steven100 Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 (edited) AirAsia pilot may have managed to make emergency landing at sea. As search teams hunt for the black boxes of AirAsia Flight QZ8501, analysts say the pilot may have managed to make an emergency water landing, only for the plane to be overcome by high seas. The Airbus A320-200 left the Indonesian city of Surabaya early Sunday and disappeared from radar over the Java Sea during a storm, but it failed to send the transmissions normally emitted when a plane crashes or is submerged. Experts say this suggests the experienced former air force pilot, Captain Iriyanto, conducted an emergency water landing which did not have a destructive impact. Read more at http://www.9news.com.au/world/2015/01/02/09/00/airasia-pilot-may-have-managed-to-ditch-plane#fSHZBPsYdqA44C37.99 Read more at http://www.9news.com.au/world/2015/01/02/09/00/airasia-pilot-may-have-managed-to-ditch-plane#fSHZBPsYdqA44C37.99 http://www.9news.com.au/world/2015/01/02/09/00/airasia-pilot-may-have-managed-to-ditch-plane Edited January 2, 2015 by metisdead Edited as per fair use policy and moved to the World News forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slipperylobster Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Wow. If the seas had been calm, just for a few minutes....then a totally different outcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post thailiketoo Posted January 2, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted January 2, 2015 Why didn't anyone have on a life vest if the plane was making an emergency landing in the water? 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weegee Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Why didn't anyone have on a life vest if the plane was making an emergency landing in the water? Thats what I was thinking... Another thing that baffles me is, when you see footage from aircraft at the scene, on the news...It doesnt look rough on the sea surface like they say it is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
umbanda Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 (edited) Why didn't anyone have on a life vest if the plane was making an emergency landing in the water? Thats what I was thinking... Another thing that baffles me is, when you see footage from aircraft at the scene, on the news...It doesnt look rough on the sea surface like they say it is... Even wit life vest on, passengers have to be belted to the seat at any landing...If the plane drowned fast ...the life vest will not help inside the plane, Edited January 2, 2015 by umbanda 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post sipi Posted January 2, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted January 2, 2015 Why didn't anyone have on a life vest if the plane was making an emergency landing in the water? Thats what I was thinking... Another thing that baffles me is, when you see footage from aircraft at the scene, on the news...It doesnt look rough on the sea surface like they say it is... Even wit life vest on, passengers have to be belted to the seat at any landing...If the plane drowned fast ...the life vest will not help inside the plane, For sure. Instructions are always to inflate your vest after leaving the aircraft. There was an incident some years ago when passengers were instructed to inflate their vests before exiting into shallow water. The plane sunk and the inflated vests pinned the passengers to the ceiling underwater. It was determined that many would have survived if they hadn't inflated their vests inside the cabin, but waited until they were outside. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuckyLew Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Why didn't anyone have on a life vest if the plane was making an emergency landing in the water? I think I read one of the bodies pulled so far did have a life vest on 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thailiketoo Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Why didn't anyone have on a life vest if the plane was making an emergency landing in the water? Thats what I was thinking... Another thing that baffles me is, when you see footage from aircraft at the scene, on the news...It doesnt look rough on the sea surface like they say it is... Even wit life vest on, passengers have to be belted to the seat at any landing...If the plane drowned fast ...the life vest will not help inside the plane, All of the bodies recovered would have had a vest on even if not inflated if making a crash landing over the water unless there was no time to put a vest on. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weegee Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Why didn't anyone have on a life vest if the plane was making an emergency landing in the water? Thats what I was thinking... Another thing that baffles me is, when you see footage from aircraft at the scene, on the news...It doesnt look rough on the sea surface like they say it is... Even wit life vest on, passengers have to be belted to the seat at any landing...If the plane drowned fast ...the life vest will not help inside the plane, For sure. Instructions are always to inflate your vest after leaving the aircraft. There was an incident some years ago when passengers were instructed to inflate their vests before exiting into shallow water. The plane sunk and the inflated vests pinned the passengers to the ceiling underwater. It was determined that many would have survived if they hadn't inflated their vests inside the cabin, but waited until they were outside. Yep remember that one ...that was really bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrTee Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Its just speculation.. Other "experts" suggest that the aircraft climbed at a rate well outside what the craft is designed to do (jet fighter type ascent) Plane behaved in ways 'bordering on edge of logic' and then plummeted dived into the sea nose first at hog velocity.. we can only know when the BlackBox is recovered and analysed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neverdie Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Its just speculation.. Other "experts" suggest that the aircraft climbed at a rate well outside what the craft is designed to do (jet fighter type ascent) Plane behaved in ways 'bordering on edge of logic' and then plummeted dived into the sea nose first at hog velocity.. we can only know when the BlackBox is recovered and analysed The other high velocity dive didn't mention entering the sea at high velocity, just that it plummeted at a point. From the photograph I saw of the cockpit, there's no way it hit the water hard, it looked in tact (frontally). If it hit the water fast it would be smashed to smithereens and flattened. Something new and different must have happened. Orange boxes will reveal all. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Robby nz Posted January 2, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted January 2, 2015 Its just speculation.. Other "experts" suggest that the aircraft climbed at a rate well outside what the craft is designed to do (jet fighter type ascent) Plane behaved in ways 'bordering on edge of logic' and then plummeted dived into the sea nose first at hog velocity.. we can only know when the BlackBox is recovered and analysed The other high velocity dive didn't mention entering the sea at high velocity, just that it plummeted at a point. From the photograph I saw of the cockpit, there's no way it hit the water hard, it looked in tact (frontally). If it hit the water fast it would be smashed to smithereens and flattened. Something new and different must have happened. Orange boxes will reveal all. Where did you see a photo of the cockpit ? The latest report I can find is on Yahoo and is from 6 hours ago at that time they had not found the plane but had identified some things underwater by echo sounding that appeared to be parts of a plane. They have now recovered 16 bodies. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrTee Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Its just speculation.. Other "experts" suggest that the aircraft climbed at a rate well outside what the craft is designed to do (jet fighter type ascent) Plane behaved in ways 'bordering on edge of logic' and then plummeted dived into the sea nose first at hog velocity.. we can only know when the BlackBox is recovered and analysed The other high velocity dive didn't mention entering the sea at high velocity, just that it plummeted at a point. From the photograph I saw of the cockpit, there's no way it hit the water hard, it looked in tact (frontally). If it hit the water fast it would be smashed to smithereens and flattened. Something new and different must have happened. Orange boxes will reveal all. I'm a bit confuzzled by your comment "The other high velocity dive didn't mention entering the sea at high velocity, just that it plummeted at a point". I'm only repeating something I read on teh interwebz so you may well be right. But if the aircraft came back to earth 10 KM from where it was last on radar at >30k feet suggests to me it descended pretty quickly.. highly unlikely it "landed" Dudi Sudibyo is basing his conjecture on the fact that an emergency transmitter never engaged.. its pretty weak based on the other evidence. Can you link to the photos of the cockpit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil B Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Just who is "Chappy Hakim", just another theorist, and a former Air Chief Marshal in the Indonesian Air force, lets just remember Indonesian Air Transport is not exactly a flagship for safety. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davejonesbkk Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 God this is horrible... What was the plan crash when people inflated their lifejackets inside the plane? I guess things like this are worth knowing and educating oneself about in case you are in such a position yourself and then can make your own informed decision! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Mega Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 God this is horrible... What was the plan crash when people inflated their lifejackets inside the plane? I guess things like this are worth knowing and educating oneself about in case you are in such a position yourself and then can make your own informed decision! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethiopian_Airlines_Flight_961 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil B Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 God this is horrible... What was the plan crash when people inflated their lifejackets inside the plane? I guess things like this are worth knowing and educating oneself about in case you are in such a position yourself and then can make your own informed decision! I think it was Ethiopia flight 961 which was hijacked and crashed in the sea in probably calmer waters than QZ8501. It cart wheeled and came to rest upside down... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrTee Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 God this is horrible... What was the plan crash when people inflated their lifejackets inside the plane? I guess things like this are worth knowing and educating oneself about in case you are in such a position yourself and then can make your own informed decision! I think it was Ethiopia flight 961 which was hijacked and crashed in the sea in probably calmer waters than QZ8501. It cart wheeled and came to rest upside down... a tourist videoed the event.. i t can be found in the youtubes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krisb Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 I've had it with speculation. I'm not buying anymore stories till that black box tells the real truth. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F430murci Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 (edited) Experts such as Subidyo, more nonsense coming from someone not deserving of the title expert. So called experts are all over the place. Ditching somewhat successfully in 9 foot seas and monsoon conditions with leaked data showing possible 11,000 to 24,000 fpm decent with 61kt forward speed . . . Plane may likely have been shedding occupants on the way down. Be interesting to know FA found was in rear of plane if tail truly got ripped off. They are also saying up to 19 foot seas causing much background noise hindering listening devices. Check this, but slide on 320 may have attached canister and activated itself. -------- Leaked documents have revealed the ill-fated AirAsia flight QZ8501 encountered a 'bizarre' decent before it crashed into the Java Sea, analysts say. Aviation Editor at The West Australian Geoffery Thomas said the new evidence shows the plane experienced a freak thunderstorm that sent it on a terrifying ride impossible to steer before it plummeted into the ocean. "Radar play back of the planes flight path leaked by Indonesian authorities show it climbing at 9000 feet per minute and then being slammed into a dive at 24,000 feet per minute," he said. However, the planes forward speed was barely 100 kilometres per hour https://au.news.yahoo.com/world/a/25875755/airasia-flight-qz8501-ill-fated-planes-bizarre-descent/ Indonesian aviation analyst Gerry Soejatman told Fairfax that according to the leaked information, the plane "was like a piece of metal being thrown down". It's really hard to comprehend... the way it goes down is bordering on the edge of logic." Mr Soejatman said the extremely low ground speed - as little as 61 knots during the descent - was equally baffling. Such a figure suggests the plane was heading almost straight down, explaining why it was found in the water just 10km from its last point of radar contact, he said. Mr believes the crash occurred because the aircraft was caught in a severe updraft, followed by an equally severe ground draft, with the leaked figures showing that it climbed at a staggering rate of 6000ft to 9000ft per minute. The aircraft then fell at 11,000ft a minute, with bursts of up to 24,000ft in marked contrast to regular circumstances, when a plane would climb between 1000ft to 1500ft on a sustained basis, gaining 3000ft in a burst. https://au.news.yahoo.com/world/a/25875755/airasia-flight-qz8501-ill-fated-planes-bizarre-descent/ Edited January 2, 2015 by F430murci 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farma Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Its just speculation.. Other "experts" suggest that the aircraft climbed at a rate well outside what the craft is designed to do (jet fighter type ascent) Plane behaved in ways 'bordering on edge of logic' and then plummeted dived into the sea nose first at hog velocity.. we can only know when the BlackBox is recovered and analysed The other high velocity dive didn't mention entering the sea at high velocity, just that it plummeted at a point. From the photograph I saw of the cockpit, there's no way it hit the water hard, it looked in tact (frontally). If it hit the water fast it would be smashed to smithereens and flattened. Something new and different must have happened. Orange boxes will reveal all. Where did you see a photo of the cockpit ? The latest report I can find is on Yahoo and is from 6 hours ago at that time they had not found the plane but had identified some things underwater by echo sounding that appeared to be parts of a plane. They have now recovered 16 bodies. I've seen the same photo neverdie refers to. It was circulated on social media on December 30 and showed a photo of a submerged cockpit with a pic of a pixelated floating body on the lower left. I can only assume from recent reports the news outlet used a stock photo of the underwater cockpit for effect. The news report and photo was from posttoday.com 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khaosai Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 I would think that if there was any sort of control over the aircraft in the final stages then a mayday call would have been made. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neverdie Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Its just speculation.. Other "experts" suggest that the aircraft climbed at a rate well outside what the craft is designed to do (jet fighter type ascent) Plane behaved in ways 'bordering on edge of logic' and then plummeted dived into the sea nose first at hog velocity.. we can only know when the BlackBox is recovered and analysed The other high velocity dive didn't mention entering the sea at high velocity, just that it plummeted at a point.From the photograph I saw of the cockpit, there's no way it hit the water hard, it looked in tact (frontally). If it hit the water fast it would be smashed to smithereens and flattened. Something new and different must have happened. Orange boxes will reveal all. Where did you see a photo of the cockpit ? The latest report I can find is on Yahoo and is from 6 hours ago at that time they had not found the plane but had identified some things underwater by echo sounding that appeared to be parts of a plane. They have now recovered 16 bodies. I've seen the same photo neverdie refers to. It was circulated on social media on December 30 and showed a photo of a submerged cockpit with a pic of a pixelated floating body on the lower left. I can only assume from recent reports the news outlet used a stock photo of the underwater cockpit for effect.The news report and photo was from posttoday.com Thanks Farma, I was racking my old brain where I saw what. When I saw the photo I was in the middle of something else and I thought it was really odd. I meant to go back and examine it more closely but then I expected to see more of the same photo again (but never did). All I could remember was it was a Thai report I was reading. Anyway, here's a link to the page. I now think Farma is right, stock foto of a submerged cockpit...pity I didn't pay more attention the first time. Sorry bout that. http://www.posttoday.com/รอบโลก/ข่าวรอบโลก/338375/พบแล้ว40ศพผู้โดยสารแอร์เอเชีย-ลอยเกลื่อนกลางทะเล-มีคลิป Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neverdie Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 I've had it with speculation. I'm not buying anymore stories till that black box tells the real truth. They're Orange and yellow crispy lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tgeezer Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 Experts such as Subidyo, more nonsense coming from someone not deserving of the title expert. So called experts are all over the place. Ditching somewhat successfully in 9 foot seas and monsoon conditions with leaked data showing possible 11,000 to 24,000 fpm decent with 61kt forward speed . . . Plane may likely have been shedding occupants on the way down. Be interesting to know FA found was in rear of plane if tail truly got ripped off. They are also saying up to 19 foot seas causing much background noise hindering listening devices. Check this, but slide on 320 may have attached canister and activated itself. -------- Leaked documents have revealed the ill-fated AirAsia flight QZ8501 encountered a 'bizarre' decent before it crashed into the Java Sea, analysts say. Aviation Editor at The West Australian Geoffery Thomas said the new evidence shows the plane experienced a freak thunderstorm that sent it on a terrifying ride impossible to steer before it plummeted into the ocean. "Radar play back of the planes flight path leaked by Indonesian authorities show it climbing at 9000 feet per minute and then being slammed into a dive at 24,000 feet per minute," he said. However, the planes forward speed was barely 100 kilometres per hour https://au.news.yahoo.com/world/a/25875755/airasia-flight-qz8501-ill-fated-planes-bizarre-descent/ Indonesian aviation analyst Gerry Soejatman told Fairfax that according to the leaked information, the plane "was like a piece of metal being thrown down". It's really hard to comprehend... the way it goes down is bordering on the edge of logic." Mr Soejatman said the extremely low ground speed - as little as 61 knots during the descent - was equally baffling. Such a figure suggests the plane was heading almost straight down, explaining why it was found in the water just 10km from its last point of radar contact, he said. Mr believes the crash occurred because the aircraft was caught in a severe updraft, followed by an equally severe ground draft, with the leaked figures showing that it climbed at a staggering rate of 6000ft to 9000ft per minute. The aircraft then fell at 11,000ft a minute, with bursts of up to 24,000ft in marked contrast to regular circumstances, when a plane would climb between 1000ft to 1500ft on a sustained basis, gaining 3000ft in a burst. https://au.news.yahoo.com/world/a/25875755/airasia-flight-qz8501-ill-fated-planes-bizarre-descent/ From the first I was reminded of an AirFrance flight from Rio to Paris. The leaked information: high rate of descent low airspeed is consistent with a stall. Speculation based on this information shouldn' be baffling or illogical to an 'expert' in aviation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F430murci Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 (edited) Experts such as Subidyo, more nonsense coming from someone not deserving of the title expert. So called experts are all over the place. Ditching somewhat successfully in 9 foot seas and monsoon conditions with leaked data showing possible 11,000 to 24,000 fpm decent with 61kt forward speed . . . Plane may likely have been shedding occupants on the way down. Be interesting to know FA found was in rear of plane if tail truly got ripped off. They are also saying up to 19 foot seas causing much background noise hindering listening devices. Check this, but slide on 320 may have attached canister and activated itself. -------- Leaked documents have revealed the ill-fated AirAsia flight QZ8501 encountered a 'bizarre' decent before it crashed into the Java Sea, analysts say. Aviation Editor at The West Australian Geoffery Thomas said the new evidence shows the plane experienced a freak thunderstorm that sent it on a terrifying ride impossible to steer before it plummeted into the ocean. "Radar play back of the planes flight path leaked by Indonesian authorities show it climbing at 9000 feet per minute and then being slammed into a dive at 24,000 feet per minute," he said. However, the planes forward speed was barely 100 kilometres per hour https://au.news.yahoo.com/world/a/25875755/airasia-flight-qz8501-ill-fated-planes-bizarre-descent/ Indonesian aviation analyst Gerry Soejatman told Fairfax that according to the leaked information, the plane "was like a piece of metal being thrown down". It's really hard to comprehend... the way it goes down is bordering on the edge of logic." Mr Soejatman said the extremely low ground speed - as little as 61 knots during the descent - was equally baffling. Such a figure suggests the plane was heading almost straight down, explaining why it was found in the water just 10km from its last point of radar contact, he said. Mr believes the crash occurred because the aircraft was caught in a severe updraft, followed by an equally severe ground draft, with the leaked figures showing that it climbed at a staggering rate of 6000ft to 9000ft per minute. The aircraft then fell at 11,000ft a minute, with bursts of up to 24,000ft in marked contrast to regular circumstances, when a plane would climb between 1000ft to 1500ft on a sustained basis, gaining 3000ft in a burst. https://au.news.yahoo.com/world/a/25875755/airasia-flight-qz8501-ill-fated-planes-bizarre-descent/ From the first I was reminded of an AirFrance flight from Rio to Paris. The leaked information: high rate of descent low airspeed is consistent with a stall. Speculation based on this information shouldn' be baffling or illogical to an 'expert' in aviation. Not sure what you are trying to say. 447 had a pitot tube clogged sending bad bad info and pilots could never reconcile that.. This was suspected very early in the investigation. Completely different than some dumb butt flying into the teeth of a storm and getting plane knocked out of the sky. 447 was operable when it went in. I think at the end of this we will find the tail and maybe other pieces were gone. These guys did not make a mayday call perhaps because of G's or perhaps because of desperation trying to save an unsaveable situation. Edited January 2, 2015 by F430murci Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaffyDuck Posted January 2, 2015 Share Posted January 2, 2015 God this is horrible... What was the plan crash when people inflated their lifejackets inside the plane? I guess things like this are worth knowing and educating oneself about in case you are in such a position yourself and then can make your own informed decision! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethiopian_Airlines_Flight_961 Worth noting : "The incident is one of the only documented water landing attempts of a widebody airliner with survivors." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tgeezer Posted January 3, 2015 Share Posted January 3, 2015 Experts such as Subidyo, more nonsense coming from someone not deserving of the title expert. So called experts are all over the place. Ditching somewhat successfully in 9 foot seas and monsoon conditions with leaked data showing possible 11,000 to 24,000 fpm decent with 61kt forward speed . . . Plane may likely have been shedding occupants on the way down. Be interesting to know FA found was in rear of plane if tail truly got ripped off. They are also saying up to 19 foot seas causing much background noise hindering listening devices. Check this, but slide on 320 may have attached canister and activated itself. -------- Leaked documents have revealed the ill-fated AirAsia flight QZ8501 encountered a 'bizarre' decent before it crashed into the Java Sea, analysts say. Aviation Editor at The West Australian Geoffery Thomas said the new evidence shows the plane experienced a freak thunderstorm that sent it on a terrifying ride impossible to steer before it plummeted into the ocean. "Radar play back of the planes flight path leaked by Indonesian authorities show it climbing at 9000 feet per minute and then being slammed into a dive at 24,000 feet per minute," he said. However, the planes forward speed was barely 100 kilometres per hour https://au.news.yahoo.com/world/a/25875755/airasia-flight-qz8501-ill-fated-planes-bizarre-descent/ Indonesian aviation analyst Gerry Soejatman told Fairfax that according to the leaked information, the plane "was like a piece of metal being thrown down". It's really hard to comprehend... the way it goes down is bordering on the edge of logic." Mr Soejatman said the extremely low ground speed - as little as 61 knots during the descent - was equally baffling. Such a figure suggests the plane was heading almost straight down, explaining why it was found in the water just 10km from its last point of radar contact, he said. Mr believes the crash occurred because the aircraft was caught in a severe updraft, followed by an equally severe ground draft, with the leaked figures showing that it climbed at a staggering rate of 6000ft to 9000ft per minute. The aircraft then fell at 11,000ft a minute, with bursts of up to 24,000ft in marked contrast to regular circumstances, when a plane would climb between 1000ft to 1500ft on a sustained basis, gaining 3000ft in a burst. https://au.news.yahoo.com/world/a/25875755/airasia-flight-qz8501-ill-fated-planes-bizarre-descent/ From the first I was reminded of an AirFrance flight from Rio to Paris. The leaked information: high rate of descent low airspeed is consistent with a stall. Speculation based on this information shouldn' be baffling or illogical to an 'expert' in aviation. Not sure what you are trying to say. 447 had a pitot tube clogged sending bad bad info and pilots could never reconcile that.. This was suspected very early in the investigation. Completely different than some dumb butt flying into the teeth of a storm and getting plane knocked out of the sky.447 was operable when it went in. I think at the end of this we will find the tail and maybe other pieces were gone. These guys did not make a mayday call perhaps because of G's or perhaps because of desperation trying to save an unsaveable situation. What I am trying to say is that it is exactly similar situation to Air France Airbus 330 : aircraft encountering thunder storms, plane lost over sea, no distress call. However if as you apparently know, that it was a case of "some dumb butt flying into the teeth of a storm and getting the plane knocked out of the sky" then I say again an expert in aviation shouldn't find the result of such action at all baffling or illogical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaffyDuck Posted January 4, 2015 Share Posted January 4, 2015 "It's really hard to comprehend... the way it goes down is bordering on the edge of logic."" - uh, not really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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