Work Permit and Location

[BlackJack]

Please all of the armchair Lawyers out there - DON'T hijack this topic and please try to stay on the topic.

The work permit (English translation) states that the WP is attached to the company and the WP is attached to the WP's company location.

Are you still with me?

Therefore, the foreigner with the WP can only work in the location where the company is registered. ie as it is written the WP holder cannot work outside the 4 walls or the grounds of the registered company.

So how can the holder of the WP work outside?

ie a real estate agent, a developer, a journalist, at an exhibition, giving a talk at the expats club, import export etc.etc.

Interested to hear your comments as I thought if you had a WP you could work outside as long as you had your WP on you and that it was on or associated with the company business that the WP is registered to.

[ubonjoe]

The work permit can be issued or even changed to allow you to work at more than one location.

To add a work place a WP6 if filed. http://wp.doe.go.th/wp/images/form/Form_tt6_area.pdf

[BlackJack]

so what your saying is that every time a real estate agent goes out to show a customer a unit, house or land they need a WP6?

[ubonjoe]

The work permit can be endorsed such that it states your work requires you to work at different locations as needed.

[BritManToo]

so what your saying is that every time a real estate agent goes out to show a customer a unit, house or land they need a WP6?

Real estate agent is a prohibited job for foreigners.

They can be owners or office managers for the company BUT,

If they are showing buyers property, they are breaking the law.

[BlackJack]

so what your saying is that every time a real estate agent goes out to show a customer a unit, house or land they need a WP6?

Real estate agent is a prohibited job for foreigners.

They can be owners or office managers for the company BUT,

If they are showing buyers property, they are breaking the law.

thanks but this is obvious

I used that as an example

The focus of this thread is not being fixed to a "location"

I have many friends that need to work in different places as required. However this is not allowed.

ie. a man has a WP and sends students to the UK for higher education. He must visit many schools and Uni's in different provinces in Thailand. By going to different provinces and meeting (working) with educational institutions he is technically breaking the Law.

There are 100's of jobs like this and so the WP laws need upgrading to allow people to move around and do work associated with their company.

It is not possible to list all the possible places that work will be done on the WP6 form.

So I would like this thread to focus on this anomaly in the WP Laws and if anyone has the same issues.

[ubonjoe]

As I wrote before a work permit can be issued that states a persons job requires them to work at various different locations. They do not have to be listed.

[BlackJack]

My runner is on the way to the labor dept now to see what the precise thai wording in the WP should be. I thank you for your assistance to date

[stevenl]

so what your saying is that every time a real estate agent goes out to show a customer a unit, house or land they need a WP6?

Real estate agent is a prohibited job for foreigners.

They can be owners or office managers for the company BUT,

If they are showing buyers property, they are breaking the law.

thanks but this is obvious

I used that as an example

The focus of this thread is not being fixed to a "location"

I have many friends that need to work in different places as required. However this is not allowed.

ie. a man has a WP and sends students to the UK for higher education. He must visit many schools and Uni's in different provinces in Thailand. By going to different provinces and meeting (working) with educational institutions he is technically breaking the Law.

There are 100's of jobs like this and so the WP laws need upgrading to allow people to move around and do work associated with their company.

It is not possible to list all the possible places that work will be done on the WP6 form.

So I would like this thread to focus on this anomaly in the WP Laws and if anyone has the same issues.

See UJ's answer in post #7. Diveinstructors here work in the diveshops, pools and boats, and if worded correctly in the workpermit this is allowed.

[ubonjoe]

A post containing quotes without reference to the original posts has been removed. Please try again but remember the max number of quotes is 4.

[SteveB2]

As I wrote before a work permit can be issued that states a persons job requires them to work at various different locations. They do not have to be listed.

Agreed - but careful about long term duties at 'another location' - the following hapened to me...

Background:-

Head office and WP originaly issued for Koh Samui, Suratthani

Temporary Work duties in Chonburi and the Gulf of Siam added into WP.

History:-

Temporary work duties in Chonburi extend - after several random labor office audits every few weeks, local officials insist I open a branch office, because the 'add another location' WP option is not valid for near permanent working at one of the other locations, although they would not give an exact time limit.

So, in accordance with their advice, another branch office location was added in Chonburi, with clients billed from the head office in Suratthani.

Chonburi tax office eventually figure this out, and state they don't like this state of affairs because they don't get any tax - summoned to a meeting with the tax office.

Sorting it out:-

Chonburi tax office state literally in the meeting that 'they are jealous' that all my tax goes to Surathani and nothing comes to Chonburi - but eventually agree to allow the end of year tax go to Surathani as long as they get the PP30 monthly VAT.

But then insist that the VAT is backdated 6 months to the beginning of the year so as to include a hefty 40% fine up near 100,000 Baht.

Conclusions

Spurious tax fine paid, tax office Hawaiian shirt guys and gals move on to the next farang shake down, & life goes on as normal. T.I.T.

[BlackJack]

Interesting post - thanks

I am working on the WP6 form however the questions seem strangely translated as soon as I get the exact Thai wording I will post.

[Satcommlee]

Most people don't worry about it..

I am one, I have worked at many places outside my area including government departments etc..

If you have a work permit saying you are confined to an office in Bangkok but are then found to be working in for example a customer facing role in Pattaya then that may be a no no..

The stipulation is there as in instrument to tackle blatant abuse - and the penalties for not complying with the location directive are not the same as those for working without a work permit..

As the above post clearly implies... to try and do it right is more hassle than it is worth - I'd rather risk the maximum 10K fine.

Edited November 26, 2014 by Satcommlee

[wow64]

That's a good question.

On my WP it only has my head office.

But I could be at a few sites.

Never thought about it.

If there is a fine.. work can pay it.

[thedemon]

Most people don't worry about it..

I am one, I have worked at many places outside my area including government departments etc..

If you have a work permit saying you are confined to an office in Bangkok but are then found to be working in for example a customer facing role in Pattaya then that may be a no no..

The stipulation is there as in instrument to tackle blatant abuse - and the penalties for not complying with the location directive are not the same as those for working without a work permit..

As the above post clearly implies... to try and do it right is more hassle than it is worth - I'd rather risk the maximum 10K fine.

I think you are right. For some reason I have in my mind that the maximum penalty for working outside the terms of your work permit is a 20k fine but it might be 10k.

In any case, since the maximum penalty is only a fairly small fine and not imprisonment, as it is for no WP at all, then the opportunities for extortion are far less. Therefore the chance of being targeted are correspondingly less.

[thedemon]

Both the Australian and the New Zealand Free Trade Agreements contain a reference to employees of companies set up under an FTA being able to apply for a WP that enables them to work anywhere in Thailand.

However I have no idea whether any such WP has ever been issued. Sometimes those agreements are signed by the Minister of Commerce and Foreign Affairs but then other ministries don't feel bound by them.

[Soutpeel]

Most people don't worry about it..

I am one, I have worked at many places outside my area including government departments etc..

If you have a work permit saying you are confined to an office in Bangkok but are then found to be working in for example a customer facing role in Pattaya then that may be a no no..

The stipulation is there as in instrument to tackle blatant abuse - and the penalties for not complying with the location directive are not the same as those for working without a work permit..

As the above post clearly implies... to try and do it right is more hassle than it is worth - I'd rather risk the maximum 10K fine.

The key is to what is in the job description, my WP doesn't restrict me, it has words to the effect of working at country wide locations

[BlackJack]

Both the Australian and the New Zealand Free Trade Agreements contain a reference to employees of companies set up under an FTA being able to apply for a WP that enables them to work anywhere in Thailand.

However I have no idea whether any such WP has ever been issued. Sometimes those agreements are signed by the Minister of Commerce and Foreign Affairs but then other ministries don't feel bound by them.

thanks for that

it is broad in that it it states Australia and Thailand as the territories and in Thailand they talk about provinces

I am still checking on the Thai wording that will allow me to work in any territory.

I found this interesting though as its about Tourism which is on the no no list of jobs foreigners can do -

Tourism and Travel Related Services

• Under the Travel Agency and Tourist Guide Business B.E. 2535 (1992), foreign equity participation in a travel agency and tourist guide business must less than 49 percent and number of foreign shareholders must less than 50 percent of the total number of shareholders.

However, this is not the area of work I will be doing.

[thedemon]

Both the Australian and the New Zealand Free Trade Agreements contain a reference to employees of companies set up under an FTA being able to apply for a WP that enables them to work anywhere in Thailand.

However I have no idea whether any such WP has ever been issued. Sometimes those agreements are signed by the Minister of Commerce and Foreign Affairs but then other ministries don't feel bound by them.

thanks for that

it is broad in that it it states Australia and Thailand as the territories and in Thailand they talk about provinces

I am still checking on the Thai wording that will allow me to work in any territory.

I found this interesting though as its about Tourism which is on the no no list of jobs foreigners can do -

Tourism and Travel Related Services

• Under the Travel Agency and Tourist Guide Business B.E. 2535 (1992), foreign equity participation in a travel agency and tourist guide business must less than 49 percent and number of foreign shareholders must less than 50 percent of the total number of shareholders.

However, this is not the area of work I will be doing.

Here is the relevant section of the Thai-NZ FTA.

Temporary Entry for New Zealand Business People to Thailand.pdf

Can't locate the Thai-Aust one right now but I'm pretty sure it contains similar wording.

[BlackJack]

Yes I found the Australian FTA and I will apply to the Labour Department to add different work to my WP and add that the territory that I work in needs to be flexible and not reported each time I go outside the office or into another province. I have to renew my WP Jan 2015 and thanks to Ubonjoe I have the correct forms.

Thank you to all.

[BlackJack]

My runner is on the way to the labor dept now to see what the precise thai wording in the WP should be. I thank you for your assistance to date

hello

the Labor Dept has stated that I cannot work in another location

I explained to them that I wasnt working at another branch and that I needed to work in different locations.

Maybe its what is listed on my work permit that is making it difficult to work in other areas.

If someone reads Thai can they tell me what my WP says under

permitted category of work

nature of work

title occupation profession

conditions

as if I have to change these with a WP6 then it has to be soon

thanks

[Soutpeel]

My runner is on the way to the labor dept now to see what the precise thai wording in the WP should be. I thank you for your assistance to date

hello

the Labor Dept has stated that I cannot work in another location

I explained to them that I wasnt working at another branch and that I needed to work in different locations.

Maybe its what is listed on my work permit that is making it difficult to work in other areas.

If someone reads Thai can they tell me what my WP says under

permitted category of work

nature of work

title occupation profession

conditions

as if I have to change these with a WP6 then it has to be soon

thanksworkpermit.jpg

I think you will find the problem is in what is written in your job description your company gave the DOL nots what written in the WP per se.

[BlackJack]

probably

but thats what a WP6 form is for as it states theres a change in the nature of work and location etc.

so I want to see whats written in the WP so I can address this issue with them