Inquest of Derby man found dead in Koh Tao

[DavidBonnie]

'Gingar dai tong'

Is an expression that translates as 'dragon who can have/wear gold medallion'

An apt expression for the people who rule Koh Tao as it is used to signify a terrible animal that is cruel and brutish and has wealth enough to buy lots of gold but is so vulgar it neither realises it's own vulgarity or cares how it gets it's wealth.

[razer]

Thai authorities won't cooperate with British police? Why won't they cooperate?

[DennisF]

Thai authorities won't cooperate with British police? Why won't they cooperate?

Maybe you should ask them direct, they are not responding to UK police.

[longtom]

Why still talk about a 50m fall - pure speculation from the police without any evidence therefore worthless.

That leaves open only 3 other possble scenarios, accident or murder/manslaughter (dismissing suicide).

Since the RTP failed to gather any additonal evidence and the autopsies did not yield a conclusive result, only a witness could provide more information. For different reasons we all know that this seems very unlikely.

Also all speculations are futile.

Another victim of RTP ineptitude and disregard.

My deepest condolences to the family and friends.

[ggt]

Good Luck with that...this is Thailand...no one gets to the truth on almost any subject...much less a highly publicized death...

[ffaarraanngg]

As sad as it is to say, but its probably better the police weren't interested as if they did bother themselves all theyd have done was stitch up a Burmese worker or 2 and another life would be ruined.

As from the morning of the David and Hannah death the police stated a Thai could not possibly have done such a thing.

Thailand is a 3rd world country with a 3rd world mentality and legal system, if you go there you must accept this is how it is and won't change no matter how many shopping centres they build.

[CapeThai]

Maybe I'm the only one who actually read the article. The pathologists said he had a blood alcohol level over 230mg/l . The drunk driving limit in the UK is 80 mg/l so she says.

He was pretty wasted by any measure.

Is it beyond the realms of possibility that he was just plain wasted and fell down the cliff??

Why do we keep seeing conspiracy theories instead of looking at the hard rational facts.

Young people get drunk/stoned and through whatever mechanism of misadventure unfortunately end up dead.

I'm the first to admit, 'there goes I but for the Grace of God',...etc that I made it through to a mature life...though I am puzzled how sometimes due some of the sh!t I did in a younger life.

And I guess many TV members will concur.

Best time to do some one in when they're drunk. What are you suggesting, that the drunk are invincible, that being drunk and getting murdered can't happen on the same night? Why be so one dimensional?

I'll leave the best time to murder someone thing up to you.

I have no knowledge of either the best time or physiological condition to do the heinous deed. I don't watch a lot of television.

What I do know is human nature.

It would not at all surprise me if the young man went to bed..as said by his father..and then decided to go and party again. I would.

And then consequently fell down the cliff.

It's not hard to do in unfamiliar territory, especially drunk.

Almost did it myself on my bucks night..Only fell 5 meters thank god...could have been fatal though. The drop was a lot more than 50m overall.

Don't forget a 50m cliff doesn't imply a sheer drop.

Just fall and bounce, which I understand is consistent with the British pathologists report.

Not all of our little darlings are really little darlings we think they are away from home.

Not all of our little darlings are really little darlings we think they are away from home.

Yeah SPOT ON, I certainly was NO darling at that age but I took my money and phone along when I went for seconds at the party........ and would neither forget my baseball cap if I were starting to show baldness at that age. All these items was still in his bungalow so maybe your missing the point mate.

[changsinghleo]

I'm wondering if Thais are tourists on the island? I should think not as they are very much inclined to fear ghosts and one can be certain ghosts are gathered there in droves. Even myself, as a farang, would not deliberately take myself somewhere where

ghosts gather. It's not like it's the only island in Thailand. I remember seeing photos of this location which pointed out that if someone toppled down that cliff he'd still not be in the water. Too many mysteries about the place, it's inhabitants, etc.

Give me Jomtien or Phuket even in a pinch. Anything anywhere, other than 'The Island Of Death'! And yes, I do doubt the place

being called 'Turtle Island' is the more deserved name. At least not in it's present state of fright.

[ThaiUser]

Nothing is said about the friends and family and how much alcohol they had consumed and how reliable their testimonies have been.

Well then, knowing several of the individuals personally, I will "say something".

At least one of the group is a non-drinker who was completely sober throughout.

The others had been drinking but were by no means drunk.

And they were all sober the following morning when they inspected the cabin, the grass around it and tried (unsuccessfully) to get the police to investigate.

I find the insinuation that his friends and family are "unreliable" in their testimonies to be quite offensive. They have made every effort to be factual, and would be more than glad to have their doubts removed/suspicions disproved.

I might add, theirs are the only statements that there are to go by, given the lack of police investigation.

Well then, since you know several of the individuals personally, it must add weight to your comments as it puts you right into the front position of the hearsay line. It doesn’t matter if one within the group is a non-drinker who was completely sober throughout. Throughout what is the question? Throughout when the victim was ‘murdered’ or when the victim had an ‘accident’ or was he not present at that location at the time?

If there is an insinuation that his friends and family are “unreliable” it certainly hasn’t been raised in my comment. There was a simple question asked, which is based on two different accounts given in two different papers. He was last seen at about 1am when put to bed and according to the coroner he was last seen at 2am. The pathologist saying that the injuries are most unlikely to have been cause by an assault with the mother explaining that he was assaulted and after that probably killed. If one is not allowed to question that, fine but to lament that the forensic experts (all sober ) the next morning inspected the cabin and the grass surrounding the cabin suggest that they knew by that time what had happened or why should they inspect the grass when looking for someone? In there pursuit for justice they might have destroyed the forensic evidence that was available at that time.

Any forensic police officer can tell you that by running over an alleged crime scene doing your private investigation contaminates in most cases the evidence that was left behind. If you are interested I can get you in contact with a Chief Inspector in CID in the UK that might explain to you how a forensic investigation is conducted or with a senior forensic officer at Perth police in Australia.

I might add that I have read two articles about the case with statements from the pathologist and from the mother which don’t match. I have read that the ‘victim’ had high content of alcohol in his blood and that there was nobody present as far as witnesses go that can describe how he died. What I find offensive is that you seem to think that because of your connection to the family and friends you are the judge how the case should be investigated and who is telling the truth. Maybe you should take a step back and read the articles speak to the parents and try to sort out where and when the confusion was introduced, but most of all get the pathologist thrown out since he is contradicting the mother.

But since that wouldn’t fit into your picture it is easier to put the blame in front of the RTP because it suits more your theories even if it doesn’t match the facts released until now.

[Sheryl]

I have not advanced any "theory" as to what happened. I have said, repeatedly, that we do not know and likely never will.

It is quite common for news articles to mix up details e.g. 1 Am, 2AM.

You seem to be under the incorrect impression that the police investigated this and found it to be an accidental death. The whole point is that they did not investigate, at all. For which I do indeed find fault.

[berybert]

Maybe I'm the only one who actually read the article. The pathologists said he had a blood alcohol level over 230mg/l . The drunk driving limit in the UK is 80 mg/l so she says.

He was pretty wasted by any measure.

Is it beyond the realms of possibility that he was just plain wasted and fell down the cliff??

Why do we keep seeing conspiracy theories instead of looking at the hard rational facts.

Young people get drunk/stoned and through whatever mechanism of misadventure unfortunately end up dead.

I'm the first to admit, 'there goes I but for the Grace of God',...etc that I made it through to a mature life...though I am puzzled how sometimes due some of the sh!t I did in a younger life.

And I guess many TV members will concur.

Are you for real ? 80 mg/l is about a pint/liter of beer. So do tell me how many people you know who get wasted on 3 pints/liters of beer ?

Would you fall off a cliff after 3 pints of beer after you had already gone to bed for the night ?

And there but for the grace of god ? You cancelled the holiday to Khao Tao ?

[ThaiUser]

I have not advanced any "theory" as to what happened. I have said, repeatedly, that we do not know and likely never will.

It is quite common for news articles to mix up details e.g. 1 Am, 2AM.

You seem to be under the incorrect impression that the police investigated this and found it to be an accidental death. The whole point is that they did not investigate, at all. For which I do indeed find fault.

I am under no impression as I only have read the news articles. According to that the RTP has send a report to the British police. That they haven't investigated the incident at all is put here first and a RTP officer should have right to reply here. Better would have been to asked the RTP prior before claiming that no investigation has taken place. That certainly would have cleared it up.

You also stated that "theirs are the only statements that there are to go by". Now look at the statement the pathologist made and what the mother implies.

[Sawan Chan 7]

Tourists should avoid going to stay on this death-island, think twice before going!

No, tourists should just be wise enough to not mess with the local mafia. If you keep to yourself and away from bars and drugs it's a wonderful island.

Tourists dies everywhere. How many tourists die in LA for example every day and do people stop going there?

[berybert]

Tourists should avoid going to stay on this death-island, think twice before going!

No, tourists should just be wise enough to not mess with the local mafia. If you keep to yourself and away from bars and drugs it's a wonderful island.

Tourists dies everywhere. How many tourists die in LA for example every day and do people stop going there?

That's really rather a funny comment.

Don't worry about going to an island that is controlled by the mafia, just make sure you don't upset them.

Cheers matey.

Wise words indeed.

[sambum]

"The Thai authorities are keeping quiet and will not cooperate with the British police, which is very frustrating for us"

What a surprise! Sounds like more of the "same same" Koh Tao story. Maybe they are not cooperating with the British Police because they are still wondering what the UK inquest might yet come up with regarding the murder of the 2 backpackers? Or possibly they have been told by someone to "say nowt, and here's some money for a cup of tea"!

[Kooweerup]

The mafia on Koh Tao needs to rein themselves in. A few more Brit deaths there will be

the absolute end of tourism. With the death hotel in Chiang Mai, their solution was to

demolish the hotel. But I think Koh Tao is too big to demolish......

A few more deaths of any Nationality will probably do it.

[cookee68]

The culprits behind this murder (IMO) could very well be the same, who killed Hannah and David!!

And no, they are not from Myanmar!!

Says who

[fey]

This was the guy, who according to the RTP fell of a cliff 50 meters into sea and drowned.

Despite the 50 meter fall, there was not a scratch on his body!!

Another fine piece of investigative work by the RTP!!

Or in other words, another case of sweeping under the carpet, what really happened!!

why would he have scratches if he fell off an ocean shelf?

[ksamuiguy]

Lot's of deaths in Koh Tao over the years, possible Serial Killer?

[ffaarraanngg]

Tourists should avoid going to stay on this death-island, think twice before going!

No, tourists should just be wise enough to not mess with the local mafia. If you keep to yourself and away from bars and drugs it's a wonderful island.

What a silly thing to say.

If I lined up 10 Thais could you distinguish which ones are connected and can get away with murder?

[fullcave]

Lawless thats what is happening

That's what you get when you don't punish 'elite" criminals

Murder, rape and extortion...

Welcome to Koh Tao

What on earth is happening in Koh Tao ?

Yes, I only wish the military would go in and clean up that discusting rat hole. Maybe it's too much to ask.

[fareastguy]

What on earth is happening in Koh Tao ?

What's happening in Koh Tao is a familiar story of Thailand's resort areas in general... it goes a bit like this:

From the beginning>>>

Someone finds a nice quiet beach & calls it "paradise"

instead of keeping quiet and enjoying it they tell they're friends & blog about it, very soon it's all over the internet.

Thousands more come to have a look, seeing the interest the natives move in for the kill, open up the usual array of restaurants,bars & knocking shops

once established as a place to make money they're quickly followed by the mafia & the Bib who take over!

Lawlessness ensues so then the dregs of society move in, fueled by alcohol, drugs & greed death will soon follow!!

In my humble experience when you call somewhere paradise you can soon kiss it goodbye !!

Moral of this story:

If you find a stretch of paradise, open a good book, put your feet up & keep your mouth shut!!!

[Soutpeel]

Tourists should avoid going to stay on this death-island, think twice before going!

No, tourists should just be wise enough to not mess with the local mafia. If you keep to yourself and away from bars and drugs it's a wonderful island.

Tourists dies everywhere. How many tourists die in LA for example every day and do people stop going there?

Go on then humour TV how many legitimate tourists die everyday in LA and please use a verifiable source on google and don't pull numbers out your bottom please

Let's say for the period 2012-2013 how many tourist did die everyday in LA ?

[jpeg]

This was the guy, who according to the RTP fell of a cliff 50 meters into sea and drowned.

Despite the 50 meter fall, there was not a scratch on his body!!

Another fine piece of investigative work by the RTP!!

Or in other words, another case of sweeping under the carpet, what really happened!!

So there is a cover-up because he had no "scratches", OK.

From the article you didn't even bother to read:

"He said: “There were some bruises on his face. He could have fell, bumped, or been assaulted. From a pathologist’s point of view, his injuries are not from an assault but I can’t rule it out.”

He said a lot of the injuries had occurred after his death."

And right on cue comes our resident (possibly quite literally) Koh Tao apologist.

Right on cue you attack the poster instead of addressing the post.

Because ... There are certain posters on this forum who can be counted upon to post with an agenda therefore rendering their views ignorant at best or self-interested, worst. You're one of them. Blocked.

Edited December 21, 2014 by jpeg

[catweazle]

Unfortunately, the parents will never find out the truth, but is good to see that at least they are pushing for it. Better than parents of kids slaughtered on that god-forsaken island who claim to be satisfied with the official version that screams, "Stitchup, coverup, liar, liar, pants on fire!" right into your face!

Wouldn't be very surprised if the murderers of that unfortunate boy are the same as Hannah's and David's. Motive here is similar - the boy was in love with the girlfriend of a (surprise, surprise!) son of a Koh Tao mafia kingpin (who could it be, hhhhmmm, let me think, who could it be? where did I hear that phrase again ????) and paid the ultimate price for it. His face was beaten in, and he was found dead in the water... Does that ring a bell?

I hope Koh Tao will go down and that - somehow, some day - a natural or man made disaster will punish the cowards on that cesspit of an island, the ones who murdered, the ones who helped to cover up the crimes, and the spineless creatures who saw what happened but decided to keep their mouths shut.

Anyone on that turd(le) island knows that you gonna die if you step on the feet of the wrong people, or that at least your business will go up in flames. It seems to be generally accepted. I can't get my head around it that people wanna live and work or retire there. What idiot would opt for a violent prison as a home if he could live in a nice little town whithout mafia structures and fear?

Edited December 21, 2014 by catweazle

[catweazle]

Tourists should avoid going to stay on this death-island, think twice before going!

No, tourists should just be wise enough to not mess with the local mafia. If you keep to yourself and away from bars and drugs it's a wonderful island.

Tourists dies everywhere. How many tourists die in LA for example every day and do people stop going there?

By far one of the most idiotic posts I ever read on TV! A tourist has a list then, telling them names and places of where to find, respectively avoid local mafia types? Did you forget your medication today, perhaps?

[newcomer71]

I have not advanced any "theory" as to what happened. I have said, repeatedly, that we do not know and likely never will.

It is quite common for news articles to mix up details e.g. 1 Am, 2AM.

You seem to be under the incorrect impression that the police investigated this and found it to be an accidental death. The whole point is that they did not investigate, at all. For which I do indeed find fault.

I am under no impression as I only have read the news articles. According to that the RTP has send a report to the British police. That they haven't investigated the incident at all is put here first and a RTP officer should have right to reply here. Better would have been to asked the RTP prior before claiming that no investigation has taken place. That certainly would have cleared it up.

You also stated that "theirs are the only statements that there are to go by". Now look at the statement the pathologist made and what the mother implies.

So you give more credit to media report than to a first hand testimony of someone who knew the poor guy?

And this is a free forum, I guess if someone of RTP wants to tell their side of the story here is welcome, but don't expect that, so don't blame Sheryl for that.

[TSF]

"The Isand of Death" has a sinister ring to it.

TAT could promote it, I am sure of that.

Island of death.JPG

That pic would make a great souvenir T-shirt, with a caption like...I Survived Koh Tao...The Island Of Death

bet they would sell like hot cakes.

[rondii]

This was the guy, who according to the RTP fell of a cliff 50 meters into sea and drowned.

Despite the 50 meter fall, there was not a scratch on his body!!

Another fine piece of investigative work by the RTP!!

Or in other words, another case of sweeping under the carpet, what really happened!!

So there is a cover-up because he had no "scratches", OK.

From the article you didn't even bother to read:

"He said: There were some bruises on his face. He could have fell, bumped, or been assaulted. From a pathologists point of view, his injuries are not from an assault but I cant rule it out.

He said a lot of the injuries had occurred after his death."

And right on cue comes our resident (possibly quite literally) Koh Tao apologist.

And why are they an apologist for quoting what was really said rather than the lies and supposition you and the other Thai haters use???

[murphya33]

This was the guy, who according to the RTP fell of a cliff 50 meters into sea and drowned.

Despite the 50 meter fall, there was not a scratch on his body!!

Another fine piece of investigative work by the RTP!!

Or in other words, another case of sweeping under the carpet, what really happened!!

How can the sea put a scratch on ones body? I have never heard of it