Red shirts get jail

[jdinasia]

Only 4 years,... That equals just a slap on the wrist and a little more extreme attitude adjustment....

I wouldn't volunteer to take their places.

[Robby nz]

I find the attitude of the PT supporters difficult to understand on this topic.

They have been going on about ordinary protesters being locked up as political prisoners, now we see the leaders being sentenced rather than the ordinary protesters one would think they would be happy that it is not the ordinary people who have been charged.

But now it seems it is about reconciliation and as long as any of the reds are locked up, no matter what they did, there can never be reconciliation.

On the other hand if those who closed the airport or were wearing a different color shirt are locked up then reconciliation could take place.

Anyway this lot have been locked up, except for the two that didn't turn up, and some of them will be facing the court again before their 4 year sentence is up in regards to 2010 and at that time they will be easy to find.

[scorecard]

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I personally find imprisoning any people for political actions is a matter for deep concern.

In principle, yes, I agree with you. However, it's the action which determines whether it's criminal or not.

If people are on a sidewalk holding placards and perhaps chanting, it's ok. If they're blocking a street, then it's questionable, depending on the gravity of the situation (if it blocks an entire section of a city for many hours, for example).

However, when people storm in to a hotel en masse, breaking one or more doors, threatening/frightening innocents, ...then it crosses the line between peaceful protest and criminal activity. That's what happened in the OP.

Add:

- They were well recorded as aiming to find and kill abhisit.

- They broke into abhisit's vehicle believing he was inside, he wasn't, then they pulled his driver out and in a gang action they seriously bashed the man who at last report a few months back was still in daily rehabilitation.

That's a way lot more than protest with placards.

[winstonc]

apols to chooka.i didnt realise the airport sit in was before so i stand corrected still painfully slooooow..

still love you and respect you.

ok ok book us a room nothing cheap mind i want proper romancing this time..

[icare999]

hopefully justice at last for these scum.

[icare999]

The witch hunt continues

All this talk of reconciliation yet all we see is more revenge and oppression. This won`t end well.

To be honest.I hope the Thai people will stay quiet, grin and bare it.

If there is to be a fight, mostly old people and university students die. I don't want to see any more wasted lives over this.

I couldn`t agree more, however Prayuth (and the elite that pull his strings) seem hell bent on provoking the red side of things into violence. This is because they need an excuse to continue martial law and their increasingly authoritarian behaviour.

The red strategy seems very simple, sit it out and wait for the inevitable to happen and when it does the one thing that gives the junta/elite their credibility is gone. The junta know that yet again they are being out witted and are trying to cause a reaction.

I find Thaksin little better than Prayuth in terms of his equally autocratic behaviour in the past, but there is no denying he just out smarts his adverseraries over and over. They rely on brute force and fight everything like a brawl, he relies on intellect and fights everything like a game of chess.

dream on i my Thai wife friends all 100% support anything which puts red short thugs in their place. We doth care about so called democracy we just want shin clan defeated at lsat. hopefully party time

[rubl]

yep we should now see yellow shirt leaders doing serious jail time also. Then we should see Suthep and the Mad Monk also in prison for storming buildings and shutting down an election. Suthep himself said in 2010 it is ilegal for protestors to occupy government buildings. That is if they go after everyone and not just one side.

I don't normally post on politics threads, but this post is so true, and surely the Junta cannot just punish one side. The Reds were wrong in 2010, and the Yellows were wrong in 2008. The leaders of both must be punished, and I will have no respect for the Junta unless they play fair and jail the Yellows leaders for shutting down two airports.

The junta doesn't punish, the junta doesn't rule. Courts do..

The case has been handled in court and after a few years a ruling comes out. Next is appeal which drags things along a wee bit longer.

Similar to the 2008 'airport closure' case. The last appeal is being processed I think.

So are you suggesting that the judiciary operates independently of the junta/government and that there is an operable separation of powers in Thailand?

That's a classic.

Do you believe in Father Christmas and the tooth fairy?

The more smileys someone seems to need to use the less arguments to counter a post I guess?

Anyway, a first ruling in the storming of the ASEAN venue' case. Next the appeal.

[TheDiva]

Four pages of back and forth about the Pattaya Summit and not a word about Newin Chidchob and his "Blue Shirts". The Democrat party Government said Newin (Interior Minister) was "on holiday" at Pattaya when he was unfortunately photographed touring the lines of his "troops" on the back of a motorcycle and reporters observed him with Suthep walking the area the night before the violence .

Abhisit also had this to say

"the blue shirts were like an organized group to back up the police, but we clearly said that any group involved must not use violence, and anybody who violates that will be prosecuted, so there will be cases brought against both blue and red shirts."

They were organized all right, no prizes for guessing by whom. Here's an interesting (and relevant to todays situation) article about the Blue Shirts and the their links to the Democrat Party Coalition Government (via the BJP), the Police and the Military.

The blue group first appeared in public view during the red-shirt protest at the Asean summit in Pattaya. Newin mobilised hundreds of blue-clad men to attack the red-shirted protesters, which turned a peaceful protest into an angry mob that disrupted the Asean summit.

The blue-shirt group includes a small political party as well as people from the military and police.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2009/05/01/politics/politics_30101785.php

[animatic]

The witch hunt continues

All this talk of reconciliation yet all we see is more revenge and oppression. This won`t end well.

To be honest.I hope the Thai people will stay quiet, grin and bare it.

If there is to be a fight, mostly old people and university students die. I don't want to see any more wasted lives over this.

They should speak up and not just grin and bare it. They have a right to a fair and honest judicial system and should not just let offenders from one side be punished. If the yellows aren't prosecuted then this will just drive a deep wedge and destroy all possibility of reconciliation. One side grinning and laughing at the other as they alone get prosecuted only builds rage that will eventually explode.

What twaddle.

They did it, it was well documented, video and photographed.

4 years actually applied is not unreasonable, and has nothing to do with a witch hunt.

In most countries they would be getting 10 years for this.

This was a quite public attack on the ASEAN meeting.

ASEAN representatives had to escape by small boats, which was seen on TV.

And this has NOTHING do with whether or not Yellow shirts get prosecuted for other crimes.

You can never have reconciliation with zealots or paid lackeys of megalomaniacs.

[NCFC]

Well well. There is a God after all! Now, any jail for the yellows who shut down two international airports?

The red shirts violently broke into the ASEAN summit. The yellow shirts peacefully occupied the airport. The criminal code treats these differently. While there should be prosecution of the yellow-shirt leaders, the severity of punishment will be nowhere near the same.

Wrong. The UN considers any act that shuts down an international airport as an act of terrorism. I already posted the relevant articles a couple of years ago to Thai Visa. Occupying an international airport is a much worse crime.

[NCFC]

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I personally find imprisoning any people for political actions is a matter for deep concern.

In principle, yes, I agree with you. However, it's the action which determines whether it's criminal or not.

If people are on a sidewalk holding placards and perhaps chanting, it's ok. If they're blocking a street, then it's questionable, depending on the gravity of the situation (if it blocks an entire section of a city for many hours, for example).

However, when people storm in to a hotel en masse, breaking one or more doors, threatening/frightening innocents, ...then it crosses the line between peaceful protest and criminal activity. That's what happened in the OP.

Add:

- They were well recorded as aiming to find and kill abhisit.

- They broke into abhisit's vehicle believing he was inside, he wasn't, then they pulled his driver out and in a gang action they seriously bashed the man who at last report a few months back was still in daily rehabilitation.

That's a way lot more than protest with placards.

At least they didn't bind his hands and feet and throw him into a khlong like Suthep's peace-makers did.

[crobe]

Well well. There is a God after all! Now, any jail for the yellows who shut down two international airports?

The red shirts violently broke into the ASEAN summit. The yellow shirts peacefully occupied the airport. The criminal code treats these differently. While there should be prosecution of the yellow-shirt leaders, the severity of punishment will be nowhere near the same.

Wrong. The UN considers any act that shuts down an international airport as an act of terrorism. I already posted the relevant articles a couple of years ago to Thai Visa. Occupying an international airport is a much worse crime.

Total rubbish NCFC - you are misinterpreting the articles and there are case precedents to prove this.

there have been numerous strikes by ground staff , air traffic controllers etc. which have shut down airports and these have not been considered by the UN as "acts of terrorism" and in fact are protected under the ILO agreements of free association.

Similarly the UN recognises the right to peaceful protest- even where this does cause inconvenience (protest marches affecting capital city centres etc - ref Tariz square in Egypt and other cases).

Tellingly - the shutdown of the ariport in Thailand was never condemned by the UN.

You may want to interpret the articles in a particular way to suit your blinkered view but it is not shared by the organisation you cite.

[halloween]

2009

Convicted

4 year sentence

Red Shirts

The "wheels of justice" grind on.

"The wheels of justice turn slowly, but grind exceedingly fine."

[halloween]

I personally find imprisoning any people for political actions is a matter for deep concern.

I'm sure the parents of the 3 children murdered by red shirts have a similar opinion, and they can't wait for it to happen.

[chooka]

Well well. There is a God after all! Now, any jail for the yellows who shut down two international airports?

The red shirts violently broke into the ASEAN summit. The yellow shirts peacefully occupied the airport. The criminal code treats these differently. While there should be prosecution of the yellow-shirt leaders, the severity of punishment will be nowhere near the same.

Wrong. The UN considers any act that shuts down an international airport as an act of terrorism. I already posted the relevant articles a couple of years ago to Thai Visa. Occupying an international airport is a much worse crime.

Total rubbish NCFC - you are misinterpreting the articles and there are case precedents to prove this.

there have been numerous strikes by ground staff , air traffic controllers etc. which have shut down airports and these have not been considered by the UN as "acts of terrorism" and in fact are protected under the ILO agreements of free association.

Similarly the UN recognises the right to peaceful protest- even where this does cause inconvenience (protest marches affecting capital city centres etc - ref Tariz square in Egypt and other cases).

Tellingly - the shutdown of the ariport in Thailand was never condemned by the UN.

You may want to interpret the articles in a particular way to suit your blinkered view but it is not shared by the organisation you cite.

I may be wrong but I think there is an enormous difference between a stop work meeting, industrial dispute and a few thousand not associated with the airport taking over and crippling services.

[halloween]

I may be wrong but I think there is an enormous difference between a stop work meeting, industrial dispute and a few thousand not associated with the airport taking over and crippling services.

Agreed. And the difference is even larger between the occupation and what is normally referred to as terrorism.

[aimbc]

You see folks, now we see proof that democracy breeds corruption. Or does it just legitimize corruption? And Thailand does it in high style. With thaksin as their number one role model.

[halloween]

I can only hope that as the consecutive sentences accumulate, these mercenary propagandists and agitators come clean about the payments they received and their employer.

[tbthailand]

The witch hunt continues

All this talk of reconciliation yet all we see is more revenge and oppression. This won`t end well.

To be honest.I hope the Thai people will stay quiet, grin and bare it.

If there is to be a fight, mostly old people and university students die. I don't want to see any more wasted lives over this.

They should speak up and not just grin and bare it. They have a right to a fair and honest judicial system and should not just let offenders from one side be punished. If the yellows aren't prosecuted then this will just drive a deep wedge and destroy all possibility of reconciliation. One side grinning and laughing at the other as they alone get prosecuted only builds rage that will eventually explode.

What twaddle.

They did it, it was well documented, video and photographed.

4 years actually applied is not unreasonable, and has nothing to do with a witch hunt.

In most countries they would be getting 10 years for this.

This was a quite public attack on the ASEAN meeting.

ASEAN representatives had to escape by small boats, which was seen on TV.

And this has NOTHING do with whether or not Yellow shirts get prosecuted for other crimes.

You can never have reconciliation with zealots or paid lackeys of megalomaniacs.

In most countries they would be getting 10 years for this.

as you would say, "what twaddle"

10 years for what? Spell out the crime(s) they committed that would put them in jail for 10 years in "most countries", as you say...

truly, what twaddle.

[halloween]

Four pages of back and forth about the Pattaya Summit and not a word about Newin Chidchob and his "Blue Shirts". The Democrat party Government said Newin (Interior Minister) was "on holiday" at Pattaya when he was unfortunately photographed touring the lines of his "troops" on the back of a motorcycle and reporters observed him with Suthep walking the area the night before the violence .

Abhisit also had this to say

"the blue shirts were like an organized group to back up the police, but we clearly said that any group involved must not use violence, and anybody who violates that will be prosecuted, so there will be cases brought against both blue and red shirts."

They were organized all right, no prizes for guessing by whom. Here's an interesting (and relevant to todays situation) article about the Blue Shirts and the their links to the Democrat Party Coalition Government (via the BJP), the Police and the Military.

The blue group first appeared in public view during the red-shirt protest at the Asean summit in Pattaya. Newin mobilised hundreds of blue-clad men to attack the red-shirted protesters, which turned a peaceful protest into an angry mob that disrupted the Asean summit.

The blue-shirt group includes a small political party as well as people from the military and police.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2009/05/01/politics/politics_30101785.php

Am I correct that you are saying that organising paramilitaries to further political goals is not acceptable? Or is it that those other than the red shirts doing it is not acceptable?

[Nickymaster]

The witch hunt continues

All this talk of reconciliation yet all we see is more revenge and oppression. This won`t end well.

lol. You talk like Thaksin. No Reconciliation without whitewashing my crimes.

[metisdead]

Off topic posts and replies have been removed.

[Fat Haggis]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

I personally find imprisoning any people for political actions is a matter for deep concern.

In principle, yes, I agree with you. However, it's the action which determines whether it's criminal or not.

If people are on a sidewalk holding placards and perhaps chanting, it's ok. If they're blocking a street, then it's questionable, depending on the gravity of the situation (if it blocks an entire section of a city for many hours, for example).

However, when people storm in to a hotel en masse, breaking one or more doors, threatening/frightening innocents, ...then it crosses the line between peaceful protest and criminal activity. That's what happened in the OP.

Add:

- They were well recorded as aiming to find and kill abhisit.

- They broke into abhisit's vehicle believing he was inside, he wasn't, then they pulled his driver out and in a gang action they seriously bashed the man who at last report a few months back was still in daily rehabilitation.

That's a way lot more than protest with placards.

Don't you get bored being so selective all the time? I wouid like to point out to you that the very thing you highlighted here happened Many times last year when people "strayed" into PDRC territory, so as I've said many times there is scum on all sides punish them all accordingly and stop being selective BB?

[TheDiva]

Four pages of back and forth about the Pattaya Summit and not a word about Newin Chidchob and his "Blue Shirts". The Democrat party Government said Newin (Interior Minister) was "on holiday" at Pattaya when he was unfortunately photographed touring the lines of his "troops" on the back of a motorcycle and reporters observed him with Suthep walking the area the night before the violence .

Abhisit also had this to say

"the blue shirts were like an organized group to back up the police, but we clearly said that any group involved must not use violence, and anybody who violates that will be prosecuted, so there will be cases brought against both blue and red shirts."

They were organized all right, no prizes for guessing by whom. Here's an interesting (and relevant to todays situation) article about the Blue Shirts and the their links to the Democrat Party Coalition Government (via the BJP), the Police and the Military.

The blue group first appeared in public view during the red-shirt protest at the Asean summit in Pattaya. Newin mobilised hundreds of blue-clad men to attack the red-shirted protesters, which turned a peaceful protest into an angry mob that disrupted the Asean summit.

The blue-shirt group includes a small political party as well as people from the military and police.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2009/05/01/politics/politics_30101785.php

Am I correct that you are saying that organising paramilitaries to further political goals is not acceptable? Or is it that those other than the red shirts doing it is not acceptable?

No. Read the history then come up with something more intelligent than "but they did this" playground arguments. Maybe if you just took a little time to read The Nation article (and I don't say that often, more's the pity) you would understand a bit more about the dynamics behind politics in Thailand - It is not a one way street.

[waitforusalso]

Those claiming peaceful yellow protests are either ignorant or liars.

Armed PAD forces seized a government television broadcaster as well as several government ministries

Police manned checkpoints on roads leading to the airport. At one checkpoint, police found 15 home-made guns, an axe and other weapons in a Dharma Army six-wheel truck taking 20 protesters to Suvarnabhumi airport.Another checkpoint found an Uzi submachine gun, homemade guns, ammunition, sling shots, bullet-proof vests and metal rods. The vehicle had the universally recognised Red Cross signs on its exterior to give the impression it was being used for medical emergencies .At another checkpoint, about 2 kilometers from the airport, was attacked by armed PAD forces in vehicles, causing the police to withdraw

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/People%27s_Alliance_for_Democracy

[jdinasia]

Those claiming peaceful yellow protests are either ignorant or liars.

Armed PAD forces seized a government television broadcaster as well as several government ministries

Police manned checkpoints on roads leading to the airport. At one checkpoint, police found 15 home-made guns, an axe and other weapons in a Dharma Army six-wheel truck taking 20 protesters to Suvarnabhumi airport.Another checkpoint found an Uzi submachine gun, homemade guns, ammunition, sling shots, bullet-proof vests and metal rods. The vehicle had the universally recognised Red Cross signs on its exterior to give the impression it was being used for medical emergencies .At another checkpoint, about 2 kilometers from the airport, was attacked by armed PAD forces in vehicles, causing the police to withdraw

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/People%27s_Alliance_for_Democracy

One of the reasons why people avoid linking to Wikipedia.

Last edited 20 hours ago by anonymous...

Was the PAD totally pacifist? Absolutely not. Were they attacked repeatedly? Yes.

This thread however is about the red shirts getting their just deserts.

[Fat Haggis]

To avoid the obvious justice needs to show consistency and just desserts need to be even handed without it looking very one sided to the outside world.

They're all rotten to the core but it's a need for the judicial system to be reformed and yet I don't see many looking in that direction.

[waitforusalso]

Those claiming peaceful yellow protests are either ignorant or liars.

Armed PAD forces seized a government television broadcaster as well as several government ministries

Police manned checkpoints on roads leading to the airport. At one checkpoint, police found 15 home-made guns, an axe and other weapons in a Dharma Army six-wheel truck taking 20 protesters to Suvarnabhumi airport.Another checkpoint found an Uzi submachine gun, homemade guns, ammunition, sling shots, bullet-proof vests and metal rods. The vehicle had the universally recognised Red Cross signs on its exterior to give the impression it was being used for medical emergencies .At another checkpoint, about 2 kilometers from the airport, was attacked by armed PAD forces in vehicles, causing the police to withdraw

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/People%27s_Alliance_for_Democracy

One of the reasons why people avoid linking to Wikipedia. ImageUploadedByThaivisa Connect1425703095.812233.jpg

Last edited 20 hours ago by anonymous...

Was the PAD totally pacifist? Absolutely not. Were they attacked repeatedly? Yes.

This thread however is about the red shirts getting their just deserts.

Some of the 165 sources cited on that page

[scorecard]

The witch hunt continues

All this talk of reconciliation yet all we see is more revenge and oppression. This won`t end well.

To be honest.I hope the Thai people will stay quiet, grin and bare it.

If there is to be a fight, mostly old people and university students die. I don't want to see any more wasted lives over this.

They should speak up and not just grin and bare it. They have a right to a fair and honest judicial system and should not just let offenders from one side be punished. If the yellows aren't prosecuted then this will just drive a deep wedge and destroy all possibility of reconciliation. One side grinning and laughing at the other as they alone get prosecuted only builds rage that will eventually explode.

What twaddle.

They did it, it was well documented, video and photographed.

4 years actually applied is not unreasonable, and has nothing to do with a witch hunt.

In most countries they would be getting 10 years for this.

This was a quite public attack on the ASEAN meeting.

ASEAN representatives had to escape by small boats, which was seen on TV.

And this has NOTHING do with whether or not Yellow shirts get prosecuted for other crimes.

You can never have reconciliation with zealots or paid lackeys of megalomaniacs.

Add:

Chooka, our retired senior cop from Australia, should know perhaps better than the rest of us that different cases take different lengths of time to go through the preliminary processes and different lengths of time to hear all the evidence etc etc.

Or put it another way, chooka, our retired senior cop from Australia, would know well that cases proceeding by a 'date offense committed' order is just not how it works and for many reasons.

Simple fake example, let's say my child is murdered but after 10 years the police still can't find the murder. If it all proceeded by a 'date offense committed' process then all cases after the said murder, ten years ago, would be on hold until the said murderer is found and the case in court is finished.

Now does that sound: logical, workable, fair, justice, etc? No.

In fact, chooka, our retired senior cop from Australia, could no doubt enlighten us all on this subject. But no, he just wants to twist everything, often somewhat misleading, to being a negative against the junta.

Hope there's not too many similar cops in Australia.

[halloween]

Am I correct that you are saying that organising paramilitaries to further political goals is not acceptable? Or is it that those other than the red shirts doing it is not acceptable?

No. Read the history then come up with something more intelligent than "but they did this" playground arguments. Maybe if you just took a little time to read The Nation article (and I don't say that often, more's the pity) you would understand a bit more about the dynamics behind politics in Thailand - It is not a one way street.

No to which question, or is it to both? And please stop the patronising "You don't know what's really happening!" BS.