Selling a Condo - Resale Market Status.

[UnhappySailor]

Hello All I'm thinking of buying a new build 1 bedroom condo unit in Bangkok shortly for around 3.5m THB, however my main concern is being able to sell it in the future if I need or choose to.

Please if anybody has previous experience in trying to sell a condo in BKK I'd appreciate to know how you found the experience and if there was enough demand given all the new build options potential buyers have.

Please if u see this post and can share your comments I'd really appreciated it.

Thanks

[trogers]

One can always sell. It's just the price. What you have to ask yourself is, 'At what point is this moment on the property cycle?'

Would you be buying high and selling low, or vice versa?

[UnhappySailor]

One can always sell. It's just the price. What you have to ask yourself is, 'At what point is this moment on the property cycle?'

Would you be buying high and selling low, or vice versa?

Trogers do you have past experience in selling a condo in Bangkok?

[trogers]

One can always sell. It's just the price. What you have to ask yourself is, 'At what point is this moment on the property cycle?'

Would you be buying high and selling low, or vice versa?

Trogers do you have past experience in selling a condo in Bangkok?

No, I only get offers from buyers, but have no intention to sell. All my 5 units were bought in 2007-8, during the sub prime crisis.

[KittenKong]

One can always sell. It's just the price. What you have to ask yourself is, 'At what point is this moment on the property cycle?'

Trogers do you have past experience in selling a condo in Bangkok?

No, I only get offers from buyers, but have no intention to sell. All my 5 units were bought in 2007-8, during the sub prime crisis.

You call it a "property cycle" but others might call it the nadir of a near collapse.

If you have to wait decades for the right time to buy, and more decades for the right time to sell, then it doesn't really qualify as a "cycle" to my mind. More like a combination of luck and longevity.

I think that most Thai property is way overpriced all the time, except when vendors are desperate in which case they sometimes find a sensible level.

It's easy to buy property in Thailand but very hard to sell it.

[i claudius]

One can always sell. It's just the price. What you have to ask yourself is, 'At what point is this moment on the property cycle?'

Trogers do you have past experience in selling a condo in Bangkok?

No, I only get offers from buyers, but have no intention to sell. All my 5 units were bought in 2007-8, during the sub prime crisis.

You call it a "property cycle" but others might call it the nadir of a near collapse.

If you have to wait decades for the right time to buy, and more decades for the right time to sell, then it doesn't really qualify as a "cycle" to my mind. More like a combination of luck and longevity.

I think that most Thai property is way overpriced all the time, except when vendors are desperate in which case they sometimes find a sensible level.

It's easy to buy property in Thailand but very hard to sell it.

Agree 110%

[trogers]

One can always sell. It's just the price. What you have to ask yourself is, 'At what point is this moment on the property cycle?'

Trogers do you have past experience in selling a condo in Bangkok?

No, I only get offers from buyers, but have no intention to sell. All my 5 units were bought in 2007-8, during the sub prime crisis.

You call it a "property cycle" but others might call it the nadir of a near collapse.

If you have to wait decades for the right time to buy, and more decades for the right time to sell, then it doesn't really qualify as a "cycle" to my mind. More like a combination of luck and longevity.

I think that most Thai property is way overpriced all the time, except when vendors are desperate in which case they sometimes find a sensible level.

It's easy to buy property in Thailand but very hard to sell it.

Yes, desperate times is the period to buy.

Two of my units were from owners who needed cash to save their stock margin trading. And my largest unit was won from a government auction.

[KittenKong]

Agree 110%

That's a real estate agent's price.

[KittenKong]

Yes, desperate times is the period to buy.

Two of my units were from owners who needed cash to save their stock margin trading. And my largest unit was won from a government auction.

I'm sure you bought well, but waiting that long for the right moment is not practical for most people. Especially if they are buying somewhere to live in.

[trogers]

Yes, desperate times is the period to buy.

Two of my units were from owners who needed cash to save their stock margin trading. And my largest unit was won from a government auction.

I'm sure you bought well, but waiting that long for the right moment is not practical for most people. Especially if they are buying somewhere to live in.

There would always be desperate times, whether from property cycles or financial cycles.

The OP wants to buy new. Read the topic I had posted on 'Supply of Condo Units Exceeding Effective Demand' with anticipation of substantial discounts for unsold units by developers next year.

[AyG]

A few generalisations:

(1) Thai people always prefer to buy new, rather than second hand.

(2) Thai people never want to sell at a loss - they'll expect at least as much for a property as they originally paid for it.

(3) If someone has died in the property, you'll have a very difficult time selling it, and will need to discount the price dramatically.

There are a couple of condo developments I know fairly well in Bangkok. In both of them about 70-80% of the properties are unoccupied, and there are dozens of "for sale" notices on the office noticeboards.

[trogers]

A few generalisations:

(1) Thai people always prefer to buy new, rather than second hand.

(2) Thai people never want to sell at a loss - they'll expect at least as much for a property as they originally paid for it.

(3) If someone has died in the property, you'll have a very difficult time selling it, and will need to discount the price dramatically.

There are a couple of condo developments I know fairly well in Bangkok. In both of them about 70-80% of the properties are unoccupied, and there are dozens of "for sale" notices on the office noticeboards.

The first point is true, but not due to actual demand of Thais. It is probably forced upon them by the finance industry, as mortgage principal can be as high as 100% of selling price for new, and as low as 50% for used.

Point 2 is not an obstacle. I bought a unit from an original owner at less than 2% more than the price she got from her developer, 12 years before. She showed me her original purchase agreement.

[wpcoe]

Agree 110%

That's a real estate agent's price.

After they apply that "special" discount "just for you."

What the real estate market here could borrow from the west would be (1) a reliable, licensed escrow system, (2) a similarly regulated/licensed appraisal system, and (3) a standardized multiple-listing service for *licensed* real estate agents to reference.

Wouldn't that just be swell?

</Pollyana mode off>

[Card]

One can always sell. It's just the price. What you have to ask yourself is, 'At what point is this moment on the property cycle?'

Trogers do you have past experience in selling a condo in Bangkok?

No, I only get offers from buyers, but have no intention to sell. All my 5 units were bought in 2007-8, during the sub prime crisis.

You call it a "property cycle" but others might call it the nadir of a near collapse.

If you have to wait decades for the right time to buy, and more decades for the right time to sell, then it doesn't really qualify as a "cycle" to my mind. More like a combination of luck and longevity.

I think that most Thai property is way overpriced all the time, except when vendors are desperate in which case they sometimes find a sensible level.

It's easy to buy property in Thailand but very hard to sell it.

Yes and the price doesn't go up very much over time for used properties, if at all. As soon as a property is occupied, like with a new car, the price immediately drops to a level that takes a long time to recover.

Edited October 26, 2015 by Card

[realenglish1]

First off understand that there is a glut of Condo on the market and the market is poor at best Without question you will see a correction coming Its not a matter of it it is a matter of when

Which I cannot predict but right now no one is getting decent prices for selling . When the builders artificially increase condo prices without there being market forces this is a very dangerous situation .

Things like guaranteeing an 8% return on investment or jacking prices by 30% over a 2 year period. If I was able to make 8 % of my money I would not build a condo project I would invest it in something I had liquidity in.

So in answer to your question Condos here are a fools game geared towards only the builder making money not the punter. There will be a point in time when a lot of the people thais and farang who have bought over the last 5 years or so what to sell. The question is SELL TO WHO.

Too many restrictions on Condos for a flip . All I can say is if you buy with the idea of just living there long term then that is fine but other than that You have not got a chance in Hell

[mike324]

Its all about the location and price when it comes to selling. But keep in mind there is an over supply of studio and 1 bedroom condos on the market. How big is the unit you are looking at?

[cape]

So how does buying at a property auction work?

I wonder what happens when the executor has to step in for a hard working far an who bought properties for his retirement in cone, and had a good innings n all, but then passed on. When you're 40 or 50 and saving you don't always think of the exit strategy.

[Robert24]

Recommend not to buy new. Recommend to buy a property that is in the process of being repossessed. You can get good deals there for properties in good locations. Maybe you have to spend 100-200k for renovation costs but you will have a far better deal than if you buy new.

[bangkapi]

There are NO standard prices in Thailand. In one project that was a few years old on the outskirts of town about a decade ago, I saw two similar 60 square meter units. One was 1.8 million baht and the other was 5.4 million baht.

Nowadays everything starts out too expensive. Likely it will not drop much, but don't expect the price to rise except in relation to foreign exchange.

[1BADDAT]

A few generalisations:

(1) Thai people always prefer to buy new, rather than second hand.

(2) Thai people never want to sell at a loss - they'll expect at least as much for a property as they originally paid for it.

(3) If someone has died in the property, you'll have a very difficult time selling it, and will need to discount the price dramatically.

There are a couple of condo developments I know fairly well in Bangkok. In both of them about 70-80% of the properties are unoccupied, and there are dozens of "for sale" notices on the office noticeboards.

The first point is true, but not due to actual demand of Thais. It is probably forced upon them by the finance industry, as mortgage principal can be as high as 100% of selling price for new, and as low as 50% for used.

Point 2 is not an obstacle. I bought a unit from an original owner at less than 2% more than the price she got from her developer, 12 years before. She showed me her original purchase agreement.

so you are saying that you paid more than she originally bought it for. Correct?

[jadee]

I liked 'KittenKong's post, I agree that condos are easier to buy than sell. However, location is everything and that's true the world over.I bought a condo in Samut Prakarn province five years ago and it would be very hard to sell, unless I wanted to take a huge loss. There is simply no demand in that area. However, there are specific areas in Bangkok where demand is very high.
My advice to the OP is that you can tell a lot by looking a Prakard.com before you buy. It's a very popular website with Thais and you'll notice that on some areas/ developments the first page has adverts over 12 months old whereas other areas, adverts will stay on the first page for 20 minutes.

[cape]

But where are the lists of properties being repossessed or auctioned kept?

[bazza40]

Why on earth would you want to live in Bangkok, let alone buy there? The plughole of Thailand, just Google "floods in Thailand".

[trogers]

A few generalisations:

(1) Thai people always prefer to buy new, rather than second hand.

(2) Thai people never want to sell at a loss - they'll expect at least as much for a property as they originally paid for it.

(3) If someone has died in the property, you'll have a very difficult time selling it, and will need to discount the price dramatically.

There are a couple of condo developments I know fairly well in Bangkok. In both of them about 70-80% of the properties are unoccupied, and there are dozens of "for sale" notices on the office noticeboards.

The first point is true, but not due to actual demand of Thais. It is probably forced upon them by the finance industry, as mortgage principal can be as high as 100% of selling price for new, and as low as 50% for used.

Point 2 is not an obstacle. I bought a unit from an original owner at less than 2% more than the price she got from her developer, 12 years before. She showed me her original purchase agreement.

so you are saying that you paid more than she originally bought it for. Correct?

Correct. A few tens of thousands baht more. Problem is she did not renovate anything in that 12 years. I spent Bt200k for total refurbishing bring total cost to Bt2.2m for 60 sqm.

Been rented out to the first and same tenant for almost 6 years at Bt18k.

[trogers]

But where are the lists of properties being repossessed or auctioned kept?

www.led.go.th

But it is better to go there and buy their latest book that lists properties with their auction dates.

Edited October 26, 2015 by trogers

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

The OP wants to buy new. Read the topic I had posted on 'Supply of Condo Units Exceeding Effective Demand' with anticipation of substantial discounts for unsold units by developers next year.

Yes...but he's not asking about the economics/pricing of his planned new condo purchase.

He's asking about the likelihood of being able to RE-SELL that unit as a USED unit at some point in the future.

The problem with that is, as things stand now, there is an overabundant and continuing supply of new condos being build by the various developers in BKK. And as long as that supply continues in abundance, it's going to be relatively more difficult to sell re-sale units -- unless there's a clear price advantage.

[1FinickyOne]

Ahoy Sailor -

Much of it depends on what your reason for buying might be…

if you want to live there, then the math would be more favorable.

If you are buying for income and rental possibilities and hopes for a better return than the banks back home - that many have minimal viability.

if you are looking for an investment only, there are probably better things to invest in.

[1BADDAT]

A few generalisations:

(1) Thai people always prefer to buy new, rather than second hand.

(2) Thai people never want to sell at a loss - they'll expect at least as much for a property as they originally paid for it.

(3) If someone has died in the property, you'll have a very difficult time selling it, and will need to discount the price dramatically.

There are a couple of condo developments I know fairly well in Bangkok. In both of them about 70-80% of the properties are unoccupied, and there are dozens of "for sale" notices on the office noticeboards.

The first point is true, but not due to actual demand of Thais. It is probably forced upon them by the finance industry, as mortgage principal can be as high as 100% of selling price for new, and as low as 50% for used.

Point 2 is not an obstacle. I bought a unit from an original owner at less than 2% more than the price she got from her developer, 12 years before. She showed me her original purchase agreement.

so you are saying that you paid more than she originally bought it for. Correct?

Correct. A few tens of thousands baht more. Problem is she did not renovate anything in that 12 years. I spent Bt200k for total refurbishing bring total cost to Bt2.2m for 60 sqm.

Been rented out to the first and same tenant for almost 6 years at Bt18k.

so it seems you agree with the other posters point 2 as well. In your other post it sounded like you disagreed.

[trogers]

The OP wants to buy new. Read the topic I had posted on 'Supply of Condo Units Exceeding Effective Demand' with anticipation of substantial discounts for unsold units by developers next year.

Yes...but he's not asking about the economics/pricing of his planned new condo purchase.

He's asking about the likelihood of being able to RE-SELL that unit as a USED unit at some point in the future.

The problem with that is, as things stand now, there is an overabundant and continuing supply of new condos being build by the various developers in BKK. And as long as that supply continues in abundance, it's going to be relatively more difficult to sell re-sale units -- unless there's a clear price advantage.

Like I have said, it depends on buying price and selling price. Should you get a new unit at 15-20% below initial launch price, you can sell it with a lower asking price against your competitors.

[trogers]

A few generalisations:

(1) Thai people always prefer to buy new, rather than second hand.

(2) Thai people never want to sell at a loss - they'll expect at least as much for a property as they originally paid for it.

(3) If someone has died in the property, you'll have a very difficult time selling it, and will need to discount the price dramatically.

There are a couple of condo developments I know fairly well in Bangkok. In both of them about 70-80% of the properties are unoccupied, and there are dozens of "for sale" notices on the office noticeboards.

The first point is true, but not due to actual demand of Thais. It is probably forced upon them by the finance industry, as mortgage principal can be as high as 100% of selling price for new, and as low as 50% for used.

Point 2 is not an obstacle. I bought a unit from an original owner at less than 2% more than the price she got from her developer, 12 years before. She showed me her original purchase agreement.

so you are saying that you paid more than she originally bought it for. Correct?

Correct. A few tens of thousands baht more. Problem is she did not renovate anything in that 12 years. I spent Bt200k for total refurbishing bring total cost to Bt2.2m for 60 sqm.

Been rented out to the first and same tenant for almost 6 years at Bt18k.

so it seems you agree with the other posters point 2 as well. In your other post it sounded like you disagreed.

Agree and disagree. Agree that they want to cover initial purchase price, but disagree that this is a total negative factor.

Buying a used unit at a 12-year old price means that owner actually lost money due to inflation, and you gain from this fact.