Ousted Thai PM Yingluck proclaims innocence as criminal trial starts

[heybruce]

Yingluck herself has said the rice scheme "lifted the quality of life for rice farmers"

Tell that to the families of farmers who went bankrupt and killed themselves months after you failed to deliver payment as promised. Most of them only got paid after you were thrown out of office.

You understand that they got paid only because the Junta abolished the constitution that prevented payment from being made?

Why were payments not made months before the Amnesty bill fiasco sparked mass protests?

Why didn't she ensure provisions and necessary borrowings were made prior to dissolving parliament?

Why did members of her brother's cabinet insist there was enough money to pay the farmers and then didn't?

Why did she vow the farmers would be paid "next week" when she knew there was no money?

Why wasn't there an election so the voters could kick her and her party out of government?

Oh wait...I just remembered.

[djjamie]

After 2 years 9 months and 2 days in office it has been concluded that a minimum of 700 billion baht was lost and 3 million tons of rice stolen so for every HOUR yingluck was PM she lost 26.8 million baht & 18,500 kgs of rice... thats PER HOUR! That's the rice committee chairman. The one that never attended one meeting. Not one meeting and when Supa who was not affiliated to any party, but was aligned with trying to uncover truth that the majority deserved to hear she politely provided constructive criticism stating through first hand knowledge that there was corruption in the scheme. I women that is not negligent would take this seriously and investigate it. No yingluck got on the defensive told Supa to investigate before yingluck sacked and investigated her.

Negligence is an understatement and if anyone says that is not negligence I really want to come and work at your business if you have one. I would not turn up for work for 2 years and 9 months. I would go to the Maldives and Africa for "important business meetings" yet cannot explain exactly what they were for and if you dare sack me I will claim innocence and you will defend me because you defend yingluck. The courts should ask her were the rice committee meetings were held. I bet she has more chance of describing the location of the Maldives than she would about the meeting room.

When yingluck still proclaims innocent after the overwhelming evidence the "car dashboard head bobble toy" kicks in without thought or logic. Ummmm, yingluck innocent. Derrrr, OK. Don't question it. 26.8 million bat of taxpayers money wasted per hour! Is this figure completely lost on some? It takes me an hour to go from Bumrungrad hospital to Plaza Anthenee in heavy traffic and I complain when the taxi costs me 100 baht!! Most on the forum do as well! BUT when it is not their money…Oh boy that is a different story as can be seen here. The majority does not deserve 26.8 million baht an hour. The tax payer definitely doesn't. You know who deserves it? The farmers. If 26.8 million baht went into the rice farmers pockets it would be OK, but nothing has changed. They are still as poor today as 15 years ago after over 1.5 trillion baht has apparently gone into schemes to help them and the poorest never got a cent. Not a cent.

By the way how much did her trip to the Maldives give back to Thailand economically?

[ScarpoFongness4U]

Ousted?

Or dissolved her government in good faith to open a new election in which her opponents expected her to win, so Uncle Suthep called in his friends?

[djjamie]

Yingluck herself has said the rice scheme "lifted the quality of life for rice farmers"

Tell that to the families of farmers who went bankrupt and killed themselves months after you failed to deliver payment as promised. Most of them only got paid after you were thrown out of office.

You understand that they got paid only because the Junta abolished the constitution that prevented payment from being made?

Why were payments not made months before the Amnesty bill fiasco sparked mass protests?

Why didn't she ensure provisions and necessary borrowings were made prior to dissolving parliament?

Why did members of her brother's cabinet insist there was enough money to pay the farmers and then didn't?

Why did she vow the farmers would be paid "next week" when she knew there was no money?

Why wasn't there an election so the voters could kick her and her party out of government?

Oh wait...I just remembered.

Because yingluck didn't want one as shown through not protecting any polling stations with the millions of soldiers at her disposal because she knew she would have lost the election because of the very reasons that Baerboxer highlighted and you refuse to answer because you have none!

She had a good hunch too (well her brother did) going by the votes that were tabulated and showed she would have lost.

Again putting the party before the people.

Very pertinent points that were made that you cannot deny held the majority in contempt and you still harp on about an election which even though they would not have won, if they had it reinforces even more the corrosive influence of unsustainable populism in destroying democracies.

But apparently you have a short memory so back to the point. Care to answer the questions that highlighted a contempt for the majority?

Concentrate now, don't change the subject.

[JoshuaCaleb]

Yingluck herself has said the rice scheme "lifted the quality of life for rice farmers"

Tell that to the families of farmers who went bankrupt and killed themselves months after you failed to deliver payment as promised. Most of them only got paid after you were thrown out of office.

You understand that they got paid only because the Junta abolished the constitution that prevented payment from being made?

Is there real evidence of the Junta being involved, or is this just speculation?

Also, what I am seeing in this article is that Yingluck agrees with points of loss, etc, but not admitting to being responsible. There are people who do not support Yingluck who want to show that she is responsible, and there are people who support her who to show that she is not.. Hopefully, all the facts will be honestly shown on both sides and this will be resolved showing the actual truth and not be able to push anybody's agenda into this situation.

[Muirton]

It is a little prepubescent to make fun of the Asian difficulty with English at times.

It does not matter if you are Japanese,Mexican or Taiwanese. Someone who rightfully holds a Masters Degree in English should do better.

Thank you three times.

Let me see if I understand you.

You are saying that walking through a few thousand people, with hundreds of cameras rolling, on her way to trial .. you have a problem with her English?

I have heard native English speakers with far lower vocabularies and general comprehension skills.

If there is a problem sir, I believe it resides within you.

May I ask what specifically is your complaint?

(You know this is an exercise in futility .. yes? .. that woman could run into a burning building and save three babies and a puppy, and you would make fun of the soot on her nose.)

It is very very safe to say the fascist contributors to any thread involving the Shinawats don't speak Thai at all [past bar-girl vocabulary] while the Shinawats indeed do speak English. Yingluk's American-English accent is not good -- but my Thai accent in rural Thailand is much worse.

yes but do you claim to have a masters degree in thai....no..you dont end of

Don't speak for me, ok? I'll do that myself.

[bristolgeoff]

I,am innocent just like my brother who lives overseas now.i should have run like my brother advised me when I was abroad

.now I,am stuck and have to answer all those questions about losing billions of thailands money

[tomacht8]

Hopefully, the investigating authorities give a lot of effort.
500.000.000.000 Baht can not so easily disappear without leaving a trace on (state) accounts.
Who has signed 500 million Baht cashier's checks?
This was not a subsidy, more a heist of state funds.
The small farmers have received nothing and the tax payers pay the bill.
Innocent?
Never.

[BSJ]

"Yingluck herself has said the rice scheme "lifted the quality of life for rice farmers" " Yes it did for 2 years, then it all started going down hill. Now rice farmers are worse off and will be for years to come.

[wowfactor10]

She is well respected by the Thais..

This lady has some class and dignity and Thais do notice that!

[mikemac]

Well after reading and seeing reports from many of the leading western news outlets they are all reporting the same as AFP. Who should I believe, the world's top news organisations or some idiot yellow keyboard warriors on TVF?

some idiot yellow keyboard warriors on TVF?

The ease with which you use invectives for those you disagree with says much of your character.

At least he makes it easier to identify him as just another red troll. Probably on his third or fourth identity on TVF.

[gemguy]

I have to agree.

I despise the Yellow shirts more than the Red shirts while a guilty verdict with leniency is one thing while a guilty verdict with a prison sentence may just be the match that lights the rage within the mass of citizens that may very well more than protest this vindictive move.

Throwing the book at her is not going to stop the endemic corruption and wide spread malfeasance practiced by the politicians and the rich and powerful and or the police and military and anyone who is in a position to do so or realizes an opportunity to do so.

What it will do is thwart the efforts of the opposition to the existing Status Quo....but it will not stop the opposition from politically challenging the Status Quo from gaining political ground in some way and finding other means to do so.

You can only surmise when a non Yellow Shirt political party gains power I guess they will feel justified when they go about vindictively suppressing the Yellow Shirt opposition and more or less copy the way the military is presently maneuvering about to suppress the opposition at present.

A sort of vicious cycle that will never end.

Cheers

What is vindictive about asking the ex-PM where B700 billion went to? Even the NE red supporters would like that answered because they know THEY didn't get it.

And what did the nation get for that huge sum? A corrupt and incompetent government more interested in the boss than them isn't what they want to hear.

Very simple.

Then hold all prime ministers former, present and in the future responsible for any programs that did not or do not meet or exceed the expectations of the political opposition......all based on where did the money go.

What you point out is the same for every Thai government administration that has been in power ( mainly the Yellow Shits )

They should also be held accountable for all the billions they stole or miss managed long before Yingluck came along....but they are not being held accountable....and never will be as long as the military is there to make sure they are not held accountable....but their political opposition will be made accountable by the military...under threat of military force if need be.

If you can not see that the Military administrations maneuvering is vindictive then you are missing what is really going on in the guise of Justice being served.

This will not stop the present government administration from plundering the government coffers and neither will it stop the Yellow shirts party from plundering the government coffers when they are put back into power by the Military

[NongKhaiKid]

All of this ' but they did it too and before us ' goes nowhere especially coming from expats who don't have a vote.

In doesn't matter who gets into power as there ill always be abuses because that's how it works here along with the nepotism and cronyism as with ' justice ' on a revenge tit for tat basis.

I can't vote but it doesn't mean I don't take an interest because what happens can and does affect me one way or another but there's no need for me to take sides to the extent some do.

[halloween]

I have to agree.

I despise the Yellow shirts more than the Red shirts while a guilty verdict with leniency is one thing while a guilty verdict with a prison sentence may just be the match that lights the rage within the mass of citizens that may very well more than protest this vindictive move.

Throwing the book at her is not going to stop the endemic corruption and wide spread malfeasance practiced by the politicians and the rich and powerful and or the police and military and anyone who is in a position to do so or realizes an opportunity to do so.

What it will do is thwart the efforts of the opposition to the existing Status Quo....but it will not stop the opposition from politically challenging the Status Quo from gaining political ground in some way and finding other means to do so.

You can only surmise when a non Yellow Shirt political party gains power I guess they will feel justified when they go about vindictively suppressing the Yellow Shirt opposition and more or less copy the way the military is presently maneuvering about to suppress the opposition at present.

A sort of vicious cycle that will never end.

Cheers

What is vindictive about asking the ex-PM where B700 billion went to? Even the NE red supporters would like that answered because they know THEY didn't get it.

And what did the nation get for that huge sum? A corrupt and incompetent government more interested in the boss than them isn't what they want to hear.

Very simple.

Then hold all prime ministers former, present and in the future responsible for any programs that did not or do not meet or exceed the expectations of the political opposition......all based on where did the money go.

What you point out is the same for every Thai government administration that has been in power ( mainly the Yellow Shits )

They should also be held accountable for all the billions they stole or miss managed long before Yingluck came along....but they are not being held accountable....and never will be as long as the military is there to make sure they are not held accountable....but their political opposition will be made accountable by the military...under threat of military force if need be.

If you can not see that the Military administrations maneuvering is vindictive then you are missing what is really going on in the guise of Justice being served.

This will not stop the present government administration from plundering the government coffers and neither will it stop the Yellow shirts party from plundering the government coffers when they are put back into power by the Military

I'm glad that you agree. I certainly have no problem with all being held accountable. But where should we start; with those long dead or having fled the country?

How about with the one still here, with her excesses large and recent in the eyes of the punters?

Have you any proof that the current government is "plundering the government coffers"?

[Muirton]

It is very very safe to say the fascist contributors to any thread involving the Shinawats don't speak Thai at all [past bar-girl vocabulary] while the Shinawats indeed do speak English. Yingluk's American-English accent is not good -- but my Thai accent in rural Thailand is much worse.

I quite understand that your Thai is limited, and that you get your input via your politically biased g/f, but that is no reason to assume that deficiency extends to other posters. None of whom AFAIK claim to have completed a higher education degree in Thai.

The extent of the Shinawatras abuse of the democratic system to further their criminality is more than obvious. What leads you to ignore that?

Reality compels.

[halloween]

It is very very safe to say the fascist contributors to any thread involving the Shinawats don't speak Thai at all [past bar-girl vocabulary] while the Shinawats indeed do speak English. Yingluk's American-English accent is not good -- but my Thai accent in rural Thailand is much worse.

I quite understand that your Thai is limited, and that you get your input via your politically biased g/f, but that is no reason to assume that deficiency extends to other posters. None of whom AFAIK claim to have completed a higher education degree in Thai.

The extent of the Shinawatras abuse of the democratic system to further their criminality is more than obvious. What leads you to ignore that?

Reality compels.

And BS smells.

[Yunla]

It is a good thing that questions are being asked of people at the top of this rice project, as huge amounts of money were involved and the amounts do not seem to add up. I have no idea where the money went, so I can not really comment on this aspect of the trial. But it is not a 'witch-hunt' to investigate these type of self-collapsing schemes, they are often intentionally used as bold and circuitous paths of plunder.

I do like to poke fun at Yingluck, but it is playful and a way of coping with my shocked disbelief. Obviously she was involved at the top in the rice project, and obviously there are many serious questions being asked about the project, so I think it is only right that she defends her role in it. My actual problems with Yingluck are more relating to her role as PM generally. I believe she was totally unfit to command, based on issues such as her floods-response, her absenteeism, the endless trips abroad, her obsession with family passports, etc.

I had no confidence in her as a PM, she seemed to be like one of those abstract art installations, where something is both "here and not here at the same time." I think this is why this trial is so interesting to me, because it is the first time I've seen her forced to just be "here."

Edited May 20, 2015 by Yunla

[Langsuan Man]

We can come back here in a couple of years and will be talking about all the corrupt schemes that the current military masters are responsible for

The large infrastructure projects like the high speed rail plan promoted by them will just turn out to be as corrupt or more corrupt than the rice scheme was

History is written by the winners and justice is in the eye of whoever is in power when it is being dispensed

Just move along, there is nothing new to see here

[Guest]

WOW - Yingluck has a masters degree in English language ?.

Well, if that's true it was clearly bought and paid for : seems like she started her life of cheating and lies sooner than we thought.

I am from election. I am from election. lol.

In a word ... "NO"

Yingluck grew up in Chiang Mai and attended Regina Coeli College, a private girls' school, for the lower secondary level, followed by Yupparaj College, a co-educational school, at the upper secondary level. She graduated with a BA degree from the Faculty of Political Science and Public Administration, at Chiang Mai University in 1988 and received a MPA degree (specialization in Management Information Systems) from Kentucky State University in 1991. (Source - Wikipedia)

[Guest]

It is a good thing that questions are being asked of people at the top of this rice project, as huge amounts of money were involved and the amounts do not seem to add up. I have no idea where the money went, so I can not really comment on this aspect of the trial. But it is not a 'witch-hunt' to investigate these type of self-collapsing schemes, they are often intentionally used as bold and circuitous paths of plunder.

I do like to poke fun at Yingluck, but it is playful and a way of coping with my shocked disbelief. Obviously she was involved at the top in the rice project, and obviously there are many serious questions being asked about the project, so I think it is only right that she defends her role in it. My actual problems with Yingluck are more relating to her role as PM generally. I believe she was totally unfit to command, based on issues such as her floods-response, her absenteeism, the endless trips abroad, her obsession with family passports, etc.

I had no confidence in her as a PM, she seemed to be like one of those abstract art installations, where something is both "here and not here at the same time." I think this is why this trial is so interesting to me, because it is the first time I've seen her forced to just be "here."

Thank you for this posting which is candid and thoughtful.

Everyone thinks I am 100% behind her ... etc .. I just get annoyed when people make up their own "facts" (Example, the claim she has a Master's in English, when her degree is Public Administration.)

I think it is insightful to point out that in this age of the "Cult of Personality" one can lead from behind, or not at all.

Love the concept that she is forced to be "here" now.

Also interested in the outcome, since I view it all as Kabuki Theater with a scripted outcome .. just interested in how they do it.

[ThaiUser]

Yingluck herself has said the rice scheme "lifted the quality of life for rice farmers"

Tell that to the families of farmers who went bankrupt and killed themselves months after you failed to deliver payment as promised. Most of them only got paid after you were thrown out of office.

Out of fairness you should also mentioned who stopped the payments to the farmers via an appeal to the courts when Yingluck was still PM.

Out of fairness you should also mention that Yingluck's government stopped paying farmers months before protests. Yingluck dissolved parliament and then found out caretaker governments can't borrow money. She also vowed to pay them without a clue where the money would come from.

Still, knowing the law, abiding by it and respecting it never been a Shiniwatra strong point.

With the first part of your comment I can only agree but have to add that you have to look at the situation in the country and the reasons why parliament was disolved. Without the situation that got the country to a stand off between government and protestors there would have been no elections (and we know how they turned out).

The last part of your comment I think is true and applies to all political colours as history and recent past have shown us, or didn't they?

[FangFerang]

Yingluck herself has said the rice scheme "lifted the quality of life for rice farmers"

Tell that to the families of farmers who went bankrupt and killed themselves months after you failed to deliver payment as promised. Most of them only got paid after you were thrown out of office.

That is actually a distortion of facts. The banks refused to release the money until after the coup....

I refuse to see anyone one-dimensionally for the sake of having online forum fake friends.

Both sides are up their elbows in stolen cash, but only one side is being pursued in the "name of justice".

Everyone who isn't a cheerleader notices there were 18 coups, that the "ruinous populist policies" included the health care reform that lets poor people be treated, and that no one even considered a coup or prosecuting negligence when the protesters were shot down in a temple.

Duh.

[Guest]

Yingluck herself has said the rice scheme "lifted the quality of life for rice farmers"

Tell that to the families of farmers who went bankrupt and killed themselves months after you failed to deliver payment as promised. Most of them only got paid after you were thrown out of office.

That is actually a distortion of facts. The banks refused to release the money until after the coup....

I refuse to see anyone one-dimensionally for the sake of having online forum fake friends.

Both sides are up their elbows in stolen cash, but only one side is being pursued in the "name of justice".

Everyone who isn't a cheerleader notices there were 18 coups, that the "ruinous populist policies" included the health care reform that lets poor people be treated, and that no one even considered a coup or prosecuting negligence when the protesters were shot down in a temple.

Duh.

it seems that on this forum, everyone sees a question as sarcasm or an attack. Please let me ask you a question so I may LEARN.

Where can I read more about this event where it was the banks who refused to release government money? (A rather novel concept)

If there is no public written source, can you please share some of that inside information with me?

Really, I never heard this before .. please expand and elaborate on this thesis.

Thank You.

UPDATE: OK, I did find a good and credible source (Reuters)

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/02/10/us-thailand-protest-idUSBREA1904Y20140210

In that, it said...

"The government lacks the power to transfer money from the central budget to pay for the rice it has committed to buy from farmers, some of whom have not been paid for months. Big banks have refused to offer bridging loans, unconvinced the government has the authority to seek them."

Is the refusal of a Bank to furnish a high risk bridge loan to an administration under siege and on the verge of collapse the same as "The banks refused to release the money until after the coup...." ??

But I think I see your point. If the opposition holds the purse strings, and knows that a failure to pay the rice (bribes) scheme will get the populace on the "throw the bums out" train .. yes .. I do see your point there.

Thanks for this posting, you make me think, do some research and see this a different way.

Edited May 20, 2015 by Guest

[LannaGuy]

Yingluck herself has said the rice scheme "lifted the quality of life for rice farmers"

Tell that to the families of farmers who went bankrupt and killed themselves months after you failed to deliver payment as promised. Most of them only got paid after you were thrown out of office.

Out of fairness you should also mentioned who stopped the payments to the farmers via an appeal to the courts when Yingluck was still PM.

Out of fairness you should also mention that Yingluck's government stopped paying farmers months before protests. Yingluck dissolved parliament and then found out caretaker governments can't borrow money. She also vowed to pay them without a clue where the money would come from.

Still, knowing the law, abiding by it and respecting it never been a Shiniwatra strong point.

a twist on the truth (as usual) when most know the banks would not cough up the cash in government loans (I wonder why) yet did so when the guys with the guns took over (I wonder why)

it is an obvious inconvenient truth that it was all planned by the ammart many moons ago

[maidee]

she is only responsible for a few hundreb billions of baht getting new wings

some rotten or inexisting rice

doubt that the farmers were the people who got the real benefits like she claims

they got the crumbs

[hugh2121]

Yingluck herself has said the rice scheme "lifted the quality of life for rice farmers"

Tell that to the families of farmers who went bankrupt and killed themselves months after you failed to deliver payment as promised. Most of them only got paid after you were thrown out of office.

Due to actions by Sutthep and paid thugs which caused dissolution of parliament and nobody having authority to pay them.

[Muirton]

It is very very safe to say the fascist contributors to any thread involving the Shinawats don't speak Thai at all [past bar-girl vocabulary] while the Shinawats indeed do speak English. Yingluk's American-English accent is not good -- but my Thai accent in rural Thailand is much worse.

I quite understand that your Thai is limited, and that you get your input via your politically biased g/f, but that is no reason to assume that deficiency extends to other posters. None of whom AFAIK claim to have completed a higher education degree in Thai.

The extent of the Shinawatras abuse of the democratic system to further their criminality is more than obvious. What leads you to ignore that?

"I quite understand that your Thai is limited, ..." is not what I wrote. Can't you be right about anything? I said my accent is poor. I live in a country town of about 16,000 where I seem to be the only Westerner. So the chances you speak Thai better than I are nil, no matter how bad my accent.

[jackanapes]

I don't think what they are doing to yingluck is right and proper you cant blame a prime minister for everything that happens and I think in this case they are making her a scapegoat .

[Guest]

It is very very safe to say the fascist contributors to any thread involving the Shinawats don't speak Thai at all [past bar-girl vocabulary] while the Shinawats indeed do speak English. Yingluk's American-English accent is not good -- but my Thai accent in rural Thailand is much worse.

I quite understand that your Thai is limited, and that you get your input via your politically biased g/f, but that is no reason to assume that deficiency extends to other posters. None of whom AFAIK claim to have completed a higher education degree in Thai.

The extent of the Shinawatras abuse of the democratic system to further their criminality is more than obvious. What leads you to ignore that?

"I quite understand that your Thai is limited, ..." is not what I wrote. Can't you be right about anything? I said my accent is poor. I live in a country town of about 16,000 where I seem to be the only Westerner. So the chances you speak Thai better than I are nil, no matter how bad my accent.

555 .. correct, just another example of the TV "make up your own facts and then go crazy with them" brigade.

You see, in a moment of irony lost on our dear friend .. your Thai is so good, that you understand how bad your accent is.

This "Thai Visa Expert on all things Thai" is so busy making fun of a PM who DID NOT MAJOR IN ENGLISH:

Yingluck grew up in Chiang Mai and attended Regina Coeli College, a private girls' school, for the lower secondary level, followed by Yupparaj College, a co-educational school, at the upper secondary level. She graduated with a BA degree from the Faculty of Political Science and Public Administration, at Chiang Mai University in 1988 and received a MPA degree (specialization in Management Information Systems) from Kentucky State University in 1991.

And mocking Thai for struggling with the L & R of English .. that he does not know there are Thai tonal combinations that it is close to impossible to mimic.

Impossible really. My wife is Thai, with a college education. She tries so patiently to get me to say things correctly .. and as you know, much of it sounds like she is saying the same word twice.

To our TV Experts on all things Thai, and frankly, just about everything in this world .. call us when you can talk about chickens and eggs, and it does not sound like you just said the same word five times in a row. (You have no idea what i am talking about, do you? odd, for cultural and language experts)

Edited May 20, 2015 by Guest

[winstonc]

Yingluck herself has said the rice scheme "lifted the quality of life for rice farmers"

Tell that to the families of farmers who went bankrupt and killed themselves months after you failed to deliver payment as promised. Most of them only got paid after you were thrown out of office.

Due to actions by Sutthep and paid thugs which caused dissolution of parliament and nobody having authority to pay them.

so the question is then why did she not pay them when she was in power....surely your bright enough to know the real answer...