AP Analysis: Is Israel democratic? Not so clear

[BKKBobby]

We're talking about Israeli citizens and yes for Israeli citizens Israel is definitely a democracy.

As far as posting off topic Israeli demonization propaganda ... why not wait until the content actually matches the topic?

The poster from my fb capture is a jew. She has been to Israel countless times. Her mother is from Israel and did her military service in Israel.

What about you?

Edited March 26, 2015 by BKKBobby

[BKKBobby]

Anyway, Israel isnt a democracy. A democracy requires that citizens is equally equal and that some people isnt more equal than others. Im talking about rights as a citizen with no regards to religion. Im not talking about the distribution of wealth.

Edited March 26, 2015 by BKKBobby

[ggold]

Israel is not a democracy

Israel just had elections, That makes it a democracy. Unlike Abbas who should have held presidential elections five years ago but hasn't. So he has usurped the position of President for his own aims, about $100million of them!

Obviously you don't know what democracy is to make such unfounded claims. In a democracy you have elections.

I hope that helps

[BKKBobby]

Israel is not a democracy

Israel just had elections, That makes it a democracy. Unlike Abbas who should have held presidential elections five years ago but hasn't. So he has usurped the position of President for his own aims, about $100million of them!

Obviously you don't know what democracy is to make such unfounded claims. In a democracy you have elections.

I hope that helps

Iran has elections, that makes it a democracy.

[Seastallion]

We're talking about Israeli citizens and yes for Israeli citizens Israel is definitely a democracy.

As far as posting off topic Israeli demonization propaganda ... why not wait until the content actually matches the topic?

For Jewish Israeli citizens it's a democracy, but not for the non-Jewish citizens who are not afforded all the same rights....that's called apartheid.

http://arabisraeliconflict.info/arab-israel-facts/fact-2-arab-israeli-citizens

Today, non-Jewish citizens of Israel constitute about 25% of the population, with 20% being Arabs. Arab Israelis have equal voting rights and their own political parties, serve on the Israeli Knesset, Cabinet, and Supreme Court; hold diplomatic positions; actively participate in the Israeli music and arts scene; and represent Israel on the national soccer team, including winning the Israeli national championship. They are granted all fundamental civil liberties, including freedoms of religion, speech, and assembly, and in fact enjoy more civil rights than Arabs living in any other Middle Eastern country

And yet they are discriminated against by government policy.

That is apartheid.

[Jingthing]

It's just a way to bash Israel. Facts are irrelevant. Israel demonizers don't get that Jewish people are legitimately indigenous in Israel.

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[BKKBobby]

It's just a way to bash Israel. Facts are irrelevant. Israel demonizers don't get that Jewish people are legitimately indigenous in Israel.

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Of course jewish people are indigenous to Israel. The amount of jews had declined to a extreme degree pre-Israel. In todays Israeli territory there was very few jews remaining before the Zionist movement and specifically until the booming of jewish immigrants when Israel became a state. What the torah/bible/koran says is of no importance, god didnt give jews Israel. Religion is not a authority on such topics. Some people even consider religion to be mostly fairytales. Im just adding that. I know you didnt state anything about a right based on the torah that the jewish people can use to claim Israel as its state.

[Scott]

A few off-topic, troll posts have been removed and a lot of replies. Please don't feed the trolls. Those nested quotes cause a lot of posts to be removed.

[ggold]

We're talking about Israeli citizens and yes for Israeli citizens Israel is definitely a democracy.

As far as posting off topic Israeli demonization propaganda ... why not wait until the content actually matches the topic?

For Jewish Israeli citizens it's a democracy, but not for the non-Jewish citizens who are not afforded all the same rights....that's called apartheid.

http://arabisraeliconflict.info/arab-israel-facts/fact-2-arab-israeli-citizens

Today, non-Jewish citizens of Israel constitute about 25% of the population, with 20% being Arabs. Arab Israelis have equal voting rights and their own political parties, serve on the Israeli Knesset, Cabinet, and Supreme Court; hold diplomatic positions; actively participate in the Israeli music and arts scene; and represent Israel on the national soccer team, including winning the Israeli national championship. They are granted all fundamental civil liberties, including freedoms of religion, speech, and assembly, and in fact enjoy more civil rights than Arabs living in any other Middle Eastern country

And yet they are discriminated against by government policy.

That is apartheid.

Rubbish.

[Ulysses G.]

Anyway, Israel isnt a democracy. A democracy requires that citizens is equally equal and that some people isnt more equal than others.

That would mean that there are probably no real democracies on earth. Democracy is a form of government in which citizens choose leaders by free elections - rule of the majority - and Israel fits right in.

[Seastallion]

It's just a way to bash Israel. Facts are irrelevant. Israel demonizers don't get that Jewish people are legitimately indigenous in Israel.

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Glass half empty.....it's not "demonising Israel" per se, to point out Israel's apartheid, rather it's empathising and trying to improve the oppressed non-Jews lot by encouraging awareness.

Ok...according to you, facts about Israel are irrelevant....Not much point discussing it with you then if you insist on living in a fantasy.

Indigenous....Yes, some Israeli Jews are. Some. But what has that got to do with the OP?

[BKKBobby]

Anyway, Israel isnt a democracy. A democracy requires that citizens is equally equal and that some people isnt more equal than others.

That would mean that there are probably no real democracies on earth. Democracy is a form of government in which citizens choose leaders by free elections - rule of the majority - and Israel fits right in.

Lets just use the word democracy whenever a country gives each man one vote or why not remove the word from the dictionary since we always can bend and widen the words meaning to fit the country we want to include. Edited March 26, 2015 by BKKBobby

[ggold]

It's just a way to bash Israel. Facts are irrelevant. Israel demonizers don't get that Jewish people are legitimately indigenous in Israel.

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Glass half empty.....it's not "demonising Israel" per se, to point out Israel's apartheid, rather it's empathising and trying to improve the oppressed non-Jews lot by encouraging awareness.

Ok...according to you, facts about Israel are irrelevant....Not much point discussing it with you then if you insist on living in a fantasy.

Indigenous....Yes, some Israeli Jews are. Some. But what has that got to do with the OP?

it is demonising per say when claiming Israel is apartheid when it is not. There are no arabs only seats on transport, Arabs have the vote, etc etc.

Obviously facts about Israel don't interest you and are irrelevant, "Not much point discussing it with you then if you insist on living in a fantasy"

[Ulysses G.]

Anyway, Israel isnt a democracy. A democracy requires that citizens is equally equal and that some people isnt more equal than others.

That would mean that there are probably no real democracies on earth. Democracy is a form of government in which citizens choose leaders by free elections - rule of the majority - and Israel fits right in.

Lets just use the word democracy whenever a country gives each man one vote or why not remove the word from the dictionary since we always can bend and widen the words meaning to fit the country we want to include.

Of course, each CITIZEN gets a vote in free elections, just like Israel and every other democracy.

[Scott]

Off-topic, troll and inflammatory posts along with replies removed. This thread is about Israel, not Iran.

Stay on topic.

[willyumiii]

This is the solution to a lot of the world's problems.

If Israel is not a democracy, the US can not support them ( kind of like what is going on with Thailand and the US right now )

If the US does not support Israel, there is no Israel.

Problem solved!

[Seastallion]

It's just a way to bash Israel. Facts are irrelevant. Israel demonizers don't get that Jewish people are legitimately indigenous in Israel.

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Glass half empty.....it's not "demonising Israel" per se, to point out Israel's apartheid, rather it's empathising and trying to improve the oppressed non-Jews lot by encouraging awareness.

Ok...according to you, facts about Israel are irrelevant....Not much point discussing it with you then if you insist on living in a fantasy.

Indigenous....Yes, some Israeli Jews are. Some. But what has that got to do with the OP?

it is demonising per say when claiming Israel is apartheid when it is not. There are no arabs only seats on transport, Arabs have the vote, etc etc.

Obviously facts about Israel don't interest you and are irrelevant, "Not much point discussing it with you then if you insist on living in a fantasy"

Without even getting into the West Bank issue........The very fact that Israel has, officially, "Israeli citizens" and "Arab Israeli citizens" is your first hint at discrimination. America has citizens who happen to be black, but the government doesn't designate them as "Black US citizens". Israeli Arabs are an official category of citizen and as such do not enjoy all the rights and privileges of plain "Israeli citizens.

The Israeli government has a scheme to help women with pregnancy and with their babies. Guess what...only Israeli citizens can apply as Arab Israeli citizens are disqualfied for their being Arab.

Wiki;

"In 2009, a comprehensive 18-month independent academic study was completed for the Human Sciences Research Council of South Africa for the South African Department of Foreign Affairs on the legal status of Israel's occupation of East Jerusalem, the West Bank and Gaza Strip.^[62] The specific questions examined in the study were whether Israeli policies are consistent with colonialism and apartheid, as these practices and regimes are spelled out in relevant international legal instruments. The second question, regarding apartheid, was the major focus of the study. Authors and analysts contributing to the study included jurists, academics and international lawyers from Israel, the occupied Palestinian territories, South Africa, England, Ireland and the United States. ...........

....Regarding international law, the team reported that Israel's practices in the OPT correlate almost entirely with the definition of apartheid as established in Article 2 of the International Convention on the Suppression and Punishment of the Crime of Apartheid. ....

...discriminatory privileges based on ascribed ethnicity (legally, as Jewish or non-Jewish); draconian enforced ethnic segregation in all parts of life, including by confining groups to ethnic "reserves and ghettoes"; comprehensive restrictions on individual freedoms, such as movement and expression; a dual legal system based on ethno-national identity (Jewish or Palestinian); denationalization (denial of citizenship); and a special system of laws designed selectively to punish any Palestinian resistance to the system...."

And so on. There's plenty more.

Just because Israel doesn't have Arab or Jew only seats on the bus.....does not mean it isn't an apartheid state.

[BKKBobby]

This is the solution to a lot of the world's problems.

If Israel is not a democracy, the US can not support them ( kind of like what is going on with Thailand and the US right now )

If the US does not support Israel, there is no Israel.

Problem solved!

Thailands democracy cant be understood by farangs, same as with the Israeli democracy. Edited March 26, 2015 by BKKBobby

[ggold]

It's just a way to bash Israel. Facts are irrelevant. Israel demonizers don't get that Jewish people are legitimately indigenous in Israel.

Sent from my Lenovo S820_ROW using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Glass half empty.....it's not "demonising Israel" per se, to point out Israel's apartheid, rather it's empathising and trying to improve the oppressed non-Jews lot by encouraging awareness.

Ok...according to you, facts about Israel are irrelevant....Not much point discussing it with you then if you insist on living in a fantasy.

Indigenous....Yes, some Israeli Jews are. Some. But what has that got to do with the OP?

it is demonising per say when claiming Israel is apartheid when it is not. There are no arabs only seats on transport, Arabs have the vote, etc etc.

Obviously facts about Israel don't interest you and are irrelevant, "Not much point discussing it with you then if you insist on living in a fantasy"

Without even getting into the West Bank issue........The very fact that Israel has, officially, "Israeli citizens" and "Arab Israeli citizens" is your first hint at discrimination. America has citizens who happen to be black, but the government doesn't designate them as "Black US citizens". Israeli Arabs are an official category of citizen and as such do not enjoy all the rights and privileges of plain "Israeli citizens.

The Israeli government has a scheme to help women with pregnancy and with their babies. Guess what...only Israeli citizens can apply as Arab Israeli citizens are disqualfied for their being Arab.

Wiki;

"In 2009, a comprehensive 18-month independent academic study was completed for the Human Sciences Research Council of South Africa for the South African Department of Foreign Affairs on the legal status of Israel's occupation of East Jerusalem, the West Bank and Gaza Strip.^[62] The specific questions examined in the study were whether Israeli policies are consistent with colonialism and apartheid, as these practices and regimes are spelled out in relevant international legal instruments. The second question, regarding apartheid, was the major focus of the study. Authors and analysts contributing to the study included jurists, academics and international lawyers from Israel, the occupied Palestinian territories, South Africa, England, Ireland and the United States. ...........

....Regarding international law, the team reported that Israel's practices in the OPT correlate almost entirely with the definition of apartheid as established in Article 2 of the International Convention on the Suppression and Punishment of the Crime of Apartheid. ....

...discriminatory privileges based on ascribed ethnicity (legally, as Jewish or non-Jewish); draconian enforced ethnic segregation in all parts of life, including by confining groups to ethnic "reserves and ghettoes"; comprehensive restrictions on individual freedoms, such as movement and expression; a dual legal system based on ethno-national identity (Jewish or Palestinian); denationalization (denial of citizenship); and a special system of laws designed selectively to punish any Palestinian resistance to the system...."

And so on. There's plenty more.

Just because Israel doesn't have Arab or Jew only seats on the bus.....does not mean it isn't an apartheid state.

From your link

In contrast, according to former Judge of the Constitutional Court of South Africa Richard Goldstone, the situation in Israel does not conform to the definition of apartheid under the 1998 Rome Statute. As examples, Goldstone pointed to the facts that Israeli Arabs vote, have political representation in the Knesset and occupy positions of acclaim, including on the Israeli Supreme Court, and that Arab patients lie alongside Jewish patients in Israeli hospitals, receiving identical treatment. According to Goldstone, in Israel equal rights are the law, the aspiration and the ideal, and inequities are often successfully challenged in court.

The Citizenship and Entry into Israel Law was passed by the Knesset in 2003 as an interim emergency measure after Israel had suffered its worst ever spate of suicide bombings^[73] and after several Palestinians who had been granted permanent residency on the grounds of family reunification took part in terrorist attacks in Israel.^[74] The law makes inhabitants of Iran, Afghanistan, Lebanon, Libya, Sudan, Syria, Iraq, Pakistan, Yemen, and areas governed by the Palestinian Authority ineligible for the automatic granting of Israeli citizenship and residency permits that is usually available through marriage to an Israeli citizen. This applies equally to a spouse of any Israeli citizen, whether Arab or Jewish, but in practice the law mostly affects Palestinian Israelis living in the towns bordering the West Bank.^[73] The law was intended to be temporary but has since been extended annually.^[75][76]

According to Amnon Rubinstein, a backer of the citizenship law, there are many international precedents for banning citizens of an enemy country in wartime, and with Hamas, which runs the Palestinian Authority, refusing to recognise Israel, that label applies to the Palestinian Authority.^[73]

After the establishment of the state of Israel, the Israel Lands Authority oversaw the administration of these properties. On 8 March 2000, the Israeli Supreme Court ruled that Israeli Arabs, too, had an equal right to purchase long-term leases of such land, even inside previously solely Jewish communities and villages. The court ruled that the government may not allocate land based on religion or ethnicity and may not prevent Arab citizens from living wherever they choose: "The principle of equality prohibits the state from distinguishing between its citizens on the basis of religion or nationality," Chief Justice Aharon Barak wrote. "The principle also applies to the allocation of state land.... The Jewish character of the state does not permit Israel to discriminate between its citizens

I copy this as fair use to refute the main point mentioned in some posts.

[Jingthing]

This is the solution to a lot of the world's problems.

If Israel is not a democracy, the US can not support them ( kind of like what is going on with Thailand and the US right now )

If the US does not support Israel, there is no Israel.

Problem solved!

Thanks for being so honest about your interest in this issue -- the end of Israel.

Same goals as Hamas, Iran, and lots of "anti-Zionists" all over.

[Litlos]

This is the solution to a lot of the world's problems.

If Israel is not a democracy, the US can not support them ( kind of like what is going on with Thailand and the US right now )

If the US does not support Israel, there is no Israel.

Problem solved!

If you believe this I can offer you a few bargains as I have exclusive rights to shares in the Eiffel Tower, Suez Canal and Sydney Harbour bridge which I am prepared to offer at an exclusive discount rate.

Almost every democracy in the world achieves government by horse-trading for seats, China and North Korea come to mind as a couple of "Democracies" where this does not happen. Surprisingly this horse trading for seats happens also in Israel where the most powerful leader comes to the fore.

If the US does not support Israel, a problem, but not the end as US influence under Obama is overstated, and the individuals in the US will continue to lobby and support. If no Israel then probably no Jews either as they will fight anybody trying to kill off Israel. Not a light statement, but one I feel confident in making having worked in the area and having a lot of association and friends with the Jews of Israel.

Cheers

[Ulysses G.]

Without even getting into the West Bank issue........The very fact that Israel has, officially, "Israeli citizens" and "Arab Israeli citizens" is your first hint at discrimination.

This - like most of what you post - is nonsense. There is no such thing as "Israeli citizens" and "Arab Israeli citizens". ALL Israelis qualify as "citizens of Israel."

There are indications of ethnicity on internal documents just like in USA - black, white, Hispanic as opposed to Arab, Jewish or Christian.

Edited March 26, 2015 by Ulysses G.

[Seastallion]

Glass half empty.....it's not "demonising Israel" per se, to point out Israel's apartheid, rather it's empathising and trying to improve the oppressed non-Jews lot by encouraging awareness.

Ok...according to you, facts about Israel are irrelevant....Not much point discussing it with you then if you insist on living in a fantasy.

Indigenous....Yes, some Israeli Jews are. Some. But what has that got to do with the OP?

it is demonising per say when claiming Israel is apartheid when it is not. There are no arabs only seats on transport, Arabs have the vote, etc etc.

Obviously facts about Israel don't interest you and are irrelevant, "Not much point discussing it with you then if you insist on living in a fantasy"

Without even getting into the West Bank issue........The very fact that Israel has, officially, "Israeli citizens" and "Arab Israeli citizens" is your first hint at discrimination. America has citizens who happen to be black, but the government doesn't designate them as "Black US citizens". Israeli Arabs are an official category of citizen and as such do not enjoy all the rights and privileges of plain "Israeli citizens.

The Israeli government has a scheme to help women with pregnancy and with their babies. Guess what...only Israeli citizens can apply as Arab Israeli citizens are disqualfied for their being Arab.

Wiki;

"In 2009, a comprehensive 18-month independent academic study was completed for the Human Sciences Research Council of South Africa for the South African Department of Foreign Affairs on the legal status of Israel's occupation of East Jerusalem, the West Bank and Gaza Strip.^[62] The specific questions examined in the study were whether Israeli policies are consistent with colonialism and apartheid, as these practices and regimes are spelled out in relevant international legal instruments. The second question, regarding apartheid, was the major focus of the study. Authors and analysts contributing to the study included jurists, academics and international lawyers from Israel, the occupied Palestinian territories, South Africa, England, Ireland and the United States. ...........

....Regarding international law, the team reported that Israel's practices in the OPT correlate almost entirely with the definition of apartheid as established in Article 2 of the International Convention on the Suppression and Punishment of the Crime of Apartheid. ....

...discriminatory privileges based on ascribed ethnicity (legally, as Jewish or non-Jewish); draconian enforced ethnic segregation in all parts of life, including by confining groups to ethnic "reserves and ghettoes"; comprehensive restrictions on individual freedoms, such as movement and expression; a dual legal system based on ethno-national identity (Jewish or Palestinian); denationalization (denial of citizenship); and a special system of laws designed selectively to punish any Palestinian resistance to the system...."

And so on. There's plenty more.

Just because Israel doesn't have Arab or Jew only seats on the bus.....does not mean it isn't an apartheid state.

From your link

In contrast, according to former Judge of the Constitutional Court of South Africa Richard Goldstone, the situation in Israel does not conform to the definition of apartheid under the 1998 Rome Statute. As examples, Goldstone pointed to the facts that Israeli Arabs vote, have political representation in the Knesset and occupy positions of acclaim, including on the Israeli Supreme Court, and that Arab patients lie alongside Jewish patients in Israeli hospitals, receiving identical treatment. According to Goldstone, in Israel equal rights are the law, the aspiration and the ideal, and inequities are often successfully challenged in court.

The Citizenship and Entry into Israel Law was passed by the Knesset in 2003 as an interim emergency measure after Israel had suffered its worst ever spate of suicide bombings^[73] and after several Palestinians who had been granted permanent residency on the grounds of family reunification took part in terrorist attacks in Israel.^[74] The law makes inhabitants of Iran, Afghanistan, Lebanon, Libya, Sudan, Syria, Iraq, Pakistan, Yemen, and areas governed by the Palestinian Authority ineligible for the automatic granting of Israeli citizenship and residency permits that is usually available through marriage to an Israeli citizen. This applies equally to a spouse of any Israeli citizen, whether Arab or Jewish, but in practice the law mostly affects Palestinian Israelis living in the towns bordering the West Bank.^[73] The law was intended to be temporary but has since been extended annually.^[75][76]

According to Amnon Rubinstein, a backer of the citizenship law, there are many international precedents for banning citizens of an enemy country in wartime, and with Hamas, which runs the Palestinian Authority, refusing to recognise Israel, that label applies to the Palestinian Authority.^[73]

After the establishment of the state of Israel, the Israel Lands Authority oversaw the administration of these properties. On 8 March 2000, the Israeli Supreme Court ruled that Israeli Arabs, too, had an equal right to purchase long-term leases of such land, even inside previously solely Jewish communities and villages. The court ruled that the government may not allocate land based on religion or ethnicity and may not prevent Arab citizens from living wherever they choose: "The principle of equality prohibits the state from distinguishing between its citizens on the basis of religion or nationality," Chief Justice Aharon Barak wrote. "The principle also applies to the allocation of state land.... The Jewish character of the state does not permit Israel to discriminate between its citizens

I copy this as fair use to refute the main point mentioned in some posts.

So what? Just because Israel doesn't do ALL of South Africa's apartheid practices does nit mean it is itself not apartheid. But that is a deflection, too...I have no desire to bring SA comparisons, as I know that some of them are invalid. The simple fact is that some of Israel's practices and policies are indeed apartheid, you can not refute that by saying some of the policies and practices are not.

[BKKBobby]

Without even getting into the West Bank issue........The very fact that Israel has, officially, "Israeli citizens" and "Arab Israeli citizens" is your first hint at discrimination.

This - like most of what you post - is nonsense. There is no such thing as "Israeli citizens" and "Arab Israeli citizens". ALL Israelis qualify as "citizens of Israel."

There are indications of ethnicity on internal documents just like in USA - black, white, Hispanic as opposed to Arab, Jewish or Christian.

Ok, muslim arab Israeli citizen.

Nonsense hairsplitting. Whats being conveyed will be understood by anyone with a brain bigger than an orange.

[Seastallion]

Without even getting into the West Bank issue........The very fact that Israel has, officially, "Israeli citizens" and "Arab Israeli citizens" is your first hint at discrimination.

This - like most of what you post - is nonsense. There is no such thing as "Israeli citizens" and "Arab Israeli citizens". ALL Israelis qualify as "citizens of Israel."

There are indications of ethnicity on internal documents just like in USA - black, white, Hispanic as opposed to Arab, Jewish or Christian.

Ok, muslim arab Israeli citizen.

Nonsense hairsplitting. Whats being conveyed will be understood by anyone with a brain bigger than an orange.

As usual, UG posts blinkered rubbish without checking the facts.

He can argue with Wiki if he wants, but I shall not waste my time.

Note the word "designation".

"Arab citizens of Israel^[3] is the Israeli government's designation for non-Jewish Israeli citizens, the majority of whosecultural and linguistic heritage or ethnic identity is Arab or Palestinian and commonly self-designate as Palestinian citizens of Israel.^[4] "

[Ulysses G.]

As usual, UG posts blinkered rubbish without checking the facts.

Unlike you, I ALWAYS check the facts before posting. I can ALWAYS back up what I write on here. ALL Israelis qualify as "citizens of Israel." Your claims of "discrimination" are distortions of the facts.

There are indications of ethnicity on internal documents, just like in USA. Black, white, Hispanic as opposed to Arab, Jewish or Christian. The term Arab citizens of Israel refers to nationality - the same as ethnic groups in USA and there are a number of other nationalities - i.e. Israeli Christians, Israeli Jews - with their own designations as well. None of these terms are on passports or ID cards. It is simply bureaucratic information about ethnicity for background information.

According to Israel's Central Bureau of Statistics, the Arab population in 2013 was estimated at 1,658,000, representing 20.7% of the country's population.[2] The majority of these identify themselves as Arab or Palestinian by nationality and Israeli by citizenship.

The very fact that Israel has, officially, "Israeli citizens" and "Arab Israeli citizens" is your first hint at discrimination. America has citizens who happen to be black, but the government doesn't designate them as "Black US citizens".

Edited March 27, 2015 by Ulysses G.

[Seastallion]

As usual, UG posts blinkered rubbish without checking the facts.

Unlike you, I ALWAYS check the facts before posting. I can ALWAYS back up what I write on here. ALL Israelis qualify as "citizens of Israel." Your claims of "discrimination" are distortions of the facts.

There are indications of ethnicity on internal documents, just like in USA. Black, white, Hispanic as opposed to Arab, Jewish or Christian. The term Arab citizens of Israel refers to nationality - the same as ethnic groups in USA and there are a number of other nationalities - i.e. Israeli Christians, Israeli Jews - with their own designations as well. None of these terms are on passports or ID cards. It is simply bureaucratic information about ethnicity for background information.

According to Israel's Central Bureau of Statistics, the Arab population in 2013 was estimated at 1,658,000, representing 20.7% of the country's population.[2] The majority of these identify themselves as Arab or Palestinian by nationality and Israeli by citizenship.

The very fact that Israel has, officially, "Israeli citizens" and "Arab Israeli citizens" is your first hint at discrimination. America has citizens who happen to be black, but the government doesn't designate them as "Black US citizens".

Well, you'd better check your facts again and ascertain the difference between "government designation" and "identify themselves".

One is official, the other is personal.

BTW..."simply bureaucratic information" is indeed what we're talking about!

[Ulysses G.]

You need to work out the difference between citizenship and ethnicity. ALL Israelis qualify as "citizens of Israel." Black people in America are required to provide bureaucratic information about their race. The same is true in Israel for Arabs, Jews and other ethnic groups.

Edited March 27, 2015 by Ulysses G.

[Seastallion]

You need to work out the difference between citizenship and ethnicity. ALL Israelis qualify as "citizens of Israel." Black people in America are required to provide bureaucratic information about their race. The same is true in Israel for Arabs, Jews and other ethnic groups.

You'd better work out what "designate" means and implies. America does not designate some of it's citizens as "black American citizens". They are American citizens who are black...it's not a designation as in Israel's case.

Bureaucratic information can be used to describe boring statistics, as in America or it can be used to distinguish between citizens, as in Israel.

What about the motherhood program that the designated Arab Israeli citizens don't qualify for because of their designation?

Go back and fully understand what "designate" means and implies before you attempt to answer.

Oh, and speaking of checking your facts....your recent lie about me using the term "Israeli Firsters" (at all, let alone "an inordinate number of times") is a clear example of you not checking your facts....another clear as day lie is that you check your facts. You don't.

[Ulysses G.]

You'd better work out what "designate" means and implies.

Maybe you should look up the definition:.

To indicate or specify; point out:

African Americans in America are required to designate their ethnic group on some official documents as are Jewish, Arab and Druze Israelis. However, they are ALL CITIZENS of their respective countries.

It is too bad that you don't spend this much time trying to look up actual facts instead of attempting to "prove" dishonest spin and distortions.

Edited March 27, 2015 by Ulysses G.