Thai Court Admits Petition Seeking To Revoke Shin's Licenses

[j_cheung]

I wonder how much money foreign companies already established here had to fork out in bribes on a yearly basis? How many of them were ready or close to packing up and move to neighbouring countries?

I still think the BIG CLEANUP will attract more foreign investors, unlike the previous government's abuse of the words "foreign investor confidence", what a joke that was. The Shin deal should not be compared to those.

But isn't that the normal business "protocol" in LOS (before, during & [most-likely] after Thaxon)? Just depends on who's pocketing the "service" fees. As for foreign investor confidence, it's quite possibly M'sia and Vietnam was "cheaper" over all ...

[Chang_paarp]

I would not want to be using Singapore for the hub of any travel for a while if Shinawatra was any place on my passport.

[Chang_paarp]

Scott,

I hope that all illegal activity is found out and punished...but I'm not thinking that this will actually happen.

One possible way that the Singapore company may have broken the law in the purchase is if they created an illegal proxy to avoid a foreign ownership limit...or if they colluded with Thai officials to change laws or ignore laws related to such transfers to avoid restrictions.

I would like to point out that illegal practices such as this probably occur quite regularly in Thailand and in fact throughout most of Asia. It has long been known by business people that asian companies have a much better chance of landing contracts in asia than western companies...this is do to the difference in business culture....one of these differences is that the asians know who to find out who to bribe and how to bribe them.....the western companies usuallly didn't have clue about this but in recent years they have learned more about how this is done and usually hire local people into their upper echelon who know how this is done. At least this is what I have heard. I am just a rice farmer and don't have these sorts of problems to deal with in my life usually.

Chownah

Unfortunately it is illegal for "western" companies to do this. If they are caught they face prosecution in their home countries and in any place that thinks they were disadvantaged. A point in case is Australian Wheat Board bribing Saddam's regime to get a few contracts to sell wheat. This has upset the US wheat growers and has got them into some very hot water in Australia.

This may not be the case if your scenario is the case in asian countries, however I seem to remember a number of Korean executives having to fall on their swords because of the golden grease they used in different markets.

[Tony Clifton]

I wonder how much money foreign companies already established here had to fork out in bribes on a yearly basis? How many of them were ready or close to packing up and move to neighbouring countries?

I still think the BIG CLEANUP will attract more foreign investors, unlike the previous government's abuse of the words "foreign investor confidence", what a joke that was. The Shin deal should not be compared to those.

But isn't that the normal business "protocol" in LOS (before, during & [most-likely] after Thaxon)? Just depends on who's pocketing the "service" fees. As for foreign investor confidence, it's quite possibly M'sia and Vietnam was "cheaper" over all ...

It may have been normal business until lately but I have a strong feeling that some people in high places have had enough of these pseudo politicians, businessmen and thieves in disguise, partial and incompetent govt. officers making a farce of this country at home abroad. I even think that following this HUGE cleanup, there will be many obotors and local politicians in the sight of investigators, even the boys in brown.

Following previous coups, have they gone to such an extent as we're seeing now with all these investigations and demotions going on? I think not. We are about to see more educated and competent people in charge from now on and what went on in the past will not be tolerated.

I am not looking for arguments with my comments, simply expressing my views from the pulse I get from my observations.

Edited October 6, 2006 by Tony Clifton

[Plus]

We are about to see more educated and competent people in charge from now on and what went on in the past will not be tolerated.

I think not. Leopards don't change spots. I hope there will be less corruption on very top levels, that's all.

Issues like foreign ownership and nominees are dealt on the case by case basis, and the law itself serves as a guiding principle. Pretty much like a read light is only a suggestion to stop.

They welcome nominees when it's overall more beneficial to the country to bend a law a little then turn away investors.

[j_cheung]

I wonder how much money foreign companies already established here had to fork out in bribes on a yearly basis? How many of them were ready or close to packing up and move to neighbouring countries?

I still think the BIG CLEANUP will attract more foreign investors, unlike the previous government's abuse of the words "foreign investor confidence", what a joke that was. The Shin deal should not be compared to those.

But isn't that the normal business "protocol" in LOS (before, during & [most-likely] after Thaxon)? Just depends on who's pocketing the "service" fees. As for foreign investor confidence, it's quite possibly M'sia and Vietnam was "cheaper" over all ...

It may have been normal business until lately but I have a strong feeling that some people in high places have had enough of these pseudo politicians, businessmen and thieves in disguise, partial and incompetent govt. officers making a farce of this country at home abroad. I even think that following this HUGE cleanup, there will be many obotors and local politicians in the sight of investigators, even the boys in brown.

Following previous coups, have they gone to such an extent as we're seeing now with all these investigations and demotions going on? I think not. We are about to see more educated and competent people in charge from now on and what went on in the past will not be tolerated.

I am not looking for arguments with my comments, simply expressing my views from the pulse I get from my observations.

I see where you're coming from and truly hope that those people in high places really do a through cleansing -- not just of Thaxon's regime but of the typical "bribery-as-usual" attitude and non-accountability of entire political and social establishment. On the other hand, the entire cleansing process shouldn't descent down to an xenophobic & vindictive witchhunt without rhyme or reason ... after all a few of the current leaders were themselves cast in an unfavorable light in earlier coups. Placing most of the former regime's administrators in non-active roles is a fair & right choice with an opportunity to "rehabitate" themselves at a future time.

Finally, I find it increasing ironically that although the interim government has chosen to abandon the CEO style of the previous government, their new ministers seem to be coming from successfully qualified business persons from NGOs and business sectors (e.g. Bank of Thailand governor MR Pridiyathorn Devakula, Bangkok Bank executive chairman Kosit Panpiemras ). Substance over form I guess

[ColPyat]

Following previous coups, have they gone to such an extent as we're seeing now with all these investigations and demotions going on? I think not.

And i think you are wrong there, again.

This time they are rather mild to their opponents.

In the previous coup, which also was supposedly about intolerable corruption, Chatchai Choonhavan's assets and the assets of several other unusually rich influental people caught on the wrong side of the track were even frozen, lots of powerful people had to flee the scene, including Gen. Chavalit, i believe. A national counter corruption commission was established, etc, blablabla.

In the end all was returned to them.

Lets just wait and see...

[nick2k]

just out of curiosity since I'm not at all aware of all the parameters of the thaksin scenario, I won't make any judgement calls on thaksin.

..BUT didn't thaksin sell his shin corporation to singapore AFTER dtac did the same thing the previous year?

now, does anybody remember who the thai owners of dtac were before it was sold to some norwegian company?

last, but not least, if thaksin is to investigated, then, it seems to me that the thais who sold dtac should also be investigated.

sound fair?

..it would also be interesting to see if the thai owners who sold dtac paid any taxes. now, just who were those thai owners. anybody know by any chance? (pssss...democrats. it is a big secret.)

[Jai Dee]

MULTI-PRONGED INVESTIGATION

SEC resolute in probing Shin

Thirachai says takeover code should be amended to plug loopholes

The Securities and Exchange Commission has vowed to proceed with its investigations into two cases involving Shin Corp and the Shinawatra family, saying that it was doing its best to uncover any wrongdoing under the existing legal framework.

While the case involving Ample Rich Investments has been wrapped up, with former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra's son Panthongtae being fined Bt6 million, the SEC is still investigating possible insider trading by executives of Advanced Info Service Plc, which included Thaksin's younger sister Yingluck, as well as transactions involving SC Assets Plc, said SEC Secretary-General Thirachai Phuvanatnaranubala.

The Stock Exchange of Thailand, under then president Kittiratt na Ranong, ruled that none of the AIS executives was guilty of insider trading in their sale of shares before Temasek Holdings' takeover of Shin Corp was announced.

"The SET's investigation is ready, but we are looking at the angles that the investigation did not cover. We have been contacting offshore organisations for further information," Thirachai said during an interview with a group of business reporters yesterday.

While saying that the investigation of SC Assets - majority owned by the Shinawatra family - was still open, Thirachai said the SEC was ready to open up the investigation involving Ample Rich transactions if new evidence emerged. He also insisted that Panthongtae had been fined the maximum according to the formula set by the sub-committee in charge of setting a penalty.

The Ample Rich investigation result was forwarded to the National Counter Corruption Commission for further investigation.

Thirachai did not specify when the investigations would be completed, saying that there were stumbling blocks, as they concerned foreign funds.

The interview took place a day after the Supreme Administrative Court ordered its lower court to rule if Shin's subsidiaries - AIS, Shin Satellite Plc and iTV Plc - were eligible for concessions following Temasek's takeover, which raised the three companies' foreign shareholdings.

Since the deal, the SEC has come under public criticism for its failure to punish any individuals believed to have benefited from the deal, particularly those in the Shinawatra family. At the centre of the criticism is Thirachai, who was appointed SEC secretary-general under the Thaksin government.

Thirachai yesterday reiterated that he had done his duty. Despite public criticism that the SEC had acted too late to pressure Shin to explain the takeover rumour, Thirachai said that under the Securities and Exchange Act the SEC's power was limited to listed companies, not their shareholders.

"We have no power over shareholders who leak takeover attempts unless their action tends to manipulate share prices," he said. "It would have concerned us if Shin had been selling its assets and denied the rumour, but in this case it involved Shin's shareholders, over whom we have no power."

He also said that since the deal the authorities had realised there were legal loopholes in the takeover code. In Hong Kong and Singapore, major shareholders are obliged to inform the authorities of a takeover attempt. By failing to do so they face various sanctions."But we do not have the power to press criminal charges against anyone involved in a takeover," he said, adding that the law should be amended to plug the loopholes.

Asked if the Temasek-Shin transaction could be identified as share manipulation, Thirachai said the shareholders could be punished only if "are quite sure that they did leak the news. Do we know who leaked the news?" He showed surprise that such a takeover attempt could have caused an increase in Shin share prices.

The Shin deal was rumoured about two months before the deal was wrapped up. Shin share prices surged from Bt37.75 on December 1, 2005 to Bt48.25 on January 23, 2006, when the deal was announced.

Thirachai was also asked why the SEC had never questioned whether Shin's directors, including Banapot Damapong - Thaksin's brother-in-law, who then served as the company's chairman - knew anything about the deal, given that its size must have required due diligence. What, he was also asked, if they knew about the deal in advance but informed the exchange and the SEC otherwise?

"We have followed the guidelines set by the SEC Act. We care whether the buyer follows the rules, but whether there was due diligence or if the buyer incurred any investment risk does not concern us," Thirachai said.

Source: The Nation - 7 October 2006

[Old Man River]

Scott,

I hope that all illegal activity is found out and punished...but I'm not thinking that this will actually happen.

One possible way that the Singapore company may have broken the law in the purchase is if they created an illegal proxy to avoid a foreign ownership limit...or if they colluded with Thai officials to change laws or ignore laws related to such transfers to avoid restrictions.

I would like to point out that illegal practices such as this probably occur quite regularly in Thailand and in fact throughout most of Asia. It has long been known by business people that asian companies have a much better chance of landing contracts in asia than western companies...this is do to the difference in business culture....one of these differences is that the asians know who to find out who to bribe and how to bribe them.....the western companies usuallly didn't have clue about this but in recent years they have learned more about how this is done and usually hire local people into their upper echelon who know how this is done. At least this is what I have heard. I am just a rice farmer and don't have these sorts of problems to deal with in my life usually.

Chownah

Unfortunately it is illegal for "western" companies to do this. If they are caught they face prosecution in their home countries and in any place that thinks they were disadvantaged. A point in case is Australian Wheat Board bribing Saddam's regime to get a few contracts to sell wheat. This has upset the US wheat growers and has got them into some very hot water in Australia.

This may not be the case if your scenario is the case in asian countries, however I seem to remember a number of Korean executives having to fall on their swords because of the golden grease they used in different markets.

Yes it is illegal, but business gets done anyway. When in Rome ......... Facilitators are rarely on the foreign company's direct payroll. They are usually paid as agents, so the foreign company never comes into contact with the actual bribes being paid nor do they know who the money goes to (they don't want to know). Allegedly, this is how some contractors do it who are after one-off contracts. Other times, a company may pay an advisor to arranges things. The problem with bribes is once you make the mistake and pay them, they are expected everytime in the future. It sets the standard as to what you are willing to do to get a contract. There is no getting out.

There are large MNC's that have never paid bribes, but continually win contracts. Instead they support Thailand, not corrupt individuals. They donate large sums of money, on an annual basis, to the Royal Family's projects or other similar worthy charitable projects. Every year you can count on these companies to support good works. The PR obtained is great and they never have to dirty their hands with paying off the government official of the month.

[Heng]

There are large MNC's that have never paid bribes, but continually win contracts. Instead they support Thailand, not corrupt individuals. They donate large sums of money, on an annual basis, to the Royal Family's projects or other similar worthy charitable projects. Every year you can count on these companies to support good works. The PR obtained is great and they never have to dirty their hands with paying off the government official of the month.

And the only reason why these aren't considered 'anything else' other than 'charitable donations' is because if anyone felt like they wanted to consider them as 'anything else,' it would illegal to do so.

[Old Man River]

I wonder how much money foreign companies already established here had to fork out in bribes on a yearly basis? How many of them were ready or close to packing up and move to neighbouring countries?

I still think the BIG CLEANUP will attract more foreign investors, unlike the previous government's abuse of the words "foreign investor confidence", what a joke that was. The Shin deal should not be compared to those.

If you are referring to short term foreign investors, then the coup will not impact them. Fund managers bring investments in and out of Thailand quickly (hot money). Foreign direct investment (long term investments - factories etc.) is different. The coup or any sudden change in status quo is damaging. These are large scale investments and once here, they can't simply pack up and move. While senior management of foreign companies can understand changes in their own countries, they have little patience for instability elsewhere.

Add to the above that a very large, global player (Temasek), which had made a large investment in Thailand only a few months ago now stands to take a loss. This is magnified greater when this large, global player is also the arm of a very rich, ultra stable Asian country, with much of the foreign direct investment now coming to Thailand from other Asian countries. Further add to the equation that the stable Malaysia, which is actively seeking foreign direct investment, is located just to the south.

You have to look at the SHIN deal as any other deal. There are no extenuating circumstances here, except for the fact that the seller is the former PM who is now in disfavor. As one other poster has mentioned, this wasn't even the first deal of its type.

[Plus]

There's a difference between Temasek type investment and MNC investment. Temasek deal has brought no benefits whatsoever to Thailand, just wait until the dividends start to flow out. MNC investments bring in knowledge and development.

Thais don't care much about suffering of "leeches" like Temasek, they try to please investors like Seagate and IBM and Nissan and Toyota.

[mouse]

The safest method for the courts and involved agencies to deal with this are to consider nationalizing the mentioned services and hold them in some sort of trust pending the outcome of thorough investigations of the facts.

Another method would be to allow it to revert to the original owner, but, again hold the agencies in trust based on outcome of the investigations.

In both cases, as the agencies are under control of the government, the licenses would continue to be validated. Revenues and profits collected could be deposited in a financial trust, of sorts, to offset any potential fines and taxes that are found to be due to the Thai government.

Why punish Thailand for what other stand accused of.

In that manner TOT does not loose one of it's major suppliers of telephone services and other IP services. Not to mention UBC, there are also all the banks that are connected to this system with their ATM systems and countless other but small agencies that dependant on these services in one way or another.

There is also all of Asia to consider, which has come to rely heavily on the ShinSat bussiness for IP, Television and telephonic communications.

Anyone dealing with this hotcake, should be very careful in what they do, cause this is a real bubble, that could have immediate and longterm effects on Thailand, it neighbors and far reaching implications on any future role Thailand plays in the business and tourism industries within Asia.

and besides that, George, me and many others would loose our ipStar.............................. not cool!!

Edited October 7, 2006 by mouse

[Ga-gai]

Yes!

Corruption stinks! It's only those who already are rich, that is getting richer.

Some years ago a relative of my wife, who is running a small computer shop here in town, tryed to sell some computers to the local goverment. They needed to buy new computers for the local goverment office.

The local goverment annonced that they were taking proposals during a limited period of time and everyone was free to enter into the competition. So my wife's relation put together a fairly good proposal and went away to the goverments office.

When he arrived at the goverment, there were a strange guy blocking the entrance. The guy asked my wife's relative what his bussiness was at the goverment building. He answered that he was going inside and give the goverment a proposal. Then the strange guy just replied that it is already settled, regarding the computer purchase. There is no need to go inside! My wife's realtive then tryed to walk beside the strange guy, but he couldn't. The guy was totally blocking the entrance. He was also backed up by two other guys with dark sunglasses. My wife's relative then felt very uncomfortable and decided to forget the whole thing, since he felt that he could risk his life if he continued to argue with the strange guys.

He told my wife about what happened. My wife then decided to call one of the higher guys, which she knew a little bit from before, in the goverment and ask him what was going on there. The freind at the goverment answered that made made excuses regarding the incident, but these guys at the entrance had paid bribes and wouldn't let anyone else to enter the competition with proposals.

He also mentioned that him and some other guys at the office were having a problems right now, since it have turned out that there actually is two different guys that both have paid bribes to different people at the office. The biggest issue then was how solve that situation.

Anyway... Corruption stinks!

There is no chance for a normal average guy to make business and one day hope for a breakthrough by being lucky on a customer. The incident above is just a tiny small thing. There are more and bigger stuff going all the time, in the society. But if even the Priminister is corrupted, what can the average small people hope for from the rest of the society?

Edited October 7, 2006 by Ga-gai

[mouse]

Yes!

Corruption stinks! It's only those who already are rich, that is getting richer.

Some years ago a relative of my wife, who is running a small computer shop here in town, tryed to sell some computers to the local goverment. They needed to buy new computers for the local goverment office.

The local goverment annonced that they were taking proposals during a limited period of time and everyone was free to enter into the competition. So my wife's relation put together a fairly good proposal and went away to the goverments office.

When he arrived at the goverment, there were a strange guy blocking the entrance. The guy asked my wife's relative what his bussines was at the goverment. He answered that he was going inside and give the goverment people a propasal. Then the strange guy just replied that it is already settled, regarding the goverments computer purchase. My wife's realtive then tryed to walk beside the strange guy, but he couldn't. The guy was totally blocking the entrance. He was also backed up by two other guys with dark sunglasses. My wife's relative then felt very uncomfortable and decided to forget the whole thing, since he felt that he could risk his life if he continued to argue with the strange guys.

He told my wife about what happened. My wife then decided to call one of the higher guys, which she knew a little bit from before, in the goverment and ask him what was going on there. The freind at the goverment answered that made made excuses regarding the incident, but these guys at the entrance had paid bribes and wouldn't let anyone else to enter the competition with proposals.

He also mentioned that him and some other guys at the office were having a problems right now, since it have turned out that there actually is two different guys that both have paid bribes to different people at the office. The biggest issue then was how solve that situation.

Anyway... Corruption stinks!

There is no chance for a normal average guy to make business and one day hope for a breakthrough by being lucky on a customer. The incident above is just a tiny small thing. There are more and bigger stuff going all the time, in the society. But if even the Priminister is corrupted, what can the average small people hope for from the rest of the society?

Dear Ga-gai.....You are so right. Thai citizens must learn that it is their solem duty to report incidents such the one you mention to the people that are in a position to do something about it and not rest until justice is served. Hopefully with time, incidents such as the one you mentioned, can be overcome and done away with. Unfortunately this type of corruption is a worldwide problem fed by the apathy of a few and greed of many.

In this particlular case, mentioned here, it is sad that a whole country should eventually suffer for the errors, greed and misconduct of a few people. If the courts do not rule wisely it could knock Thailand back 30 years.

[mouse]

Thai citizens must learn that it is their solem duty to report incidents such the one you mention

I want to go one step further and state that a citizen has a duty to report misdeeds that are caused by people, like the strange ones, mentioned by Ga-gai. This is part of patriotism. The inherent risk of one for the better of the whole village, town, nation or in this case the entire Kingdom.

[Ga-gai]

My wife, 32 years old, have told me that there is lots of thing that have changed to worse during the Thaksin era. People have started to get greedier. The teachers at the local schools doesn't take their work seriously any more, almost leaving the students to make their own sessions at school. Some teachers also sells copies of students homework, to other students.

To become a local chief in a village, doesn't mean that someone is interrested in helping the village. He/she is just doing it in order to make money from deals/bribes.

My wife told me that when she was a child, the teachers really cared and took big responsibility. Some teachers even helped poorer students with their own money, if the child one day couldn't eat or pay the bus ticket when the class were visiting museums etc. The local village cheifs regulary gathered the village people and having meeting, to discuss things that had to be done or solve problems of any kind.

It seems like that time is mostly gone today. The reason is that there have grown a greedy mentality during the last years. What can one expect though, when villagers are getting paid up to 500 Baht per person for voting on the "right" guy...

I think that thai people somehow have to go back to the roots and start thinking about how they can contribute to the society, like they did in the past. Doing this without scaring of foreign investors and industry, requires a gentle touch and understanding. And of course, get rid of corruption.

[Ga-gai]

Thai citizens must learn that it is their solem duty to report incidents such the one you mention

I want to go one step further and state that a citizen has a duty to report misdeeds that are caused by people, like the strange ones, mentioned by Ga-gai. This is part of patriotism. The inherent risk of one for the better of the whole village, town, nation or in this case the entire Kingdom.

I think that there is a big will for the average thai to do such. I know that my wife's relative surely would like to do the same. The problem is, by doing so, he is probably risking his life, if someone founds out that he made a complaint regarding the situation mentioned above. Even polititians here have killed each other, due to some argument or simply winning power. So that is easier than said. All things for changes, must come from above. A priminster must show the people that honesty is the right way for the society. Thaksin really put a shame on that. Today, meaning of becoming polititian is equal to becoming richer. Local guys that invest 2 miljon Baht during an election, are counting on having at least the triple back if they are elcted. How can an honest, but poorer person, ever get elected among villagers, when these only see the money they can earn by selling their votes...? Villagers also does seem to go for the guy who already has the most money and power before. Like if they are scared of that guy, or something.

Edited October 7, 2006 by Ga-gai

[mouse]

Thai citizens must learn that it is their solem duty to report incidents such the one you mention

I want to go one step further and state that a citizen has a duty to report misdeeds that are caused by people, like the strange ones, mentioned by Ga-gai. This is part of patriotism. The inherent risk of one for the better of the whole village, town, nation or in this case the entire Kingdom.

I think that there is a big will for the average thai to do such. I know that my wife's relative surely would like to do the same. The problem is, by doing so, he is probably risking his life, if someone founds out that he made a complaint regarding the situation mentioned above. Even polititians here have killed each other, due to some argument or simply winning power. So that is easier than said. All things for changes, must come from above. A priminster must show the people that honesty is the right way for the society. Thaksin really put a shame on that. Today, meaning of becoming polititian is equal to becoming richer. Local guys that invest 2 miljon Baht during an election, are counting on having at least the triple back if they are elcted. How can an honest, but poorer person, ever get elected among villagers, when these only see the money they can earn by selling their votes...? Villagers also does seem to go for the guy who already has the most money and power before. Like if they are scared of that guy, or something.

You sound like the type of Thai person that I would like to have as a friend. My suggestion to you is for you (if you are in fact Thai) or your wife to think about entering politics. "YOU CAN MAKE DIFFERENCE!" Now is the perfect time to get involved and make a difference.

The most beautiful quote I ever heard was "Do not take more from the earth than you need". I do not know who said this, but, I am sure that I read that it was a Thai as it coincides with basic Buddhist values. This definitely applies now and to the greed and materialism that has rapidly spread through Thai society, prevelant especially amongst the young. It is time to reinstitute those old priciples and for the right people to step forth and take charge. The bad guys mentioned previously, will likely be banned from politics for at least 5 years, giving you or your wife a chance to make a difference to the country I and many other farang have come to love.

[younghusband]

There's a difference between Temasek type investment and MNC investment. Temasek deal has brought no benefits whatsoever to Thailand, just wait until the dividends start to flow out. MNC investments bring in knowledge and development.

Thais don't care much about suffering of "leeches" like Temasek, they try to please investors like Seagate and IBM and Nissan and Toyota.

This is a very important point and one with which I have strong agreement, quite apart from the current political context.Plus is quite correct to imply that MNCs (even the retailers like Lotus and Carrefour) generally bring efficiencies, jobs,knowhow,training as well as money.Of course they want and need to show a good return on capital invested, and I don't think Thais mind this.But what exactly does Temasek or frankly any other venture capital outfit contribute? They say of course they add value,are "empowering" management and provide international linkages but there's little evidence of this frankly.The reality they would sell their investment to the devil in five minutes if they could achieve the right return.

[mcfester]

My wife, 32 years old, have told me that there is lots of thing that have changed to worse during the Thaksin era. People have started to get greedier. The teachers at the local schools doesn't take their work seriously any more, almost leaving the students to make their own sessions at school. Some teachers also sells copies of students homework, to other students.

To become a local chief in a village, doesn't mean that someone is interrested in helping the village. He/she is just doing it in order to make money from deals/bribes.

My wife told me that when she was a child, the teachers really cared and took big responsibility. Some teachers even helped poorer students with their own money, if the child one day couldn't eat or pay the bus ticket when the class were visiting museums etc. The local village cheifs regulary gathered the village people and having meeting, to discuss things that had to be done or solve problems of any kind.

It seems like that time is mostly gone today. The reason is that there have grown a greedy mentality during the last years. What can one expect though, when villagers are getting paid up to 500 Baht per person for voting on the "right" guy...

I think that thai people somehow have to go back to the roots and start thinking about how they can contribute to the society, like they did in the past. Doing this without scaring of foreign investors and industry, requires a gentle touch and understanding. And of course, get rid of corruption.

We had a new village head last year, soon after his appointment the village lake was trebled in size, even though it has never been less than half full even during the last droughts, very few villages use it as a water supply now, this was done solely to sell the land that was removed by the diggers, where did the money go? To pay for the cost of the diggers, lol.

Next project was a canopy over the front of the village run shop, cost 120,000B, all work done by locals at 200B per day, I estimated the total cost to be about 50,000B, when asking the locals about the price they just shrugg their shoulders and smile.

My wifes brother is university educated and oftens thinks of running for village head to do some of the badly needed things like installing a drainage system in the village, yet he fears for his life if other corrupt peole want to be village head.

Corruption stinks.

[Tony Clifton]

We have 3 different obotors taking care of a secondary road, not 2 kilometers long, leading to Amata Nakorn, hundreds of buses thousands of m'cycles and cars use it daily but the road has looked like it's been bombed for months. Any budget money for at least gravel to fill the craters or 1 foot drops from the pavement? I guess not. They also never coordinate when or if they do fix it. A few have died, many more have flipped on motorcycles, inexcusable.

The last fix was done with soil which turned into a mudbath within 6 hours.

[seri thai]

We have 3 different obotors taking care of a secondary road, not 2 kilometers long, leading to Amata Nakorn, hundreds of buses thousands of m'cycles and cars use it daily but the road has looked like it's been bombed for months. Any budget money for at least gravel to fill the craters or 1 foot drops from the pavement? I guess not. They also never coordinate when or if they do fix it. A few have died, many more have flipped on motorcycles, inexcusable.

The last fix was done with soil which turned into a mudbath within 6 hours.

I asked a Thai friend how a known criminal like Thaksin could become Prime Minister when he voted in on the first election. He replied that many Thais are poorly educated in school and out, and that in a democracy "we get the government we deserve." Though provoking isn't it ? and it applies to all democracies......

[ColPyat]

I asked a Thai friend how a known criminal like Thaksin could become Prime Minister when he voted in on the first election.

In what way was Thaksin a "known criminal" when he was voted in on the first election?

Elaborate please.

I am sure you can provide us with courtcases, including convictions, amount of time Thaksin has spend behind bars, etc.

[Old Man River]

There's a difference between Temasek type investment and MNC investment. Temasek deal has brought no benefits whatsoever to Thailand, just wait until the dividends start to flow out. MNC investments bring in knowledge and development.

Thais don't care much about suffering of "leeches" like Temasek, they try to please investors like Seagate and IBM and Nissan and Toyota.

Wrong. Some MNC's prefer green field investments, while others prefer to acquire existing facilities, changing corporate identities, upgrading facilities and processes as needed and operating and expanding these companies. Temasek is a long term investor. Many of the companies Temasek acquired in SHIN are highly capital intensive and over the long haul will require huge outlays of capital investment. The Temasek people in Singapore have a great deal of experience in many industries, including the telecom and aviation industries. Other companies owned include SingTel and Singapore Airlines.

I am not sure I understand the comment on Temasek paying dividends, as it is normal for investors to pay dividends when the investment is profitable. This is a normal aspect of a capitalistic society.

The biggest risk in voiding the SHIN deal is the high political risk it will create (is already creating). Decision makers of MNC's view political risk very seriously, as do companies supporting the investments (equity investors, financial institutions, insurance companies, capital equipment suppliers etc.). This is a risk beyond their control.

While countries can pick the types of investments they want, investors can pick the countries they want to invest in. While making a statement to Temasek, the statement will also be heard loud and clear by other long term investors. Thailand may differentiate, but long term investors won't.