Non-O Visa Failure - Not Accepting Proof of Income (?)

[nzexpat]

Many people forgo going through the immigration nonsense.

They get a multi-entry Non-O.

when they return they book weekends away in different countries to do their 90 day border run.

Cheap flights and hotels in places like Burma, Malaysia, even Japan and Korea, Vietnam. Get good deals when booking 90/180/140/360 days ahead. Nice breaks, and never even think of a Thai immigration office and their nonsense again.

Multi-entry Non-O visas are not available to all especially within the region.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

No matter how "cheap" the foreign country hotels and regional air flights may be, they're not going to be less expensive than paying a 1900 baht annual fee at Immigration for a retirement or marriage-based extension of stay, plus perhaps another $50 for a U.S. Consulate income affidavit if someone goes the monthly income instead of the Thai bank deposit route.

Especially if you're having to make those foreign border-run trips every 90 days.

There is the hassle and bureaucracy factor at Thai Immigration. But some of the foreign Thai Consulates have been known to have their own hassle factor as well. Add into that agent fees and sometimes multi-day turnaround times. And, if I had to fly back to the U.S. in order to apply for a multi-O visa at a Thai consulate there, instead of somewhere here in the region, that further shoots the economics of it to hell.

Edited May 29, 2015 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[DLang]

Many people forgo going through the immigration nonsense.

They get a multi-entry Non-O.

when they return they book weekends away in different countries to do their 90 day border run.

Cheap flights and hotels in places like Burma, Malaysia, even Japan and Korea, Vietnam. Get good deals when booking 90/180/140/360 days ahead. Nice breaks, and never even think of a Thai immigration office and their nonsense again.

Multi-entry Non-O visas are not available to all especially within the region.

Easily available to all married to a Thai, in the region. No proof of funds (any funds) required.

Marriage cert, 5 thousand baht, done.

[JeffreyO]

At the end of the day, I already have flights lined up every month to other countries with the exception of August. It would save me some cash to go the route of immigration however, adding only one flight to Savannakhet to my current plans won't be too much of a hassle. I will still attempt immigration one more time with the additional documentation. If that fails I'll do the multi-entry non-O.

[Tassie Norm]

From my knowledge. initial Non 'O' can only be obtained, quote, "outside the Kingdom". Near 90 days you can then apply for your 1 year extension. Hope this has not confused the situation. Good luck

[JeffreyO]

From my knowledge. initial Non 'O' can only be obtained, quote, "outside the Kingdom". Near 90 days you can then apply for your 1 year extension. Hope this has not confused the situation. Good luck

A tourist visa can be converted to a Non-O at immigration and can then be extended as a regular Non-O would.

[Blackfox]

I think it best for people not to quote specifics if they are not certain of factual correctness.

Leave that for Joe.

[White Tiger]

I chose the battles that I know I can win - jousting at windmills is fruitless, I agree with JB300 - deposit the 400K in Thai bank then you wll get the Non-O Extension - you said yourself, she will remember you, with the money in the bank she has no recourse but to grant the extension...............

You might be right TunnelRat. However, one thing to keep in mind is that this seems to be the first extension of permission to stay on grounds of marriage. So even with the financial conditions being met immigration may still ask for proof/evidence of the marriage being genuine. What I mean by this is they may want family members and the pooyai bahn to come along to immigration and confirm that they know the foreigner and confirm that they know the foreigner and the Thai are married. (It's not clear from the OP if the marriage was a Thai marriage or a marriage that happened overseas).

I had a similar experience to the OP several months ago in Khon Kaen. I entered the country on a non imm O visa (issued on grounds of marriage). Had extensions of permission to stay several times on grounds of working in Thailand as a teacher. Then I stopped working as a teacher and wanted to extend my stay in Thailand on grounds of being married. I showed evidence of an income from the UK of over £1K per month (50K THB per month) - I had UK bank statements, UK pension statements, and the Embassy letter confirming my monthly income (the Embassy won't give that letter unless they have satisfied themselves, from the evidence you show to the Embassy, that you have that income in the UK). Was told by K Kaen immigration monthly income was not acceptable for a marriage extension. So then I pulled out what I thought was my trump card - a letter from my Thai bank showing over 1M THB in my Thai bank account for over 3 months preceding the date of my application for an extension of stay.

Immigration said that was insufficient. They said just about everyone in the village would have to come along to immigration and swear that I was who I said I was and that I was married to my Thai wife. (I understand from another forum that this is indeed a requirement for your first extension on grounds of marriage. My marriage took place in England - not in Thailand). Immigration also said I could have a retirement extension there and then if I wanted. (I didn't want it - because I wanted to start work again as a teacher at some time in the period covered by the extension; and on a retirement visa that would not be allowed, but on a non imm O visa I would be able to do that and get a work permit again. I had no job offer or contract of employment at the time I was applying for my marriage extension).

Anyway by this time I was exasperated and I lost it - blew my top and called all the immigration officers at K Kaen immigration a load of buffaloes. My wife dragged me out of the office before anyone shot me. A few days later we went to Savannakhet with all the same paperwork and got a new multi entry visa on grounds of marriage.

2 things from my experience in this:

1. The immigration officer who dealt with me at KKaen was a woman who fits the description mentioned earlier in this thread. Might it have been the same person and might she have been transferred. Who knows. But the thought did cross my mind.

2. Even satisfying the financial tests does not mean the extension of permission to stay is guaranteed. Immigration always seem to have something up their sleeve to throw a spanner in the works. In the case of the OP. If this is his 1st extension of permission to stay on grounds of marriage, then even after showing income and money in the bank, immigration might still ask to see, meet and interview people from the village, or people who know his Thai wife, just to check everything out. This might depend on whether or not he got married in Thailand.

It might work differently in Bangkok for all I know. But my experience in K Kaen was not too dis-similar from that of the OP in Bangkok.

[wolfmanjack]

They did the same to me. They told me if i wanted to use the income affidavit from the embassy I had to switch to a retirement extension.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

They did the same to me. They told me if i wanted to use the income affidavit from the embassy I had to switch to a retirement extension.

They where? What Immigration Office, and when generally?

And what did you end up doing after getting that answer?

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

From my knowledge. initial Non 'O' can only be obtained, quote, "outside the Kingdom". Near 90 days you can then apply for your 1 year extension. Hope this has not confused the situation. Good luck

A tourist visa can be converted to a Non-O at immigration and can then be extended as a regular Non-O would.

I believe that's correct. The only other detail to add is, not all Immigration Offices will do that kind of initial conversion.

BKK will, and a few others will. But I think many will not. So someone wanting to do that needs to position themselves to be dealing with a cooperative office.

[ubonjoe]

From my knowledge. initial Non 'O' can only be obtained, quote, "outside the Kingdom". Near 90 days you can then apply for your 1 year extension. Hope this has not confused the situation. Good luck

A tourist visa can be converted to a Non-O at immigration and can then be extended as a regular Non-O would.

I believe that's correct. The only other detail to add is, not all Immigration Offices will do that kind of initial conversion.

BKK will, and a few others will. But I think many will not. So someone wanting to do that needs to position themselves to be dealing with a cooperative office.

Only Bangkok immigration does the conversion to a non immigrant visa based upon qualifying for an extension based upon upon marriage. The are also the only office that will process them for retirement.

For other types of extension there are 3 other offices that are authorized to do them.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Thanks for clarifying that, Joe...

So, Bangkok is the only choice for those wanting to convert from a tourist visa to a Non-O to an extension of stay based on retirement or marriage.

[ubonjoe]

Thanks for clarifying that, Joe...

So, Bangkok is the only choice for those wanting to convert from a tourist visa to a Non-O to an extension of stay based on retirement or marriage.

Correct

But Bangkok immigration has authorized a few offices within the central region (division 3) to accept the application for one based upon retirement and send it to them for approval.

[fauxie]

Is all this only an issue getting a Non-O based on marriage in this area? Is it still straight-forward applying by post at the embassy in London? Last time I applied, which would've been just over a year ago, I didn't have to show anything about my income, just marriage cert. copy, wife's passport/ID card copy and the usual photos and application form.

On the London website they say 'Evidence of adequate finance (20,000 Baht per person and 40,000 Baht per family)' as a general rule for all types of non-immigrant visa, but then under the 'O' visa it says '3 months bank statement showing monthly income of more than £1,400 anuually', which is obviously a bit messed up. I was intending just to put a few months of savings account statements in with my application, showing maybe four or five thousand GBP.

[ubonjoe]

Is all this only an issue getting a Non-O based on marriage in this area? Is it still straight-forward applying by post at the embassy in London? Last time I applied, which would've been just over a year ago, I didn't have to show anything about my income, just marriage cert. copy, wife's passport/ID card copy and the usual photos and application form.

On the London website they say 'Evidence of adequate finance (20,000 Baht per person and 40,000 Baht per family)' as a general rule for all types of non-immigrant visa, but then under the 'O' visa it says '3 months bank statement showing monthly income of more than £1,400 anuually', which is obviously a bit messed up. I was intending just to put a few months of savings account statements in with my application, showing maybe four or five thousand GBP.

The topic is about applying for an extension of stay at immigration not getting a visa.

A multiple entry non-o can be a applied for in Savannakhet Laos with no financial proof.

The info on the London embassy website is an error. There have been several reports of people getting them with no financial proof.

[fauxie]

Is all this only an issue getting a Non-O based on marriage in this area? Is it still straight-forward applying by post at the embassy in London? Last time I applied, which would've been just over a year ago, I didn't have to show anything about my income, just marriage cert. copy, wife's passport/ID card copy and the usual photos and application form.

On the London website they say 'Evidence of adequate finance (20,000 Baht per person and 40,000 Baht per family)' as a general rule for all types of non-immigrant visa, but then under the 'O' visa it says '3 months bank statement showing monthly income of more than £1,400 anuually', which is obviously a bit messed up. I was intending just to put a few months of savings account statements in with my application, showing maybe four or five thousand GBP.

The topic is about applying for an extension of stay at immigration not getting a visa.

A multiple entry non-o can be a applied for in Savannah Laos with no financial proof.

It info on the London embassy website is an error. There have been several reports of people getting them with no financial proof.

Thanks ubonjoe. Yeah, I realised my error, and just saw as much on other threads in the last year since I got my current 'O' visa based on marriage. So nothing has changed since then. I'm going back to the UK on the 1st of August and suddenly got a little worried that I wasn't prepared. So I need only the application form, passport photos, postal order, marriage cert. copies, wife's ID card copy... but how about house book? I've never sent copies of that for this before, but did see it mentioned on one thread.

[ubonjoe]

If you have a copy of her house book registry it would not hurt to include it. I don't think it is mandatory in London.

[fauxie]

Thanks. Yep, I'll put copies in there just to be sure.