Discriminatory Interview Questions at an International School

[NickJ]

Read the wanted adds in the Post. Certain height , wage , age and sex. Disabled .....Forgetta bout it. In Korea they often hire on a persons Blood type.

The only meaning of PC here is less majeste and The Face Game.

[HooHaa]

you are not in kansas anymore. simple, innit?

[maidee]

this is thailand

good manners & brains are best left at the airport

[ggt]

Welcome to Thailand...consider this interview as a primer for the rest of your stay here...

Learn to roll with the punches...or forget the whole "teaching in Thailand fantasy"...

This forum is filled with disillusioned foreigners who tried the teaching in Thailand dream and left dismayed at the crap they had to put up with...

[aarontendo]

OP, don't let it get to you. The vast majority of <deleted> on this board would never even qualify for a Thai or Western teaching license.

If you've ever been an instructor who's had to take on additional work or an administrator who has suddenly and unexpectedly had to juggle the timetable & staffing allocations or a parent whose child has had to cope with a succession of substitute teachers because someone has "disappeared" for one reason or another, no matter how legitimate, you might understand that just qualifying for a teaching license doesn't make you particularly qualified to comment. Most people who think there's nothing wrong with the questions that were asked have probably had experience with the problems everyone has to deal with when the staffing is not stable and predictable.

So you're suggesting that females of child bearing age shouldn't be hired then I suppose. Welcome to the 1950s.

I mean you're not saying that, but it's a logical outcome from what you've said, right?

Guess what, occasionally women do get pregnant and have kids. Since that's an inconvenience employers shouldn't bother with them.

Protip: Usually you have a few months to prepare for a maternity leave. It's not as hard as you make it out to be.

I understand that the vast majority of men on this site hate western women but this is just a tad much...

Edited February 11, 2015 by aarontendo

[quandow]

I've worked both International and Private Schools in Thailand for the last eight years. True International Schools have fewer drunks (while they DO exist, they take measures to keep it on the downlow), and I NEVER saw anyone I would consider a creeper. In the Private Schools I've taught at, chat about the previous night's drunken escapades were commonplace, and thankfully I've never met a creeper, though I DO know a couple of actual creepers, and if I didn't know they were pedo's, I never would have guessed it.

To get back to the OP's question, if you're feeling wrong about this place and can afford to continue searching, keep looking. It sounds like a bad match.

[Briggsy]

What's a "Thai personal"? You mean person, or personnel?

Probably asking a teacher if she can spell would be considered too personal ... or do I mean too personnel?

I noticed that too but I subtly corrected the OP's error. In Thailand you need to be indirect and circumspect. However, the OP has long since left her own thread so I shall too.

[simon43]

I think all single men above 32 suspect

Are you sure it is 32? Perhaps 33? Maybe even 30?

What is the exact age that single men become pedophiles?

Is it relevant if the single person has grandchildren?

Howabout if he is gay?

I just want to check these facts so that I can alter my CV accordingly - I was wondering why I wasn't getting job interviews

[AnotherOneAmerican]

Dear OP,

Learn to lie at interviews like everyone else.

"what brought me to Thailand, how long would I plan to be here and would I be bearing kids during my stay here"

A1: I've always wanted to learn more about Buddhism.

A2: I will say as long as I can find employment in teaching.

A3: I love children, but unfortunately cannot have them myself.

How do they sound?

Edited February 11, 2015 by AnotherOneAmerican

[smotherb]

In the US, you will have already passed a fingerprint clearance, so that eliminates a lot of innuendos about one's past. I've hear male teachers in LOS complain that the director always referred to their GFs as "prostitutes." When they need you; they will hire you, as long as you meet the minimum standards. BTW, some of these so called

"International Schools" in CM are paying degreed NES about 25K.

You're not in Kansas anymore Dorothy. Many locals in all countries refer to their women who accompany farangs as 'prostitutes.' Guess what, many are, so what? Speak English, have a pulse, claim a degree, you're in.

[smotherb]

I know some philipina teachers in thailand who had babies but they had their own houses and had their family members talking care of them however when the school found out they got fired.....

And most often they do not hire foreign teachers with kids..and if u get pregnant most likely u get fired..

yes i agree they never care really ur teaching skills or methods much more they keen on collecting all kind of information from you that nothing got to do with the job requirements...

Thainess perhaps

I don't know where you find this. I know at least four Filipina teachers with kids. My sister-in-law has four kids and a husband on her work permit and she is in her third year at the school. Having children and family here may be seen as beneficial to your chances of stay.

Well in the Op the interviewer was asking if she had or wanted any kids...Why u think she wants to know this..?

I just heard this story first hand from a phill friend of mine she just got fired and went back with her baby to phills...anyway i sure every school has another policy..Fact remains they r asking during interviews to many questions that are not their business..

Duh, that is your opinion. who cares what you think, TIT.

[wowfactor10]

I know some philipina teachers in thailand who had babies but they had their own houses and had their family members talking care of them however when the school found out they got fired.....

And most often they do not hire foreign teachers with kids..and if u get pregnant most likely u get fired..

yes i agree they never care really ur teaching skills or methods much more they keen on collecting all kind of information from you that nothing got to do with the job requirements...

Thainess perhaps

I don't know where you find this. I know at least four Filipina teachers with kids. My sister-in-law has four kids and a husband on her work permit and she is in her third year at the school. Having children and family here may be seen as beneficial to your chances of stay.

Well in the Op the interviewer was asking if she had or wanted any kids...Why u think she wants to know this..?

I just heard this story first hand from a phill friend of mine she just got fired and went back with her baby to phills...anyway i sure every school has another policy..Fact remains they r asking during interviews to many questions that are not their business..

Yes, they may have wanted to know if the OP would be available for the entire session and not take maternity leave or time-off to care for kids, or that she may get lonely for any kids she may have left behind and return home, or it could have just been a curiosity. As has been mentioned, political correctness is not rampant here.

The Filipina you mention may well have been terminated for reasons other than simply having a child. I do not know her, so that is pure speculation. However, I do know few Filipino teachers leave Thailand when so many jobs are available here--jobs at better pay than they can get in the PI, and the jobs that are not readily available in the PI. I know, because I have a rather extensive network of Filipino teacher friends here. My wife, also a Filipina, teaches and brokers Filipino teachers to Thai schools; has done so for six years.

I don't believe Thai schools in general have any problem with foreign teachers with children, especially Filipino teachers. Two of my sister-in-law's kids attend the school in which she teaches, the other two, twin boys, were born last year in her second year of teaching there, and her husband volunteers at the school--so the school is well aware of her married with children status. And, as I mentioned, I know at least four other Filipina teachers with kids here, and all of them teach at different schools.

Its possible honestly i do also know other phillipina teachers here with kids and their kids even go to the same schools as were they are teaching.makes good sense to me.

But its a different school...I guess what happened is that she lied to the school about having a child and when they found out they terminated her contract.Maybe they had reasons for it to do so..

[ubonjoe]

A inflammatory post and replies to it have been removed,

[jacky54]

I wonder if the OP will ever post again? I don't find it unreasonable to ask if she planned on having kids, who wants to employ somebody who is off after a few months pregnant?

[SlyAnimal]

A number of posts have been removed, along with some quoted replies, for trolling (And even more were very very close to being removed for trolling as well).

If you're going to reply, please try to assist the OP, rather than just trying to be the biggest eTroll.

In response to the OP's post:

Thailand has very strict discrimination laws, however they're not enforced, as a result, they are allowed to discriminate on just about anything.

i.e. A couple of years ago, one of my Thai friends had her last shot at applying for a bank. Her last shot, because she was already 25, and she had to be 25 or under (and female), with an appropriate degree, in order to even be considered for an entry level position (bank teller).

Ladyboys are likewise often discriminated against, just recently there was a story in the newspaper about a quite famous Ladyboy who, accompanied by 2 foreign friends, was refused entry to a bar when they checked her ID, because she was a ladyboy.

Also according to my wife, a Thai interviewer will often ask if you're pregnant in an interview (Or intend on becoming pregnant in the near future), even to Thai people, and if you reply yes, they'll usually refuse your application (As if you're pregnant, then they're legally required to give you some kind of maternity leave or similar).

From the school's perspective, I can completely understand why they'd ask all of these types of questions, primarily because they can, but also because it's beneficial for them to know as much information about applicants as possible. With foreign teachers, particularly female teachers, they'd likely be worried about you leaving the school in the middle of the term, as there is quite a high turnover of foreign teachers.

Also as well, the questions would likely help them to get to know you on a more personal level, so that they can understand you a little more. These types of questions aren't rude in Thailand, sometimes considered a little prying, but Thai people will often just ask what they want to know, and if it's a foreigner, then sometimes they'll ask, even if they know that Thai people might find it a little bit rude.

Thai culture is very different to Western culture, and so we need to be quite tolerant of some of the aspects which we might find offensive, since even if it might seem offensive or similar, it's not necessarily intended to be, rather they just don't understand Western culture (Or perhaps do, but forget and just stick with what's natural to them).

[Eliot Rosewater]

A number of posts have been removed, along with some quoted replies, for trolling (And even more were very very close to being removed for trolling as well).

If you're going to reply, please try to assist the OP, rather than just trying to be the biggest eTroll.

In response to the OP's post:

Thailand has very strict discrimination laws, however they're not enforced, as a result, they are allowed to discriminate on just about anything.

i.e. A couple of years ago, one of my Thai friends had her last shot at applying for a bank. Her last shot, because she was already 25, and she had to be 25 or under (and female), with an appropriate degree, in order to even be considered for an entry level position (bank teller).

Ladyboys are likewise often discriminated against, just recently there was a story in the newspaper about a quite famous Ladyboy who, accompanied by 2 foreign friends, was refused entry to a bar when they checked her ID, because she was a ladyboy.

Also according to my wife, a Thai interviewer will often ask if you're pregnant in an interview (Or intend on becoming pregnant in the near future), even to Thai people, and if you reply yes, they'll usually refuse your application (As if you're pregnant, then they're legally required to give you some kind of maternity leave or similar).

From the school's perspective, I can completely understand why they'd ask all of these types of questions, primarily because they can, but also because it's beneficial for them to know as much information about applicants as possible. With foreign teachers, particularly female teachers, they'd likely be worried about you leaving the school in the middle of the term, as there is quite a high turnover of foreign teachers.

Also as well, the questions would likely help them to get to know you on a more personal level, so that they can understand you a little more. These types of questions aren't rude in Thailand, sometimes considered a little prying, but Thai people will often just ask what they want to know, and if it's a foreigner, then sometimes they'll ask, even if they know that Thai people might find it a little bit rude.

Thai culture is very different to Western culture, and so we need to be quite tolerant of some of the aspects which we might find offensive, since even if it might seem offensive or similar, it's not necessarily intended to be, rather they just don't understand Western culture (Or perhaps do, but forget and just stick with what's natural to them).

"Thai people will often just ask what they want to know, and if it's a foreigner, then sometimes they'll ask, even if they know that Thai people might find it a little bit rude"

"we need to be quite tolerant of some of the aspects which we might find offensive, since even if it might seem offensive or similar, it's not necessarily intended to be, rather they just don't understand Western culture (Or perhaps do, but forget and just stick with what's natural to them)."

Is it just me or does anyone else find these statements contradictory?

Seems he is saying that a Thai can act in a way towards a Westerner that the Westerner AND Thai people would find rude; however, we as Westerners must act in a way to NEVER seem rude in any way.

[Phatcharanan]

Oh, International School teachers...they could never be washed up teachers fired from posts in home countries. They could never have drinking problems. They could never be one step ahead of the law in their home countries. GuesNever had morals or discipline charges levied against them. I missed all that. I missed how having a teaching credential somehow makes someone abive scrutiny, in Thailand no less.

As for her being a woman - while I've never met a woman with qualifications to teach intl schools, the ones I have met were as crazy drinkers as their male counterparts.

Too funny, intl teachers beyond scrutiny. Lol.

The above applies to teachers no matter what country they are in. They have human frailties same as every other profession.

However, the great majority of people you have met who fall into all of the above is probably because........thats the pool you are swimming in

You will likely find a higher percentage than within the international schools circuit.

Actually, you sound quite bitter.

[DaBloodyMess]

Based on your experience I can make a good guess at which school this is. Despite the good things you may have heard, you don't want to work there (if your interview experience hasn't already dissuaded you).

[Mencken]

I must agree with some of the previous replies that there are a lot of extended (sex) tourists, drunks, derelicts and people with other odd reasons to be in Thailand and teaching seems to be the job of choice.

I have kids on and international and a bi-lingual school and several incidents over the past few years including two involving my kids make it very clear that these schools have a hard time sifting out the unwanted elements.

So yes, I can understand that the questions go far and for me they couldn't go far enough. Many people have reasons to be in Thailand and that not always makes them the people you want to be involved with the education of your kids.

Exactly.

So much for my bitterness. From the teachers I've met and worked with, Id say 60% are unfit to be anywhere near children. So its 35% in Intl schools?

I used to think teachers were not such a bad lot, until I taught a few years. Drinking problems topped everything by numbers butmy biggest concern was with creepers. Next to this were the broke-ass teachers scrounging money and the sloppy dressed and disheveled. Facial hair. Of course non of these people had any interest in being at the school a second longer than they could squeeze out of, despite school policy. Activities, forget it. My impression the vast amount of teachers was unsuprisingly is - its just a crappy job and Ill do the minimum, get paid and go home. Somehow I see in this equation a distinct lack of integrity, honesty.

Filipinos and married men should be teaching all the kids. Being married doesn't solve the drunk aspect, but my hunch is in metro areas would greatly decrease. Would solve the creeper issue by and large.

Even background checks are useless. Persons I have been most disgusted by could pass a check.

Thailand really needs to sort out the creepers, even more than the drunks. Drunks just waste kids time, creepers damage for life.

[Eliot Rosewater]

I must agree with some of the previous replies that there are a lot of extended (sex) tourists, drunks, derelicts and people with other odd reasons to be in Thailand and teaching seems to be the job of choice.

I have kids on and international and a bi-lingual school and several incidents over the past few years including two involving my kids make it very clear that these schools have a hard time sifting out the unwanted elements.

So yes, I can understand that the questions go far and for me they couldn't go far enough. Many people have reasons to be in Thailand and that not always makes them the people you want to be involved with the education of your kids.

Exactly.

So much for my bitterness. From the teachers I've met and worked with, Id say 60% are unfit to be anywhere near children. So its 35% in Intl schools?

I used to think teachers were not such a bad lot, until I taught a few years. Drinking problems topped everything by numbers butmy biggest concern was with creepers. Next to this were the broke-ass teachers scrounging money and the sloppy dressed and disheveled. Facial hair. Of course non of these people had any interest in being at the school a second longer than they could squeeze out of, despite school policy. Activities, forget it. My impression the vast amount of teachers was unsuprisingly is - its just a crappy job and Ill do the minimum, get paid and go home. Somehow I see in this equation a distinct lack of integrity, honesty.

Filipinos and married men should be teaching all the kids. Being married doesn't solve the drunk aspect, but my hunch is in metro areas would greatly decrease. Would solve the creeper issue by and large.

Even background checks are useless. Persons I have been most disgusted by could pass a check.

Thailand really needs to sort out the creepers, even more than the drunks. Drunks just waste kids time, creepers damage for life.

I think where you have been working and who you work with says a lot about you. Clearly you are not qualified to teach in a real school.

There are those of us who work at real schools here in TH where teachers make over 80K US per year on average. We don't have anything even close to the problems you describe.

[cdnvic]

If you guys can't discuss things without insults, don't waste your time typing posts that will only wind up in the trash.

[Fatty123]

Sorry to hear that you had to put up with nonsense at an interview. It was sexist, yes. What can you do about it? Nothing. Thais can be as subtle as a sledgehammer. I've been asked if I've got HIV or syphillis. Just straight out and casually after asking to see my passport. I've seen a black guy called ''Mr Black'' and laughed and pointed at by Thai staff.

It happens, sadly. Perhaps this isn't the country for you.

[Fatty123]

In three years of teaching, I have encountered drunks, jr drunks, party monsters and at least one creeper at each school I taught or am teaching. I very much think that questions about who you are quite valid. If you go to websites featuring efl teachers, many of the resumes (jobs) complete bs. Many teachers here carry dual passposts.

Unfortunately the ones most dangerous and/or burned out having been at this game for a ling time and creepers are far from stupid despite their compulsion.

I think all single men above 32 suspect. Who are you and why are you in Thailand and not your home country seens an excellent question. The weather is nice does not seem to be a sufficient answer.

There are a lot of bad people in this country and many agebcies have no qualms abiut placing them in front of a classroom.

Whether these were standard questions or they did not like the looks of you, eho knows. Take stock in it.

I'm not slagging you, just that in my exoerience there is frightening concern.

I've never met a larger more unprofessional group of people in my life. They will.say and do anything to get and stay hired - except the job and attendant responsibilities thsy were hired for.

Its like working in a call center wuth a bunch of immature hugh school drop outs.

This isn't your home country - they have no access to references and all sorts of checks snd balances. Sixty percent of teachers could move to China, agencies close. The kids would be all the safer.

Drunks are not harmless. They are lazy, sloppy and waste time. Creepers, just goes without saying. At least one of these in each school I've been in - and two people that drink to excess.

Its their country, they can ask what they want, but moreover children are involved.

The thought of someone with your attitude towards others teaching kids fills me with dread.

[SheungWan]

I must agree with some of the previous replies that there are a lot of extended (sex) tourists, drunks, derelicts and people with other odd reasons to be in Thailand and teaching seems to be the job of choice.

I have kids on and international and a bi-lingual school and several incidents over the past few years including two involving my kids make it very clear that these schools have a hard time sifting out the unwanted elements.

So yes, I can understand that the questions go far and for me they couldn't go far enough. Many people have reasons to be in Thailand and that not always makes them the people you want to be involved with the education of your kids.

Exactly.

So much for my bitterness. From the teachers I've met and worked with, Id say 60% are unfit to be anywhere near children. So its 35% in Intl schools?

I used to think teachers were not such a bad lot, until I taught a few years. Drinking problems topped everything by numbers butmy biggest concern was with creepers. Next to this were the broke-ass teachers scrounging money and the sloppy dressed and disheveled. Facial hair. Of course non of these people had any interest in being at the school a second longer than they could squeeze out of, despite school policy. Activities, forget it. My impression the vast amount of teachers was unsuprisingly is - its just a crappy job and Ill do the minimum, get paid and go home. Somehow I see in this equation a distinct lack of integrity, honesty.

Filipinos and married men should be teaching all the kids. Being married doesn't solve the drunk aspect, but my hunch is in metro areas would greatly decrease. Would solve the creeper issue by and large.

Even background checks are useless. Persons I have been most disgusted by could pass a check.

Thailand really needs to sort out the creepers, even more than the drunks. Drunks just waste kids time, creepers damage for life.

I think where you have been working and who you work with says a lot about you. Clearly you are not qualified to teach in a real school.

There are those of us who work at real schools here in TH where teachers make over 80K US per year on average. We don't have anything even close to the problems you describe.

$80K on average? There are an awfully large number of people on this forum who will be all ears to know where these places are.

[aarontendo]

Yeah it's a pretty much full of $hit figure heh. I'm not doubting there are some folks here on that, but these are multiple years experienced and top end schools at best. Looking back at state schools at home a teacher caps around $65k with a masters and 15 years in. I suppose with filghts and housing if they matched that they'd hit 80k USD.

Edited February 20, 2015 by aarontendo

[Mencken]

I've been asked if I've got HIV or syphillis.

Edited.

Edited February 20, 2015 by Mencken

[aarontendo]

Eh to be fair on the syphilis thing, it is something they test for here in order to get a work permit. Not really suitable to ask someone during an interview but yeah...

[Mencken]

Eh to be fair on the syphilis thing, it is something they test for here in order to get a work permit. Not really suitable to ask someone during an interview but yeah...

Well, since it is on the health check then there would be no reason to ask a clean, healthy, well dressed person by my mind.

I bet he did not get the job lol.

[Mencken]

Teachers at best intl schools most likely pulling in 65k and that is most likely for 50 hour weeks plus duties/activities. Many are not near public transport so they have expenses as well, no to mention the cost of their proper credentials at home.

Very, very, very few teachers are bringing in, 80k in Thailand. My friend taught at avery cream private in China, head teacher and he was making 65k thb.

[Fatty123]

Eh to be fair on the syphilis thing, it is something they test for here in order to get a work permit. Not really suitable to ask someone during an interview but yeah...

Well, since it is on the health check then there would be no reason to ask a clean, healthy, well dressed person by my mind.

I bet he did not get the job lol.

Yes, you can tell if someone has aids or syphillis by looking at them (did you have a health check before you processed your first work permit then, as in before a job offer?) What planet are you on? Perhaps the 'schools' you've worked at didn't follow the correct procedures, as all they got coming in were the dregs of society.

And, yes I got the job. That's why they were checking my passport and then copying it

Loser. You seem obsessed with pedos too. Interesting...those that claim to hate gay people tend to have homosexual fantasies but are ashamed of them. You meanwhile...

Edited February 20, 2015 by Fatty123