Thailand Is Considered As A Sanctuary For Foreign Criminals

[Griffin]

I doubt anyone can call the Pattaya news a bastion of literature and this latest article seems to prove that point.

However, the description of gang activities by country seems fair enough. If one person from a country finds a way of making money and then invites his friends to do the same, who then go on to show others. It doesn't take long before you have a group of people doing it.

The liberal apologists need to put down their tofu for a moment. Just because you are honest and decent doesn't mean everyone else is. I recall the head of london police stating that, something like, 75% of muggings involved black males and he supported a task force to deal with the problem. The hand wringers got all upset and slammed his 'racist' comments and nothing was done about it.

[terry57]

i dont see a problem as we all know that theres heaps of crim's operating in los.

its only a problem when they get caught but that dont worry us good people.

thats why i love los because you never know just who you might behaving a larger with.

love it all.

cheers old friend's, crim's and as well.

[charlesfrith]

I doubt anyone can call the Pattaya news a bastion of literature and this latest article seems to prove that point.

However, the description of gang activities by country seems fair enough. If one person from a country finds a way of making money and then invites his friends to do the same, who then go on to show others. It doesn't take long before you have a group of people doing it.

The liberal apologists need to put down their tofu for a moment. Just because you are honest and decent doesn't mean everyone else is. I recall the head of London police stating that, something like, 75% of muggings involved black males and he supported a task force to deal with the problem. The hand wringers got all upset and slammed his 'racist' comments and nothing was done about it.

Are you a neo-con loving paranoiac?

[Martin]

In post #32, 'Terry 57' said:

"thats why i love los because you never know just who you might behaving a larger with."

So true.

I have found it quite amusing to open a conversation, with a farang who I haven't met before, with the mild question: "Where do you come from, then?".

Genuine types have no trouble answering, but some of the guarded, wary, evasive replies are quite amusing!!!

Likewise: "What did you do before you came to Thailand?"!!!

[nikster]

And, IMHO, what the article says about Pattaya is right. Every farang I met in the few days I spent there, without exception, was there because they were in trouble of some sort or another in their own country, whether their country knew it or not. They'd do well to start the clean-up there.

Nah please keep them there where they can be amongst their peers. So the rest of us can just avoid P. and be done with it. Cracking down on P. will just send them all over the country.

I agree with others here that the Article is senseless - there are criminal gangs everywhere in the world, and no tougher immgration laws will stop them. The connection to Mr. Karr is ridiculous as well - people should just get over it. There is no way Mr. Karr could have been stopped either from entering Thailand or from teaching being as it is that he is a accredited teacher. The BKK schools kicked him out - they did their job as well as they could. No one is to blame here. It's also highly questionable he did it at all - more likely he is just crazy. Not harmless but probably not a murderer.

In my home country we have - or had, not sure this is still going on - a similar situation, just with more cash involved. Rich russians were waltzing around Vienna with thick bundles of Dollar notes. Every now and then, one of them would get killed in a gang-style slaying Chicago-1930s style - machine-gunned in their car. Before these guys arrived, such a crime had never happened in Vienna. But at the same time these Russians were more than welcome at the glitzy 1st-class shops in the inner city where they spent gobs of money. Business owners were very happy about them.

The really big criminals in Europe certainly don't bother with Thailand, they invest their money in legal businesses in the EU or the U.S. or keep it in swiss bank accounts. They launder their money right there in Europe which is very easy to do one the organization has reached a certain size.

I might also mention that getting your stuff stolen, you credit cards copied, and sleeping gassed in your camper van or train compartment is all much more likely in southern Europe - Italy, south of France - than it is in Pattaya. This kind of stuff happened to a few friends of mine... in the EU. Friends of mine were sleeping in their van in southern France, the whole family, parents and 3 kids. Someone piped sleeping gas in the van and fleeced them of everything they had including passports, credit cards etc. And if you leave your bag unattended for a minute in Naples, it's as good as gone.

[jdinasia]

And, IMHO, what the article says about Pattaya is right. Every farang I met in the few days I spent there, without exception, was there because they were in trouble of some sort or another in their own country, whether their country knew it or not. They'd do well to start the clean-up there.

Right, I'd better go hide somewhere safe.

So what exactly were you on the run from at home?

[ilyushin]

Got to be many more foreign criminals in the US than any other country in the world.

I am coming over to Bangkok in few weeks time, any guys would like to show me sites? Maybee?

I'll show you the cross hair sites!

[Claymore]

As is the case with ANY country that has open borders.

Authors like this should be ashamed of themselves. It's media like this that is the sludge of society. All these stories do it breed distrust for foreigners and build upon peoples sense of fear by perpetuating stereotypes.

At best the Thai police will counter effect the bad publicity and make life harder for all the expats. Thailand is reeling bad enough after the publicity of Karr who is a freak. What good could possible come from this article?

What a bunch of cr@p!

Agreed. What a crock. Iranian and Iraqi gangs / mafia. I just spewed hot coffee on my keyboard. Sounds like the neo-cons from the USA had some input into this one.

The name of this policeman is awfully familiar. He does know a lot of local foreign mafioso. They do not seem to get arrested though. Meanwhile the Foreign Section of the local police seems to have earned the tag 'Foreign Criminals Cash and Credit Card Assistance ( or Relief of) Centre

[BlackJack]

Yes - crime goes on everywhere an in every major city

Its kind of dumb to think that if you have a whole city of bars and working girls then you dont have crims associated with it

the young thai guys on bikes and in cars, drunk/yaba and fighting worry me more than any international crims

[Huckenfell]

Well, what do you expect? In a country where corruption starts at the top (with Mr T) and goes all the way down to the 'nice 'young girl who dishes out work permits at the local labour office (in Prachuab Kirikhan, btw) who seemed to require 4000baht (apparently "no - it's not corruption money - it's an unadvertised service charge" !?!) deposited in her bank to be passed on to 'ensure the right decision is made' (by her superiors, I expect she means). It's a real shame, as the majority of Thais (that is, those that don't wear a uniform or a suit) are actually good honest people (such as my girlfriend, her family and all our friends here), but none of the good guys have the guts to stand up to the bad ones, usually for fear of their lives. IMHO, if they can't keep their own house in order, I don't expect they'll make much impact with the foreign contingent. Personally, I'm sick to the back teeth of being told that I can get whatever I'm having trouble getting if I am prepared to pass considerable amounts of money 'under the table' (I got this offer twice yesterday in Bangkok!). I starting to think that because I've got principles I'm probably in the wrong country (or just unfortunate to have fallen in love with a girl from the wrong country).

And, IMHO, what the article says about Pattaya is right. Every farang I met in the few days I spent there, without exception, was there because they were in trouble of some sort or another in their own country, whether their country knew it or not. They'd do well to start the clean-up there.

Right, I'd better go hide somewhere safe.

"every farang i met without exception" OMG where in the hel_l did you hang out. I know of many ordinary working guys who go, and have gone to Pattaya just for a good time with the girls. All of them without exception have no criminal record or contacts, they are ordinary hard working young men doing what normal young men do so i think you need to get real or at least change your social contacts. Learn a little more of the people around you and STOP painting everybody with the same brush...idiot !

[Jarrod]

I feel very disappointed when criminals from other countries taint Thailand with their antics. Each time this happens, it just makes it harder for genuine people who choose to visit or live in Thailand. Worse still, if any of my fellow countrymen behave badly, I feel genuinely ashamed and I hope they get maximised penalties. Already, I suffer the consequences of these people when I return home from Thailand. I have visited there 9 times and have had 2 hour searches of my luggage on 5 of these occasions. It got worse when a so called respectable local executive got jailed here for drug trafficking to clear his business debts. I love Thailand and everything about it (even the bad bits) and I am dreading being compromised when I finally apply to live there permanently. Look at my risk factors, single male, travelling alone, multiple visits, laboratory scientist, born Egypt and now wanting to teach language...... uggh thanks crims you suck big time and I hope the Thai authorities deal to you appropriately.

[terry57]

I feel very disappointed when criminals from other countries taint Thailand with their antics. Each time this happens, it just makes it harder for genuine people who choose to visit or live in Thailand. Worse still, if any of my fellow countrymen behave badly, I feel genuinely ashamed and I hope they get maximised penalties. Already, I suffer the consequences of these people when I return home from Thailand. I have visited there 9 times and have had 2 hour searches of my luggage on 5 of these occasions. It got worse when a so called respectable local executive got jailed here for drug trafficking to clear his business debts. I love Thailand and everything about it (even the bad bits) and I am dreading being compromised when I finally apply to live there permanently. Look at my risk factors, single male, travelling alone, multiple visits, laboratory scientist, born Egypt and now wanting to teach language...... uggh thanks crims you suck big time and I hope the Thai authorities deal to you appropriately.

yes my friend,

i emphathize with you and share your conundrem,

you might have to swap the lab for driving a tuk tuk.

but you will soon get used to it.

cheers

[shotover]

Wonder why the author of the 1st article did not include the largest group of foreigners in Thai prisons, Nigerians and other western Africans who operate extensive drug rings.

I know local criminal gangs were not in the scope of the original article, but few foreign criminal groups can operate without the cooperation of the extensive Thai mafia (often the police and military).

I would think South American car burglary and theft gangs hardly rank a mention with European, African, Middle East, South Asian, Chinese, and Japanese criminal activities.

[meom]

US fake passports are worth alot, due to the number of requests? Seams like a lot of people wants to travel to the US and that with fake passports. I wonder why?

Would that be for business or ??????

The advantage of a US passport is that you can enter many countries without a visa.

Not sure which passport has the most flexibility but believe US, Brit and New-Zealand are ranked very high.

[Thaddeus]

Comment

"The media should be considered as a significant threat to people who are able to make their own minds up thank you very much"

The media, bless them, they tell the ignorant what they should be thinking. The domino effect then takes over.

(BTW .... I used the word ignorant in it's correct definition.... but I have done that elsewhere and regretted it, mainly due to ignorance)

[Scott]

Of course Thailand should clean up the criminal element, but only when someone is reasonably believed to be a criminal or there is a report from the home country. Otherwise it is a witch-hunt.

In the case of Karr, the police did exactly what was asked of them--there only problem was they couldn't keep their mouth shut--they may have severely damaged the prosecutions case by their endless (and sometimes incorrect) versions of his stories.

As far as large sophisticated foreign gangs--I am suspicious. I would think it would be hard to run a gang in Thailand--the locals know the lay of the land better than foreigners. This doesn't mean that they don't exist or that groups of bad people can't come together to become a sort of "gang."

Because it is a tourist destination and provides easy access for a lot of people, it's a convenient place to meet, launder some money and have your holiday at the same time. It also makes for a reasonable good hiding place for people who may need to "lay low."

[youngexpat]

how did he write this article without mentioning the russians. Has he been to Pattaya? for christ's sake the time share surveys now have a russian language version.

[Johpa]

Got to be many more foreign criminals in the US than any other country in the world.

In the US who needs foreign criminal gangs when we have Republicans. Why should Thailand go after Toxin when the US lets similar financial crooks like Frank Quattrone go free.

[Thaiquila]

Got to be many more foreign criminals in the US than any other country in the world.

In the US who needs foreign criminal gangs when we have Republicans. Why should Thailand go after Toxin when the US lets similar financial crooks like Frank Quattrone go free.

Why should Thailand care what the US does? Seems they are more interested in what China is doing.

As far as the case against Mr. Carr. If he is convicted without DNA evidence, I will eat my hat.

Much ado about a most probably innocent wacko.

A soon to be VERY RICH innocent wacko. Doesn't he already have a Hollywood movie deal? I doubt he plotted this, but the guy is crazy, crazy like a fox.

Edited August 28, 2006 by Thaiquila

[charlesfrith]

how did he write this article without mentioning the russians. Has he been to Pattaya? for christ's sake the time share surveys now have a russian language version.

Welcome. Everybody missed the obvious. You have a good future ahead of you

Charles

[kozi]

Chiang Mai has its fair share of Farang undesirables, who often term up with Thai counterparts. These are not in anyway community minded people nor would it be wise to associate with them.

Thailand has become a haven for foreign criminals and sexual deviants.

I would like to see the visa amount substantially increased for those acquiring one-year visas, a termination of the visa runs and government agencies established for those wishing to apply to stay in the Kingdom short term or long term, meaning having to use an agent to apply for visas. Companies, schools etc being fined or closed down if discovered employing illegal stayers, criminals and sexual deviants. Employers knowing or not knowing.

From each home country a special document is available from police confirming there is nothing or something on file about applicants. I have one myself, from Scotland Yard London police. Cost £10, 40 days for issue.

Edited August 28, 2006 by kozi

[Martin]

In post #45, 'Thaddeus' said:

"

"The media should be considered as a significant threat to people who are able to make their own minds up thank you very much"

The media, bless them, they tell the ignorant what they should be thinking. The domino effect then takes over."

This reminds me of 60 years ago, when my father used to get quite cross with "The Times" in England for printing too much comment on the news.

"A newspaper should use all its space for reporting the facts of the news, and leave its readers to make up their own minds when their ignorance (i.e. lack of knowledge) has been thereby alleviated", he used to say.

He would be more than cross about today's media----and scathing about the Pattaya Mail.

In post #49, 'Thaiquila' said:

"Why should Thailand care what the US does?

Seems they are more interested in what China is doing".

This reflects the present geopolitical situation.

We are early in the period when China takes over as the world superpower.

Thailand can expect to be, in 40 years, a small (60 million) country in the slipstream of China (over 1300 million); much as, 40 years ago, it was in the slipstream of the US (whose poulation was a little under 300 million).

I hope that, in 2046, Thailand will be in the slipstream of a China that is just an economically-minded superpower.

(Unlike 1966, when Thailand was in the slipstream of a militarily-minded superpower, and the Vietnam War was raging.)

This, of course, will depend on the US ceding dominance to China gracefully. But I am quite optimistic that the next two generations of US leaders will be inclined to do that. The political youngsters coming along have different inclinations to the political oldsters of today.

I am not 'off topic'.

The Pattaya Mail's meagre content of crime statistics renders their article largely worthless.

And visa issue follows from the geopolitical/geoeconomic realities in which countries find themselves.

As to criminal foreigners entering, there is only one possible solution and that is positive vetting before issue of the visa-extension which allows long-term stay in Thailand, coupled with the cessation of the issue of 'back-to-back' tourist visas.

Thailand already does partial positive vetting by enquiring of the local police, where we are residing, before non-immigrant visas for husbands of Thai wives are extended for the first time.

I know that steps towards full positive vetting (where the visa-extension won't be issued without a lifelong, fully-verified CV being obtained by the Immigration Police) will cause howls of outrage from Thais who make their money out of long-stay foreigners.

But I think it will have to come.

And it is better that it comes before too many 'baddies' have sought 'sanctuary' here.

Prevention (of entry) beats cure (by deportation).

[astral]

Not everybody the US claims is a criminal, really is................

[charlesfrith]

Chiang Mai has its fair share of Farang undesirables, who often term up with Thai counterparts. These are not in anyway community minded people nor would it be wise to associate with them.

Thailand has become a haven for foreign criminals and sexual deviants.

I would like to see the visa amount substantially increased for those acquiring one-year visas, a termination of the visa runs and government agencies established for those wishing to apply to stay in the Kingdom short term or long term, meaning having to use an agent to apply for visas. Companies, schools etc being fined or closed down if discovered employing illegal stayers, criminals and sexual deviants. Employers knowing or not knowing.

From each home country a special document is available from police confirming there is nothing or something on file about applicants. I have one myself, from Scotland Yard London police. Cost £10, 40 days for issue.

Does that mean Scotland Yard have a certificate to say you don't engage in oral sex or other unnatural acts? Good on you sir.

[fruittbatt]

Chiang Mai has its fair share of Farang undesirables, who often term up with Thai counterparts. These are not in anyway community minded people nor would it be wise to associate with them.

Thailand has become a haven for foreign criminals and sexual deviants.

I would like to see the visa amount substantially increased for those acquiring one-year visas, a termination of the visa runs and government agencies established for those wishing to apply to stay in the Kingdom short term or long term, meaning having to use an agent to apply for visas. Companies, schools etc being fined or closed down if discovered employing illegal stayers, criminals and sexual deviants. Employers knowing or not knowing.

From each home country a special document is available from police confirming there is nothing or something on file about applicants. I have one myself, from Scotland Yard London police. Cost £10, 40 days for issue.

The old argument that greater financial equity=better moral quality farangs is flawed and elitist. One of the richest foreigners to invest in Chiang Mai was George Patrick Dubie, an extraordinarily talented con man whose Canadian ex-girlfriend shot him dead in CM in July this year.

Most farangs I know in Thailand live on a budget with income derived from teaching, o/s investments, or a pension/superannuation from their home countries. These people are not criminals and don't associate with criminals. They are not "deviants" in the sense of being paedophiles, though I imagine most enjoy a healthy & active sex life with either Thai or farang partner/s. I am not sure what you mean by "community minded" but if that means socialising and caring about each other's well-being & about our host country, then all these people fit the bill.

The only ways that I can see to reduce the number of resident criminal farangs in Thailand are:

- better & reciprocal global criminal history checks at airports & other entry points. (This will not net those travelling with false documents)

- reporting of people who are evidently paedophiles to thai police - take a photo, get their car licence plate, or simply report where they are hanging out and description of both the farang & the child.

[BlackJack]

Chiang Mai has its fair share of Farang undesirables, who often term up with Thai counterparts. These are not in anyway community minded people nor would it be wise to associate with them.

Thailand has become a haven for foreign criminals and sexual deviants.

I would like to see the visa amount substantially increased for those acquiring one-year visas, a termination of the visa runs and government agencies established for those wishing to apply to stay in the Kingdom short term or long term, meaning having to use an agent to apply for visas. Companies, schools etc being fined or closed down if discovered employing illegal stayers, criminals and sexual deviants. Employers knowing or not knowing.

From each home country a special document is available from police confirming there is nothing or something on file about applicants. I have one myself, from Scotland Yard London police. Cost £10, 40 days for issue.

it sounds like you dont know much about thailand

[womble]

Chiang Mai has its fair share of Farang undesirables, who often term up with Thai counterparts. These are not in anyway community minded people nor would it be wise to associate with them.

Thailand has become a haven for foreign criminals and sexual deviants.

I would like to see the visa amount substantially increased for those acquiring one-year visas, a termination of the visa runs and government agencies established for those wishing to apply to stay in the Kingdom short term or long term, meaning having to use an agent to apply for visas. Companies, schools etc being fined or closed down if discovered employing illegal stayers, criminals and sexual deviants. Employers knowing or not knowing.

From each home country a special document is available from police confirming there is nothing or something on file about applicants. I have one myself, from Scotland Yard London police. Cost £10, 40 days for issue.

it sounds like you dont know much about thailand

How does raising visa prices help? Lots of these 'criminals' you talk of have access to money, and some honest decent folk are not rolling in cash.

And using agents just makes it more costly, you seem to think that the authorities and government agencies here can be trusted to carry out fair and non corruptable assesment of applications.

I think Blackjack is right, you know nothing about this country, or indeed what any developing country such as thailand is like.

[baboon]

Chiang Mai has its fair share of Farang undesirables, who often term up with Thai counterparts. These are not in anyway community minded people nor would it be wise to associate with them.

Thailand has become a haven for foreign criminals and sexual deviants.

I would like to see the visa amount substantially increased for those acquiring one-year visas, a termination of the visa runs and government agencies established for those wishing to apply to stay in the Kingdom short term or long term, meaning having to use an agent to apply for visas. Companies, schools etc being fined or closed down if discovered employing illegal stayers, criminals and sexual deviants. Employers knowing or not knowing.

From each home country a special document is available from police confirming there is nothing or something on file about applicants. I have one myself, from Scotland Yard London police. Cost £10, 40 days for issue.

SHOOT! SHOOT TO KILL!

Or for a more sensible solution how about this- all arrivals to be thrown into a river or lake. If they float, they are criminals or pedos, so lock them up and deport them.

If they drown, all well and good so let them in. [except for blacks, Jews and americans of course.]

[charlesfrith]

Gotta love Merriam Websters word for the day today!

[email protected] +Add contact

Subject: extradite: M-W's Word of the Day

****************************************************************School, office, or the comfort of home--cover all the bases withthe Eleventh Edition of our Collegiate® Dictionary!http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/book.pl?c11.htm&1**************************************************************** The Word of the Day for August 29 is: extradite \EK-struh-dyte\ verb *1 : to surrender (an alleged criminal) to another authority having jurisdiction to try the charge 2 : to obtain the surrender of (an alleged criminal) from another authority Example sentence: The treaty between the two nations provides that neither country is bound to extradite its own citizens. Did you know? Some countries have a tradition of extradition -- a fact which might concern criminals. But though few criminals who are extradited are likely to care whether "extradition" and "tradition" are related, indeed they are -- both "extradition" and "tradition" come from the Latin verb "tradere," which means "to hand over." (Think of a tradition as something handed over from one generation to the next.) Some other words that have been handed down from "tradere" include "betray," "traitor," and "treason." *Indicates the sense illustrated in the example sentence. You Are Subscribed As: [email protected] unsubscribe, change your e-mail address or to subscribe to the htmlversion of Merriam-Webster's Word of the Day, featuring audiopronunciations, please visit: http://www.startsampling.com/sm/wod/changeofaddress.iphtml © 2006 by Merriam-Webster, Incorporated Merriam-Webster, Inc.47 Federal StreetP.O. Box 281Springfield, MA 01102Loading... Click any message to view it in the reading pane. Attachments, pictures, and links from unknown senders are blocked to help protect your privacy and safety.

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[BPayette]

Thailand Is Considered As A Sanctuary For Foreign Criminals

Do I read you well, Foreign Criminals?

Why not just say Thailand Is Considered As A Sanctuary For Criminals.

Crime is everywhere, when the top is giving the bad example.

If the top is allowed illegal doings, the rest will follow so.

That is so in a country, in a corporation, in a football ligue, that is so on Internet. Why should it then be different, in a country where political and ethical standards are low?

It is called decadence, ask the Romans.

Very good comparison!!!