Soldiers ‘Politely’ Stalk Pheu Thai Politician

[Fat Haggis]

Its not rumours is it , they have admitted visiting his home. Does not matter what was said having people from the army turning up at your house to talk to you , would be intimidating in itself

Only, ..... If you have something to hide.. Why did he not record the meeting.. I record all meetings. Its normal for someone like this ex-MP to do so.! PTP.... lies and more lies.. not one honest MP amongst them...

Hey mate, check out your own grammatical issues before trying to slag me off, you're giving us Scots a bad name!!

[robblok]

Thick as a block if you dont acknowledge this is intimidation by the junta

I get intimidated by police and military, but someone as powerful and connected like this guy.. afraid for the military after a few questions. I highly doubt it, a nuisance at most and for intimidation there needs to be fear. This guy just uses it for PR.

However well this guy may be connected, and not have to feel intimidated, is all well and beside the point. Junta fanboys will no doubt feel that having armed soldiers following people around and visiting their houses is all for the good of the people. Just like when they arrested 14 students due to their connections to certain political groups. "We'll trace their cell phone calls"! Oh yeah, and how did that go? I don't remember this yielding any conclusive connections to anyone, and I'm sure the Junta would have been keen to expose anything they found. Thats what I call intimidation and squashing of rights, just as this here situation is as well.

Before anyone tries to label me in their monochrome system, I am not a Thaksin supporter either so think again!

It is not besides the point if you call it intimidation, for that there has to be fear. That this is a nuisance and breach of privacy I agree, I just don't agree its intimidation. I think the guy might even be happy, as its good PR for him and bad for the junta. I think he is using it to his advantage and its certainly is not intimidation. A nuisance YES, breach of privacy Yes. Not a good thing just not intimidation.

You make the fatal mistake of basing your own interpretation of what it means to be intimidated. Intimidation doesn't need to involve fear,intimidated to me means uncertain outcomes of a situation you are placed in unnecessary against your will.

If the Cops kept stopping you at home for no apparent reason or without just cause and appeared randomly it's harassment and intimidation.

As for the rank of these soldiers, it matters not, as the Army already admitted they were there to "have a chat with him" they were under orders to do it, have a friendly chat can take place over a phone call.

You also seem to forget that this has been happening since he applied to travel overseas, and was rejected.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/intimidate

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/intimidate

Not my interpretation but that of a dictionary.

[Fat Haggis]

Thick as a block if you dont acknowledge this is intimidation by the junta

I get intimidated by police and military, but someone as powerful and connected like this guy.. afraid for the military after a few questions. I highly doubt it, a nuisance at most and for intimidation there needs to be fear. This guy just uses it for PR.

However well this guy may be connected, and not have to feel intimidated, is all well and beside the point. Junta fanboys will no doubt feel that having armed soldiers following people around and visiting their houses is all for the good of the people. Just like when they arrested 14 students due to their connections to certain political groups. "We'll trace their cell phone calls"! Oh yeah, and how did that go? I don't remember this yielding any conclusive connections to anyone, and I'm sure the Junta would have been keen to expose anything they found. Thats what I call intimidation and squashing of rights, just as this here situation is as well.

Before anyone tries to label me in their monochrome system, I am not a Thaksin supporter either so think again!

It is not besides the point if you call it intimidation, for that there has to be fear. That this is a nuisance and breach of privacy I agree, I just don't agree its intimidation. I think the guy might even be happy, as its good PR for him and bad for the junta. I think he is using it to his advantage and its certainly is not intimidation. A nuisance YES, breach of privacy Yes. Not a good thing just not intimidation.

You make the fatal mistake of basing your own interpretation of what it means to be intimidated. Intimidation doesn't need to involve fear,intimidated to me means uncertain outcomes of a situation you are placed in unnecessary against your will.

If the Cops kept stopping you at home for no apparent reason or without just cause and appeared randomly it's harassment and intimidation.

As for the rank of these soldiers, it matters not, as the Army already admitted they were there to "have a chat with him" they were under orders to do it, have a friendly chat can take place over a phone call.

You also seem to forget that this has been happening since he applied to travel overseas, and was rejected.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/intimidate

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/intimidate

Not my interpretation but that of a dictionary.

Yep, look up the same dictionary definitions of JUSTICE and then tell me it's exactly they way it's done in Thailand !!

And considering soldiers have enforced article 44 and have arrested people without police being present, I'd say that being shadowed 24/7 by a power hungry junta warrants the words intimidated

Edited August 15, 2015 by Fat Haggis

[robblok]

Thick as a block if you dont acknowledge this is intimidation by the junta

I get intimidated by police and military, but someone as powerful and connected like this guy.. afraid for the military after a few questions. I highly doubt it, a nuisance at most and for intimidation there needs to be fear. This guy just uses it for PR.

However well this guy may be connected, and not have to feel intimidated, is all well and beside the point. Junta fanboys will no doubt feel that having armed soldiers following people around and visiting their houses is all for the good of the people. Just like when they arrested 14 students due to their connections to certain political groups. "We'll trace their cell phone calls"! Oh yeah, and how did that go? I don't remember this yielding any conclusive connections to anyone, and I'm sure the Junta would have been keen to expose anything they found. Thats what I call intimidation and squashing of rights, just as this here situation is as well.

Before anyone tries to label me in their monochrome system, I am not a Thaksin supporter either so think again!

It is not besides the point if you call it intimidation, for that there has to be fear. That this is a nuisance and breach of privacy I agree, I just don't agree its intimidation. I think the guy might even be happy, as its good PR for him and bad for the junta. I think he is using it to his advantage and its certainly is not intimidation. A nuisance YES, breach of privacy Yes. Not a good thing just not intimidation.

You make the fatal mistake of basing your own interpretation of what it means to be intimidated. Intimidation doesn't need to involve fear,intimidated to me means uncertain outcomes of a situation you are placed in unnecessary against your will.

If the Cops kept stopping you at home for no apparent reason or without just cause and appeared randomly it's harassment and intimidation.

As for the rank of these soldiers, it matters not, as the Army already admitted they were there to "have a chat with him" they were under orders to do it, have a friendly chat can take place over a phone call.

You also seem to forget that this has been happening since he applied to travel overseas, and was rejected.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/intimidate

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/intimidate

Not my interpretation but that of a dictionary.

Yep, look up the same dictionary definitions of JUSTICE and then tell me it's exactly they way it's done in Thailand !!

And considering soldiers have enforced article 44 and have arrested people without police being present, I'd say that being shadowed 24/7 by a power hungry junta warrants the words intimidated

Haggis

Am I right or wrong, it states fear for there to be intimidation. I would say if it was a farmer or someone else of low standing sure. But not a powerful politician no fear there.

I never said its right, just don't see how it warrants the label intimidation. Nuisance, Illegal, annoying.

Just not intimidation, if a security guard stops me every day I will get bored annoyed ect but no fear, if the police or the army does it I will get afraid and see it as intimidation as I am powerless against them.

I just don't think this guy is afraid he is wealthy, he has power.

[Fat Haggis]

So you don't find the army admitting to stalking this guy for "chats" highly irregular and wrong?

Yes your right by your definitions of intimidation

But what this guys gets regularly rich and powerful or not , he gets subjected to some of the things described below

intimidation

ɪnˌtɪmɪˈdeɪʃn/

noun

the action of intimidating someone, or the state of being intimidated.

"the intimidation of witnesses and jurors"

synonyms: frightening, menacing, terrifying, scaring, alarming, terrorization, terrorizing, cowing, subduing, daunting, unnerving; threatening, domineering, browbeating, bullying, pressuring, pressurizing, pressurization, coercion, harassment, harrying, hounding, tormenting, plaguing; tyrannization, persecution, oppression; informalstrong-arm tactics, arm-twisting, bulldozing, steamrollering, railroading

"there had been blatant intimidation of witnesses"

[robblok]

So you don't find the army admitting to stalking this guy for "chats" highly irregular and wrong?

Yes your right by your definitions of intimidation

But what this guys gets regularly rich and powerful or not , he gets subjected to some of the things described below

intimidation

ɪnˌtɪmɪˈdeɪʃn/

noun

the action of intimidating someone, or the state of being intimidated.

"the intimidation of witnesses and jurors"

synonyms: frightening, menacing, terrifying, scaring, alarming, terrorization, terrorizing, cowing, subduing, daunting, unnerving; threatening, domineering, browbeating, bullying, pressuring, pressurizing, pressurization, coercion, harassment, harrying, hounding, tormenting, plaguing; tyrannization, persecution, oppression; informalstrong-arm tactics, arm-twisting, bulldozing, steamrollering, railroading

"there had been blatant intimidation of witnesses"

I find it wrong and irregular, but look they all start with fear. Not my definition also yours that you just post. Just don't label it as intimidation. I would the moment it was someone different without the backing he has the power and money he has. Now i see it as annoying and a good way for him to discredit the junta but I doubt he is afraid (harassed maybe ) though it seems to happen only a few times not every day. Below from webster.. thought it was a famous English dictionary

Full Definition of INTIMIDATE

transitive verb

: to make timid or fearful : frighten; especially : to compel or deter by or as if by threats <tried tointimidate a witness>

[Linky]

Intimidation is for the receiver to determine. What may not be intimidating or offencive to you and me is not a concern. If he feels he is intimidated then he is intimidated.

I dont care how high ranking he is, his money etc will cut no sway if the junta decides it wants to take him away and do whatever they want with him.

It is pure intimidation, nothing less.

[noosard]

Politely stalked

Now is that an oxymoron

[mikemac]

Politely stalked

Now is that an oxymoron

I was thinking "How do you politely stalk someone" ? Do you say sorry every time they notice you are following them?

And how did this even become a story ?

If the slimy Wattana Muengsuk came out and said the soldiers had politely pulled his fingernails out, then that's a story !

[Baerboxer]

If this is in any way true it displays the arrogance of the junta in thinking they can come out with any BS and it will be believed.

If the soldiers were there to have a polite chat then why didn't they and as Idiablo pointed out someone of rank would have been sent to ' chat ' as they would carry some authority. Beyond this following someone around in this fashion isn't even surveillance as the object of such is usually not to be seen but making sure someone knows you are there is making a point and it's intimidation.

Fair comment. As you say we don't know the circumstances, or what rank those soldiers actually are.

Are people under observation? If so by what division, what levels etc. Or were these two squaddies told to keep a watch on him who he invited in for a cup of tea.

Unfortunately PTP members have a known propensity for lying and being very economical with the truth - 'crying wolf" effect. And the Military aren't exactly subtle, even when trying to be polite.

So what is his point in releasing this - garner some international support, get the people feeling sympathy for him or showing this is moving towards a police state?

[Baerboxer]

Intimidation is for the receiver to determine. What may not be intimidating or offencive to you and me is not a concern. If he feels he is intimidated then he is intimidated.

I dont care how high ranking he is, his money etc will cut no sway if the junta decides it wants to take him away and do whatever they want with him.

It is pure intimidation, nothing less.

Real intimidation would have been just that - making him disappear or an extra judicial execution. Like so many others have this century.

[phoenixdoglover]

Read the article again. But when you get to the part where the army guy is explaining what they were doing, imagine a thick Brooklyn accent.

Yo, Vinnie! Why don't you's guys have a little conversation wit' dat guy? Take Moose wit ya.

Edited August 15, 2015 by phoenixdoglover

[Baerboxer]

Does anybody think their own country's governments don't do similar? May be not be the military but the security services. UK it's Special Branch or MI5. GCHQ listen in and monitor etc etc.

Human rights, conventions, international treaties - all governments ignore them whenever it suits. The difference is that because of more freedom of and access of information now people here of it more.

People in the UK have less real freedoms than they did 30-50 years ago. And all for our protection and safe keeping!

This all seems a strange story - but anything connected with politicians here usually does.

[phoenixdoglover]

Does anybody think their own country's governments don't do similar? May be not be the military but the security services. UK it's Special Branch or MI5. GCHQ listen in and monitor etc etc.

Human rights, conventions, international treaties - all governments ignore them whenever it suits. The difference is that because of more freedom of and access of information now people here of it more.

People in the UK have less real freedoms than they did 30-50 years ago. And all for our protection and safe keeping!

This all seems a strange story - but anything connected with politicians here usually does.

Two wrongs don't make a right.

The "yeah, but other countries do it" argument is weak, weak, weak.

And to answer your question: No, in my country army soldiers do not follow civilians around just to have a little talk with them.

Edited August 15, 2015 by phoenixdoglover

[Rykbanlor]

Politely stalked

Now is that an oxymoron

I was thinking "How do you politely stalk someone" ? Do you say sorry every time they notice you are following them?

And how did this even become a story ?

If the slimy Wattana Muengsuk came out and said the soldiers had politely pulled his fingernails out, then that's a story !

Sting and Michael Jackson may lead the way, if not in Polite stalking, certainly poetic. (Bilie Jean/Every breath you take).

I wonder after the polite stalking if there will be any more polite detentions, or some civil interrogation. Maybe just some gentle harrassment.

[Fat Haggis]

So you don't find the army admitting to stalking this guy for "chats" highly irregular and wrong?

Yes your right by your definitions of intimidation

But what this guys gets regularly rich and powerful or not , he gets subjected to some of the things described below

intimidation

ɪnˌtɪmɪˈdeɪʃn/

noun

the action of intimidating someone, or the state of being intimidated.

"the intimidation of witnesses and jurors"

synonyms: frightening, menacing, terrifying, scaring, alarming, terrorization, terrorizing, cowing, subduing, daunting, unnerving; threatening, domineering, browbeating, bullying, pressuring, pressurizing, pressurization, coercion, harassment, harrying, hounding, tormenting, plaguing; tyrannization, persecution, oppression; informalstrong-arm tactics, arm-twisting, bulldozing, steamrollering, railroading

"there had been blatant intimidation of witnesses"

I find it wrong and irregular, but look they all start with fear. Not my definition also yours that you just post. Just don't label it as intimidation. I would the moment it was someone different without the backing he has the power and money he has. Now i see it as annoying and a good way for him to discredit the junta but I doubt he is afraid (harassed maybe ) though it seems to happen only a few times not every day. Below from webster.. thought it was a famous English dictionary

Full Definition of INTIMIDATE

transitive verb

: to make timid or fearful : frighten; especially : to compel or deter by or as if by threats <tried tointimidate a witness>

You do realise Rob, that to feel intimidated it doesn't have to be in order as per any definition? It's not a sequence of acts that makes up a definition, it has multiple components, fear/fearing is but one of them

[oneday]

"...the soldiers were merely making conversation with Wattana and ensuring he was safe..."

“...It was an effort to engage in conversation, exchange opinions and coordinate information...”

Wow! They sure know how to spin a good tale.

[metisdead]

Some inflammatory posts have been removed.

[Spleen]

Its not rumours is it , they have admitted visiting his home. Does not matter what was said having people from the army turning up at your house to talk to you , would be intimidating in itself

Only, ..... If you have something to hide.. Why did he not record the meeting.. I record all meetings. Its normal for someone like this ex-MP to do so.! PTP.... lies and more lies.. not one honest MP amongst them...

, you wouldn't be nervous if soldiers of a military Junta who can intern you for as long as they like without reason or trial came to your house ?

Edited August 15, 2015 by Spleen

[roamer]

i'm finding it increasingly easy to believe that a copy of the Stasi handbook has been translated from German to Thai....

[Baerboxer]

Does anybody think their own country's governments don't do similar? May be not be the military but the security services. UK it's Special Branch or MI5. GCHQ listen in and monitor etc etc.

Human rights, conventions, international treaties - all governments ignore them whenever it suits. The difference is that because of more freedom of and access of information now people here of it more.

People in the UK have less real freedoms than they did 30-50 years ago. And all for our protection and safe keeping!

This all seems a strange story - but anything connected with politicians here usually does.

Two wrongs don't make a right.

The "yeah, but other countries do it" argument is weak, weak, weak.

And to answer your question: No, in my country army soldiers do not follow civilians around just to have a little talk with them.

Read what I posted. Slowly and try and think, without the constraint of a box imposed by your agenda.

Soldiers don't follow civilians in my country either, well apart from Military Intelligence sometimes. But MI5 and Special Branch do and people do get pulled in for "friendly chats".

I didn't say other countries do it so it's o k - that's your convenient invention and misconstrue.

I make the point that all countries do it, some more than others, so clowns who pretend it only happens because of the Junta are living in a fools paradise.

[Baerboxer]

i'm finding it increasingly easy to believe that a copy of the Stasi handbook has been translated from German to Thai....

Are you from the DDR? Do you actually have any experience of the Stasi or any idea of how the trained their operatives?

[callaway]

Maybe he recognised it as intimidation as he surely used this tactic to further his own course while in power. How the world turns. Som nom na

[peteski1]

Intimidation, by definition (as stated here) includes the "feeling" of fear.

"Fear" an emotion, subjective ... unknown and potentially negative outcomes

"Fear" an emotion, objective based on negative past experiences

If a person states that they "felt" fear then it is entirely their ownership ... nothing for anyone else to argue against.

No different than any other emotion, thought, opinion etc... to each his/her own.

Any argument against a person's legitimate sense of fear is by logic, shear conjecture

If a person says that they "felt" intimidated" there is no logical argument to prove their "feelings" are otherwise

Were a person present and witness to the incident they may observe otherwise that the person in question "showed no fear" yet again, the truth in all cases is that regardless of what might emotions appear to be on the surface, the truth of what is felt lies solely with the owner of said feelings.

[robblok]

So you don't find the army admitting to stalking this guy for "chats" highly irregular and wrong?

Yes your right by your definitions of intimidation

But what this guys gets regularly rich and powerful or not , he gets subjected to some of the things described below

intimidation

ɪnˌtɪmɪˈdeɪʃn/

noun

the action of intimidating someone, or the state of being intimidated.

"the intimidation of witnesses and jurors"

synonyms: frightening, menacing, terrifying, scaring, alarming, terrorization, terrorizing, cowing, subduing, daunting, unnerving; threatening, domineering, browbeating, bullying, pressuring, pressurizing, pressurization, coercion, harassment, harrying, hounding, tormenting, plaguing; tyrannization, persecution, oppression; informalstrong-arm tactics, arm-twisting, bulldozing, steamrollering, railroading

"there had been blatant intimidation of witnesses"

I find it wrong and irregular, but look they all start with fear. Not my definition also yours that you just post. Just don't label it as intimidation. I would the moment it was someone different without the backing he has the power and money he has. Now i see it as annoying and a good way for him to discredit the junta but I doubt he is afraid (harassed maybe ) though it seems to happen only a few times not every day. Below from webster.. thought it was a famous English dictionary

Full Definition of INTIMIDATE

transitive verb

: to make timid or fearful : frighten; especially : to compel or deter by or as if by threats <tried tointimidate a witness>

You do realise Rob, that to feel intimidated it doesn't have to be in order as per any definition? It's not a sequence of acts that makes up a definition, it has multiple components, fear/fearing is but one of them

Fear is the most important one in intimidation else it would not be mentioned first in almost all descriptions. You do realize that too don't you.

[phoenixdoglover]

Does anybody think their own country's governments don't do similar? May be not be the military but the security services. UK it's Special Branch or MI5. GCHQ listen in and monitor etc etc.

Human rights, conventions, international treaties - all governments ignore them whenever it suits. The difference is that because of more freedom of and access of information now people here of it more.

People in the UK have less real freedoms than they did 30-50 years ago. And all for our protection and safe keeping!

This all seems a strange story - but anything connected with politicians here usually does.

Two wrongs don't make a right.

The "yeah, but other countries do it" argument is weak, weak, weak.

And to answer your question: No, in my country army soldiers do not follow civilians around just to have a little talk with them.

Read what I posted. Slowly and try and think, without the constraint of a box imposed by your agenda.

Soldiers don't follow civilians in my country either, well apart from Military Intelligence sometimes. But MI5 and Special Branch do and people do get pulled in for "friendly chats".

I didn't say other countries do it so it's o k - that's your convenient invention and misconstrue.

I make the point that all countries do it, some more than others, so clowns who pretend it only happens because of the Junta are living in a fools paradise.

I see. So the situation in Thailand is similar to what happens in other countries, except it's not. I accept that argument, as weak as it is.

Maybe you could dig your way out by finishing the following sentence: "I pointed out that this sort of thing happens in other countries, because....."

By the way, you referred to clowns who pretend it only happens because of the Junta . Do you have any examples of that being said in this thread? I think the point being made is that it IS happening and it is wrong. Do you think it is wrong?

Edited August 16, 2015 by phoenixdoglover

[metisdead]

A nonsense trolling post has been removed as well as a reply. An inflammatory post was removed as well.