'Defrauded by my wife and criminals in Thailand' - BBC special report

[MaeJoMTB]

People make mistakes and we don't know the whole story and situation as not much was said about it. Also people can fall out of love. But it seems mighty odd behavior for someone to birth three children for a man and live with him for 10 years if she did not have some feelings for him.

No,it's entirely normal.

Women breed when the urge takes them, where the sperm comes from usually doesn't matter.

I have 4 children with my first English wife ....... who hated me.

Another child with a Thai lady ....... who cares nothing for me.

The first wife did it for the lifestyle I could provide.

The second one wanted white skinned babies.

You clearly don't understand women.

Edited September 20, 2015 by MaeJoMTB

[Laughing Gravy]

criminal energy is not only in Thailand, happened around the world

Yes we know but this is a Thai Forum and the fake smile and everyone is Jaidee, is absolute rubbish. At least I know many people and nationalities in the west are bad and untrustworthy. But even the current people in power (as before) always say publically that a Thai could never do that.

Here is the low down. Some Thai people like any other nationality are not always genuine and even bad. Just admit it. There are bad people in the world, everywhere.

[thaibeachlovers]

IMO odd only to someone from a western culture brought up with fanciful notions of everlasting love and romance.

You may want to reread the post, your reading comprehension fails you at the moment.

I thought I was pointing out that some cultures do not put any emphasis on "love" or "feelings" as a factor in having children and staying with someone for years.

Sorry if I did not make that clear.

[MaeJoMTB]

IMO odd only to someone from a western culture brought up with fanciful notions of everlasting love and romance.

You may want to reread the post, your reading comprehension fails you at the moment.

I thought I was pointing out that some cultures do not put any emphasis on "love" or "feelings" as a factor in having children and staying with someone for years.

Sorry if I did not make that clear.

I agree,

In most of the world marriage and children are a business agreement.

Nothing to do with love or even liking each other.

The western world, is in the minority, but I suspect only from the western male point of view.

To many western women, it's still business.

[thaibeachlovers]

IMO odd only to someone from a western culture brought up with fanciful notions of everlasting love and romance.

You may want to reread the post, your reading comprehension fails you at the moment.

I thought I was pointing out that some cultures do not put any emphasis on "love" or "feelings" as a factor in having children and staying with someone for years.

Sorry if I did not make that clear.

I agree,

In most of the world marriage and children are a business agreement.

Nothing to do with love or even liking each other.

The western world, is in the minority, but I suspect only from the western male point of view.

To many western women, it's still business.

When I worked in Saudi, an Egyptian nurse went home on holiday and was introduced to her fiancé- she had no say in the matter.

[springheeled jack]

I do feel sympathy for this man taken to the cleaners by his wife of 9 years must have been quite a shock but unfortunately it happens all too often he is just another statistic another victim of a greedy woman.

[Morakot]

The house looked like a bog standard 'Bangkok mansion' style, no way would it have cost 10 mil. Looks like the wife was on the make from the 'get go'

Little you seem to know about Phuket.

Edited September 20, 2015 by Morakot

[Morakot]

It is irrelevant what age or weight this man is.

The point is that as the wife has been jailed for fraud yet those who facilitated said remain untouched!

Absolutely!

Even more shocking is that despite judicial pronouncement of a fraudulent transaction, it seems impossible to recover the property.

Edited September 20, 2015 by Morakot

[Straight8]

It does hapen in other countries, Paul MacCartney, look what happened to him. Any country where farangs go and marry girls half their age it's bound to happen.

The biggest scam currently in the UK is where the funds are transferred to a solicitor to buy a house are intercepted by criminals and transferred to another account, it's not the banks fault so people are losing thousands.

Pretty shocked when I found out Paul was taken for such a huge amount.

Wonder how he will manage to survive on his remaining 3 billion USD.

[icare999]

dont try and get around the law by using company purchase and proxy. You can legally own condos so if you dont trust them issues do that. Sorry he's obviously a nice guy but he was acting illegally to get over land ownership laws here and so suffered the consequences. I got over that problem long long ago by simply putting everything 100% in my wife's name. Maybe im lucky after 30+ years here.

Woman got caught in loan sharks hands probably due to gambling and so while I'm not making excuses for her she was probably totally desperate.

What i nor my This wife can ever understand is how a mother as here they often do dont care for theirs own kids one bit.

He must have known it was illegal to own land and so has himself to blame.

[icare999]

Yeah..

And here is a big "boo" to all those tv members who insist that thai law will divide property fairly, when things go astray. Your moeny is gone to debts to money lenders without your knowledge. Even this guy thought he was safe, but his wife simply forged his name and he was taken off as a "director/share holder"...etc.

If you have a wife like this, she has moneylenders that will sap off the equity. If you have legal "rights", good luck in the long, tedious process of court hearings/adjournments and translators. A bad wife with debts to money lenders will allow them to suck you dry..without you knowing anything...until it is too late.

rent...for goodness sakes, and avoid this altogether. If you die, leave the money you save by not purchasing property to your family...they can buy a home on their own.

People pushing property here on TV are part of the problem. Legal recourse........lol (no such animal)

well I'm glad after 30+ years i did not take this sort of advise and yes my wife was half my age when we married. If you cant trust your wife dont marry. Its true a lot get scammed but just as many have wonderful marriages and many when they split theirs no stealing or conning.

[Alan poole]

Wonder how he will manage to survive on his remaining 3 billion USD.

All you need is love, is all you need

[Alan poole]

here's plenty more rules. These are probably the essential ones. Please reply if you can think of more and I'll include them in the book.

Never get into political discussions with Thais, even with your SO. If you are ever asked about your political opinions in re Thailand, simply smile and say you don't know enough about it to have an opinion (even though you probably know more about it than whoever is asking for your views).

Never believe anything anyone tells you, Thai or farang, unless/until you can verify that what you've been told is true.

Don't keep money in Thailand. Pay the exorbitant ATM fees - just think of it as insurance.

Don't get inebriated to the point that you can't fend for yourself.

Internalize the fact that even very wealthy/successful Thais are generally not very well-educated in terms of understanding even the history of their own country, science and mathematics, etc., much less the history of other countries, or even basic logical reasoning. Do not get hung up on illogical behavior you observe; it is what it is, and you aren't going to 'educate' anyone.

Minimize your interaction with officialdom.

Never drive anywhere, never purchase a vehicle. Take public transportation when you can, use taxis or hired cars/drivers when that isn't an option.

If you speak/read Thai, never let on that you understand what Thais are saying/reading/writing. Cultivate a poker-face. This applies both to random Thais with whom you interact, your SO, and (especially) officialdom.

Never tell anyone, including your SO, how much money you have/make, where your money is located, etc. If you have to prove an income for a retirement visa or proof of sufficient funds for visiting, have a throwaway bank account you can use only for those purposes, completely apart from any bank accounts where your main income is stored. Use a completely different bank for this purpose.

If you are in a serious relationship with a Thai, and you're so inclined, do set up a life insurance policy, will, etc. But do not tell the intended beneficiaries that you have done this; arrange it so that if you pass away, they will be contacted and will receive the benefits at that point in time, with no incentive to arrange your premature death.

Have at least one trusted family member, friend, or lawyer outside Thailand who is an emergency contact with power of attorney to make decisions on your behalf in the event you become disabled to the point where you are unable to do so yourself. Do not ever grant this kind of power over your affairs to any Thai (even a Thai attorney) or local farang, under any circumstances.

Make appointments at least an hour in advance of when you actually expect the meeting to take place; be prepared for the odd Thai who will show up on time, but don't ever expect them to show up at the appointed time.

Have both an air and an overland escape plan; ensure you have all the necessary visas to execute this escape plan. Have at least one additional form of official ID from your country of origin in case your passport is lost, damaged, stolen, or confiscated.

Stock up on nonperishable food and drinking water. Have at least one month's supply of each on hand at all times, replenish as needed.

Do not get involved in any sort of business venture with Thais or with local farangs, ever.

Even though you see Thais breaking the law every day, in every way, do your best to adhere to the letter of the law.

Avoid situations in which you might be likely to need law enforcement assistance, because you won't get it (or, alternately, you'll get it good and hard). If you must fill out a police report for something like a lost/stolen passport, never volunteer any information beyond the bare minimum.

Carry at all times a laminated, full-size, high-resolution reproductions of the personal information section of your passport, and your current visa or visa-waiver stamp.

Never gamble, bet, or play games of chance with Thais or local farangs, even if it's stated that no money is changing hands. Avoid any area in which Thais or local farangs are doing so.

Great post I'm with you on everything but the drivng- no Thai is ever going to drive me if I can help it

[icare999]

All I can say is be careful. There are a lot of older "gentlemen" on this very forum who like to preach to mostly younger crowd how Thailand is not cheap and how you need a lot of money to live here. The truth is Thailand is extremely cheap and anyone telling you otherwise is probably being ripped off by their wife and family.

total BS yes Thailand can be cheap but if you want to live a western life style, have your children well educated in a top international school it can be more expensive than UK. School fees for our 2 children was over 800,000 a year. My medical costs (no i dont have insurance and cant) has run into ,millions of baht over last 10 years( free in Uk). Trues we have a maid and gardener which we could not afford in UK and live very high standard with out electricity bill being ask much as many earn here. Yes it can be cheap if you want to I've like a This but some of us prefer to live a good life. MArried to a this girl over 30 years who was half my age and long ago i decided to put all in her name.

So many bitter people here and os many I've met. Sad people all of them. Old saying better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all. MOney does not matter at all if your going to end up bitter untrusting and so pathetic and sad you need to use prostitutes and as many advocate rent your wife. Pathetic

[taxin]

You have got to be kidding, I know many personally who have lost their lot and many more stories that I have heard many times over from others on casual meetings. It goes on and on all the time and it never ceases to amaze me that some very otherwise intelligent and successful businessmen seem to leave their collective wit at the airport locker room and do everything different here in Thailand. You really have NO RIGHTS here, get use to it, be prepared to lose the lot if you want invest put your money into Thailand. Up to you how you play your game, I will play mine my way, that way I stay in control all the time, they can't get my house/condo/lease/shares if I don't have any.

No im not kidding, I have never met or know anyone who has met a farang who had a Thai wife forge his signature to sell any property. Farangs buying property and "gifting" it to a Thai GF who then dumps the farang yes, but this is not illegal and does not require the Thai GF to seek the help of crooked lawyers to forge any signatures.

One interesting link with regards to the Colin Vard and Ian Vance stories, despite both of them being married with children the "family" properties were kept well away from the wife and held by a company 100% controlled by the farang (or at least they thought so). It makes you ask the question, would we be hearing about these stories if the farang simply put the house in the wifes name ?

Look at the resulting scenario we have by the farang choosing not to do this. The relationship already starts off badly with the wife losing face by being told she cant be trusted and that the property will be kept out of her reach. The wife who is not getting any younger is then asked to give up her life by raising 3 of the farangs children, the mother having zero financial security knowing that the properties will never be hers, she has to live with the fact that one day he could dump her and the 3 kids for a younger model, leaving her with nothing. In other words what they are basically proposing to the wife is "you can marry me, live in my house and spend the next XX years of your life raising my children and doing my laundry, but dont expect anything for it !".

Could Colin and Ian's decision not to give the mothers any long term security be a contributing factor in what they did ?

I'm by no means making excuses for these ladies, but it could be seen as a motive.

[Whyamiandwhatamidoinghere]

I don't understand why men come here in their golden years to marry a woman young enough to be their grand daughter, who will most likely outlive them. Give her kids that you will never see graduate from university nor see them have your grandchildren. THEN... left to find their way in a dangerous world, without a father's love nor guidance. How are you any better than a Thai man that leaves his wife and kids to make a new family? Oh I forgot they will have more stuff...

I didn't come to paradise to find a Mrs. Whyamiandwhatamidoinghere. The visions I had about paradise had me on a beautiful beach with two tall tropical drinks, with those little umbrellas on top, in each hand. TWO beautiful naturally tan girls, with long shinny blue black hair, under each arm feeding me anything I want and another two beauties on standby. A carefree retirement with less drama as possible. I don't bring sand to a beach nor take it home. This is paradise.... Try to remember that and there is no way you'll be defrauded and left broke.

Edited September 20, 2015 by Whyamiandwhatamidoinghere

[slipperx]

You have got to be kidding, I know many personally who have lost their lot and many more stories that I have heard many times over from others on casual meetings. It goes on and on all the time and it never ceases to amaze me that some very otherwise intelligent and successful businessmen seem to leave their collective wit at the airport locker room and do everything different here in Thailand. You really have NO RIGHTS here, get use to it, be prepared to lose the lot if you want invest put your money into Thailand. Up to you how you play your game, I will play mine my way, that way I stay in control all the time, they can't get my house/condo/lease/shares if I don't have any.

No im not kidding, I have never met or know anyone who has met a farang who had a Thai wife forge his signature to sell any property. Farangs buying property and "gifting" it to a Thai GF who then dumps the farang yes, but this is not illegal and does not require the Thai GF to seek the help of crooked lawyers to forge any signatures.

One interesting link with regards to the Colin Vard and Ian Vance stories, despite both of them being married with children the "family" properties were kept well away from the wife and held by a company 100% controlled by the farang (or at least they thought so). It makes you ask the question, would we be hearing about these stories if the farang simply put the house in the wifes name ?

Look at the resulting scenario we have by the farang choosing not to do this. The relationship already starts off badly with the wife losing face by being told she cant be trusted and that the property will be kept out of her reach. The wife who is not getting any younger is then asked to give up her life by raising 3 of the farangs children, the mother having zero financial security knowing that the properties will never be hers, she has to live with the fact that one day he could dump her and the 3 kids for a younger model, leaving her with nothing. In other words what they are basically proposing to the wife is "you can marry me, live in my house and spend the next XX years of your life raising my children and doing my laundry, but dont expect anything for it !".

Could Colin and Ian's decision not to give the mothers any long term security be a contributing factor in what they did ?

I'm by no means making excuses for these ladies, but it could be seen as a motive.

What a lot of drivel. Apart from the fact I had already bought land for her in her home town why would any foreigner start a business all in the wife's name. As for the rest, she would have it all eventually if she did not betray her family. It is no motive at all,

The motive is with the money lenders, crooked lawyers and a host of others jealous, greedy and criminal who managed to persuade and cajole with the Thai love Thai crap, lies and deceit. I know in my case and in Colin's case the start of it all was on a very small level the women thought they were smart enough to handle but once you have done one thing wrong you have played into the hands of criminals who will use the fact to extort, threaten and cajole to get what they want. Those are the people along with dozens of other Thais with no morals or compunction who assist and turn a blind eye. Despite the huge amount of evidence both I and Colin have gathered, somehow the justice system finds a way to excuse these pitiful people of their crime for no good reason at all. The lawyers are the worst because to date every single one save the one I am now using has worked against my interest but corruption whilst easy to see is incredibly difficult to prove if the judge wants to look the other way. These money lenders are well advised and very adept at screwing you over and not at all stupid which is the BS they try to tell the judges who do not want to question it. You can wonder why that is the case but I will not say what I think as the contempt laws here are strong

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[slipperx]

dont try and get around the law by using company purchase and proxy. You can legally own condos so if you dont trust them issues do that. Sorry he's obviously a nice guy but he was acting illegally to get over land ownership laws here and so suffered the consequences. I got over that problem long long ago by simply putting everything 100% in my wife's name. Maybe im lucky after 30+ years here.

Woman got caught in loan sharks hands probably due to gambling and so while I'm not making excuses for her she was probably totally desperate.

What i nor my This wife can ever understand is how a mother as here they often do dont care for theirs own kids one bit.

He must have known it was illegal to own land and so has himself to blame.

If it's illegal to take a lease why do the land office register them. If it's illegal for a foreigner to be involved in a business why are foreigners allowed to invest here ? If having anything to do with property is illegal for foreigners why is the Bangkok Post, local newspapers and advertising hoardings so full of advertising if property in English. No the laws do not prevent these things because the country wants to receive the foreign income which prevents the country imploding and then uses the legal system to support crime simply because it fits into the racist mindset which deserves no place in the law. If the Thais don't want it then bake the laws clear - it really is simple to do and would stop people being duped by lawyers and what they see around them. I am sure with 30 years experience you know the traps but most investors do not have 30 years to check out the lie (sic) of the land

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[Robert24]

dont try and get around the law by using company purchase and proxy. You can legally own condos so if you dont trust them issues do that. Sorry he's obviously a nice guy but he was acting illegally to get over land ownership laws here and so suffered the consequences. I got over that problem long long ago by simply putting everything 100% in my wife's name. Maybe im lucky after 30+ years here.

Woman got caught in loan sharks hands probably due to gambling and so while I'm not making excuses for her she was probably totally desperate.

What i nor my This wife can ever understand is how a mother as here they often do dont care for theirs own kids one bit.

He must have known it was illegal to own land and so has himself to blame.

If it's illegal to take a lease why do the land office register them. If it's illegal for a foreigner to be involved in a business why are foreigners allowed to invest here ? If having anything to do with property is illegal for foreigners why is the Bangkok Post, local newspapers and advertising hoardings so full of advertising if property in English. No the laws do not prevent these things because the country wants to receive the foreign income which prevents the country imploding and then uses the legal system to support crime simply because it fits into the racist mindset which deserves no place in the law. If the Thais don't want it then bake the laws clear - it really is simple to do and would stop people being duped by lawyers and what they see around them. I am sure with 30 years experience you know the traps but most investors do not have 30 years to check out the lie (sic) of the land

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not illegal to lease property here for a foreigner, not illegal here for a foreigner to do business and invest, not illegal for a foreigner to buy property ( granted there are restrictions).

[micmichd]

What "racist mindset"?

Maybe Thais simply don't want Imperialistic Farangs to take control over the country, and there are good reasons for this.

[minikev]

It is interesting this this thread has gotten so much viewing and responses. I have a feeling- many believe- that there for the grace of God- go I; This can happen to anyone in any country given circumstances of wealth and fraud. It does happen more in Thailand than anywhere else I have ever been. Part of it is the inherent gullibility of people in general; people looking for love in the all wrong places; couples not being able to communicate; and a lax legal system. I don't condemn anyone if this happens to them. I shall not call them stupid or ignorant. However, reading over these posts- I was almost inclined to go to Soi Cowboy, grab a grog and a girl and have a chat. I asked my wife if I should go and she said yes with a nice Thai smile, except when I looked in her eyes, she really meant- don't even think about it. Communication, my friends- ever so difficult in Thailand! Those who have been here for awhile will get the point. I can always go to Soi Cowboy some other time.

I think you summed it up with "there for the grace of god go I"

We are in a country that works in a different way to our homelands. I think they have it right. Should foreigners be able to buy land and houses Thailand would be much like England by now.

Last time I went back I didn't see many English people.

We have to make our choice and if we want to settle we have to trust someone with whatever we are investing for our future. We then have to behave as the whole system is made to claim back what belongs to Thai's and Thailand. To win here you have to choose your partener very carefully , you have to take care of them well and in return you can have paradise.

Alternatively don't trust anyone and rent a condo , I don't like that choice I think it would lead to a lonely old life.

I suppose it can all go wrong at any point as moods change as do circumstances. I have put a huge amount of work into building my own paradise and I don't own it I am I suppose simply a guest.

My wife says we are all guests and the land we live on belongs to all that lived here previously. She prays to them and asks that we can use it. This is why she has a shrine to them and makes offerings.

I don't. I simply try and take care of my family here and I think they can see I love them and they return that.

I think there must be a little more to this story.

[slipperx]

What "racist mindset"?

Maybe Thais simply don't want Imperialistic Farangs to take control over the country, and there are good reasons for this.

You will find out if you are ever dragged into the legal system

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[slipperx]

It is interesting this this thread has gotten so much viewing and responses. I have a feeling- many believe- that there for the grace of God- go I; This can happen to anyone in any country given circumstances of wealth and fraud. It does happen more in Thailand than anywhere else I have ever been. Part of it is the inherent gullibility of people in general; people looking for love in the all wrong places; couples not being able to communicate; and a lax legal system. I don't condemn anyone if this happens to them. I shall not call them stupid or ignorant. However, reading over these posts- I was almost inclined to go to Soi Cowboy, grab a grog and a girl and have a chat. I asked my wife if I should go and she said yes with a nice Thai smile, except when I looked in her eyes, she really meant- don't even think about it. Communication, my friends- ever so difficult in Thailand! Those who have been here for awhile will get the point. I can always go to Soi Cowboy some other time.

I think you summed it up with "there for the grace of god go I"

We are in a country that works in a different way to our homelands. I think they have it right. Should foreigners be able to buy land and houses Thailand would be much like England by now.

Last time I went back I didn't see many English people.

We have to make our choice and if we want to settle we have to trust someone with whatever we are investing for our future. We then have to behave as the whole system is made to claim back what belongs to Thai's and Thailand. To win here you have to choose your partener very carefully , you have to take care of them well and in return you can have paradise.

Alternatively don't trust anyone and rent a condo , I don't like that choice I think it would lead to a lonely old life.

I suppose it can all go wrong at any point as moods change as do circumstances. I have put a huge amount of work into building my own paradise and I don't own it I am I suppose simply a guest.

My wife says we are all guests and the land we live on belongs to all that lived here previously. She prays to them and asks that we can use it. This is why she has a shrine to them and makes offerings.

I don't. I simply try and take care of my family here and I think they can see I love them and they return that.

I think there must be a little more to this story.

I am simply trying to take care of my family too. The issue with property here is confused and not at all clear. Leases are supposed to be fine are they not? Now I am not so sure. One of the judgements says foreigners can use the business method to own property - it says so very clearly. I do not think the issue is clear at all even for Thais because the law is such a mess and so unclear.

Thailand should make the position totally clear through robust and clear laws. It doesn't. Why?

Many here write what they think but the law is not written like that and we have to follow the law. I thought I was. And this has been going on for so long Now yet nothing is done to clarify the law because Thailand is afraid of the effect on investment which they want on the one hand but don't want on the other.

Obviously my advice now is do not invest a penny here because if you cannot rely on the law for protection then there is no basis for any business

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[Maggusoil]

Hu not learned his lesson. Look at his next wife, Thai as well. Sorry to say but he deserves it. Sorry for the 3 poor kids from his first marriage.

Hey! Somene likes living in Thailand, likes Thai women, good on him. I know many men who got it wrong once, twice and even three times but then got the relationship they deserved and were looking for. They didn't run away.

Sometimes we bleed a bit in the jungle before returning home with the goods.

[metisdead]

Some more troll posts have been removed.

[Robert24]

It is interesting this this thread has gotten so much viewing and responses. I have a feeling- many believe- that there for the grace of God- go I; This can happen to anyone in any country given circumstances of wealth and fraud. It does happen more in Thailand than anywhere else I have ever been. Part of it is the inherent gullibility of people in general; people looking for love in the all wrong places; couples not being able to communicate; and a lax legal system. I don't condemn anyone if this happens to them. I shall not call them stupid or ignorant. However, reading over these posts- I was almost inclined to go to Soi Cowboy, grab a grog and a girl and have a chat. I asked my wife if I should go and she said yes with a nice Thai smile, except when I looked in her eyes, she really meant- don't even think about it. Communication, my friends- ever so difficult in Thailand! Those who have been here for awhile will get the point. I can always go to Soi Cowboy some other time.

I think you summed it up with "there for the grace of god go I"

We are in a country that works in a different way to our homelands. I think they have it right. Should foreigners be able to buy land and houses Thailand would be much like England by now.

Last time I went back I didn't see many English people.

We have to make our choice and if we want to settle we have to trust someone with whatever we are investing for our future. We then have to behave as the whole system is made to claim back what belongs to Thai's and Thailand. To win here you have to choose your partener very carefully , you have to take care of them well and in return you can have paradise.

Alternatively don't trust anyone and rent a condo , I don't like that choice I think it would lead to a lonely old life.

I suppose it can all go wrong at any point as moods change as do circumstances. I have put a huge amount of work into building my own paradise and I don't own it I am I suppose simply a guest.

My wife says we are all guests and the land we live on belongs to all that lived here previously. She prays to them and asks that we can use it. This is why she has a shrine to them and makes offerings.

I don't. I simply try and take care of my family here and I think they can see I love them and they return that.

I think there must be a little more to this story.

I am simply trying to take care of my family too. The issue with property here is confused and not at all clear. Leases are supposed to be fine are they not? Now I am not so sure. One of the judgements says foreigners can use the business method to own property - it says so very clearly. I do not think the issue is clear at all even for Thais because the law is such a mess and so unclear.

Thailand should make the position totally clear through robust and clear laws. It doesn't. Why?

Many here write what they think but the law is not written like that and we have to follow the law. I thought I was. And this has been going on for so long Now yet nothing is done to clarify the law because Thailand is afraid of the effect on investment which they want on the one hand but don't want on the other.

Obviously my advice now is do not invest a penny here because if you cannot rely on the law for protection then there is no basis for any business

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

well that's nothing new that the rule of law is weak here. I'm not aware of anyone who thinks otherwise. Yet there are plenty of opportunities hence why you have many foreign investments here. It's kind of all about managing risk vs opportunities. So if rule of law as a business is your no 1 priority, you will not choose Thailand as a base, you will go to Singapore or Hong Kong in Asia.

What I don't understand in this case is that he was looking for a place with strong rule of law and then settled in Phuket. Somehow that doesn't make sense. But it is indeed shocking that after such a long marriage with kids you get defrauded by your wife without even having any relationship issues. To me something is missing here.

[micmichd]

It is interesting this this thread has gotten so much viewing and responses. I have a feeling- many believe- that there for the grace of God- go I; This can happen to anyone in any country given circumstances of wealth and fraud. It does happen more in Thailand than anywhere else I have ever been. Part of it is the inherent gullibility of people in general; people looking for love in the all wrong places; couples not being able to communicate; and a lax legal system. I don't condemn anyone if this happens to them. I shall not call them stupid or ignorant. However, reading over these posts- I was almost inclined to go to Soi Cowboy, grab a grog and a girl and have a chat. I asked my wife if I should go and she said yes with a nice Thai smile, except when I looked in her eyes, she really meant- don't even think about it. Communication, my friends- ever so difficult in Thailand! Those who have been here for awhile will get the point. I can always go to Soi Cowboy some other time.

I think you summed it up with "there for the grace of god go I"

We are in a country that works in a different way to our homelands. I think they have it right. Should foreigners be able to buy land and houses Thailand would be much like England by now.

Last time I went back I didn't see many English people.

We have to make our choice and if we want to settle we have to trust someone with whatever we are investing for our future. We then have to behave as the whole system is made to claim back what belongs to Thai's and Thailand. To win here you have to choose your partener very carefully , you have to take care of them well and in return you can have paradise.

Alternatively don't trust anyone and rent a condo , I don't like that choice I think it would lead to a lonely old life.

I suppose it can all go wrong at any point as moods change as do circumstances. I have put a huge amount of work into building my own paradise and I don't own it I am I suppose simply a guest.

My wife says we are all guests and the land we live on belongs to all that lived here previously. She prays to them and asks that we can use it. This is why she has a shrine to them and makes offerings.

I don't. I simply try and take care of my family here and I think they can see I love them and they return that.

I think there must be a little more to this story.

I am simply trying to take care of my family too. The issue with property here is confused and not at all clear. Leases are supposed to be fine are they not? Now I am not so sure. One of the judgements says foreigners can use the business method to own property - it says so very clearly. I do not think the issue is clear at all even for Thais because the law is such a mess and so unclear.

Thailand should make the position totally clear through robust and clear laws. It doesn't. Why?

Many here write what they think but the law is not written like that and we have to follow the law. I thought I was. And this has been going on for so long Now yet nothing is done to clarify the law because Thailand is afraid of the effect on investment which they want on the one hand but don't want on the other.

Obviously my advice now is do not invest a penny here because if you cannot rely on the law for protection then there is no basis for any business

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well that's nothing new that the rule of law is weak here. I'm not aware of anyone who thinks otherwise. Yet there are plenty of opportunities hence why you have many foreign investments here. It's kind of all about managing risk vs opportunities. So if rule of law as a business is your no 1 priority, you will not choose Thailand as a base, you will go to Singapore or Hong Kong in Asia.

What I don't understand in this case is that he was looking for a place with strong rule of law and then settled in Phuket. Somehow that doesn't make sense. But it is indeed shocking that after such a long marriage with kids you get defrauded by your wife without even having any relationship issues. To me something is missing here.

Do you miss equity (as a supplement to common law)?

Guess you'll find equity in Thailand, too, but maybe very different from what you're used to in the West.

[JLCrab]

[maidee]

if you confuse love with infatuation

and the girls confuses money with : let's take all i can get, thai law is always in my favor & never for the farang anyway

[thaibeachlovers]

here's plenty more rules. These are probably the essential ones. Please reply if you can think of more and I'll include them in the book.

Never get into political discussions with Thais, even with your SO. If you are ever asked about your political opinions in re Thailand, simply smile and say you don't know enough about it to have an opinion (even though you probably know more about it than whoever is asking for your views).

Never believe anything anyone tells you, Thai or farang, unless/until you can verify that what you've been told is true.

Don't keep money in Thailand. Pay the exorbitant ATM fees - just think of it as insurance.

Don't get inebriated to the point that you can't fend for yourself.

Internalize the fact that even very wealthy/successful Thais are generally not very well-educated in terms of understanding even the history of their own country, science and mathematics, etc., much less the history of other countries, or even basic logical reasoning. Do not get hung up on illogical behavior you observe; it is what it is, and you aren't going to 'educate' anyone.

Minimize your interaction with officialdom.

Never drive anywhere, never purchase a vehicle. Take public transportation when you can, use taxis or hired cars/drivers when that isn't an option.

If you speak/read Thai, never let on that you understand what Thais are saying/reading/writing. Cultivate a poker-face. This applies both to random Thais with whom you interact, your SO, and (especially) officialdom.

Never tell anyone, including your SO, how much money you have/make, where your money is located, etc. If you have to prove an income for a retirement visa or proof of sufficient funds for visiting, have a throwaway bank account you can use only for those purposes, completely apart from any bank accounts where your main income is stored. Use a completely different bank for this purpose.

If you are in a serious relationship with a Thai, and you're so inclined, do set up a life insurance policy, will, etc. But do not tell the intended beneficiaries that you have done this; arrange it so that if you pass away, they will be contacted and will receive the benefits at that point in time, with no incentive to arrange your premature death.

Have at least one trusted family member, friend, or lawyer outside Thailand who is an emergency contact with power of attorney to make decisions on your behalf in the event you become disabled to the point where you are unable to do so yourself. Do not ever grant this kind of power over your affairs to any Thai (even a Thai attorney) or local farang, under any circumstances.

Make appointments at least an hour in advance of when you actually expect the meeting to take place; be prepared for the odd Thai who will show up on time, but don't ever expect them to show up at the appointed time.

Have both an air and an overland escape plan; ensure you have all the necessary visas to execute this escape plan. Have at least one additional form of official ID from your country of origin in case your passport is lost, damaged, stolen, or confiscated.

Stock up on nonperishable food and drinking water. Have at least one month's supply of each on hand at all times, replenish as needed.

Do not get involved in any sort of business venture with Thais or with local farangs, ever.

Even though you see Thais breaking the law every day, in every way, do your best to adhere to the letter of the law.

Avoid situations in which you might be likely to need law enforcement assistance, because you won't get it (or, alternately, you'll get it good and hard). If you must fill out a police report for something like a lost/stolen passport, never volunteer any information beyond the bare minimum.

Carry at all times a laminated, full-size, high-resolution reproductions of the personal information section of your passport, and your current visa or visa-waiver stamp.

Never gamble, bet, or play games of chance with Thais or local farangs, even if it's stated that no money is changing hands. Avoid any area in which Thais or local farangs are doing so.

Great post I'm with you on everything but the drivng- no Thai is ever going to drive me if I can help it

Agreed, but while my wife's driving terrifies me, so I will always drive if possible when with her, I live in fear of running over a Thai kid/ kids on a m'bike that drives into my path without looking ( as they do in the countryside ) and being beaten to death by the villagers. If for only that reason I'll happily let Thais drive me in a bus. Never had to regret that so far.

The one about an escape plan reminds me of the one I had to get out of Saudi in a hurry.