Problems changing from a tourist visa to Non B in Thailand

[infofootballaj]

Hi

I am a thirty four year old British national and I have had 3 work permits before now up until 2012 when i returned to the UK. I was teaching on the work permits over the 3 years. I have recently returned to Thailand 30 days ago on a tourist visa. I was applying for jobs to teach here while I was back in the UK, but like anything it is hard to secure work if you are not in the country that you are applying for the job in order to attend an interview etc. I went to the local Thai consulate in the UK and told them I was planning to return to Thailand to work and that I have several interviews lined up but no concrete offer at the time. They advised me to come here on a tourist visa, going on to say that if I am able to secure work in the first month then I will then be able to transfer my tourist visa to a non B in Bangkok. GREAT! So I thought. Since arriving, I have indeed secured work and I went to Bangkok yesterday from Rayong (where my new school is), stayed the night, woke up early and proceeded to go to immigration with all the correct documentation from the school to change my visa. On arrival at the immigration in Bangkok, I was greeted with 'where are you working'? I said ' Rayong'. A rather abrupt 'the rules have changed you can now do it in Rayong' was directed at me by a very hard looking immigration officer. She gave me all the documents back and told me to leave. I was shocked by the attitude and unfriendly approach but even so I went on my merry way and went back to the bus station to rush back down to Rayong immigration to do it here. 3 hours later I arrived at Rayong immigration and again was met with complete attitude by an immigration officer in Rayong with her saying 'why didn't you get a non B from your home country before coming, we cannot change it easily anymore you need a good reason'. I proceeded to explain why I couldn't get it as stated above with no confirmation of work at the time in place. She then commented that all the documents needed to be stamped by the British embassy and the Thai consular in another part of Bangkok. Again, she was very abrupt and strict. Has anyone heard of this before, regarding having every document stamped by the British embassy. Seems a bit much, I only want to change the visa not apply for a residence permit. I would just like to know what my options are now and if anyone else has had any experience like this too? I can go back to Bangkok and do what this officer asked yes, but there is something telling me she will find something else that is wrong on my next visit there. I am half tempted to just go to Laos and get the non B as I now have a job, hence a letter from the employer is no longer a problem. I am just stunned that I have met such unco-operative people today who seemed intent on making my life as hard as possible with no sign of a willingness to communicate in a nice, polite way. My current visa as i've said is a double entry tourist visa, and I could activate the 2nd entry if time is an issue. My first entry is up on the 15th of June. I do not really want to leave and re enter on my 2nd entry though as I want to commence my work permit application.

Any advice would be of great help.

Anthony

[nzexpat]

If you wish to obtain a "B" visa probably best to seek it from a Thai embassy/ Consulate in a nearby country.

You will need all the supporting paperwork which your employer will provide.

[Mario2008]

It is easier to apply for a non-B in a neighboring country, although BKK could do it. (You would need a teaching license or waiver of the license for working at a regular school and have had to apply for the work permit already).

[Gumballl]

...

On arrival at the immigration in Bangkok, I was greeted with 'where are you working'? I said ' Rayong'.

...

Btw, IMHO, that was the wrong answer to give... or perhaps you paraphrased your conversation incorrectly. You should have stated that you are NOT working yet, but will be.

[infofootballaj]

...

On arrival at the immigration in Bangkok, I was greeted with 'where are you working'? I said ' Rayong'.

...

Btw, IMHO, that was the wrong answer to give... or perhaps you paraphrased your conversation incorrectly. You should have stated that you are NOT working yet, but will be.

Work is allowed if work permit application has commenced(which it has) so I answered honestly and correctly.

[infofootballaj]

It is easier to apply for a non-B in a neighboring country, although BKK could do it. (You would need a teaching license or waiver of the license for working at a regular school and have had to apply for the work permit already).

So I need the teachers license or waiver before I go to apply for non B in a neighboring country? The thing that makes me chuckle in this county is that we hear different things off different bodies. I was told that the procedure is ........NON b.............teachers license........work permit............visa extension of stay.

[Mario2008]

No, you do not need them to apply for a non-B visa abroad, but you would probably need them for a conversion to a non-B in BKK.

[infofootballaj]

No, you do not need them to apply for a non-B visa abroad, but you would probably need them for a conversion to a non-B in BKK.

Thanks for clearing the non b application question up but as for conversion to a non B in Bkk, well that is something that no longer happens as of 2 months ago if you are working outside Bkk. It gets dealt with in the province you are working in now, but from my experience today, they are either making things as difficult as possible or they have no clue what they are doing.

[nzexpat]

No, you do not need them to apply for a non-B visa abroad, but you would probably need them for a conversion to a non-B in BKK.

Thanks for clearing the non b application question up but as for conversion to a non B in Bkk, well that is something that no longer happens as of 2 months ago if you are working outside Bkk. It gets dealt with in the province you are working in now, but from my experience today, they are either making things as difficult as possible or they have no clue what they are doing.

"

"I am a thirty four year old British national and I have had 3 work permits before now up until 2012 "

What, in your opinion, has "changed " since 2012 ?

Edited May 25, 2015 by nzexpat

[thaimelody]

local immigration offices are now changing tourist to non b visas on a case by case basis. You should check with your nearest office. Certainly no need to go to a foreign embassy though since you can do it in BKK for sure. Just make sure you have at east 21 days left on your tourist visa and you original doc. from back home.

Edited May 25, 2015 by thaimelody

[infofootballaj]

No, you do not need them to apply for a non-B visa abroad, but you would probably need them for a conversion to a non-B in BKK.

Thanks for clearing the non b application question up but as for conversion to a non B in Bkk, well that is something that no longer happens as of 2 months ago if you are working outside Bkk. It gets dealt with in the province you are working in now, but from my experience today, they are either making things as difficult as possible or they have no clue what they are doing.

"

"I am a thirty four year old British national and I have had 3 work permits before now up until 2012 "

What, in your opinion, has "changed " since 2012 ?

Well, the conservatives have won by a majority. I am a few kg heavier and I have more grey hairs!!!

[ubonjoe]

Bangkok immigration has apparently authorized some offices within the central region (division 3) to accept applications for a change of visa status. I suspect Rayong was not really prepared to accept your application.

Most people find it best to go out to an embassy or consulate rather than doing the change at immigration because the required documents to do the change are the same as that needed for an extension plus a few more documents.

Did you already have a work permit application approval letter it not that is just one more thing you would of needed.

Do you have a certification of your degree? That is needed.

If you look at the list of requirements ()police certificate not needed) to apply for a non-b in Vientiane it is a lot shorter than what immigration will want. http://vientiane.thaiembassy.org/vientiane/en/consular/consular_check/

[aidenai]

The degree verification is an old rule but until recently never enforced. With the rule recently being enforced, it has become possible to do the change of visa also in the provinces instead only at HQ.

5.5 The Applicant’s educational degree certificate (must be translated into Thai or English and certified by local or overseas Embassy or Consulate of the foreigner and by the Legalization Division, Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Thailand) (For more information, please call 0-2575-1056-9), not less than Bachelor’s degree, academic transcript and evidence of TOEIC scores.

OP, wanted to sent you a PM but you can't receive any.

[infofootballaj]

The degree verification is an old rule but until recently never enforced. With the rule recently being enforced, it has become possible to do the change of visa also in the provinces instead only at HQ.

5.5 The Applicant’s educational degree certificate (must be translated into Thai or English and certified by local or overseas Embassy or Consulate of the foreigner and by the Legalization Division, Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Thailand) (For more information, please call 0-2575-1056-9), not less than Bachelor’s degree, academic transcript and evidence of TOEIC scores.

OP, wanted to sent you a PM but you can't receive any.

Not sure why. Just had a look at my settings but nothing on there that was blocking pm's.

[ubonjoe]

The degree verification is an old rule but until recently never enforced. With the rule recently being enforced, it has become possible to do the change of visa also in the provinces instead only at HQ.

5.5 The Applicant’s educational degree certificate (must be translated into Thai or English and certified by local or overseas Embassy or Consulate of the foreigner and by the Legalization Division, Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Thailand) (For more information, please call 0-2575-1056-9), not less than Bachelor’s degree, academic transcript and evidence of TOEIC scores.

OP, wanted to sent you a PM but you can't receive any.

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[infofootballaj]

The degree verification is an old rule but until recently never enforced. With the rule recently being enforced, it has become possible to do the change of visa also in the provinces instead only at HQ.

5.5 The Applicant’s educational degree certificate (must be translated into Thai or English and certified by local or overseas Embassy or Consulate of the foreigner and by the Legalization Division, Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Thailand) (For more information, please call 0-2575-1056-9), not less than Bachelor’s degree, academic transcript and evidence of TOEIC scores.

OP, wanted to sent you a PM but you can't receive any.

Not sure why. Just had a look at my settings but nothing on there that was blocking pm's.

Just tried myself. Check that your messenger storage is not full. Try deleting a few of your messages.

Got this message.

"The following errors were found

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Hi Joe

Thanks for your help. Do you think it would be quicker to get my original degree and transcripts certified at the British embassy or to just take the originals to Laos with me to just apply for a non B there, come back and proceed with the non B from scratch? Will I still need to get my documents verified if I have a non B from Laos or if I already have the non B is it not then necessary to do that? I am just wondering how much and how long it takes to do this at the British embassy.

Regards

A

[ubonjoe]

I have seen no reports of Vientiane wanting the certificate to be certified.

You will only be able to do a self certification by doing a statement at the UK embassy. This can be done while you wait but you have to first make an appointment. They will not certify it themselves. Info here: https://www.gov.uk/notarial-and-documentary-services-guide-for-thailand

Normally the certification is not needed to get an extension of stay.

[Mario2008]

Certified not needed for getting the visa. However, when applying for a teaching license (waiver) the teachers council will want to see the degree and check it before issueing a waiver. The labour department will alsow ant to see the degree and Immigraiton might also want to see the drgee before issueing an extension of stay.

[Nawanakorn1]

The degree does not need to be certified by your embassy if the name found on the certificate matches the name on your passport and it is for the non b. A teaching certificate is not required to teach in Bangkok or Pathumtani. I know a number of teachers that have gone through the process without a teachers certificate and a few with teachers certificates. If your degree says diploma on it, you will have to go to your embassy and have them certify it as being a BS or a BA degree. If you do get a teachers certificate, you will have more options in Thailand. Like working directly for the school and making a bit more than others working through an agency or through a schools contract with the school.

[infofootballaj]

I have seen no reports of Vientiane wanting the certificate to be certified.

You will only be able to do a self certification by doing a statement at the UK embassy. This can be done while you wait but you have to first make an appointment. They will not certify it themselves. Info here: https://www.gov.uk/notarial-and-documentary-services-guide-for-thailand

Normally the certification is not needed to get an extension of stay.

All interesting stuff. Which ever way I twig it, it is edging more and more towards a trip to Laos. I may go to Suvanaket on the Mukdahan crossing instead of Vientienne I did the latter some years back and didn't think much of the city. Fancy a change so will give the other one a go. Anyone know if it is still operating and if non B's are available there with the correct documentation?

Regarding certification, my degree has been checked already during the previous 3 work permit applications. Teachers council and labour so they can check a 4th time if they feel the need.

I am better off just going to Laos and getting it done asap. Thanks for info Joe it was much appreciated.

[ubonjoe]

Savannakhet will do the non-b. They have the same requirements as Vientiane.

[duanebigsby]

The degree does not need to be certified by your embassy if the name found on the certificate matches the name on your passport and it is for the non b. A teaching certificate is not required to teach in Bangkok or Pathumtani. I know a number of teachers that have gone through the process without a teachers certificate and a few with teachers certificates. If your degree says diploma on it, you will have to go to your embassy and have them certify it as being a BS or a BA degree. If you do get a teachers certificate, you will have more options in Thailand. Like working directly for the school and making a bit more than others working through an agency or through a schools contract with the school.

You don't need a teaching certificate anywhere in Thailand, but you do need the waiver.

The waiver is good for two years but you can only get two of them limiting your teaching to four years max in Thailand without a B.Ed

[angsta]

Another low for teaching in Thailand.

[ubonjoe]

Two off topic troll posts have been removed.

[Nawanakorn1]

I have been working here for almost 7 years and I do not have a waiver nor a teaching certificate. Neither do 10 or more other teachers that I know.

[infofootballaj]

I have been working here for almost 7 years and I do not have a waiver nor a teaching certificate. Neither do 10 or more other teachers that I know.

Yes, there are many doing this but unfortunately it is still classed as illegal, so going down the correct route covers teachers legally.

[duanebigsby]

I have been working here for almost 7 years and I do not have a waiver nor a teaching certificate. Neither do 10 or more other teachers that I know.

Might get a surprise then when next applying for new work permit from Dept of Labour.

Khurusapha might be telling you go back to school. Is happening to a friend whose 4 years are soon up.

[Nawanakorn1]

From what I have read, it depends if who you are working for is an informal or formal school. An agency is considered informal. Now, I understand why a school that gets a contract considers themselves an agency. For now it is a Thai thing and not something you can send a farang to jail for. Let the Thais make that decision. In other words, if they do not ask for it, do not provide it

[Mario2008]

From what I have read, it depends if who you are working for is an informal or formal school. An agency is considered informal. Now, I understand why a school that gets a contract considers themselves an agency. For now it is a Thai thing and not something you can send a farang to jail for. Let the Thais make that decision. In other words, if they do not ask for it, do not provide it

It indeed depends on the type of school.

It is not a Thai thing. There are several laws, the law regarding teaching has a provision that teaching without a license (for schools that require them) is a criminal offense. (Can't recall the penalty, possibly 1 year 1 jail).

[duanebigsby]

From what I have read, it depends if who you are working for is an informal or formal school. An agency is considered informal. Now, I understand why a school that gets a contract considers themselves an agency. For now it is a Thai thing and not something you can send a farang to jail for. Let the Thais make that decision. In other words, if they do not ask for it, do not provide it.

Partly true.

You don't need a waiver or license to teach in non-formal schools. Some agencies are also non-formal schools. If they place you in one of their schools or another non-formal situation you don't require the waiver. If you are placed in a formal school waivers or a license are needed.