Concerns over coup 'will only give China more room to woo Thailand'

[boomerangutang]

Re; the US and SE Asia: Uncle Sam has more Thais with Philippines than any other SE Asian country. Philippines, more than any other SE Asian country, is looking at having to face-off (militarily) with China. Thailand can play a minor role. Most likely, Thailand will do what it's been doing for past years, staying firmly on the sidelines. If forced to venture an opinion, it will say something benign (Rodney King'ish) like: 'Can't we all just get along?'

In a recent post, someone said something like, "when an elected Thai gov;t gets in power, it will be more measured in its reactions to Chinese intrusion." Not sure if that will happen. If a Shinawatre comes to power again, then Thai policy will continue kissing up to China. As for other possibilities, like Amart, it's hard to say, but it's worth noting that most large corps in Thailand are Chinese-Thai owned. Same for most politicians.

[Time Traveller]

Also, China is facing armed trouble in and around the Philippine islands off Luzon's west coast.

Having a friend in Thailand, for China, is good for them, but having a friend with Chinese subs is even better, from the Chinese view. Friends with weapons become special friends with special status.

It's strange that Thailand would want to provoke neighbouring South East Asian countries with purchasing Chinese subs and an alliance with China. I guess thats what you get when the military control the country. They're always looking for an excuse for war.

[yuv06]

Also, China is facing armed trouble in and around the Philippine islands off Luzon's west coast.

Having a friend in Thailand, for China, is good for them, but having a friend with Chinese subs is even better, from the Chinese view. Friends with weapons become special friends with special status.

It's strange that Thailand would want to provoke neighbouring South East Asian countries with purchasing Chinese subs and an alliance with China. I guess thats what you get when the military control the country. They're always looking for an excuse for war.

What's the issue with buying Chinese subs? We are an independent country any purchase is our decision I don't get why buying Chinese sub will cause a war! Buying US stuff is certain cause for war as seen in the past. The subs capability are better than the German and Swedish subs that is why they decided to go Chinese. Thailand has been Chinese Military and Western Military hardware for quite sometime.

[Thai at Heart]

Buying bits of Chinese military hardware is not the same as politically separating yourself from the USA. Asean countries are allied with the USA, and several have problems with China. Thailand has an awful lot to lose by moving its military alliance too close to China at the expense of the USA. Myanmar is moving away from China forthwith, and running towards the EU and USA. Thailand risks leaving itself politically and militarily rather isolated if it keeps going on like this.

As I said earlier though, most of this so called move to China is fairly short term so far and will probably be unravelled once a civilan govt returns. At the end of the day, do the amaart and the military really want to give up all their perks afforded by being close to the USA? I very very much doubt it.

How many governments since the 90s Thais are till staying their cause and even when it returns to civilian rule if won't affect anything that has been going on.

Myanmar maybe right or wrong but China is one of the largest investors and Myanmar depends on China for arms look at their hardware, AF Chinese jets + Mig29, Tanks Chinese + BTR, Ships Chinese.

I am proud that we have stayed our cause and not become a lapdog of the USA.

Since when is allying with people who have helped you out over the years make u a lapdog.

Without the contribution of the USA and allies, Thailand would have been a very different place from what it is today, and not for the better.

One should be a little grateful.

[yuv06]

Buying bits of Chinese military hardware is not the same as politically separating yourself from the USA. Asean countries are allied with the USA, and several have problems with China. Thailand has an awful lot to lose by moving its military alliance too close to China at the expense of the USA. Myanmar is moving away from China forthwith, and running towards the EU and USA. Thailand risks leaving itself politically and militarily rather isolated if it keeps going on like this.

As I said earlier though, most of this so called move to China is fairly short term so far and will probably be unravelled once a civilan govt returns. At the end of the day, do the amaart and the military really want to give up all their perks afforded by being close to the USA? I very very much doubt it.

How many governments since the 90s Thais are till staying their cause and even when it returns to civilian rule if won't affect anything that has been going on.

Myanmar maybe right or wrong but China is one of the largest investors and Myanmar depends on China for arms look at their hardware, AF Chinese jets + Mig29, Tanks Chinese + BTR, Ships Chinese.

I am proud that we have stayed our cause and not become a lapdog of the USA.

Since when is allying with people who have helped you out over the years make u a lapdog.

Without the contribution of the USA and allies, Thailand would have been a very different place from what it is today, and not for the better.

One should be a little grateful.

Don't get me wrong I am grateful for what USA did especially after WW2 and during the communist expansion but it wasn't a one way thing it was a two way thing.

[Thai at Heart]

Buying bits of Chinese military hardware is not the same as politically separating yourself from the USA. Asean countries are allied with the USA, and several have problems with China. Thailand has an awful lot to lose by moving its military alliance too close to China at the expense of the USA. Myanmar is moving away from China forthwith, and running towards the EU and USA. Thailand risks leaving itself politically and militarily rather isolated if it keeps going on like this.

As I said earlier though, most of this so called move to China is fairly short term so far and will probably be unravelled once a civilan govt returns. At the end of the day, do the amaart and the military really want to give up all their perks afforded by being close to the USA? I very very much doubt it.

How many governments since the 90s Thais are till staying their cause and even when it returns to civilian rule if won't affect anything that has been going on.

Myanmar maybe right or wrong but China is one of the largest investors and Myanmar depends on China for arms look at their hardware, AF Chinese jets + Mig29, Tanks Chinese + BTR, Ships Chinese.

I am proud that we have stayed our cause and not become a lapdog of the USA.

Since when is allying with people who have helped you out over the years make u a lapdog.

Without the contribution of the USA and allies, Thailand would have been a very different place from what it is today, and not for the better.

One should be a little grateful.

Don't get me wrong I am grateful for what USA did especially after WW2 and during the communist expansion but it wasn't a one way thing it was a two way thing.

What did America take from Thailand whilst it was busy saving Thailand ass, building roads and investing billions.....

[yuv06]

Don't get me wrong I am grateful for what USA did especially after WW2 and during the communist expansion but it wasn't a one way thing it was a two way thing.

What did America take from Thailand whilst it was busy saving Thailand ass, building roads and investing billions.....

Well we let the use our air base and we sent troops to fight the Thais were the 3rd largest contributor in the Vietnam war after USA and S.Korea

[Thai at Heart]

Don't get me wrong I am grateful for what USA did especially after WW2 and during the communist expansion but it wasn't a one way thing it was a two way thing.

What did America take from Thailand whilst it was busy saving Thailand ass, building roads and investing billions.....

Well we let the use our air base and we sent troops to fight the Thais were the 3rd largest contributor in the Vietnam war after USA and S.Korea

Well, since it was on Thailand doorstep, I presume Thailand would have fought anyway. I presume, the alternative would have been that the USA and it's allies didn't pitch at all, and had left Thailand to fight on their own.

The outcome would have seen the spectacular Thai army take on the Vietnamese army on their own. I mean, u want the USA to say thanks for coming along, and allying with Thailand to save it's ass from fighting on its own? U think Thailand would have been able to fight the various communist armies on its borders?

[yuv06]

Don't get me wrong I am grateful for what USA did especially after WW2 and during the communist expansion but it wasn't a one way thing it was a two way thing.

What did America take from Thailand whilst it was busy saving Thailand ass, building roads and investing billions.....

Well we let the use our air base and we sent troops to fight the Thais were the 3rd largest contributor in the Vietnam war after USA and S.Korea

Well, since it was on Thailand doorstep, I presume Thailand would have fought anyway. I presume, the alternative would have been that the USA and it's allies didn't pitch at all, and had left Thailand to fight on their own.

The outcome would have seen the spectacular Thai army take on the Vietnamese army on their own. I mean, u want the USA to say thanks for coming along, and allying with Thailand to save it's ass from fighting on its own? U think Thailand would have been able to fight the various communist armies on its borders?

I think you need to rethink and get your facts straight on what you are saying the Vietnam war was not a Thai war it was in the beginning a French and Vietnamese war when the French lost the USA took over the fight! Nothing involved Thailand and Thai policy was actually not to intervene in neighbors affairs. However, due to pressure from USA the Thais then sent troops to fight.

[Thai at Heart]

Don't get me wrong I am grateful for what USA did especially after WW2 and during the communist expansion but it wasn't a one way thing it was a two way thing.

What did America take from Thailand whilst it was busy saving Thailand ass, building roads and investing billions.....

Well we let the use our air base and we sent troops to fight the Thais were the 3rd largest contributor in the Vietnam war after USA and S.Korea

Well, since it was on Thailand doorstep, I presume Thailand would have fought anyway. I presume, the alternative would have been that the USA and it's allies didn't pitch at all, and had left Thailand to fight on their own.

The outcome would have seen the spectacular Thai army take on the Vietnamese army on their own. I mean, u want the USA to say thanks for coming along, and allying with Thailand to save it's ass from fighting on its own? U think Thailand would have been able to fight the various communist armies on its borders?

I think you need to rethink and get your facts straight on what you are saying the Vietnam war was not a Thai war it was in the beginning a French and Vietnamese war when the French lost the USA took over the fight! Nothing involved Thailand and Thai policy was actually not to intervene in neighbors affairs. However, due to pressure from USA the Thais then sent troops to fight.

You think that in time, communist aggressive expansion wouldn't have moved into Thailand? You think because Thailand hadnt interfered in their neighbors affairs, they would have simply left Thailand to sit independent.

[yuv06]

Don't get me wrong I am grateful for what USA did especially after WW2 and during the communist expansion but it wasn't a one way thing it was a two way thing.

What did America take from Thailand whilst it was busy saving Thailand ass, building roads and investing billions.....

Well we let the use our air base and we sent troops to fight the Thais were the 3rd largest contributor in the Vietnam war after USA and S.Korea

Well, since it was on Thailand doorstep, I presume Thailand would have fought anyway. I presume, the alternative would have been that the USA and it's allies didn't pitch at all, and had left Thailand to fight on their own.

The outcome would have seen the spectacular Thai army take on the Vietnamese army on their own. I mean, u want the USA to say thanks for coming along, and allying with Thailand to save it's ass from fighting on its own? U think Thailand would have been able to fight the various communist armies on its borders?

I think you need to rethink and get your facts straight on what you are saying the Vietnam war was not a Thai war it was in the beginning a French and Vietnamese war when the French lost the USA took over the fight! Nothing involved Thailand and Thai policy was actually not to intervene in neighbors affairs. However, due to pressure from USA the Thais then sent troops to fight.

You think that in time, communist aggressive expansion wouldn't have moved into Thailand? You think because Thailand hadnt interfered in their neighbors affairs, they would have simply left Thailand to sit independent.

Yes there was concern about communist expansion but at that time Laos and Cambodia were still not communist and Thailand at that time was busy fighting the communist insurgency in Thailand the USA actually requested battle hardened troops from Thailand but the Thai government refused because those troops were needed to fight the communist in Thailand that is why a volunteer army was set up to be sent to Vietnam. BTW we did fine against the Vietnamese when they were in Cambodia without US help.

Edited August 8, 2015 by yuv06

[boomerangutang]

What's the issue with buying Chinese subs? We are an independent country any purchase is our decision....

Yes, it's Thailand's decision. It's also Thailand's decision to have an inferior education system which puts it on the bottom of the list of English-as-2nd-language speakers. The sub purchase decision is wrong for many reasons.

...I don't get why buying Chinese sub will cause a war! Buying US stuff is certain cause for war as seen in the past. The subs capability are better than the German and Swedish subs that is why they decided to go Chinese. Thailand has been Chinese Military and Western Military hardware for quite sometime.

....better than German or Swedish? Get real, dude. Where does China get all it's tech from? Right, the Europeans and Americans. Farang were developing subs and aircraft carriers 110+ years before Asians. The best China can do with modern tech is a somewhat ok copy of farang tech. I go to a hardware store which sells dozens of different brands of electric tools. All the Chinese-made tools are copies of farang (and Japanese and Korean) tools. All the Chinese tools are half the price (or less) of the same size tool from other countries. That includes water pumps and welders, etc.

Customers have a choice: buy a well-crafted tool using good materials, or buy the same-looking / same-size tool for half price which is cheaply made using inferior materials. One will last ten or more years (being used often). ....the other will last months.

[yuv06]

What's the issue with buying Chinese subs? We are an independent country any purchase is our decision....

Yes, it's Thailand's decision. It's also Thailand's decision to have an inferior education system which puts it on the bottom of the list of English-as-2nd-language speakers. The sub purchase decision is wrong for many reasons.

...I don't get why buying Chinese sub will cause a war! Buying US stuff is certain cause for war as seen in the past. The subs capability are better than the German and Swedish subs that is why they decided to go Chinese. Thailand has been Chinese Military and Western Military hardware for quite sometime.

....better than German or Swedish? Get real, dude. Where does China get all it's tech from? Right, the Europeans and Americans. Farang were developing subs and aircraft carriers 110+ years before Asians. The best China can do with modern tech is a somewhat ok copy of farang tech. I go to a hardware store which sells dozens of different brands of electric tools. All the Chinese-made tools are copies of farang (and Japanese and Korean) tools. All the Chinese tools are half the price (or less) of the same size tool from other countries. That includes water pumps and welders, etc.

Customers have a choice: buy a well-crafted tool using good materials, or buy the same-looking / same-size tool for half price which is cheaply made using inferior materials. One will last ten or more years (being used often). ....the other will last months.

I aren't going to baby sit you go check out the spec of the sub first before commenting

[boomerangutang]

awww please babysit me. Seriously though, checking out specs is secondary, though it's doubtful any Chinese sub can compare favorably to a farang-made sub. What's most important is to assess whether Thailand needs any subs at all in a shallow water bay, with its history of sub-par maintenance, and no maritime enemies. Just one of many examples: After the tsunami, Thailand was given early warning buoys. Just one problem, Thai navy couldn't figure out how to change the batteries in the darn things - or they forgot about the maintenance schedule or both. Subs in shallow water are near useless, unless you retrofit large windows and use it as a tourist attraction (stationary or moving). Even then, it would help to have marine life to look at, which are becoming more scarce along Thailand's shores.

[yuv06]

awww please babysit me. Seriously though, checking out specs is secondary, though it's doubtful any Chinese sub can compare favorably to a farang-made sub. What's most important is to assess whether Thailand needs any subs at all in a shallow water bay, with its history of sub-par maintenance, and no maritime enemies. Just one of many examples: After the tsunami, Thailand was given early warning buoys. Just one problem, Thai navy couldn't figure out how to change the batteries in the darn things - or they forgot about the maintenance schedule or both. Subs in shallow water are near useless, unless you retrofit large windows and use it as a tourist attraction (stationary or moving). Even then, it would help to have marine life to look at, which are becoming more scarce along Thailand's shores.

I'm really getting sick of the shallow excuse people keep inferring as I said many times Singapore is shallower than the Gulf of Thailand and they have 6 subs with another 2 on order. I think you look down at the Chinese! Have you heard about the incident with the Song Class submarine and the US Aircraft Carrier Task Group? BTW the Song Class was only built as a test bed.

[yuv06]

Hope they build it soon as possible as this well be the government that will be able to push this through

Easing the Malacca Energy Bottleneck: Is it Time for the Kra Canal? http://www.forbes.com/sites/drillinginfo/2015/06/29/kra-canal/

[yuv06]

USA and their sidekick the EU are pushing Thailand into a corner "EU must show it means business about not trading with Thailand"

http://www.eureporter.co/magazine/2015/08/13/eu-must-show-it-means-business-about-not-trading-with-thailand/?

Edited August 13, 2015 by yuv06

[tonbridgebrit]

Nation Newspaper, be careful what you say.

And if Thaksin or Abhisit ever get back in, are you going to say that there is now "concern that America will be given the chance to woo Thailand" ? Actually, even if Thaksin or Abhisit get back in, I doubt you will be making that comment. That's because if Thaksin or Abhisit get back in, you will notice that Thailand will simply carry on the junta's China policy.

Get real. Thaksin/Abhisit are not going to want to reduce the number of Chinese tourists turning up in Thailand. And Thaksin/Abhisit are not going to get a German or American company to replace the Chinese when building Thailand's railways.

Actually, if Thaksin gets back in, we'ill probably see a bigger chance of the canal being built. Yes, the canal that will massively reduce the ships sailing pass Singapore.