How to become Legal Guardian between Thai relatives

[Cam]

I have been with my Thai wife for 25 years. We currently are resident in Kuala Lumpur where I am an expat worker. My wife's brother recently is the father of a baby daughter with his Thai girlfriend. Neither mother or father are in a position to properly care for the child and do not want to keep the child. My wife's family members in Thailand are not prepared to take the child because of a long history of drug fueled abusive behavior from the father and the fear that he would use the baby in the future as blackmail to obtain money. On the other hand the family consider the baby to be blood and prefer her not to be adopted out. The mother's family is unknown to us but does not seem to be an option as we are told by the mother that she has had children before, none living with her family, that she "gave away". At this stage in our life we were not planning on raising another child (we have two grown up children) but the situation is tearing at our hearts. The child needs be moved on from her current situation as soon as possible for her welfare.

I know as a foreigner it is difficult and time consuming to adopt a child from Thailand. We have been down that road in the past. Our idea is for my wife to become the legal guardian and then bring her to live with us in KL. We are variously told that this can be a) done through a lawyer with father and mother signing a paper, 2) save money and go directly to the Ampur office, 3) go to the family court. The last option would take too long for us. I've read through the forum and cannot find instructions on exactly how a Thai can become a guardian of a Thai child. It must be fairly simple as it obviously happens all the time among Thais. In my case it needs to be ironclad because I would need to apply for a long term visa for Malaysia for her and convince the airline and Thai immigration leaving the country that we are not stealing her. In the future I would need to apply for permanent residence for her in Australia. I'm not sure if that will be possible but will face it in the future. Meanwhile I would be grateful for advice from anyone that has knowledge of the process for my Thai wife to become a legal guardian of her brother's baby.

Many thanks,

Cam

[scorecard]

Firstly I very much admire your and your wife's concern for the welfare of the baby girl and your hopes to give her a long term decent home and love. I hope you succeed and please don't become disheartened by the bumps that will possibly appear on your journey.

Hopefully the experts will appear quickly and give you some solid specific advice, on the other hand why not quickly go to a relevant Thai lawyer and get expert advice that way.

You mention the probable need for signatures from both parents and I strongly encourage you to get those signatures as quickly as is possible. Long delays could mean it's difficult or very difficult to contact the signatories.

Please be very wary of the comments that will undoubtedly come soon from the armchairs warriors who will bring their personal opinions rather then solid procedural facts.

Listen to the experts.

Good luck.

[Bcgardener]

We have been through the Thai adoption process and it is pretty straightforward but takes around 6 - 9 Months to complete. We adopted my wife's younger sister's daughter for the same drug related reasons. However I am not sure how it would work with you living in KL as we did it while living in Thailand (This was about 5 years ago) and I would assume you would need a Thai address and house blue book for your wife to get the process moving.

It was done through paperwork at the local Amphur and involved us filling out the required paperwork, providing financial details and also photos of our house (which they later inspected) to prove that we had the resources and suitable living accommodation for her. It also required the birth mothers consent only, as the father was unknown on the birth certificate. If both parents appear on the birth certificate I would assume you need both to consent. My wife has dual citizenship (Thai and Australian) and I am an Australian citizen. They were only interested in my wife's Thai ID card etc but they still needed me to sign the forms to say that I also consented to the adoption. We have been married for 17 years but the marriage was in Australia, however the local Amphur accepted a certified Thai translation without any questions . The final adoption papers have both our names as the adopting parents.

The adoption is totally legal in Thailand however it is not recognised by the Australian Government for the purpose of her being eligible for Australian Citizenship. Regardless of this fact it has not stopped us applying for and receiving tourist visas for her to travel to Australia and travelling without a visa to Hong Kong. On the one occasion we were queried by Thai Immigration when leaving the country with her, showing a copy of the adoption papers was readily accepted by them.

Hope this helps you, and you are doing the right thing. No child should have to suffer because of the parents problems.

[ljd1308]

That's a big commitment, well done for even considering it.

But does it really need to be done? How strict are Malaysian immigration? I would think you could just take the child with you and stay there, maybe get the father to take the child initially?

I will eventually be going through the adoption route with my stepson as I believe that will make it easier when we move back to Australia and I am not looking forward to it.

[Cam]

I have tried the adoption process before, but again I was an expat living in the Middle East. The application had to be lodged at the adoption center in Bangkok and they needed to liaise with an adoption agency in our country of residence. It was too difficult for us to arrange from our location. Even 6 - 9 months is too long in our case. My wife needs guardianship ASAP so that we can bring her back to our home and make her safe.

From KL I don't have immediate access to a Thai Lawyer or the Ampur office. When we go to Thailand I won't have much time and so I am trying to find out as much as I can to get a jump start. It would still be good to hear from anyone who has been involved with guardianship between Thais.

Many thanks for your replies to date. I very much appreciate them.