from these people was because they felt disenfranchised and neglected, are they going to make the same mistake again?

2) You are aware how many people in the list will have been politicians in the past?

3) How is picking a heavily one sided NRC going to help the situation and prevent further coups? It is just repeating 2006 all over again.

Bring in the young modern generation, even if they have no political experience. We are going around in circles with all these old political and military geriatric dinosaurs/dynasties. The same names just come up over and over.

"one sided" to what, there is nothing political going on here (as it should be), it's about reforms to the system

and a small percentage of redshirts being violent ordered by the leadership is a very flawed way of thinking - they represent the whole organisation which is why they lost so much support

you seem to have already decided the outcome before it starts - lets give it a chance - it couldn't be any worse than it was......and that's a fact

Nothing political, really are you that naive?

Prayuth's 'father' and the 'father' of the east tigers General Prawit was Defence Minister a few short years ago in the Democrat administration, among other rumors about the PDRC protests.

Granted it could not get much worse than what it was before, but they had a completely clean slate and can do whatever they want, yet they select the same old names and faces which rightly or wrongly due to the previous years are tainted and not seen as impartial by one side or the other.

You are wrong it can and will get much worse. The road chosen is an dead end that will see this country endure much more pain. If you supress people's views long enough they have little to loose and that is extremely dangerous for longterm stability. The red shirts was born because of the oppression by the traditional elites. The only hope we have is that the political groups will unite against the junta. If this happen most of the people can unite against conservatism.

Posted

555 well this is a surprise. Does anyone here now seriously believe that the junta is some kind of neutral actor that could be a mediator between the Reds and the Yellows. This only confirms my suspicion that, long term, the country is heading on a direct path towards civil war.

"The peace expert said he would also be organising such events on his own, and holding brainstorming sessions on three key reform issues, namely elections, decentralisation, and political parties, from next month onwards."

- I wouldn't be surprised to see this stepped on by the junta. Especially given what happened recently with the Thammasat seminar on the 1976 massacre.

"However, Chamnan Chaneyang, independent law expert and a member of the Midnight University, said he was indifferent to the list. He said the purpose of establishing the NRC was for the National Council for Peace and Order (NCPO) to gain public approval and credibility, pointing out that the NRC would not have any real influence on the country's reform."

- But if the NRC is blatantly stacked, then it isn't going to gain much "public approval and credibility" now is it.

"The NRC is not an essential part of the country's reform because its only task is to propose a reform agenda, which will be approved by the NCPO."

- In other words, the whole NRC thing is just a charade to try and lend a veneer of legitimacy to the military regime. But I really don't understand the point of it, because I can't imagine who would get sucked in by the whole thing.

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

yeh sure just appoint Jutaporn Nattawut Thilda as heads of the NRC and get a direct skype link in so Thaksin can tell them all what to do and say

OK sorry but isn't that what this process is trying to eradicate and why there was a coup in the first place.......oh and dare I mention the stellar fiscal performance of PT and the missing billions

move along

The Reds would have far more chance of winning an election than these clowns, especially if they make it clear that they were in touch with Thaksin. So they must have been doing something right (maybe actually spending some taxpayer's money on the general population). Is that "what this process is trying to eradicate and why there was a coup in the first place"?

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Posted

What does "anti-PT" have t do with being anti "ordinary people". Just perhaps, there are people out there who want to support the poor, but don't necessarily support PT and they destructive populist policies.

The sentiment is a worthy one.

But these elitist groups just don't get the poor .

The greatest fault this country has , is it's treatment and indifference to the poor and the inequality .

I have been shocked by how so many rich Thais ( also their children) dismiss the poor as irrelevant and basically think they must have done something wrong to be poor.

The red shirts simply just didn't happen but you are right to be anti pt is not to not be pro- equality, pro the average working family.

I just wish more people expressed this sentiment but everything is so polarised here now.

Thank you for saying that.

Posted

please explain how "reforms" can be one sided - what on earth does that mean - <snip>

As today's front page of the Bangkok Post says: A list of mostly pro-NCPO [bangkok Elitists]

"Instead of offering solutions, the reforms (of this anti-common Thai People NRC group) would create more problems. Eventually an elected government will need to step in to solve them, after which there will be a coup, trapping the country in a vicious."

Unless of course, the Thai people from the north realize that a Royal Autonomous Northern Region is the only way they will see political and judicial equity.

Before martial law was declared, Gen Prayuth told me ‘Khun Suthep and your masses of PDRC supporters are too exhausted. It’s now the duty of the army to take over the task’, ” Mr Suthep said.

  • Like 1
Posted

This article is pointless drivel - the very fact that the author has something to say just highlights the problem in Thailand - constant polarisation

oh and the redshirts are not being represented - seriously ? why would a mafia/terrorist violent organisation be represented when the very existence of the NRC is to rid Thailand of same and create a fair balanced landscape with laws and reforms that make it difficult for such organisations to function

Hopefully the NRC will create a solid base for Thailand to enter into a true democracy that can not be abused or influenced by greed and those with power and money, Thailand needs to get tough on this **** if it really intends to break the historical cycle of elections - corruption and coups

Move along NRC - get it done, the few that have something to say on the matter are those that have the most to lose - politicians being a fine example

A couple of points:

1) A very small percentage of red shirts have been violent, there are moderates affiliated with the group who should be included. Like it or not they have a huge amount of support, a number which you cannot just sideline by labeling them all terrorists. If you do that, next time the violence will be worse. They have to be listened to and included. Lest we forget the reason TS was able to get so much support from these people was because they felt disenfranchised and neglected, are they going to make the same mistake again?

2) You are aware how many people in the list will have been politicians in the past?

3) How is picking a heavily one sided NRC going to help the situation and prevent further coups? It is just repeating 2006 all over again.

Bring in the young modern generation, even if they have no political experience. We are going around in circles with all these old political and military geriatric dinosaurs/dynasties. The same names just come up over and over.

"one sided" to what, there is nothing political going on here (as it should be), it's about reforms to the system

and a small percentage of redshirts being violent ordered by the leadership is a very flawed way of thinking - they represent the whole organisation which is why they lost so much support

you seem to have already decided the outcome before it starts - lets give it a chance - it couldn't be any worse than it was......and that's a fact

It probably will get worse. All of this is leading up to a stacked legislature before the next election. Either through pre screened candidates like Hong Kong, or military appointed representatives like burma. Either way this will ensure that only the "good" people ever have power again, regardless of voter wishes. Ultimately, voters will become frustrated and the result will be what is happening in Hong Kong right now.

  • Like 1
Posted

This article is pointless drivel - the very fact that the author has something to say just highlights the problem in Thailand - constant polarisation

oh and the redshirts are not being represented - seriously ? why would a mafia/terrorist violent organisation be represented when the very existence of the NRC is to rid Thailand of same and create a fair balanced landscape with laws and reforms that make it difficult for such organisations to function

Hopefully the NRC will create a solid base for Thailand to enter into a true democracy that can not be abused or influenced by greed and those with power and money, Thailand needs to get tough on this **** if it really intends to break the historical cycle of elections - corruption and coups

Move along NRC - get it done, the few that have something to say on the matter are those that have the most to lose - politicians being a fine example

A couple of points:

1) A very small percentage of red shirts have been violent, there are moderates affiliated with the group who should be included. Like it or not they have a huge amount of support, a number which you cannot just sideline by labeling them all terrorists. If you do that, next time the violence will be worse. They have to be listened to and included. Lest we forget the reason TS was able to get so much support from these people was because they felt disenfranchised and neglected, are they going to make the same mistake again?

2) You are aware how many people in the list will have been politicians in the past?

3) How is picking a heavily one sided NRC going to help the situation and prevent further coups? It is just repeating 2006 all over again.

Bring in the young modern generation, even if they have no political experience. We are going around in circles with all these old political and military geriatric dinosaurs/dynasties. The same names just come up over and over.

"one sided" to what, there is nothing political going on here (as it should be), it's about reforms to the system

and a small percentage of redshirts being violent ordered by the leadership is a very flawed way of thinking - they represent the whole organisation which is why they lost so much support

you seem to have already decided the outcome before it starts - lets give it a chance - it couldn't be any worse than it was......and that's a fact

It probably will get worse. All of this is leading up to a stacked legislature before the next election. Either through pre screened candidates like Hong Kong, or military appointed representatives like burma. Either way this will ensure that only the "good" people ever have power again, regardless of voter wishes. Ultimately, voters will become frustrated and the result will be what is happening in Hong Kong right now.

and any 'event' could trigger that, regretfully

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.



×
×
  • Create New...