Requirements For Obtaining And Renewing A 2 Year Driving Licence

[raro]

We had it numerous times just like the pizza and burgers, but what is the latest on school recommendations in Pattaya?

The daughter is due end of the year and the selection process shall begin!

Best bang for the buck?

Budget is as little as possible, fully aware that you won't get something for nothing. So how much do I have to plan for?

[Thailaw]

You need to provide more information if you want a useful response. How old is your daughter (i.e., pre-school or 1st grade)? What kind of school do you want -- Thai; Thai with English Program; International. Obviously, the price/fees go up (in many cases significantly) as you go from the first group to the last.

If your daughter is under 5 and you are looking form a good Thai/English pre-school, IMO Hastin School on SSCC is among the best, and certainly the best value for the money spent. It is a small school, with a nice environment for young children. They provide lots of attention to the needs of the children and good interaction with parents. And the fees are very reasonable (a bargain, in my opinion). My daughters have moved on from Hastins now, but they enjoyed their time there and got a good foundation for the International School that they now attend. We were very pleased with their development while at Hastin. It only goes to age 6 presently, but Khun Pat, the teacher in charge, has said that they have plans to open a primary school (grades 1 to 6, maybe beyond) in the next 1 or 2 years.

[raro]

Right, she's going to Hastin at the moment and the next term will be the last one... Then school starts.

Very happy with Hastin, if they can keep the same value for money for their school, then it's a no brainer for me.

[guzzi850m2]

Maryvitt school are considered among the best schools in the area.

My son goes there, he is 5 now so kindergarten 3, next year it really starts.

Very demanding, many washes out in the first years.

They learn in: Thai-English & Chinese and uses Filipinos and Chinese Nationals for the foreign languages.

I am very impressed with the school, no students rides motor bike to/from school and are very polite & disciplined and no leaves before schools over unless they gets sick.

+85% ends up in university.

[innerspace]

Wow, amazing to hear 2 of the places I know anything about being the only ones mentioned so far. Hastin is walking distance but daughter too young, may be extending lease based on recomendations so far. Seems nice but no first hand experience.

Stepson at Maryvit, less involved and most info I get second hand. No international school but regarded one of the best English Thai schools locally.

Have had a number of negative experiences but cant place them all on the school, though cant ignore it all personally.

Certainly more fortuners and camrys than student driven motorbike in the morning, occasional mercedes - says more about the parents than children or teachers but useful observation regardless.

[raro]

How much is it for a term at Maryvitt? I also heard good things about them, but nothing first hand.

[guzzi850m2]

How much is it for a term at Maryvitt? I also heard good things about them, but nothing first hand.

+30k baht per term, 2 terms per year. This is for kindergarten, it might be slightly more in 1st grade.

If you want your kid to start direct in 1st grade, she will have to pass a test first.

An expat friend of mine also had his girl transferred to Maryvitt but she had to drop down one year because of lacking Thai language skills.

[Thailaw]

Unless things have changed recently, Maryvitt is a Thai private school, with no English program. English is taught as a foreign language a few hours per week. If you expect your daughter to live her life in Thailand (and do not mind her being constrained to do so), Maryvitt is a good school and a good choice. I would not have considered any school without a full English program -- full stop. The Thai schools with English programs (at least all that friends have had children at) all get low marks -- more like education factories than schools. Several friends have moved their children out of the better known of these schools and put their children in Maryvitt. You should look at Mooltrepakdee Int'l School (formerly, the Montessouri School) near the Million Years Stone Park. It is among the cheapest of the Int'l Schools, about B70k per term (not sure if there are 2 or 3 terms). I would not rank it with the other International Schools, but it is certainly better than the Thai private schools, including Maryvitt. It stays fully booked, so you would need to get your daughter on their waiting list early.

[guzzi850m2]

Well for us expats with kids, they will get 2 passports in most cases (my son will) so they are by no means constrained to stay in Thailand.

Saying that they only learn English a few hours per week is not quite correct, in my sons class room they have 2 teachers in class at all times and the lead teacher is Thai and the 2nd teacher will either be Philippine or Chinese but more English lessons than Chinese.

Furthermore you will have the option to put your kid in summer school and the 2nd part is in English only where a Western teacher comes and teach them.

The Maryvit owners are very well aware of that English is extremely important for the kids and at the last open school day, Mr Steven (Owners son & co owner (I think)) made introduction speeches to the parents in both English and Thai and said that over the last few years they are going more over towards more English orientated programs.

[Thailaw]

Well for us expats with kids, they will get 2 passports in most cases (my son will) so they are by no means constrained to stay in Thailand.

Saying that they only learn English a few hours per week is not quite correct, in my sons class room they have 2 teachers in class at all times and the lead teacher is Thai and the 2nd teacher will either be Philippine or Chinese but more English lessons than Chinese.

Furthermore you will have the option to put your kid in summer school and the 2nd part is in English only where a Western teacher comes and teach them.

The Maryvit owners are very well aware of that English is extremely important for the kids and at the last open school day, Mr Steven (Owners son & co owner (I think)) made introduction speeches to the parents in both English and Thai and said that over the last few years they are going more over towards more English orientated programs.

I do not want to debate with you on the merits or demerits of a Thai school vs. an International School education for a dual nationality child. You are certainly entitled to your opinion, and the only person that will suffer from it is your child. But the first sentence in your post above shows, I think, your complete lack of understanding of the issues involved. And your earlier post about your friend's child having "to drop down one year because of lacking Thai language skills" says a lot about the language priorities/emphasis of Thai schools, even good ones. A passport/visa will allow your child to physically leave Thailand and go to a foreign country; that's all. If you think that your child, even with extra English classes, will be able to compete with native English speakers and get a good job in an ever more English speaking world, you are in almost every case wrong. My kids are only half Thai, and I want to give them every opportunity to move anywhere with ease and opportunities, and to get further/higher education in the US, the UK or Singapore, which will require a very strong English reading and writing capability, which they wouldn't get in a Thai school, even a good one. And Thai universities are not an acceptable option for a child who wants to live and work outside Thailand. A student will complete university in Thailand with the equivalent of a mediocre high school education in the US or Europe. My former secretary in Bangkok, a Thailand college graduate who speaks excellent conversational English and now lives in the US, works as a waitress in a Thai restaurant because that is the only job available for her. I want more (much more) for my kids. And if I am wrong (not likely), I would rather err on the side of better education than take the risk (on foolish hopes and expectations) of a poor/weak education (really, an education can never be too good). If I and my wife were Thai, Maryvitt and other good Thai private schools would be very acceptable. As an ex-pat living in Thailand, I would never consider it as an acceptable school for my daughters.

It is, I think, common for parents to rationalize poor education choices for their children. It helps them assuage their guilt. So, if it helps, carry on.......and hope that the Maryvitt co-owner carries through with his improvements very quickly.

[jaxtravel]

Thanks for the detailed information and response Thailaw. Very well said and good examples that you gave.

[JSixpack]

Well for us expats with kids, they will get 2 passports in most cases (my son will) so they are by no means constrained to stay in Thailand.

Saying that they only learn English a few hours per week is not quite correct, in my sons class room they have 2 teachers in class at all times and the lead teacher is Thai and the 2nd teacher will either be Philippine or Chinese but more English lessons than Chinese.

Furthermore you will have the option to put your kid in summer school and the 2nd part is in English only where a Western teacher comes and teach them.

The Maryvit owners are very well aware of that English is extremely important for the kids and at the last open school day, Mr Steven (Owners son & co owner (I think)) made introduction speeches to the parents in both English and Thai and said that over the last few years they are going more over towards more English orientated programs.

I do not want to debate with you on the merits or demerits of a Thai school vs. an International School education for a dual nationality child. You are certainly entitled to your opinion, and the only person that will suffer from it is your child. But the first sentence in your post above shows, I think, your complete lack of understanding of the issues involved. And your earlier post about your friend's child having "to drop down one year because of lacking Thai language skills" says a lot about the language priorities/emphasis of Thai schools, even good ones. A passport/visa will allow your child to physically leave Thailand and go to a foreign country; that's all. If you think that your child, even with extra English classes, will be able to compete with native English speakers and get a good job in an ever more English speaking world, you are in almost every case wrong. My kids are only half Thai, and I want to give them every opportunity to move anywhere with ease and opportunities, and to get further/higher education in the US, the UK or Singapore, which will require a very strong English reading and writing capability, which they wouldn't get in a Thai school, even a good one. And Thai universities are not an acceptable option for a child who wants to live and work outside Thailand. A student will complete university in Thailand with the equivalent of a mediocre high school education in the US or Europe. My former secretary in Bangkok, a Thailand college graduate who speaks excellent conversational English and now lives in the US, works as a waitress in a Thai restaurant because that is the only job available for her. I want more (much more) for my kids. And if I am wrong (not likely), I would rather err on the side of better education than take the risk (on foolish hopes and expectations) of a poor/weak education (really, an education can never be too good). If I and my wife were Thai, Maryvitt and other good Thai private schools would be very acceptable. As an ex-pat living in Thailand, I would never consider it as an acceptable school for my daughters.

It is, I think, common for parents to rationalize poor education choices for their children. It helps them assuage their guilt. So, if it helps, carry on.......and hope that the Maryvitt co-owner carries through with his improvements very quickly.

It ain't that simple. True story: Friend of mine, and his Thai wife, adopted a Thai kid from a village. He went to good Thai schools, by no means the so-called best for hi-so's, with English programs. He and his dad studied English some at night and weekends. Then he went to ABAC, exempted all the English courses, and did well academically, graduating in Business. Great guy, very ambitious, good moral character. He went to the States, had no problem finding management-track positions, his degree accepted everywhere (which most here would not believe). Then he got bored with ordinary suburban life and joined the US military, now on track to be an officer.

I think much depends on the home environment and the person. As the story suggest above, I wouldn't feel guilty in the least if my kid didn't go to an international school. It might be worth it, if you've got the dosh, but then again it might not.

[guzzi850m2]

I do not want to debate with you on the merits or demerits of a Thai school vs. an International School education for a dual nationality child. You are certainly entitled to your opinion, and the only person that will suffer from it is your child. But the first sentence in your post above shows, I think, your complete lack of understanding of the issues involved. And your earlier post about your friend's child having "to drop down one year because of lacking Thai language skills" says a lot about the language priorities/emphasis of Thai schools, even good ones. A passport/visa will allow your child to physically leave Thailand and go to a foreign country; that's all. If you think that your child, even with extra English classes, will be able to compete with native English speakers and get a good job in an ever more English speaking world, you are in almost every case wrong. My kids are only half Thai, and I want to give them every opportunity to move anywhere with ease and opportunities, and to get further/higher education in the US, the UK or Singapore, which will require a very strong English reading and writing capability, which they wouldn't get in a Thai school, even a good one. And Thai universities are not an acceptable option for a child who wants to live and work outside Thailand. A student will complete university in Thailand with the equivalent of a mediocre high school education in the US or Europe. My former secretary in Bangkok, a Thailand college graduate who speaks excellent conversational English and now lives in the US, works as a waitress in a Thai restaurant because that is the only job available for her. I want more (much more) for my kids. And if I am wrong (not likely), I would rather err on the side of better education than take the risk (on foolish hopes and expectations) of a poor/weak education (really, an education can never be too good). If I and my wife were Thai, Maryvitt and other good Thai private schools would be very acceptable. As an ex-pat living in Thailand, I would never consider it as an acceptable school for my daughters.

It is, I think, common for parents to rationalize poor education choices for their children. It helps them assuage their guilt. So, if it helps, carry on.......and hope that the Maryvitt co-owner carries through with his improvements very quickly.

I don't think I lack understanding of what is involved and I don't fell any guilt too, why should I. My wife and I have discussed in great detail what is best for him and I think we made the right choice based on our income. Not all of us are super rich like you, but we still trying doing the best for our kid.

My son will very likely makes his fortune here in Thailand, what is wrong with that?

We all talk about university, who know perhaps he is not smart enough for that or have no interest? Too early to say yet.

I am not a native English speaker myself but somehow managed to land a 1/2 descent job myself for a British owned company based in Singapore and I never went to uni, I become an engineer.

If he chooses same direction, I don't see any reason why he can't do that in say Singapore later on?

I work with a Thai/Canadian guy and he did just that and he also had his first 10 year primary schools in Thailand.

Your post is bordering of insulting me.

[Thailaw]

It ain't that simple. True story: Friend of mine, and his Thai wife, adopted a Thai kid from a village. He went to good Thai schools, by no means the so-called best for hi-so's, with English programs. He and his dad studied English some at night and weekends. Then he went to ABAC, exempted all the English courses, and did well academically, graduating in Business. Great guy, very ambitious, good moral character. He went to the States, had no problem finding management-track positions, his degree accepted everywhere (which most here would not believe). Then he got bored with ordinary suburban life and joined the US military, now on track to be an officer.

I think much depends on the home environment and the person. As the story suggest above, I wouldn't feel guilty in the least if my kid didn't go to an international school. It might be worth it, if you've got the dosh, but then again it might not.

When it come to planning/preparing for your children's future, it really is just that simple. There are of course exceptions, and no one suggested that there aren't -- people win lottery jackpots, high school dropouts become millionaire businessmen/women, a guy living in a box on the street invents a contraption and sells the patent for millions. But would/should you plan your child's future on one of those events happening to him/her? I think not.

There is much more to success in life than education, and talented, resourceful and highly motivated people can overcome disadvantages of many/all kinds. But that does not change the fact that most people will succeed or fail based on the skills that they develop through childhood -- not all, most (aka the vast majority). And in Thailand, the most glaringly absent necessary skill is the ability to read, write and speak English proficiently. If you care about your child and want to provide him/her with (actually, prepare him/her to work for) the best possible opportunities, that includes giving him/her the best education available that you can afford. And it has no ill effects, except costing you more. Giving him/her a good home life, with encouragement and developing goal/success oriented values and creativity/imagination, is also very important. But I place the highest high value on education -- it has served me very well -- and is highly transportable, you can take it with you where ever you go, and short of killing you, no one can take it from you.

That you can find exceptions to the almost universal rule is interesting, but proves nothing. Bill Gates, the wealthiest person in the world, is a college dropout (albeit from Harvard). I met a 14 year old boy in Udon in a Thai government school that spoke excellent English, thanks to his mom's and her sister's efforts. But the fact remains that most Thai children in government schools cannot speak English beyond a few basic words. And his example would not under any circumstances convince me to put my daughters in a Thai government school, no mater what may be possible for the rare, exceptional, motivated individual. When it comes to your children, base your decisions on their future on what is likely and not on what is (remotely) possible -- simple as that.

And giving them the best education possible is always worth it.

Edited March 16, 2015 by Thailaw

[Rimmer]

An off topic post with messed up quotes has been removed

[PattayaPhom]

Nobody mentioned Phoenix yet. Quite a few parents I know seem impressed. Correct me as I always believed Maryvit to be down past Bang Saray? so mayb a bit far for Raro.

[guzzi850m2]

Maryvit have 2 schools, one is app 2-3km north of BKK/Pat hospital not far from Sukhumvit road on the dark side and the other one near Satahip, so likely the one you mention PattayaPhom.

[chakatee]

Maryvit has a 3rd one since a few years in Bowin. There they're still growing (though already big) so may invest more in decent teachers while the Pattaya area is already a given success so they're starting to slack on teachers with more and more Thai teachers teaching English and 2nd rank Philippine "teachers" (sadly very few of the old batch left).

Note: the Chinese is just a marketing trick and as such a joke. With 1h (?) per week by the time they get to Matayom they may be able to echo a song, say a word or 5 and recognize a character or 3.

Also due to them being a victim of their own success the school's getting overcrowded. Swimming sessions per 2 classes (of 35-40 children!), filthy toilets, lunch break in about 3 sessions for different groups with the first group starting lunch right after breakfast.

So it ain't paradise, far from. But it's the only quality school there is in the area if you can't afford MIS, if you don't want your child to endure traffic during a trip to Assumption Sriracha every day. Unless you'd give Sawang Boriboon school a try, only until Prathom 6 though.