Anyone believe Jesus was partly copied from Buddha ?

[rockyysdt]

How sure are you or we that there is no life or hell after death ?

Of course I can only speak for myself.

100%.

According to the Buddha you are technically correct:

Bikkhu Buddhadasa translated the Buddhas teaching on the subject as:

Buddhism does not embody the eternal-soul view, for the religion does not accept a permanent self. Buddhism is not an annihilation doctrine, for it maintains that things arising from causes and contributory factors depend on the causes and factors, and that the state existing without causes and factors is eternal. Buddhism is not nihilistic because it accepts existence of things in one of the two states that which is uncertain and impermanent characterizes the conditioned things, and that which is certain and permanent characterizes the unconditioned.

Buddhism, accepts that everything is not-self, but at the same time it accepts the existence of things in one of two states: one state continually arising, ceasing, and changing, and the other state having neither origination nor cessation and being unchangeable.

In other words, if re birth arises due to causes and contributory factors, then what is re born will not be "nidieunimaire" as we know "nidieunimaire" to be.

Whilst in the state of Samsara anything re born is in a state continually arising, ceasing, & changing.

Quite rightly, upon "nidieunimaire's" death the body/mind will cease because Samsara is a state in which there is continual arising, ceasing, and change.

The religion accepts that there are impermanent things, namely, those with causes which include defilements, good deeds and evil deeds, happiness and suffering, and all related to them, but these exist impermanently, that is, they always change.

However, if the causes and contributory factors cease (Awakening), then a state having neither origination nor cessation is entered (Nibanna).

If anything belongs to the group that does not result from causes and contributory factors, it can exist by itself without having to arise, will never cease to exist, and will also be permanent. For example, the Buddha said that Nibbana exists.

Edited August 28, 2015 by rockyysdt

[only1]

Exactly, no one can be sure, meaning a person may end without heaven despite believing with the church an entire life. All the more my actions are proven good intentions and right thoughts.

You've missed the point. It doesn't matter whether or not there is life after death, or a heaven and hell. The placebo effect is a real effect. We don't fully understand it yet, but we recognise that all belief has a placebo effect. It's why Drug companies need double-blind tests using placebos to test the efficacy of their new drugs. The placebo effect is always at work, even if the drug is useless. An effective drug is one that has an effect that is greater than the placebo effect. It's estimated that, on average, about 30% of the effectiveness of any drug, can be attributed to a placebo effect. It's always present.

Religion can have a tremendous placebo effect. I've got no objection to that. The problem is with those who try to reinforce the placebo effect by killing anyone who disagrees with their belief. I think you know who I am referring to.

Placebo may work only if a person don't know about it. Once a person understand placebo effects, it will never work.

The same for those who believe a religion out of faith or blind faith. I have see too many Christians suffered miserably near death, when they awakens from their heavenly dreams.

[AYJAYDEE]

Exactly, no one can be sure, meaning a person may end without heaven despite believing with the church an entire life. All the more my actions are proven good intentions and right thoughts.

You've missed the point. It doesn't matter whether or not there is life after death, or a heaven and hell. The placebo effect is a real effect. We don't fully understand it yet, but we recognise that all belief has a placebo effect. It's why Drug companies need double-blind tests using placebos to test the efficacy of their new drugs. The placebo effect is always at work, even if the drug is useless. An effective drug is one that has an effect that is greater than the placebo effect. It's estimated that, on average, about 30% of the effectiveness of any drug, can be attributed to a placebo effect. It's always present.

Religion can have a tremendous placebo effect. I've got no objection to that. The problem is with those who try to reinforce the placebo effect by killing anyone who disagrees with their belief. I think you know who I am referring to.

Placebo may work only if a person don't know about it. Once a person understand placebo effects, it will never work.

The same for those who believe a religion out of faith or blind faith. I have see too many Christians suffered miserably near death, when they awakens from their heavenly dreams.

I haven't seen that at all. what would awaken them?

[only1]

Honesty.

[VincentRJ]

Exactly, no one can be sure, meaning a person may end without heaven despite believing with the church an entire life. All the more my actions are proven good intentions and right thoughts.

You've missed the point. It doesn't matter whether or not there is life after death, or a heaven and hell. The placebo effect is a real effect. We don't fully understand it yet, but we recognise that all belief has a placebo effect. It's why Drug companies need double-blind tests using placebos to test the efficacy of their new drugs. The placebo effect is always at work, even if the drug is useless. An effective drug is one that has an effect that is greater than the placebo effect. It's estimated that, on average, about 30% of the effectiveness of any drug, can be attributed to a placebo effect. It's always present.

Religion can have a tremendous placebo effect. I've got no objection to that. The problem is with those who try to reinforce the placebo effect by killing anyone who disagrees with their belief. I think you know who I am referring to.

Placebo may work only if a person don't know about it. Once a person understand placebo effects, it will never work.

The same for those who believe a religion out of faith or blind faith. I have see too many Christians suffered miserably near death, when they awakens from their heavenly dreams.

Not necessarily. Even when people are informed they are being given a placebo, it can still have a beneficial effect, possibly because they feel good that at least someone is taking the trouble to administer something to them, even though it's a sugar pill, and show them some care.

Religious belief can have a very strong placebo effect in reducing pain and curing certain ailments. You wouldn't want to deprive people of this benefit, would you?

http://www.theguardian.com/science/2010/dec/22/placebo-effect-patients-sham-drug

http://www.nhs.uk/news/2015/07July/Pages/The-placebo-effect-can-still-work-even-if-people-know-its-a-placebo.aspx

[only1]

The placebo effect is just to camouflage the money making part ? See the way the church collect money by passing the money bag and suggesting up to 10% from income. This is a scam.

Instead of using placebo effect which is just temporary, why not let them understand the truth ?

[AYJAYDEE]

Honesty.

are you saying christians are dishonest for believing as they do?? wow

[AYJAYDEE]

The placebo effect is just to camouflage the money making part ? See the way the church collect money by passing the money bag and suggesting up to 10% from income. This is a scam.

Instead of using placebo effect which is just temporary, why not let them understand the truth ?

buddhism encourages donations too

[only1]

Nothing wrong with donation but the dirty trick and ways of collecting.

[only1]

Honesty.

are you saying christians are dishonest for believing as they do?? wow

Please be honest in your conversation, don't change my meaning.

Honesty is needed to awaken the Christians don't mean they are dishonest. Only a small numbers, the pastors are dishonest.

[coulson]

Exactly, no one can be sure, meaning a person may end without heaven despite believing with the church an entire life. All the more my actions are proven good intentions and right thoughts.

You've missed the point. It doesn't matter whether or not there is life after death, or a heaven and hell. The placebo effect is a real effect. We don't fully understand it yet, but we recognise that all belief has a placebo effect. It's why Drug companies need double-blind tests using placebos to test the efficacy of their new drugs. The placebo effect is always at work, even if the drug is useless. An effective drug is one that has an effect that is greater than the placebo effect. It's estimated that, on average, about 30% of the effectiveness of any drug, can be attributed to a placebo effect. It's always present.

Religion can have a tremendous placebo effect. I've got no objection to that. The problem is with those who try to reinforce the placebo effect by killing anyone who disagrees with their belief. I think you know who I am referring to.

Placebo may work only if a person don't know about it. Once a person understand placebo effects, it will never work.

The same for those who believe a religion out of faith or blind faith. I have see too many Christians suffered miserably near death, when they awakens from their heavenly dreams.

Do you think Christians are deluded?

[AYJAYDEE]

Honesty.

are you saying christians are dishonest for believing as they do?? wow

Please be honest in your conversation, don't change my meaning.

Honesty is needed to awaken the Christians don't mean they are dishonest. Only a small numbers, the pastors are dishonest.

so who used this honesty to awaken them at their time of death??

[VincentRJ]

........Instead of using placebo effect which is just temporary, why not let them understand the truth ?

Because we don't know the truth. Don't you realise that? Only a very few individuals are claimed to know the truth, such as Buddha and Jesus Christ. Whether those individuals actually did know the truth in reality, is a matter of belief. Furthermore, when talking about the truth in a scientific context, one has to be very specific. The truth about what, precisely? Even the Buddha did not claim to know whether or not their exists a creator God. The combined knowledge of modern science has arrived at a stage where it is able to potentially detect or observe, using the best scientific instruments available, only 5% of the matter and energy that surrounds us. The rest, about 95%, is an unknown. It's existence is mere speculation. Didn't you know that?

As I've mentioned before, there are basically two types of people. Those who know that they don't know, and those who don't know that they don't know. You appear to be in the latter group, Only1.

[only1]

Honesty.

are you saying christians are dishonest for believing as they do?? wow

Please be honest in your conversation, don't change my meaning.

Honesty is needed to awaken the Christians don't mean they are dishonest. Only a small numbers, the pastors are dishonest.

so who used this honesty to awaken them at their time of death??

Time of death is too late for them.

One should understand the truth and be honest while he is still alive.

The truth of Christianity and how they cheat must be informed to prevent them from further delusion.

[only1]

As I've mentioned before, there are basically two types of people. Those who know that they don't know, and those who don't know that they don't know. You appear to be in the latter group, Only1.

You missed out..

Those who know what others don't know. I am in this group.

Saying that everything is unknown is just an excuse by religious people to victimize others.

Logic cannot be denied.

Edited September 1, 2015 by only1

[only1]

Exactly, no one can be sure, meaning a person may end without heaven despite believing with the church an entire life. All the more my actions are proven good intentions and right thoughts.

You've missed the point. It doesn't matter whether or not there is life after death, or a heaven and hell. The placebo effect is a real effect. We don't fully understand it yet, but we recognise that all belief has a placebo effect. It's why Drug companies need double-blind tests using placebos to test the efficacy of their new drugs. The placebo effect is always at work, even if the drug is useless. An effective drug is one that has an effect that is greater than the placebo effect. It's estimated that, on average, about 30% of the effectiveness of any drug, can be attributed to a placebo effect. It's always present.

Religion can have a tremendous placebo effect. I've got no objection to that. The problem is with those who try to reinforce the placebo effect by killing anyone who disagrees with their belief. I think you know who I am referring to.

Placebo may work only if a person don't know about it. Once a person understand placebo effects, it will never work.

The same for those who believe a religion out of faith or blind faith. I have see too many Christians suffered miserably near death, when they awakens from their heavenly dreams.

Do you think Christians are deluded?

Yes, very much, and the churches knew it. Will show more evidence if anyone is interested to know.

[rockyysdt]

Giving charity (10%) is a compassionate thing.

Some of my Christian family make the offerings directly to worthy recipients.

It's up to the individual.

If an evil person places themselves within the church and cheats parishioners then why denigrate the church?

Acts involving attachment to Greed is performed by individuals.

It has nothing to do with Jesus intent for the Church.

Edited September 1, 2015 by rockyysdt

[AYJAYDEE]

Giving charity (10%) is a compassionate thing.

Some of my Christian family make the offerings directly to worthy recipients.

It's up to the individual.

If an evil person places themselves within the church and cheats parishioners then why denigrate the church?

Acts involving attachment to Greed is performed by individuals.

It has nothing to do with Jesus intent for the Church.

a lost cause

[rockyysdt]

a lost cause

It prompts me to begin a post of observations & examples of strong "attachment".

[AYJAYDEE]

a lost cause

It prompts me to begin a post of observations & examples of strong "attachment".

if its for his benefit, its probably a waste

[only1]

It's not difficult to find out who is who in a religious forum.

Those of you who behaved like don't understand what I am saying, be honest. Watch out on karma.

Do you need 10% from everyone's income ?

Other religions never asked for that much.

Where the money goes?

Why passing the money bag instead of using a stationed box like Buddhism or Chinese temples ?

Need me to elaborate more ?

[xylophone]

Giving charity (10%) is a compassionate thing.

Some of my Christian family make the offerings directly to worthy recipients.

It's up to the individual.

If an evil person places themselves within the church and cheats parishioners then why denigrate the church?

Acts involving attachment to Greed is performed by individuals.

It has nothing to do with Jesus intent for the Church.

Quote: "If an evil person places themselves within the church and cheats parishioners then why denigrate the church?".

Surely the "all powerful being" who is supposed to be overseeing what goes on would prevent this happening?

Is God willing to prevent Evil, but not able?

Then he is not omnipotent.

Is God able, but not willing?

Then he is malevolent.

Is he both able and willing?

Then whence cometh evil?

Is he neither able nor willing?

Then why call him God?

[only1]

Giving charity (10%) is a compassionate thing.

Some of my Christian family make the offerings directly to worthy recipients.

It's up to the individual.

If an evil person places themselves within the church and cheats parishioners then why denigrate the church?

Acts involving attachment to Greed is performed by individuals.

It has nothing to do with Jesus intent for the Church.

Quote: "If an evil person places themselves within the church and cheats parishioners then why denigrate the church?".

Surely the "all powerful being" who is supposed to be overseeing what goes on would prevent this happening?

Is God willing to prevent Evil, but not able?

Then he is not omnipotent.

Is God able, but not willing?

Then he is malevolent.

Is he both able and willing?

Then whence cometh evil?

Is he neither able nor willing?

Then why call him God?

Exactly. This is why more and more people today start to realise that such religion was started as a fraud or a scam.

If you add in Islam, the wars between both(started by the same God !!) and the way they collect money from the people, the little confession room. A very convincingly planned scheme.

[VincentRJ]

Giving charity (10%) is a compassionate thing.

Some of my Christian family make the offerings directly to worthy recipients.

It's up to the individual.

If an evil person places themselves within the church and cheats parishioners then why denigrate the church?

Acts involving attachment to Greed is performed by individuals.

It has nothing to do with Jesus intent for the Church.

Quote: "If an evil person places themselves within the church and cheats parishioners then why denigrate the church?".

Surely the "all powerful being" who is supposed to be overseeing what goes on would prevent this happening?

Is God willing to prevent Evil, but not able?

Then he is not omnipotent.

Is God able, but not willing?

Then he is malevolent.

Is he both able and willing?

Then whence cometh evil?

Is he neither able nor willing?

Then why call him God?

Exactly. This is why more and more people today start to realise that such religion was started as a fraud or a scam.

If you add in Islam, the wars between both(started by the same God !!) and the way they collect money from the people, the little confession room. A very convincingly planned scheme.

I think you've completely misunderstood the situation, Only1. The people who wrote the scriptures of the current religions, roughly 2 or 3 thousand years ago, could only describe their concepts in terms that they and others understood, according the the knowledge and culture of the times. There's no reason to suppose any intention of fraud.

The story of Genesis is one of empowerment. It's purpose is to instill self confidence in those who subscribed to the religion.

For example, "Then God said, “And now we will make human beings; they will be like us and resemble us. They will have power over the fish, the birds, and all animals, domestic and wild, large and small.”

Imagine the situation of the 'hunter/gatherer' environment. Don't you want to be told that you have 'power over the fish, the birds, and all animals, domestic and wild, large and small'?

In your ignorant state of fear and confusion, about all the things you have no control over and don't understand, such as storms, floods, lightning strikes, attacks from dangerous animals, mysterious diseases and so on, don't you want to hear from your leaders that you have been created in the image of God and therefore have great potential to control your environment and circumstances?

Hopefully, your interest in Buddhism will help you to think more clearly.

[jmccarty]

When i was travelling in India, i was told by some monk that both Jesus and Buddha are avatars of Vishnu, same as Rama, Krishna etc.

The most important similarity between them, IMHO, is that they were against the bigotry of the priests, and their exploitation of their status for material gains.

The fact that religions have been used as an excuse for crimes and wars, is not a proof that the world would be better without religions..

.. And a religious man is not necessarily better than an atheist, and viceversa.

A tour guide told me the same thing about Vishnu and Rama on a bus from New Delhi to the Taj Mahal.

If man is not extinct in another 2,000 years, will Bart Simpson be remembered as a god that took over from earlier barbaric religions mostly forgotten by then?

Ponzi schemes are found out eventually, regardless of what disguise is used.

[only1]

When i was travelling in India, i was told by some monk that both Jesus and Buddha are avatars of Vishnu, same as Rama, Krishna etc.

The most important similarity between them, IMHO, is that they were against the bigotry of the priests, and their exploitation of their status for material gains.

The fact that religions have been used as an excuse for crimes and wars, is not a proof that the world would be better without religions..

.. And a religious man is not necessarily better than an atheist, and viceversa.

A tour guide told me the same thing about Vishnu and Rama on a bus from New Delhi to the Taj Mahal.

If man is not extinct in another 2,000 years, will Bart Simpson be remembered as a god that took over from earlier barbaric religions mostly forgotten by then?

Ponzi schemes are found out eventually, regardless of what disguise is used.

Yes, Hinduism, Taoism and Buddhism all believe in rebirth but he is already a different person.

The Buddha said human's weaknesses are ignorance and desire. As long as there are people, scams will exist. Just like the churches are still doing go business although all people today should know some science.

[only1]

Giving charity (10%) is a compassionate thing.

Some of my Christian family make the offerings directly to worthy recipients.

It's up to the individual.

If an evil person places themselves within the church and cheats parishioners then why denigrate the church?

Acts involving attachment to Greed is performed by individuals.

It has nothing to do with Jesus intent for the Church.

Quote: "If an evil person places themselves within the church and cheats parishioners then why denigrate the church?".

Surely the "all powerful being" who is supposed to be overseeing what goes on would prevent this happening?

Is God willing to prevent Evil, but not able?

Then he is not omnipotent.

Is God able, but not willing?

Then he is malevolent.

Is he both able and willing?

Then whence cometh evil?

Is he neither able nor willing?

Then why call him God?

Exactly. This is why more and more people today start to realise that such religion was started as a fraud or a scam.

If you add in Islam, the wars between both(started by the same God !!) and the way they collect money from the people, the little confession room. A very convincingly planned scheme.

I think you've completely misunderstood the situation, Only1. The people who wrote the scriptures of the current religions, roughly 2 or 3 thousand years ago, could only describe their concepts in terms that they and others understood, according the the knowledge and culture of the times. There's no reason to suppose any intention of fraud.

The story of Genesis is one of empowerment. It's purpose is to instill self confidence in those who subscribed to the religion.

For example, "Then God said, And now we will make human beings; they will be like us and resemble us. They will have power over the fish, the birds, and all animals, domestic and wild, large and small.

Imagine the situation of the 'hunter/gatherer' environment. Don't you want to be told that you have 'power over the fish, the birds, and all animals, domestic and wild, large and small'?

In your ignorant state of fear and confusion, about all the things you have no control over and don't understand, such as storms, floods, lightning strikes, attacks from dangerous animals, mysterious diseases and so on, don't you want to hear from your leaders that you have been created in the image of God and therefore have great potential to control your environment and circumstances?

Hopefully, your interest in Buddhism will help you to think more clearly.

If that is the case, it wasn't a fraud in the past but a fraud today since the pastors and church operators could not be so ignorant. It all boils down to ignorance and greed(desire).

[Gandonsi]

So because Jesus shared some of the same ideals as Buddha, he was a copy despite historical evidence of his existence? Then isn't Buddha simply a copy of Confucius who first came up with the golden rule? Maybe Confucius is also a copy of someone prior who was either never recorded or whose records were lost? No, nonsense. These people all existed.

Perhaps realize that good ideals are universal because we as humans share the same pattern of thought. Or perhaps, and it wouldn't be far-fetching, Jesus did actually go to India during those years not recorded in The Bible and learnt of Buddha and perhaps even Confucius? At the same time, the Old Testament already contains passages including one that says "love thy neighbour" so perhaps Jesus simply took the good from the Old Testament and worked on that?

I'm certainly of the theory that Jesus was a revolutionist, trying to change a religion he was dissatisfied with and make the focus back on God, love and forgiveness rather than meaningless rituals and petty man-made laws. If Jesus did came back, I'm sure he would be doing the same as he once did before because Christianity has become like the Pharisee movement especially with the whole hierarchy of priests. History repeats itself apparently.

As for God, why is a god required to do anything other than watch and instruct us? The instruction has been given, it is humanity who continues to choose, with their free will, to follow selfish desires and start wars. If humanity destroys itself then it will only have itself to blame.

It's not difficult to find out who is who in a religious forum.
Those of you who behaved like don't understand what I am saying, be honest. Watch out on karma.
Do you need 10% from everyone's income ?
Other religions never asked for that much.
Where the money goes?
Why passing the money bag instead of using a stationed box like Buddhism or Chinese temples ?
Need me to elaborate more ?

Yeah Buddhism is perfect then? Punishing people apparently for their misdeeds in a prior existence? Condemning them to the "great nothingness" if they don't reach enlightenment in the cycle of life, their goodness not mattering in the end? You yourself seem to have a lot of hatred and intolerance towards Christians and Muslims. Isn't Buddhism suppose to teach you to be at peace and love everyone? And doesn't Buddhism have the same money corruption problem in Thailand as the Church does world-wide?

You're not perfect either.

The truth is that religion isn't to blame, people are and people will use religion for their own gain. Take religion away and they will find something else that is an ideology be it secular or something else. Atheistic ideologies are no exception. Communism has killed more than any religion and it itself was a political ideology that was actually atheist, requiring the oppression and eventual destruction of religion to fulfil Karl Marx's ideology. This is why communist states banned the practices of religions and ironically, these atheist communist states ended up having little rights for humans, took away free speech and ended up killing more people than any religion has done in but a century alone.

What we have from history is proof that humans are evil and will use any ideology to get their way, atheists were no exception. Just as we have religious tyrants, we also have atheist tyrants such as Kim Jong Un who has his own people worship him and before you say anything, North Korea's government even defines itself as "officially atheist."

Edited September 24, 2015 by Gandonsi

[luk AJ]

[only1]

So because Jesus shared some of the same ideals as Buddha, he was a copy despite historical evidence of his existence? Then isn't Buddha simply a copy of Confucius who first came up with the golden rule? Maybe Confucius is also a copy of someone prior who was either never recorded or whose records were lost? No, nonsense. These people all existed.

[/b][/font][/color]

Are you spinning ? Refer to my TS, the evidence of copy is not on ideals or existence. If God truly sent him, do god need to create him with all those similarities as the Buddha as stated in my TS ? It's clearly a fraud. He tried to rebel by creating fake claims, got caught and put to death; is a more convincing story. It explains all the logic-defying claims too.

You are right to trace back everything. In fact, the big flood of the Abrahamic religion was copied from Hinduism, which is a much older religion.

The Jews are known to be intelligent people. They created the one God and creator concept. Christianity and Islam are their offshots and betrayed them. Yes, this is karma.

Buddha did not choppy from others, those similarities are there in nature. He merely discovered the explanation which no one did before him.

As for your other parts of your comment, I will continue other time. Your comments on karma and Buddhism beliefs are very wrong.

Meanwhile, remember honesty is the best policy.

Edited September 24, 2015 by only1