US boy, 3, killed self with gun he found in mother's purse

[PHP87]

Dallas, some nutter with a gun(s) and pipe bombs shoots up a police station...

That sort of thing just does not happen in the UK, although gun licences are heavenly restricted and a total ban on hand guns, some criminals do get their hands on fire arms, but thankfully only a few and most shooting seem to be turf wars between criminal gangs.

Again, you're comparing apples to oranges as you cannot compare the US to the UK for various reasons, such as one is an island country and doesn't have the racial makeup of the US

The UK knife crime rate is skyrocketing BTW, but we don't hear much about that in the US or from the Brits on TV. But that sort of thing doesn't happen in the UK, now does it. No, just an epidemic of stabbings and slashings.

BTW, most shootings in the US are also between gangs. More than 2/3rds of gun murders are committed by a demographic of less than 5% of the population.

The remaining 2,500 gun murders is committed by 90,000,000 people. I would say that makes guns one of the safest weapons seeing how 90Million people are committing about 2,500 gun murders and who knows how many of those were justifiable homicide.

99.999999% of gun owners in the US didn't kill anyone with their guns last year. The US doesn't have a gun problem. It has a societal gang problem and punishing 99.999999% of law-abiding gun owners for the irresponsible actions of a few is insanity, not to mention those 90 Million gun owner prevent up to 3,000,000 crimes per year according to the FBI

3 Million people weren't robbed, raped or murdered last year because law-abiding people were able to defend themselves, yet the likes of you would rather punish them than the criminals, which seems quite common in the UK

Just ask Tony Martin and others.

It's the equivalent of banning cars because criminals use them in crimes. It's not even the equivalent, because owning firearms is a right, not a privilege like driving is.

Please, explain this FACT to me:

Then read "More Guns, Less Crime" by John Lott or Gary Kleck "Point Blank: Guns and Violence in America"

Two books that are filled with facts and research by two former anti-gun advocates who found that when they crunched the numbers from their extensive research, discovered that guns in the hands of the law-abiding lead to plummeting crime rates.

Or remain intellectually lazy and continue to post anecdotal evidence that is meaningless because facts and logic seem to be lost on your type.

[Linky]

I can run from a knife. Others can run too. You dont usually get mass stabbing incidents.

Oz had a mass shooting many years ago. Tough gun laws brought in. People accepted it for the good of society instead of against it for some egotistical self centred reason.

Oz has never had a mass shooting since then. Go figure.

That is what can happen when people consider society as a whole instead of selfishness.

[Seastallion]

I would rather see 10 robberies occur than one child killed in a shooting accident.

Who wouldn't?

If the price for making children safe is more robberies, then so be it.

But the things is...when Australia introduced it's tough gun laws (as mentioned above), not only was there never another massacre, but smaller violent crimes and robberies did not increase other than the normal trend over time.

Edited June 14, 2015 by Seastallion

[PHP87]

Again, you can't compare an island country with the US so why do you insist upon doing so?

Australia doesn't even allow Blacks into their country for the most part, thus the lower crime rate.

Oranges to Apples.

Come back when you have educated yourself, use some logic and facts and read some hard research like that by Lott and Kleck.

Until then, you are just spewing anecdotal evidence.

And the emotive "for the children" schtick is more intellectual laziness designed to appeal to emotion and not logic or facts.

And who says only robberies were among the 3 Million crimes prevented by lawful gun owners, other than you?

How many murders? Rapes? Where do YOU draw the line at what is acceptable and what isn't?

The facts are that very few children, especially those under 5 die of gunfire and more die in bathtubs, yet you and others carry on as if it were some sort of epidemic.

Again, stop displaying such utter ignorance.

Why is it that those that are the least knowledgeable about guns are the most vocal "experts" that only manage to embarrass themselves and display their ignorance?

And why do you and others continue to ignore this "inconvenient truth":

Because more guns equals less crime and it has been proven in peer reviewed research, yet you and your ilk want to disarm the law-abiding so that criminals can prey upon them, yet you can't admit that the facts PROVE that more guns in the hands of the law-abiding leads to lower crime. Proven fact. Period. End of story.

The road to hell is paved with good intentions by your ilk.

[PHP87]

More facts:

http://crimepreventionresearchcenter.org/2013/12/murder-and-homicide-rates-before-and-after-gun-bans/

http://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2013/08/21/aussie-politician-complains-about-u-s-gun-laws-but-gun-crime-in-sydney-is-out-of-control/

http://www.gunfacts.info/gun-control-myths/guns-in-other-countries/

[d2b2]

Oh PHP87 has determined that everyone in the USA should have a gun to shoot the blacks and other pesky non-whites who have invaded their country.

[PHP87]

Oh PHP87 has determined that everyone in the USA should have a gun to shoot the blacks and other pesky non-whites who have invaded their country.

More nonsense and personal attacks, yet you can't refute a single fact I've posted.

Instead, you proudly show off your ignorance and embarrass yourself.

[tartempion]

Tragic as it is, I feel a bit ....it will never change, and more children will die, most certainly, while the NRA continues to lobby for guns for everybody.

More kids age 5 and under die in backyard swimming pools, and the NRA doesn't "lobby for guns for everybody"

My 4 year young girl won't drown in a swimming pool, she learned to swim age 2, neither will she kill herself age 5 with a gun, no guns around here.

This USA thing "all people may carry loaded guns" is plain stupid.

According to the U.S. Consumer Product Safety Commission, between 2006 and 2010 a total of 303 children under age 5 years old drown in just bathtubs, less than that of gunfire. Are you going to stop bathing your child as well?

http://crimepreventionresearchcenter.org/2015/01/do-more-children-die-of-bathtub-drownings-than-of-accidental-shootings-no/

And "all people may carry loaded guns" in the USA is completely BS and ignorance. You are calling your own false argument "plain stupid" which speaks volumes about yourself.

It is very difficult to obtain a concealed carry permit in the US, but in the states that allow concealed carry, crime has fallen at a higher rate than non-carry states.

It amazes me how those that have so little knowledge of firearms feel the need to embarrass themselves by spewing their utter ignorance, and that's putting it lightly.

Seriously, I am European and I am not aware of children shooting themselves, simply because not many Europeans have guns at home.

You embarrass yourselves by walking around with guns.

[Anthony5]

More facts:

http://crimepreventionresearchcenter.org/2013/12/murder-and-homicide-rates-before-and-after-gun-bans/

http://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2013/08/21/aussie-politician-complains-about-u-s-gun-laws-but-gun-crime-in-sydney-is-out-of-control/

http://www.gunfacts.info/gun-control-myths/guns-in-other-countries/

Don't you have any graphs from 1932 or so to make your point.

Anyway I see that Belgium scores lower than the US, and very few people have a gun there, same as in the Netherlands.

[CMNightRider]

I can run from a knife. Others can run too. You dont usually get mass stabbing incidents.

Oz had a mass shooting many years ago. Tough gun laws brought in. People accepted it for the good of society instead of against it for some egotistical self centred reason.

Oz has never had a mass shooting since then. Go figure.

That is what can happen when people consider society as a whole instead of selfishness.

You can run from a knife? That is a delusional thought.

What Oz does have is out of control home invasions.

In Australia, if someone breaks into your home when you are present and you in some way harm this person, you will be liable. In America, you can protect yourself in your own home.

Have some more Vegemite.

[PHP87]

Yet more children under the age of 5 die in bathtubs than by guns.

Get a clue. How do we "embarrass ourselves" by taking responsibility for our own personal safety and well-being?

You, like others, cannot give a logical and reasonable answer to any of the facts I've posed so you resort to childish insults.

Adult males in Switzerland are REQUIRED to own "Assault Weapons" and keep them in the home, so it's a fallacy that not many Europeans have guns at home.

You also live in a nanny state where government knows what's best for you and taxes the hell out of you for that "privilege", yet they can't stop someone from breaking into your home and causing you harm.

At least in America, we are given a choice and 90 Million American's have made the choice to own firearms and use them to protect themselves and their loved one's if such a scenario should occur.

What will you do? Cower in a fetal position while your wife and daughter are raped right before you and they are murdered?

Or do "such things" not occur in the liberal utopia of Europe?

Once again, those that know the least about firearms are hell bent on displaying their utter ignorance about them and making complete fools of themselves.

And please, just one of you. Explain this little fact to me:

Or this fact:

You won't, because you can't. You can only post emotive, illogical arguments and childish insults.

You choose to remain intellectually lazy while posting ignorance that is utterly staggering.

Why is it that those that know the least about firearms feel compelled to show off their complete lack of knowledge and facts?

Go read "More Guns, Less Crime" by John Lott or the works of Gary Kleck and educate your ignorant selves.

[CMNightRider]

Oh PHP87 has determined that everyone in the USA should have a gun to shoot the blacks and other pesky non-whites who have invaded their country.

PHP87 never implied that but you already knew that. Why make this stuff up?

[sirineou]

as I am writing this I am listening to the news

at the Waldorf Astoria Hotel, four were hurt as an idiots gun accidental fired in his pocket

on the bright side, the idiot had a free penis reduction , and there was very little crime at the Waldorf

[stevenl]

Quite a lot of the facts here are nonsense, point in fact:

Adult males in Switzerland are REQUIRED to own "Assault Weapons" and keep them in the home, so it's a fallacy that not many Europeans have guns at home.

First point is not true, and even if it were true it would not prove point 2 as the author claims. He is wrong there anyway.

[PHP87]

Oh PHP87 has determined that everyone in the USA should have a gun to shoot the blacks and other pesky non-whites who have invaded their country.

PHP87 never implied that but you already knew that. Why make this stuff up?

Why make this stuff up? Because many of you can't debate this subject due to your appalling ignorance, that's why.

FBI estimates that 3 million crimes are prevented each year in the US by law-abiding gun owners.

But the hoplophobes would rather see 3 million people victimized because of their ignorance regarding firearms.

I guess facts and logic won't work with your ilk, so I'll resort to name-calling which many of you seem to understand:

"Ohh, I'm scared of an inanimate object. It might just shoot me on its own!"

Bunch of cowards. I know women that shoot and they have more balls than many of you Aussie's, Brits and Europeans combined. You're nothing but subjects and not citizens that spent most of your lives in a nanny state and having people like Tony Martin imprisoned for defending his home against a thug that had been arrested 26 times and was just released on bail the night that Martin shot him in his own house that was burglarized at least 10 times before he finally said "Enough is enough"

In the US, he would be hailed as a hero. In the backwards UK, he was thrown in prison for defending himself in his own home, so save your pretentious preaching as it rings hollow and false.

And thankfully, my Father took up arms at a young age as an insurgent in Hungary to fight the Soviets in the Revolution of 1956, saving his wife (My Mother) and numerous other family members and also allowed them to escape the iron fist of communism.

I suppose many of you would have cowered and let the Soviet Army rape your wives, mothers and daughters and kill the male members of your family. All the while trying to rationalize and reason with them as they lined you up against a blood stained and pick-marked bullet riddled wall.

Like I said, I know women that have more balls than many of you combined. Some of you sound like the women that say it's better to be raped than to take the life of an attacker.

Many of you truly disgust me with your cowardice and fear or firearms along with your utter ignorance.

Like I said, either educate yourselves on the issue, or remain intellectually lazy. My guess is that most, if not all of you will choose the latter.

[Basil B]

Oh boy, lot of NRA propaganda...

Want to know more, just Google "NRA LIES".

[Linky]

I can run from a knife. Others can run too. You dont usually get mass stabbing incidents.

Oz had a mass shooting many years ago. Tough gun laws brought in. People accepted it for the good of society instead of against it for some egotistical self centred reason.

Oz has never had a mass shooting since then. Go figure.

That is what can happen when people consider society as a whole instead of selfishness.

You can run from a knife? That is a delusional thought.

What Oz does have is out of control home invasions.

In Australia, if someone breaks into your home when you are present and you in some way harm this person, you will be liable. In America, you can protect yourself in your own home.

Have some more Vegemite.

Ox has home invasions but in the majority very few are murdered.unlike the safe US.

Your other point is an outright lie. In Oz you can indeed protect yourself in your home. You just cannot go over the top in doing so.

Your lies dont help your propaganda.

[Linky]

Oh PHP87 has determined that everyone in the USA should have a gun to shoot the blacks and other pesky non-whites who have invaded their country.

Yes i noted he says Oz doesnt allow blacks into the country for the most part.

Not sure of the colour of the sky in his world.

Must be a KKK convention on somewhere.

Unbelievable what some will post on here and think people believe it. He is proof positive on why people like him should not only not be armed but should not be allowed out in public without a chaperone.

[CMNightRider]

Oh PHP87 has determined that everyone in the USA should have a gun to shoot the blacks and other pesky non-whites who have invaded their country.

PHP87 never implied that but you already knew that. Why make this stuff up?

Why make this stuff up? Because many of you can't debate this subject due to your appalling ignorance, that's why.

FBI estimates that 3 million crimes are prevented each year in the US by law-abiding gun owners.

But the hoplophobes would rather see 3 million people victimized because of their ignorance regarding firearms.

I guess facts and logic won't work with your ilk, so I'll resort to name-calling which many of you seem to understand:

"Ohh, I'm scared of an inanimate object. It might just shoot me on its own!"

Bunch of cowards. I know women that shoot and they have more balls than many of you Aussie's, Brits and Europeans combined. You're nothing but subjects and not citizens that spent most of your lives in a nanny state and having people like Tony Martin imprisoned for defending his home against a thug that had been arrested 26 times and was just released on bail the night that Martin shot him in his own house that was burglarized at least 10 times before he finally said "Enough is enough"

In the US, he would be hailed as a hero. In the backwards UK, he was thrown in prison for defending himself in his own home, so save your pretentious preaching as it rings hollow and false.

And thankfully, my Father took up arms at a young age as an insurgent in Hungary to fight the Soviets in the Revolution of 1956, saving his wife (My Mother) and numerous other family members and also allowed them to escape the iron fist of communism.

I suppose many of you would have cowered and let the Soviet Army rape your wives, mothers and daughters and kill the male members of your family. All the while trying to rationalize and reason with them as they lined you up against a blood stained and pick-marked bullet riddled wall.

Like I said, I know women that have more balls than many of you combined. Some of you sound like the women that say it's better to be raped than to take the life of an attacker.

Many of you truly disgust me with your cowardice and fear or firearms along with your utter ignorance.

Like I said, either educate yourselves on the issue, or remain intellectually lazy. My guess is that most, if not all of you will choose the latter.

I think you may be addressing the wrong poster, lol. I didn't imply you were making anything up. I was standing up for you. :-)

[PHP87]

Quite a lot of the facts here are nonsense, point in fact:

Adult males in Switzerland are REQUIRED to own "Assault Weapons" and keep them in the home, so it's a fallacy that not many Europeans have guns at home.

First point is not true, and even if it were true it would not prove point 2 as the author claims. He is wrong there anyway.

"Gun politics in Switzerland are unique in Europe. The vast majority of men between the ages of 20 and 30 are conscripted into the militia and undergo military training, including weapons training. The personal weapons of the militia are kept at home as part of the military obligations. However, it is generally not permitted to keep army-issued ammunition (compatible ammunition purchased privately by the individual is still permitted); Switzerland thus has one of the highest gun ownership rates in the world.^[1] In recent times a minority of political opposition has expressed a desire for tighter gun regulations.^[2]A referendum in February 2011 rejected stricter gun control.^[3]"

"Each soldier is required to keep his army-issued personal weapon (the 5.56×45mm SIG SG 550 (Assault rifle) for enlisted personnel and/or the 9×19mm SIG P220 semi-automatic pistol for officers, military police, medical and postal personnel) at home or (as of 2010) in the local armoury"

^{https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_Switzerland}

[PHP87]

Oh PHP87 has determined that everyone in the USA should have a gun to shoot the blacks and other pesky non-whites who have invaded their country.

PHP87 never implied that but you already knew that. Why make this stuff up?

Why make this stuff up? Because many of you can't debate this subject due to your appalling ignorance, that's why.

FBI estimates that 3 million crimes are prevented each year in the US by law-abiding gun owners.

But the hoplophobes would rather see 3 million people victimized because of their ignorance regarding firearms.

I guess facts and logic won't work with your ilk, so I'll resort to name-calling which many of you seem to understand:

"Ohh, I'm scared of an inanimate object. It might just shoot me on its own!"

Bunch of cowards. I know women that shoot and they have more balls than many of you Aussie's, Brits and Europeans combined. You're nothing but subjects and not citizens that spent most of your lives in a nanny state and having people like Tony Martin imprisoned for defending his home against a thug that had been arrested 26 times and was just released on bail the night that Martin shot him in his own house that was burglarized at least 10 times before he finally said "Enough is enough"

In the US, he would be hailed as a hero. In the backwards UK, he was thrown in prison for defending himself in his own home, so save your pretentious preaching as it rings hollow and false.

And thankfully, my Father took up arms at a young age as an insurgent in Hungary to fight the Soviets in the Revolution of 1956, saving his wife (My Mother) and numerous other family members and also allowed them to escape the iron fist of communism.

I suppose many of you would have cowered and let the Soviet Army rape your wives, mothers and daughters and kill the male members of your family. All the while trying to rationalize and reason with them as they lined you up against a blood stained and pick-marked bullet riddled wall.

Like I said, I know women that have more balls than many of you combined. Some of you sound like the women that say it's better to be raped than to take the life of an attacker.

Many of you truly disgust me with your cowardice and fear or firearms along with your utter ignorance.

Like I said, either educate yourselves on the issue, or remain intellectually lazy. My guess is that most, if not all of you will choose the latter.

I think you may be addressing the wrong poster, lol. I didn't imply you were making anything up. I was standing up for you. :-)

My apologies for the misunderstanding. It's 4:38 AM in California...

[CMNightRider]

I can run from a knife. Others can run too. You dont usually get mass stabbing incidents.

Oz had a mass shooting many years ago. Tough gun laws brought in. People accepted it for the good of society instead of against it for some egotistical self centred reason.

Oz has never had a mass shooting since then. Go figure.

That is what can happen when people consider society as a whole instead of selfishness.

You can run from a knife? That is a delusional thought.

What Oz does have is out of control home invasions.

In Australia, if someone breaks into your home when you are present and you in some way harm this person, you will be liable. In America, you can protect yourself in your own home.

Have some more Vegemite.

Ox has home invasions but in the majority very few are murdered.unlike the safe US.

Your other point is an outright lie. In Oz you can indeed protect yourself in your home. You just cannot go over the top in doing so.

Your lies dont help your propaganda.

What do you mean you can't go over the top, lol. If some fool breaks into your home when you are present, you should be able to eliminate them from this planet.

[Linky]

Oh PHP87 has determined that everyone in the USA should have a gun to shoot the blacks and other pesky non-whites who have invaded their country.

PHP87 never implied that but you already knew that. Why make this stuff up?

Why make this stuff up? Because many of you can't debate this subject due to your appalling ignorance, that's why.

FBI estimates that 3 million crimes are prevented each year in the US by law-abiding gun owners.

But the hoplophobes would rather see 3 million people victimized because of their ignorance regarding firearms.

I guess facts and logic won't work with your ilk, so I'll resort to name-calling which many of you seem to understand:

"Ohh, I'm scared of an inanimate object. It might just shoot me on its own!"

Bunch of cowards. I know women that shoot and they have more balls than many of you Aussie's, Brits and Europeans combined. You're nothing but subjects and not citizens that spent most of your lives in a nanny state and having people like Tony Martin imprisoned for defending his home against a thug that had been arrested 26 times and was just released on bail the night that Martin shot him in his own house that was burglarized at least 10 times before he finally said "Enough is enough"

In the US, he would be hailed as a hero. In the backwards UK, he was thrown in prison for defending himself in his own home, so save your pretentious preaching as it rings hollow and false.

And thankfully, my Father took up arms at a young age as an insurgent in Hungary to fight the Soviets in the Revolution of 1956, saving his wife (My Mother) and numerous other family members and also allowed them to escape the iron fist of communism.

I suppose many of you would have cowered and let the Soviet Army rape your wives, mothers and daughters and kill the male members of your family. All the while trying to rationalize and reason with them as they lined you up against a blood stained and pick-marked bullet riddled wall.

Like I said, I know women that have more balls than many of you combined. Some of you sound like the women that say it's better to be raped than to take the life of an attacker.

Many of you truly disgust me with your cowardice and fear or firearms along with your utter ignorance.

Like I said, either educate yourselves on the issue, or remain intellectually lazy. My guess is that most, if not all of you will choose the latter.

If you dont like it here perhaps you would be better leaving. Would do wonders for your blood pressure and your posts are actually excellent proof of our arguments against guns.

Its good you dont realise that so keep going, you are a great poster boy for anti gun laws.

Edited June 14, 2015 by Linky

[PHP87]

Oh PHP87 has determined that everyone in the USA should have a gun to shoot the blacks and other pesky non-whites who have invaded their country.

Yes i noted he says Oz doesnt allow blacks into the country for the most part.

Not sure of the colour of the sky in his world.

Must be a KKK convention on somewhere.

Unbelievable what some will post on here and think people believe it. He is proof positive on why people like him should not only not be armed but should not be allowed out in public without a chaperone.

More insults, more insinuations, more ignorance on display by those that no nothing about firearms, yet they think they are experts on the subject.

Is this you?:

[CMNightRider]

Oh boy, lot of NRA propaganda...

Want to know more, just Google "NRA LIES".

The NRA were never mentioned in this incident. If you don't like the NRA, don't join their organization.

Edited June 14, 2015 by CMNightRider

[PHP87]

Oh PHP87 has determined that everyone in the USA should have a gun to shoot the blacks and other pesky non-whites who have invaded their country.

PHP87 never implied that but you already knew that. Why make this stuff up?

Why make this stuff up? Because many of you can't debate this subject due to your appalling ignorance, that's why.

FBI estimates that 3 million crimes are prevented each year in the US by law-abiding gun owners.

But the hoplophobes would rather see 3 million people victimized because of their ignorance regarding firearms.

I guess facts and logic won't work with your ilk, so I'll resort to name-calling which many of you seem to understand:

"Ohh, I'm scared of an inanimate object. It might just shoot me on its own!"

Bunch of cowards. I know women that shoot and they have more balls than many of you Aussie's, Brits and Europeans combined. You're nothing but subjects and not citizens that spent most of your lives in a nanny state and having people like Tony Martin imprisoned for defending his home against a thug that had been arrested 26 times and was just released on bail the night that Martin shot him in his own house that was burglarized at least 10 times before he finally said "Enough is enough"

In the US, he would be hailed as a hero. In the backwards UK, he was thrown in prison for defending himself in his own home, so save your pretentious preaching as it rings hollow and false.

And thankfully, my Father took up arms at a young age as an insurgent in Hungary to fight the Soviets in the Revolution of 1956, saving his wife (My Mother) and numerous other family members and also allowed them to escape the iron fist of communism.

I suppose many of you would have cowered and let the Soviet Army rape your wives, mothers and daughters and kill the male members of your family. All the while trying to rationalize and reason with them as they lined you up against a blood stained and pick-marked bullet riddled wall.

Like I said, I know women that have more balls than many of you combined. Some of you sound like the women that say it's better to be raped than to take the life of an attacker.

Many of you truly disgust me with your cowardice and fear or firearms along with your utter ignorance.

Like I said, either educate yourselves on the issue, or remain intellectually lazy. My guess is that most, if not all of you will choose the latter.

If you dont like it here perhaps you would be better leaving. Would do wonders for your blood pressure and your posts are actually excellent proof of our arguments against guns.

Its good you dont realise that so keep going, you are a great poster boy for anti gun laws.

Translation: "Please leave as our lack of knowledge is being exposed by someone that isn't ignorant"

Ahh, the liberal way. Silence opposition instead of engaging them in logical debate.

Perhaps you and your ignorance should leave until you can educate yourself on the issue, then come back and discuss it without acting like a child.

BTW, my BP is 125/75 and without any meds.

And you still won't address the facts I've posted because you can't.

Like I said, explain this. Address this one little fact if you can:

Edited June 14, 2015 by PHP87

[d2b2]

PHP

Your insults are hilariously off base. It only reinforces my perception of you being wrong about everything. I also grew up in the USA, hail from San Francisco. I am well acquainted with guns and was a sharp shooter in the Air Force. I grew up in a home with guns and I have several relatives in law enforcement.

You cherry pick NRA propaganda to post as fact and fail to hear, much less listen to anyone else's opinion or experience. You marginalized other nations, ethnicities and people to prop yourself up. It saddens me that Thais will perceive Americans are like you. You call people cowards and you bully your position. Of course you are a proud gun proponent, many insecure and inadequate gun zealots are. The bulk of Americans support reasonable gun control and the majority are disgusted by the tactics of the NRA, but as a constutionalist I support the 2nd amendment. But the NRA and gun zealots have taken things to the extreme. Opposing any and all restrictions and conditions, they are holding America hostage to the preaching and rants of zealots like yourself. Background checks, limits on gun shows, training requirements, meaningful assult weapon reductions, all supported by the majority of US citizens and all blocked by a few radical zealots and their politically connected association. The NRA was a respectable organization until it was radicalized and it is now a danger to the nation.

[PHP87]

I can run from a knife. Others can run too. You dont usually get mass stabbing incidents.

Oz had a mass shooting many years ago. Tough gun laws brought in. People accepted it for the good of society instead of against it for some egotistical self centred reason.

Oz has never had a mass shooting since then. Go figure.

That is what can happen when people consider society as a whole instead of selfishness.

You can run from a knife? That is a delusional thought.

What Oz does have is out of control home invasions.

In Australia, if someone breaks into your home when you are present and you in some way harm this person, you will be liable. In America, you can protect yourself in your own home.

Have some more Vegemite.

Ox has home invasions but in the majority very few are murdered.unlike the safe US.

Your other point is an outright lie. In Oz you can indeed protect yourself in your home. You just cannot go over the top in doing so.

Your lies dont help your propaganda.

What do you mean you can't go over the top, lol. If some fool breaks into your home when you are present, you should be able to eliminate them from this planet.

Instead, they ask him what is he doing in their home and does he intend to do harm to me? By that time, you will likely be dead, stabbed in the back while preparing tea and vegemite for their uninvited guest.

It doesn't take a genius to figure out that someone that has unlawfully entered your home has bad intentions and it's best to incapacitate them, killing included before they do the same to you.

I would hate to see these same people in wartime: "Are you going to shoot me? If so, please let me know so I can arrange to be elsewhere when that time com....BOOM!"

Are these people for real? Or is it an upbringing and an indoctrination from living under a socialist, nanny state?

Or are they just cowards?

[Linky]

Keep going. You are arguing our points perfectly.?

[Linky]

Oh PHP87 has determined that everyone in the USA should have a gun to shoot the blacks and other pesky non-whites who have invaded their country.

PHP87 never implied that but you already knew that. Why make this stuff up?

Why make this stuff up? Because many of you can't debate this subject due to your appalling ignorance, that's why.

FBI estimates that 3 million crimes are prevented each year in the US by law-abiding gun owners.

But the hoplophobes would rather see 3 million people victimized because of their ignorance regarding firearms.

I guess facts and logic won't work with your ilk, so I'll resort to name-calling which many of you seem to understand:

"Ohh, I'm scared of an inanimate object. It might just shoot me on its own!"

Bunch of cowards. I know women that shoot and they have more balls than many of you Aussie's, Brits and Europeans combined. You're nothing but subjects and not citizens that spent most of your lives in a nanny state and having people like Tony Martin imprisoned for defending his home against a thug that had been arrested 26 times and was just released on bail the night that Martin shot him in his own house that was burglarized at least 10 times before he finally said "Enough is enough"
In the US, he would be hailed as a hero. In the backwards UK, he was thrown in prison for defending himself in his own home, so save your pretentious preaching as it rings hollow and false.

And thankfully, my Father took up arms at a young age as an insurgent in Hungary to fight the Soviets in the Revolution of 1956, saving his wife (My Mother) and numerous other family members and also allowed them to escape the iron fist of communism.

I suppose many of you would have cowered and let the Soviet Army rape your wives, mothers and daughters and kill the male members of your family. All the while trying to rationalize and reason with them as they lined you up against a blood stained and pick-marked bullet riddled wall.

Like I said, I know women that have more balls than many of you combined. Some of you sound like the women that say it's better to be raped than to take the life of an attacker.

Many of you truly disgust me with your cowardice and fear or firearms along with your utter ignorance.

Like I said, either educate yourselves on the issue, or remain intellectually lazy. My guess is that most, if not all of you will choose the latter.

If you dont like it here perhaps you would be better leaving. Would do wonders for your blood pressure and your posts are actually excellent proof of our arguments against guns.

Its good you dont realise that so keep going, you are a great poster boy for anti gun laws.

Translation: "Please leave as our lack of knowledge is being exposed by someone that isn't ignorant"

Ahh, the liberal way. Silence opposition instead of engaging them in logical debate.

Perhaps you and your ignorance should leave until you can educate yourself on the issue, then come back and discuss it without acting like a child.

BTW, my BP is 125/75 and without any meds.

And you still won't address the facts I've posted because you can't.

Like I said, explain this. Address this one little fact if you can:

Would this assist you? Probably not.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/sep/18/gun-ownership-gun-deaths-study