energy labels accurate ?

[pokerkid]

Can someone explain to me what this label means. I guess it means that the fridge uses 238 units a year but am not sure about the other numbers.

Are these numbers accurate ?

[bankruatsteve]

TIT. There seems to be no consumer prudence for things like this. But, Samsung is a reliable brand. There you go.

BTW: How many "units" used will be up to you and the weather. There is no way something can say how many units will be used. But, if they post a "5", there might be something to it vs. something else that doesn't post.

[pokerkid]

TIT. There seems to be no consumer prudence for things like this. But, Samsung is a reliable brand. There you go.

BTW: How many "units" used will be up to you and the weather. There is no way something can say how many units will be used. But, if they post a "5", there might be something to it vs. something else that doesn't post.

it seems that every single fridge in thailand has a 5 star rating...

[Anthony5]

TIT. There seems to be no consumer prudence for things like this. But, Samsung is a reliable brand. There you go.

BTW: How many "units" used will be up to you and the weather. There is no way something can say how many units will be used. But, if they post a "5", there might be something to it vs. something else that doesn't post.

it seems that every single fridge in thailand has a 5 star rating...

No it isn't, but the ones with lower rating are not so eager to have that sticker on the front.

[KhunBENQ]

As to be expected: the numbers are for comparison purposes based on a 2012 Thai standard.

"238.80" as you wrote is the consumption per year in kWh.

The "783.26" is the price for electricity in Baht based on this 2012 standard.

As useless number (comes out as 2.7 Baht/kWh), realistic about 4.2 Baht/kWh (= 1192 Baht).

A funny coincidence

the "238.8" in the last line is the volume in liter, "8.4" cubic feet.

So to say: numbers are accurate, but the consumption and price is for comparison only

Might be higher or lower based on your use.

Forget the "5 star" rating. Technical development has overtaken the standard. Similar to Europe where you have "A", "A+", "A++" etc.

No more "B" or lower in most device categories.

The important number is the consumption to compare with other devices.

238.30 for a fridge of this size is a "good" number as far as I remember.

Probably an inverter type?

You could do a volume/consumption ratio to compare different size fridges (the higher the better).

1.0 in your case

(or vice versa: consumption/volume = 1.0 kWh per liter in your case, the smaller the better)

Edited July 3, 2015 by KhunBENQ

[IMHO]

These are all based on standard TIS test procedures - which are in turn all based on EU standards.

They are essentially as reliable as fuel efficiency numbers of cars - some people will use more, some people will use less, others might actually get close to the rated energy usage. The main point is to provide consumers with a basis for comparing energy efficiency - i.e. an "apples to apples" comparison.

It's not 100% perfect - i.e. I would expect that some manufacturers give special attention to optimising their appliances for the test itself (especially seeing as it's not just TH - it's all of EU as well), but even then, a poor design will never perform as good as a good one

You can lookup the labels for all appliances here:

http://labelno5.opr.egat.co.th/appdata/labelno5/en

Ad you can see some basic technical info here:

http://labelno5.egat.co.th/index.php?lang=en

[Pib]

5 on the label must be fairly easy to meet....I've never seen an appliance displaying the label not having a 5 but I expect there are some...I just haven't seen them. Every device with such a label in my home, to include the A/Cs, has a label with a 5 on it...and almost all the appliances/A/Cs are around 7 years old.

And all a 5 means is Very Good energy efficiency...but what "Very Good" means in some real number, energy efficiency numbers I couldn't say. A Very Good rating under standard XYZ could be only Average under another standard ABC.

Edited July 4, 2015 by Pib

[KhunBENQ]

The above is a label for an airconditioner.

Also I found that the layout of the labels changed over the years.

For airconditioners there seems to be no newer standard than "2011":

4807.20: units (kWh) per year

15767.60: pricce for electricity per year (based on unreallistic 3.28 Baht/kWh)

11.99: ? unsure, some EER (energy efficiency ratio)

19744.56: BTU ("size"/"strenght") of the aircon

Edited July 4, 2015 by KhunBENQ

[KhunBENQ]

The EER (11.99): as far as I understood it is the BTU number divided by the electrical power consumption in Watt (at full load).

So recerse computed this quite big airconditioner would use 19744/11.99 ~ 1.6 kW.

A good value, its a modern but pricey inverter type.

Close to what the data sheet says:

http://directtoshop.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/th/directtoshop/%E0%B9%81%E0%B8%AD%E0%B8%A3%E0%B9%8C-%E0%B8%95%E0%B8%B4%E0%B8%94%E0%B8%9C%E0%B8%99%E0%B8%B1%E0%B8%87-carrier-42tvu022-703-19744-btu-p1004890

Edited July 4, 2015 by KhunBENQ

[IMHO]

For airconditioners there seems to be no newer standard than "2011":

For AC's there's actually a new standard this year... and ratings are now all based on SEER rather than EER.

[Pib]

For airconditioners there seems to be no newer standard than "2011":

For AC's there's actually a new standard this year... and ratings are now all based on SEER rather than EER.

Thailand using the SEER rating method? You sure? thailand don't have much of any seasonal change except from hot to not-so-hot. The difference between the SEER and EER rating can be quite a bit different for the same A/C. A person can do a rough estimate of just increasing the EER rating by 10% to get the "rough/approx/in the ball park" SEER rating but there is a more complete formula to reach the exact SEER rating.

[bankruatsteve]

When I buy something, I mostly ignore the hype and so-called ratings that are stuck on by the mfg. In the states, I would rely on Consumers Union (CU) to do tests and recommend. Thailand and most of SE Asia seems far from that. So for me, just stick with known brands (and check out comments from places like this) and you won't be disappointed. As far as I'm aware, there is no consequence for saying whatever you want about your product in Thailand. (?)

[IMHO]

For airconditioners there seems to be no newer standard than "2011":

For AC's there's actually a new standard this year... and ratings are now all based on SEER rather than EER.

Thailand using the SEER rating method? You sure? thailand don't have much of any seasonal change except from hot to not-so-hot. The difference between the SEER and EER rating can be quite a bit different for the same A/C. A person can do a rough estimate of just increasing the EER rating by 10% to get the "rough/approx/in the ball park" SEER rating but there is a more complete formula to reach the exact SEER rating.

Here's the official announcement:

http://labelno5.egat.co.th/downloads/58/AIR_58.pdf

And here's a photo of one:

To convert SEER back to EER for comparisons with older designs, simply multiply SEER by 0.875 - that will get you close enough....

Under the changes, the requirements to achieve 5 stars have been raised:

AC's making less than 27K BTU needed an EER of >= 11.6 in order to achieve 5 stars under the 2011 sticker rules. Under the 2015 sticker rules, they must now make an EER > 13.1 (SEER > 15) to get a 5-star rating.

AC manufacturers are not required to use the 2015 standards for models launched prior to 2015, so 2015 stickers are still pretty rare. But it's worth bearing in mind that many 2011 5-star AC's would only be 4-stars under the 2015 rules.

OTOH, there's a handful of units that still far exceed the requirements for 5 stars under both rating systems.

Always compare EER (and convert SEER) when shopping, if efficiency is a primary criteria.

Edited July 4, 2015 by IMHO

[KhunBENQ]

I win by 0.03 points

Stupid I am, I just realized that we had bought a new AC for the familys sleeping room downstairs.

~12000 BTU, Mitsubishi Inverter ("Mr Slim"?),

Fairly expensive for such a small size (26000 incl. installation),

SEER = 15.49.

Edited July 5, 2015 by KhunBENQ

[Pib]

Under the changes, the requirements to achieve 5 stars have been raised:

AC's making less than 27K BTU needed an EER of >= 11.6 in order to achieve 5 stars under the 2011 sticker rules. Under the 2015 sticker rules, they must now make an EER > 13.1 (SEER > 15) to get a 5-star rating.

AC manufacturers are not required to use the 2015 standards for models launched prior to 2015, so 2015 stickers are still pretty rare. But it's worth bearing in mind that many 2011 5-star AC's would only be 4-stars under the 2015 rules.

OTOH, there's a handful of units that still far exceed the requirements for 5 stars under both rating systems.

Always compare EER (and convert SEER) when shopping, if efficiency is a primary criteria.

Ok, that makes sense. I expect (guess) manufacturers could still either use a EER or SEER rating as long as that EER or SEER rating met the minimum required rating they would get the associated 5 Stars rating. But I expect most manufacturers may start putting a SEER rating on their labels since a SEER rating is a higher number than an EER rating due to the method of calculation and knowing the common person probably don't have a clue about the difference between EER and SEER, how they are calculated differently, and will just buy the A/C with the "highest number"....like one with a SEER of 15 must be much better than one with an EER of 13.1---not necessarily

I think a SEER rating is better since it takes in account Seasonal variations even though Thailand's seasonal variation from Hot to Not-So-Hot for most of the country is not that much---at least for me here in the Bangkok area...but in northern Thailand where is does get much cooler during part of the year where the Seasons are much more evident. All depends where you live.

See this webpage showing more details on the SEER, EER, and other related A/C formulas/ratings. Paragraph 4 talks SEER.

Edited July 5, 2015 by Pib

[KhunBENQ]

but in northern Thailand where is does get much cooler during part of the year where the Seasons are much more evident. All depends where you live.

So true.

Lowest electricity bill (total) from December was about 900 Baht.

Last one for June was 2600 Baht.

I am afraid this month we will be over 3000 Baht.

The airconditioners will be totally off here for usually 4 to 5 months.

This year is terrible though, Endless heat and drought push the electricity consumption.

[Pib]

My A/Cs are never off here in Bangkok...Dec and Jan are the two coolest months and my lowest electricity bills.

[IMHO]

I win by 0.03 points

Stupid I am, I just realized that we had bought a new AC for the familys sleeping room downstairs.

~12000 BTU, Mitsubishi Inverter ("Mr Slim"?),

Fairly expensive for such a small size (26000 incl. installation),

SEER = 15.49.

20150705_131943.jpg

Hehe, yeah - but you trail by 2042.08 BTU, spent ~3,000 Baht more, don't have WiFi + mobile app control of the AC

[bankruatsteve]

I win by 0.03 points

Stupid I am, I just realized that we had bought a new AC for the familys sleeping room downstairs.

~12000 BTU, Mitsubishi Inverter ("Mr Slim"?),

Fairly expensive for such a small size (26000 incl. installation),

SEER = 15.49.

20150705_131943.jpg

Sounds like a fair price to me. Nothing stupid about that. I've had Mitsu A/C's for years (the standard ones) and they run 24/7 or once in a while and no complaints.