Moving to Bangkok: Downtown vs Nichada

[BecksNYC]

We will be moving to Bangkok from the U.S. in a few months with a 2 yo and a 6 mo. I understand that Nichada is a great community for families with school-aged children, but for those with youngsters, would it be better to live downtown? Commuting will obviously be better for my husband downtown, but what about day-to-day life with two small children? Thank you!

[CharlieH]

Probably better with this in the Bangkok forum for localised input.

MOVED

[DirtyDan]

A couple other questions to ask yourselves: How long are you here for? Will your kids need an international school in a few years? Do you need the same American social networks to survive or are you comfortable experiencing a new culture? Do you really want to live in a Florida retirement community where you can drive your golf cart around inside the gated compound? Also, depending on where and when the husband works, the commute could be just as bad.

I know families that live in both places - and both are happy with their choices as it comes down to personal preference. From what I've been told, there's no nightlife and severely limited dining options in Nichida - the coworkers come down to my place for dinner.

I assume you're on a lucrative ex-pat assignment to be able to afford Nichida pricing... but remember for roughly one half of Nichida prices you can get a really sweet condo downtown. Let me sum up Nichida to you with the one statement my co-worker said, "My son's don't even know we've left America." I'm thinking - why did you even leave then?

Personally, Mrs. Dirty and I would never be happy living on a compound and schooling options downtown are just as decent as the ISB. We love "downtown", this is an amazing city - there's a Bangkok for everyone and you'll never experience it living in Nichida. There are many different areas fine for family living - Silom/Saladeang, along Sukumvit from Thonglor (55) to Ekkamai (63?) and up to On Nut(103?) (I would avoid lower Sukumvit for traffic and lifestyle issues). Honestly, anywhere on the BTS is fine to live as we often take the train simply because it's more efficient than waiting in traffic. A colleague lives in Ari and loves it.

Honestly, you'll have to explore both options when you arrive (are you coming on a pre-visit?).

Best of luck.

Edited August 6, 2015 by DirtyDan

[TheKnave]

We will be moving to Bangkok from the U.S. in a few months with a 2 yo and a 6 mo. I understand that Nichada is a great community for families with school-aged children, but for those with youngsters, would it be better to live downtown? Commuting will obviously be better for my husband downtown, but what about day-to-day life with two small children? Thank you!

Sorry you had to suffer that nitwit's {non)response...

My favorite Mexican Restaurant, Que Pasa, is out that way, and is usually packed with farang families on the weekends, due to the International School and Nichada housing estate. However, there doesn't appear to be much to do out there, and the commute to 'downtown' Bangkok is horrendous.

Unless your kidlets are ready for school, I would think your family better served by living as close to your husband's employer as possible. Certainly more for you and the kids to dfo during the day, and for you and your hubby to do, especially since he won't be exhausted from the commute.

You can always reevaluate after he's been on the job for a while.

With his solid job, work permit and visa, you will be plenty secure, and Bangkok can be a really interesting place if you are open to it.

Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain...

Best of luck, and enjoy Thailand.

[MobileContent]

I lived 8 years on Nichada and some of the best restaurants were around that area. Nichada is a great deal if your hubby is on an expat package and ISB got to be your first choice. I left Nichada many years ago but consider moving back to Nichada in two years time as my boy is now 2 1/2 years. BTW My boy is Thai German and before I spend that money on the Swiss German School I prefer ISB.

Edited August 6, 2015 by MobileContent

[DirtyDan]

Sorry you had to suffer that nitwit's {non)response...

My favorite Mexican Restaurant, Que Pasa, is out that way,

Have you tried Senor Pico's in the Rembrandt hotel (Sukumvit Soi 18)? A Mexican I know says it's much better and I, as a non-Mexican, have to agree. There's also Mejico in Central Mall Chitlom (Phleonchit?) which is outstanding.

These are both places that could be a 2 hour round trip commute from Nichida.

[Sweet Dreams]

<post removed>

What a ridiculous statement to make. There are thousands of expat children living in Bangkok, of all ages. It is an exciting and safe city to live in.

Perhaps Thai Visa is not the best place to pose such innocent questions, as there are some very jaded posters on here.

I suggest contacting the American Women's Club, or reading The Bangkok Guide published by the Australian, New Zealand Women's Group, or Bkk Kids on Face Book.

Come to Bangkok, bring the kids, and expect to live a happy life!

[derator01]

An inappropriate post has been removed from view. Please abide by forum rules and show respect to other members.

[smokie36]

Find a large apartment in the Phrom Pong to Thonglor area and you will be very happy in Bangkok....easy transport links and everything you could want in the surrounding area.

I've no idea why anyone would choose to live in a Western ghetto in the middle of nowhere in Bangkok!

[smokie36]

Sorry you had to suffer that nitwit's {non)response...

My favorite Mexican Restaurant, Que Pasa, is out that way,

Have you tried Senor Pico's in the Rembrandt hotel (Sukumvit Soi 18)? A Mexican I know says it's much better and I, as a non-Mexican, have to agree. There's also Mejico in Central Mall Chitlom (Phleonchit?) which is outstanding.

These are both places that could be a 2 hour round trip commute from Nichida.

La Monita...Sabroso....to name but two that are much better than Senor Pico.....although the guacamole made at your table is very nice indeed.

[luk AJ]

In Nichada the kids will be able to go to their friends in the neighbourhood. I understand they are too young for ISB. If the expat job is in downtown I guess the best option is to find a condo close to the work place or close to a skytrain station. Traffic from Nichada to downtown is horrific can take up to 2 hours one way. Whatever your choice, welcome to Bangkok!

[roamer]

I think Dirty Dan gave some very good advice. Very unscientific I know but guessing the BecksNYC is New York City ? In that case maybe downtown might be far less strange to you than Pleasantville (Nichada). Known a few people who have lived at Nichada and visited there, most definately not for me. I know quite a few families living happily downtown that also have similar views on Nichada. You might also try browsing the Families and children forum on here and ask a few questions. Good luck.

[BecksNYC]

Thank you all for your advice! I think that it will probably be best - in our case - to start out downtown for a few years, and then move if we decide to go to ISB. One thing I was wondering - is the air quality better in Nichada than downtown? I worry about exposing my kids to bad air (not that it's amazing in NYC either).

[Thian]

Nichada sure ain't bad but except the Central mall there's not much around except traffic jam. But you won't go around with those baby's while nobody speaks english outside nichada. Also the area is very ugly outside the moobaan.

But with the kids you can drive your golfcart over the private road into the Central Chaengwattana...there are loads of restaurants and shops. They even have reserved parking for nichada residents.

A 5* condo in the city is the other option but think of walking there with your baby's....you 'll need personell, a maid or so.

There are many more great moobaans though, up to budget. There's also one next to an international scool, Hydepark.

Edited August 7, 2015 by Thian

[TheKnave]

Sorry you had to suffer that nitwit's {non)response...

My favorite Mexican Restaurant, Que Pasa, is out that way,

Have you tried Senor Pico's in the Rembrandt hotel (Sukumvit Soi 18)? A Mexican I know says it's much better and I, as a non-Mexican, have to agree. There's also Mejico in Central Mall Chitlom (Phleonchit?) which is outstanding.

These are both places that could be a 2 hour round trip commute from Nichida.

Don't want to hijack this thread, but Mexican food, like Thai, Italian, and almost all other national cusines, is regional. So a Mexican from Michoacan might turn his nose up at Baja food, etc.

I like Que Pasa for its relaxed atmosphere, decent comfort Mexican food, and service. La Monita is very good, but cramped and feels like a quickie.

I wish I could remember the name of the place on Soi Convent, a few meters down from Silom on the left. Great enchiladas suizas and good margaritas...anybody?

[mmh8]

in nichada you have a home, relativly unpolluted air. you can walk with no food vendors in the way and little if any in the way of the heckling you get foir being a farang. YOu will have spoace to live in, and if not the condos in nichada you have a garden and don't hear your neighbours rutting with the girls they brought home, or wife/ husband/ ladyboy depending on that neigbours position.

you have security that is good with others in a similar position to you

in downtown you don't get the above. you get a condo probably since good home with garden is taken by rich Thais and unlikly to be rented out. walk out you are on busy street usually etc.

[luk AJ]

Nichada sure ain't bad but except the Central mall there's not much around except traffic jam. But you won't go around with those baby's while nobody speaks english outside nichada. Also the area is very ugly outside the moobaan.

But with the kids you can drive your golfcart over the private road into the Central Chaengwattana...there are loads of restaurants and shops. They even have reserved parking for nichada residents.

A 5* condo in the city is the other option but think of walking there with your baby's....you 'll need personell, a maid or so.

There are many more great moobaans though, up to budget. There's also one next to an international scool, Hydepark.

central plaza, Homepro, BigC, Makro....

Nichada opened a new club house at the new lake condominium and at the old club house there will be an Italian very soon. Besides this, inside Nichada compound there is Starbucks and Villa market. So with kids for sure a nice protected place but when the husband got a job in downtown, commuting is a nightmare. So as long as the kids don't need ISB, I would settle somewhere downtown. Airpollution is an issue, try to find condo at + 20th floor. The higher you find less pollution and NO mosquitos!

[mmh8]

not sure you are correct about the pollution thing above 20th floor. volatile compounds and density stuff yeah? but what about those little carbon particles that are able to travel through walls. thats right, the further away from the pollution the better.

also remember you live up that high you are totally fuked if a fire breaks out.

ne na ne na, you've seen how the government act, well just add a magnitude of order to the comedy of the fire brigade, junkos circus clowns would be better. thats if they arrive at your condo through the traffic, then they have to save face for having a little ladder that can't go above 5th floor, to save face they climb up to the top of the ladder and jump a little, stand on each others shoulders pretending they can reach that 6th floor.

then they stand around discussiong things as people jump out of windows to escape the fire, they don't care its karma

Edited August 7, 2015 by mmh8

[luk AJ]

not sure you are correct about the pollution thing above 20th floor. volatile compounds and density stuff yeah? but what about those little carbon particles that are able to travel through walls. thats right, the further away from the pollution the better.

also remember you live up that high you are totally fuked if a fire breaks out.

ne na ne na, you've seen how the government act, well just add a magnitude of order to the comedy of the fire brigade, junkos circus clowns would be better. thats if they arrive at your condo through the traffic, then they have to save face for having a little ladder that can't go above 5th floor, to save face they climb up to the top of the ladder and jump a little, stand on each others shoulders pretending they can reach that 6th floor.

then they stand around discussiong things as people jump out of windows to escape the fire, they don't care its karma

There is always a doom scenario. Be careful today for metheorites, black cats and acid rain!

[kblaze]

Sorry you had to suffer that nitwit's {non)response...

My favorite Mexican Restaurant, Que Pasa, is out that way,

Have you tried Senor Pico's in the Rembrandt hotel (Sukumvit Soi 18)? A Mexican I know says it's much better and I, as a non-Mexican, have to agree. There's also Mejico in Central Mall Chitlom (Phleonchit?) which is outstanding.

These are both places that could be a 2 hour round trip commute from Nichida.

In my opinion, Que Pasa is much better than Senor Picos. Senor Picos isn't bad, but Que Pasa and La Monita are better in my view. This is coming from someone who is half Mexican by ethnicity.

Back to the topic. There are indeed things to do around Nichada, don't be fooled into believing otherwise. There is a giant mall less than 10 min away. Yes, it is very much Pleasantville when you cross into it. But if you want to quickly meet other families and be part of a community, it can't be beat.

[mmh8]

 

not sure you are correct about the pollution thing above 20th floor. volatile compounds and density stuff yeah? but what about those little carbon particles that are able to travel through walls. thats right, the further away from the pollution the better.

also remember you live up that high you are totally fuked if a fire breaks out.

ne na ne na, you've seen how the government act, well just add a magnitude of order to the comedy of the fire brigade, junkos circus clowns would be better. thats if they arrive at your condo through the traffic, then they have to save face for having a little ladder that can't go above 5th floor, to save face they climb up to the top of the ladder and jump a little, stand on each others shoulders pretending they can reach that 6th floor.

then they stand around discussiong things as people jump out of windows to escape the fire, they don't care its karma

There is always a doom scenario. Be careful today for metheorites, black cats and acid rain!

 

this is not doom scenario, TIT. You ever seen a road accident in Thailand, you ever seen a fire in property in thailand?

if you are a well balanced individual with a family which I have assumed the op is, you would want to minimise risk in a country where common sense is optional. fires can and do happen, your neighbours in the condo may be cooking over open fire pits dug into the cement for all you know?

20th floor does not save you from pollution and the little dangerous particles may be worse there.

if you have a family you care about, you put them somewhere safe where a walk outside does not involve dosding motorbikes on the pavement, etc etc. some risks are serious, your ones above are not so serious, but death by motorbike,fire, etc veryu real

[luk AJ]

How many casualties in Bangkok in condo building fires during the last 5 years? You are clearly a doom thinker. No need to respond, I am checking out of this post...

[BecksNYC]

Continued thanks for the advice. I know there are many varying opinions, and it's helpful for me to hear all if them. After the latest round, I'm now wondering if the most responsible thing would be to live in the safe, American community with clean air from the start. My goal while living in Thailand is to give my children a safe and happy life. I was thinking that starting out downtown might make it easier to do activities with them, since I got the sense that Nicgada family life really begins when children are school aged - and we can spare my husband a terrible commute. However, the clean air, and perhaps distance from some of the crazy might make it safer for us in Nichada from the go. Then again, we are not suburb people... Very torn at the moment!

[eppic]

Just pick the right area of Bangkok. I came to Bangkok from NYC, then Singapore, and I can't imagine living in nowheresville suburbia....Unless by NYC, you really mean "Westport, CT" or other far away suburbs. Don't underestimate the nightmare of a daily commute to/from central BKK for your husband. BTW, "downtown" is not really a thing here...better off saying central BKK or specify districts, but you will learn that in time.

If you want quiet and safe, there are areas like that in BKK. I personally prefer the Embassy district, which happens to be where I live. Easy access to BTS (100 meters to Ratchadamri in my case), wide sidewalks on Ratchadamri Rd, plenty to do and see. Very rarely see the undesireables that are rampant around most of central Bangkok. Walking distance to green space and best malls, which are great places to take the kids. No need for a car, just live by GrabCar and Uber, that's what we do -- avoids parking hassles. We also have a baby on the way, and have no intention of moving to suburbia any time soon -- plenty of small children (especially babies) in our building, and a very safe, upscale area. Commute to work almost certainly a breeze. Expensive by BKK standards, but totally worth it for the (relative) serenity combined with convenience.

Just an idea, stay at a serviced apartment for a month or two (suggest Grande Centrepoint Ratchadamri or similar) before deciding.

[BecksNYC]

Thank you eppic - that's helpful! We currently live in midtown Manhattan and go everywhere by foot with the stroller. Uber is great, but complicated bc I would need to install two car seats for each trip, and stow the toddler one when we arrive to our destination (the infant one fits in the stroller).

Would it ever make sense have a car and driver when living in central BKK? My husband - who lived in BkK for work ten years ago - thinks that having a car/driver will help with the car seat issue. Assuming his work foots the bill for such a luxury, would this be helpful, or completely useless since traffic is so bad anyway?

[eppic]

Ah, the nice thing for you is that (most parts of) midtown is within a reasonable walk to Central Pk, which is fantastic for kids. I went to biz school on the UWS (ok, almost Harlem) and later lived on the UES while working in midtown. I also really enjoyed the ability to walk there, so rarely used my car.

Unfortunately, most of Bangkok is not very walkable at all, although I believe the embassy/ratchaprasong area is probably the best with the wide Ratchadamri sidewalks and the skywalk nearby. Sidewalks in most of the city are cracked, full of holes, clogged with vendors, or sometimes nonexistent. Cars and motorcycles also do not respect pedestrians (vehicles ALWAYS assume the right-of-way), so it can be hazardous to walk unless you keep very aware. So for certain, you will do less walking here, and a truck-like stroller would be helpful. Strollers here are seen mostly in the malls, although we see some around us and will likely use one in our immediate, walkable area.

As for a the car situation, one child would be easy to manage with Uber/GrabCar, but I agree your situation with two small children would be challenging. I have rented a car on a monthly basis and also ordered a new one at one time, but with the advent of Uber/GC, for daily use it's usually not necessary, so ultimately opted against it.

Some people have drivers here, but it is not as common as you might think -- unlike a place such as Jakarta, which just about every expat has a driver. The problem is that drivers are notoriously unreliable and good ones are difficult to find (same for a good Thai nanny, btw) -- but perhaps if the company can arrange one, that might be ideal. You can also self-drive and that is not a problem, although the parking situation here can be a real pain.

At least if you live in midtown you are used to the crowds, your first stroll through Siam Paragon won't be a shock (kinda like fifth ave during tourist season).

Anyway, probably a women's expat club or forum could give you some more helpful suggestions, but just wanted to give your our perspective coming from a similar, urban background.

Edited August 9, 2015 by eppic

[BecksNYC]

Eppic - I also went to biz school in the city, but downtown (I think we both know where we went). I love Manhattan and this will be my third time leaving to live abroad...hopefully to return again one day.

In any case, I've never been too concerned living with the inconveniences of developing countries, but with small children, I suddenly feel very 'American' with the questions I see myself asking.

I will definitely be getting involved with the women's expat clubs to get more specifics on the do's and don't's with the little ones. I really appreciate all of your help!

[Thian]

Eppic - I also went to biz school in the city, but downtown (I think we both know where we went). I love Manhattan and this will be my third time leaving to live abroad...hopefully to return again one day.

In any case, I've never been too concerned living with the inconveniences of developing countries, but with small children, I suddenly feel very 'American' with the questions I see myself asking.

I will definitely be getting involved with the women's expat clubs to get more specifics on the do's and don't's with the little ones. I really appreciate all of your help!

You sure sound very american but that's allright, you can't help it that you never lived in the 3rd world.

Thailand might look developed but that's all smoke and mirrors.

With young children like yours i wouldn't come here at all, even the flight with crying kids would be a disaster for me.

You sure need personell here and best live right next to a good mall (like in nichada). For going out you'll need a driver and company car like all other expats have.

[DirtyDan]

I'll add a little to the previous posters comments, without being quite as negative. The infrastructure around the various farang-frequented red-light districts are pretty rough (sidewalks, etc.) and I wonder if some of these doom-and-gloom types have ever wandered more than 3 blocks away?

Yes, living downtown will be work. You've got to be vigilant to ensure you keep your kids from touching low-hanging live-wires, running into traffic (or having a motorcycle run over them while you're on the sidewalk), or falling into an open drain/canal... But many families do it here just fine. Coming to Bangkok as an ex-pat with greater income than the locals, will put you in the advantageous position of being able to hire someone to help you watch them (and a decent nanny is cheap-as-chips compared to hiring help in North America).

Don't let some people's scare mongering worry you - nothing is easy, but it certainly can be done.

Edited August 11, 2015 by DirtyDan

[tx22cb]

Additional thoughts for your consideration ...

- commuting from Nich to/from downtown for hubby's work will be a nightmare - he'll be subject to rush hour both ways. Although there are tollways, they are jammed packed with your fellow suburbanites and there is no HOV lane.

If you lived downtown and your children went to ISB, they will have ISB school buses to ferry them, and they will be going against the rush hour traffic flows so their commute would be much better.

- You may have read about the air pollution in China and S E Asia. BKK air quality is pretty good. BKK is not cold and does not have the temperature inversion pollution you see in Beijing (plus no-one needs to burn coal to keep warm). BKK does not suffer from smoke from forest fires from Indonesia (the "haze"). The only air pollution is from cars/buses, so don't get a convertible car, and you'll never use the sunroof.

- safety is always a concern in any big unfamiliar city. But many downtown condos in your price range (150,000 Baht/month?) are in very safe areas with great security. With young infants, you are unlikely to be wandering in the streets after 9 pm. IMHO, BKK is safer than NY, Chicago, Detroit, Houston.

- as an expat, your husband will be working late, several business dinners, and regional travel. Living downtown will give your family more family time together.

Final thought. If you were an untraveled housewife from a small town in the mid-West, I'd recommend a cloistered community like Nich. However, if you live in cosmopolitan NYC, have street smarts and have lived overseas before, then it's downtown BKK.

On a personal note, we used to have a large house in the 'burbs (but near the "British" school, not ISB), but after a while we preferred to live in a condo with full facilities downtown.

Good luck.

Edited August 11, 2015 by tx22cb