Adjustable bike shocks for dummies.

[Shurup]

Ok, I confess, I'm a dummy. Never have had anything with adjustable shocks (not talking about spring preload) up until now. All my bikes' suspension performed well the way it was.

Picked up a Ducati Diavel today and could feel every road bump on my arse while riding it out of BKK to moo ban near Korat. Halfway from BKK I pulled over to the side of the road to try to make the ride smoother. Cranked the rear shock all the way to the softest setting and that made quite a difference.

So can someone please explain me when and how to adjust the shocks properly?

My weight is 85 kg or about 187 lbs, if that is of any help.

[Hili]

A proper setup is quite complex you cant just crank the rear open and don't touch the front. Normally you start from the factory setting 1-2 clicks soft/hard then it also depends which settings your shocks do allow. The best is try until you find your best feel as everybody's preference, weight etc differs then again depending in riding style and roads

For a basic setup while standing you can find guides on youtube. From there you can also start to play.

Edited December 4, 2014 by Hili

[dave_boo]

Here's a good youtube video on the subject:

[Shurup]

YouTube videos would have to wait until I get back to work where I would have a faster Internet connection, I run out of data on my mobile already, it's unlimited but at the turtle speed now.

@Hili Ok so if I start from factory and do 1-2 clicks (there are no clicks on this rear shock but we could say 1-2 full turns), how do I know when to stop? How is it supposed to feel when it's too hard or too soft?

[yankee99]

YouTube videos would have to wait until I get back to work where I would have a faster Internet connection, I run out of data on my mobile already, it's unlimited but at the turtle speed now.

@Hili Ok so if I start from factory and do 1-2 clicks (there are no clicks on this rear shock but we could say 1-2 full turns), how do I know when to stop? How is it supposed to feel when it's too hard or too soft?

Although what hilli says might work you should do it properly as the front forks need to be set together with the rear. It takes 2 people and yourself but isnt that complicated. Lots of good youtube videos.

[dave_boo]

The 'measure the sag' method is the best anyone can tell you without being there and adjusting it with you until it meets what you like.

Generally 30mm of sag front and rear is what's recommended for street riding. If I were you, I'd adjust the rear to that, then adjust the front to the same. Take it for a spin and see if it is what you like. From there add or subtract until you get what fits your riding habits.

[dave_boo]

Also, check out this thread:

http://www.diavel-forum.com/index.php?/topic/5891-setting-up-stock-suspension/

[Shurup]

@dave_boo Ok I can try that, get someone to help me measure the sag.

But I'm still confused about how should it feel when it's too soft/hard. I guess if the ride is too bumpy, it is to hard, but how does it feel when it's too soft?

From the other treads I remember reading people complained about the Yamaha MT-09 being too soft and it was advised to modify the stock suspension at the first opportunity. How does sit feel when it's too soft? How is the handling affected by too soft (or too hard) setting.

This is my 4th bike that I own now, I have a Dirtbike yamaha WR450 (which I can't say is too hard or too sort as riding it off road, everything feels bumpy), then there's a Ninja 300 and a Yamaha Dragstar 400 and like I said I have no complains about how they perform in stock. But the Diavel was too bumpy out the door, just trying to set it up right.

[dave_boo]

@dave_boo Ok I can try that, get someone to help me measure the sag.

But I'm still confused about how should it feel when it's too soft/hard. I guess if the ride is too bumpy, it is to hard, but how does it feel when it's too soft?

From the other treads I remember reading people complained about the Yamaha MT-09 being too soft and it was advised to modify the stock suspension at the first opportunity. How does sit feel when it's too soft? How is the handling affected by too soft (or too hard) setting.

This is my 4th bike that I own now, I have a Dirtbike yamaha WR450 (which I can't say is too hard or too sort as riding it off road, everything feels bumpy), then there's a Ninja 300 and a Yamaha Dragstar 400 and like I said I have no complains about how they perform in stock. But the Diavel was too bumpy out the door, just trying to set it up right.

Ever ride in a Cadillac? That's the definition of too soft.

Forks/shocks bottoming out is the ultimate too soft setting. Basically, if you're not getting some feedback from the road it's too soft. Is it too soft for you? I can't say; but if the softness of the suspension has the bike doing things without telling you than I would definitely firm it up.

From reading around; it looks like the biggest problem with the Diavel is the front end; it's really stiff and rebound isn't as good as it should be. Follow that thread I posted earlier and see if you can get your stuff sorted out.

[Shurup]

Also, check out this thread:

http://www.diavel-forum.com/index.php?/topic/5891-setting-up-stock-suspension/

Ok this is very informative, thanks will finish reading it tomorrow or the day after. Also I better study the MOM before playing with adjustments any further, there seems to be more shock settings to play with than I thought.

[dave_boo]

Also, check out this thread:

http://www.diavel-forum.com/index.php?/topic/5891-setting-up-stock-suspension/

Ok this is very informative, thanks will finish reading it tomorrow or the day after. Also I better study the MOM before playing with adjustments any further, there seems to be more shock settings to play with than I thought.

Have fun....there are 3 settings to play with that can go either way (so really 6 settings). They also interact with each other to an extent...so it's a bit overwhelming.

I'm sure you'll handle it just fine though.

[seedy]

Compression damping is the suspensions resistance to being compressed, like when you hit a bump.

Rebound damping is the resistance of the shock to extend by the action of the spring once it has been compressed.

All loads are carried by the spring, the damping just stops the spring from being compressed too quickly or returning to its static state after being compressed.

The ultimate setting, in terms of full suspension travel usage, is to adjust compression damping until it very occasionally bottoms - and only then that it bottoms gently, not hammers the bike.

Compression damping adjustment so that after compression the shock does not return to its static state too quickly or too slowly.

What was said above will get you started re: sag. If the adjustments will not give you the ride you want, changes must he made. Where these are needed is dependant on what it is doing - or not doing.

[mania]

Hey congrats on the new!

Hope you have many enjoyable safe rides

About suspension as others have mentioned setting sag is where you start.

That way the bike is set for you & not some hypothetical general setting........

BUT......... Here is the thing the bike is new & you have no real data/feedback on what it does, under various scenarios

like hard braking cornering etc. or what its general handling characteristics are.

Sag is fine to set anyway but really do not go too far with settings yet

Just ride it......break it in........get use to it & its handling characteristics.

Then when you make changes you will realize what has happened & if it is something you agree with or not

depending mainly on your style of riding how hard you push in turns, your braking style etc etc etc

Good Luck & congrats again on the new ride

Edited December 4, 2014 by mania

[dave_boo]

Compression damping is the suspensions resistance to being compressed, like when you hit a bump.

Rebound damping is the resistance of the shock to extend by the action of the spring once it has been compressed.

All loads are carried by the spring, the damping just stops the spring from being compressed too quickly or returning to its static state after being compressed.

The ultimate setting, in terms of full suspension travel usage, is to adjust compression damping until it very occasionally bottoms - and only then that it bottoms gently, not hammers the bike.

Compression damping adjustment so that after compression the shock does not return to its static state too quickly or too slowly.

What was said above will get you started re: sag. If the adjustments will not give you the ride you want, changes must he made. Where these are needed is dependant on what it is doing - or not doing.

Pretty good description. I didn't want to overwhelm him so I tried to keep it basic.

You also forgot about preload. That's usually the method to prevent bottoming; although the compression damping also plays a part. Setting the preload so that you can just bottom it and then adjusting the compression so that you can almost bottom the fork/shock is the best practice.

There was also a slight typo in your post. You said "Compression damping adjustment so that after compression the shock does not return to its static state too quickly or too slowly." As you had previously stated the correct definition of rebound damping, I'm not saying you're wrong, just letting the OP know of the correct term.

The interaction between compression and rebound damping can be observed on ripples. If the compression is set too 'hard', the bike will skip over these ripples. Set too 'soft' and it will keep compressing to a point that it loses travel. The rebound settings can either be too 'hard' where it acts like a pogo stick amplifying the effects of the ripples or too 'soft' where it doesn't allow the fork to return to approximately the static state.

Note that 'soft' and 'hard' are used in reverse (kinda of like how 'tall' gearing is actual a lower ratio) as you're describing the end effect. Setting the fork's travel to a slower rate actually decreases the rate that the oil flows through orifices--this ensures the spring doesn't compress or extend as quickly as more force has to be used to move the oil.

[Nickymaster]

@dave_boo Ok I can try that, get someone to help me measure the sag.

But I'm still confused about how should it feel when it's too soft/hard. I guess if the ride is too bumpy, it is to hard, but how does it feel when it's too soft?

From the other treads I remember reading people complained about the Yamaha MT-09 being too soft and it was advised to modify the stock suspension at the first opportunity. How does sit feel when it's too soft? How is the handling affected by too soft (or too hard) setting.

This is my 4th bike that I own now, I have a Dirtbike yamaha WR450 (which I can't say is too hard or too sort as riding it off road, everything feels bumpy), then there's a Ninja 300 and a Yamaha Dragstar 400 and like I said I have no complains about how they perform in stock. But the Diavel was too bumpy out the door, just trying to set it up right.

Also check your tyre pressure. It will help a lot with the bumpiness. In Thailand they have a habit of over inflating the tires. It is fairly easy to adjust the preload on that bike. The back has a remote adjuster. The front you just need a large key the turn the large nut. Do some reading and it will all become clear. You start by setting up its sag. Adjust it first for one person. With the adjuster you just increase the preload a bit once you have a passenger. Trial and error. Leave the front and remember the back preload settings.

Try finding someone who has experience with adjusting suspension. Many know how to do. If I would live near to you I could help you.

Edited December 4, 2014 by Nickymaster

[Shurup]

Also check your tyre pressure. It will help a lot with the bumpiness. In Thailand they have a habit of over inflating the tires. It is fairly easy to adjust the preload on that bike. The back has a remote adjuster. The front you just need a large key the turn the large nut. Do some reading and it will all become clear. You start by setting up its sag. Adjust it first for one person. With the adjuster you just increase the preload a bit once you have a passenger. Trial and error. Leave the front and remember the back preload settings.

Try finding someone who has experience with adjusting suspension. Many know how to do. If I would live near to you I could help you.

To bad I don't know of anyone else with a big bike in my area. Where do you live?

I kind of got an idea what I need to do. Better read the manual 1st so I know how to adjust things. Would start after the 1st service so I know how the bike feels and if the changes I make are making my ride better.

Thanks all who replied, very helpful!

[seedy]

Thanks Dave - typo for sure. Ting Tong !

[BKKBike09]

@dave_boo Ok I can try that, get someone to help me measure the sag.

But I'm still confused about how should it feel when it's too soft/hard. I guess if the ride is too bumpy, it is to hard, but how does it feel when it's too soft?

From the other treads I remember reading people complained about the Yamaha MT-09 being too soft and it was advised to modify the stock suspension at the first opportunity. How does sit feel when it's too soft? How is the handling affected by too soft (or too hard) setting.

Lots of good advice here already. Nickymaster's point about tyre pressures is a good one: before you do anything to your suspension, make sure you know what tyre pressures you're running and how different pressures affect handling. After trying various combos I find 33 front / 37 rear works well for me on my FZ-09 (recommended is 36/42).

Another good tip is to put a zip tie around a front fork leg. That gives you a very good indication as to how much fork travel you're using.

On the FZ-09 for me, at 85kg, the stock suspension was indeed too soft at the front. Nothing much you can do about that because the problem lies with the springs, which are not very stiff. At the same time the rear shock has quite weak rebound damping and a very stiff spring, so there's an inherent imbalance in the suspension.

I've put stiffer springs at the front (9.0 N/mm from stock 7.35 N/mm), with heavier weight oil (10W from 0W), and have an Ohlins shock which has a slighter less stiff spring (95 N/mm from 100 N/mm). Net result is that the front and rear response is much more in sync and the ride is waaaay better. The bike tracks over rough surfaces with confidence. However, the trade-off on the -09 is that the ride is also a good deal firmer and since neither my forks nor shock have compression adjustment there's not a great deal I can do about that (although having the seat remodeled helped).

If you're going to fiddle with your suspension settings do make sure to have a pen and paper handy to write things down! And when you adjust, start from a reference of say full out so that you know where you started from when adding say 9 clicks of rebound or whatever.

[garryjohns]

A mate has just gone through all this to get it right

He refered me to this site>>took him a while to set his up but is now happy with his bike;

My view is >.set it and forget it and get out and ride.

http://www.gostar-racing.com/club/motorcycle_suspension_set-up.htm

[BKKBike09]

OP - you might find these simple explanations from Ohlins of some help (this also being one of various different ways to set sag).

[ll2]

If your teeth is shaking, it is hard. If the bike wallows it is soft.

Only you can figure it out. Depends on how your body reacts and your riding style etc.

[garryjohns]

If your teeth is shaking, it is hard. If the bike wallows it is soft.

Only you can figure it out. Depends on how your body reacts and your riding style etc.

Starting first of course by checking tyre pressures ,as you said earlier.

Incorrect inflation can cause far more problems than shocks finetuning can ever overcome.

Suspension settings are very much up to the individuals personal preferences and the only way to get it right is by perseverence.

For the average road rider i really think that these huge amounts of variable adjustments are overkill.

Each to their own.