Koh Tao: Trial opens for 2 accused of killing British tourists

[Rykbanlor]

Not what i asked! I wont bother conversing with you or debating as you cant answer a straight question. More stepovers than Ronaldo and better at dodging questions than most politicians.

You asked: "Still awaiting an answer to my question. seems to been ignored by the RTP supporters. If this was a family member. Would you be happy with this investigation?"

I answered you -- you asked if (speculating) I would be :happy" about the police investigation if (speculating) it was my family. As I clearly stated, I would not be "happy" about anything to do with these events but I would be satisfied, as the actual families are, that the right people are on trial and would have faith justice will be carried out in court. Lots of game playing with speculation when there really is no reason to ask such imaginative questions when the families have releases statements and they are more in the know that any of us and they actually did lose their family members.

It's certainly heartwarming to see a man so full of faith in the judicial system here, which has been slammed in yearly human rights watch reports as being heavily vulnerable to corruption by the Police and Thai mafia and generally described as weak at best.

Certainly heartwarming to see the continuation of one thing said to pretend something else was said in an effort to keep up the comical conspiracy theories.

Ok, I've no idea what you are getting at with that post. You said you would be satisfied with the proceedings - satisfaction denotes that you must have faith in the system. What did i misrepresent?

Just out of interest John, why do you think the boys changed their plea and retracted their statements - if, as you said, they admitted the same to one of the Human rights guys.

Why did they change their minds, any ideas?

[Darkknight666]

According to the translator, Maung said he was not present when the murders took place

took place. He had left his friends at 1am to meet his girlfriend so he did not know about anything that took place afterwards.

He said Zaw Rin and Win admitted that they had indeed committed the murders and that they confirmed that Maung had left earlier. They said they were drunk and that they bludgeoned the heads of the tourists. The first weapon was a large bottle of wine which was used by Win on David Miller. Then Win used a hoe was used to finish the job.

Meanwhile, Zaw Rin had taken Hannah some distance away. She resisted and screamed, so he hit her with the same hoe. Win was the first to rape her, the translator said. He said the two did not leave the island immediately because it was difficult to do so with the police keeping a close watch.

Police yesterday confirmed the mobile phone of Koh Tao murder victim, David Miller, had been retrieved from the accommodation of one of the two Myanmar suspects.

National police chief Somyot Pumpanmuang said suspect Saw Rim, 21, had intended to take the victims mobile phone for his own use, but he later found the device cannot be used in Thailand, so he smashed and discarded it in his living quarters.

Pol Col Prachum Ruangthong, superintendent of the Koh Phangan police station, said the device is a black iPhone 4, taken from the shorts pocket of Miller, 24, who was found dead on a Koh Tao beach alongside Hannah Witheridge, 23, on Sept 15.

The confirmation came as doubts spread on social media as to whether the phone was really taken from the suspects. Some pictures circulated online show a friend of Witheridge brought a mobile phone to Pol Col Prachum during the inquest.

The men underwent medical checks before and after the inquiry to prove they were not tortured into admitting a crime.

They seemed in good health, except for pain in their chests [allegedly from their interrogation], added Aung Myo Thant.

"Two Myanmar suspects have confessed to killing the pair," national police chief Somyot Pumpunmuang told the AFP news service even before the press conference. "DNA test results confirmed that the same DNA was found in the body of the (female)victim."

With her partner incapacitated, both men then set upon Witheridge, taking turns as raping her while alternately smoking a cigarette. When they were through, Wynsmashed her head

Lawyer Aung Myo Thant said the pair, Zaw Lin and Win Zaw Htun, both 21, from the Arakanese town of Kyaukphyu, told a Burmese embassy legal team they had murdered English tourists Hannah Witheridge and David Miller by bludgeoning them to death with a hoe on 15 September.

A second witness, Dr. Chasit Yoohad, gave testimony about his examination of the victims' bodies. He said he also performed a medical checkup of the two accused, and found them in good health. He said he asked through a translator if they had committed the crime, and they replied that they had.

BANGKOK: -- A human rights commissioner said Tuesday the two Myanmar migrant workers arrested on charges of murdering the two British backpackers on Koh Tao admitted to him that they committed the crime as charged.

The commissioner, Mr Prinya Sirisarakan, and his staff visited the two suspects at a prison on Koh Samui where they are being detained pending prosecution.

Commenting on the suspicion by netizens in the social media that the two suspects might be just scapegoats, Mr Prinya suggested that the police should disclose more details about the case to clear up the air.

He said the two told him that they drank both beer and wine before they attacked the two British tourists and he suspected that they might be drunk at the time they committed the crime.

So you think B2 could restrain Hannah and beat David with a wine bottle at the same time? I'm around the same size as David, if a man the size of Win came at me with nothing but a broken bottle he would be in for a beating. So, both B2 beat David? Who was restraining Hannah?

So much B.S it's not even funny.

Those confessions are under alleged abuse and you know that. Why would they fight the case when their best chance in the world is confessing and receiving life in prison or anything less than a death sentence?

So many things do not add up, John.

[JohnThailandJohn]

According to the translator, Maung said he was not present when the murders took place

took place. He had left his friends at 1am to meet his girlfriend so he did not know about anything that took place afterwards.

He said Zaw Rin and Win admitted that they had indeed committed the murders and that they confirmed that Maung had left earlier. They said they were drunk and that they bludgeoned the heads of the tourists. The first weapon was a large bottle of wine which was used by Win on David Miller. Then Win used a hoe was used to finish the job.

Meanwhile, Zaw Rin had taken Hannah some distance away. She resisted and screamed, so he hit her with the same hoe. Win was the first to rape her, the translator said. He said the two did not leave the island immediately because it was difficult to do so with the police keeping a close watch.

Police yesterday confirmed the mobile phone of Koh Tao murder victim, David Miller, had been retrieved from the accommodation of one of the two Myanmar suspects.

National police chief Somyot Pumpanmuang said suspect Saw Rim, 21, had intended to take the victim’s mobile phone for his own use, but he later found the device cannot be used in Thailand, so he smashed and discarded it in his living quarters.

Pol Col Prachum Ruangthong, superintendent of the Koh Phangan police station, said the device is a black iPhone 4, taken from the shorts pocket of Miller, 24, who was found dead on a Koh Tao beach alongside Hannah Witheridge, 23, on Sept 15.

The confirmation came as doubts spread on social media as to whether the phone was really taken from the suspects. Some pictures circulated online show a friend of Witheridge brought a mobile phone to Pol Col Prachum during the inquest.

The men underwent medical checks before and after the inquiry to prove they were not tortured into admitting a crime.

“They seemed in good health, except for pain in their chests [allegedly from their interrogation],” added Aung Myo Thant.

"Two Myanmar suspects have confessed to killing the pair," national police chief Somyot Pumpunmuang told the AFP news service even before the press conference. "DNA test results confirmed that the same DNA was found in the body of the (female)victim."

With her partner incapacitated, both men then set upon Witheridge, taking turns as raping her while alternately smoking a cigarette. When they were through, Wynsmashed her head

Lawyer Aung Myo Thant said the pair, Zaw Lin and Win Zaw Htun, both 21, from the Arakanese town of Kyaukphyu, told a Burmese embassy legal team they had murdered English tourists Hannah Witheridge and David Miller by bludgeoning them to death with a hoe on 15 September.

A second witness, Dr. Chasit Yoohad, gave testimony about his examination of the victims' bodies. He said he also performed a medical checkup of the two accused, and found them in good health. He said he asked through a translator if they had committed the crime, and they replied that they had.

BANGKOK: -- A human rights commissioner said Tuesday the two Myanmar migrant workers arrested on charges of murdering the two British backpackers on Koh Tao admitted to him that they committed the crime as charged.

The commissioner, Mr Prinya Sirisarakan, and his staff visited the two suspects at a prison on Koh Samui where they are being detained pending prosecution.

Commenting on the suspicion by netizens in the social media that the two suspects might be just scapegoats, Mr Prinya suggested that the police should disclose more details about the case to clear up the air.

He said the two told him that they drank both beer and wine before they attacked the two British tourists and he suspected that they might be drunk at the time they committed the crime.

Now a glass bottle? And you know they have retracted their statements right?

Yes, their lawyer(s) have retracted their confession to police but gave no explanation why they admitted to the crimes, while having no problem saying the were abused by police, to their first lawyer assigned by the embassy as well as embassy officials ... but I am sure you have an ironclad theory to go along with the many other, often very contradictory, conspiracy theories by the online detectives.

[bruceybonus]

According to the translator, Maung said he was not present when the murders took place

took place. He had left his friends at 1am to meet his girlfriend so he did not know about anything that took place afterwards.

He said Zaw Rin and Win admitted that they had indeed committed the murders and that they confirmed that Maung had left earlier. They said they were drunk and that they bludgeoned the heads of the tourists. The first weapon was a large bottle of wine which was used by Win on David Miller. Then Win used a hoe was used to finish the job.

Meanwhile, Zaw Rin had taken Hannah some distance away. She resisted and screamed, so he hit her with the same hoe. Win was the first to rape her, the translator said. He said the two did not leave the island immediately because it was difficult to do so with the police keeping a close watch.

Police yesterday confirmed the mobile phone of Koh Tao murder victim, David Miller, had been retrieved from the accommodation of one of the two Myanmar suspects.

National police chief Somyot Pumpanmuang said suspect Saw Rim, 21, had intended to take the victim’s mobile phone for his own use, but he later found the device cannot be used in Thailand, so he smashed and discarded it in his living quarters.

Pol Col Prachum Ruangthong, superintendent of the Koh Phangan police station, said the device is a black iPhone 4, taken from the shorts pocket of Miller, 24, who was found dead on a Koh Tao beach alongside Hannah Witheridge, 23, on Sept 15.

The confirmation came as doubts spread on social media as to whether the phone was really taken from the suspects. Some pictures circulated online show a friend of Witheridge brought a mobile phone to Pol Col Prachum during the inquest.

The men underwent medical checks before and after the inquiry to prove they were not tortured into admitting a crime.

“They seemed in good health, except for pain in their chests [allegedly from their interrogation],” added Aung Myo Thant.

"Two Myanmar suspects have confessed to killing the pair," national police chief Somyot Pumpunmuang told the AFP news service even before the press conference. "DNA test results confirmed that the same DNA was found in the body of the (female)victim."

With her partner incapacitated, both men then set upon Witheridge, taking turns as raping her while alternately smoking a cigarette. When they were through, Wynsmashed her head

Lawyer Aung Myo Thant said the pair, Zaw Lin and Win Zaw Htun, both 21, from the Arakanese town of Kyaukphyu, told a Burmese embassy legal team they had murdered English tourists Hannah Witheridge and David Miller by bludgeoning them to death with a hoe on 15 September.

A second witness, Dr. Chasit Yoohad, gave testimony about his examination of the victims' bodies. He said he also performed a medical checkup of the two accused, and found them in good health. He said he asked through a translator if they had committed the crime, and they replied that they had.

BANGKOK: -- A human rights commissioner said Tuesday the two Myanmar migrant workers arrested on charges of murdering the two British backpackers on Koh Tao admitted to him that they committed the crime as charged.

The commissioner, Mr Prinya Sirisarakan, and his staff visited the two suspects at a prison on Koh Samui where they are being detained pending prosecution.

Commenting on the suspicion by netizens in the social media that the two suspects might be just scapegoats, Mr Prinya suggested that the police should disclose more details about the case to clear up the air.

He said the two told him that they drank both beer and wine before they attacked the two British tourists and he suspected that they might be drunk at the time they committed the crime.

You, Ali G & Buggy are going to look EXTREMELY stupid when the gunshot evidence comes out in court. Hannah was shot a close range, and that is a matter of FACT that completely debunks all your fallacious drivel.

However, you will probably say the B2 purchased a gun with their vast fortunes & shot her due to their extreme state of arousal.

[JohnThailandJohn]

According to the translator, Maung said he was not present when the murders took place

took place. He had left his friends at 1am to meet his girlfriend so he did not know about anything that took place afterwards.

He said Zaw Rin and Win admitted that they had indeed committed the murders and that they confirmed that Maung had left earlier. They said they were drunk and that they bludgeoned the heads of the tourists. The first weapon was a large bottle of wine which was used by Win on David Miller. Then Win used a hoe was used to finish the job.

Meanwhile, Zaw Rin had taken Hannah some distance away. She resisted and screamed, so he hit her with the same hoe. Win was the first to rape her, the translator said. He said the two did not leave the island immediately because it was difficult to do so with the police keeping a close watch.

Police yesterday confirmed the mobile phone of Koh Tao murder victim, David Miller, had been retrieved from the accommodation of one of the two Myanmar suspects.

National police chief Somyot Pumpanmuang said suspect Saw Rim, 21, had intended to take the victims mobile phone for his own use, but he later found the device cannot be used in Thailand, so he smashed and discarded it in his living quarters.

Pol Col Prachum Ruangthong, superintendent of the Koh Phangan police station, said the device is a black iPhone 4, taken from the shorts pocket of Miller, 24, who was found dead on a Koh Tao beach alongside Hannah Witheridge, 23, on Sept 15.

The confirmation came as doubts spread on social media as to whether the phone was really taken from the suspects. Some pictures circulated online show a friend of Witheridge brought a mobile phone to Pol Col Prachum during the inquest.

The men underwent medical checks before and after the inquiry to prove they were not tortured into admitting a crime.

They seemed in good health, except for pain in their chests [allegedly from their interrogation], added Aung Myo Thant.

"Two Myanmar suspects have confessed to killing the pair," national police chief Somyot Pumpunmuang told the AFP news service even before the press conference. "DNA test results confirmed that the same DNA was found in the body of the (female)victim."

With her partner incapacitated, both men then set upon Witheridge, taking turns as raping her while alternately smoking a cigarette. When they were through, Wynsmashed her head

Lawyer Aung Myo Thant said the pair, Zaw Lin and Win Zaw Htun, both 21, from the Arakanese town of Kyaukphyu, told a Burmese embassy legal team they had murdered English tourists Hannah Witheridge and David Miller by bludgeoning them to death with a hoe on 15 September.

A second witness, Dr. Chasit Yoohad, gave testimony about his examination of the victims' bodies. He said he also performed a medical checkup of the two accused, and found them in good health. He said he asked through a translator if they had committed the crime, and they replied that they had.

BANGKOK: -- A human rights commissioner said Tuesday the two Myanmar migrant workers arrested on charges of murdering the two British backpackers on Koh Tao admitted to him that they committed the crime as charged.

The commissioner, Mr Prinya Sirisarakan, and his staff visited the two suspects at a prison on Koh Samui where they are being detained pending prosecution.

Commenting on the suspicion by netizens in the social media that the two suspects might be just scapegoats, Mr Prinya suggested that the police should disclose more details about the case to clear up the air.

He said the two told him that they drank both beer and wine before they attacked the two British tourists and he suspected that they might be drunk at the time they committed the crime.

So you think B2 could restrain Hannah and beat David with a wine bottle at the same time? I'm around the same size as David, if a man the size of Win came at me with nothing but a broken bottle he would be in for a beating. So, both B2 beat David? Who was restraining Hannah?

So much B.S it's not even funny.

Those confessions are under alleged abuse and you know that. Why would they fight the case when their best chance in the world is confessing and receiving life in prison or anything less than a death sentence?

So many things do not add up, John.

I believe you will find they hit unarmed David from behind initially and assume he did't have eyes in the back of his head let alone suspect an attack was coming.

Well police may have threatened or coerced a confession from them ... their lawyers and embassy officials didn't and the two told them they did it outside police presence while showing no fear in telling them they were also abused by police.

[bruceybonus]

According to the translator, Maung said he was not present when the murders took place

took place. He had left his friends at 1am to meet his girlfriend so he did not know about anything that took place afterwards.

He said Zaw Rin and Win admitted that they had indeed committed the murders and that they confirmed that Maung had left earlier. They said they were drunk and that they bludgeoned the heads of the tourists. The first weapon was a large bottle of wine which was used by Win on David Miller. Then Win used a hoe was used to finish the job.

Meanwhile, Zaw Rin had taken Hannah some distance away. She resisted and screamed, so he hit her with the same hoe. Win was the first to rape her, the translator said. He said the two did not leave the island immediately because it was difficult to do so with the police keeping a close watch.

Police yesterday confirmed the mobile phone of Koh Tao murder victim, David Miller, had been retrieved from the accommodation of one of the two Myanmar suspects.

National police chief Somyot Pumpanmuang said suspect Saw Rim, 21, had intended to take the victim’s mobile phone for his own use, but he later found the device cannot be used in Thailand, so he smashed and discarded it in his living quarters.

Pol Col Prachum Ruangthong, superintendent of the Koh Phangan police station, said the device is a black iPhone 4, taken from the shorts pocket of Miller, 24, who was found dead on a Koh Tao beach alongside Hannah Witheridge, 23, on Sept 15.

The confirmation came as doubts spread on social media as to whether the phone was really taken from the suspects. Some pictures circulated online show a friend of Witheridge brought a mobile phone to Pol Col Prachum during the inquest.

The men underwent medical checks before and after the inquiry to prove they were not tortured into admitting a crime.

“They seemed in good health, except for pain in their chests [allegedly from their interrogation],” added Aung Myo Thant.

"Two Myanmar suspects have confessed to killing the pair," national police chief Somyot Pumpunmuang told the AFP news service even before the press conference. "DNA test results confirmed that the same DNA was found in the body of the (female)victim."

With her partner incapacitated, both men then set upon Witheridge, taking turns as raping her while alternately smoking a cigarette. When they were through, Wynsmashed her head

Lawyer Aung Myo Thant said the pair, Zaw Lin and Win Zaw Htun, both 21, from the Arakanese town of Kyaukphyu, told a Burmese embassy legal team they had murdered English tourists Hannah Witheridge and David Miller by bludgeoning them to death with a hoe on 15 September.

A second witness, Dr. Chasit Yoohad, gave testimony about his examination of the victims' bodies. He said he also performed a medical checkup of the two accused, and found them in good health. He said he asked through a translator if they had committed the crime, and they replied that they had.

BANGKOK: -- A human rights commissioner said Tuesday the two Myanmar migrant workers arrested on charges of murdering the two British backpackers on Koh Tao admitted to him that they committed the crime as charged.

The commissioner, Mr Prinya Sirisarakan, and his staff visited the two suspects at a prison on Koh Samui where they are being detained pending prosecution.

Commenting on the suspicion by netizens in the social media that the two suspects might be just scapegoats, Mr Prinya suggested that the police should disclose more details about the case to clear up the air.

He said the two told him that they drank both beer and wine before they attacked the two British tourists and he suspected that they might be drunk at the time they committed the crime.

Now a glass bottle? And you know they have retracted their statements right?

Since when do glass bottles make knife shaped stab wounds?

[Rykbanlor]

According to the translator, Maung said he was not present when the murders took place

took place. He had left his friends at 1am to meet his girlfriend so he did not know about anything that took place afterwards.

He said Zaw Rin and Win admitted that they had indeed committed the murders and that they confirmed that Maung had left earlier. They said they were drunk and that they bludgeoned the heads of the tourists. The first weapon was a large bottle of wine which was used by Win on David Miller. Then Win used a hoe was used to finish the job.

Meanwhile, Zaw Rin had taken Hannah some distance away. She resisted and screamed, so he hit her with the same hoe. Win was the first to rape her, the translator said. He said the two did not leave the island immediately because it was difficult to do so with the police keeping a close watch.

Police yesterday confirmed the mobile phone of Koh Tao murder victim, David Miller, had been retrieved from the accommodation of one of the two Myanmar suspects.

National police chief Somyot Pumpanmuang said suspect Saw Rim, 21, had intended to take the victim’s mobile phone for his own use, but he later found the device cannot be used in Thailand, so he smashed and discarded it in his living quarters.

Pol Col Prachum Ruangthong, superintendent of the Koh Phangan police station, said the device is a black iPhone 4, taken from the shorts pocket of Miller, 24, who was found dead on a Koh Tao beach alongside Hannah Witheridge, 23, on Sept 15.

The confirmation came as doubts spread on social media as to whether the phone was really taken from the suspects. Some pictures circulated online show a friend of Witheridge brought a mobile phone to Pol Col Prachum during the inquest.

The men underwent medical checks before and after the inquiry to prove they were not tortured into admitting a crime.

“They seemed in good health, except for pain in their chests [allegedly from their interrogation],” added Aung Myo Thant.

"Two Myanmar suspects have confessed to killing the pair," national police chief Somyot Pumpunmuang told the AFP news service even before the press conference. "DNA test results confirmed that the same DNA was found in the body of the (female)victim."

With her partner incapacitated, both men then set upon Witheridge, taking turns as raping her while alternately smoking a cigarette. When they were through, Wynsmashed her head

Lawyer Aung Myo Thant said the pair, Zaw Lin and Win Zaw Htun, both 21, from the Arakanese town of Kyaukphyu, told a Burmese embassy legal team they had murdered English tourists Hannah Witheridge and David Miller by bludgeoning them to death with a hoe on 15 September.

A second witness, Dr. Chasit Yoohad, gave testimony about his examination of the victims' bodies. He said he also performed a medical checkup of the two accused, and found them in good health. He said he asked through a translator if they had committed the crime, and they replied that they had.

BANGKOK: -- A human rights commissioner said Tuesday the two Myanmar migrant workers arrested on charges of murdering the two British backpackers on Koh Tao admitted to him that they committed the crime as charged.

The commissioner, Mr Prinya Sirisarakan, and his staff visited the two suspects at a prison on Koh Samui where they are being detained pending prosecution.

Commenting on the suspicion by netizens in the social media that the two suspects might be just scapegoats, Mr Prinya suggested that the police should disclose more details about the case to clear up the air.

He said the two told him that they drank both beer and wine before they attacked the two British tourists and he suspected that they might be drunk at the time they committed the crime.

Now a glass bottle? And you know they have retracted their statements right?

Since when do glass bottles make knife shaped stab wounds?

There is absolutely ZERO evidence of anything consistent with a glass bottle being used.

[Darkknight666]

According to the translator, Maung said he was not present when the murders took place

took place. He had left his friends at 1am to meet his girlfriend so he did not know about anything that took place afterwards.

He said Zaw Rin and Win admitted that they had indeed committed the murders and that they confirmed that Maung had left earlier. They said they were drunk and that they bludgeoned the heads of the tourists. The first weapon was a large bottle of wine which was used by Win on David Miller. Then Win used a hoe was used to finish the job.

Meanwhile, Zaw Rin had taken Hannah some distance away. She resisted and screamed, so he hit her with the same hoe. Win was the first to rape her, the translator said. He said the two did not leave the island immediately because it was difficult to do so with the police keeping a close watch.

Police yesterday confirmed the mobile phone of Koh Tao murder victim, David Miller, had been retrieved from the accommodation of one of the two Myanmar suspects.

National police chief Somyot Pumpanmuang said suspect Saw Rim, 21, had intended to take the victims mobile phone for his own use, but he later found the device cannot be used in Thailand, so he smashed and discarded it in his living quarters.

Pol Col Prachum Ruangthong, superintendent of the Koh Phangan police station, said the device is a black iPhone 4, taken from the shorts pocket of Miller, 24, who was found dead on a Koh Tao beach alongside Hannah Witheridge, 23, on Sept 15.

The confirmation came as doubts spread on social media as to whether the phone was really taken from the suspects. Some pictures circulated online show a friend of Witheridge brought a mobile phone to Pol Col Prachum during the inquest.

The men underwent medical checks before and after the inquiry to prove they were not tortured into admitting a crime.

They seemed in good health, except for pain in their chests [allegedly from their interrogation], added Aung Myo Thant.

"Two Myanmar suspects have confessed to killing the pair," national police chief Somyot Pumpunmuang told the AFP news service even before the press conference. "DNA test results confirmed that the same DNA was found in the body of the (female)victim."

With her partner incapacitated, both men then set upon Witheridge, taking turns as raping her while alternately smoking a cigarette. When they were through, Wynsmashed her head

Lawyer Aung Myo Thant said the pair, Zaw Lin and Win Zaw Htun, both 21, from the Arakanese town of Kyaukphyu, told a Burmese embassy legal team they had murdered English tourists Hannah Witheridge and David Miller by bludgeoning them to death with a hoe on 15 September.

A second witness, Dr. Chasit Yoohad, gave testimony about his examination of the victims' bodies. He said he also performed a medical checkup of the two accused, and found them in good health. He said he asked through a translator if they had committed the crime, and they replied that they had.

BANGKOK: -- A human rights commissioner said Tuesday the two Myanmar migrant workers arrested on charges of murdering the two British backpackers on Koh Tao admitted to him that they committed the crime as charged.

The commissioner, Mr Prinya Sirisarakan, and his staff visited the two suspects at a prison on Koh Samui where they are being detained pending prosecution.

Commenting on the suspicion by netizens in the social media that the two suspects might be just scapegoats, Mr Prinya suggested that the police should disclose more details about the case to clear up the air.

He said the two told him that they drank both beer and wine before they attacked the two British tourists and he suspected that they might be drunk at the time they committed the crime.

So you think B2 could restrain Hannah and beat David with a wine bottle at the same time? I'm around the same size as David, if a man the size of Win came at me with nothing but a broken bottle he would be in for a beating. So, both B2 beat David? Who was restraining Hannah?

So much B.S it's not even funny.

Those confessions are under alleged abuse and you know that. Why would they fight the case when their best chance in the world is confessing and receiving life in prison or anything less than a death sentence?

So many things do not add up, John.

I believe you will find they hit unarmed David from behind initially and assume he did't have eyes in the back of his head let alone suspect an attack was coming.

Well police may have threatened or coerced a confession from them ... their lawyers and embassy officials didn't and the two told them they did it outside police presence while showing no fear in telling them they were also abused by police.

"Now boys, if you tell anybody we threatened and coerced you we will kill not only you, by hanging in your cell. After that's done we will find your family and do the same"

That's all it takes here, John. They're also in the custody of RTP so vulnerable to being killed in their cells... Once there was enough attention and the B2 couldn't be murdered in jail, they could be more open with everyone. Do you know cops here do dirty stuff all the time? Trying to ejaculate a man to frame him for a crime, the Kristy Jones case?

There is damn good reason not to trust the authorities on this.. By their own hand they've shown they're corrupt and incompetent.

[StealthEnergiser]

According to the translator, Maung said he was not present when the murders took place

took place. He had left his friends at 1am to meet his girlfriend so he did not know about anything that took place afterwards.

He said Zaw Rin and Win admitted that they had indeed committed the murders and that they confirmed that Maung had left earlier. They said they were drunk and that they bludgeoned the heads of the tourists. The first weapon was a large bottle of wine which was used by Win on David Miller. Then Win used a hoe was used to finish the job.

Meanwhile, Zaw Rin had taken Hannah some distance away. She resisted and screamed, so he hit her with the same hoe. Win was the first to rape her, the translator said. He said the two did not leave the island immediately because it was difficult to do so with the police keeping a close watch.

Police yesterday confirmed the mobile phone of Koh Tao murder victim, David Miller, had been retrieved from the accommodation of one of the two Myanmar suspects.

National police chief Somyot Pumpanmuang said suspect Saw Rim, 21, had intended to take the victims mobile phone for his own use, but he later found the device cannot be used in Thailand, so he smashed and discarded it in his living quarters.

Pol Col Prachum Ruangthong, superintendent of the Koh Phangan police station, said the device is a black iPhone 4, taken from the shorts pocket of Miller, 24, who was found dead on a Koh Tao beach alongside Hannah Witheridge, 23, on Sept 15.

The confirmation came as doubts spread on social media as to whether the phone was really taken from the suspects. Some pictures circulated online show a friend of Witheridge brought a mobile phone to Pol Col Prachum during the inquest.

The men underwent medical checks before and after the inquiry to prove they were not tortured into admitting a crime.

They seemed in good health, except for pain in their chests [allegedly from their interrogation], added Aung Myo Thant.

"Two Myanmar suspects have confessed to killing the pair," national police chief Somyot Pumpunmuang told the AFP news service even before the press conference. "DNA test results confirmed that the same DNA was found in the body of the (female)victim."

With her partner incapacitated, both men then set upon Witheridge, taking turns as raping her while alternately smoking a cigarette. When they were through, Wynsmashed her head

Lawyer Aung Myo Thant said the pair, Zaw Lin and Win Zaw Htun, both 21, from the Arakanese town of Kyaukphyu, told a Burmese embassy legal team they had murdered English tourists Hannah Witheridge and David Miller by bludgeoning them to death with a hoe on 15 September.

A second witness, Dr. Chasit Yoohad, gave testimony about his examination of the victims' bodies. He said he also performed a medical checkup of the two accused, and found them in good health. He said he asked through a translator if they had committed the crime, and they replied that they had.

BANGKOK: -- A human rights commissioner said Tuesday the two Myanmar migrant workers arrested on charges of murdering the two British backpackers on Koh Tao admitted to him that they committed the crime as charged.

The commissioner, Mr Prinya Sirisarakan, and his staff visited the two suspects at a prison on Koh Samui where they are being detained pending prosecution.

Commenting on the suspicion by netizens in the social media that the two suspects might be just scapegoats, Mr Prinya suggested that the police should disclose more details about the case to clear up the air.

He said the two told him that they drank both beer and wine before they attacked the two British tourists and he suspected that they might be drunk at the time they committed the crime.

So you think B2 could restrain Hannah and beat David with a wine bottle at the same time? I'm around the same size as David, if a man the size of Win came at me with nothing but a broken bottle he would be in for a beating. So, both B2 beat David? Who was restraining Hannah?

So much B.S it's not even funny.

Those confessions are under alleged abuse and you know that. Why would they fight the case when their best chance in the world is confessing and receiving life in prison or anything less than a death sentence?

So many things do not add up, John.

I believe you will find they hit unarmed David from behind initially and assume he did't have eyes in the back of his head let alone suspect an attack was coming.

Well police may have threatened or coerced a confession from them ... their lawyers and embassy officials didn't and the two told them they did it outside police presence while showing no fear in telling them they were also abused by police.

"Now boys, if you tell anybody we threatened and coerced you we will kill not only you, by hanging in your cell. After that's done we will find your family and do the same"

That's all it takes here, John. They're also in the custody of RTP so vulnerable to being killed in their cells... Once there was enough attention and the B2 couldn't be murdered in jail, they could be more open with everyone. Do you know cops here do dirty stuff all the time? Trying to ejaculate a man to frame him for a crime, the Kristy Jones case?

There is damn good reason not to trust the authorities on this.. By their own hand they've shown they're corrupt and incompetent.

If the police didn't threaten them where is the video and audio evidence to prove this ?

[thailandchilli]

According to the translator, Maung said he was not present when the murders took place

took place. He had left his friends at 1am to meet his girlfriend so he did not know about anything that took place afterwards.

He said Zaw Rin and Win admitted that they had indeed committed the murders and that they confirmed that Maung had left earlier. They said they were drunk and that they bludgeoned the heads of the tourists. The first weapon was a large bottle of wine which was used by Win on David Miller. Then Win used a hoe was used to finish the job.

Meanwhile, Zaw Rin had taken Hannah some distance away. She resisted and screamed, so he hit her with the same hoe. Win was the first to rape her, the translator said. He said the two did not leave the island immediately because it was difficult to do so with the police keeping a close watch.

Police yesterday confirmed the mobile phone of Koh Tao murder victim, David Miller, had been retrieved from the accommodation of one of the two Myanmar suspects.

National police chief Somyot Pumpanmuang said suspect Saw Rim, 21, had intended to take the victim’s mobile phone for his own use, but he later found the device cannot be used in Thailand, so he smashed and discarded it in his living quarters.

Pol Col Prachum Ruangthong, superintendent of the Koh Phangan police station, said the device is a black iPhone 4, taken from the shorts pocket of Miller, 24, who was found dead on a Koh Tao beach alongside Hannah Witheridge, 23, on Sept 15.

The confirmation came as doubts spread on social media as to whether the phone was really taken from the suspects. Some pictures circulated online show a friend of Witheridge brought a mobile phone to Pol Col Prachum during the inquest.

The men underwent medical checks before and after the inquiry to prove they were not tortured into admitting a crime.

“They seemed in good health, except for pain in their chests [allegedly from their interrogation],” added Aung Myo Thant.

"Two Myanmar suspects have confessed to killing the pair," national police chief Somyot Pumpunmuang told the AFP news service even before the press conference. "DNA test results confirmed that the same DNA was found in the body of the (female)victim."

With her partner incapacitated, both men then set upon Witheridge, taking turns as raping her while alternately smoking a cigarette. When they were through, Wynsmashed her head

Lawyer Aung Myo Thant said the pair, Zaw Lin and Win Zaw Htun, both 21, from the Arakanese town of Kyaukphyu, told a Burmese embassy legal team they had murdered English tourists Hannah Witheridge and David Miller by bludgeoning them to death with a hoe on 15 September.

A second witness, Dr. Chasit Yoohad, gave testimony about his examination of the victims' bodies. He said he also performed a medical checkup of the two accused, and found them in good health. He said he asked through a translator if they had committed the crime, and they replied that they had.

BANGKOK: -- A human rights commissioner said Tuesday the two Myanmar migrant workers arrested on charges of murdering the two British backpackers on Koh Tao admitted to him that they committed the crime as charged.

The commissioner, Mr Prinya Sirisarakan, and his staff visited the two suspects at a prison on Koh Samui where they are being detained pending prosecution.

Commenting on the suspicion by netizens in the social media that the two suspects might be just scapegoats, Mr Prinya suggested that the police should disclose more details about the case to clear up the air.

He said the two told him that they drank both beer and wine before they attacked the two British tourists and he suspected that they might be drunk at the time they committed the crime.

A reminder above of the farce going on in the investigation, full of contradictions and inaccuracies

1. Dr. Chasit Yoohad, gave testimony about his examination of the victims' bodies. He said he also performed a medical checkup of the two accused, and found them in good health. He said he asked through a translator if they had committed the crime, and they replied that they had.

The above doctor is a local Koh Tao quack, who asked the translator, the Rotti seller! Its was the same Rotti seller who said they confessed to him that they used a wine bottle! Yet the RTP are adamant only one weapon the hoe was used. Will be interesting to hear the rotti sellers statement in the witness box in the next session.

2. With her partner incapacitated, both men then set upon Witheridge, taking turns as raping her while alternately smoking a cigarette

The cigarettes were found 50 meters away from the crime scene!!

I could go on but please JTJ if your going to provide a report then try to make it a convincing one that is not so full of holes

[JohnThailandJohn]

Just a quick search on the internet resulted in numerous ways the police allegedly tortured these two. Are there more claims?

interrogators said they would kill them

The interrogators told them to confess to the crime, and threatened to cut off their limbs, put them in a bag, and dump them in a river if they did not.

The police also threatened to tie the two boys to a tyre, pour petrol on it, and set it alight.

he was beaten and threatened with electrocution after refusing to confess

they had been scalded with boiling water during a police interrogation

they were forced to confess to the crimes after police punched and slapped them during interrogations.

They covered our heads with black plastic bags and threatened to stab us with a nail-like object

withdrawn their confessions claiming police beat it out of them.

As a side note, the health of the suspects was checked by at least three doctors from different organisations, including the Rights and Liberties Protection Department, who did not detect signs of physical assault.

"We prosecutors pay more attention to witness statements and evidence (not confessions)," said Thawatchai Siangjaew, director-general of the Office of Public Prosecution Region 8.

"More importantly, forensic evidence and statements given by medical doctors are treated as the most important elements when we decide whether or not to indictsuspects."

[thailandchilli]

Just a quick search on the internet resulted in numerous ways the police allegedly tortured these two. Are there more claims?

interrogators said they would kill them

The interrogators told them to confess to the crime, and threatened to cut off their limbs, put them in a bag, and dump them in a river if they did not.

The police also threatened to tie the two boys to a tyre, pour petrol on it, and set it alight.

he was beaten and threatened with electrocution after refusing to confess

they had been scalded with boiling water during a police interrogation

they were forced to confess to the crimes after police punched and slapped them during interrogations.

They covered our heads with black plastic bags and threatened to stab us with a nail-like object

withdrawn their confessions claiming police beat it out of them.

As a side note, the health of the suspects was checked by at least three doctors from different organisations, including the Rights and Liberties Protection Department, who did not detect signs of physical assault.

"We prosecutors pay more attention to witness statements and evidence (not confessions)," said Thawatchai Siangjaew, director-general of the Office of Public Prosecution Region 8.

"More importantly, forensic evidence and statements given by medical doctors are treated as the most important elements when we decide whether or not to indictsuspects."

How about asking the RTP why they refused to answer questions to the Human Rights Commission regards the allegations of torture, not only refused they completely ignored their requests to attend meetings on at least 3 occasions! Why would they do that if they had nothing to hide. A lack of transparency the common theme from the RTP throughout this case and trial

[Si Thea01]

This question is for you, Balo. Since you seem to know for sure NS was in Bangkok. If his life is ruined and he is so depressed why is he doing nothing to prove his innocence? That's what I would do if I were him and I really had nothing to do with all this, I'd give interviews to all who asked, make my phone records public, find CCTV of me in BKK the night before or even the day before. I would submit to polygraphs, agree to take a truth syrum so long as my attorney is present... I would send the running man bid to FBI and ask them to compare my walk to the running mans walking style (it can be done)

Anything, I'm telling you ANYTHING I could do to clear my name from what was done to David and Hannah.. And yet, none of the people suspected are doing that.. Quite the opposite really.

Of course you don't have to answer it's no demand.. I'm just curious what you think about it?

I understand that this is addressed to balo but if I may ask, has this person, and I take it you are referring to Nomsod, been charged with any offence relating to this matter. If he hasn't then he is deemed innocent and is not obliged to prove or provide anything to anyone, however, if he was charged, then what you are talking about is the task of investigating police in order to establish a person's involvement. And no, I am not sticking up for him, just telling you the way it works in the real world.

Very valid. I agree that Nomsod has no obligation to react to accusations from people on Thaivisa that he looks like someone on fuzzy CCTV footage. But the "real world" you talk about is different depending on where in the world you are. In a place like Koh Tao, the police are primarily part of a mafia.

Let me preface what I am now going to write by saying that I do not know who committed the crime. I am only explaining what I would expect if certain people were involved.

If those being accused on social media were involved, it is quite likely that a policeman would have been part of the gang that committed the murders. Even if not, they would certainly act to ensure the drug and extortion businesses that are their main source of income remain intact. Allowing key members of the mafia to be indicted would not be an option. Even in Bangkok, if you are high enough in the pecking order, you can get away with anything (including murder in front of 200 eye witnesses). In Koh Tao, it is usually trivial, but the attention focused by the fact that the victims were two young westerners has complicated matters.

From what many say on here in regards to the coppers may well be justified but as I do not know what their game is, that is the coppers, I have to accept, given what many on here say, that there is a high degree of criminality on the island and that they do very little, if anything, to curtail it. I am in no way condoning their actions or that of this Nomsod, I was just pointing out that even if he was as guilty as hell, he has not been charged, let alone convicted of any offence in relation to these murders, therefore is not obliged to do or say anything, and would be a fool if he subjected himself to any form of scrutiny. As for a copper to be involved in this crime possibly, it has happened before, in my home state of NSW, so I am not blind to this.

Now, with that aside, for drugs and criminal activity to flourish, as it appears it is, then yes, it would be fair to state that these so called police are corrupt and apparently complicit in any and all illegal activity that is undertaken on the island. If so, then it would be in their interest to turn a blind eye to those who it appears they are assisting, thus giving rise to the crime scene contamination, tampering with evidence, so that is was compromised, and in their failure to follow basic police protocols and procedures it has given rise to a flawed investigation. Yes, and before some of you jump in, I know I'm referring to the RTP. In respect to the Thai criminal code, I do not know if there is an offence such as "Perverting the Course of Justice" but if there is, then many of these people who call themselves police, should be in the dock and charged with such. Given what is coming out, I would dare to say that many of them would not make a coppers bootlace.

When I made mention of the real world, I meant that not everything will happen as one expects, there a situations that one can believe should occur but do not and that unfortunately leads to disappointment, or even resentment toward some one or something. I was also having a little dig at the poster when he suggested using truth serum, sounded like something from a movie script. I know it exists, but it is a mind altering drug and is not 100% reliable. It cannot be used in an interrogation, and anything garnered from it is inadmissible in a court of law. Also, if one is a compulsive liar, which criminals are, it apparently has little, if any, effect and makes it extremely difficult in determining if something stated by a person is the truth or a lie. yes, I see the pecking order, it is unfortunate but it exists and so do those who allow such atrocities go unpunished. When will it change, I cannot answer that, I doubt if anyone can.

[Darkknight666]

According to the translator, Maung said he was not present when the murders took place

took place. He had left his friends at 1am to meet his girlfriend so he did not know about anything that took place afterwards.

He said Zaw Rin and Win admitted that they had indeed committed the murders and that they confirmed that Maung had left earlier. They said they were drunk and that they bludgeoned the heads of the tourists. The first weapon was a large bottle of wine which was used by Win on David Miller. Then Win used a hoe was used to finish the job.

Meanwhile, Zaw Rin had taken Hannah some distance away. She resisted and screamed, so he hit her with the same hoe. Win was the first to rape her, the translator said. He said the two did not leave the island immediately because it was difficult to do so with the police keeping a close watch.

Police yesterday confirmed the mobile phone of Koh Tao murder victim, David Miller, had been retrieved from the accommodation of one of the two Myanmar suspects.

National police chief Somyot Pumpanmuang said suspect Saw Rim, 21, had intended to take the victims mobile phone for his own use, but he later found the device cannot be used in Thailand, so he smashed and discarded it in his living quarters.

Pol Col Prachum Ruangthong, superintendent of the Koh Phangan police station, said the device is a black iPhone 4, taken from the shorts pocket of Miller, 24, who was found dead on a Koh Tao beach alongside Hannah Witheridge, 23, on Sept 15.

The confirmation came as doubts spread on social media as to whether the phone was really taken from the suspects. Some pictures circulated online show a friend of Witheridge brought a mobile phone to Pol Col Prachum during the inquest.

The men underwent medical checks before and after the inquiry to prove they were not tortured into admitting a crime.

They seemed in good health, except for pain in their chests [allegedly from their interrogation], added Aung Myo Thant.

"Two Myanmar suspects have confessed to killing the pair," national police chief Somyot Pumpunmuang told the AFP news service even before the press conference. "DNA test results confirmed that the same DNA was found in the body of the (female)victim."

With her partner incapacitated, both men then set upon Witheridge, taking turns as raping her while alternately smoking a cigarette. When they were through, Wynsmashed her head

Lawyer Aung Myo Thant said the pair, Zaw Lin and Win Zaw Htun, both 21, from the Arakanese town of Kyaukphyu, told a Burmese embassy legal team they had murdered English tourists Hannah Witheridge and David Miller by bludgeoning them to death with a hoe on 15 September.

A second witness, Dr. Chasit Yoohad, gave testimony about his examination of the victims' bodies. He said he also performed a medical checkup of the two accused, and found them in good health. He said he asked through a translator if they had committed the crime, and they replied that they had.

BANGKOK: -- A human rights commissioner said Tuesday the two Myanmar migrant workers arrested on charges of murdering the two British backpackers on Koh Tao admitted to him that they committed the crime as charged.

The commissioner, Mr Prinya Sirisarakan, and his staff visited the two suspects at a prison on Koh Samui where they are being detained pending prosecution.

Commenting on the suspicion by netizens in the social media that the two suspects might be just scapegoats, Mr Prinya suggested that the police should disclose more details about the case to clear up the air.

He said the two told him that they drank both beer and wine before they attacked the two British tourists and he suspected that they might be drunk at the time they committed the crime.

So you think B2 could restrain Hannah and beat David with a wine bottle at the same time? I'm around the same size as David, if a man the size of Win came at me with nothing but a broken bottle he would be in for a beating. So, both B2 beat David? Who was restraining Hannah?

So much B.S it's not even funny.

Those confessions are under alleged abuse and you know that. Why would they fight the case when their best chance in the world is confessing and receiving life in prison or anything less than a death sentence?

So many things do not add up, John.

I believe you will find they hit unarmed David from behind initially and assume he did't have eyes in the back of his head let alone suspect an attack was coming.

Well police may have threatened or coerced a confession from them ... their lawyers and embassy officials didn't and the two told them they did it outside police presence while showing no fear in telling them they were also abused by police.

"Now boys, if you tell anybody we threatened and coerced you we will kill not only you, by hanging in your cell. After that's done we will find your family and do the same"

That's all it takes here, John. They're also in the custody of RTP so vulnerable to being killed in their cells... Once there was enough attention and the B2 couldn't be murdered in jail, they could be more open with everyone. Do you know cops here do dirty stuff all the time? Trying to ejaculate a man to frame him for a crime, the Kristy Jones case?

There is damn good reason not to trust the authorities on this.. By their own hand they've shown they're corrupt and incompetent.

If the police didn't threaten them where is the video and audio evidence to prove this ?

He/She (Sorry, Stealth not sure has a very valid point. Why wasn't the interrogation recorded? Seems beneficial for both police and defendants.

The RTP don't record any interrogations? I know that to be false personally.

[JohnThailandJohn]

Just a quick search on the internet resulted in numerous ways the police allegedly tortured these two. Are there more claims?

interrogators said they would kill them

The interrogators told them to confess to the crime, and threatened to cut off their limbs, put them in a bag, and dump them in a river if they did not.

The police also threatened to tie the two boys to a tyre, pour petrol on it, and set it alight.

he was beaten and threatened with electrocution after refusing to confess

they had been scalded with boiling water during a police interrogation

they were forced to confess to the crimes after police punched and slapped them during interrogations.

They covered our heads with black plastic bags and threatened to stab us with a nail-like object

withdrawn their confessions claiming police beat it out of them.

As a side note, the health of the suspects was checked by at least three doctors from different organisations, including the Rights and Liberties Protection Department, who did not detect signs of physical assault.

"We prosecutors pay more attention to witness statements and evidence (not confessions)," said Thawatchai Siangjaew, director-general of the Office of Public Prosecution Region 8.

"More importantly, forensic evidence and statements given by medical doctors are treated as the most important elements when we decide whether or not to indictsuspects."

How about asking the RTP why they refused to answer questions to the Human Rights Commission regards the allegations of torture, not only refused they completely ignored their requests to attend meetings on at least 3 occasions! Why would they do that if they had nothing to hide. A lack of transparency the common theme from the RTP throughout this case and trial

Don't need to ask them as they already have stated: fear any statements they give could adversely affect the criminal case case

It is pretty standard for investigators not to answer questions about a criminal case until trial even where it is a lawful civil case as a criminal case takes precedence. National Human Rights Commission who "invited" them to testify did the right thing but if they felt an obligation to hear such testimony they have the ability to lodge a formal complaint and proceeding to compel such testimony as opposed to just "inviting" for a fact finding mission. The police said many times publicly they didn't torture them and that is all they would have said to the NHRC unless of course the NHRC was conducting some sort of real investigation, prior to the criminal trial, and were going to get witnesses (not just rely on hearsay of defendants) and evidence ... which of course was not going to happen prior to a criminal trial.

So really no sense in trying to draw facts from the absence of something you seem to have no clue about.

As for the defendants being abused, certainly they may have been and if they were that would be wrong but doesn't make them innocent. It just makes their confession to the police questionable. However, they did admit their guilt to others outside of police presence including their first lawyer and prosecutors have made clear the case is not going to rest on their confession but rather be about actual physical evidence and witness testimony.

[Si Thea01]

According to the translator, Maung said he was not present when the murders took place

took place. He had left his friends at 1am to meet his girlfriend so he did not know about anything that took place afterwards.

He said Zaw Rin and Win admitted that they had indeed committed the murders and that they confirmed that Maung had left earlier. They said they were drunk and that they bludgeoned the heads of the tourists. The first weapon was a large bottle of wine which was used by Win on David Miller. Then Win used a hoe was used to finish the job.

Meanwhile, Zaw Rin had taken Hannah some distance away. She resisted and screamed, so he hit her with the same hoe. Win was the first to rape her, the translator said. He said the two did not leave the island immediately because it was difficult to do so with the police keeping a close watch.

Police yesterday confirmed the mobile phone of Koh Tao murder victim, David Miller, had been retrieved from the accommodation of one of the two Myanmar suspects.

National police chief Somyot Pumpanmuang said suspect Saw Rim, 21, had intended to take the victim’s mobile phone for his own use, but he later found the device cannot be used in Thailand, so he smashed and discarded it in his living quarters.

Pol Col Prachum Ruangthong, superintendent of the Koh Phangan police station, said the device is a black iPhone 4, taken from the shorts pocket of Miller, 24, who was found dead on a Koh Tao beach alongside Hannah Witheridge, 23, on Sept 15.

The confirmation came as doubts spread on social media as to whether the phone was really taken from the suspects. Some pictures circulated online show a friend of Witheridge brought a mobile phone to Pol Col Prachum during the inquest.

The men underwent medical checks before and after the inquiry to prove they were not tortured into admitting a crime.

“They seemed in good health, except for pain in their chests [allegedly from their interrogation],” added Aung Myo Thant.

"Two Myanmar suspects have confessed to killing the pair," national police chief Somyot Pumpunmuang told the AFP news service even before the press conference. "DNA test results confirmed that the same DNA was found in the body of the (female)victim."

With her partner incapacitated, both men then set upon Witheridge, taking turns as raping her while alternately smoking a cigarette. When they were through, Wynsmashed her head

Lawyer Aung Myo Thant said the pair, Zaw Lin and Win Zaw Htun, both 21, from the Arakanese town of Kyaukphyu, told a Burmese embassy legal team they had murdered English tourists Hannah Witheridge and David Miller by bludgeoning them to death with a hoe on 15 September.

A second witness, Dr. Chasit Yoohad, gave testimony about his examination of the victims' bodies. He said he also performed a medical checkup of the two accused, and found them in good health. He said he asked through a translator if they had committed the crime, and they replied that they had.

BANGKOK: -- A human rights commissioner said Tuesday the two Myanmar migrant workers arrested on charges of murdering the two British backpackers on Koh Tao admitted to him that they committed the crime as charged.

The commissioner, Mr Prinya Sirisarakan, and his staff visited the two suspects at a prison on Koh Samui where they are being detained pending prosecution.

Commenting on the suspicion by netizens in the social media that the two suspects might be just scapegoats, Mr Prinya suggested that the police should disclose more details about the case to clear up the air.

He said the two told him that they drank both beer and wine before they attacked the two British tourists and he suspected that they might be drunk at the time they committed the crime.

You, Ali G & Buggy are going to look EXTREMELY stupid when the gunshot evidence comes out in court. Hannah was shot a close range, and that is a matter of FACT that completely debunks all your fallacious drivel.

However, you will probably say the B2 purchased a gun with their vast fortunes & shot her due to their extreme state of arousal.

You state that the young women was shot at close range. Where did this come from, how is it that you know it to be factual, yet nothing has ever been reported or are you referring to some newspaper article referring to shrapnel or something. I would have thought that if she was shot one would have seen this in big, bold, black print, whilst the defence team and Andy would have spoken about it, yet nothing. I was wondering where you obtained your information to be so adamant that what you state is factual.

[Darkknight666]

According to the translator, Maung said he was not present when the murders took place

took place. He had left his friends at 1am to meet his girlfriend so he did not know about anything that took place afterwards.

He said Zaw Rin and Win admitted that they had indeed committed the murders and that they confirmed that Maung had left earlier. They said they were drunk and that they bludgeoned the heads of the tourists. The first weapon was a large bottle of wine which was used by Win on David Miller. Then Win used a hoe was used to finish the job.

Meanwhile, Zaw Rin had taken Hannah some distance away. She resisted and screamed, so he hit her with the same hoe. Win was the first to rape her, the translator said. He said the two did not leave the island immediately because it was difficult to do so with the police keeping a close watch.

Police yesterday confirmed the mobile phone of Koh Tao murder victim, David Miller, had been retrieved from the accommodation of one of the two Myanmar suspects.

National police chief Somyot Pumpanmuang said suspect Saw Rim, 21, had intended to take the victims mobile phone for his own use, but he later found the device cannot be used in Thailand, so he smashed and discarded it in his living quarters.

Pol Col Prachum Ruangthong, superintendent of the Koh Phangan police station, said the device is a black iPhone 4, taken from the shorts pocket of Miller, 24, who was found dead on a Koh Tao beach alongside Hannah Witheridge, 23, on Sept 15.

The confirmation came as doubts spread on social media as to whether the phone was really taken from the suspects. Some pictures circulated online show a friend of Witheridge brought a mobile phone to Pol Col Prachum during the inquest.

The men underwent medical checks before and after the inquiry to prove they were not tortured into admitting a crime.

They seemed in good health, except for pain in their chests [allegedly from their interrogation], added Aung Myo Thant.

"Two Myanmar suspects have confessed to killing the pair," national police chief Somyot Pumpunmuang told the AFP news service even before the press conference. "DNA test results confirmed that the same DNA was found in the body of the (female)victim."

With her partner incapacitated, both men then set upon Witheridge, taking turns as raping her while alternately smoking a cigarette. When they were through, Wynsmashed her head

Lawyer Aung Myo Thant said the pair, Zaw Lin and Win Zaw Htun, both 21, from the Arakanese town of Kyaukphyu, told a Burmese embassy legal team they had murdered English tourists Hannah Witheridge and David Miller by bludgeoning them to death with a hoe on 15 September.

A second witness, Dr. Chasit Yoohad, gave testimony about his examination of the victims' bodies. He said he also performed a medical checkup of the two accused, and found them in good health. He said he asked through a translator if they had committed the crime, and they replied that they had.

BANGKOK: -- A human rights commissioner said Tuesday the two Myanmar migrant workers arrested on charges of murdering the two British backpackers on Koh Tao admitted to him that they committed the crime as charged.

The commissioner, Mr Prinya Sirisarakan, and his staff visited the two suspects at a prison on Koh Samui where they are being detained pending prosecution.

Commenting on the suspicion by netizens in the social media that the two suspects might be just scapegoats, Mr Prinya suggested that the police should disclose more details about the case to clear up the air.

He said the two told him that they drank both beer and wine before they attacked the two British tourists and he suspected that they might be drunk at the time they committed the crime.

You, Ali G & Buggy are going to look EXTREMELY stupid when the gunshot evidence comes out in court. Hannah was shot a close range, and that is a matter of FACT that completely debunks all your fallacious drivel.

However, you will probably say the B2 purchased a gun with their vast fortunes & shot her due to their extreme state of arousal.

You state that the young women was shot at close range. Where did this come from, how is it that you know it to be factual, yet nothing has ever been reported or are you referring to some newspaper article referring to shrapnel or something. I would have thought that if she was shot one would have seen this in big, bold, black print, whilst the defence team and Andy would have spoken about it, yet nothing. I was wondering where you obtained your information to be so adamant that what you state is factual.

Yeah I don't know about the gun thing either but it seems unlikely. I think because the UK forensic guy has a military background and the wound is so large some find it plausible. Someone posted ages ago they thought they spotted an entrance wound under Hannah's chin.. I didn't see it myself.

[thailandchilli]

Just a quick search on the internet resulted in numerous ways the police allegedly tortured these two. Are there more claims?

interrogators said they would kill them

The interrogators told them to confess to the crime, and threatened to cut off their limbs, put them in a bag, and dump them in a river if they did not.

The police also threatened to tie the two boys to a tyre, pour petrol on it, and set it alight.

he was beaten and threatened with electrocution after refusing to confess

they had been scalded with boiling water during a police interrogation

they were forced to confess to the crimes after police punched and slapped them during interrogations.

They covered our heads with black plastic bags and threatened to stab us with a nail-like object

withdrawn their confessions claiming police beat it out of them.

As a side note, the health of the suspects was checked by at least three doctors from different organisations, including the Rights and Liberties Protection Department, who did not detect signs of physical assault.

"We prosecutors pay more attention to witness statements and evidence (not confessions)," said Thawatchai Siangjaew, director-general of the Office of Public Prosecution Region 8.

"More importantly, forensic evidence and statements given by medical doctors are treated as the most important elements when we decide whether or not to indictsuspects."

How about asking the RTP why they refused to answer questions to the Human Rights Commission regards the allegations of torture, not only refused they completely ignored their requests to attend meetings on at least 3 occasions! Why would they do that if they had nothing to hide. A lack of transparency the common theme from the RTP throughout this case and trial

Don't need to ask them as they already have stated: fear any statements they give could adversely affect the criminal case case

It is pretty standard for investigators not to answer questions about a criminal case until trial even where it is a lawful civil case as a criminal case takes precedence. National Human Rights Commission who "invited" them to testify did the right thing but if they felt an obligation to hear such testimony they have the ability to lodge a formal complaint and proceeding to compel such testimony as opposed to just "inviting" for a fact finding mission. The police said many times publicly they didn't torture them and that is all they would have said to the NHRC unless of course the NHRC was conducting some sort of real investigation, prior to the criminal trial, and were going to get witnesses (not just rely on hearsay of defendants) and evidence ... which of course was not going to happen prior to a criminal trial.

So really no sense in trying to draw facts from the absence of something you seem to have no clue about.

As for the defendants being abused, certainly they may have been and if they were that would be wrong but doesn't make them innocent. It just makes their confession to the police questionable. However, they did admit their guilt to others outside of police presence including their first lawyer and prosecutors have made clear the case is not going to rest on their confession but rather be about actual physical evidence and witness testimony.

Don't need to ask them as they already have stated: fear any statements they give could adversely affect the criminal case case

To right it could, if found to be true they should be up for criminal charges themselves. Yes that would affect the whole criminal case! Again it appears the RTP can "say so" and thats all thats required in this case.

As for the defendants being abused, certainly they may have been and if they were that would be wrong but doesn't make them innocent.

An admission on your part that they may have been abused and so you must also admit that the persons who would have been responsible for the abuse should be charged. Nobody said being a victim of abuse/torture makes you innocent but it does cast huge doubts as to the whole case and this one aspect is just one of dozens that have occurred in this investigation that require clear answers from the RTP if they are to be believed in anything they say.

[Nigeone]

According to the translator, Maung said he was not present when the murders took place

took place. He had left his friends at 1am to meet his girlfriend so he did not know about anything that took place afterwards.

He said Zaw Rin and Win admitted that they had indeed committed the murders and that they confirmed that Maung had left earlier. They said they were drunk and that they bludgeoned the heads of the tourists. The first weapon was a large bottle of wine which was used by Win on David Miller. Then Win used a hoe was used to finish the job.

Meanwhile, Zaw Rin had taken Hannah some distance away. She resisted and screamed, so he hit her with the same hoe. Win was the first to rape her, the translator said. He said the two did not leave the island immediately because it was difficult to do so with the police keeping a close watch.

Police yesterday confirmed the mobile phone of Koh Tao murder victim, David Miller, had been retrieved from the accommodation of one of the two Myanmar suspects.

National police chief Somyot Pumpanmuang said suspect Saw Rim, 21, had intended to take the victims mobile phone for his own use, but he later found the device cannot be used in Thailand, so he smashed and discarded it in his living quarters.

Pol Col Prachum Ruangthong, superintendent of the Koh Phangan police station, said the device is a black iPhone 4, taken from the shorts pocket of Miller, 24, who was found dead on a Koh Tao beach alongside Hannah Witheridge, 23, on Sept 15.

The confirmation came as doubts spread on social media as to whether the phone was really taken from the suspects. Some pictures circulated online show a friend of Witheridge brought a mobile phone to Pol Col Prachum during the inquest.

The men underwent medical checks before and after the inquiry to prove they were not tortured into admitting a crime.

They seemed in good health, except for pain in their chests [allegedly from their interrogation], added Aung Myo Thant.

"Two Myanmar suspects have confessed to killing the pair," national police chief Somyot Pumpunmuang told the AFP news service even before the press conference. "DNA test results confirmed that the same DNA was found in the body of the (female)victim."

With her partner incapacitated, both men then set upon Witheridge, taking turns as raping her while alternately smoking a cigarette. When they were through, Wynsmashed her head

Lawyer Aung Myo Thant said the pair, Zaw Lin and Win Zaw Htun, both 21, from the Arakanese town of Kyaukphyu, told a Burmese embassy legal team they had murdered English tourists Hannah Witheridge and David Miller by bludgeoning them to death with a hoe on 15 September.

A second witness, Dr. Chasit Yoohad, gave testimony about his examination of the victims' bodies. He said he also performed a medical checkup of the two accused, and found them in good health. He said he asked through a translator if they had committed the crime, and they replied that they had.

BANGKOK: -- A human rights commissioner said Tuesday the two Myanmar migrant workers arrested on charges of murdering the two British backpackers on Koh Tao admitted to him that they committed the crime as charged.

The commissioner, Mr Prinya Sirisarakan, and his staff visited the two suspects at a prison on Koh Samui where they are being detained pending prosecution.

Commenting on the suspicion by netizens in the social media that the two suspects might be just scapegoats, Mr Prinya suggested that the police should disclose more details about the case to clear up the air.

He said the two told him that they drank both beer and wine before they attacked the two British tourists and he suspected that they might be drunk at the time they committed the crime.

So you think B2 could restrain Hannah and beat David with a wine bottle at the same time? I'm around the same size as David, if a man the size of Win came at me with nothing but a broken bottle he would be in for a beating. So, both B2 beat David? Who was restraining Hannah?

So much B.S it's not even funny.

Those confessions are under alleged abuse and you know that. Why would they fight the case when their best chance in the world is confessing and receiving life in prison or anything less than a death sentence?

So many things do not add up, John.

Yes the attack bit doesn't make sense to me either. I'm same about the same height but broader and for sure even if I was overpowered I would inflict some damage first. And the same for poor Hannah and yet no apparent injuries or sign of being in a struggle on the B2 . Doesn't add to me either mind as I've said this took more than two people in my opinion so who knows

[JohnThailandJohn]

Just a quick search on the internet resulted in numerous ways the police allegedly tortured these two. Are there more claims?

interrogators said they would kill them

The interrogators told them to confess to the crime, and threatened to cut off their limbs, put them in a bag, and dump them in a river if they did not.

The police also threatened to tie the two boys to a tyre, pour petrol on it, and set it alight.

he was beaten and threatened with electrocution after refusing to confess

they had been scalded with boiling water during a police interrogation

they were forced to confess to the crimes after police punched and slapped them during interrogations.

They covered our heads with black plastic bags and threatened to stab us with a nail-like object

withdrawn their confessions claiming police beat it out of them.

As a side note, the health of the suspects was checked by at least three doctors from different organisations, including the Rights and Liberties Protection Department, who did not detect signs of physical assault.

"We prosecutors pay more attention to witness statements and evidence (not confessions)," said Thawatchai Siangjaew, director-general of the Office of Public Prosecution Region 8.

"More importantly, forensic evidence and statements given by medical doctors are treated as the most important elements when we decide whether or not to indictsuspects."

How about asking the RTP why they refused to answer questions to the Human Rights Commission regards the allegations of torture, not only refused they completely ignored their requests to attend meetings on at least 3 occasions! Why would they do that if they had nothing to hide. A lack of transparency the common theme from the RTP throughout this case and trial

Don't need to ask them as they already have stated: fear any statements they give could adversely affect the criminal case case

It is pretty standard for investigators not to answer questions about a criminal case until trial even where it is a lawful civil case as a criminal case takes precedence. National Human Rights Commission who "invited" them to testify did the right thing but if they felt an obligation to hear such testimony they have the ability to lodge a formal complaint and proceeding to compel such testimony as opposed to just "inviting" for a fact finding mission. The police said many times publicly they didn't torture them and that is all they would have said to the NHRC unless of course the NHRC was conducting some sort of real investigation, prior to the criminal trial, and were going to get witnesses (not just rely on hearsay of defendants) and evidence ... which of course was not going to happen prior to a criminal trial.

So really no sense in trying to draw facts from the absence of something you seem to have no clue about.

As for the defendants being abused, certainly they may have been and if they were that would be wrong but doesn't make them innocent. It just makes their confession to the police questionable. However, they did admit their guilt to others outside of police presence including their first lawyer and prosecutors have made clear the case is not going to rest on their confession but rather be about actual physical evidence and witness testimony.

Don't need to ask them as they already have stated: fear any statements they give could adversely affect the criminal case case

To right it could, if found to be true they should be up for criminal charges themselves. Yes that would affect the whole criminal case! Again it appears the RTP can "say so" and thats all thats required in this case.

As for the defendants being abused, certainly they may have been and if they were that would be wrong but doesn't make them innocent.

An admission on your part that they may have been abused and so you must also admit that the persons who would have been responsible for the abuse should be charged. Nobody said being a victim of abuse/torture makes you innocent but it does cast huge doubts as to the whole case and this one aspect is just one of dozens that have occurred in this investigation that require clear answers from the RTP if they are to be believed in anything they say.

You are being a bit obtuse here. First, you don't hold testimony outside and prior to the criminal case when those hearings any evidence, including hearsay, don't jive with the standards of a criminal case. A police officer would not be allowed anywhere to offer such testimony without a legal order (in this case it was an invite) from a court

Two detectives possibly being rough with some suspected rapists murderers doesn't cast doubt on the entire case but rather just any confession they got from such abuse but as stated by the prosecution, they filled and moved on this case because of the physical evidence and witnesses and not the confessions or their admission to their own embassy and legal team.

This case will come down to the DNA and all the other evidence will either jive with that or be discounted if the DNA were to somehow come in to question such as the defense lawyers casting credible doubt on it being their client's semen found in one of the victims.

[smedly]

According to the translator, Maung said he was not present when the murders took place
took place. He had left his friends at 1am to meet his girlfriend so he did not know about anything that took place afterwards.

He said Zaw Rin and Win admitted that they had indeed committed the murders and that they confirmed that Maung had left earlier. They said they were drunk and that they bludgeoned the heads of the tourists. The first weapon was a large bottle of wine which was used by Win on David Miller. Then Win used a hoe was used to finish the job.

Meanwhile, Zaw Rin had taken Hannah some distance away. She resisted and screamed, so he hit her with the same hoe. Win was the first to rape her, the translator said. He said the two did not leave the island immediately because it was difficult to do so with the police keeping a close watch.

The translator and his background

Myanmar Muslim roti seller who acted as a translator for the Myanmar suspects after their arrest arrest . He is from Yangon and has lived in Thailand for 18 years. He also acts as a volunteer volunteer Meaning: someone who is not paid for the work that they do

• and what makes anyone convinced that this mans testimony is true and not a total fabrication, well the crime scene should verify what he said

Maung readily admitted that he was with the two and that they had bought beer at the 7-11. From his information, police then detained Zaw Rin. Win, however, had fled to Surat Thani where he was eventually detained.

• First I heard that one that Win had fled

The suspects suspects Meaning: a person who is thought to have committed a crime Thai clothes showed no signs of blood since it had been washed, the translator said.

• it is not easy to remove blood stains from clothing better to just burn them

• so it was a wine bottle used on David and glass from the wine bottle is all over the sand and was tested for fingerprints and DNA from both the victim and the accused.........right ?, and then the Hoe was used on David and meanwhile the same Hoe was being used on Hannah further up the beach

• then they (I assume) both carried the body of David to the water, ever tried lifting a limp body twice your weight and size and if he was dragged across the sand there would be very clear evidence of that -

Maung Maung told the lawyer that when he returned home at 5am, he found the two suspects sleeping and nothing seemed suspicious.

• this is all down to who you believe so is a pointless exercise in even posting

"They said they didn't do it, that the Thai police [along with their Myanmar-Thai translator] beat them until they confessed to something they didn't do. They're pleading with the Myanmar government to look into the case and find out the truth. They were a really pitiful sight. Their bodies had all sorts of bruises. I have already reported all that I have seen today to my government."

Johnthiajohn, you have been very selective in your posting

again not saying guilty or innocent but so far all of the above is just hearsay until it can be backed up with solid verifiable evidence

If I claimed I saw you on the beach that night at 4am with a Hoe in your hand, I think you would want more than just my say so - right ? and upon inspection of my bank account I had suddenly become 30m baht richer

keep the feet for dancing

[JohnThailandJohn]

Those confessions are under alleged abuse and you know that. Why would they fight the case when their best chance in the world is confessing and receiving life in prison or anything less than a death sentence?

So many things do not add up, John.

There is a very vocal online community that has cast doubt on the case and the defense team is rightfully using this to their advantage. They have tried very hard to continue to try this in the public with letter writing campaigns and selectively making statements about small snippets that occurred during days of testimony. This is a very smart move on their part. The fact they cast huge doubt on the confession has given them momentum to see if they can cast doubt on the DNA (which is all this is going to come down to). Here too they have done a great job of leaking information at every step of the way including talking about discovery being unfair and all the meaningful DNA being gone. If they can somehow create a plausible doubt as to why their clients semen was not in the victim then they will win this case. However, I suspect they are going to examine the DNA evidence and despite sloppy work may have been involved, the only way to get around it would be to spin a vast conspiracy theory. So, my money is still on them pleading guilty before it comes down to a verdict.

[thailandchilli]

Don't need to ask them as they already have stated: fear any statements they give could adversely affect the criminal case case

To right it could, if found to be true they should be up for criminal charges themselves. Yes that would affect the whole criminal case! Again it appears the RTP can "say so" and thats all thats required in this case.

As for the defendants being abused, certainly they may have been and if they were that would be wrong but doesn't make them innocent.

An admission on your part that they may have been abused and so you must also admit that the persons who would have been responsible for the abuse should be charged. Nobody said being a victim of abuse/torture makes you innocent but it does cast huge doubts as to the whole case and this one aspect is just one of dozens that have occurred in this investigation that require clear answers from the RTP if they are to be believed in anything they say.

You are being a bit obtuse here. First, you don't hold testimony outside and prior to the criminal case when those hearings any evidence, including hearsay, don't jive with the standards of a criminal case. A police officer would not be allowed anywhere to offer such testimony without a legal order (in this case it was an invite) from a court

Two detectives possibly being rough with some suspected rapists murderers doesn't cast doubt on the entire case but rather just any confession they got from such abuse but as stated by the prosecution, they filled and moved on this case because of the physical evidence and witnesses and not the confessions or their admission to their own embassy and legal team.

This case will come down to the DNA and all the other evidence will either jive with that or be discounted if the DNA were to somehow come in to question such as the defense lawyers casting credible doubt on it being their client's semen found in one of the victims.

Actually I'm being a realist not obtuse.

This was a request from Thailand own Human Rights Organization JTJ, echoed by the FCO and amnesty international, you do not need a court order to attend a meeting with Human rights and its clear in Thailand you can ignore them at will if you happen to be the RTP in this case.

Again if they had nothing to hide then they should have attended for the sake of transparency.

Being rough with a suspect is dependent on how rough and we will never know because they refused to attend however we do have the statements from the B2 which although are not evidence in themselves, they have never been investigated.

You say this case comes down to DNA, perhaps you should add verified DNA rather than a report. At the moment all the court and defense has seen is the a report from the RTP and no evidence, that may change, I wait with baited breath for this and also the evidence of the chain of custody of the DNA to ensure any left has not been contaminated or compromised.

[smedly]

Those confessions are under alleged abuse and you know that. Why would they fight the case when their best chance in the world is confessing and receiving life in prison or anything less than a death sentence?

So many things do not add up, John.

There is a very vocal online community that has cast doubt on the case and the defense team is rightfully using this to their advantage.

the defence team will get no advantage whatsoever from online speculation, it will be proven with verifiable evidence - nothing more nothing less

[JohnThailandJohn]

Don't need to ask them as they already have stated: fear any statements they give could adversely affect the criminal case case

To right it could, if found to be true they should be up for criminal charges themselves. Yes that would affect the whole criminal case! Again it appears the RTP can "say so" and thats all thats required in this case.

As for the defendants being abused, certainly they may have been and if they were that would be wrong but doesn't make them innocent.

An admission on your part that they may have been abused and so you must also admit that the persons who would have been responsible for the abuse should be charged. Nobody said being a victim of abuse/torture makes you innocent but it does cast huge doubts as to the whole case and this one aspect is just one of dozens that have occurred in this investigation that require clear answers from the RTP if they are to be believed in anything they say.

You are being a bit obtuse here. First, you don't hold testimony outside and prior to the criminal case when those hearings any evidence, including hearsay, don't jive with the standards of a criminal case. A police officer would not be allowed anywhere to offer such testimony without a legal order (in this case it was an invite) from a court

Two detectives possibly being rough with some suspected rapists murderers doesn't cast doubt on the entire case but rather just any confession they got from such abuse but as stated by the prosecution, they filled and moved on this case because of the physical evidence and witnesses and not the confessions or their admission to their own embassy and legal team.

This case will come down to the DNA and all the other evidence will either jive with that or be discounted if the DNA were to somehow come in to question such as the defense lawyers casting credible doubt on it being their client's semen found in one of the victims.

Actually I'm being a realist not obtuse.

This was a request from Thailand own Human Rights Organization JTJ, echoed by the FCO and amnesty international, you do not need a court order to attend a meeting with Human rights and its clear in Thailand you can ignore them at will if you happen to be the RTP in this case.

Actually anyone can refuse an "invitation" to provide testimony about a criminal case prior to the trial. And there is mechanisms for for the NHRC who "invited" them, to complain and actually file charges but to my knowledge they did neither because they knew police offices were not going to speak about the case prior to a trial. The defense has the right to question them and it is not an invitation but will be mandatory during the criminal case and then the NHRC can then take further actions after the testimony in the criminal case. You are trying to make something out of nothing and that would be common even in first world nations where the criminal case takes precedence.

[smedly]

According to the translator, Maung said he was not present when the murders took place

took place. He had left his friends at 1am to meet his girlfriend so he did not know about anything that took place afterwards.

He said Zaw Rin and Win admitted that they had indeed committed the murders and that they confirmed that Maung had left earlier. They said they were drunk and that they bludgeoned the heads of the tourists. The first weapon was a large bottle of wine which was used by Win on David Miller. Then Win used a hoe was used to finish the job.

Meanwhile, Zaw Rin had taken Hannah some distance away. She resisted and screamed, so he hit her with the same hoe. Win was the first to rape her, the translator said. He said the two did not leave the island immediately because it was difficult to do so with the police keeping a close watch.

The translator and his background

Myanmar Muslim roti seller who acted as a translator for the Myanmar suspects after their arrest arrest . He is from Yangon and has lived in Thailand for 18 years. He also acts as a volunteer volunteer Meaning: someone who is not paid for the work that they do

• and what makes anyone convinced that this mans testimony is true and not a total fabrication, well the crime scene should verify what he said

Maung readily admitted that he was with the two and that they had bought beer at the 7-11. From his information, police then detained Zaw Rin. Win, however, had fled to Surat Thani where he was eventually detained.

• First I heard that one that Win had fled

The suspects suspects Meaning: a person who is thought to have committed a crime Thai clothes showed no signs of blood since it had been washed, the translator said.

• it is not easy to remove blood stains from clothing better to just burn them

• so it was a wine bottle used on David and glass from the wine bottle is all over the sand and was tested for fingerprints and DNA from both the victim and the accused.........right ?, and then the Hoe was used on David and meanwhile the same Hoe was being used on Hannah further up the beach

• then they (I assume) both carried the body of David to the water, ever tried lifting a limp body twice your weight and size and if he was dragged across the sand there would be very clear evidence of that -

Maung Maung told the lawyer that when he returned home at 5am, he found the two suspects sleeping and nothing seemed suspicious.

• this is all down to who you believe so is a pointless exercise in even posting

"They said they didn't do it, that the Thai police [along with their Myanmar-Thai translator] beat them until they confessed to something they didn't do. They're pleading with the Myanmar government to look into the case and find out the truth. They were a really pitiful sight. Their bodies had all sorts of bruises. I have already reported all that I have seen today to my government."

Johnthiajohn, you have been very selective in your posting

again not saying guilty or innocent but so far all of the above is just hearsay until it can be backed up with solid verifiable evidence

If I claimed I saw you on the beach that night at 4am with a Hoe in your hand, I think you would want more than just my say so - right ? and upon inspection of my bank account I had suddenly become 30m baht richer

keep the feet for dancing

oh and anyone know the location of Maung Maung, it was reported that he is in Thai police custody being held as a witness for the prosecution but was also reported as residing at the Burmese Embassy.

Based on his alleged witness statement he would be key to the prosecution case, but then again maybe he is going to be a defence witness and claim he didn't say what was quoted by the reliable roti interpreter or had turned down a massive bribe and decided to tell the truth .....speculation of course

[thailandchilli]

Don't need to ask them as they already have stated: fear any statements they give could adversely affect the criminal case case

To right it could, if found to be true they should be up for criminal charges themselves. Yes that would affect the whole criminal case! Again it appears the RTP can "say so" and thats all thats required in this case.

As for the defendants being abused, certainly they may have been and if they were that would be wrong but doesn't make them innocent.

An admission on your part that they may have been abused and so you must also admit that the persons who would have been responsible for the abuse should be charged. Nobody said being a victim of abuse/torture makes you innocent but it does cast huge doubts as to the whole case and this one aspect is just one of dozens that have occurred in this investigation that require clear answers from the RTP if they are to be believed in anything they say.

You are being a bit obtuse here. First, you don't hold testimony outside and prior to the criminal case when those hearings any evidence, including hearsay, don't jive with the standards of a criminal case. A police officer would not be allowed anywhere to offer such testimony without a legal order (in this case it was an invite) from a court

Two detectives possibly being rough with some suspected rapists murderers doesn't cast doubt on the entire case but rather just any confession they got from such abuse but as stated by the prosecution, they filled and moved on this case because of the physical evidence and witnesses and not the confessions or their admission to their own embassy and legal team.

This case will come down to the DNA and all the other evidence will either jive with that or be discounted if the DNA were to somehow come in to question such as the defense lawyers casting credible doubt on it being their client's semen found in one of the victims.

Actually I'm being a realist not obtuse.

This was a request from Thailand own Human Rights Organization JTJ, echoed by the FCO and amnesty international, you do not need a court order to attend a meeting with Human rights and its clear in Thailand you can ignore them at will if you happen to be the RTP in this case.

Actually anyone can refuse an "invitation" to provide testimony about a criminal case prior to the trial. And there is mechanisms for for the NHRC who "invited" them, to complain and actually file charges but to my knowledge they did neither because they knew police offices were not going to speak about the case prior to a trial. The defense has the right to question them and it is not an invitation but will be mandatory during the criminal case and then the NHRC can then take further actions after the testimony in the criminal case. You are trying to make something out of nothing and that would be common even in first world nations where the criminal case takes precedence.

Can you not read? If they had nothing to hide they would have attended. I have no need to make something out of nothing as more authoritative people than me have already done that:

AMNESTY

Amnesty International has called for an independent investigation into allegations of torture and ill-treatment by Thai police during the investigation into the murder of two British tourists on Koh Tao last month.

In a statement released on Tuesday, the London-based rights group called on Thai authorities to “ensure an independent and thorough investigation into mounting allegations of torture and other ill-treatment by the police, and respect the right to a fair trial” during the murder probe.

UK POLICE

There are two areas we are particularly concerned about. One if the verification of the DNA samples of the suspects, making sure there is further independent verification.

‘And the second is the investigation into allegations of mistreatment of the suspects.

FCO

We are concerned about the reports of allegations of mistreatment and expect the Thai authorities to address these thoroughly and transparently.

We have raised our concerns with the Thai authorities, including the need for the investigation and any future judicial proceedings to be carried out according to due process in a fair and transparent way.

[Si Thea01]

Those confessions are under alleged abuse and you know that. Why would they fight the case when their best chance in the world is confessing and receiving life in prison or anything less than a death sentence?

So many things do not add up, John.

There is a very vocal online community that has cast doubt on the case and the defense team is rightfully using this to their advantage. They have tried very hard to continue to try this in the public with letter writing campaigns and selectively making statements about small snippets that occurred during days of testimony. This is a very smart move on their part. The fact they cast huge doubt on the confession has given them momentum to see if they can cast doubt on the DNA (which is all this is going to come down to). Here too they have done a great job of leaking information at every step of the way including talking about discovery being unfair and all the meaningful DNA being gone. If they can somehow create a plausible doubt as to why their clients semen was not in the victim then they will win this case. However, I suspect they are going to examine the DNA evidence and despite sloppy work may have been involved, the only way to get around it would be to spin a vast conspiracy theory. So, my money is still on them pleading guilty before it comes down to a verdict.

Some of the things you write, I agree with others I don't. However, on this occasion what you have written is quite plausible. Of course it is a defence team's duty to discredit anything that could lead to the conviction of a client, in particular when noting the crime carries the death penalty. They have the responsibility to show that the police evidence is not credible, that the manner in which evidence was discovered was unlawful, therefore unfair to the defendants, it goes on and on. Unfortunately, for both sides, the initial police investigation was flawed, however, what has occurred since, with a new team, no one knows and there may be more evidence or none, we can only guess so we will just have to wait and see what else is tendered in evidence.

[Si Thea01]

Those confessions are under alleged abuse and you know that. Why would they fight the case when their best chance in the world is confessing and receiving life in prison or anything less than a death sentence?

So many things do not add up, John.

There is a very vocal online community that has cast doubt on the case and the defense team is rightfully using this to their advantage. They have tried very hard to continue to try this in the public with letter writing campaigns and selectively making statements about small snippets that occurred during days of testimony. This is a very smart move on their part. The fact they cast huge doubt on the confession has given them momentum to see if they can cast doubt on the DNA (which is all this is going to come down to). Here too they have done a great job of leaking information at every step of the way including talking about discovery being unfair and all the meaningful DNA being gone. If they can somehow create a plausible doubt as to why their clients semen was not in the victim then they will win this case. However, I suspect they are going to examine the DNA evidence and despite sloppy work may have been involved, the only way to get around it would be to spin a vast conspiracy theory. So, my money is still on them pleading guilty before it comes down to a verdict.

deleted as double post.

[thailandchilli]

oh and anyone know the location of Maung Maung, it was reported that he is in Thai police custody being held as a witness for the prosecution but was also reported as residing at the Burmese Embassy.

Based on his alleged witness statement he would be key to the prosecution case, but then again maybe he is going to be a defence witness and claim he didn't say what was quoted by the reliable roti interpreter or had turned down a massive bribe and decided to tell the truth .....speculation of course

Yes he went back to Burma where he remains and will not be attending the trial as far as is known. I suspect he's one of those that the defense has referred to as too scared to return