NGV bus bid draws little interest from private sector

[Lite Beer]

NGV bus bid draws little interest from private sector

BANGKOK: -- The bus procurement scheme of Bangkok Mass Transit Authority (BMTA) for the first lot of 489 NGV-fuelled buses through bidding drew little interest from bidders with only two bus firms submitting their documents yesterday.

BMTA required a total of 21 interested bidders who earlier bought bidding documents to return them by yesterday deadline.

As the deadline ended yesterday only two submitted the documents with proposals to sell the first lot of 489 buses to BMTA.

BMTA acting director Mrs Pranee Sukrasorn said although the bus bid drew only two firms, the bidding process would continue.

She said BMTA would check documents of the two bidders to see their qualifications and inform them before March 16.

Qualified bidders will enter the electronic bidding set on March 23, she said.

Citing the urgency of the bus procurement project, Mrs Pranee said in case of only one bidder being qualified to enter the final bid, it will be accepted a winner but the BMTA will negotiate the lowest price with it.

The BMTA will award the buys contract with the winner end of March and delivery of the new fleet of NGV fueled buses will begin from April till June.

For the rest 2,694 buses to be procured, she said the BMTA had to make sure it has completed its efficiency improvement and bus route management schemes to submit to the State Enterprises Policy Committee for consideration first, she added.

Earlier the BMTA mandated all bidders to sign memorandum of understanding before entering the bidding. The agreement stipulates that they must have merits and virtues in making business with the BMTA.

Source: http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/ngv-bus-bid-draws-little-interest-from-private-sector

-- Thai PBS 2015-03-07

[TheDiva]

Citing the urgency of the bus procurement project, Mrs Pranee said in case of only one bidder being qualified to enter the final bid, it will be accepted a winner but the BMTA will negotiate the lowest price with it.

What could possibly go wrong?

BMTA: You're the only bidder but we need the buses urgently and we want the lowest price.

Bid Winner: Right.........................OK, rearrange this sentence, over a barrel you we have

Edited March 7, 2015 by TheDiva

[Just1Voice]

Why only two bidders? Simple, the requirements by the BMTA were ridiculous, so most GOOD companies, such as Scanna, laughed at them and withdrew.

Remember, Thailand, you get what you paid for.

[trogers]

"The agreement stipulates that they must have merits and virtues in making business with the BMTA."

And BMMA stipulates the CEO of the winning bidder must waltz with an orangutan on national TV.

[Just1Voice]

Ay bets on the "winning bidder" being a Thai company, with the right "connections"?

[ToddinChonburi]

Maybe the NGV is the problem here. does your bus factory have NGV certification to build system ? NO

OK out of the bid process. After market installation voids vehicle warranty.

[arthurboy]

Deal done long ago. Envelopes consigned.

Sorted. With the added bonus, there's no corruption in Thailand.

Geddit?

[yellowboat]

Do not blame anyone not wanting to do business in Thailand now.

[LuckyLew]

They are gonna get stuck with cheap Thai or cheap Chinese buses

No company worth a lick is interested in working with the BMTA

[Daniel Ingalls]

Gee,...........thats all we need now is 489 more buses plugging up the streets!.........Must present virtue and merits from a company? How the heck do you do that? and what is a virtue in Thailand? (Corruption free?)

Edited March 7, 2015 by Daniel Ingalls

[rubl]

Why the hurry? The project only started in 2008 when the late Samak was Prime Minister.

Interesting though that the original idea of 6000 news busses got down to 3184 now. Probably because public transportation improved a lot, more people use cars and Bangkok got less populated

Edited March 7, 2015 by rubl

[bangon04]

Ay bets on the "winning bidder" being a Thai company, with the right "connections"?

are you suggesting that wasn't one of the original conditions for eligibility???

[FangFerang]

Just another day in the corruption hub of ASEAN...

[tomacht8]

Citing the urgency of the bus procurement project, Mrs Pranee said in case of only one bidder being qualified to enter the final bid, it will be accepted a winner but the BMTA will negotiate the lowest price with it.

Buying cheap get cheap, means low quality.

One bus cost 8 million baht and runs 5 years.

Another bus costs 12 million baht and runs 9 years.
Which bus is cheaper/better in the long run?

Only buy the cheap crap sucks.
You have to buy new again and repair, repair again.
Waste of time and money.

Edited March 7, 2015 by tomacht8

[trogers]

Citing the urgency of the bus procurement project, Mrs Pranee said in case of only one bidder being qualified to enter the final bid, it will be accepted a winner but the BMTA will negotiate the lowest price with it.

Buying cheap get cheap, means low quality.

One bus cost 8 million baht and runs 5 years.

Another bus costs 12 million baht and runs 9 years.

Which bus is cheaper/better in the long run?

Only buy the cheap crap sucks.

You have to buy new again and repair, repair again.

Waste of time and money.

And here lies the main reason why the civil service cannot compete with the private sector when it comes to running a business. You can list down all the state enterprises, and you would find this one common trait in all of them.

[halloween]

Gee,...........thats all we need now is 489 more buses plugging up the streets!.........Must present virtue and merits from a company? How the heck do you do that? and what is a virtue in Thailand? (Corruption free?)

Gee, it would be a shame if 489 more buses hindered you in your 4wd truck.

[dinger]

I seem to recall to reading an article here on TV a few months back where both Volvo and Scanna ( both very competent bus builders) said that the bid requirements were impossibe to meet at the price point that the Thai Gvmt had set so they both pulled out.

Wouldn't be suprised to see the winning bid come from China

[Ghoulst Writer]

atleast they could have specified ngv or electric. the knife was put in even before the bids were called. china has a firm that does electric buses.

Thai Transport Minister urges feasibility study for electric buses >>

http://news.thaivisa.com/thailand/thai-transport-minister-urges-feasibility-study-for-electric-buses/34131/

beijing buses>>

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/790332-18-meter-long-electric-buses-debut-in-beijing/

thailand has already locally developed electric buses>>

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/759714-pea-introduces-thailands-first-electric-passenger-bus/

have never seen one of these

Edited March 8, 2015 by Ghoulst Writer

[Strangebrew]

Citing the urgency of the bus procurement project, Mrs Pranee said in case of only one bidder being qualified to enter the final bid, it will be accepted a winner but the BMTA will negotiate the lowest price with it.

What could possibly go wrong?

BMTA: You're the only bidder but we need the buses urgently and we want the lowest price.

Bid Winner: Right.........................OK, rearrange this sentence, over a barrel you we have

[Strangebrew]

Must be two different departments same company, And the question is you want them when? After laughing dies down next question got the money? Somchai the force is with you?

[rubl]

"two bus firms submitting their documents yesterday"

I wonder with which overseas companies these two have partnered up, assuming they did that it.

[Jonmarleesco]

'... in case of only one bidder being qualified to enter the final bid, it will be accepted a winner but the BMTA will negotiate the lowest price with it.' She thinks? I doubt that.

'... the BMTA mandated all bidders to sign memorandum of understanding (that) stipulates that they must have merits and virtues in making business with the BMTA.' Therein lies the problem: the pot demanding a pristine kettle.

[Chris Lawrence]

So why go to all the bother and expense of submitting a tender when the idea is now to look at 250-300 km range buses? Weren't they also expecting the cost of each bus to be $118K to $142K (US dollars).

Left hand right hand disease? These guys advisers are not giving value to the Government or some other connection can work better with another product? A cynical outlook I know.

The whole idea was to make public transport in Bangkok more accessible to disabled people.

What I don't get is that it is only seen as a need in Bangkok? What about people with disabilities in other parts of Thailand?

[rubl]

So why go to all the bother and expense of submitting a tender when the idea is now to look at 250-300 km range buses? Weren't they also expecting the cost of each bus to be $118K to $142K (US dollars).

Left hand right hand disease? These guys advisers are not giving value to the Government or some other connection can work better with another product? A cynical outlook I know.

The whole idea was to make public transport in Bangkok more accessible to disabled people.

What I don't get is that it is only seen as a need in Bangkok? What about people with disabilities in other parts of Thailand?

Although you are correct in stating the need for more accessability for disabled outside Bangkok as well, the topic is about Bangkok and the BMTA (aka Bangkok Mass Transit Authority). That limits the scope somewhat.

[Chris Lawrence]

So why go to all the bother and expense of submitting a tender when the idea is now to look at 250-300 km range buses? Weren't they also expecting the cost of each bus to be $118K to $142K (US dollars).

Left hand right hand disease? These guys advisers are not giving value to the Government or some other connection can work better with another product? A cynical outlook I know.

The whole idea was to make public transport in Bangkok more accessible to disabled people.

What I don't get is that it is only seen as a need in Bangkok? What about people with disabilities in other parts of Thailand?

Although you are correct in stating the need for more accessability for disabled outside Bangkok as well, the topic is about Bangkok and the BMTA (aka Bangkok Mass Transit Authority). That limits the scope somewhat.

You are correct Rubi, but doesn't it get the mind thinking of others? But that is what a forum like this is all about. Discussing the issues. I have seen some of your posts that go outside the parameters of an original post? To say that the scope of discussion is limited only tries to stagnate discussion on the issue? To even contemplate a comment like yours would mean that you will need to be making similar comments on most posts on TV, and not a whole lot stay in the very narrow parameter as suggested by yourself of what is being posted. It would just get your posts up without ever saying anything.

It does beg the question 'how much is spent on Bangkok per year as against the rest of the country'? The issue of transport needs for the disabled is not confined to Bangkok? The op does not mention the change of direction the boys in the back room want the tender process to head, and that is to look at electric buses that can travel only 250-300 kilometres a day? But this also goes with the story. Also the time factor it has taken and the cost they expect to pay for each bus. It’s not there, but is related to the story.

The process of the tender and the recent change of thought on what is needed do reflect on how the current regime will be judged on the process. When it comes to living with a disability, I feel the deal should be offered to all, not just a select few in a select area.

The General has also made the commitment that the new regime will be fair to all of Thailand and its people. They are still running the same old same old as the past Governemts, looking after the city they live in.

[rubl]

So why go to all the bother and expense of submitting a tender when the idea is now to look at 250-300 km range buses? Weren't they also expecting the cost of each bus to be $118K to $142K (US dollars).

Left hand right hand disease? These guys advisers are not giving value to the Government or some other connection can work better with another product? A cynical outlook I know.

The whole idea was to make public transport in Bangkok more accessible to disabled people.

What I don't get is that it is only seen as a need in Bangkok? What about people with disabilities in other parts of Thailand?

Although you are correct in stating the need for more accessability for disabled outside Bangkok as well, the topic is about Bangkok and the BMTA (aka Bangkok Mass Transit Authority). That limits the scope somewhat.

You are correct Rubi, but doesn't it get the mind thinking of others? But that is what a forum like this is all about. Discussing the issues. I have seen some of your posts that go outside the parameters of an original post? To say that the scope of discussion is limited only tries to stagnate discussion on the issue? To even contemplate a comment like yours would mean that you will need to be making similar comments on most posts on TV, and not a whole lot stay in the very narrow parameter as suggested by yourself of what is being posted. It would just get your posts up without ever saying anything.

It does beg the question 'how much is spent on Bangkok per year as against the rest of the country'? The issue of transport needs for the disabled is not confined to Bangkok? The op does not mention the change of direction the boys in the back room want the tender process to head, and that is to look at electric buses that can travel only 250-300 kilometres a day? But this also goes with the story. Also the time factor it has taken and the cost they expect to pay for each bus. It’s not there, but is related to the story.

The process of the tender and the recent change of thought on what is needed do reflect on how the current regime will be judged on the process. When it comes to living with a disability, I feel the deal should be offered to all, not just a select few in a select area.

The General has also made the commitment that the new regime will be fair to all of Thailand and its people. They are still running the same old same old as the past Governemts, looking after the city they live in.

How much of Bangkok's budget is provided by the central government?

[Chris Lawrence]

So why go to all the bother and expense of submitting a tender when the idea is now to look at 250-300 km range buses? Weren't they also expecting the cost of each bus to be $118K to $142K (US dollars).

Left hand right hand disease? These guys advisers are not giving value to the Government or some other connection can work better with another product? A cynical outlook I know.

The whole idea was to make public transport in Bangkok more accessible to disabled people.

What I don't get is that it is only seen as a need in Bangkok? What about people with disabilities in other parts of Thailand?

Although you are correct in stating the need for more accessability for disabled outside Bangkok as well, the topic is about Bangkok and the BMTA (aka Bangkok Mass Transit Authority). That limits the scope somewhat.

You are correct Rubi, but doesn't it get the mind thinking of others? But that is what a forum like this is all about. Discussing the issues. I have seen some of your posts that go outside the parameters of an original post? To say that the scope of discussion is limited only tries to stagnate discussion on the issue? To even contemplate a comment like yours would mean that you will need to be making similar comments on most posts on TV, and not a whole lot stay in the very narrow parameter as suggested by yourself of what is being posted. It would just get your posts up without ever saying anything.

It does beg the question 'how much is spent on Bangkok per year as against the rest of the country'? The issue of transport needs for the disabled is not confined to Bangkok? The op does not mention the change of direction the boys in the back room want the tender process to head, and that is to look at electric buses that can travel only 250-300 kilometres a day? But this also goes with the story. Also the time factor it has taken and the cost they expect to pay for each bus. It’s not there, but is related to the story.

The process of the tender and the recent change of thought on what is needed do reflect on how the current regime will be judged on the process. When it comes to living with a disability, I feel the deal should be offered to all, not just a select few in a select area.

The General has also made the commitment that the new regime will be fair to all of Thailand and its people. They are still running the same old same old as the past Governemts, looking after the city they live in.

How much of Bangkok's budget is provided by the central government?

Depending on what article you may read on the net, the year and the Government in power, somewhere between 50 and 72%. But there is a disparity when compared to other areas in Thailand. Have a look at spending in Isan. They don't get much spent up there. Do the research and have a look.

What spending initiatives have been earmarked for the rural areas by the General?

Have they increased the military budget? Historical data indicates that this goes into double figures after a coup.

But I am digressing from the bus issue......

Good to see you pushing me Rubi. I hope the discussion stimulates your thoughts.

[rubl]

You are correct Rubi, but doesn't it get the mind thinking of others? But that is what a forum like this is all about. Discussing the issues. I have seen some of your posts that go outside the parameters of an original post? To say that the scope of discussion is limited only tries to stagnate discussion on the issue? To even contemplate a comment like yours would mean that you will need to be making similar comments on most posts on TV, and not a whole lot stay in the very narrow parameter as suggested by yourself of what is being posted. It would just get your posts up without ever saying anything.

It does beg the question 'how much is spent on Bangkok per year as against the rest of the country'? The issue of transport needs for the disabled is not confined to Bangkok? The op does not mention the change of direction the boys in the back room want the tender process to head, and that is to look at electric buses that can travel only 250-300 kilometres a day? But this also goes with the story. Also the time factor it has taken and the cost they expect to pay for each bus. It’s not there, but is related to the story.

The process of the tender and the recent change of thought on what is needed do reflect on how the current regime will be judged on the process. When it comes to living with a disability, I feel the deal should be offered to all, not just a select few in a select area.

The General has also made the commitment that the new regime will be fair to all of Thailand and its people. They are still running the same old same old as the past Governemts, looking after the city they live in.

How much of Bangkok's budget is provided by the central government?

Depending on what article you may read on the net, the year and the Government in power, somewhere between 50 and 72%. But there is a disparity when compared to other areas in Thailand. Have a look at spending in Isan. They don't get much spent up there. Do the research and have a look.

What spending initiatives have been earmarked for the rural areas by the General?

Have they increased the military budget? Historical data indicates that this goes into double figures after a coup.

But I am digressing from the bus issue......

Good to see you pushing me Rubi. I hope the discussion stimulates your thoughts.

The discussion here only gives me the impression that you don't like to discuss the topic.

The Samak government launched the idea and initial plan for more than 6000 new busses. Plans got changed, torpedoed, resurrected till what we have now.

AS for upcountry, well they'll get nice new infrastructure with investment in rail links and roads. With that further investment will be more easily induced. Sorry about the lack of a high-speed passenger link between Chiang Mai and Bangkok. I'm aware that one of Ms. Yingluck's cabinet Ministers stated that there were so many poor commuters in Chiang Mai waiting for such link. Maybe they can be consoled with a lunch box ?

Edited March 10, 2015 by rubl

[Chris Lawrence]

You are correct Rubi, but doesn't it get the mind thinking of others? But that is what a forum like this is all about. Discussing the issues. I have seen some of your posts that go outside the parameters of an original post? To say that the scope of discussion is limited only tries to stagnate discussion on the issue? To even contemplate a comment like yours would mean that you will need to be making similar comments on most posts on TV, and not a whole lot stay in the very narrow parameter as suggested by yourself of what is being posted. It would just get your posts up without ever saying anything.

It does beg the question 'how much is spent on Bangkok per year as against the rest of the country'? The issue of transport needs for the disabled is not confined to Bangkok? The op does not mention the change of direction the boys in the back room want the tender process to head, and that is to look at electric buses that can travel only 250-300 kilometres a day? But this also goes with the story. Also the time factor it has taken and the cost they expect to pay for each bus. It’s not there, but is related to the story.

The process of the tender and the recent change of thought on what is needed do reflect on how the current regime will be judged on the process. When it comes to living with a disability, I feel the deal should be offered to all, not just a select few in a select area.

The General has also made the commitment that the new regime will be fair to all of Thailand and its people. They are still running the same old same old as the past Governemts, looking after the city they live in.

How much of Bangkok's budget is provided by the central government?

Depending on what article you may read on the net, the year and the Government in power, somewhere between 50 and 72%. But there is a disparity when compared to other areas in Thailand. Have a look at spending in Isan. They don't get much spent up there. Do the research and have a look.

What spending initiatives have been earmarked for the rural areas by the General?

Have they increased the military budget? Historical data indicates that this goes into double figures after a coup.

But I am digressing from the bus issue......

Good to see you pushing me Rubi. I hope the discussion stimulates your thoughts.

The discussion here only gives me the impression that you don't like to discuss the topic.

The Samak government launched the idea and initial plan for more than 6000 new busses. Plans got changed, torpedoed, resurrected till what we have now.

AS for upcountry, well they'll get nice new infrastructure with investment in rail links and roads. With that further investment will be more easily induced. Sorry about the lack of a high-speed passenger link between Chiang Mai and Bangkok. I'm aware that one of Ms. Yingluck's cabinet Ministers stated that there were so many poor commuters in Chiang Mai waiting for such link. Maybe they can be consoled with a lunch box ?

Rubi, you asked me the off topic question, 'How much of Bangkok's budget is provided by the central government?'

The bid for the bus contract appears to have been not a good one. One of the main reasons for calling for the new buses was the access for disabled people. I only raised the fact that little is done outside of Bangkok for people with disabilities to highlight the disparity between Bangkok and the rest of Thailand. I am also well aware of the history of "on the buses".

You asked for some extra information which I was happy to provide to you. My response is also to new material you put in your posts. More than happy to discuss.

Regarding the rail and road links, a lot is said but no contracts have been signed.

[rubl]

How much of Bangkok's budget is provided by the central government?

Depending on what article you may read on the net, the year and the Government in power, somewhere between 50 and 72%. But there is a disparity when compared to other areas in Thailand. Have a look at spending in Isan. They don't get much spent up there. Do the research and have a look.

What spending initiatives have been earmarked for the rural areas by the General?

Have they increased the military budget? Historical data indicates that this goes into double figures after a coup.

But I am digressing from the bus issue......

Good to see you pushing me Rubi. I hope the discussion stimulates your thoughts.

The discussion here only gives me the impression that you don't like to discuss the topic.

The Samak government launched the idea and initial plan for more than 6000 new busses. Plans got changed, torpedoed, resurrected till what we have now.

AS for upcountry, well they'll get nice new infrastructure with investment in rail links and roads. With that further investment will be more easily induced. Sorry about the lack of a high-speed passenger link between Chiang Mai and Bangkok. I'm aware that one of Ms. Yingluck's cabinet Ministers stated that there were so many poor commuters in Chiang Mai waiting for such link. Maybe they can be consoled with a lunch box ?

Rubi, you asked me the off topic question, 'How much of Bangkok's budget is provided by the central government?'

The bid for the bus contract appears to have been not a good one. One of the main reasons for calling for the new buses was the access for disabled people. I only raised the fact that little is done outside of Bangkok for people with disabilities to highlight the disparity between Bangkok and the rest of Thailand. I am also well aware of the history of "on the buses".

You asked for some extra information which I was happy to provide to you. My response is also to new material you put in your posts. More than happy to discuss.

Regarding the rail and road links, a lot is said but no contracts have been signed.

Chris you started with "how about outside Bangkok".

BTW the project for new buses seems to have started under PM the late Samak and may have been influenced by Newin Chidchob, his party then part of the PPP-led coalition government. A 110 bilion Baht plan for 6000 NGV buses to be rented. Rejected with request for feasability studies, July 2008. It became 4000 airco buses leased for 67 billion only, some mention introduction of electronic ticketing had something to do with the price drop. Later price dropped to 63 billion. Lots of different insights, plans, changes, etc., etc.

The first mention I found on 'doing something for disabled' is from 2013-11-01

"Moreover, representatives of the disabled community have proposed that the public hearing committee be held to address the issue of adding wheelchair ramps to facilitate the disabled."

http://www.gnvmagazine.com/eng/noticia-bangkok_mass_transit_authority_to_hold_public_hearing_for_its_ngv_public_bus_project-3328

Of course if buses selected are not fit for disabled any ramps will be useless.

Interesting is that the BRT link which is wholly BMA financed (as far as I know) does have all features for easy access. In the five or six years I've been using BRT I've never seen the wheelchair lift, or location in the bus been used as such. Makes me wonder if things still work. The Satorn - Technic Krungthep stretch seems highly popular with students though.

As for rail links, since the dual tracking of existing lines has been put back in the Transport Ministries (yearly) budget at least that's continuing. For new links the governments seeks co-financing which somehow seems more difficult (read more expensive) than expected.