Koh Tao: Trial opens for 2 accused of killing British tourists

[Nigeone]

OMG My late father used to say I could try the patience of a saint! I think it now belongs to you. Oh I don't doubt they claimed it for one minute but they were only part of a chain and what they said they may believe but if other links in the chain are flawed it doesn't stand up. This is the last time I'm going to say this to you

As everyone else is laughing at you and I hate to see grown men cry! Up to NOW ! there is no evidence to link the B2 to this case. Please please for all the other people In here take a moment, maybe go and have a cup of tea and contemplate that statement. You'll feel better if you do.!

Don't flatter yourself, I'm cool as a cucumber.

If the chain of evidence is under question then the onus is on those making the claim to produce the evidence for it; and no, just saying that someone, somewhere got paid to tamper with it doesn't cut it.

Look at some of the very first pictures from the first day of people posting on this case and you will see the chain of evidence is already broken. As people that shouldn't have been on the crime scene were on the crime scene. People walking around a crime scene and moving things or even just sticking their footprints in the sand is already tampering with the evidence. The chain of evidence is not under question as you say as it is plain for all to see it was broken.

The main evidence against the accused is semen found inside the victim, no amount of people walking around the scene and moving things would have placed it there.

Proving their innocence is easy, prove the DNA taken from the victim doesn't match and they are free, anything else is a sideshow.

Correction, the main alleged evidence against the accused.! And how do you know the semen was there when the people as you say were walking round the scene! I don't know and nobody in here knows that. We know what the RTP tells us. But we don't all believe them. Maybe it was there, maybe it does belong to the accused but as I said it still doesn't prove murder! And that's not a conspiracy theory just common sense based on the performance of the RTP up to now. I know a poster on here with some connections has stated that the defense is going to blow the case out of the water in days to come. I wait with baited breath!

[Darkknight666]

This question is for you, Balo. Since you seem to know for sure NS was in Bangkok. If his life is ruined and he is so depressed why is he doing nothing to prove his innocence? That's what I would do if I were him and I really had nothing to do with all this, I'd give interviews to all who asked, make my phone records public, find CCTV of me in BKK the night before or even the day before. I would submit to polygraphs, agree to take a truth syrum so long as my attorney is present... I would send the running man bid to FBI and ask them to compare my walk to the running mans walking style (it can be done)

Anything, I'm telling you ANYTHING I could do to clear my name from what was done to David and Hannah.. And yet, none of the people suspected are doing that.. Quite the opposite really.

Of course you don't have to answer it's no demand.. I'm just curious what you think about it?

I understand that this is addressed to balo but if I may ask, has this person, and I take it you are referring to Nomsod, been charged with any offence relating to this matter. If he hasn't then he is deemed innocent and is not obliged to prove or provide anything to anyone, however, if he was charged, then what you are talking about is the task of investigating police in order to establish a person's involvement. And no, I am not sticking up for him, just telling you the way it works in the real world.

Yes that is all true, I'm saying what I would do if I had been accused of a crime and people believed it, I would do all I could.. Not that anyone else is currently on trial.

[GOLDBUGGY]

Interesting story of alleged smuggling of Migrant Workers into Thailand.

http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1431945319&section=12&typecate=06

[Nigeone]

The main evidence against the accused is semen found inside the victim, no amount of people walking around the scene and moving things would have placed it there.

Proving their innocence is easy, prove the DNA taken from the victim doesn't match and they are free, anything else is a sideshow.

well yes and no, I remember when I was a teenager camping at a rock concert, a young girl was gang raped by a crown of bikers and had her throat cut, 5 of them were convicted of rape only one was convicted of rape and murder.......just sayin

Yes again I agree and have said the same on many occasions. Semen or DNA could prove rape but not murder but as most people in here would say that this was unlikely to be carried out by two people only and very unlikely two of the stature of the B2. As a footnote of course if DNA was found on the alleged murder weapon that might be a different story. But we all know what apparently happened to that.

[Darkknight666]

Interesting story of alleged smuggling of Migrant Workers into Thailand.

http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1431945319&section=12&typecate=06

Which is related how?

[Linky]

This question is for you, Balo. Since you seem to know for sure NS was in Bangkok. If his life is ruined and he is so depressed why is he doing nothing to prove his innocence? That's what I would do if I were him and I really had nothing to do with all this, I'd give interviews to all who asked, make my phone records public, find CCTV of me in BKK the night before or even the day before. I would submit to polygraphs, agree to take a truth syrum so long as my attorney is present... I would send the running man bid to FBI and ask them to compare my walk to the running mans walking style (it can be done)

Anything, I'm telling you ANYTHING I could do to clear my name from what was done to David and Hannah.. And yet, none of the people suspected are doing that.. Quite the opposite really.

Of course you don't have to answer it's no demand.. I'm just curious what you think about it?

I understand that this is addressed to balo but if I may ask, has this person, and I take it you are referring to Nomsod, been charged with any offence relating to this matter. If he hasn't then he is deemed innocent and is not obliged to prove or provide anything to anyone, however, if he was charged, then what you are talking about is the task of investigating police in order to establish a person's involvement. And no, I am not sticking up for him, just telling you the way it works in the real world.

If there is a lot of speculation about him and it is depressing him there is an easy way to put all the speculation to rest.

Perhaps some on here should tell him.

[BritTim]

This question is for you, Balo. Since you seem to know for sure NS was in Bangkok. If his life is ruined and he is so depressed why is he doing nothing to prove his innocence? That's what I would do if I were him and I really had nothing to do with all this, I'd give interviews to all who asked, make my phone records public, find CCTV of me in BKK the night before or even the day before. I would submit to polygraphs, agree to take a truth syrum so long as my attorney is present... I would send the running man bid to FBI and ask them to compare my walk to the running mans walking style (it can be done)

Anything, I'm telling you ANYTHING I could do to clear my name from what was done to David and Hannah.. And yet, none of the people suspected are doing that.. Quite the opposite really.

Of course you don't have to answer it's no demand.. I'm just curious what you think about it?

I understand that this is addressed to balo but if I may ask, has this person, and I take it you are referring to Nomsod, been charged with any offence relating to this matter. If he hasn't then he is deemed innocent and is not obliged to prove or provide anything to anyone, however, if he was charged, then what you are talking about is the task of investigating police in order to establish a person's involvement. And no, I am not sticking up for him, just telling you the way it works in the real world.

Very valid. I agree that Nomsod has no obligation to react to accusations from people on Thaivisa that he looks like someone on fuzzy CCTV footage. But the "real world" you talk about is different depending on where in the world you are. In a place like Koh Tao, the police are primarily part of a mafia.

Let me preface what I am now going to write by saying that I do not know who committed the crime. I am only explaining what I would expect if certain people were involved.

If those being accused on social media were involved, it is quite likely that a policeman would have been part of the gang that committed the murders. Even if not, they would certainly act to ensure the drug and extortion businesses that are their main source of income remain intact. Allowing key members of the mafia to be indicted would not be an option. Even in Bangkok, if you are high enough in the pecking order, you can get away with anything (including murder in front of 200 eye witnesses). In Koh Tao, it is usually trivial, but the attention focused by the fact that the victims were two young westerners has complicated matters.

[AleG]

This question is for you, Balo. Since you seem to know for sure NS was in Bangkok. If his life is ruined and he is so depressed why is he doing nothing to prove his innocence? That's what I would do if I were him and I really had nothing to do with all this, I'd give interviews to all who asked, make my phone records public, find CCTV of me in BKK the night before or even the day before. I would submit to polygraphs, agree to take a truth syrum so long as my attorney is present... I would send the running man bid to FBI and ask them to compare my walk to the running mans walking style (it can be done)

Anything, I'm telling you ANYTHING I could do to clear my name from what was done to David and Hannah.. And yet, none of the people suspected are doing that.. Quite the opposite really.

Of course you don't have to answer it's no demand.. I'm just curious what you think about it?

I understand that this is addressed to balo but if I may ask, has this person, and I take it you are referring to Nomsod, been charged with any offence relating to this matter. If he hasn't then he is deemed innocent and is not obliged to prove or provide anything to anyone, however, if he was charged, then what you are talking about is the task of investigating police in order to establish a person's involvement. And no, I am not sticking up for him, just telling you the way it works in the real world.

The problem is that every time that person (or anyone else that's been accused of having been involved in the murders by people in Social Media) has taken the time to prove their innocence that has been taken as being part of a cover-up. CCTV footage? Fake, DNA testing? Fake, University documents? Fake. Etc, etc... Whatever they say or do is reinterpreted as being even more damning.

At some point any person would realize that there is no amount of evidence they could provide that would convince a believer; as Carl Sagan put it, you can't convince a believer of anything, because their belief is not based on evidence.

[Linky]

OMG My late father used to say I could try the patience of a saint! I think it now belongs to you. Oh I don't doubt they claimed it for one minute but they were only part of a chain and what they said they may believe but if other links in the chain are flawed it doesn't stand up. This is the last time I'm going to say this to you

As everyone else is laughing at you and I hate to see grown men cry! Up to NOW ! there is no evidence to link the B2 to this case. Please please for all the other people In here take a moment, maybe go and have a cup of tea and contemplate that statement. You'll feel better if you do.!

Don't flatter yourself, I'm cool as a cucumber.

If the chain of evidence is under question then the onus is on those making the claim to produce the evidence for it; and no, just saying that someone, somewhere got paid to tamper with it doesn't cut it.

Look at some of the very first pictures from the first day of people posting on this case and you will see the chain of evidence is already broken. As people that shouldn't have been on the crime scene were on the crime scene. People walking around a crime scene and moving things or even just sticking their footprints in the sand is already tampering with the evidence. The chain of evidence is not under question as you say as it is plain for all to see it was broken.

The main evidence against the accused is semen found inside the victim, no amount of people walking around the scene and moving things would have placed it there.

Proving their innocence is easy, prove the DNA taken from the victim doesn't match and they are free, anything else is a sideshow.

How do you know the semen was found in the body? Unless that is evidence with chain of custody you are guilty of speculation which is against the wishes of the family, as younkeep repeating.

So what you really mean is that YOUR speculation is ok.

[AleG]

The main evidence against the accused is semen found inside the victim, no amount of people walking around the scene and moving things would have placed it there.

Proving their innocence is easy, prove the DNA taken from the victim doesn't match and they are free, anything else is a sideshow.

Correction, the main alleged evidence against the accused.! And how do you know the semen was there when the people as you say were walking round the scene! I don't know and nobody in here knows that. We know what the RTP tells us. But we don't all believe them. Maybe it was there, maybe it does belong to the accused but as I said it still doesn't prove murder! And that's not a conspiracy theory just common sense based on the performance of the RTP up to now. I know a poster on here with some connections has stated that the defense is going to blow the case out of the water in days to come. I wait with baited breath!

The notion that DNA evidence would only prove rape or consensual doesn't fly, they had a long time to come clear on that if that was the case; during the investigation and after their arrest.

Besides that, as I said before, if David Miller's phone can be linked to them conclusively that's it for them, the notion that they both just happened to have sex with one of the victims on that night and then just happened to "find" the phone of the other within the space of a few hours without being in some way involved in the crime is beyond reasonable.

[AleG]

Look at some of the very first pictures from the first day of people posting on this case and you will see the chain of evidence is already broken. As people that shouldn't have been on the crime scene were on the crime scene. People walking around a crime scene and moving things or even just sticking their footprints in the sand is already tampering with the evidence. The chain of evidence is not under question as you say as it is plain for all to see it was broken.

The main evidence against the accused is semen found inside the victim, no amount of people walking around the scene and moving things would have placed it there.

Proving their innocence is easy, prove the DNA taken from the victim doesn't match and they are free, anything else is a sideshow.

How do you know the semen was found in the body? Unless that is evidence with chain of custody you are guilty of speculation which is against the wishes of the family, as younkeep repeating.

So what you really mean is that YOUR speculation is ok.

It has been reported to be the case since a few days after the murders, it's also been testified in court.

Don't play games, this is a serious issue.

[Darkknight666]

This question is for you, Balo. Since you seem to know for sure NS was in Bangkok. If his life is ruined and he is so depressed why is he doing nothing to prove his innocence? That's what I would do if I were him and I really had nothing to do with all this, I'd give interviews to all who asked, make my phone records public, find CCTV of me in BKK the night before or even the day before. I would submit to polygraphs, agree to take a truth syrum so long as my attorney is present... I would send the running man bid to FBI and ask them to compare my walk to the running mans walking style (it can be done)

Anything, I'm telling you ANYTHING I could do to clear my name from what was done to David and Hannah.. And yet, none of the people suspected are doing that.. Quite the opposite really.

Of course you don't have to answer it's no demand.. I'm just curious what you think about it?

I understand that this is addressed to balo but if I may ask, has this person, and I take it you are referring to Nomsod, been charged with any offence relating to this matter. If he hasn't then he is deemed innocent and is not obliged to prove or provide anything to anyone, however, if he was charged, then what you are talking about is the task of investigating police in order to establish a person's involvement. And no, I am not sticking up for him, just telling you the way it works in the real world.

The problem is that every time that person (or anyone else that's been accused of having been involved in the murders by people in Social Media) has taken the time to prove their innocence that has been taken as being part of a cover-up. CCTV footage? Fake, DNA testing? Fake, University documents? Fake. Etc, etc... Whatever they say or do is reinterpreted as being even more damning.

At some point any person would realize that there is no amount of evidence they could provide that would convince a believer; as Carl Sagan put it, you can't convince a believer of anything, because their belief is not based on evidence.

We're any of the above mentioned items for an alibi contested by anyone we can trust 100%? One was from his lawyer, one was done with his father present and with police who already declared a Thai couldn't have done this... And the school record? Not sure he released that, could be wrong.. Anyways.. Point is evidence that you were in Bangkok is pretty damn easy to supply. Yet... We've nothing by that can be verified.

You see I don't trust the police in this case, So their say so isn't satisfying, Sorry.

And I want the real killer, nobody else... No matter who they are or where they're from or what their job or immigration status may be.

[Mooner]

Still awaiting an answer to my question. seems to been ignored by the RTP supporters. If this was a family member. Would you be happy with this investigation?

If you choose to ignore this post again I will name you directly. Man up and make a divinative statement. Yes or no please! Please do not use beliefs linked to irrevalant beliefs.

The question is very simple!

Why not look at what the actual victim's family have stated?

In statements released through Britain's Foreign Office, the victims' families said they had seen strong evidence against the suspects and expressed confidence in the case.

"There is a great deal of detail and vast areas of investigative work which has been shared with us," Witheridge's family said in a statement.

"We would like to stress that as a family we are confident in the work that has been carried out into these atrocious crimes."

On Friday the family of Miller criticised "increasing sensationalism of this story" and said that "speculation" should be suspended until all evidence is made public.

"From what we have seen, the suspects have a difficult case to answer. The evidence against them appears to be powerful and convincing."

The families of Miller and Witheridge issued statements thanking police detectives for reviewing the case, and calling for the investigation to be allowed to take its course, The Guardian reported.

Miller's family said: "We would like to express our relief that progress is being made in Thailand and this case is finally coming to court."

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/national/UK-families-say-Koh-Tao-case-looks-convincing-30249283.html

Yes John, thanks for posting that for the 13th time. We've seen it. It was one member of one family who made that statement. It was 8 months ago. A lot's happened in 8 months. The statement was made based on lies the family was told, by people who were told lies in Thailand. Lies built upon lies.

Actually I am seeing two families make statements abive. Here are some statements from just weeks ago too ...

"Please allow the police and the court to do their jobs during the coming weeks and months. We, of course, want to see those responsible for the brutal murder of our precious girl brought to justice." [/size]

The victims' families have also previously said they have confidence in the case after British investigators reported back to them following a visit to Thailand late last year.[/size]

"This pain will remain a part of us for the rest of our lives. We have borne our thoughts in silence, as we have not wanted to influence any court proceedings, but simply want to see justice done fairly and openly. We ask the media to afford David and Hannah dignity in the reporting of this trial and also that we are given privacy and respect while we battle with our emotions during the difficult weeks ahead." - See more at: http://news.asiaone.com/news/asia/accused-koh-tao-murder-case-want-independently-test-forensic-[/size]

Again not much sense in asking people to speculate on if this were there kids when the actually were somebody's kids and they have expressed their thoughts about the case as well as the idiotic, uniformed and hurtful speculation all for some online users to get their jollies

So after months and months of RTP support you and your friends cant answer a simple questions. Instead hiding behind Parents statements when you you know you have to put your neck on the line.

Will you answer the question?

[AleG]

This question is for you, Balo. Since you seem to know for sure NS was in Bangkok. If his life is ruined and he is so depressed why is he doing nothing to prove his innocence? That's what I would do if I were him and I really had nothing to do with all this, I'd give interviews to all who asked, make my phone records public, find CCTV of me in BKK the night before or even the day before. I would submit to polygraphs, agree to take a truth syrum so long as my attorney is present... I would send the running man bid to FBI and ask them to compare my walk to the running mans walking style (it can be done)

Anything, I'm telling you ANYTHING I could do to clear my name from what was done to David and Hannah.. And yet, none of the people suspected are doing that.. Quite the opposite really.

Of course you don't have to answer it's no demand.. I'm just curious what you think about it?

I understand that this is addressed to balo but if I may ask, has this person, and I take it you are referring to Nomsod, been charged with any offence relating to this matter. If he hasn't then he is deemed innocent and is not obliged to prove or provide anything to anyone, however, if he was charged, then what you are talking about is the task of investigating police in order to establish a person's involvement. And no, I am not sticking up for him, just telling you the way it works in the real world.

The problem is that every time that person (or anyone else that's been accused of having been involved in the murders by people in Social Media) has taken the time to prove their innocence that has been taken as being part of a cover-up. CCTV footage? Fake, DNA testing? Fake, University documents? Fake. Etc, etc... Whatever they say or do is reinterpreted as being even more damning.

At some point any person would realize that there is no amount of evidence they could provide that would convince a believer; as Carl Sagan put it, you can't convince a believer of anything, because their belief is not based on evidence.

We're any of the above mentioned items for an alibi contested by anyone we can trust 100%? One was from his lawyer, one was done with his father present and with police who already declared a Thai couldn't have done this... And the school record? Not sure he released that, could be wrong.. Anyways.. Point is evidence that you were in Bangkok is pretty damn easy to supply. Yet... We've nothing by that can be verified.

You see I don't trust the police in this case, So their say so isn't satisfying, Sorry.

And I want the real killer, nobody else... No matter who they are or where they're from or what their job or immigration status may be.

Q.E.the F.D

It's not just what the police says.

The CCTV footage was released to the public, it was examined by the press in detail.

The DNA tests were done in four different hospitals.

You are clinging to the notion of all of that being part of a cover-up and the people that have handled the evidence are all complicit, people in charge of the CCTV at the building, the press, the hospitals, the police, everyone is in on it; and what is your evidence to support this notion? None, isn't it?

Here's another quote from Christopher Hitchens, "that which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence".

[BritTim]

How do you know the semen was found in the body? Unless that is evidence with chain of custody you are guilty of speculation which is against the wishes of the family, as younkeep repeating.

So what you really mean is that YOUR speculation is ok.

It has been reported to be the case since a few days after the murders, it's also been testified in court.

Don't play games, this is a serious issue.

It has also been testified in court that David was felled by a single blow to the back of the head. (This is contradicted by photographic evidence.) It has also been testified in court that DNA samples were lost or all used up. (This has been contradicted by later police and witness statements.) Which pieces of testimony are we supposed to take as gospel, and which are subject to doubt?

[JohnThailandJohn]

Still awaiting an answer to my question. seems to been ignored by the RTP supporters. If this was a family member. Would you be happy with this investigation?

If you choose to ignore this post again I will name you directly. Man up and make a divinative statement. Yes or no please! Please do not use beliefs linked to irrevalant beliefs.

The question is very simple!

Why not look at what the actual victim's family have stated?

In statements released through Britain's Foreign Office, the victims' families said they had seen strong evidence against the suspects and expressed confidence in the case.

"There is a great deal of detail and vast areas of investigative work which has been shared with us," Witheridge's family said in a statement.

"We would like to stress that as a family we are confident in the work that has been carried out into these atrocious crimes."

On Friday the family of Miller criticised "increasing sensationalism of this story" and said that "speculation" should be suspended until all evidence is made public.

"From what we have seen, the suspects have a difficult case to answer. The evidence against them appears to be powerful and convincing."

The families of Miller and Witheridge issued statements thanking police detectives for reviewing the case, and calling for the investigation to be allowed to take its course, The Guardian reported.

Miller's family said: "We would like to express our relief that progress is being made in Thailand and this case is finally coming to court."

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/national/UK-families-say-Koh-Tao-case-looks-convincing-30249283.html

Actually I am seeing two families make statements abive. Here are some statements from just weeks ago too ...

"Please allow the police and the court to do their jobs during the coming weeks and months. We, of course, want to see those responsible for the brutal murder of our precious girl brought to justice." [/size]

The victims' families have also previously said they have confidence in the case after British investigators reported back to them following a visit to Thailand late last year.[/size]

"This pain will remain a part of us for the rest of our lives. We have borne our thoughts in silence, as we have not wanted to influence any court proceedings, but simply want to see justice done fairly and openly. We ask the media to afford David and Hannah dignity in the reporting of this trial and also that we are given privacy and respect while we battle with our emotions during the difficult weeks ahead." - See more at: http://news.asiaone.com/news/asia/accused-koh-tao-murder-case-want-independently-test-forensic-[/size]

Again not much sense in asking people to speculate on if this were there kids when the actually were somebody's kids and they have expressed their thoughts about the case as well as the idiotic, uniformed and hurtful speculation all for some online users to get their jollies

So after months and months of RTP support you and your friends cant answer a simple questions. Instead hiding behind Parents statements when you you know you have to put your neck on the line.

Will you answer the question?

I'd be grateful the defendants are standing trial and grateful that the police got them. I would not be "happy" about anything to do with this event or anything related to it. They only thing that would make me more upset is if the people responsible for the crime walked and like the family, I believe the right people are standing trial. However, like the parents, I have confidence the judges in this case will come to the correct decision but I still anticipate they will plead guilty before a verdict is reached.

[thailandchilli]

The problem is that every time that person (or anyone else that's been accused of having been involved in the murders by people in Social Media) has taken the time to prove their innocence that has been taken as being part of a cover-up. CCTV footage? Fake, DNA testing? Fake, University documents? Fake. Etc, etc... Whatever they say or do is reinterpreted as being even more damning.

At some point any person would realize that there is no amount of evidence they could provide that would convince a believer; as Carl Sagan put it, you can't convince a believer of anything, because their belief is not based on evidence.

We're any of the above mentioned items for an alibi contested by anyone we can trust 100%? One was from his lawyer, one was done with his father present and with police who already declared a Thai couldn't have done this... And the school record? Not sure he released that, could be wrong.. Anyways.. Point is evidence that you were in Bangkok is pretty damn easy to supply. Yet... We've nothing by that can be verified.

You see I don't trust the police in this case, So their say so isn't satisfying, Sorry.

And I want the real killer, nobody else... No matter who they are or where they're from or what their job or immigration status may be.

Q.E.the F.D

It's not just what the police says.

The CCTV footage was released to the public, it was examined by the press in detail.

The DNA tests were done in four different hospitals.

You are clinging to the notion of all of that being part of a cover-up and the people that have handled the evidence are all complicit, people in charge of the CCTV at the building, the press, the hospitals, the police, everyone is in on it; and what is your evidence to support this notion? None, isn't it?

Here's another quote from Christopher Hitchens, "that which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence".

"that which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence"

Good quote, currently the RTP have provided a report of the DNA match, we are still waiting for the actual evidence of that report and have been for over 10 months. Lets see if they stick to their word this time and do indeed allow a retest bearing in mind a retest is useless without also have evidence of the chain of custody of any DNA trace samples left.

[Nigeone]

The main evidence against the accused is semen found inside the victim, no amount of people walking around the scene and moving things would have placed it there.

Proving their innocence is easy, prove the DNA taken from the victim doesn't match and they are free, anything else is a sideshow.

Correction, the main alleged evidence against the accused.! And how do you know the semen was there when the people as you say were walking round the scene! I don't know and nobody in here knows that. We know what the RTP tells us. But we don't all believe them. Maybe it was there, maybe it does belong to the accused but as I said it still doesn't prove murder! And that's not a conspiracy theory just common sense based on the performance of the RTP up to now. I know a poster on here with some connections has stated that the defense is going to blow the case out of the water in days to come. I wait with baited breath!

The notion that DNA evidence would only prove rape or consensual doesn't fly, they had a long time to come clear on that if that was the case; during the investigation and after their arrest.

Besides that, as I said before, if David Miller's phone can be linked to them conclusively that's it for them, the notion that they both just happened to have sex with one of the victims on that night and then just happened to "find" the phone of the other within the space of a few hours without being in some way involved in the crime is beyond reasonable.

Of course your basing the fact on them being there but if they weren't there why would they admit to rape. And as the phone again the same applies as if It can be proven that it was David's phone, and there's some doubt about that, you would still have to show a chain of custody and I don't think they can as wasn't it reported last week at the trial that a police officer didn't know anything about a chain of custody.

[Darkknight666]

This question is for you, Balo. Since you seem to know for sure NS was in Bangkok. If his life is ruined and he is so depressed why is he doing nothing to prove his innocence? That's what I would do if I were him and I really had nothing to do with all this, I'd give interviews to all who asked, make my phone records public, find CCTV of me in BKK the night before or even the day before. I would submit to polygraphs, agree to take a truth syrum so long as my attorney is present... I would send the running man bid to FBI and ask them to compare my walk to the running mans walking style (it can be done)

Anything, I'm telling you ANYTHING I could do to clear my name from what was done to David and Hannah.. And yet, none of the people suspected are doing that.. Quite the opposite really.

Of course you don't have to answer it's no demand.. I'm just curious what you think about it?

I understand that this is addressed to balo but if I may ask, has this person, and I take it you are referring to Nomsod, been charged with any offence relating to this matter. If he hasn't then he is deemed innocent and is not obliged to prove or provide anything to anyone, however, if he was charged, then what you are talking about is the task of investigating police in order to establish a person's involvement. And no, I am not sticking up for him, just telling you the way it works in the real world.

The problem is that every time that person (or anyone else that's been accused of having been involved in the murders by people in Social Media) has taken the time to prove their innocence that has been taken as being part of a cover-up. CCTV footage? Fake, DNA testing? Fake, University documents? Fake. Etc, etc... Whatever they say or do is reinterpreted as being even more damning.

At some point any person would realize that there is no amount of evidence they could provide that would convince a believer; as Carl Sagan put it, you can't convince a believer of anything, because their belief is not based on evidence.

We're any of the above mentioned items for an alibi contested by anyone we can trust 100%? One was from his lawyer, one was done with his father present and with police who already declared a Thai couldn't have done this... And the school record? Not sure he released that, could be wrong.. Anyways.. Point is evidence that you were in Bangkok is pretty damn easy to supply. Yet... We've nothing by that can be verified.

You see I don't trust the police in this case, So their say so isn't satisfying, Sorry.

And I want the real killer, nobody else... No matter who they are or where they're from or what their job or immigration status may be.

Q.E.the F.D

It's not just what the police says.

The CCTV footage was released to the public, it was examined by the press in detail.

The DNA tests were done in four different hospitals.

You are clinging to the notion of all of that being part of a cover-up and the people that have handled the evidence are all complicit, people in charge of the CCTV at the building, the press, the hospitals, the police, everyone is in on it; and what is your evidence to support this notion? None, isn't it?

Here's another quote from Christopher Hitchens, "that which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence".

Right. You believe the cops, I don't.

You believe the story they put forth and I do not.

I thought that had been established about 130 pages ago. Thai press said the only tape they saw from the lawyer (lol one tape) could have been photoshopped and some of the furniture wasn't in their correct place, So some doubt, yeah?

Don't hate me because we believe different pieces on uncontested (so far) evidence.

[BritTim]

Q.E.the F.D

It's not just what the police says.

The CCTV footage was released to the public, it was examined by the press in detail.

The DNA tests were done in four different hospitals.

You are clinging to the notion of all of that being part of a cover-up and the people that have handled the evidence are all complicit, people in charge of the CCTV at the building, the press, the hospitals, the police, everyone is in on it; and what is your evidence to support this notion? None, isn't it?

Here's another quote from Christopher Hitchens, "that which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence".

On the CCTV, it is quite true that the full CCTV from multiple cameras was studied by Thai PBS. It was not an obvious fake. There are still ways that it could have been falsified.

On the DNA testing of Nomsod, call me a skeptic. It is probable that Nomsod was afforded information about the initial DNA test results that has so far been withheld from the defense, but his private DNA testing has no independent chain of custody (if any at all).

[Linky]

Still awaiting an answer to my question. seems to been ignored by the RTP supporters. If this was a family member. Would you be happy with this investigation?

If you choose to ignore this post again I will name you directly. Man up and make a divinative statement. Yes or no please! Please do not use beliefs linked to irrevalant beliefs.

The question is very simple!

Why not look at what the actual victim's family have stated?

In statements released through Britain's Foreign Office, the victims' families said they had seen strong evidence against the suspects and expressed confidence in the case.

"There is a great deal of detail and vast areas of investigative work which has been shared with us," Witheridge's family said in a statement.

"We would like to stress that as a family we are confident in the work that has been carried out into these atrocious crimes."

On Friday the family of Miller criticised "increasing sensationalism of this story" and said that "speculation" should be suspended until all evidence is made public.

"From what we have seen, the suspects have a difficult case to answer. The evidence against them appears to be powerful and convincing."

The families of Miller and Witheridge issued statements thanking police detectives for reviewing the case, and calling for the investigation to be allowed to take its course, The Guardian reported.

Miller's family said: "We would like to express our relief that progress is being made in Thailand and this case is finally coming to court."

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/national/UK-families-say-Koh-Tao-case-looks-convincing-30249283.html

Yes John, thanks for posting that for the 13th time. We've seen it. It was one member of one family who made that statement. It was 8 months ago. A lot's happened in 8 months. The statement was made based on lies the family was told, by people who were told lies in Thailand. Lies built upon lies.

Actually I am seeing two families make statements abive. Here are some statements from just weeks ago too ...

"Please allow the police and the court to do their jobs during the coming weeks and months. We, of course, want to see those responsible for the brutal murder of our precious girl brought to justice." [/size]

The victims' families have also previously said they have confidence in the case after British investigators reported back to them following a visit to Thailand late last year.[/size]

"This pain will remain a part of us for the rest of our lives. We have borne our thoughts in silence, as we have not wanted to influence any court proceedings, but simply want to see justice done fairly and openly. We ask the media to afford David and Hannah dignity in the reporting of this trial and also that we are given privacy and respect while we battle with our emotions during the difficult weeks ahead." - See more at: http://news.asiaone.com/news/asia/accused-koh-tao-murder-case-want-independently-test-forensic-[/size]

Again not much sense in asking people to speculate on if this were there kids when the actually were somebody's kids and they have expressed their thoughts about the case as well as the idiotic, uniformed and hurtful speculation all for some online users to get their jollies

Pot,kettle ,black comes to mind here. And as for the statements my heart goes out to the families and those emotive statements however I don't see anything in them that gives credit to what's gone on. In fact it's all optimism that justice will be done based on the hopes that all parties will act honestly and fairly. Lovely words but definatly no praise for what's gone on up to now. Just my opinion and observation mind.

Go easy on him, its the only thing he's got left to hang his hat on. The RTP have already proved the statements of the families are without basis.

[Mooner]

Still awaiting an answer to my question. seems to been ignored by the RTP supporters. If this was a family member. Would you be happy with this investigation?

If you choose to ignore this post again I will name you directly. Man up and make a divinative statement. Yes or no please! Please do not use beliefs linked to irrevalant beliefs.

The question is very simple

Actually I am seeing two families make statements abive. Here are some statements from just weeks ago too ...

"Please allow the police and the court to do their jobs during the coming weeks and months. We, of course, want to see those responsible for the brutal murder of our precious girl brought to justice." [/size]

The victims' families have also previously said they have confidence in the case after British investigators reported back to them following a visit to Thailand late last year.[/size]

"This pain will remain a part of us for the rest of our lives. We have borne our thoughts in silence, as we have not wanted to influence any court proceedings, but simply want to see justice done fairly and openly. We ask the media to afford David and Hannah dignity in the reporting of this trial and also that we are given privacy and respect while we battle with our emotions during the difficult weeks ahead." - See more at: http://news.asiaone.com/news/asia/accused-koh-tao-murder-case-want-independently-test-forensic-[/size]

Again not much sense in asking people to speculate on if this were there kids when the actually were somebody's kids and they have expressed their thoughts about the case as well as the idiotic, uniformed and hurtful speculation all for some online users to get their jollies

So after months and months of RTP support you and your friends cant answer a simple questions. Instead hiding behind Parents statements when you you know you have to put your neck on the line.

Will you answer the question?

I'd be grateful the defendants are standing trial and grateful that the police got them. I would not be "happy" about anything to do with this event or anything related to it. They only thing that would make me more upset is if the people responsible for the crime walked and like the family, I believe the right people are standing trial. However, like the parents, I have confidence the judges in this case will come to the correct decision but I still anticipate they will plead guilty before a verdict is reached

Not what i asked! I wont bother conversing with you or debating as you cant answer a straight question. More stepovers than Ronaldo and better at dodging questions than most politicians.

[GOLDBUGGY]

I am sorry but there is one thing, and perhaps the last for awhile, that I must say.

This has got to be the worst Media Reporting that I have seen in my life-time!

That is including the covering any news. sporting or criminal event. I am not signaling out any one newspaper here as they all seem to be the same. You get the odd article one day, where it seems biased, but the next you get someone reporting 2 sentences on big news, and 6 paragraphs that seems like you are reading his opinion and not the news at all. How many more times do I have to read that Amnesty International is investigating any wrong doings in this case but not a bloody word as to their progress. Other then trying to set up some interviews months ago.

I mean even when they get news they don't report it the way it is stated. Like no we don't have that...no it was lost...no it was used up....yes! Who told you that, we have that? Or like this last link someone provided, which I will link later again. I was just proven by a poster here, and rightly so, that when Lin went to trial in December he showed his Passport to show he was in Thailand Legally. They never did report if he was or not, as they need that space to go on about Amnesty International again. So it is left up to us to assume.

But this link today says that the 2 accused were charged with illegally working in Thailand. So does that mean that Lin was here on a tourist visa but not allowed to work, or does this mean this statement is incorrect. Why do we constantly have to be guessing what the man is trying to say? Why not say Lin was allowed to be here but not allowed to work. Isn't there job to report the news clearly and so that we all understand what he is saying, and not have to keep guessing all the time?

Or the clothes for example at the crime scene. Originally shown not scattered but not in a neat pile.Then 11 months later they are in a neat pile. It is then media reported that the first officer on the scene found them this way. Then that got changed to the 2nd Police Officer on the scene. Then it is reported he didn't say anything about how the clothes were found but rather it was the Prosecutor who said this.

Then you get the Head of Forensics on the stand for what? Nearly a whole day was it? The the news comes out then next day and all you get is a few paragraphs. Only Hannah's Blood was found on the hoe and we duplicate and general save DNA and save that for 1 to 2 years. Surely in all this time she must have said more than just that. There may be a ban on publications, but if there is say so! Surely there is no ban on saying there is one.

Just take the time of death for instance. I would bet my bottom dollar that in a way earlier News Media Report they said the time of death was between the hours of 2 am and 4 am. Then someone posted to me that it was actually 4:30 am. Which even though I didn't see that time change, I couldn't contest as he could be right. Now from this link it says 5:30 am. Jesus Christ! Is the next time I hear this is it going to be on a different day. Did the media report this incorrectly? Did the person who said this change his mind? If that is so then tell us he did and why? That is your job and what you are suppose to do!

Even us Arm Chair Quarter Backs can do a better job then Media Reports. We know David hit the AC Bar at around 2 am to meet up with Hannah. Say an hour at least for some chit chat and a beer or 2 then they would have left around 3 am. Say another 20 minutes to stroll to the rocks, and another 10 minuted before being attacked and that places this time at 3;30 am. The Rapes must have taken some time at least before she was murdered, So say 30 minutes and now you got 4:00 am as the time of death. Beach Cleaner finds bodies at 5;45 am (or close to that) and there you have. Without even seeing the bodies we could have deduced the time of death from 4:00 am to 5;30 am. So who needs media to report to us the 3 different times of death when we could have done a better job on our own.

I know I have bumped heads here with a lot of you, but please don't take this personal. I now I don't. Except for Name Calling. I know many here have very strong feelings and opinions about this case. Some justified. Some not so much. But I was only expressing my opinion to at that time, and I honestly felt like it based it on what I had read in the media, reporting about this case, and from the evidence they were said to be holding.

At the moment I have very little faith in the News Media Reporting this case. If you have to go to a Human Rights Activist to get your news, you should know something is wrong right from the start. This is not meant to be an insult to these people as I am sure they have a good place in society. I am merely pointing out that it would be difficult for them to be biased when I think news reporting should be,

I honestly don't know how you guys feel about what has been reported on this case, but I know how I feel about it.

http://www.news.com.au/world/asia/families-hear-gruesome-details-as-trial-for-thailand-murders-of-two-british-tourists-begins/story-fnh81fz8-1227434677803 . .

.

I agree that the coverage of what's actually been taking place in the courtroom has been minimal. It's hard to decipher how the case it being argued when all we get are soundbites or a short synopsis. It also doesn't help when journalists are obstructed ie: not being allowed to take notes , translators threatened off the job.

I don't really think you can deny that the police have made a pigs ear out of this case and in typical Thai fashion instead of accepting culpability have deflected criticism and dug a rather large hole for themselves.I find your arguments often rely on the ability to take the polices word as gospel. It's common knowledge here that RTP are notorious for conspiring to subvert justice to suit their nefarious agendas. I think you mean well but are just naive to the realities of dealing with Thai police, no offence. Nobody knows who did this but people are right to question the evidence as it has been shown time and time again that the police here do not always apply justice in a way would be considered fair by international standards.

I do admit that I tend to defend one basic principle here, which is not what people think. What I strongly believe, referring only to this particular case, is that this rape and murders is not a cover-up nor where they looking for scapegoats that took 2 weeks to find. This case has had International Media Attention for the day this happened. It has involved some very High Ranking Police Officials and also including the Top Man in Thailand and the Top Man in the UK, and the Top Man in Myanmar.

Even then, if it was only their word against the word of the accused, as it appears to be right now with the alleged forced confessions, it isn't. The Prosecution has reported through the Media (if you can believe that) a strong and convincing case once all the evidence comes out. In particular 5 items. I have not seen or heard anything from the Defense Side so far except rumors and poking holes in the Prosecutions case. But all this evidence both sides they claim to have will have to come out in court.

So I just don't believe it is a cover-up. Does that make me so unreasonable and worthy of name calling? That I don't believe 2 police men would take a swab and place the 2 accused sperm (heaven knows how they would get that) inside of Hannah. That the entire Forensic Lab Team is falsifying evidence. That the Prosecutor would submit evidence of crucial DNA tests but not have the paper work to back them? And this list goes on.

Do they have the wrong people? That is for the court to decide based on evidence that will be presented in the coming months and not me. But again the Prosecution appears to have a strong and convincing case against the accused.

You may not know this but I was one of the first to post here on this case and one of the first things I said was that the police should stop all transportation leaving the Island. I even explained one of my long stories how a friend of mine was on a passenger ship landing in Italy and the Police keep everyone on-board for 3 days and until a missing person was solved. I was also one of the first ones to say they should protect the integrity of the Crime Scene.

Yes, the presentation of this case seems in shambles at times. You just don't know who to believe. Not having a Translator certainly is not helping the cause but in all honesty, don't you think it is time for them to stop crying about that? The Reports first reported this about 3 weeks ago, Plenty of time to bring someone from there own country who speaks and understands Thai. Hell, there are Farangs in Thailand who can do that. Andy is one of them.

Sure I know some of the rumors of the goings on in Thailand. I have to use the words alleged as personally this never happen to me and after living their a very long time. But this case is far more serious then just paying a fine to a traffic cop so you don't have to go to the Police Station. I have also worked in countries far more corrupt than Thailand, so maybe this doesn't fizz on me as much. Where you had to slide 5 bucks in your passport to just get in the country regardless of your visa. Or in another where Gaddafi was in charge. Or yet another where we had to travel to work with a Police Escort and in Bullet Proof Buses. And this list goes on and on.

Sorry, GB, all I gained from reading that is you're quite gulible. If this were France, Germany, even the U.S. Which is also at times corrupt, I would believe the police, only slightly more. In Thailand I don't believe them 90% of the time and that's with good reason.

You've always sounded like you have the utmost faith in law and order in Thailand, and It doesn't make sense to me.

Nobody knows exactly what happened aside from those who were in the bar and on the beach that night. You choose to believe the "official" side of things and I tend to be skeptical of their every move, also with good reason.

I think you're a decent guy, Just being a bit gulibile

I believe what I said is that I do not believe this case is a cover-up and I explained why. If you want to try and analysis my thoughts on what I think about the Police in general, it is really irrelevant. In everyone of those countries you mention I could link you cases of Police Corruption, Police Brutality, Innocent People being sent to prison, and so on. So I try to stick to this one case only.

You may think I am gullible, but at least I have left the door open to change my mind if I ever see proof of the 2 accused being Innocent. That I will weigh both sides and make this judgement on my own. But for many here they only want to belong to some gang and look at one side, regardless of the evidence. Evidence that they will refuse to accept as it points in the opposite direction of their "Gut Feeling".

I could use many other words to describe this, but to me this is what being "Gullible" is. .

[evadgib]

Would now be a good time to lock the thread until the trial resumes? I for one am getting fed up reading this...

[Rykbanlor]

Q.E.the F.D

It's not just what the police says.

The CCTV footage was released to the public, it was examined by the press in detail.

The DNA tests were done in four different hospitals.

You are clinging to the notion of all of that being part of a cover-up and the people that have handled the evidence are all complicit, people in charge of the CCTV at the building, the press, the hospitals, the police, everyone is in on it; and what is your evidence to support this notion? None, isn't it?

Here's another quote from Christopher Hitchens, "that which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence".

On the CCTV, it is quite true that the full CCTV from multiple cameras was studied by Thai PBS. It was not an obvious fake. There are still ways that it could have been falsified.

On the DNA testing of Nomsod, call me a skeptic. It is probable that Nomsod was afforded information about the initial DNA test results that has so far been withheld from the defense, but his private DNA testing has no independent chain of custody (if any at all).

Furthermore - the lead investigator has stated that no report ever came from the DNA testing of Nomsod. So this was only ever orally confirmed by Sir Somyot the Moneyed.

DNA tests were done in 4 different hospitals - anyone can swab the boys mouth. Now we have to believe the Police are providing the correct samples to compare - Doubt has already been cast by Pornthip, the defence and pretty much everyone thats sporting more than a handful of brain cells - WE DO NOT TRUST THE POLICE and cannot believe what they tell us when there is zero transparency. Chain of custody is unclear and the samples were taken at the crime scene WITHOUT A PROPER FORENSICS OFFICER.

And again - NO REPORT AVAILABLE for Nomsods DNA test.

AleG, can you now comprehend what the problem is man? You keep arguing for the police and DNA samples. Now, re-read my post again, and see if you can get it, before you post again about DNA and police statements -

[JohnThailandJohn]

Actually I am seeing two families make statements abive. Here are some statements from just weeks ago too ...

"Please allow the police and the court to do their jobs during the coming weeks and months. We, of course, want to see those responsible for the brutal murder of our precious girl brought to justice." [/size]

The victims' families have also previously said they have confidence in the case after British investigators reported back to them following a visit to Thailand late last year.[/size]

"This pain will remain a part of us for the rest of our lives. We have borne our thoughts in silence, as we have not wanted to influence any court proceedings, but simply want to see justice done fairly and openly. We ask the media to afford David and Hannah dignity in the reporting of this trial and also that we are given privacy and respect while we battle with our emotions during the difficult weeks ahead." - See more at: http://news.asiaone.com/news/asia/accused-koh-tao-murder-case-want-independently-test-forensic-[/size]

Again not much sense in asking people to speculate on if this were there kids when the actually were somebody's kids and they have expressed their thoughts about the case as well as the idiotic, uniformed and hurtful speculation all for some online users to get their jollies

So after months and months of RTP support you and your friends cant answer a simple questions. Instead hiding behind Parents statements when you you know you have to put your neck on the line.

Will you answer the question?

I'd be grateful the defendants are standing trial and grateful that the police got them. I would not be "happy" about anything to do with this event or anything related to it. They only thing that would make me more upset is if the people responsible for the crime walked and like the family, I believe the right people are standing trial. However, like the parents, I have confidence the judges in this case will come to the correct decision but I still anticipate they will plead guilty before a verdict is reached

Not what i asked! I wont bother conversing with you or debating as you cant answer a straight question. More stepovers than Ronaldo and better at dodging questions than most politicians.

You asked: "Still awaiting an answer to my question. seems to been ignored by the RTP supporters. If this was a family member. Would you be happy with this investigation?"

I answered you very clearly above -- you asked if (speculating) I would be "happy" about the police investigation if (speculating) it was my family. As I clearly stated, I would not be "happy" about anything to do with these events but I would be satisfied, as the actual families are, that the right people are on trial and would have faith justice will be carried out in court. Lots of game playing with speculation when there really is no reason to ask such imaginative questions when the families have releases statements and they are more in the know that any of us and they actually did lose their family members.

[Rykbanlor]

So after months and months of RTP support you and your friends cant answer a simple questions. Instead hiding behind Parents statements when you you know you have to put your neck on the line.

Will you answer the question?

I'd be grateful the defendants are standing trial and grateful that the police got them. I would not be "happy" about anything to do with this event or anything related to it. They only thing that would make me more upset is if the people responsible for the crime walked and like the family, I believe the right people are standing trial. However, like the parents, I have confidence the judges in this case will come to the correct decision but I still anticipate they will plead guilty before a verdict is reached

Not what i asked! I wont bother conversing with you or debating as you cant answer a straight question. More stepovers than Ronaldo and better at dodging questions than most politicians.

You asked: "Still awaiting an answer to my question. seems to been ignored by the RTP supporters. If this was a family member. Would you be happy with this investigation?"

I answered you -- you asked if (speculating) I would be :happy" about the police investigation if (speculating) it was my family. As I clearly stated, I would not be "happy" about anything to do with these events but I would be satisfied, as the actual families are, that the right people are on trial and would have faith justice will be carried out in court. Lots of game playing with speculation when there really is no reason to ask such imaginative questions when the families have releases statements and they are more in the know that any of us and they actually did lose their family members.

It's certainly heartwarming to see a man so full of faith in the judicial system here, which has been slammed in yearly human rights watch reports as being heavily vulnerable to corruption by the Police and Thai mafia and generally described as weak at best.

[JohnThailandJohn]

According to the translator, Maung said he was not present when the murders took place
took place. He had left his friends at 1am to meet his girlfriend so he did not know about anything that took place afterwards.

He said Zaw Rin and Win admitted that they had indeed committed the murders and that they confirmed that Maung had left earlier. They said they were drunk and that they bludgeoned the heads of the tourists. The first weapon was a large bottle of wine which was used by Win on David Miller. Then Win used a hoe was used to finish the job.

Meanwhile, Zaw Rin had taken Hannah some distance away. She resisted and screamed, so he hit her with the same hoe. Win was the first to rape her, the translator said. He said the two did not leave the island immediately because it was difficult to do so with the police keeping a close watch.

Police yesterday confirmed the mobile phone of Koh Tao murder victim, David Miller, had been retrieved from the accommodation of one of the two Myanmar suspects.

National police chief Somyot Pumpanmuang said suspect Saw Rim, 21, had intended to take the victim’s mobile phone for his own use, but he later found the device cannot be used in Thailand, so he smashed and discarded it in his living quarters.

Pol Col Prachum Ruangthong, superintendent of the Koh Phangan police station, said the device is a black iPhone 4, taken from the shorts pocket of Miller, 24, who was found dead on a Koh Tao beach alongside Hannah Witheridge, 23, on Sept 15.

The confirmation came as doubts spread on social media as to whether the phone was really taken from the suspects. Some pictures circulated online show a friend of Witheridge brought a mobile phone to Pol Col Prachum during the inquest.
The men underwent medical checks before and after the inquiry to prove they were not tortured into admitting a crime.

“They seemed in good health, except for pain in their chests [allegedly from their interrogation],” added Aung Myo Thant.

"Two Myanmar suspects have confessed to killing the pair," national police chief Somyot Pumpunmuang told the AFP news service even before the press conference. "DNA test results confirmed that the same DNA was found in the body of the (female)victim."

With her partner incapacitated, both men then set upon Witheridge, taking turns as raping her while alternately smoking a cigarette. When they were through, Wynsmashed her head

Lawyer Aung Myo Thant said the pair, Zaw Lin and Win Zaw Htun, both 21, from the Arakanese town of Kyaukphyu, told a Burmese embassy legal team they had murdered English tourists Hannah Witheridge and David Miller by bludgeoning them to death with a hoe on 15 September.

A second witness, Dr. Chasit Yoohad, gave testimony about his examination of the victims' bodies. He said he also performed a medical checkup of the two accused, and found them in good health. He said he asked through a translator if they had committed the crime, and they replied that they had.

BANGKOK: -- A human rights commissioner said Tuesday the two Myanmar migrant workers arrested on charges of murdering the two British backpackers on Koh Tao admitted to him that they committed the crime as charged.

The commissioner, Mr Prinya Sirisarakan, and his staff visited the two suspects at a prison on Koh Samui where they are being detained pending prosecution.

Commenting on the suspicion by netizens in the social media that the two suspects might be just scapegoats, Mr Prinya suggested that the police should disclose more details about the case to clear up the air.

He said the two told him that they drank both beer and wine before they attacked the two British tourists and he suspected that they might be drunk at the time they committed the crime.

[JohnThailandJohn]

I'd be grateful the defendants are standing trial and grateful that the police got them. I would not be "happy" about anything to do with this event or anything related to it. They only thing that would make me more upset is if the people responsible for the crime walked and like the family, I believe the right people are standing trial. However, like the parents, I have confidence the judges in this case will come to the correct decision but I still anticipate they will plead guilty before a verdict is reached

Not what i asked! I wont bother conversing with you or debating as you cant answer a straight question. More stepovers than Ronaldo and better at dodging questions than most politicians.

You asked: "Still awaiting an answer to my question. seems to been ignored by the RTP supporters. If this was a family member. Would you be happy with this investigation?"

I answered you -- you asked if (speculating) I would be :happy" about the police investigation if (speculating) it was my family. As I clearly stated, I would not be "happy" about anything to do with these events but I would be satisfied, as the actual families are, that the right people are on trial and would have faith justice will be carried out in court. Lots of game playing with speculation when there really is no reason to ask such imaginative questions when the families have releases statements and they are more in the know that any of us and they actually did lose their family members.

It's certainly heartwarming to see a man so full of faith in the judicial system here, which has been slammed in yearly human rights watch reports as being heavily vulnerable to corruption by the Police and Thai mafia and generally described as weak at best.

Certainly heartwarming to see the continuation of one thing said to pretend something else was said in an effort to keep up the comical conspiracy theories.

[Rykbanlor]

According to the translator, Maung said he was not present when the murders took place

took place. He had left his friends at 1am to meet his girlfriend so he did not know about anything that took place afterwards.

He said Zaw Rin and Win admitted that they had indeed committed the murders and that they confirmed that Maung had left earlier. They said they were drunk and that they bludgeoned the heads of the tourists. The first weapon was a large bottle of wine which was used by Win on David Miller. Then Win used a hoe was used to finish the job.

Meanwhile, Zaw Rin had taken Hannah some distance away. She resisted and screamed, so he hit her with the same hoe. Win was the first to rape her, the translator said. He said the two did not leave the island immediately because it was difficult to do so with the police keeping a close watch.

Police yesterday confirmed the mobile phone of Koh Tao murder victim, David Miller, had been retrieved from the accommodation of one of the two Myanmar suspects.

National police chief Somyot Pumpanmuang said suspect Saw Rim, 21, had intended to take the victim’s mobile phone for his own use, but he later found the device cannot be used in Thailand, so he smashed and discarded it in his living quarters.

Pol Col Prachum Ruangthong, superintendent of the Koh Phangan police station, said the device is a black iPhone 4, taken from the shorts pocket of Miller, 24, who was found dead on a Koh Tao beach alongside Hannah Witheridge, 23, on Sept 15.

The confirmation came as doubts spread on social media as to whether the phone was really taken from the suspects. Some pictures circulated online show a friend of Witheridge brought a mobile phone to Pol Col Prachum during the inquest.

The men underwent medical checks before and after the inquiry to prove they were not tortured into admitting a crime.

“They seemed in good health, except for pain in their chests [allegedly from their interrogation],” added Aung Myo Thant.

"Two Myanmar suspects have confessed to killing the pair," national police chief Somyot Pumpunmuang told the AFP news service even before the press conference. "DNA test results confirmed that the same DNA was found in the body of the (female)victim."

With her partner incapacitated, both men then set upon Witheridge, taking turns as raping her while alternately smoking a cigarette. When they were through, Wynsmashed her head

Lawyer Aung Myo Thant said the pair, Zaw Lin and Win Zaw Htun, both 21, from the Arakanese town of Kyaukphyu, told a Burmese embassy legal team they had murdered English tourists Hannah Witheridge and David Miller by bludgeoning them to death with a hoe on 15 September.

A second witness, Dr. Chasit Yoohad, gave testimony about his examination of the victims' bodies. He said he also performed a medical checkup of the two accused, and found them in good health. He said he asked through a translator if they had committed the crime, and they replied that they had.

BANGKOK: -- A human rights commissioner said Tuesday the two Myanmar migrant workers arrested on charges of murdering the two British backpackers on Koh Tao admitted to him that they committed the crime as charged.

The commissioner, Mr Prinya Sirisarakan, and his staff visited the two suspects at a prison on Koh Samui where they are being detained pending prosecution.

Commenting on the suspicion by netizens in the social media that the two suspects might be just scapegoats, Mr Prinya suggested that the police should disclose more details about the case to clear up the air.

He said the two told him that they drank both beer and wine before they attacked the two British tourists and he suspected that they might be drunk at the time they committed the crime.

Now a glass bottle? And you know they have retracted their statements right?