Dispute Customs Tax charge?

[thelongshoot]

Howdy one and all. Im not sure if anyone can offer any advice or feedback here but i figure it is worth asking, so here goes. I ordered some trainers, T-shirts and shorts from a UK retailer, totaly cost 417 GBP which is just under 21,000 THB.

I just recieved a customs invoice from the courier company for just over 10,000 THB.

It makes no sense to me. I am always ordering stuff on-line and I have noticed that the charge fluctuates wildly for clothes/aparel. I have been charged as little as THB for a pair pf trainers before, and as much as 2,000 for a similar pair a few weeks later. I just accept that there is no real system to this. That said, surely 10,000 THB is a joke? I have to draw the line somewhere man, and this is it for me.

What annoys me even more is that in typical Thai style I can just imagine some overweight lazy Somchai type sitting in his office, clutching the sales receipt for my stuff, with one eye on the TV watching a daytime drama and Som Tam dripping off his triple chin whist declaring to himself "I have no idea how much this should be.... Lets just say a nice round figure of 10,000 THB so I can get back to my drama"

Is there anyway I can contest this? Im sure i read a Facebook thread recently about a ferang in BKK who contested there customs charge and they said it was quite easy. The way I read it was that they contacted customs and said "this is way too much" and almost right away the halfed the amount. Maybe that sounds too good to be true?

Is there anything I can do here?

Many thanks

TLS

[marko kok prong]

Could it be a mistake,it sounds to be a very high figure.

[HeijoshinCool]

Next time, address it to a Thai.

[gerry123]

next time don't use the courier route go for registered post every time whilst the postal fee may be higher its nowhere near 10 k

Edited February 24, 2015 by gerry123

[thelongshoot]

Thanks. This is the first time I have ever felt a need to dispute a customs charge although in the past there have been a few charges that I have raised my eyebrows to, this one realy must be wrong.

I try never to use couriers as they are nothing but trouble in Thailand - DHL are by far the worst - this company is Aramex, the best out of a bad bunch I guess. The company in the UK i have ordered from are a large company who always use couriers so it is not like I can email them and ask them to send EMS or anything.

To be honest I dont think i will order from this company again. But for now, i need to dispute this charge. I can afford to pay it, but its the principal more than anything. I feel like I am being ripped off here....

[Don Mega]

21000 + 30% import = 27300 (6300 import).

27300 + 7% VAT = 29211 (1911 VAT).

= 8200 in taxes

do they charge anything else ?

[CWMcMurray]

21000 + 30% import = 27300 (6300 import).

27300 + 7% VAT = 29211 (1911 VAT).

= 8200 in taxes

do they charge anything else ?

Tax is based on CIF value not invoice value... So also need to add in the freight charges... Which for Courier mode have a set 'per kg rate' for every country of origin that customs uses to calculate for duty and cat valuation

For Insurance premium cost for calculation of CIF value, customs will use 1% of invoice value of no receipt for insurance showing the premium amount

Once adding in the Freight and Insurance cost, the above will go up

[thelongshoot]

Thanks DonMega & Murray

I emailed them and they replied with these figures, i wonder if you could take a real quick look at them and see if you agree?

For your parcel value is GBP 437 = THB 21,744 +

Freight (zone 4 = 460 * 4.7(Kgs.) = 2,162 +

Insurance 1 % = 217.44

Total value = 24,123.44 Baht.

Declare (Cost) 21,744 + (Freight) 2,162 + (Insurance) 217.44 = 24,123.44 Baht. (CIF value)

Thai customs charge 30 % = 7,237.03

Vat 7 % = 2,195.23

Handling = 214

Total amount = 9,646.26 Baht

I didn't realize that you had to pay a customs charge percentage PLUS VAT on top of that? And where do they get 30% from is that the standard rate for apparel do you know?

I guess the 30% at 7,237 is reasonable but should I also pay 7% VAT on top of that? And why are they charging me 2,162 for "Freight Zone 4"?

Can you guys spot any discrepancies here? Or does it look fair to you?

Again, I'm not trying to pinch pennies here and usually when I get a customs charge through that looks a little high I just shrug my shoulders and pay it without a fuss. For some reason this has hit a nerve with me though.... Its like 200 GBP for a few pairs of trainers and a few shorts!

[MrWorldwide]

Thanks. This is the first time I have ever felt a need to dispute a customs charge although in the past there have been a few charges that I have raised my eyebrows to, this one realy must be wrong.

I try never to use couriers as they are nothing but trouble in Thailand - DHL are by far the worst - this company is Aramex, the best out of a bad bunch I guess. The company in the UK i have ordered from are a large company who always use couriers so it is not like I can email them and ask them to send EMS or anything.

To be honest I dont think i will order from this company again. But for now, i need to dispute this charge. I can afford to pay it, but its the principal more than anything. I feel like I am being ripped off here....

I accept that you've done this before and the system seems opaque, but I plugged some numbers into dutycalculator,com and this is what came back - the duties seem hauntingly familiar, dont they ? You can play around with shipping and insurance numbers, but I couldnt see much sense in insuring a 21K shipment for anything less than 3K THB, as the Thais will factor this into their CIF estimate if its not provided. VAT is also levied on the total amount after the duties are added - a double whammy that I've never particularly enjoyed. Don Mega's calculation was close but he didnt factor in the insurance and freight costs.

Personally, I've paid no tax on individual CDs I bought from Amazon and been slugged a couple of thousand baht for a Springsteen boxed set of CDs : I'm confident that your mate Somchai at Customs has a set of dropdown menus similar to that at dutycalculator.com and when it all gets too hard he goes with the option that spells b-a-h-t. Good luck getting a refund - based on what you've told us, I dont see that happening.

Total customs value (CIF):

THB25500.00

This is the amount that customs values your import at

- Duty:

THB7650.00

- Interior Tax:

THB0.00

- Surcharge:

THB0.00

- VAT:

THB2320.50

Total import duty & taxes due:

THB9970.50

This is the amount that needs to be paid to customs

Total landed cost:

THB35470.50

This is the total cost of importing, including product, shipping, insurance and import duty & taxes

Notes on duty & taxes rates and compliance

Clothes Men has an import duty rate of 30% and a VAT rate of 7%, Interior Tax rate is 0%, Surcharge rate is 0% .

[CharlieH]

21000 + 30% import = 27300 (6300 import).

27300 + 7% VAT = 29211 (1911 VAT).

= 8200 in taxes

do they charge anything else ?

The postal and any insurance cost is also added to the base line before the + + +

[MrWorldwide]

I'd just like to add two things to my last post in this thread, purely observations and nothing more.

- the OP does have one silver lining - he (presumably) avoided 20% VAT in the UK buying from Thailand only to be slugged with 30% duties and 7% VAT when his package arrived in Thailand. At least there is some logic here - Thailand does have an industry to protect when you consider clothing and shoes - although I doubt that anyone being hit with that kind of charge feels the need to support the Thai garment industry - such is life.

- I still consider CIF value an ingenious method of getting max revenue from every shipment, esp when they add 7% VAT after everything else is calculated. For every thousand baht of the OP's shipment, let's assume the CIF value is 1100 baht:

Duties - 1100 X 30% = 330 baht

1100+330 = 1430 baht

VAT - 1430 x 7% = 100 baht

1430+100 = 1530 baht

And there we are - an additional 53% on every thousand baht of the purchase price for the sake of a 10% freight+insurance hit on the purchase price. Granted, you have to be pretty keen to import something that attracts that much duty but I'm stuffed if I can work out why some of the hi-fi gear I've bought here was almost line-ball with US pricing while other gear from the same vendor seems to have attracted the 'additional 53%' .... often across electronics from the same brand. Amazing Thailand.

[CharlieH]

I'd just like to add two things to my last post in this thread, purely observations and nothing more.

- the OP does have one silver lining - he (presumably) avoided 20% VAT in the UK buying from Thailand only to be slugged with 30% duties and 7% VAT when his package arrived in Thailand. At least there is some logic here - Thailand does have an industry to protect when you consider clothing and shoes - although I doubt that anyone being hit with that kind of charge feels the need to support the Thai garment industry - such is life.

- I still consider CIF value an ingenious method of getting max revenue from every shipment, esp when they add 7% VAT after everything else is calculated. For every thousand baht of the OP's shipment, let's assume the CIF value is 1100 baht:

Duties - 1100 X 30% = 330 baht

1100+330 = 1430 baht

VAT - 1430 x 7% = 100 baht

1430+100 = 1530 baht

And there we are - an additional 53% on every thousand baht of the purchase price for the sake of a 10% freight+insurance hit on the purchase price. Granted, you have to be pretty keen to import something that attracts that much duty but I'm stuffed if I can work out why some of the hi-fi gear I've bought here was almost line-ball with US pricing while other gear from the same vendor seems to have attracted the 'additional 53%' .... often across electronics from the same brand. Amazing Thailand.

Good and valuable post for future reference, well explained.

The other fair point is it is very much a "lottery" as to whether you get hit or not, and that does seem to be very much linked with the method of shipping used as stated in many other posts on this subject.

In short, stay away from couriers (mostly) and from there on its pot luck as with many things in Thailand there is little or no consistency.

[robblok]

I got really screwed once.. they did not believe my real shipping cost 700$ (and started to recalculate it on weight). Not fun when your importing 300lbs in dumbbells from the USA.

As for the calculation that was given to the OP its 100% correct and you always pay VAT after the charges because often if you buy from outside Thailand you can have the seller drop the VAT charges.

[MrWorldwide]

OP, I'm just wondering if you've come to grips with the CIF+VAT calculation - you seem to think it's somehow unusual to do it that way ? AFAIK, Thailand isnt alone in adopting this method and the website I mentioned earlier tells me the duty payable on men's clothing is 30% - I didnt check shoes, but given that Thailand exports shoes I expect its just as hefty. Nice little earner under the guise of 'protecting local industry' : gotta love it.

http://www.dutycalculator.com

I plugged in Men's Shoes but changed the country of origin to China - this does offer some hope for the future :

Men's Shoes has an import duty rate of 30% and a VAT rate of 7%, Interior Tax rate is 0%, Surcharge rate is 0% . Duty rate for Men's shoes may be reduced as China-ASEAN free trade agreement applies.

[yankee99]

OP, I'm just wondering if you've come to grips with the CIF+VAT calculation - you seem to think it's somehow unusual to do it that way ? AFAIK, Thailand isnt alone in adopting this method and the website I mentioned earlier tells me the duty payable on men's clothing is 30% - I didnt check shoes, but given that Thailand exports shoes I expect its just as hefty. Nice little earner under the guise of 'protecting local industry' : gotta love it.

http://www.dutycalculator.com

I plugged in Men's Shoes but changed the country of origin to China - this does offer some hope for the future :

Men's Shoes has an import duty rate of 30% and a VAT rate of 7%, Interior Tax rate is 0%, Surcharge rate is 0% . Duty rate for Men's shoes may be reduced as China-ASEAN free trade agreement applies.

Of course to take advantage of the agreement you must have a certificate of origin which you wont get purchasing retail.

[pieeyed]

Not to sure how they determine the taxes. I recently purchased a music player from DBM in the UK. It arrived from the UK via Parcel Force Global Priority and ended up with EMS. The price for the music player was 40,000 baht and they charged me 2800 baht which works out to 7%. Maybe clothes are in a different tax bracket.

[sundrenched]

I received guitars from Japan twice and paid 10% in custom's charges and 7% VAT.

30% + 7% on top of that (i.e., 39.1% total taxes) is a complete ripoff. Although it warms the heart that tax money is SO WELL spent here.

I have to thank the OP as I was thinking about ordering sneakers from the UK, but now I'll get them shipped to a friend in Hong Kong.

[Don Mega]

I received guitars from Japan twice and paid 10% in custom's charges and 7% VAT.

30% + 7% on top of that (i.e., 39.1% total taxes) is a complete ripoff. Although it warms the heart that tax money is SO WELL spent here.

I have to thank the OP as I was thinking about ordering sneakers from the UK, but now I'll get them shipped to a friend in Hong Kong.

Guitars are charged at a different rate to clothes...... how it is a rip off when these charges can be found on the internet well before you decide to import.

[sundrenched]

I received guitars from Japan twice and paid 10% in custom's charges and 7% VAT.

30% + 7% on top of that (i.e., 39.1% total taxes) is a complete ripoff. Although it warms the heart that tax money is SO WELL spent here.

I have to thank the OP as I was thinking about ordering sneakers from the UK, but now I'll get them shipped to a friend in Hong Kong.

Guitars are charged at a different rate to clothes...... how it is a rip off when these charges can be found on the internet well before you decide to import.

I say "rip off", not "scam". The government can impose any taxes it wants, and it's legal, but no less a rip off.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/rip-off ": something that is too expensive : something that is not worth its price"

Edited February 24, 2015 by sundrenched

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Sending clothes and shoes thru a private courier service to Thailand is asking to get nailed....

Lessons here... don't use private couriers. And if you have to send clothes/shoes, keep the individual package values small, and don't use private couriers... It bears repeating.

Typically, electronics may be a 10% duty if they're caught for duty. But clothes and shoes seem to draw anywhere from 30 to 60 percent. And yes, I've had a private courier clothes package dutied at 60 percent... Never again.

You can appeal with your local Customs office, but I've never heard of much success with that. Since they apparently can assign their own value determinations, regardless of the purchase price. And, the duty rates are so bureaucratic that if they charged u 40 percent, there's likely at least some plausible basis for them doing so. It all comes down to their interpretation, and that's pretty hard to win an argument about.

Edited February 24, 2015 by TallGuyJohninBKK