Thai govt seeks to extradite lese majeste suspect from New Zealand

[kinmaew]

In country, Thais refer to farang as you know what, but it seems when genuine compassion is required, then farang is like god (Conveniently)

[ubonjoe]

A post and a reply to it has been being in violation of the Forum Rules

This is the rule and it includes any comment that can be construed to be LM.

1) You will not express disrespect of the King of Thailand or any one member of the Thai royal family, whether living or deceased, nor to criticize the monarchy as an institution.

By law, the Thai Royal Family are above politics. Speculation, comments and discussion of either a political or personal nature are not allowed when discussing HM The King or the Royal family.*
Discussion of the Lese Majeste law or Lese Majeste cases is permitted on the forum, providing no comment or speculation is made referencing the royal family.

To breach these rules may result in immediate ban.

Linking to external sites which break these rules will be treated as if you yourself posted them.

[NanLaew]

... If the offence came close to preaching revolution with a wee bit of red-shirt 'democratic' violence, the charge might stick in NZ.

In your dreams.

[Baerboxer]

But for some reason, they are unable to extradite from Singapore.

Funny that, isn't it.

Show some compassion, poor chaps still got a bad cold.

And repairs to a damaged Ferrari can take many years, be patient, he is.

What? Are you implying it's all ok for the red bull cop killer as long as he sits outside Thailand for a few years? You think it's acceptable for him to get away with killing someone, fleeing the scene, trying to pervert the course of justice, possible whilst pissed and on drugs? You must have been some politician.

It's a disgrace that he's been allowed to avoid real justice based on the wealth of his family. But as we know, wealth and family trumps the law and justice every time in Thailand.

[Jim walker]

Medieval laws dating back to the dark ages hope New Zealand will just treat the extradition request with the respect it deserves and wait about 900 years to give a verdict. They need to lighten up a bit in Thailand and get Spitting Image on channel 7 every night for 30 minutes.

[Kalbo]

Lets just say that XYZ is a serious crime in NZ, but is perfectly legal in Thailand. Johnny Kiwi commits XYZ in NZ and flees the country to Thailand.

NZ wants Johnny back to face trial.

Should Thailand help NZ and hand Johnny over?

Extradition is a bit of a complicated process and is usually only possible if the crime committed is a crime in both countries. Some examples of this would be murder or kidnapping.

However, as was seen in the UK case when Thailand requested extradition of a Thai who has naturalized UK citizenship, the UK responded by saying that since there is no

lese majeste crime in the UK, there are no grounds to extradite the subject to Thailand.

Not to stray off topic, this is just an example I'm using to question what you have said (although I think you may be right)

What Julian Assange is accused of in Sweden is not a crime in the UK (some odd twist on rape).....so why is Assange holed up unless he knows the UK will grant extradition?

From what I remember,he was accused on four different counts,with only one of those counts not being a crime in the UK.

[sprq]

I sincerely hope N.Z. has the necessary balls to tell this regime where they can stick their archaic and repressive law......................

Some of the LM is something that would be highly illegal in every country....not only if it is about the King/President....I let it to your imagination what that might be.

But I have no idea what it was in this case. Other cases are known...

Not in my home country.

In the US, you can insult the head of State (the President) in the most explicit terms, 24 hours a day.

The repercussion will be that your friends may abandon you as a "whack job"; but there is no law against it as long as you do not make threats of violence.

Likewise in the UK. You can say what you like about anybody in the royal family as long as it is based on fact and does not threaten violence, exactly the same under law as for any other Briton. And in practice, you are safer to say anything you like about the royal family than about other Britons, because the royal family almost never takes anybody to court, regarding it as beneath their dignity and probably counter-productive anyway, in the sense that it would look like people of great privilege harassing an ordinary citizen.

Compare and contrast, as they say.

[Tchooptip]

I sincerely hope N.Z. has the necessary balls to tell this regime where they can stick their archaic and repressive law......................

Some of the LM is something that would be highly illegal in every country....not only if it is about the King/President....I let it to your imagination what that might be.

But I have no idea what it was in this case. Other cases are known...

Not in my home country.

In the US, you can insult the head of State (the President) in the most explicit terms, 24 hours a day.

The repercussion will be that your friends may abandon you as a "whack job"; but there is no law against it as long as you do not make threats of violence.

You are absolutely right...On the other hand, one could hardly try 10% of it to a police officer without being roughly thrown to the ground, handcuffed, probably tased and even if unlucky shot to death... There is no law against that either

[glenmohr]

But for some reason, they are unable to extradite from Singapore.

Funny that, isn't it.

Show some compassion, poor chaps still got a bad cold.

And repairs to a damaged Ferrari can take many years, be patient, he is.

What? Are you implying it's all ok for the red bull cop killer as long as he sits outside Thailand for a few years? You think it's acceptable for him to get away with killing someone, fleeing the scene, trying to pervert the course of justice, possible whilst pissed and on drugs? You must have been some politician.

It's a disgrace that he's been allowed to avoid real justice based on the wealth of his family. But as we know, wealth and family trumps the law and justice every time in Thailand.

we agree with you baer, the posts above yours were attempts to satirise.

[joebrown]

But for some reason, they are unable to extradite from Singapore.

Funny that, isn't it.

Show some compassion, poor chaps still got a bad cold.

And repairs to a damaged Ferrari can take many years, be patient, he is.

What? Are you implying it's all ok for the red bull cop killer as long as he sits outside Thailand for a few years? You think it's acceptable for him to get away with killing someone, fleeing the scene, trying to pervert the course of justice, possible whilst pissed and on drugs? You must have been some politician.

It's a disgrace that he's been allowed to avoid real justice based on the wealth of his family. But as we know, wealth and family trumps the law and justice every time in Thailand.

And I thought I was the only one on TVF not to recognise sarcasm in other peoples' posts. I'm glad to see I'm not alone. Welcome to the 'club'!

[oldsailor35]

Stupid fools , wasting time and money. Don't they realise that New Zealand is not a Military Dictatorship, but a Democratic govt., and will have nothing to do with antiquated laws which are only used for political gains and revenge.

Edited June 17, 2015 by oldsailor35

[bobmac10]

I see this arose from a speech from a red stage in 2013.

Lets hope they start going carefully through all the speeches from various red stages and activating the stalled cases against all the red leaders who implicated themselves with their hate and violence filled speeches when they thought they were invincible and untouchable.

Ah poor wee Rabby, hunkered doon up there, scribbling oot the conservative line.

Who's listenin' mon?

Naebaddy.

[sprq]

Singapore has some pretty tough laws against people criticizing the head of state and government. I wonder what people's views are regarding to that.

I don't like it. Why do you ask? Because you do like it?

[oldsailor35]

I see this arose from a speech from a red stage in 2013.

Lets hope they start going carefully through all the speeches from various red stages and activating the stalled cases against all the red leaders who implicated themselves with their hate and violence filled speeches when they thought they were invincible and untouchable.

Think that you need to change your nationality to "Yellow Thai" Robbie. NZ has no place for this kind of crap, There, people are free to stand on any stage and announce their political leanings without being condemned. Unlike yourself, they believe in freedom of speech and choice of politics.

[oldsailor35]

Pure stupidity to bring this case back in the limelight!!

Trying to prove, that they are faithful pawns??

You are correct.It is myopia of the first order for all the reasons previously rehearsed at length on this forum.

There is an interesting aspect however, namely the motivation (some would say the warped psychology) of those who pressed for action with the NZ Government.They are not presumably unintelligent so already know the request is dead in the water, and will further embarrass the country.So why precisely have they gone down this cul de sac?

Because like Lemmings, they blindly follow anything or anyone who opposes whatever or whoever they believe in or worship.

[glenmohr]

I see this arose from a speech from a red stage in 2013.

Lets hope they start going carefully through all the speeches from various red stages and activating the stalled cases against all the red leaders who implicated themselves with their hate and violence filled speeches when they thought they were invincible and untouchable.

Ah poor wee Rabby, hunkered doon up there, scribbling oot the conservative line.

Who's listenin' mon?

Naebaddy.

Och Aye mon, He's a wee poor timorous creature.

[oldsailor35]

Pure stupidity to bring this case back in the limelight!!

Trying to prove, that they are faithful pawns??

You are correct.It is myopia of the first order for all the reasons previously rehearsed at length on this forum.

There is an interesting aspect however, namely the motivation (some would say the warped psychology) of those who pressed for action with the NZ Government.They are not presumably unintelligent so already know the request is dead in the water, and will further embarrass the country.So why precisely have they gone down this cul de sac?

Every chance your opinion is correct Jayboy.

Surely the Thai authorities would be familiar, or made themselves familiar, with the important clause in the New Zealand Extradition Act which specifies "An extraditable offence involves conduct that would be regarded as criminal had it occurred in New Zealand..."

Since we don't know what exactly was said and posting here what was said would be an LM offence in itself (plus a ban of course), it is difficult to say whether or not the 'offence' would be seen as such in NZ. If the offence came close to preaching revolution with a wee bit of red-shirt 'democratic' violence, the charge might stick in NZ.

In that case he is lucky that he does not support the "Arch-Corruptor" Suthep !

[oldsailor35]

The law is the law...until it's changed. This numbnuts knew the LM law existed but still broke that law. If he gets sent back to LOS it's tough luck for him.

What I can't understand is.....why the he11 did he pick NZ??? Of all the countries in the world......NEW ZEALAND!

Yes been there many times, beautiful country. Great place to live.

There are many Thais living in NZ and all the ones that i know , love it there and never want to leave it for Thailand. One once told me that NZ is a place where it is desirable to live and that Thailand a nice place to holiday.

[oldsailor35]

I see this arose from a speech from a red stage in 2013.

Lets hope they start going carefully through all the speeches from various red stages and activating the stalled cases against all the red leaders who implicated themselves with their hate and violence filled speeches when they thought they were invincible and untouchable.

What a delightful person you are.

You seem to think the red leaders should be allowed to get away with their hate and violence speeches which inspired their followers to arson and murder.

"Burn BKK to the ground". "Each bring a bottle I have a million liters of Gasoline".

No problem to you, reconciliation for the reds but what about the victims of their riots ?

I see you can only manage an insult this time, no sensible post.

Go see a doctor Robbie, get some medical advice.....PLEASE !

[Liquorice]

Freedom of Speech was guaranteed in the 1997 Constitution of Thailand and those guarantees continue in the 2007 Constitution..................however you should read the 365 page quick reference guide for exceptions to the rule.

[Cuchulainn]

These scummy fugitives on the run cherish the thing so dear and precious to them, yet we are almost denied..........a passport!!

[spermwhale]

Thailand's new tourism slogan should be: Speechless Thailand

[glenmohr]

I see this arose from a speech from a red stage in 2013.

Lets hope they start going carefully through all the speeches from various red stages and activating the stalled cases against all the red leaders who implicated themselves with their hate and violence filled speeches when they thought they were invincible and untouchable.

What a delightful person you are.

You seem to think the red leaders should be allowed to get away with their hate and violence speeches which inspired their followers to arson and murder.

"Burn BKK to the ground". "Each bring a bottle I have a million liters of Gasoline".

No problem to you, reconciliation for the reds but what about the victims of their riots ?

I see you can only manage an insult this time, no sensible post.

Go see a doctor Robbie, get some medical advice.....PLEASE !

Robbie, you are all for punishment, But did not the Thai military shoot to kill over the incident you describe? I understand they continued shooting until about 90 were dead. Can you please specify how much punishment will actually satisfy your lust for blood?

[mikemac]

OK, it is just getting boring now !

To the poster who has written every comment on this topic, and perhaps a few others as well, flaming Robby and condemning the government for the LM laws, enough is enough !

Well at least it seems like all the flames and monotonous condemnations of the LM laws were penned by the one person or came out of the one book.

If so, you must be as busy as a Beirut bricklayer, posting that many comments.

Cannot see the point myself, bagging the present government for a law that has stood since 1908, as if they had created it.

How about getting some new material ? Get original for a change.

Anyway, the whole thing is a waste of time, because the Kiwis will not let go of this idiot if they don't want to.

That's if the Bledisloe Cup is anything to go by.

[CiaranO]

Unfortunately Thai officials have yet to understand that most countries do not agree with is law and will not extradite anyone being charged under it.

[laocowboy2]

Won't work. Normally extradition is only possible if the 'crime' is an offence in BOTH jurisdictions. Going to a Christian religious service in Saudi Arabia is a crime - try extraditing someone from the US or Ireland on that one!

[Plutojames88]

The slants on truth have nil power.

They are unelected Australia even bans them from their soil.

New Zealand refuses to even recognise them ( junta)

He could go to a bar in New Zealand and vent his thoughts.

Thailand needs to understand this country is just a place to do things on the cheap.

It has no respect or currency in westerner countries

Edited June 17, 2015 by Plutojames88

[oneday]

Thailand...like a dog with a bone.

[a99az]

They would have had a better chance of arresting him by simply forgetting about him. Now the Thai government have helped him to secure a NZ passport as he will probably be seen as a political refugee.

[Fat Haggis]

OK, it is just getting boring now !

To the poster who has written every comment on this topic, and perhaps a few others as well, flaming Robby and condemning the government for the LM laws, enough is enough !

Well at least it seems like all the flames and monotonous condemnations of the LM laws were penned by the one person or came out of the one book.

If so, you must be as busy as a Beirut bricklayer, posting that many comments.

Cannot see the point myself, bagging the present government for a law that has stood since 1908, as if they had created it.

How about getting some new material ? Get original for a change.

Anyway, the whole thing is a waste of time, because the Kiwis will not let go of this idiot if they don't want to.

That's if the Bledisloe Cup is anything to go by.

The reason people are bagging on Prayuths lot are obvious mate, they are pursuing 112 articles and 112 convictions and sentencing has more than doubled since they "seized power"

What agenda do they have about such cases? would their time not be better spent pursuing criminals who murder, rape and steal?

What's to be gained by jailing a person through the military courts for the minimum of 15 years, it's almost like some sort of perversion?

If Thailand and the current lot of constitution writers and enforcers really wanted to win over the people, they'd abolish 112 and down grade the severity of sentencing.