Maize and Rotational Crops

[farmerjo]

Was going well till we got an inch of rain late last night.

[IsaanAussie]

If you can't sell it, is it worth baling? Perhaps give it an EMA spray and let it compost where it is then turn it in? Another thought, if you get straw mushrooms near you then maybe you could use the bales for that? The spores are on my rice straw or via the wind and germinate and grow on wet straw bales. Then I compost the straw.

Under TIT norms, light a match. LOL

[farmerjo]

Hi I/A

Probably more interested to see what a bale will come out like to start.

Under no obligations to bale all the 70 rai at this stage. 

The local contractor has an old style new holland baler.(20 baht a bale)

There can be many uses but you need a stock pile to start.

From the picture above,anybody got any estimates of how many bales it would produce?

2-3000?

 

 

[kickstart]

Can it go for Bio fuel,if any one in your area has a big baler that makes big round bales, last year some one posted some photos of a contractor baling some sugar cane straw for bio fuel that was somewhere in Issan.

As for baling it  as feed for cattle ,it would have to be very dry ,or it would heat up and probable go moldy, some buffalo's might eat it but feed value would be poor.

Good hay ,here in Thailand is about 100 120 baht/bale ,haulage in a big part of cost ,rice straw is now about 30-35 baht /bale, price dropping now rice harvest has stated ,your rice grass in bales ,would be about the same price as rice straw.

As for compost it has hard storks and   would take some rotting down  if it could be incorporated in to the soil ,it would do some good ,but finding the equipment to incorporate  the stuff not easy .

Problem is a lot of the seed has from the seed heads has dropped ,so it will grow again next year, as IA said TIT and burn it ,it will get rid of some of the seeds ,they will be a few units of P and K in the ash.

 

[wayned]

3 hours ago, farmerjo said:

Hi I/A

Probably more interested to see what a bale will come out like to start.

Under no obligations to bale all the 70 rai at this stage. 

The local contractor has an old style new holland baler.(20 baht a bale)

There can be many uses but you need a stock pile to start.

From the picture above,anybody got any estimates of how many bales it would produce?

2-3000?

 

 

Or you could bale it all and start a new venture and go a buy a couple of cows. I'm sure that your wife will relish taking care of them when you are away as they have to be fed 365 days per year. and giving shots and castration is so much fun even with a head gate. I raised them in the US for about 10 years, never again!

[farmerjo]

8 hours ago, wayned said:

Or you could bale it all and start a new venture and go a buy a couple of cows. I'm sure that your wife will relish taking care of them when you are away as they have to be fed 365 days per year. and giving shots and castration is so much fun even with a head gate. I raised them in the US for about 10 years, never again!

Been down that path before,sure it won't happen again.

That's how i ended with tractors and a harvester.

[CLW]

Or you could bale it all and start a new venture and go a buy a couple of cows. I'm sure that your wife will relish taking care of them when you are away as they have to be fed 365 days per year. and giving shots and castration is so much fun even with a head gate. I raised them in the US for about 10 years, never again!

Beef cows are the easier burden.
At least they "just" need to be fed daily.
Get some dairy cows and say goodbye to your normal life...
Back home in my village all farmers except one got rid of their animals and growing crops now.
The one who's still in the business has a mother-calf herd.
He said his life has never been easier.

[IsaanAussie]

18 hours ago, farmerjo said:

Hi I/A

Probably more interested to see what a bale will come out like to start.

Under no obligations to bale all the 70 rai at this stage. 

The local contractor has an old style new holland baler.(20 baht a bale)

There can be many uses but you need a stock pile to start.

From the picture above,anybody got any estimates of how many bales it would produce?

2-3000?

 

 

Our local guy had a square baler "cobble up" mounted on a pickup chassis. It had a Nissan badge on it to let you made it was a factory machine.... but it packed a tight bale. A mate came over to watch the four guys with forks loading in the straw, before they started he asked "<deleted> is that?" I said a Nissan!

He would make to whatever length you wanted, which was great as the storage area was a metre wide so that what he made. We used to get about 100 bales from 12 rai of Hom Mali straw. So looking at the height of that grass I would guess you would get at least that many per rai (about 8)? I used to pay 15 baht a bale but that was with the straw in a pile from the thresher so no need to move about. 

[kickstart]

Looking at the height of that grass ,and looking at Google ,how many bales of hay an acre ,mainly American web pages I would say 25 -35 bales /rie  with an average weight /of 25kg -30,they is a lot of depends , like is it an even crop, and even height.

If you are going to bale the grass it will have to be rowed up so the baler can pick up the grass ,you said you had an inch of rain ,I would say the grass underneath  would still be wet ,so it will  need turning over to dry before it can be baled.

So, can you find a hay turner in your area, I would say not easy to find an old acrobat ,as we use to call them ,like in the photo would do the job ,I have seen a few about but not common ,they are a few PTO driven ones about ,we have one in this area, again not common . 

[farmerjo]

Hi KS,

Will finish cutting today and wait a week to dry out.

I've cut it about 10 inches above ground level.

Pretty sure the contractor has only the baler and have not seen a rake in the district.

I enquired to buy a rake that was advertised on here but the guy wanted to sell the package of cutter,rake and baler which was fair enough.

I also did enquire at local machinery mob,90 days ex china 35,000 baht for a 4 wheel one but at the time wasn't that important.

Will see how a few bales turn out with them scouring the field with the baler and will still look for a rake as any harvester windrows will need raking in the future. 

That picture looks like in Thailand mate.

Edited November 11, 2018 by farmerjo

[wayned]

37 minutes ago, farmerjo said:

Pretty sure the contractor has only the baler and have not seen a rake in the district.

If the guy is offering baling services, he must at least have access to a rake.  Hard to bail properly unless dried and raked in rows.

[kickstart]

20 minutes ago, wayned said:

If the guy is offering baling services, he must at least have access to a rake.  Hard to bail properly unless dried and raked in rows.

That thought occurred to me, being in ain a big cow area we have a few balers, all for baling rice straw, most balers belong to straw merchants, they buy, bale and sell the rice straw, they do not have a hay turner.

We have one PTO driven hay turner /hay bob in the area, I think it belongs to a farmer, uses it to row up rice straw. mainly for his own use 

[IsaanAussie]

There are lots of "disgarded" square balers in Oz, with most now using big round balers. Be nice to get a few of the antiques shipped over. Most are just rusting away. 

[wayned]

26 minutes ago, IsaanAussie said:

There are lots of "discarded" square balers in Oz, with most now using big round balers. Be nice to get a few of the antiques shipped over. Most are just rusting away. 

The problem with that is cost, especially on low price used equipment: 

1. They would have to be disassembled and packed in a container,

2.  Internal land transport in Aus and then sea freight to Bangkok

3. Port charges on arrival

4.  Customs duty

5.  VAT

6.  Internal delivery in Thailand to your facility

7.  Unpacking the container and assembly of the units., an unseen erector set with no instructions.

 

Not cheap.  I've imported three John Deere combines from Minnesota in the US and believe me it is not cheap.

 

[farmerjo]

After all the hype i've decided not to go ahead with the straw baling.

53mm of rain over a week and no rake to turn it made the decision easier.

Cost me 85 baht/rai in diesel to slash it so a little more than burning would of been.

Will let the worms do there thing and have that soil armour through the dry season.

Still have rice to cut later so can bale some of that for my fence project.

Thanks for all the input 

[kickstart]

Looking at your original photo and the amount of grass that the worms have to work at, they will be busy.

I can still see a lot of that grass still on the surface next year at drilling time, with your no-till system ,the direct drill would have a job to cut through  that  old grass to get too the soil underneath and drill the crop, Ok by May next year a lot will have rotted down ,but a lot will still be on the surface .

I know you are trying for a no-till system, but they is a lot of grass they and a lot of the seeds will have been shed and will grow again next year.

What it wants is incorporating into the soil, on that clay land of yours all that organic matter would do the soil some good,

So how, maybe a Thai Pan-Chet, 7 discs, disc plough would help one or maybe two passes, best of all a one pass cultivator .a frame with ridged tines and spring tines, maybe a crumbler bar at the back, not difficult to make, it would incorporate the grass a treat, with your acreage it would soon pay for its self. 

I

[kickstart]

Looking at your original photo and the amount of grass that the worms have to work at, they will be busy.

I can still see a lot of that grass still on the surface next year at drilling time, with your no-till system ,the direct drill would have a job to cut through  that  old grass to get too the soil underneath and drill the crop, Ok by May next year a lot will have rotted down ,but a lot will still be on the surface .

I know you are trying for a no-till system, but they is a lot of grass they and a lot of the seeds will have been shed and will grow again next year.

What it wants is incorporating into the soil, on that clay land of yours all that organic matter would do the soil some good,

So how, maybe a Thai Pan-Chet, 7 discs, disc plough would help one or maybe two passes, best of all a one pass cultivator .a frame with ridged tines and spring tines, maybe a crumbler bar at the back, not difficult to make, it would incorporate the grass a treat, with your acreage it would soon pay for its self. 

I

[kickstart]

Combining maize, just up from our place, this guy will be happy he is getting 7.50baht/kg, best price this year, moisture will be low.

But with lack of rain, the yield will not be great a lot of the cobs not full,

But 3 hours after combining this crop we had 17 mm of rain, in two showers, most we have had for over 3 weeks, about the last for this year, wife says not so, we shall see. 

Where else can you block a road while emptying a combine, 

[Kasane]

Hi. I am a newbie on TV. Also trying my hand at farming, newbie there too. I am glad I found this forum with many selfless experienced contributors. I had my first experience planting rice this season on a 5 rai plot, though the farm itself is about 12 rai. Grew Jasmine and sticky rice. Had problems with golden snail (I think that's what they are called) during growing season. Just finished cutting (farm labor, by hand) and the rice dries out in another two days. Then bundle, thresh, distribute some to family, save seeds for next season, and sell the remainder. I think I will be in a 10k baht hole for this crop. That's ok for now and with time it will hopefully change so that each crop is at least b/e.

 

I am considering planting a maize crop in Dec to harvest in Apr-May. Any pointers regarding seeds quality, soil prep, info on direct drill manual machines, water requirement, pests and weed control are greatly appreciated. 

 

Lastly, there are many Teak trees on the property, some mature, some young. I believe there are laws restricting Teak trees cutting but am not familiar with the laws. Any pointers are appreciated. 

 

 

[wayned]

9 minutes ago, Kasane said:

I am considering planting a maize crop in Dec to harvest in Apr-May. Any pointers regarding seeds quality, soil prep, info on direct drill manual machines, water requirement, pests and weed control are greatly appreciated

Where are you located?  Unless you are going to irrigate it, corn here, Nakhon Sawan Province. is planted at the start of rainy season around May 1 and harvested in August/September.

[Kasane]

I am in Na Klang district, in Nong Bua Lam Phu I have a pond on the property and can irrigate the crop.

 

[kickstart]

4 hours ago, Kasane said:

I am in Na Klang district, in Nong Bua Lam Phu I have a pond on the property and can irrigate the crop.

 

As wayned said corn is normally grown in the wet season, you can irrigate the crop but will irrigation cost

outweigh the cost of selling the crop, also growing corn out of season is they a buyer in your area that will buy just a few tons, some buyers will not buy a small amount, out of season, for them to much hassle, they will not have a buyer to sell it on too for just a few tons.

Have you thought of sweet corn you could  sell it by a roadside, or load a motorbike up and sell it locally, 

Re your questions about growing maize, this thread will have your answers. 

As for teak trees, look in TV history they is a thread about them.

[wayned]

4 hours ago, kickstart said:

Have you thought of sweet corn you could  sell it by a roadside, or load a motorbike up and sell it locally

Off season here, some farmers plant small fields of sweet corn and baby corn, irrigate it and pack the harvest in a truck and take it to the big wholesale market in Bangkok, Pathum Thanni, I think.  The harvest is done during the night and the corn is loaded and on the way to the market, fresh, before 0600, with a 2 hour trip to Bangkok.

[kickstart]

11 hours ago, wayned said:

Off season here, some farmers plant small fields of sweet corn and baby corn, irrigate it and pack the harvest in a truck and take it to the big wholesale market in Bangkok, Pathum Thanni, I think.  The harvest is done during the night and the corn is loaded and on the way to the market, fresh, before 0600, with a 2 hour trip to Bangkok.

The wholesale market is known as the Dalart Thai, it is near Rangsit, just north on Bangkok.

We have the Petchaboon-Saraburi-Bangkok road near here, and I regularly see loads of sweet corn, and now cabbages, grown in Petchaboon Provence, all bound for the Darlart Thai, loads taller than they are wide (but this is Thailand after all ).

Those members from the UK will remember the old Covent Garden market in London, this is the Thai version 

 .They say Covent Garden had a Pub with special licensing hours that stayed open all night and shut, I think it was 5-6.00am, they said it sold a gallon of whiskey over one night,

Harvesting at night is a new one to me, good to see some grower do think about the quality of their crops they are selling. 

[Kasane]

16 hours ago, kickstart said:

you can irrigate the crop but will irrigation cost outweigh the cost of selling the crop, also growing corn out of season is they a buyer in your area that will buy just a few tons, some buyers will not buy a small amount, out of season, for them to much hassle, they will not have a buyer to sell it on too for just a few tons.

Have you thought of sweet corn you could  sell it by a roadside, or load a motorbike up and sell it locally, 

Re your questions about growing maize, this thread will have your answers. 

As for teak trees, look in TV history they is a thread about them.

I was thinking of installing a solar operated water pump. After the initial panel, pump, and pipelines cost the system may pay for itself in the power cost saved over the years, if there is no theft of the system. Thanks for the sweet corn lead. I'll look into it in more detail.

[MikeN]

Re: teak trees

 The govt has approved changes in the law to make it easier to harvest teak and other trees on private land, I believe it is still in the process of getting royal assent and then publication in the Royal Gazette before it actually comes into law. There was a thread here on “big trees” that had a link to the latest news.

[kickstart]

What is  it ?, near here Pacific seeds have an R and D station, research and development .they try out new strains of maize varieties on 3-4 rie plots, been they 20 years, and have had or still have a farang manager.

They just mono-crop maize, this year for the first time they have grown some sun hemp,they have grown some mungbean in the past .

 Not certain what they are going to do with it ,best thing disc it in, then plough the field .

So I wonder  if FJ's Ider of growing Sunhemp has come this far south ???? .

[CLW]

What is  it ?, near here Pacific seeds have an R and D station, research and development .they try out new strains of maize varieties on 3-4 rie plots, been they 20 years, and have had or still have a farang manager.
They just mono-crop maize, this year for the first time they have grown some sun hemp,they have grown some mungbean in the past .
 Not certain what they are going to do with it ,best thing disc it in, then plough the field .
So I wonder  if FJ's Ider of growing Sunhemp has come this far south [emoji3] .

Maybe they harvest the seeds and plow in the straw and stubble.

[kickstart]

11 hours ago, CLW said:

13 hours ago, kickstart said:

What is  it ?, near here Pacific seeds have an R and D station, research and development .they try out new strains of maize varieties on 3-4 rie plots, been they 20 years, and have had or still have a farang manager.
They just mono-crop maize, this year for the first time they have grown some sun hemp,they have grown some mungbean in the past .
 Not certain what they are going to do with it ,best thing disc it in, then plough the field .
So I wonder  if FJ's Ider of growing Sunhemp has come this far south  .

Maybe they harvest the seeds and plow in the straw and stubble.

Thought did cross my mind, but they have no combine and get one in for just a few rie .........unless they harvest it by hand and put it through a mobile thrasher, which I think they have, but that would be a crap job.

[wayned]

This has been the most unusual year in the 20 years that I have lived here.  Normally the corn is harvested in late August, sunflowers are planted and the Sugar cane harvest begins in November.  This, due to the wet weather, some of the corn fields were replanted the second time, others were planted with sorghum and I've even seen some sun hemp.  There are very few Sunflower fields.  We are currently harvesting the corn, a good crop, and the sorghum.  Most of the Sun hemp is just being plowed under.  The sugar cane harvest has yet to begin.