Danish seniors revealed for fraud in Thailand

[Prbkk]

I Believe Australia has the same rule-----a deduction if you have a de-facto or if married.

Yes, the combines pension for couples is less than for single X 2, on the understanding that it is cheaper for a couple. That doesn't apply in this case because the likelihood is the Danish men concerned are paying for all costs in the relationship

[oneday]

How petty of the Danish goverment...and so wrong to assume a Thai wife could contribute any money to the partnership. It should be the other way around, they should get 2000 more.

[godden]

fair play to them

[SunsetT]

Poor so and so's need more if living with a Thai, not less!!!

[Ulic]

Just living with my caregiver.

[Skywalker69]

Which (11k) would put him below the required 65k income for retirement stay in Thailand so kind of understandable why not being reported by even those that are otherwise honest.

Not if they have 800/400k on a thai bankaccount. Today Superrich pays 5.22 for the danish krona (57420:- thb) 7580:- thb missing not a big problem even if they don´t hav money in a bank.

Edited November 2, 2015 by Skywalker69

[TigerandDog]

A single Danish senior in Thailand receives 13.000 Danish kroner before tax, but if he is living together with a Thai woman he will only receive 11.000 Danish kroner.

This sounds like it is specific to those cohabiting with Thais. If he is living with a Cambodian women does the same apply? It appears this is a translation so I guess the English is not perfect.

What is very clear is that this is a ridiculous and mean law. So you live with another - how does that effect your personal financial status?

Many, (like me) assume the Scandinavian countries are good at looking after citizens, but these punitive 'punishments' show they are just as hypercritical and petty as the rest...

Many think that a couple can live together more cheaply than two lone single people.

Also, maybe this law wasn't framed with expatriates in mind.

In the UK, if a couple is married, they get more favourably treated for income tax.

So, if I am understanding you correctly, the law presumes if you live with another person then both will have their benefits reduced (As it is supposedly cheaper), but this is only possible if both receive benefits from the government...

I am not affected by this, but find it interesting that the supposed 'generous' countries are just as horrible to their citizens when they want.

So, a massive international fraud has been uncovered!!! An underwhelming majority of 24 people have been hunted down by an international task force investigation. Each has been getting away with 10k baht per month!

The Kroner must surely rise on this news...

Thank god I am not Danish...

Australia does the same with their age pensioners. If you are single pensioner living in Australia you will receive AUD$433.50 per week. However if you are living with a partner who also receives the pension then both receive a reduced benefit of AUD $326.75 per week. Now here's the nasty bit. If you are a single pensioner, but have a partner living with you (regardless of whether they work or not) you only receive AUD $326.75 per week. Take this one step further and apply it to a pensioner who is living outside Australia, all these rates are reduced. e.g the single pensioner living outside Australia will only receive AUD $405.00 per week. Now I understand why this reduction occurs, because as an expat the add on supplements the govt pays for power etc do not get paid. The base pension remains unchanged, but the age supplement is drastically reduced. So Denmark is not the only country with social security payments that are unfair and unreasonable for senior citizens.

[martin81]

According to danish law it does not matter if your spouse or cohabitant is Thai or Danish or other nationality. They just reduce the pension amount because it is cheaper per person to live 2 persons together than living alone. In this case they probably don't look at income level of thai cohabitant as that info may be difficult to obtain for Thai women.

But they probably will not catch many cheaters this way as many danish pensioners in Thailand will probably have a pro-forma address in an EU country and then get the full pension. I actually heard some danish pensioners in Thailand bragging about this a few years ago.

Edited November 2, 2015 by martin81

[nidieunimaitre]

Question...

Lot of people saying it is not right to reduce the pension, but if it were 2 Danish persons would both be receiving individual pensions if both were of pension age?

Maybe similar rules to Belgium?

If husband and wife are both retired, they get only 1 pension (the highest of the 2).

If 1 is retired, the other not, they get taxed on their communal total income.

And since taxes are progressive, this means that if the partner has a high income, there will be a higher tax%. If the partner has no income, the couple falls in a lower tax bracket.

Practically: AFTER tax a retiree will earn more if partner has no income (known to the Belgian taxman...).

BEFORE tax, it does not make any difference whether married or not.

[alfalfa19]

Petty and nonsensical. Thus, it fits right in.

[SOTIRIOS]

..trying to comply with all these constraining rules and regulations.....and supporting Thai women...and the Thai economy.....

....if they share a house with someone does that make them married.....

[kiwikeith]

..... none of the seniors have been reported to the police for benefit fraud.

Why not?

Who caught them? does not sound like anything thai police would be concerned about.

Not only Danes do this but just about everyone on a pension from most countries where this law applies does it, mainly because it's unfair .

My friend had to show a divorce certificate from ex thai wife to NZ pension when he applied to bring pension over here .

[Emster23]

Sounds like an incentive to go short time.... "Honey, I'd like to live with you, but they will take away my money!". do like the idea of hired "caregiver" or "mia chan" (think that is the term for "renta wife"). How about if you adopt the person? Add a dependent? Differences in ages often pointed out young enough to be daughter, or grand daughter.....

[pizzachang]

Ok, so according to the Danish authority, a single senior will receive 13000 kroner, but if he has a partner to support, he will get 2000 kroner LESS?

It that not backwards? If the senior has to support a partner, should he not be getting MORE? Is the assumption that the partner is employed and contributing to the household income? Would it not then be appropriate to ask for a declaration of income from the partner, and then adjust the pension payout accordingly? Or does that make too much sense?

Punishment for being on a pension and living with (someone not Danish?) Now I've heard of some strange "rules" but this one tops anything the Thais do! Where does the Danish Government think the money they spend comes from? Governments seldom have any money that isn't taken from working people or businesses.

[Jaggg88]

Does this include a live in maid?

[soalbundy]

Surely, something was lost in the translation, making it rather pointless to comment on this case.

Making comments is never pointless, only life is pointless.

beats dying though.

[anon444]

I am a Norwegian and no specialist in Danish pension, but I guess it is not very much unlike the Norwegian. The size of your pension is a matter of income before retirement. Talking about a fix pension of 13.000 danish kroner make me think this is about minimum pension, that is the pension you get if your lifetime income has been to lo or is no existing. Then it is the same in Norway: A married couple get less pension than single person. May be that is the case also here. The nationality of the wife is of no importance. Married or not does not matter, the point is that you share household with another person.

[soalbundy]

Does this include a live in maid?

depends where she was made

[shirtless]

That pretty rough all the same , if your wife/ partner is a dependent you should not be penalized .How stupid are governments

[Cloggie]

According to danish law it does not matter if your spouse or cohabitant is Thai or Danish or other nationality. They just reduce the pension amount because it is cheaper per person to live 2 persons together than living alone. In this case they probably don't look at income level of thai cohabitant as that info may be difficult to obtain for Thai women.

But they probably will not catch many cheaters this way as many danish pensioners in Thailand will probably have a pro-forma address in an EU country and then get the full pension. I actually heard some danish pensioners in Thailand bragging about this a few years ago.

>> They just reduce the pension amount because it is cheaper per person to live 2 persons together than living alone.

This is exactly what my government tell me as well, which is a complete mystery for me as living alone is simply cheaper - it's that simple!

So to use "government logic" is is cheaper to go out together than alone.....

[Suradit69]

A single Danish senior in Thailand receives 13.000 Danish kroner before tax, but if he is living together with a Thai woman he will only receive 11.000 Danish kroner.

This sounds like it is specific to those cohabiting with Thais. If he is living with a Cambodian women does the same apply? It appears this is a translation so I guess the English is not perfect.

What is very clear is that this is a ridiculous and mean law. So you live with another - how does that effect your personal financial status?

Many, (like me) assume the Scandinavian countries are good at looking after citizens, but these punitive 'punishments' show they are just as hypercritical and petty as the rest...

"but these punitive 'punishments' show they are just as hypercritical and petty as the rest..."

"so I guess the English is not perfect."

A reasonable guess.

[springheeled jack]

old Danish fiddlers my oh my of course its one way of making your pension spin out that extra 2000kroner makes a difference .

[smotherb]

Strange law.

But i have met some strange Danish people along the way ass well.

Hi there here is your pension now go live miserable alone and not take care of anyone.

Ow sorry you take care of someone then we need to cut you back 2000 kroner ??

Doesn't make any sense to me.

Perhaps the Danes assume a partner shares expenses and is not just a drain on them.

[Aussieroaming]

They should have asked for 11 000 coronas

[trogers]

Strange law.

But i have met some strange Danish people along the way ass well.

Hi there here is your pension now go live miserable alone and not take care of anyone.

Ow sorry you take care of someone then we need to cut you back 2000 kroner ??

Doesn't make any sense to me.

Perhaps the Danes assume a partner shares expenses and is not just a drain on them.

Yep! A retiree on limited pension has to tell his potential partner, "I am no sugar daddy!"

[BernieOnTour]

that is not fraud - that is SELF DEFENCE !

More and more European governments are trying to reduce your hard earned pensions by introducing ridiculous rules, which weren't in place at the start of the "contract", when you were paying in their coffers.

On the other hand, they have no problems to cash out billions to economic refugees flooding Europe...

[elgordo38]

A single Danish senior in Thailand receives 13.000 Danish kroner before tax, but if he is living together with a Thai woman he will only receive 11.000 Danish kroner.

This sounds like it is specific to those cohabiting with Thais. If he is living with a Cambodian women does the same apply? It appears this is a translation so I guess the English is not perfect.

What is very clear is that this is a ridiculous and mean law. So you live with another - how does that effect your personal financial status?

Many, (like me) assume the Scandinavian countries are good at looking after citizens, but these punitive 'punishments' show they are just as hypercritical and petty as the rest...

Governments all over the globe are hurting and putting the squeeze on ex-pats while basically giving them nothing in return including medical coverage. The Americans have FATCA, RBS is asking foreigners to close their accounts and on it goes. Watch out Americans your social security and other pension plans are a nice fat sitting duck to a government hungry for new money to keep them out of the hole. They may force you to buy into a grandiose government scheme and well we all know how politicians like to spend other peoples money. They operate like Whimpy in the hamburgler story.

[smotherb]

Strange law.

But i have met some strange Danish people along the way ass well.

Hi there here is your pension now go live miserable alone and not take care of anyone.

Ow sorry you take care of someone then we need to cut you back 2000 kroner ??

Doesn't make any sense to me.

Perhaps the Danes assume a partner shares expenses and is not just a drain on them.

Yep! A retiree on limited pension has to tell his potential partner, "I am no sugar daddy!"

No, I would think anyone would think more of themselves than to have to pay for companionship.

[ozyjon]

The thin edge of the wedge.

I'm reading about this issue more and more in

various tabloids from various countries, how

soon before they make it Law, pensioners

living outside their (pension country) will get

less pension than one living in their pension

country, wait and see.

[Krataiboy]

Just the latest example of how pensioners across the Western world are increasingly being treated as a parasitic sub-species, to be vilified and penalised at every opportunity. Thank God for our grandchildren who see us for what we really are.