Most community leaders support impeachment cases: survey

[Jumper]

I find it interesting that these polls never publish their error bounds. It makes one wonder about the discipline of the process. Having studied the technical issues of surveys (as part of an MBA program), I have some understanding of the things that can go wrong. Polls are basically applied statistics, and as Mark Twain (Samuel Clemons) once said: there are liars, damn liars and statisticians.

But let's just assume for the moment that these results can be believed, and that the community leaders are expressing the general feelings within their communities.

That would leave a sizable minority who do not believe that the impeachment processes should go forward or that officials should be punished for the rice pledging scheme.

Many TVF posters during the last administration were complaining that Democracy should not be about the "tyranny of the majority". Even if a government won a majority vote (which actually PTP may not have), that did not give them the right to do as they please. I think they were correct in those feelings, and I think the same standard should be applied here.

The issues in proceeding in this situation are obvious to me. The nation is deeply divided on these issues, and without first generating more of a consensus (dealing seriously with opposing views), pressing forward on these issues will only result in more turmoil in the end.

I personally think that both of these issues should be pressed forward, but only after some effort to build the required consensus.

[robblok]

These polls here are as valid as those polls that ran during the YL administration. Any poll that runs can be made to show what the people paying for the poll wants.

I doubt the previous government did it any different.

[robblok]

I find it interesting that these polls never publish their error bounds. It makes one wonder about the discipline of the process. Having studied the technical issues of surveys (as part of an MBA program), I have some understanding of the things that can go wrong. Polls are basically applied statistics, and as Mark Twain (Samuel Clemons) once said: there are liars, damn liars and statisticians.

But let's just assume for the moment that these results can be believed, and that the community leaders are expressing the general feelings within their communities.

That would leave a sizable minority who do not believe that the impeachment processes should go forward or that officials should be punished for the rice pledging scheme.

Many TVF posters during the last administration were complaining that Democracy should not be about the "tyranny of the majority". Even if a government won a majority vote (which actually PTP may not have), that did not give them the right to do as they please. I think they were correct in those feelings, and I think the same standard should be applied here.

The issues in proceeding in this situation are obvious to me. The nation is deeply divided on these issues, and without first generating more of a consensus (dealing seriously with opposing views), pressing forward on these issues will only result in more turmoil in the end.

I personally think that both of these issues should be pressed forward, but only after some effort to build the required consensus.

Nice.. but actually its not up to the public to tell the courts what to do. The courts should check if the law is broken and apply it to culprits. (in an ideal world).

[Jumper]

I find it interesting that these polls never publish their error bounds. It makes one wonder about the discipline of the process. Having studied the technical issues of surveys (as part of an MBA program), I have some understanding of the things that can go wrong. Polls are basically applied statistics, and as Mark Twain (Samuel Clemons) once said: there are liars, damn liars and statisticians.

But let's just assume for the moment that these results can be believed, and that the community leaders are expressing the general feelings within their communities.

That would leave a sizable minority who do not believe that the impeachment processes should go forward or that officials should be punished for the rice pledging scheme.

Many TVF posters during the last administration were complaining that Democracy should not be about the "tyranny of the majority". Even if a government won a majority vote (which actually PTP may not have), that did not give them the right to do as they please. I think they were correct in those feelings, and I think the same standard should be applied here.

The issues in proceeding in this situation are obvious to me. The nation is deeply divided on these issues, and without first generating more of a consensus (dealing seriously with opposing views), pressing forward on these issues will only result in more turmoil in the end.

I personally think that both of these issues should be pressed forward, but only after some effort to build the required consensus.

Nice.. but actually its not up to the public to tell the courts what to do. The courts should check if the law is broken and apply it to culprits. (in an ideal world).

Robb, I understand that. Two points, however: first the impeachment (accusation) process is a political process in the NLA, not the courts and second we are dealing with a deeply divided nation whose rifts need to be healed.

I'm certainly not supportive of an amnesty, but I also think there is no need to rush to judgement on the issues of legal culpability or liability. Those issues can always be pressed forward and an effort to build consensus and understanding among the population about why they need to be pressed forward would be effort well spent.

[FangFerang]

Dave..... My.... mind is going......

Daisy.....day...zee......give me............your......................answerrrrrrrrrrrrrr..............................................do.......

[Commerce]

An opinion survey by Thai Researchers in Community Happiness Association .............

It doesn't get more pathetic. No need for further comment.

[EnglishJohn]

I can just imagine the red shirt poll "up country" and the response from a man behind a buffalo (because he is still to poor to buy a tractor) if he supports impeachment.

"What does impeachment mean"

When the majority reach 93% support for the Junta they are dismissed with comparisons to North Korea as it does not suit the 7%'ers agenda. Dismissing the majority.

When the majority (not a 43 "very small majority" like the 2010 elections mind you which ironically some have suggested is an overwhelming majority!) offer 54% support for impeachment they are dismissed by stating a belief that "no one outside Bangkok believes it". Dismissing the majority.

Under yingluck and 12 months ago when the majority (yes, yes, even the red shirts) suggested they were strongly against the amnesty bill they were dismissed because it did not suit the PTP agenda who went on to vote 310 - 0 for the amnesty bill. Dismissing the majority.

9 months ago when the majority suggested the rice scheme had no corruption in it they are heralded as gospel because it did suit the PTP agenda. Listening to the majority.

18 months ago when the polls suggested the amnesty would bring country wide reconciliation they are heralded as gospel because it did suit the PTP agenda. Listening to the majority.

So the comments are more agenda based from the results of the polls and that will decide if the polls (i.e. the majority) are to be respected. When it is 93% support they denounce because the % is just too high. When the % is low, but still a majority, evolved excuses beliefs come to the forte.

It seems some 7% supporters are such a confused bunch and are so bitter and unable to respect the majority they can no longer use facts anymore and fall back onto sarcasm and smart ass comments that remind me of the last gasps of a man drowning in the pool of accountability.

I pity them.

The majority have spoken and unlike the guy that can't swim I do respect that majority instead of making excuses to denounce them.

PS The rice scheme does have corruption in it.

PSS The amnesty bill did not bring reconciliation.

After a while, you spot these traits in red-shirt comments here and Bangkok Post. The ignore any facts which don't suit them and their arguments are more like spoilt schoolboy rants than anything logical. I eventually arrived at the conclusion that they all have big chips on their shoulders because they believe everyone in Bangkok is 'rich elite'. They wish someone would take that money off those elite and give it to them. They don't care about right and wrong, they just want to get something for nothing. Reminds me of the drunk who went to my GF's parents house and demanded they give him some money because he saw a farang in the family. The problem is that the more you try to understand them, the lower your opinion gets as the benefit of the doubt is removed.

[ginjag]

How do they get away with this nonsense! no one (outside of Bangkok) believes it so why does the junta keep producing these bogus surveys?

THEY are ALL bogus surveys if you do not agree with them. If the surveys were showing a minority, you would say they were for real and cheer them on.

I actually do not go along with most of the polls---I didn't with Yingluck, whether they were in her favour or not. But the PM will never be the flavor of the month with most---BUT at the minute most are going along with the ride---like it or lump it.

[Robespiere]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

How do they get away with this nonsense! no one (outside of Bangkok) believes it so why does the junta keep producing these bogus surveys?

A fair few on here believe it absolutely. "Against stupidity the gods themselves fail to contend."

Well robespiere I guess this is like when yingluck, against all data produced by her own government which said food pieces / daily stapes etc were rising strongly the lady said publically, 'prices have not gone up, it's all in your mind'.

?

[ginjag]

An opinion survey by Thai Researchers in Community Happiness Association .............

It doesn't get more pathetic. No need for further comment.

I do not always go along with Thai polls, but it is pathetic if YOU want it to be-

Suggestion you go out and do a spot check poll over most counties, you may find at the minute they are not that far out------with no guns at their heads as some posters believe.

Some are that OTT that you have to believe to go to Tesco guns are aimed at you, and sticky tape is at the ready-----OMG.

[Alwyn]

I can just imagine the red shirt poll "up country" and the response from a man behind a buffalo (because he is still to poor to buy a tractor) if he supports impeachment.

"What does impeachment mean"

When the majority reach 93% support for the Junta they are dismissed with comparisons to North Korea as it does not suit the 7%'ers agenda. Dismissing the majority.

When the majority (not a 43 "very small majority" like the 2010 elections mind you which ironically some have suggested is an overwhelming majority!) offer 54% support for impeachment they are dismissed by stating a belief that "no one outside Bangkok believes it". Dismissing the majority.

Under yingluck and 12 months ago when the majority (yes, yes, even the red shirts) suggested they were strongly against the amnesty bill they were dismissed because it did not suit the PTP agenda who went on to vote 310 - 0 for the amnesty bill. Dismissing the majority.

9 months ago when the majority suggested the rice scheme had no corruption in it they are heralded as gospel because it did suit the PTP agenda. Listening to the majority.

18 months ago when the polls suggested the amnesty would bring country wide reconciliation they are heralded as gospel because it did suit the PTP agenda. Listening to the majority.

So the comments are more agenda based from the results of the polls and that will decide if the polls (i.e. the majority) are to be respected. When it is 93% support they denounce because the % is just too high. When the % is low, but still a majority, evolved excuses beliefs come to the forte.

It seems some 7% supporters are such a confused bunch and are so bitter and unable to respect the majority they can no longer use facts anymore and fall back onto sarcasm and smart ass comments that remind me of the last gasps of a man drowning in the pool of accountability.

I pity them.

The majority have spoken and unlike the guy that can't swim I do respect that majority instead of making excuses to denounce them.

PS The rice scheme does have corruption in it.

PSS The amnesty bill did not bring reconciliation.

Respect the majority you say? I whole heartedly agree. Which is why when a government elected by a majority is taken down by a military coup i have to say I don't like it. I'm sure you must agree, right?

[ginjag]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

How do they get away with this nonsense! no one (outside of Bangkok) believes it so why does the junta keep producing these bogus surveys?

A fair few on here believe it absolutely. "Against stupidity the gods themselves fail to contend."

Well robespiere I guess this is like when yingluck, against all data produced by her own government which said food pieces / daily stapes etc were rising strongly the lady said publically, 'prices have not gone up, it's all in your mind'.

?

These were pre written by her brother, he had no idea he was half a world away. When did Yingluck ever go out to the local market shopping ha ha 555.

[Robespiere]

The people that should be punished are the government officials that were required to monitor the rice deposits. Along with the people that profited illegally from the scheme.

The above headlines and the statistics from "community leaders" have no real value in opinion as they are harvested from a biases group.

The thing I don’t get is why is there this camouflage to promote hatred? Why not prosecute?

To just say it was the politicians is a scandal? The fact of the matter is that there were a number of people involved and these are the real culprits.

The problem is, that some of those culprits are proudly wearing their yellow shirt and are classified as "the good people"!!

Of course.. yellow are the good people the winner, they out thought and outmaneuvered the criminal from Dubai. However those that were involved should should be punished.

No, the Yellows just have the guns and a facade to hide behind.

Those with the guns will always be against the people in this land, but the facade is about to experience a seismic change.

You gotta pay more attention to the long game robblok.

Vive la Shinawatra.

[Robespiere]

Well robespiere I guess this is like when yingluck, against all data produced by her own government which said food pieces / daily stapes etc were rising strongly the lady said publically, 'prices have not gone up, it's all in your mind'.

?

These were pre written by her brother, he had no idea he was half a world away. When did Yingluck ever go out to the local market shopping ha ha 555.

Geez, you guys struggle so hard with actual events, facts and, well, basically reality.

[ginjag]

I can just imagine the red shirt poll "up country" and the response from a man behind a buffalo (because he is still to poor to buy a tractor) if he supports impeachment.

"What does impeachment mean"

When the majority reach 93% support for the Junta they are dismissed with comparisons to North Korea as it does not suit the 7%'ers agenda. Dismissing the majority.

When the majority (not a 43 "very small majority" like the 2010 elections mind you which ironically some have suggested is an overwhelming majority!) offer 54% support for impeachment they are dismissed by stating a belief that "no one outside Bangkok believes it". Dismissing the majority.

Under yingluck and 12 months ago when the majority (yes, yes, even the red shirts) suggested they were strongly against the amnesty bill they were dismissed because it did not suit the PTP agenda who went on to vote 310 - 0 for the amnesty bill. Dismissing the majority.

9 months ago when the majority suggested the rice scheme had no corruption in it they are heralded as gospel because it did suit the PTP agenda. Listening to the majority.

18 months ago when the polls suggested the amnesty would bring country wide reconciliation they are heralded as gospel because it did suit the PTP agenda. Listening to the majority.

So the comments are more agenda based from the results of the polls and that will decide if the polls (i.e. the majority) are to be respected. When it is 93% support they denounce because the % is just too high. When the % is low, but still a majority, evolved excuses beliefs come to the forte.

It seems some 7% supporters are such a confused bunch and are so bitter and unable to respect the majority they can no longer use facts anymore and fall back onto sarcasm and smart ass comments that remind me of the last gasps of a man drowning in the pool of accountability.

I pity them.

The majority have spoken and unlike the guy that can't swim I do respect that majority instead of making excuses to denounce them.

PS The rice scheme does have corruption in it.

PSS The amnesty bill did not bring reconciliation.

Respect the majority you say? I whole heartedly agree. Which is why when a government elected by a majority is taken down by a military coup i have to say I don't like it. I'm sure you must agree, right?

Taken down by it's own people, then finished off by it's own army. Elected does not give anyone power to flout the law,---they found that out the hard way.

[jcsmith]

I actually do not go along with most of the polls---I didn't with Yingluck, whether they were in her favour or not. But the PM will never be the flavor of the month with most---BUT at the minute most are going along with the ride---like it or lump it.

THEY are ALL bogus surveys if you do not agree with them. If the surveys were showing a minority, you would say they were for real and cheer them on.

I'd guess it has more to do with the fact that the people running these polls started up just before the coup and were formed by military tied individuals, and each of their polls deals with community leaders.

[Robespiere]

These polls here are as valid as those polls that ran during the YL administration. Any poll that runs can be made to show what the people paying for the poll wants.

I doubt the previous government did it any different.

The previous government did it very differently on 6 consecutive occasions.

The polls were called elections and they won them all handily.

[Mudcrab]

An opinion survey by Thai Researchers in Community Happiness Association .............

It doesn't get more pathetic. No need for further comment.

Promise?...you'll never comment on TV ever again?

[ginjag]

Well robespiere I guess this is like when yingluck, against all data produced by her own government which said food pieces / daily stapes etc were rising strongly the lady said publically, 'prices have not gone up, it's all in your mind'.

?

These were pre written by her brother, he had no idea he was half a world away. When did Yingluck ever go out to the local market shopping ha ha 555.

Geez, you guys struggle so hard with actual events, facts and, well, basically reality.

HaHa you mean a photo op--------who picks up a glass jar and is not looking, what is in the basket----wow "hey big spender"---a load of old cods if you believe she went out shopping that day and was caught on camera.

Please don't let yourself be fooled.

She was hardly in the country never mind local shopping--her son was being cared for not by her--the country was making decisions by her brother.

Now you come along with a JOKE post.

[Baerboxer]

I wonder if anyone takes surveys seriously here. Size of respondent group and who they were? Without the details; results of surveys are worthless.

Remember, there are lies, damn lies and statistics!

[brucec64]

The people that should be punished are the government officials that were required to monitor the rice deposits. Along with the people that profited illegally from the scheme.

The above headlines and the statistics from "community leaders" have no real value in opinion as they are harvested from a biases group.

The thing I don’t get is why is there this camouflage to promote hatred? Why not prosecute?

To just say it was the politicians is a scandal? The fact of the matter is that there were a number of people involved and these are the real culprits.

The problem is, that some of those culprits are proudly wearing their yellow shirt and are classified as "the good people"!!

Of course.. yellow are the good people the winner, they out thought and outmaneuvered the criminal from Dubai. However those that were involved should should be punished.

It takes thinking and maneuvering to win an election. Using brute force to take power does not.

[ginjag]

I actually do not go along with most of the polls---I didn't with Yingluck, whether they were in her favour or not. But the PM will never be the flavor of the month with most---BUT at the minute most are going along with the ride---like it or lump it.

THEY are ALL bogus surveys if you do not agree with them. If the surveys were showing a minority, you would say they were for real and cheer them on.

I'd guess it has more to do with the fact that the people running these polls started up just before the coup and were formed by military tied individuals, and each of their polls deals with community leaders.

OK so what your saying is every government has it's own pollsters. The feeling at this minute (apart from minority TVF posters) is that all is far from well--as expected BUT not all that bad .....

[ginjag]

The people that should be punished are the government officials that were required to monitor the rice deposits. Along with the people that profited illegally from the scheme.

The above headlines and the statistics from "community leaders" have no real value in opinion as they are harvested from a biases group.

The thing I don’t get is why is there this camouflage to promote hatred? Why not prosecute?

To just say it was the politicians is a scandal? The fact of the matter is that there were a number of people involved and these are the real culprits.

The problem is, that some of those culprits are proudly wearing their yellow shirt and are classified as "the good people"!!

Of course.. yellow are the good people the winner, they out thought and outmaneuvered the criminal from Dubai. However those that were involved should should be punished.

It takes thinking and maneuvering to win an election. Using brute force to take power does not.

I'll definitely go along with the maneuvering.-------PTP amnesty---and Yingluck pulling a fast one to keep it alive.

[Commerce]

An opinion survey by Thai Researchers in Community Happiness Association .............

It doesn't get more pathetic. No need for further comment.

Promise?...you'll never comment on TV ever again?

Nope. Live with it or learn to cope with truth.

[ginjag]

An opinion survey by Thai Researchers in Community Happiness Association .............

It doesn't get more pathetic. No need for further comment.

Promise?...you'll never comment on TV ever again?

Nope. Live with it or learn to cope with truth.

What's the truth 7 % ??

[robblok]

I find it interesting that these polls never publish their error bounds. It makes one wonder about the discipline of the process. Having studied the technical issues of surveys (as part of an MBA program), I have some understanding of the things that can go wrong. Polls are basically applied statistics, and as Mark Twain (Samuel Clemons) once said: there are liars, damn liars and statisticians.

But let's just assume for the moment that these results can be believed, and that the community leaders are expressing the general feelings within their communities.

That would leave a sizable minority who do not believe that the impeachment processes should go forward or that officials should be punished for the rice pledging scheme.

Many TVF posters during the last administration were complaining that Democracy should not be about the "tyranny of the majority". Even if a government won a majority vote (which actually PTP may not have), that did not give them the right to do as they please. I think they were correct in those feelings, and I think the same standard should be applied here.

The issues in proceeding in this situation are obvious to me. The nation is deeply divided on these issues, and without first generating more of a consensus (dealing seriously with opposing views), pressing forward on these issues will only result in more turmoil in the end.

I personally think that both of these issues should be pressed forward, but only after some effort to build the required consensus.

Nice.. but actually its not up to the public to tell the courts what to do. The courts should check if the law is broken and apply it to culprits. (in an ideal world).

Robb, I understand that. Two points, however: first the impeachment (accusation) process is a political process in the NLA, not the courts and second we are dealing with a deeply divided nation whose rifts need to be healed.

I'm certainly not supportive of an amnesty, but I also think there is no need to rush to judgement on the issues of legal culpability or liability. Those issues can always be pressed forward and an effort to build consensus and understanding among the population about why they need to be pressed forward would be effort well spent.

Personally i feel that she should be impeached, it was not included in the budget, they tried to strong-arm everyone who came out with data that said it cost money (remember it was self financing and not included int he budget).

Had it included in the budget I would have been more OK with it. (they did not want this because they had already the max deficit allowable)

The reds will never agree to an impeachment because she is their hero.

[robblok]

The people that should be punished are the government officials that were required to monitor the rice deposits. Along with the people that profited illegally from the scheme.

The above headlines and the statistics from "community leaders" have no real value in opinion as they are harvested from a biases group.

The thing I don’t get is why is there this camouflage to promote hatred? Why not prosecute?

To just say it was the politicians is a scandal? The fact of the matter is that there were a number of people involved and these are the real culprits.

The problem is, that some of those culprits are proudly wearing their yellow shirt and are classified as "the good people"!!

Of course.. yellow are the good people the winner, they out thought and outmaneuvered the criminal from Dubai. However those that were involved should should be punished.

It takes thinking and maneuvering to win an election. Using brute force to take power does not.

No elections only need vote buying with a rice scheme and other things that now burden the country. The yellows overcame bombings and attacks like Trad (slaughter of children by red-shirts applauded on stage by red-shirts) and helped to depose of the corrupt goverment.

People like Charlem actively helped those red terrorist and liked the bombing telling the protesters to go home for their own safety. But in the end the army saved the day and deposed of the former government.

Though I like this, I can't say that I am happy with everything they have done, but i guess even redshirts are not happy with everything their previous government has done.

[Tchooptip]

George Orwell and Aldous Huxley would have found a rich vein of material in the Thailand of 2014.

Maybe Groucho Marks too?

[Alwyn]

I can just imagine the red shirt poll "up country" and the response from a man behind a buffalo (because he is still to poor to buy a tractor) if he supports impeachment.

"What does impeachment mean"

When the majority reach 93% support for the Junta they are dismissed with comparisons to North Korea as it does not suit the 7%'ers agenda. Dismissing the majority.

When the majority (not a 43 "very small majority" like the 2010 elections mind you which ironically some have suggested is an overwhelming majority!) offer 54% support for impeachment they are dismissed by stating a belief that "no one outside Bangkok believes it". Dismissing the majority.

Under yingluck and 12 months ago when the majority (yes, yes, even the red shirts) suggested they were strongly against the amnesty bill they were dismissed because it did not suit the PTP agenda who went on to vote 310 - 0 for the amnesty bill. Dismissing the majority.

9 months ago when the majority suggested the rice scheme had no corruption in it they are heralded as gospel because it did suit the PTP agenda. Listening to the majority.

18 months ago when the polls suggested the amnesty would bring country wide reconciliation they are heralded as gospel because it did suit the PTP agenda. Listening to the majority.

So the comments are more agenda based from the results of the polls and that will decide if the polls (i.e. the majority) are to be respected. When it is 93% support they denounce because the % is just too high. When the % is low, but still a majority, evolved excuses beliefs come to the forte.

It seems some 7% supporters are such a confused bunch and are so bitter and unable to respect the majority they can no longer use facts anymore and fall back onto sarcasm and smart ass comments that remind me of the last gasps of a man drowning in the pool of accountability.

I pity them.

The majority have spoken and unlike the guy that can't swim I do respect that majority instead of making excuses to denounce them.

PS The rice scheme does have corruption in it.

PSS The amnesty bill did not bring reconciliation.

Respect the majority you say? I whole heartedly agree. Which is why when a government elected by a majority is taken down by a military coup i have to say I don't like it. I'm sure you must agree, right?

Taken down by it's own people, then finished off by it's own army. Elected does not give anyone power to flout the law,---they found that out the hard way.

Taken down by a violent minority of anarchists you mean, paving the way for the military coup.

[JOC]

An editorial in BP today asked the question:

Almost 6 months and what?

A very good question. You supporters of the general, please explain to me, what the coup-makers have accomplished in their almost 6 months in power?? Starting from the 22nd of May, so no posts with: "but YL" "but Thaksin"

What exactly has the general and his men done to make Thailand a better place for everyone, reds, yellows, expats and investors??