Chinese Z Visa in Phnom Penh?

[Fullstop]

Hi...I am an Australian citizen. I'm interested in applying for a job in China. Can I apply for a Chinese Z Visa (work visa) in Phnom Penh? I'm seeing stories about having to apply in your own country...but I think that's only for certain nationalities. Going back to Australia would be a bit of a trip!

[Tomtomtom69]

I can't speak specifically for Phnom Penh but most likely the answer is yes. I applied for a Z visa last year in Bangkok and it went fine. The only condition is that the invitation letter specifically states that you are applying in Phnom Penh. That's very important because otherwise they could either refuse you and tell you to apply elsewhere (such as back home) or ask you to come back with a letter that states this.

[Fullstop]

Thanks. Aware of the "address issue" .... but apparently consuls vary from country to country so if anyone has specific info on the Chinese Consul in PP ... that's be great.

[Tomtomtom69]

Thanks. Aware of the "address issue" .... but apparently consuls vary from country to country so if anyone has specific info on the Chinese Consul in PP ... that's be great.

Well get that letter first and then try to apply and see what happens. Not much is posted about this online and Phnom Penh is not a very well known place to apply for any visas apart from Thai visas perhaps so information online will be very limited.

I suggest that if you want more specific answers you should try khmer440.com, although the information on there is not very extensive either, or perhaps Chinese-forums.com, making a post in the "visas" section. The posters there are quite reliable and will be quick to give you a response. I highly doubt anyone on Thai visa will have any experience with obtaining Chinese visas in Phnom Penh, especially not work visas. I personally have applied for a Chinese visa in Phnom Penh before, but it wasn't a work visa, it was a tourist visa and I didn't even step inside the embassy - an agent at my hotel did everything for me. All I know was that I handed my passport, a photograph and the money (express fee) to the hotel clerk at 8am, and got my passport and visa back at 5pm the same day. I didn't even fill out a form. However, the criteria for applying for a Chinese visa has tightened slightly since then but still isn't too difficult and for Z visas I think is still much the same as years ago.

For Z visa applications express service should also be available, but this depends on your nationality. Some don't get rush service and have to wait 4 days (i.e. you receive your passport back on the third day after application), others are luckier and get it back the same day or the following day.

I don't think residency would be required for applying for a Z visa in Phnom Penh. But here's a hint just in case. Anyone can get "residency" in Cambodia by entering on an ordinary visa (now US$35, up from US$25 since October 1st) and then converting it to a 6-month or 1-year multiple entry extension of stay for just under US$300. Although unless you are certain that they require residency in this form, I wouldn't bother going about doing this, but it's certainly a more convenient option than going back home to apply for a visa. But as I said I doubt it's required, especially not for a Z visa, which means you are leaving whatever country you are applying in to live and work in China, thus meaning there's no reason for you to go back to said country (in theory). When I applied for my Z visa last July in Bangkok, I was in Thailand on a 30-day stamp too.

[TheSiemReaper]

Officially you are supposed to get a z-visa from your country of origin. Unofficially the only Western nation for which this is always true is France. The French upset the Chinese a while back and have been sent home to do their visas ever since...

If you can get the right invitation letter; it is very likely that they will process the application in Phnom Penh - there are plenty of people in Cambodia who get their z-visas and head to China.

However, having lived in China for 3 years - I can promise you that it's just about the worst place to work in Asia and the hardest place to live in Asia for foreigners - and my wife is Chinese. If you've heard that it's the land of milk and honey; think again.

[Fullstop]

I suggest that if you want more specific answers you should try khmer440.com

Been a member there for a couple of years. No info there.

perhaps Chinese-forums.com, making a post in the "visas" section

Thanks. I'll try there.

I don't think residency would be required for applying for a Z visa in Phnom Penh. But here's a hint just in case. Anyone can get "residency" in Cambodia by entering on an ordinary visa

My research so far confirms I do need to be "resident". Already extended my 30 day Ordinary to six months. Pick up this Friday.

If you can get the right invitation letter; it is very likely that they will process the application in Phnom Penh - there are plenty of people in Cambodia who get their z-visas and head to China........However, having lived in China for 3 years - I can promise you that it's just about the worst place to work in Asia and the hardest place to live in Asia for foreigners - and my wife is Chinese. If you've heard that it's the land of milk and honey; think again.

Is that hearsay or have you actually known people who have done so? A firm "Yes or No" to this question would pretty much answer my main question in this thread.

My ex wife is Chinese, I lived in Guangzhou for a year, can speak Mandarin enough to get by and I hear where you're coming from. But I'm the adventurous/gypsy type. I just want to try Beijing for a year or two.

[Tomtomtom69]

Officially you are supposed to get a z-visa from your country of origin. Unofficially the only Western nation for which this is always true is France. The French upset the Chinese a while back and have been sent home to do their visas ever since...

If you can get the right invitation letter; it is very likely that they will process the application in Phnom Penh - there are plenty of people in Cambodia who get their z-visas and head to China.

However, having lived in China for 3 years - I can promise you that it's just about the worst place to work in Asia and the hardest place to live in Asia for foreigners - and my wife is Chinese. If you've heard that it's the land of milk and honey; think again.

That's debatable and very much subjective, depending on the individual.

If you can speak the language or are willing to learn, plus if you engage the locals you'll probably find China is actually one of the better places for expats to live in Asia (well, with the exception of air pollution in Beijing for example). In my opinion it's possible to integrate more easily into Chinese society, provided you are willing to learn the language and cultural nuisances and all, compared to say Thailand or Cambodia, where so few foreigners speak the language and various policies (particularly in Thailand) sort of combine to make expats permanently feel like outsiders. However, China also makes the assumption that if you are coming to live there, you will eventually become fluent in the language and adapt to it's ways.

Thailand and Cambodia never make such assumptions - in both countries you are treated like a tourist even if you have lived there for 20 years and are fluent in the language - the burden of proof is always on you to prove your bona fides, i.e. language ability and visa status etc. if necessary to be treated more as a local and not ripped off or have food made for tourist palates. But in tourist areas this can still be a difficult endeavour. Also, both countries make the assumption that "once a foreigner, always a foreigner" and thus everything from restaurants that make food "less spicy" to foreigners demanding more comfortable "western-style" apartments, food, ways of travelling and things they are used to in the west are assumed. There is no assumption that foreigners will ever go "local" in that their language abilities, habits, etc. will become like that of locals and nobody ever seems to get upset if Mr. Jones still can't string out more than beer bar Thai or Cambo after 25 years of continuous residence.

In that sense both Thailand and Cambo are much easier places to live, if you're looking for the conveniences of home at a lower cost. There will be more people who can speak English (even if it's not always the best, especially in Thailand), more imported food and more restaurants serving foreign cuisine and therefore there's less of a need to integrate than in China.

I have lived in both China and in Thailand and also spent a good deal of time in Cambodia, having travelled there many times. I have good friends in both countries (Thailand and China). While it might take longer to get to know Chinese people, my experience is that they are more keen to get to know you, stay in touch, help you out etc. once they know you than Thais are. Thai friends eventually tend to disappear after a while for no apparent reason, but Chinese friends are always waiting for you if you ever come back, even if it's just for a visit.

Chinese are more business like, Thais can come off as being a bit more immature and playful easy to befriend initially, but difficult to get to know intimately.

Each to their own I think.

[TheSiemReaper]

Officially you are supposed to get a z-visa from your country of origin. Unofficially the only Western nation for which this is always true is France. The French upset the Chinese a while back and have been sent home to do their visas ever since...

If you can get the right invitation letter; it is very likely that they will process the application in Phnom Penh - there are plenty of people in Cambodia who get their z-visas and head to China.

However, having lived in China for 3 years - I can promise you that it's just about the worst place to work in Asia and the hardest place to live in Asia for foreigners - and my wife is Chinese. If you've heard that it's the land of milk and honey; think again.

That's debatable and very much subjective, depending on the individual.

If you can speak the language or are willing to learn, plus if you engage the locals you'll probably find China is actually one of the better places for expats to live in Asia (well, with the exception of air pollution in Beijing for example). In my opinion it's possible to integrate more easily into Chinese society, provided you are willing to learn the language and cultural nuisances and all, compared to say Thailand or Cambodia, where so few foreigners speak the language and various policies (particularly in Thailand) sort of combine to make expats permanently feel like outsiders. However, China also makes the assumption that if you are coming to live there, you will eventually become fluent in the language and adapt to it's ways.

Thailand and Cambodia never make such assumptions - in both countries you are treated like a tourist even if you have lived there for 20 years and are fluent in the language - the burden of proof is always on you to prove your bona fides, i.e. language ability and visa status etc. if necessary to be treated more as a local and not ripped off or have food made for tourist palates. But in tourist areas this can still be a difficult endeavour. Also, both countries make the assumption that "once a foreigner, always a foreigner" and thus everything from restaurants that make food "less spicy" to foreigners demanding more comfortable "western-style" apartments, food, ways of travelling and things they are used to in the west are assumed. There is no assumption that foreigners will ever go "local" in that their language abilities, habits, etc. will become like that of locals and nobody ever seems to get upset if Mr. Jones still can't string out more than beer bar Thai or Cambo after 25 years of continuous residence.

In that sense both Thailand and Cambo are much easier places to live, if you're looking for the conveniences of home at a lower cost. There will be more people who can speak English (even if it's not always the best, especially in Thailand), more imported food and more restaurants serving foreign cuisine and therefore there's less of a need to integrate than in China.

I have lived in both China and in Thailand and also spent a good deal of time in Cambodia, having travelled there many times. I have good friends in both countries (Thailand and China). While it might take longer to get to know Chinese people, my experience is that they are more keen to get to know you, stay in touch, help you out etc. once they know you than Thais are. Thai friends eventually tend to disappear after a while for no apparent reason, but Chinese friends are always waiting for you if you ever come back, even if it's just for a visit.

Chinese are more business like, Thais can come off as being a bit more immature and playful easy to befriend initially, but difficult to get to know intimately.

Each to their own I think.

I honestly can't disagree with you more than I do. I've lived and worked all over the world (including in Nigeria and Saudi Arabia) and I've never been anywhere less hospitable or less pleasant to be than China. It was and is awful. The Chinese are on the whole the most rude and disagreeable people I have ever encountered. The filth and pollution is overwhelming. The lack of English skills baffling at times (I don't expect everyone to speak English but I do expect those who work serving solely English speaking customers to do so). The food comes in two flavours; bland and bland with chili. (Prior to moving to China, Chinese was my favorite food in the world - now I flinch whenever I see a Chinese restaurant).

Visas are ridiculous, according to Chinese law because my spouse is Chinese I should be able to get a long stay visa (non-working); in reality during 3 years I lived there they refused to issue those visas to anyone because of the events they were hosting (Olympics through to Shenzhen Universiade Games). So I was stuck on business visas, fleeing the country every 30-60 days despite being there legitimately.

I did make Chinese friends but I don't find them any more (or less) attentive than friends from other parts of the world.

And I'm not sure how being deprived of your own culture or being forced to learn a language translates as "more enjoyable". That sounds like masochism to me. I do speak some Mandarin, some Arabic, some Thai, and even some Khmer but none of them in huge volumes. I don't expect to stay anywhere for 20-30 years and the universal language is now English - that's a done deal. So I'll continue to learn to give directions to taxi, order food and beer, and then pretty much skip the rest. I have better things to do with my time than learn languages to brag about learning them.

[TheSiemReaper]

@ Fullstop

It's a firm, yes it's possible and no, it's not guaranteed. I know people who have done it, 100% from Phnom Penh. But this is China we're talking about and goal posts, rules, etc. change daily.

[Tomtomtom69]

Officially you are supposed to get a z-visa from your country of origin. Unofficially the only Western nation for which this is always true is France. The French upset the Chinese a while back and have been sent home to do their visas ever since...

If you can get the right invitation letter; it is very likely that they will process the application in Phnom Penh - there are plenty of people in Cambodia who get their z-visas and head to China.

However, having lived in China for 3 years - I can promise you that it's just about the worst place to work in Asia and the hardest place to live in Asia for foreigners - and my wife is Chinese. If you've heard that it's the land of milk and honey; think again.

That's debatable and very much subjective, depending on the individual.

If you can speak the language or are willing to learn, plus if you engage the locals you'll probably find China is actually one of the better places for expats to live in Asia (well, with the exception of air pollution in Beijing for example). In my opinion it's possible to integrate more easily into Chinese society, provided you are willing to learn the language and cultural nuisances and all, compared to say Thailand or Cambodia, where so few foreigners speak the language and various policies (particularly in Thailand) sort of combine to make expats permanently feel like outsiders. However, China also makes the assumption that if you are coming to live there, you will eventually become fluent in the language and adapt to it's ways.

Thailand and Cambodia never make such assumptions - in both countries you are treated like a tourist even if you have lived there for 20 years and are fluent in the language - the burden of proof is always on you to prove your bona fides, i.e. language ability and visa status etc. if necessary to be treated more as a local and not ripped off or have food made for tourist palates. But in tourist areas this can still be a difficult endeavour. Also, both countries make the assumption that "once a foreigner, always a foreigner" and thus everything from restaurants that make food "less spicy" to foreigners demanding more comfortable "western-style" apartments, food, ways of travelling and things they are used to in the west are assumed. There is no assumption that foreigners will ever go "local" in that their language abilities, habits, etc. will become like that of locals and nobody ever seems to get upset if Mr. Jones still can't string out more than beer bar Thai or Cambo after 25 years of continuous residence.

In that sense both Thailand and Cambo are much easier places to live, if you're looking for the conveniences of home at a lower cost. There will be more people who can speak English (even if it's not always the best, especially in Thailand), more imported food and more restaurants serving foreign cuisine and therefore there's less of a need to integrate than in China.

I have lived in both China and in Thailand and also spent a good deal of time in Cambodia, having travelled there many times. I have good friends in both countries (Thailand and China). While it might take longer to get to know Chinese people, my experience is that they are more keen to get to know you, stay in touch, help you out etc. once they know you than Thais are. Thai friends eventually tend to disappear after a while for no apparent reason, but Chinese friends are always waiting for you if you ever come back, even if it's just for a visit.

Chinese are more business like, Thais can come off as being a bit more immature and playful easy to befriend initially, but difficult to get to know intimately.

Each to their own I think.

I honestly can't disagree with you more than I do. I've lived and worked all over the world (including in Nigeria and Saudi Arabia) and I've never been anywhere less hospitable or less pleasant to be than China. It was and is awful. The Chinese are on the whole the most rude and disagreeable people I have ever encountered. The filth and pollution is overwhelming. The lack of English skills baffling at times (I don't expect everyone to speak English but I do expect those who work serving solely English speaking customers to do so). The food comes in two flavours; bland and bland with chili. (Prior to moving to China, Chinese was my favorite food in the world - now I flinch whenever I see a Chinese restaurant).

Visas are ridiculous, according to Chinese law because my spouse is Chinese I should be able to get a long stay visa (non-working); in reality during 3 years I lived there they refused to issue those visas to anyone because of the events they were hosting (Olympics through to Shenzhen Universiade Games). So I was stuck on business visas, fleeing the country every 30-60 days despite being there legitimately.

I did make Chinese friends but I don't find them any more (or less) attentive than friends from other parts of the world.

And I'm not sure how being deprived of your own culture or being forced to learn a language translates as "more enjoyable". That sounds like masochism to me. I do speak some Mandarin, some Arabic, some Thai, and even some Khmer but none of them in huge volumes. I don't expect to stay anywhere for 20-30 years and the universal language is now English - that's a done deal. So I'll continue to learn to give directions to taxi, order food and beer, and then pretty much skip the rest. I have better things to do with my time than learn languages to brag about learning them.

Well as I said before, each to their own. It sounds to me that you'd rather live somewhere where being an outsider is more accepted. If that is so, then clearly Thailand and Cambodia are such countries. As mentioned already China expects (even demands) a certain level of integration because getting by with just English or expecting them to do things the "international" way is not going to cut it.

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China expects (even demands) a certain level of integration because getting by with just English or expecting them to do things the "international" way is not going to cut it.

I think that's fair enough. Most western countries like their migrants to integrate. Even though it wasn't necessary in Thailand... I still made an effort. Learnt to read, write and speak fairly well; Lived in non farang areas,participated in local events etc. To me it's all part of the "adventure"

Anyway...thanks to an ex Chinese wife I already have a head start on the language. I don't think life in China is going to be too much of a shock to me.

EDIT

...but after 2 weeks here in Cambodia I'm falling in love with the place. I just may stay here...which will make this thread moot. The acts of kindness and helpfulness I've experienced here in just 2 weeks has far outstripped anything I experienced in 7 years in Thailand. But that's a story for another thread.