Decisions made for returning to the USA

[metisdead]

Off-topic posts and replies removed.

Please stay on the topic of the thread. That means addressing the issues presented in the post, not in making comments to or about other posters. Doing so is off-topic and your post will be removed and you could face a suspension. Digging through other member's posts and bringing them up on the forum can be considered stalking and it is against the forum rules.

[Gumballl]

I think a lot of people who commented on this thread in a less than laudatory fashion were legitimately put off by some of the comments the OP made in the process of sharing his story about his transition back to America. Because many people, some of whom I have a degree of respect for, seem to not understand why some reacted this way, I would like to say a few words in defense of “the vulture club,” even though I do not consider myself a card-carrying member of said club.

Tim Robbins in the house?

The OP makes several comments which suggested he saw his post as a sort of motivational pep talk for other expats who may have lost sight of or perhaps forgotten all that America has to offer. For example, he starts out by saying, ‘The decision to return to the USA after 10+ years living in Thailand was not as hard as what I imagined,’ and concludes by remarking, ‘For those contemplating moving back or starting over, it is not impossible.’

So far, so good. At first blush, this all sounds encouraging enough. But once the gist of the OP’s story is fully digested, the reader quickly realizes that in order to do what the OP has recounted, a person would more than likely need to be relatively young (in order to restart his career, pay off the mortgage, earn money to support his family in a suburban lifestyle, etc.), as well as have highly marketable job skills (mostly gained through higher education), and have had a way to have maintained these skills while on a 10+ year sabbatical in Thailand. The number of expats who enjoy all of these life circumstances is fairly limited, and for those who are fortunate enough in this regard, I seriously question whether they need the OP’s guidance as their self-appointed life coach in deciding whether returning to their home country is the best course of action. For those who don’t fall into this niche, they cannot easily emulate what the OP recounted. A person obviously can’t turn back the hands of time or acquire advanced degrees or in-demand job skills over night. I think that this is why some readers perceived the OP as doing something other than giving us a collective pep-talk.

Does somebody need an ego-boost?

When you set aside the OP’s claim that he was just innocently sharing his story in the hopes that it might inspire others to consider following his example, the tone of the post did strike my ear as, if not outright bragging, certainly a little too self-congratulatory, at least to my ear:

“….my own business doing quite well… huge SUV…

I have an advanced education in engineering …easy to find a very high paying job in the USA…. bought my wife a brand new car… live in Florida about 1600 feet from the beach… my mother, who is a retired doctor.”

The OP also posted a picture of a youthful, attractive Thai woman who was impeccably made up (hair highlights, meticulously plucked brow line, sophisticated mascara and lipstick, perfect teeth, maybe even wearing colored contact lenses? It’s hard to believe that that picture wasn’t calculated to instill envy in viewers. I also asked myself If everyone’s so blissfully happy and adjusting so well, why no pictures of the family together? Why just the wife?

America good; Thailand bad. Americans good; Thais bad. (yawn)

The OP doesn’t have much of anything positive to say about Thais and Thailand and glorifies America and Americans in an unbalanced biased manner.

Thailand is the land of insufferable heat, floods, water shortages, power outages, grinding poverty, and low educational standards. America is just the opposite: no extreme weather, crime free, a social paradise where anyone can grow up to be President. The land of “no hardships.”

Thais are scam artists, corrupt, poorly educated, dishonest, and criminally inclined. Americans are warm, friendly, welcoming, non-judgmental, better educated, just plain smarter, hard-working, and well bred.

The OP may be fortunate enough to be able to largely insulate himself and his family from the realities of what day to day life is like for many Americans, but as we all know there’s two sides to every story, and the OP does seem to be in need of being reminded of this.

Should I head to Mukdahan to look for my next wife or not???

The OP at first describes Isaan as a mecca which anyone hoping to find a wife in Thailand should make a beeline to. But then the OP says stuff like: “Many of the people working or even owning the restaurants appear to me to be the same types as you would run into in Isaan with the same behaviors.” or “ poverty and lack of education in Isaan.” The OP also opined that: “Honesty is not a common trait in Thailand.” Isn’t Isaan part of Thailand? I don’t understand why the OP is recommending Isaan as a good place to look for a wife, when he appears to hold everyone else in Isaan aside from his wife in quite low regard. I mean, why would I look for a wife in a place where everyone behaves badly, is poorly educated and dishonesty is part of their genome???

Newsflash, OP, we’re not all emotional retards in need of marriage counseling from you.

If there’s one thing in the OP’s post which really had me gagging it was the insufferably self-congratulatory rhetoric about how the OP had “grown up” and “unlike some men saw his wife as his equal” and how it takes a “special kind of person to put his family first.”

Just, FYI, OP, what you describe here is the norm, and nothing special at all. I don’t know any family men who don’t put their family first. As far as treating your wife as your equal, I am curious to know ---beyond buying her a car and setting her up with ATM and credit cards--- the extent to which you encourage her (1) to embrace her Thai culture (music, religion, art, customs, heritage, decorating the house, etc.), (2) to develop a social life independent of you (perhaps with other Thais), (3) to improve her English skills, (4) continue her education, and (5) seek employment? That would be the real test of your true commitment to helping her fulfill her full potential, not just providing things such as a car and ATM cards to facilitate her role as a housewife. Frankly, some of the comments you made about your wife being Americanized (de-Thai-ed, if you will) and the negativity you have expressed about Thailand and Thais (which is after all your wife’s homeland) disturbed me, and I hope that you will give this a great considerable thought, for the sake of your wife and future domestic happiness.

But, again, I genuinely wish the OP and his family happiness ever after, and it was informative to read his story.

I agree with most of your post and it is clearly written and well stated. I would like to add a few things.

The funniest thing to me is that the OP talks about how he rebuilt a jeep and mustang, and bought his wife a car. Fast forward to the picture of his garage / driveway. Certainly nothing picture worthy or impressive there.

The other thing that the OP kept mentioning was how his wife has integrated into society and is not judged. I find that very hard to believe in Florida. If he had said that she found a group of thai women to socialize with ok, but I highly doubt she is accepted at the country club.

I'm not the OP, and nor do I have a driveway chock full of vehicles. But I do have a Thai wife that has found her place in the US. She has job that she greatly adores (she's a florist), and as for myself, I have done the best to provide for my wife and my two children.

We (that would mean my wife and I) could NEVER have achieved such success in Thailand or any other country.

Btw, my wife does have Thai friends... of the caliber that you would never know.

"Cheerio"... or whatever they say in your circles.

[VIPinthailand]

USA, very nice place!

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-100days100nights-gang-threats-of-violence-on-social-media-draw-fear-20150727-story.html

[RedQualia]

Don't forget to account for US property taxes, which would be quite substantial on a property valued at $800k. Maybe $15k/year?

Just checking in after a few days. Mostly, I think a pretty good thread. I'm happy to see that it's been allowed to continue, in spite of a few occasionally contestorial postings.

A couple of additional semi-random thoughts. Seann mentions property taxes. They'll vary by state and area in the US, and range from enough to choke on to "DIE! DIE! DIE!" My property taxes in LOS are quite negligible.

Something Seann did not mention, however, is health care costs. Inpatient-only health insurance for my wife and I in LOS is running about 55,000-60,000 Baht per year. For the sake of argument, let's say $2,000US. Adequate health insurance in the US would run more than $12,000US. I don't know how much more, but depending on area, perhaps a lot more (I'm thinking specifically about California). Outpatient costs? Daily visits to the emergency room at the local hospital to have the wound on my foot cleaned and dressed over the past month were 70 Baht each. Cheapest emergency room visit in the states would likely be what? $150? Unless they actually had to DO something, of course. Antibiotics at a Thai pharmacy will run maybe 100-150 Baht for a six day course. Last time I was in the states, a six day course of amoxicillin cost $50US, because hey -- I had to find a doctor somewhere who was accepting new patients, and pay more than twice as much for the generic pills.

Generally, the cost of "x" in the states will be more. That is, generally, all costs appear to be constructed around the prevailing wages of whatever region is in question. And so a house in say, the middle of Iowa will cost an amount appropriate to the wages of the middle of Iowa, while a house in San Francisco will cost an amount appropriate to whatever Google and Apple are paying their better people. Unaffordable to most? Scads of people commute to San Francisco from 60-100 miles away, every day, since houses in Stockton, Modesto and Ceres cost far less.

A similar thing might be said about Thailand: the cost of "x" in LOS will be lower, since costs are again constructed around the prevailing local wages. Many of the people (not all) spending US dollars or European Euros, etc., in LOS are quite fortunate. Bordering on filthy rich. A good many Thais will never be debating the cost of beachfront property.

These things said, it is generally possible to live on a lower income in Thailand than it is in the states. Rephrased, it can be quite difficult to live in the states, or England, without a substantially higher income, which may be unavailable, and at the very least will likely involve being employed by someone or some corporation. "Hustle, hustle, hustle. Don't stop. You're not dancing as fast as you can." And of course, the same can be said of Thais working in Bangkok. There are reasons why they're eating dinner on the sidewalks at 10PM.

Personally, I am not interested in beachfront property, nor likely would most be considering such. The houses I have are all fairly modest, running 100-120 sq. meters. Single story, three bedroom, two bath kinds of things. Quite comfortable and attractive, but in no way overdone by western standards. Those who are interested in living in Bangkok would likely, of course, be looking at condos, about which I know next to nothing, other than that they have their own, separate pricing dynamics. Regardless, far from the beaches.

But there is one other thing that makes comparing costs in the USA to costs in LOS a bit difficult: the exchange rate. The first house I built in LOS was at 42 Baht per US dollar (clearly, some years ago). I built none when the exchange rate was 30 Baht per dollar. My bank tells me that its rate today is 34.55 Baht per dollar, and the dollar is on the way up in value, it seems. And so a "six million Baht beachfront home" (as well as more modest homes, condos, etc.) is likely to cost fewer and fewer US dollars or Euros as the next several months go by, for those fortunate enough to have US dollars or Euros to spend in Thailand.

As I said... Just a few semi-random thoughts relating to the comparison of things in LOS to those in the states and elsewhere. None of which will make the USA or Thailand either better or worse for everyone here. But I think things worth considering.

[1BADDAT]

I agree with most of your post and it is clearly written and well stated. I would like to add a few things.

The funniest thing to me is that the OP talks about how he rebuilt a jeep and mustang, and bought his wife a car. Fast forward to the picture of his garage / driveway. Certainly nothing picture worthy or impressive there.

The other thing that the OP kept mentioning was how his wife has integrated into society and is not judged. I find that very hard to believe in Florida. If he had said that she found a group of thai women to socialize with ok, but I highly doubt she is accepted at the country club.

I'm not the OP, and nor do I have a driveway chock full of vehicles. But I do have a Thai wife that has found her place in the US. She has job that she greatly adores (she's a florist), and as for myself, I have done the best to provide for my wife and my two children.

We (that would mean my wife and I) could NEVER have achieved such success in Thailand or any other country.

Btw, my wife does have Thai friends... of the caliber that you would never know.

"Cheerio"... or whatever they say in your circles.

It seems you have misunderstood my post. I don't care about the country club lifestyle or being within certain circles. And I don't know where your "Cheerio" came from, but I am American. I am happy for you and your wife and family and it sounds like you all are getting along well. The fact that your wife has found a rewarding job and Thai friends certainly helps a lot.

My point is that his claims of "even a wife from Isaan can be well respected in the highest societies of your own country." is not realistic. He seems to brag that he has taken a country girl and turned here into a country club girl. No where does he point out how she feels about the situation, he just boasts about he has showed her how to dress and act.

[Shadychris]

A big consideration is that OP has a child. While you might prefer an Isaan shack, I doubt it is in a child's best interest.

That would depend on how you define 'the child's best interests'...

If you believe being bought up in a purple palace, in a super materialistic American society where being loud, fat and rich is something to aspire to is a good thing, then yes I guess Florida is in the child's best interest.

On the other hand if you consider material things to be of less importance than your child living a peaceful, loved, contented and fulfilled life away from the rat race, then a shack in Isaan is by far the better place to be.

.

What rubbish...why can't it be in a good neighbourhood going to a good school in the west..the education system here is terrible..if you have a chance to educate your child better then you should take it..not come up with some materialistic moral clap trap...

A contented and fulfilled life in a shack...really..

Well yes I wouldn't disagree that IF you believe having a first class education, and glittering academic success is the most important thing in life, then the West is more likely to provide an opportunity for that.

Although judging by the poor literacy displayed by a lot of 'western' posters on this forum, it would seem that even the education system in the West is not without it's own failings!

There are many though that do not believe academic achievements are the 'be all and end all' of a person's development. Whilst I now have several qualifications, I left school with just a few 'O' level awards - my academic achievements were gained as an outcome of employment - not vice versa. Good communication skills, literacy, numeracy and a good practical aptitude and attitude will help you achieve a lot in life. Whereas say, an in depth knowledge of quantum physics will help you be a physicist, but be of little use to much else in your life.

However talk of education opportunities is maybe off topic as the OP actually says little to nothing about his childs education or future. He seems more focussed on his lack of hardship in the USA, and all the material things he has provided for his wife.

I have to wonder what hardship he faced in Thailand? Why was he unable to provide the car, nice house and the golf lessons for his wife, or even pay for his child to get a good education? Well the answer would seem to me to lie in his business being wiped out by flood. It appears that the main reason to move back to the USA was actually for economic reasons of not being able to support his family here in Thailand, no matter how much he tries to justify it by reasons of a 'better quality of life in the USA'. His post seems to me to be much more about his current 'standard of living' and zero to do with quality of life.

Here's another take on the story.

30'ish man gets bored.

Has a nice little stash of cash and a rich supportive mummy to fall back on.

Decides to jack it in and go see the world.

Meets Thai girl, falls in love and marries

Decides to settle in Thailand

Business fails, money begins to run out.

Wife unhappy rich husband not rich any more - 'my friend foreigner husband buy her car, why you cannot?'

Warning signs of wifey about to depart.

Promise her a great life in the USA - wifey happy again

Go back to USA, maybe get Mummy to bail him out until he can get a job and a mortgage again.

Bring wife and kid to US and give her a car and a credit card so she can pay at restaurants with his money.

Problem sorted.

Or maybe that's too cynical.....

Edited July 28, 2015 by Shadychris

[KuhnPaen]

I accidentally hit the "follow post" button and now my email is getting spammed with replies to this post. How can I un-follow this thread from an iPhone?

[Shadychris]

I accidentally hit the "follow post" button and now my email is getting spammed with replies to this post. How can I un-follow this thread from an iPhone?

If you are using the Thai Visa app then likely you will see a yellow star at the top of the screen - click that star to make it just plain and it will un-subscribe you - that's how it works on Android anyway.

[VIPinthailand]

"even a wife from Isaan can be well respected ..."

excuse meeeeee! what does it mean? do you mean that Thai people don't have to be respected?

[bkkgooner]

Was it just me or did everyone cringe at the OP's almost Pretty Woman style description of turning his poor lowly "Thai wife" into a high class American lady who fits in down at the country club?

Best of luck to you OP but hate to rain on your parade, some of us who live here are genuinely happy!

[huawei]

A big consideration is that OP has a child. While you might prefer an Isaan shack, I doubt it is in a child's best interest.

That would depend on how you define 'the child's best interests'...

If you believe being bought up in a purple palace, in a super materialistic American society where being loud, fat and rich is something to aspire to is a good thing, then yes I guess Florida is in the child's best interest.

On the other hand if you consider material things to be of less importance than your child living a peaceful, loved, contented and fulfilled life away from the rat race, then a shack in Isaan is by far the better place to be.

.

What rubbish...why can't it be in a good neighbourhood going to a good school in the west..the education system here is terrible..if you have a chance to educate your child better then you should take it..not come up with some materialistic moral clap trap...

A contented and fulfilled life in a shack...really..

Well yes I wouldn't disagree that IF you believe having a first class education, and glittering academic success is the most important thing in life, then the West is more likely to provide an opportunity for that.

Although judging by the poor literacy displayed by a lot of 'western' posters on this forum, it would seem that even the education system in the West is not without it's own failings!

There are many though that do not believe academic achievements are the 'be all and end all' of a person's development. Whilst I now have several qualifications, I left school with just a few 'O' level awards - my academic achievements were gained as an outcome of employment - not vice versa. Good communication skills, literacy, numeracy and a good practical aptitude and attitude will help you achieve a lot in life. Whereas say, an in depth knowledge of quantum physics will help you be a physicist, but be of little use to much else in your life.

However talk of education opportunities is maybe off topic as the OP actually says little to nothing about his childs education or future. He seems more focussed on his lack of hardship in the USA, and all the material things he has provided for his wife.

I have to wonder what hardship he faced in Thailand? Why was he unable to provide the car, nice house and the golf lessons for his wife, or even pay for his child to get a good education? Well the answer would seem to me to lie in his business being wiped out by flood. It appears that the main reason to move back to the USA was actually for economic reasons of not being able to support his family here in Thailand, no matter how much he tries to justify it by reasons of a 'better quality of life in the USA'. His post seems to me to be much more about his current 'standard of living' and zero to do with quality of life.

Here's another take on the story.

30'ish man gets bored.

Has a nice little stash of cash and a rich supportive mummy to fall back on.

Decides to jack it in and go see the world.

Meets Thai girl, falls in love and marries

Decides to settle in Thailand

Business fails, money begins to run out.

Wife unhappy rich husband not rich any more - 'my friend foreigner husband buy her car, why you cannot?'

Warning signs of wifey about to depart.

Promise her a great life in the USA - wifey happy again

Go back to USA, maybe get Mummy to bail him out until he can get a job and a mortgage again.

Bring wife and kid to US and give her a car and a credit card so she can pay at restaurants with his money.

Problem sorted.

Or maybe that's too cynical.....

eloquent post. Education isn't the "be all and end all" but please do not think that someone who lives in a shack cannot be as aspirational as anyone else, just like the Thai kid who lives in the moo baan..

Btw, I have an American neighbour he is neither fat or loud , very nice guy.

[Berkshire]

A big consideration is that OP has a child. While you might prefer an Isaan shack, I doubt it is in a child's best interest.

That would depend on how you define 'the child's best interests'...

If you believe being bought up in a purple palace, in a super materialistic American society where being loud, fat and rich is something to aspire to is a good thing, then yes I guess Florida is in the child's best interest.

On the other hand if you consider material things to be of less importance than your child living a peaceful, loved, contented and fulfilled life away from the rat race, then a shack in Isaan is by far the better place to be.

.

What rubbish...why can't it be in a good neighbourhood going to a good school in the west..the education system here is terrible..if you have a chance to educate your child better then you should take it..not come up with some materialistic moral clap trap...

A contented and fulfilled life in a shack...really..

Well yes I wouldn't disagree that IF you believe having a first class education, and glittering academic success is the most important thing in life, then the West is more likely to provide an opportunity for that.

Although judging by the poor literacy displayed by a lot of 'western' posters on this forum, it would seem that even the education system in the West is not without it's own failings!

There are many though that do not believe academic achievements are the 'be all and end all' of a person's development. Whilst I now have several qualifications, I left school with just a few 'O' level awards - my academic achievements were gained as an outcome of employment - not vice versa. Good communication skills, literacy, numeracy and a good practical aptitude and attitude will help you achieve a lot in life. Whereas say, an in depth knowledge of quantum physics will help you be a physicist, but be of little use to much else in your life.

However talk of education opportunities is maybe off topic as the OP actually says little to nothing about his childs education or future. He seems more focussed on his lack of hardship in the USA, and all the material things he has provided for his wife.

I have to wonder what hardship he faced in Thailand? Why was he unable to provide the car, nice house and the golf lessons for his wife, or even pay for his child to get a good education? Well the answer would seem to me to lie in his business being wiped out by flood. It appears that the main reason to move back to the USA was actually for economic reasons of not being able to support his family here in Thailand, no matter how much he tries to justify it by reasons of a 'better quality of life in the USA'. His post seems to me to be much more about his current 'standard of living' and zero to do with quality of life.

Here's another take on the story.

30'ish man gets bored.

Has a nice little stash of cash and a rich supportive mummy to fall back on.

Decides to jack it in and go see the world.

Meets Thai girl, falls in love and marries

Decides to settle in Thailand

Business fails, money begins to run out.

Wife unhappy rich husband not rich any more - 'my friend foreigner husband buy her car, why you cannot?'

Warning signs of wifey about to depart.

Promise her a great life in the USA - wifey happy again

Go back to USA, maybe get Mummy to bail him out until he can get a job and a mortgage again.

Bring wife and kid to US and give her a car and a credit card so she can pay at restaurants with his money.

Problem sorted.

Or maybe that's too cynical.....

Well explained, Chris. This actually makes a lot more sense than the OPs version of events.

[55Jay]

USA, very nice place!

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-100days100nights-gang-threats-of-violence-on-social-media-draw-fear-20150727-story.html

Another foolish, delusional post.

Your life isn't worth very much in Thailand either. You could be sat there at the local market, eating your 30 Baht bag of rice and monkey balls, and be struck down any number of ways, including waring gangs or a love triangle gone wrong. Wrong place, wrong time.

The bumbling boys in brown will ride up on their personal motorbikes, perhaps slightly drunk depending on the hour, and crowd around your body, pointing, for the compulsory, morbid selfie.

Investigation done and dusted, your bloody corpse will be fought over by stethoscope wielding morons in white coats posing as medical/rescue technicians; the winner having the rights to pick you clean of cash (if any) and jewelry (if any) on the way to the morgue.

If you make the news, the Thai Visa RIP Brigade will eulogize you, whilst others speculate on how much money you had and which female (or lady boy) in your life arranged for the hit. Just another forgotten, delusional old fool in Thailand....... which is also a Very Nice Place.

http://asiancorrespondent.com/134144/gang-wars-tackling-thailands-vocational-college-violence/

Edited July 28, 2015 by 55Jay

[VIPinthailand]

if you miss America, watch this... you will feel better.

Edited July 28, 2015 by VIPinthailand

[bwpage3]

USA, very nice place!

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-100days100nights-gang-threats-of-violence-on-social-media-draw-fear-20150727-story.html

Another foolish, delusional post.

Your life isn't worth very much in Thailand either. You could be sat there at the local market, eating your 30 Baht bag of rice and monkey balls, and be struck down any number of ways, including waring gangs or a love triangle gone wrong. Wrong place, wrong time.

The bumbling boys in brown will ride up on their personal motorbikes, perhaps slightly drunk depending on the hour, and crowd around your body, pointing, for the compulsory, morbid selfie.

Investigation done and dusted, your bloody corpse will be fought over by stethoscope wielding morons in white coats posing as medical/rescue technicians; the winner having the rights to pick you clean of cash (if any) and jewelry (if any) on the way to the morgue.

If you make the news, the Thai Visa RIP Brigade will eulogize you, whilst others speculate on how much money you had and which female (or lady boy) in your life arranged for the hit. Just another forgotten, delusional old fool in Thailand....... which is also a Very Nice Place.

http://asiancorrespondent.com/134144/gang-wars-tackling-thailands-vocational-college-violence/

Here is one for you:

[fey]

Success stories like this are hard to find. Why were you in Thailand to begin with? Nice temples?

If it was then I will give your scene a great chance at success. Typically these situations don't last because men taking wives from Thailand have certain character flaws which creep up every now and again on both sides making "normal" lives and relationships, which you seem to be alluding to, untenable.

Why do you have to imply that all men coming to Thailand are doing it for the women, or that they are men who can't get a hot woman in their own country?

Some of us came here for real work, in my case I was head hunted and offered an amazing package to come here from Hong Kong.

Not all of us find Asian girls hotter than Western girls, I grew up in Asia so to me Asian girls are nothing special, plus the Western women I was surrounded by in HK make the average Thai look decidedly average. Plus with a Western girl you share language, culture and usually a similar level of education.

To the OP, great hearing you are happy and congrats on a nice house and lifestyle. Your wife looks and sounds nice too.

Personally I plan to stay in Thailand although I am also looking longer term at the possibility of moving to Myanmar and building an eco resort on one of the many islands they have.

Men come to Thailand for 3 main reasons

1. Cheaper cost of living

2. Women

3. Both 1 & 2

Carreer building is not normally on theat list. I too came here for real work, but then again I requested to come here. Your situation is quite rare amongst men moving to Thailand. Not everyone can't get women in their own country, but its certainly easier to find much more attractive or younger woman here.

not really, it's just prostitutes. traditional thai women are very conservative.

[Shadychris]

USA, very nice place!

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-100days100nights-gang-threats-of-violence-on-social-media-draw-fear-20150727-story.html

Another foolish, delusional post.

Your life isn't worth very much in Thailand either. You could be sat there at the local market, eating your 30 Baht bag of rice and monkey balls, and be struck down any number of ways, including waring gangs or a love triangle gone wrong. Wrong place, wrong time.

The bumbling boys in brown will ride up on their personal motorbikes, perhaps slightly drunk depending on the hour, and crowd around your body, pointing, for the compulsory, morbid selfie.

Investigation done and dusted, your bloody corpse will be fought over by stethoscope wielding morons in white coats posing as medical/rescue technicians; the winner having the rights to pick you clean of cash (if any) and jewelry (if any) on the way to the morgue.

If you make the news, the Thai Visa RIP Brigade will eulogize you, whilst others speculate on how much money you had and which female (or lady boy) in your life arranged for the hit. Just another forgotten, delusional old fool in Thailand....... which is also a Very Nice Place.

Yup I'll agree with you on that point. If you research murder rates per capita you will find that Thailand and the USA are actually quite similar figures. UK is considerably less with South American and African countries by far the worst for obvious reasons. Interestingly Greenland also has a very high figure...

However just looking at those figures alone is a bit subjective and I think other factors such as either rural or city locations, motive, type of murder ie gang war, crime of passion etc really need to be taken into account - especially when comparing countries of vastly different populus and geographic areas.

With the exception of the really notorious locations and the really safe ones I'm not so sure it is so simple to say that any one place is safer than another.

I do know however that I tend to feel much safer walking around late at night in Thailand than I do in many other supposedly safer places in Europe, and as far as the USA goes, well at least I dont have to worry about being shot by a cop for no reason other than he doesn't like the colour of my skin..

[kungpao]

I've only been to Thailand 3 times - for two week stints over the last 3 1/2 years. Met my Thai wife, she came to US last year. We talk about moving to Thailand, but gee whiz: there's an awful lot I like about USA and Pacific Northwest. I like Thailand. We don't know where we will end up. Tomorrow will never come. We are here for today. We live frugal and I could live as cheap here, nearly, as there. She makes okay money and I'm doing okay at work. We are going back to Thailand in 2 weeks for 2 weeks.

First time I went to Thailand I did not want to leave. The second time I was ready to go home after 2 weeks. The 3rd time - I wanted to stay there with my to-be wife. She worked for government and had a steady good paying job. In my gut, I knew I had to come back and she had to come with me and we had to save a little and she needed citizenship and qualify for Social Security. And experience the USA. She gave up her job and came here making far more money then over there 3x times as much per month.

And her daughter and her are learning English fast. Her more than daughter.

Anyway, the future? Not sure. Live in Khon Kaen? Maybe. Our base for traveling Europe and the rest of the world? Maybe.

Both places have their advantages.

[RedQualia]

I've only been to Thailand 3 times - for two week stints over the last 3 1/2 years. Met my Thai wife, she came to US last year. We talk about moving to Thailand, but gee whiz: there's an awful lot I like about USA and Pacific Northwest. I like Thailand. We don't know where we will end up. Tomorrow will never come. We are here for today. We live frugal and I could live as cheap here, nearly, as there. She makes okay money and I'm doing okay at work. We are going back to Thailand in 2 weeks for 2 weeks.

First time I went to Thailand I did not want to leave. The second time I was ready to go home after 2 weeks. The 3rd time - I wanted to stay there with my to-be wife. She worked for government and had a steady good paying job. In my gut, I knew I had to come back and she had to come with me and we had to save a little and she needed citizenship and qualify for Social Security. And experience the USA. She gave up her job and came here making far more money then over there 3x times as much per month.

And her daughter and her are learning English fast. Her more than daughter.

Anyway, the future? Not sure. Live in Khon Kaen? Maybe. Our base for traveling Europe and the rest of the world? Maybe.

Both places have their advantages.

Pressed for time, so if this seems scattered, apologies!

Have never been fond of Khon Kaen. If you haven't seen the rest of Thailand, might be good to go have a looksee. Loei and Udon are both near Khon Kaen, along with Phetchabun and Khao Koh. Not saying you'd want to live in any such places, only that they're near KK and easy enough to visit from there.

Dunno your age, but that's something to consider when thinking about living here or there. It would be good to bring the equivalent of a few to several million Baht with you, should you ever decide to relocate to here.

More tongue-in-cheek than anything else, with regard to the Pacific Northwest, there's this:

http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2015/07/20/the-really-big-one

Have fun!

[beachproperty]

I've only been to Thailand 3 times - for two week stints over the last 3 1/2 years. Met my Thai wife, she came to US last year. We talk about moving to Thailand, but gee whiz: there's an awful lot I like about USA and Pacific Northwest. I like Thailand. We don't know where we will end up. Tomorrow will never come. We are here for today. We live frugal and I could live as cheap here, nearly, as there. She makes okay money and I'm doing okay at work. We are going back to Thailand in 2 weeks for 2 weeks.

First time I went to Thailand I did not want to leave. The second time I was ready to go home after 2 weeks. The 3rd time - I wanted to stay there with my to-be wife. She worked for government and had a steady good paying job. In my gut, I knew I had to come back and she had to come with me and we had to save a little and she needed citizenship and qualify for Social Security. And experience the USA. She gave up her job and came here making far more money then over there 3x times as much per month.

And her daughter and her are learning English fast. Her more than daughter.

Anyway, the future? Not sure. Live in Khon Kaen? Maybe. Our base for traveling Europe and the rest of the world? Maybe.

Both places have their advantages.

Sounds like you have a plan....the reality of happiness is NOT where you live but who you live with. You sound young (have a job and family) so only you can decide what's best for your family and future. Where ever life may take you...

Good luck

[kungpao]

I've only been to Thailand 3 times - for two week stints over the last 3 1/2 years. Met my Thai wife, she came to US last year. We talk about moving to Thailand, but gee whiz: there's an awful lot I like about USA and Pacific Northwest. I like Thailand. We don't know where we will end up. Tomorrow will never come. We are here for today. We live frugal and I could live as cheap here, nearly, as there. She makes okay money and I'm doing okay at work. We are going back to Thailand in 2 weeks for 2 weeks.

First time I went to Thailand I did not want to leave. The second time I was ready to go home after 2 weeks. The 3rd time - I wanted to stay there with my to-be wife. She worked for government and had a steady good paying job. In my gut, I knew I had to come back and she had to come with me and we had to save a little and she needed citizenship and qualify for Social Security. And experience the USA. She gave up her job and came here making far more money then over there 3x times as much per month.

And her daughter and her are learning English fast. Her more than daughter.

Anyway, the future? Not sure. Live in Khon Kaen? Maybe. Our base for traveling Europe and the rest of the world? Maybe.

Both places have their advantages.

Pressed for time, so if this seems scattered, apologies!

Have never been fond of Khon Kaen. If you haven't seen the rest of Thailand, might be good to go have a looksee. Loei and Udon are both near Khon Kaen, along with Phetchabun and Khao Koh. Not saying you'd want to live in any such places, only that they're near KK and easy enough to visit from there.

Dunno your age, but that's something to consider when thinking about living here or there. It would be good to bring the equivalent of a few to several million Baht with you, should you ever decide to relocate to here.

More tongue-in-cheek than anything else, with regard to the Pacific Northwest, there's this:

http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2015/07/20/the-really-big-one

Have fun!

Thank you for the post. Just accidentally deleted my long reply.

Wife has house in KK, a concrete jungle in a flat plain. I could live without it, except it has a lot of things of the big city. Her parents are nearby and we thought of live in city in her house and build a small place in the countryside on lake her dad is deeding to her.

My wife and I love the north. We are going to Chiang Khan next month on the Mekong up there. Something to consider, a house in the rolling hills up there and only a few hours from her parents...food for thought and something to talk to her about. It's very beautiful and I love looking at photos of that area. As long as you can get internet somehow, wherever you are, is a fine place for living.

As for the PNW, my house is not bolted to the foundation. It has survived a couple of earthquakes since 1962, but a big one...a big risk to have a house destroyed and still owe on the mortgage. And earthquake insurance is expensive and basically not worth it.

[kungpao]

I've only been to Thailand 3 times - for two week stints over the last 3 1/2 years. Met my Thai wife, she came to US last year. We talk about moving to Thailand, but gee whiz: there's an awful lot I like about USA and Pacific Northwest. I like Thailand. We don't know where we will end up. Tomorrow will never come. We are here for today. We live frugal and I could live as cheap here, nearly, as there. She makes okay money and I'm doing okay at work. We are going back to Thailand in 2 weeks for 2 weeks.

First time I went to Thailand I did not want to leave. The second time I was ready to go home after 2 weeks. The 3rd time - I wanted to stay there with my to-be wife. She worked for government and had a steady good paying job. In my gut, I knew I had to come back and she had to come with me and we had to save a little and she needed citizenship and qualify for Social Security. And experience the USA. She gave up her job and came here making far more money then over there 3x times as much per month.

And her daughter and her are learning English fast. Her more than daughter.

Anyway, the future? Not sure. Live in Khon Kaen? Maybe. Our base for traveling Europe and the rest of the world? Maybe.

Both places have their advantages.

Sounds like you have a plan....the reality of happiness is NOT where you live but who you live with. You sound young (have a job and family) so only you can decide what's best for your family and future. Where ever life may take you...

Good luck

Thank you, yes we have a plan, or many plans, as we like to joke about. "Young" at 51. Wife is 41. I've never been happy like I am now and it's all due to my wife. She's never been happier in her life. I never thought I was compatible with Thai culture, but it was the best thing for me. Yin/yang. She taught me not to get upset about things and to let them go (yes, she vents about work, ha, but she's not good with authority). We could live anywhere and be happy, just to be with her each day. Now we just let things roll off our backs and not get worked up. And she's into frugal and simple living, which is wonderful. She's "cheap" to maintain, LOL.

Job is going fine and saving and living simple/frugal.

[kungpao]

Having to wait 16 month apart before they could come to the USA seems crazy. Happy that it all worked out but people reading this shouldn't assume that will be the norm.

Actually, the norm is 18 months.

Fiance visas are much faster: a few months, at least over the last couple of years. Marriage visas take a couple of years.

[SpokaneAl]

I've only been to Thailand 3 times - for two week stints over the last 3 1/2 years. Met my Thai wife, she came to US last year. We talk about moving to Thailand, but gee whiz: there's an awful lot I like about USA and Pacific Northwest. I like Thailand. We don't know where we will end up. Tomorrow will never come. We are here for today. We live frugal and I could live as cheap here, nearly, as there. She makes okay money and I'm doing okay at work. We are going back to Thailand in 2 weeks for 2 weeks.

First time I went to Thailand I did not want to leave. The second time I was ready to go home after 2 weeks. The 3rd time - I wanted to stay there with my to-be wife. She worked for government and had a steady good paying job. In my gut, I knew I had to come back and she had to come with me and we had to save a little and she needed citizenship and qualify for Social Security. And experience the USA. She gave up her job and came here making far more money then over there 3x times as much per month.

And her daughter and her are learning English fast. Her more than daughter.

Anyway, the future? Not sure. Live in Khon Kaen? Maybe. Our base for traveling Europe and the rest of the world? Maybe.

Both places have their advantages.

Pressed for time, so if this seems scattered, apologies!

Have never been fond of Khon Kaen. If you haven't seen the rest of Thailand, might be good to go have a looksee. Loei and Udon are both near Khon Kaen, along with Phetchabun and Khao Koh. Not saying you'd want to live in any such places, only that they're near KK and easy enough to visit from there.

Dunno your age, but that's something to consider when thinking about living here or there. It would be good to bring the equivalent of a few to several million Baht with you, should you ever decide to relocate to here.

More tongue-in-cheek than anything else, with regard to the Pacific Northwest, there's this:

http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2015/07/20/the-really-big-one

Have fun!

Thank you for the post. Just accidentally deleted my long reply.

Wife has house in KK, a concrete jungle in a flat plain. I could live without it, except it has a lot of things of the big city. Her parents are nearby and we thought of live in city in her house and build a small place in the countryside on lake her dad is deeding to her.

My wife and I love the north. We are going to Chiang Khan next month on the Mekong up there. Something to consider, a house in the rolling hills up there and only a few hours from her parents...food for thought and something to talk to her about. It's very beautiful and I love looking at photos of that area. As long as you can get internet somehow, wherever you are, is a fine place for living.

As for the PNW, my house is not bolted to the foundation. It has survived a couple of earthquakes since 1962, but a big one...a big risk to have a house destroyed and still owe on the mortgage. And earthquake insurance is expensive and basically not worth it.

Earthquake insurance, much like flood insurance, is relatively expensive and seems to be a waste of money, until you experience an earthquake or a flood.

Of course the same could be said about any insurance - I tend to hope that I will not need to file a claim and it is all purely a waste of money for me.

[bwpage3]

the USA make me laugh, they always compare themselves to the worst countries in the world like some countries of South America , but never to the best countries( like Australia, Norway, Switzerland, Sweden, Monaco,and Thailand.).

and US farangs always say the USA are a better place , why they don't go home if it's so much better in America? at least they should have the honesty to say their country "abandoned" them.

in life you can not have all. USA and Europe are now too expensive for most of the people but they prefer to struggle with their shit life because they are blinded with their ridiculous patriotism . I moved to Thailand because my life style is more comfortable and I prefer Thai people.

Nice contradiction.

1. USA doesn't compare to (list countries in Europe) that are the best ones.

2. Europe and USA are too expensive and offer Sh@t life.

It is beyond me why anyone still lets you post on here.

Agree with 1BADDAT.

Anyone that thinks Thailand ranks up there with the best countries in the world like Switzerland and Monaco, is delusional at best.

[ableguy]

Nice post, lived with my gf for six years would not swap her period, , sadly too old to return home though I miss the states like you would not believe, however if I did go back many things I would miss from here, though I am quite wealthy compared to a lot of ex pats miss the street food, miss my home here and oddly miss the police not in your nose on every street corner even though I hate the average Thai driver, this is a dangerous country to live where bullets are cheaper than a lawyer and every Thai looks at you as if you are the golden goose, but all said.

I am looking after my gfs neice who is ten years old because I can afford to send her to a private school I do this because she is super smart and I love her as my daughter, one really good thing I can be proud of, I would hate not to complete my task of seeing her enter one of the top unis, I have two kids both grown who are both super successful ,enough said .

Wish you all the best hope all your dreams come true, did not intend to write my history .

[CharlieH]

A number of petty squabbling/off topic posts removed and replies to them.

Member here would also do well to observe this forum rule:

7) You will respect fellow members and post in a civil manner. No personal attacks, hateful or insulting towards other members, (flaming) Stalking of members on either the forum or via PM will not be allowed.

[Ace of Pop]

USA is not expensive compared to my Lifestyle here..it's only cheap here if you trade down.

[OKOK23]

Ok calm everybody lol

Don't need to be jealous at him or what he has . In long run, we are all die!
Is that so? Then maybe we should stop breathing right now lol.

I mean that we should value our time not other thing and enjoy your life.

So I congrats the op. I'm happy that you and your family happy and successful. And I hope it will stay like that.

Lol what we or me should do is focus on my life and find what really make me happy. What is the truly meaning of my life then go after it blah blah blah

I finish my rants runaway !


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Shadychris]

Ok calm your titsxxxxx everybody lol

Don't need to be jealous at him or what he has . In long run, we are all die!

Is that so? Then maybe we should stop breathing right now lol.

I mean that we should value our time not other thing and enjoy your life.

So I congrats the op. I'm happy that you and your family happy and successful. And I hope it will stay like that.

Lol what we or me should do is focus on my life and find what really make me happy. What is the truly meaning of my life then go after it blah blah blah

I finish my rants runaway !

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You make some good points about valuing and focussing on one's own life, and finding happiness and success in a way that satisfies your own self.

However whilst I can't speak for everybody, here I'm pretty sure 'everybody' is not jealous of the OP. Why would we be?

Jealous of a house the interior of which looks like something from the Ideal Homes catalogue mixed in with a bit of Gypsy caravan style thrown in, un-lived in appearance and not exhibiting much of a warm happy family life? - ummm no.

Jealous of his oh so perfect looking wife, make-up applied with surgical precision and perfectly posed? Well lovely and good hearted girl though she may actually be - again no.

Jealous of his small collection of mundane cars or the postcard picture images of beaches which may or may not be near his house? Absolutely not.

Don't forget this is a forum - a place to air opinions and discuss.

The OP expressed a lot of opinions - and remember opinions are like a'holes - everybody has one, and if you don't want yours to be inspected closely then it might be best not to show it on a forum like this one ;-)

I'm sure if the OP had posted a story about how he had left his family for 2 years to go to South Africa to do missionary work for no pay, helping starving people to build schools and wells and enduring hardship himself, we would all be loudly congratulating him.

However he posted a story about re-locating back to his home country, getting a job and providing his family with what appear to be by western standards, fairly average circumstances. Hardly the worlds toughest achievement.

Moreover the self laudatory manner in which he presented it, along with his comparisons between the USA and Thailand almost exclusively favouring the former, were bound to elicit a large amount of opinions, queries and even criticisms.

Although there may be a few individuals who feel a degree of jealousy towards the OP, because we are not all falling over ourselves to congratulate him does not mean we are all jealous and not focussed on being happy in our own lives.

Edited July 30, 2015 by Shadychris