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First 5 tigers removed from Tiger Temple by Thai authorities


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First 5 tigers removed from Tiger Temple by Thai authorities
By Coconuts Bangkok

tiger_10.jpg
A Buddhist monk with a tiger at the Tiger Temple. Photo: Reuters

BANGKOK: -- The first five tigers have been removed from the infamous Tiger Temple, according to a wildlife foundation.

Wildlife Friends Foundation Thailand said in a post on their Facebook page that Thai authorities had removed the tigers from the Kanchanaburi temple, formerly known as Wat Pa Luangta Bua Yannasampanno, overnight.

"The exploitation, illegal trade and torture is going to stop," the foundation said in its post.

Full story: http://bangkok.coconuts.co/2016/01/29/first-5-tigers-removed-tiger-temple-thai-authorities

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-- Coconuts Bangkok 2016-01-29

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Moved where? There's no possibility of releasing these domesticated animals into the wild. The tigers would probably have a better quality life with the monks. At least their presence at the temple is now so high profile that trafficking is unlikely to occur again. The abbot had got out of control, but that's the authorities' fault for not regulating the place properly.

Just keep a close eye on the temple - that's the best solution. By closing the place down I fear these tigers are now in more danger than ever.

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5 Big Cats Removed Overnight from 'Tiger Temple'
By Teeranai Charuvastra
Staff Reporter

14540521081454052218l.jpg
Monks and volunteers in April 2015 block government vehicles from leaving the Tiger Temple in Kanchanaburi province.

KANCHANABURI — After years of frustrated attempts, wildlife officials last night removed five tigers from the infamous Tiger Temple, a religious site that also operates an illegal commercial tourism business that has won the ire of animal rights activists.

The operation, in which officials from the Department of Wildlife spirited away five tigers during the night, was either long-delayed intervention by committed officials or a temporary measure approved by temple administrators, depending on who tells the story.

“We kept the news secret because we didn’t want reporters to be there,” temple lawyer Saiyood Pengboonchoo said Friday. “Otherwise, people would come out to protest, and officials would have a hard time working. They removed five tigers, as negotiated … We kept it a big secret. We didn’t even tell our own staff. Only five people in the temple knew about it.”

However the move was hailed as a victory and turning point by Edwin Wiek, founder of Wildlife Friends of Thailand, one of several organizations that have long campaigned against the temple’s commercial use of the tigers.

“This is a good beginning. It’s a victory,” Wiek said upon hearing about the tigers’ removal. “But the important thing is that they have to stop the breeding of tigers, too. Otherwise, now they removed five tigers, but five or six more cubs will be born.”

Full story: http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1454052108

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-- Khaosod English 2016-01-29

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Where have those tiger be brought to? Another private zoo? Removing those tiger from the Temple is not enough. Those tiger must be brought to a BETTER place where proper care and maintenance is guaranteed. Where the animals' welfare can be monitored by the public.

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Well done National Geographic. And the world wide web.

It's not really "well done National Geographic" - "it should be thanks for the help, N.G."....the Donkey-work has been done by Cee4Life and organisations like WFFT and Care for the Wild who have been chipping away for years.

Edited by cumgranosalum
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Where have those tiger be brought to? Another private zoo? Removing those tiger from the Temple is not enough. Those tiger must be brought to a BETTER place where proper care and maintenance is guaranteed. Where the animals' welfare can be monitored by the public.

Read the WFFT statements on this. though I think it is likely their whereabouts will be kept secret for a while at least.

" The tigers will be moved for a period of 6-12 months to centres of the government where new cages have been constructed. After this period longterm places will be found and build at proper zoos, rescue and conservation centres. No exploitation or breeding will be allowed." - WFFT

Apparently their destination is known...

The authorities....."took them to wildlife conservation centres (wildlife sanctuaries, wildlife reserves) in Ratchaburi province, the Khao Son and Khao Prathub Chang animal reserves.

Edited by cumgranosalum
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Moved where? There's no possibility of releasing these domesticated animals into the wild. The tigers would probably have a better quality life with the monks. At least their presence at the temple is now so high profile that trafficking is unlikely to occur again. The abbot had got out of control, but that's the authorities' fault for not regulating the place properly.

Just keep a close eye on the temple - that's the best solution. By closing the place down I fear these tigers are now in more danger than ever.

Seriously? TIT. They will be much safer with WFT, Edwins group will make sure they do not disappear in the night. If you leave them where they are things will not change, this has been a huge business and also fed the tiger medicine trade in China.

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Please - the place is a disgrace - YES! but please get up to speed on the issues that have brought it into disrepute - so far there has been no evidence of drugging - it isn't in the many allegations that have been levelled at the place so harping on about it just shows how little you know about what is actually wrong with the place.

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The need to complete the movement of the tigers and other animals and this should be capped off with razing the entire facility,

sieze assets of said temple and put the people involved, monks included, into public work p-rojects for a peroid of time

that would send a real warning to others involved in similar boon doggles.

The authorties are aware of a couple more and some government employees involved.

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Moved where? There's no possibility of releasing these domesticated animals into the wild. The tigers would probably have a better quality life with the monks. At least their presence at the temple is now so high profile that trafficking is unlikely to occur again. The abbot had got out of control, but that's the authorities' fault for not regulating the place properly.

Just keep a close eye on the temple - that's the best solution. By closing the place down I fear these tigers are now in more danger than ever.

By "better quality of life" - you mean up until the point they are slaughtered and their parts sold to China?

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I'd like to know why people are so confident the tigers will have a better quality life elsewhere. Animals don't look happy in even the best zoos in the world.

With these tigers spread out across various facilities of undetermined standard, and therefore with an undetermined future, they will be far less trackable and even more prone to trafficking or mistreatment.

At the temple at least they get plenty of attention and some degree of freedom, instead of being behind bars all day every day. From the pictures I've seen they look blissfully content, and no, I don't believe that's from sedatives either.

I don't agree with any kind of zoo, but if animals are going to be kept, then the temple seems as good a place as any, and better than most. Just needs monitoring to prevent trafficking, as I said. If the WFFT identified some problems, then I'm pretty sure they would find problems at any Thai zoo, or any zoo in the world come to that.

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Moved where? There's no possibility of releasing these domesticated animals into the wild. The tigers would probably have a better quality life with the monks. At least their presence at the temple is now so high profile that trafficking is unlikely to occur again. The abbot had got out of control, but that's the authorities' fault for not regulating the place properly.

Just keep a close eye on the temple - that's the best solution. By closing the place down I fear these tigers are now in more danger than ever.

By "better quality of life" - you mean up until the point they are slaughtered and their parts sold to China?

Are you even aware of what's been going on?

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I'd like to know why people are so confident the tigers will have a better quality life elsewhere. Animals don't look happy in even the best zoos in the world.

With these tigers spread out across various facilities of undetermined standard, and therefore with an undetermined future, they will be far less trackable and even more prone to trafficking or mistreatment.

At the temple at least they get plenty of attention and some degree of freedom, instead of being behind bars all day every day. From the pictures I've seen they look blissfully content, and no, I don't believe that's from sedatives either.

I don't agree with any kind of zoo, but if animals are going to be kept, then the temple seems as good a place as any, and better than most. Just needs monitoring to prevent trafficking, as I said. If the WFFT identified some problems, then I'm pretty sure they would find problems at any Thai zoo, or any zoo in the world come to that.

" Animals don't look happy in even the best zoos in the world" - I think a comment like that shows how poorly informed the poster is.

"At the temple at least they get plenty of attention and some degree of freedom" and this confirms it....why do people bother posting when they obviously don't have a clue about what has been going on at the temple for the past 10 years or more?

" then the temple seems as good a place as any" - this has to qualify as the most facile comment on the entire thread so far.

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I'd like to know why people are so confident the tigers will have a better quality life elsewhere. Animals don't look happy in even the best zoos in the world.

With these tigers spread out across various facilities of undetermined standard, and therefore with an undetermined future, they will be far less trackable and even more prone to trafficking or mistreatment.

At the temple at least they get plenty of attention and some degree of freedom, instead of being behind bars all day every day. From the pictures I've seen they look blissfully content, and no, I don't believe that's from sedatives either.

I don't agree with any kind of zoo, but if animals are going to be kept, then the temple seems as good a place as any, and better than most. Just needs monitoring to prevent trafficking, as I said. If the WFFT identified some problems, then I'm pretty sure they would find problems at any Thai zoo, or any zoo in the world come to that.

" Animals don't look happy in even the best zoos in the world" - I think a comment like that shows how poorly informed the poster is.

"At the temple at least they get plenty of attention and some degree of freedom" and this confirms it....why do people bother posting when they obviously don't have a clue about what has been going on at the temple for the past 10 years or more?

" then the temple seems as good a place as any" - this has to qualify as the most facile comment on the entire thread so far.

Care to actually answer the points I made?

If you've ever been in a zoo, you'll see big animals like tigers and polar bears pacing up and down, up and down, in a confined space - clearly going off their heads.

I'm talking about the quality of life of the animals, rather than the trafficking issue for now. To come back to my question, how is the tiger's quality of life worse at the temple than at other zoos, and especially at all the scabby zoos that are dotted around East Asia?

There's no ideal place for an animal in captivity, but the best place is surely where they get lots of attention (and being cats, they seem to like it) and are not stuck behind bars all the time. Apart from all that, the temple is a world famous tourist attraction, and has surely spread a lot of pleasure. The only scandal is the 600 baht entrance fee.

I ask again, what's going to happen to these tigers once they are removed? Can anyone guarantee they will have a better life, especially when all the fuss has died down? I doubt it.

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These animals are screwed one way or the other....

Bred in captivity to take photos with tourists is very unfortunate since they can never be released in any natural habitat....

Who's going to pay 20kg of meat per day for a pet tiger now?

They sooner they get into a bowl of Chinese soup the better off they will be.....

Who owns this place and has been making money from the trafficking?

A temple doesn't traffic illegal tigers without human involvement...

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I'd like to know why people are so confident the tigers will have a better quality life elsewhere. Animals don't look happy in even the best zoos in the world.

With these tigers spread out across various facilities of undetermined standard, and therefore with an undetermined future, they will be far less trackable and even more prone to trafficking or mistreatment.

At the temple at least they get plenty of attention and some degree of freedom, instead of being behind bars all day every day. From the pictures I've seen they look blissfully content, and no, I don't believe that's from sedatives either.

I don't agree with any kind of zoo, but if animals are going to be kept, then the temple seems as good a place as any, and better than most. Just needs monitoring to prevent trafficking, as I said. If the WFFT identified some problems, then I'm pretty sure they would find problems at any Thai zoo, or any zoo in the world come to that.

" Animals don't look happy in even the best zoos in the world" - I think a comment like that shows how poorly informed the poster is.

"At the temple at least they get plenty of attention and some degree of freedom" and this confirms it....why do people bother posting when they obviously don't have a clue about what has been going on at the temple for the past 10 years or more?

" then the temple seems as good a place as any" - this has to qualify as the most facile comment on the entire thread so far.

Care to actually answer the points I made?

If you've ever been in a zoo, you'll see big animals like tigers and polar bears pacing up and down, up and down, in a confined space - clearly going off their heads.

I'm talking about the quality of life of the animals, rather than the trafficking issue for now. To come back to my question, how is the tiger's quality of life worse at the temple than at other zoos, and especially at all the scabby zoos that are dotted around East Asia?

There's no ideal place for an animal in captivity, but the best place is surely where they get lots of attention (and being cats, they seem to like it) and are not stuck behind bars all the time. Apart from all that, the temple is a world famous tourist attraction, and has surely spread a lot of pleasure. The only scandal is the 600 baht entrance fee.

I ask again, what's going to happen to these tigers once they are removed? Can anyone guarantee they will have a better life, especially when all the fuss has died down? I doubt it.

OK - the "points" you make are in reality just questions and assertions,

I Most of them have actually been addressed in this thread, if you had bothered to take the time to read it.

The rest has been covered in the NG article and the CEE4life report.

It seems to me that it isn't too much to expect that that people should take a little time to get informed about the topic before making baseless posts...may I suggest that before you anymore facile statements you spend about an hour familiarising yourself with the issues surrounding the temple?

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Moved where? There's no possibility of releasing these domesticated animals into the wild. The tigers would probably have a better quality life with the monks. At least their presence at the temple is now so high profile that trafficking is unlikely to occur again. The abbot had got out of control, but that's the authorities' fault for not regulating the place properly.

Just keep a close eye on the temple - that's the best solution. By closing the place down I fear these tigers are now in more danger than ever.

By "better quality of life" - you mean up until the point they are slaughtered and their parts sold to China?

Are you even aware of what's been going on?

Yes - I am aware that the temple has been trafficking tigers.

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Moved where? There's no possibility of releasing these domesticated animals into the wild. The tigers would probably have a better quality life with the monks. At least their presence at the temple is now so high profile that trafficking is unlikely to occur again. The abbot had got out of control, but that's the authorities' fault for not regulating the place properly.

Just keep a close eye on the temple - that's the best solution. By closing the place down I fear these tigers are now in more danger than ever.

By "better quality of life" - you mean up until the point they are slaughtered and their parts sold to China?

Are you even aware of what's been going on?

Yes - I am aware that the temple has been trafficking tigers.

QED

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I'd like to know why people are so confident the tigers will have a better quality life elsewhere. Animals don't look happy in even the best zoos in the world.

With these tigers spread out across various facilities of undetermined standard, and therefore with an undetermined future, they will be far less trackable and even more prone to trafficking or mistreatment.

At the temple at least they get plenty of attention and some degree of freedom, instead of being behind bars all day every day. From the pictures I've seen they look blissfully content, and no, I don't believe that's from sedatives either.

I don't agree with any kind of zoo, but if animals are going to be kept, then the temple seems as good a place as any, and better than most. Just needs monitoring to prevent trafficking, as I said. If the WFFT identified some problems, then I'm pretty sure they would find problems at any Thai zoo, or any zoo in the world come to that.

" Animals don't look happy in even the best zoos in the world" - I think a comment like that shows how poorly informed the poster is.

"At the temple at least they get plenty of attention and some degree of freedom" and this confirms it....why do people bother posting when they obviously don't have a clue about what has been going on at the temple for the past 10 years or more?

" then the temple seems as good a place as any" - this has to qualify as the most facile comment on the entire thread so far.

Care to actually answer the points I made?

If you've ever been in a zoo, you'll see big animals like tigers and polar bears pacing up and down, up and down, in a confined space - clearly going off their heads.

I'm talking about the quality of life of the animals, rather than the trafficking issue for now. To come back to my question, how is the tiger's quality of life worse at the temple than at other zoos, and especially at all the scabby zoos that are dotted around East Asia?

There's no ideal place for an animal in captivity, but the best place is surely where they get lots of attention (and being cats, they seem to like it) and are not stuck behind bars all the time. Apart from all that, the temple is a world famous tourist attraction, and has surely spread a lot of pleasure. The only scandal is the 600 baht entrance fee.

I ask again, what's going to happen to these tigers once they are removed? Can anyone guarantee they will have a better life, especially when all the fuss has died down? I doubt it.

OK - the "points" you make are in reality just questions and assertions,

I Most of them have actually been addressed in this thread, if you had bothered to take the time to read it.

The rest has been covered in the NG article and the CEE4life report.

It seems to me that it isn't too much to expect that that people should take a little time to get informed about the topic before making baseless posts...may I suggest that before you anymore facile statements you spend about an hour familiarising yourself with the issues surrounding the temple?

So you have no answer, only ad hominem attacks that are the hallmark of people with no answer. Please conduct a more civil discussion.

I've read the NG article and the CEE4life report. They are almost exclusively addressing the trafficking issue. As I said, I'm not talking about the trafficking issue, as that is easily addressed by proper monitoring by the authorities (whether the authorities want to address it is another matter). I'm talking about what happens to the tigers now and whether they will have better quality of life than at the (properly-monitored) temple.

You are arguing (apparently) that they will, without having any idea as to where they are going, what the conditions will be like there, or whether they will be any safer from the predations of the traffickers, given the rampant corruption in this country that facilitaties such things. If the tigers are dispersed in various places, they will fall off the public's radar and there will be even less chance for them to be properly accounted for. There's also hardly any reason to suppose living conditions there will be better. They will be shut in the usual cages 24/7 where they will begin their rabid pacing up and down.

Please reply only when you have some relevant points to make.

Edited by ddavidovsky
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The tigers in Thailand had their fate sealed back when it was decided that exporting rice was more important than preserving wildlife habitat.

In 1950 Thailand was 80% jungle. Today, it's something like 20%.

The fate of tigers in the wild in Thailand is not simply down to loss of habitat. in act as recently as 2007 it was asserted by American researchers that there was potentially enough wilderness in thailand to support a population of up to 2000 tigers.

One of the things the temple has done is create a distorted view of the tiger situation, by claiming to be conservationists, they created a belief that somehow so long as the temple was there there was hope for tigers in the wild - this totally overlooks the real situation which is down to creating or maintaining sustainable eco-systems in the wild of which tigers are the apex predators - nothing to do with breeding hybrids and interbred animals in captivity for public entertainment. Not one tiger from the temple could ever - even in theory be released into the wild. They are an eco-bombshell created by the misguided aims of the temple.

There is no connection between the temple and conservation - in fact with their breeding program and now the alleged trading they actually harm the prospects of the tiger. Once they are shown to be what they actually are, then people can concentrate on saving the tiger as a wild animal in Thailand.

Thailand is at present a favourite contender for the ignominious distinction of being the next nation to preside over the extinction of the tiger within its borders.

this is not a done deal yet, and if the revelations about the temple are established, it could well be a wake-up call for Thailand to ring an end to the trade and exploitation of this animal and set about reestablishing it in its natural environment.

Edited by cumgranosalum
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